Watership Down ~ Lost in Adaptation
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2024
- How loyalty did the movie that scarred a thousand childhoods stick to the book it's based on by Richard Adams?
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The glaring mistake in claiming the film came out in 1994 instead of 1978 was due to a typo in the script that I didn't catch because I read these things like Ron Burgundy.
Yeah I thought I had a brain fart and imagined I heard that date....
I need to know the name of that death metal song, m'lord.
As a kid, we actually paid attention to the animated film, when an English teacher used it to get us more into the book.
It was one of the tapes on the Multi level, multi video and reel to reel tapes on shelves, with either a projector or a tiny TV/VHS player on top.
Legend of Sleepy Hollow/Rip Van Winkle/ Goofy Cartoon mixed tape was a favorite of kids in elementary school. 🎃
@knight meh but they're awesome!
@@casperchristiansen2458 absolutely!
A possible opposite to In Name Only: *The Book Incarnate*
This seems quite appropriate
Ooh this is a good one.
This needs more likes
I like this one.
Fitting
“It’s ok honey. Here’s a nice story about a puppy to make you feel better “
Writes Plague Dogs
I read this book the week we got our puppy...
So fucked up
Wait what??? Plague Dog!?
@@johnhelton9624 if you haven’t put yourself through the torture that is that story, do yourself a favor and don’t. If you think Watership Down is dark, you’ve got a big surprise coming your way if you pick up that book.
Fun fact: both Watership Down and Plague Dogs both have John Hurt as the voice of a main character
I should have been prepared for your poetic plot summary mood piece…
What's this one of my favorite youtube content creator commenting another favorite youtube content creators video. Nice.
Hey, it's Ryan!
Hi, Ryan ouo
I would argue Hyzenthlay was a strong female character, though not a main character, as the leader of the resistance movement in Efrafa. She had an even greater role in the book so I'm surprised she didn't even get a real mention. She was one of the only characters who had the guts to stand up to Woundwart to his face. She's pretty pivotal so to have her be ignored in a review seems a bit of a let down.
There was also Thethuthinnang who was spicy and showed lip to Bigwig when she first met him.
Idk, even as a woman, I’ve never understood the criticism about the lack of female main characters in this story. Not every story needs a girlboss to girlboss all over the place. And I even hated the change to make Strawberry female in the Netflix series. Just like how not every story needs to have the “token dude” if they have an all-female main cast.
@@KlutzyNinjaKitty it's because useless people complain about these things to feel important
@@KlutzyNinjaKitty What did you think about them making Blackberry female in the TV series? I watched that when I was a kid, before I knew about the book, so to me Blackberry was always female.
They worked Blackberry's gender swap into the story with Bigwig doing his "Bucks don't dig!" thing and Blackberry rolling her eyes like she hears that shit all the time. Although they did tackle sexism, it didn't feel forced because Blackberry didn't do any "girlboss" stuff. It was made pretty clear that although she's very intelligent and an excellent digger, she's not a fighter. Bigwig, Campion (whom Blackberry fell in love with) and even Hazel and (most surprising of all) Fiver could fight but Blackberry relied on her wits.
Making Strawberry female didn't add anything. Making Blackberry female felt like it was done in service of the story.
I was so glad to see her get more attention in the remake!
I'd call it a Too Close for Comfort: an adaptation that's so close that it, while faithful, is sometimes very uncomfortable in how close it is
Hello, Fangirl! Nice seeing you here.
@@TheCodemasterc I refuse to flirt with my fiance in Dom's comments !!
YES
Flawless!
Yes! This one!
"General Woundworts body was never found. It could be he still lives his fierce life somewhere else, but from that day on mother rabbits would tell their kittens: "That if they did not do what they were told, "The General" would get them". Such was Woundworts monument and perhaps it would not have displeased him." Best ending to a villain in movie history.
@The Dark Overlord That's just like, your opinion man. ;)
Ah yes, the Spartacus fate
Impressive. I still prefer Big Fido from Men at Arms. :-D (another "Oh no, Pratchett was inspired by that one too!" moment)
@The Dark Overlord That's the simplest explanation. But General Woundwort was a narcissist, cult-leader, demagogue. The followers of people like that as well as the people harmed by them in real life are willing to believe all sorts of ridiculous things about the cult-leader and are happy to write magical mythology about them long after they're gone. People like him often end up posthumously larger than life, so it was really realistic that a character like that would be regarded that way after death. It's like all the people who question whether Hitler really died in that bunker. Both neo-nazis and regular people who hated him include some people who feel unsure, despite the fact that there was physical proof of his death.
@The Dark Overlord the general outright Killed that dog
Hey, I remember this childhood trauma!
For real though, this was a great book. Something I really appreciated more as an adult than as a kid was how ELDRITCH the humans seemed to the animals. Like they do things that are incomprehensible to the rabbits, ranging from killing off hundreds of them at a time, to building unknowable things, to saving the life of a single rabbit just 'cause. Their actions have seemingly no rhyme or reason to them, but make perfect sense to us humans, and it creates a fascinating dichotomy between what we see and what the characters in the book see.
It reminds me one book I read as a kid. It is about fox male who were save by hunter and raised by him. He (the fox not dude) later run´s away and try to find place to live. Humans are by far the worst thing he has to face. Sadly (to my knowledge) it was never published in english.
@@petrfedor1851 That reminds me of the original book version if Bambi. A side character deer is taken and raised by humans, then returned to the forest. He gets shot by hunters because he trusts humans and doesn't run away.
I read this comment yesterday and came back today to find it and save it for myself. This is a brilliant observation and it's an angle I hadn't considered, even though I've read the book half a dozen or more times. It also puts the stories that are about actual eldritch/alien/otherwise incomprehensible entities in a different light. Just all around, this is a great insight. Thanks!!
Yeah, Watership Down absolutely deserves to be an example on the TV Tropes Humans Are Cthulhu page.
I liked how Red from Overly Sarcastic Productions put it recently, that to the characters, it's cosmic horror, and to the readers it's dramatic irony, and that combination occurs in no other genre.
I do love Bigwig’s little “My Chief Rabbit has ordered me to defend this run” speech, it’s just great on so many levels - like, it’s just a badass/awesome moment to begin with, but also shows his character development because he’s learned to trust Hazel, and when Woundwort hears it, he’s like “if this guy isn’t the Chief, then their Chief must be a fucking monster”… and then it turns out that the Chief is Hazel, who isn’t big or strong or intimidating, but is Chief because he’s so smart… I fucking love it
And because it shows that the Watership Down rabbits have remembered who they are, what it means to be a rabbit in the world of the story, which the Efrafans, Cowslip, and the Sandleford warren are all doomed for having forgotten - "be cunning and full of tricks and your people will never be destroyed".
I wonder how Woundwort would have felt if he found out that the rabbit with a limp that had proposed an alliance of warrens earlier, and Woundwort had let go because he was no threat, was actually Bigwig's chief
George R.R. Martin: I am the most sadistic author when it comes to killing characters.
Richard Adams: That's cute.
Clive Barker: "Whomst has summoned the Almighty One?"
::Joss Whedon raises an eyebrow::
Colin Dann: Hold my beer.
Kathryn Lasky would like a word with you.
Glen Cook deserves a spot at this table for The Black Company
“The characters have been watered down”? Don’t you mean they’ve been “watershipped down”?
Boo! Lol
Shut up and take my Like!
HA!
This was the film that taught my mother, after she watched it with my siblings and I, that must because its animated, Does Not mean it's appropriate for children under the age of 12. A great lesson was learned that day in the Brammer household.
I remove it from the childrens section of every charity shop dvd shelf I go into. A few years back the BBC put it on at Easter because bunnies and twitter had a meltdown of adults who thought their childhood memories were exaggerated. Reader: they were not.
To be fair, at least in the UK, Watership Down is listed as a U rated movie, so I could see people assuming it was fine lol. It's definitely one of the biggest screw-ups by the bbfc.
EDIT: I've since discovered it was changed to a PG (so 8 and above and with actual warnings about the blood now) just a couple of years ago, which is way better.
Back when Watchmen was in theaters, had a grandma tell me she was dropping off her grandkids to see it. I asked how old they were, and she said 12 and 9. I have NEVER talked someone out of doing something so fast in my life. Just cause the source material is "kiddy" does not make it kid safe.
Same with parents letting their young kids go see the first Deadpool movie. "Its just violence and some cussing."
As a devoted WSD fan, I must say "Surviving against all odds through the sheer power of British grumpiness" is perhaps the best description of Bigwig I've ever heard. Was real glad you mentioned the 1999 animated series, because it's one of the lesser known adaptations but it's one of my favorites! Since its a series it's able the devote more time to developing the rabbits as characters & illustrating what makes Hazel a uniquely qualified leader. Do not let the cute art style fool you!
You're 100% right - and Richard Briers came back (not voicing his original character, but still cool)!
I loved the TV series, I've watched every episode so many times, and it feels like pretty much no one even knows about its existence
It’s a criminally overlooked series! Personally, I like it better than the Netflix series, I think it does a better job fleshing out the characters & exploring their world.
Does it keep the blood?
@@sonofjafarreturnswell no, not exactly, blackavar still has his ears, about the only one who looks bad is campion in season 3.
Maybe try "To the Letter" as an opposite designation to "In Name Only."
This one is great!
This suggestion, like many, is superb. Dominic will have a hard time choosing!
ooh, I like this one
I've always loved Watership Down - I do have a hard time believing the author's intent when it comes to allegory, especially when it comes to the details of the totalitarian rabbit community. Though that's more pushed in the film than the book. Really good breakdown, Dom!
This should be studied in schools; high school at least
I adore your work and if you don't see this as you probably won't oh well
Maybe he just didnt have a specific regime in mind or didnt want to be used against only a specific regime.
@@LucyLioness100 It was in mine, then I'm also in the UK
The author was a Torrie, they have a love for ruralism and the countryside gentry and hatred for city/urban life in general, including collectivist communities. Was also a criticism of the art of cities (personified through silverweed) being nothing but a disconnected reflection of a doomed society. The author was sort of a dick, basically, who later on had no problem gassing the rabbits eating from his own garden, sort of indicative of the hypocritical above the law attitude of the english upper class in general.
The part where the rabbits get trapped, poisoned, and crushed in their warren by construction equipment makes me never want anything to be built ever again, so good on Richard Adams and the filmmakers for making that scene so fucked up.
May I suggest the title "Page to Stage" for the basically the book on screen? It was what we had nickname a module at uni where we were taught how to convert books into screen/stage plays and then the best one was chosen from class and we learnt it, made costumes, props and set and performed it.
That is a wonderful title, and it explains the process very well.^^
very clever, this is perfect
Ooh, I like that
Only problem I see is that, when it comes to movies, it's very unlikely to be shot on a stage unless the scene actually takes place on a stage of some sort. Even if you want to count a studio as a stage, I still feel the name doesn't work that well when it comes to film.
@@PlayerZeroStart I do see what u mean, but the audio area is called the Sound stage and older days it was called the acting stage. It just got shortened to set. Maybe find a book linked word to rhyme with set?
Fun fact: The entire Watership Down movie used to be on TH-cam split into nine parts around 2010. And a nine-year old me stumbled across it on early TH-cam and proceeded to get extraordinarily affected by it. This is probably the single movie that's caused the greatest amount of childhood trauma to unknowing children. Still remember that gorey, bloody Bigwig vs Woundwort fight and the fake warren scene like yesterday. Can't believe this movie got a "U"-rating. The people that gave it that genuinely can not have watched the movie.
Ah,yes...the "U-gonagetscarred" rating.
I remember my Mom putting that playlist on for me and my sibling one day (I think it was Easter)
This was how i used to watch this movie on youtube in 9 parts! I was then suggested Felidae, another animated animal movie except it's about cats in a murder mystery and was some how MORE terrifying... I should have known when it was a suggested movie after Watership Down
@@selbyburke8315 I had the exact same experience! Part 6 of Felidae on TH-cam… That changed me
I also first found Watership down on TH-cam (I was about 11-12, I think) and really liked it. It reminded me of the old TV-show "The Animals of Farthing Wood", whitch I really loved when I was a little child. (I just adored anything with animals in it)
After that TH-cam recommended me Felidae and Plague Dogs. Those two actually managed traumatize me, especially Plague Dogs. That movie isn't just brutal, but also very tragic.
I demand an in-depth, 1 hour behind-the-scenes where we see Dom record all the horrific bloody bunny costume scenes. I refuse to believe the real filming wasn’t done to a soundtrack of nonstop laughter.
Adams used “The Private Life of the Rabbit” by naturalist RM Lockley as research for rabbit behaviour. The study includes descriptions of bucks fighting over territory and does in heat and yep it can get pretty brutal.
Yep, as someone who has owned both male and female rabbits. Bucks can be extremy violent little buggers. 😳
"Name-Worthy"
Short, rolls of the tongue, you immediately know what it means.
I really love how the rabbits have their own mythology. For lack of a better term this detail makes them seem more human. Think about it: There was a time when mythology and religion went hand-in-hand, if not considered the same. These bunnies have a mythology, an established deified figure, and the concept of an afterlife.
Although I don't consider myself a religious individual, I would be remiss if I didn't acknowledge what a powerfully unifying force religion can be between many individuals, so I think it's only natural that many of us would feel a sense of connection or relatability to these characters in addition to their ability to speak and behave in some ways akin to human beings.
The fur farm rabbits also showed the very beginnings of music and art because they now had free time in the book!
@@takkycat That sounds pretty cool :D
You would definitely like Fire Bringer which is about deer. Their mythology is really fun to read, enough that I actually remember several specific stories...and that's on top of the actual really good story.
@@rosemali3022 Thanks so much for the recommendation! :D I will be sure to check it out. I hope you're doing well and that all things are going your way.
@@loneronin6813 That's very kind of you to say :) And I hope the same for you.. but hopefully far more accurate for you lol. I did pick the book up again last night and I wasntmisremembering, it's pretty good!
I didn’t read this until my sophomore year English class, but I was really into the Warrior Cats and Guardians of Gahoole books as a kid. Mrs. Brisby and the Rats of Nimh was also one of my favorite books growing up, so by the time we got to Watership down I was already on board with violent, elaborate, and emotional stories involving animal societies.
For some reason, not a lot of my peers appreciated it in the same way I did.
Same here with warrior cats, probably got me prepared for watership down
Warriors and Guardians were my early years reading too
Warriors was my shit
I absolutely love Warrior cats! I need to reread the series since it's been a bit, and I kinda stopped reading after the third series, meaning I only know the ending of power of three.
"Carnage. Like fucking Venom. Like the Venom villain."
Gotta love the bloopers! 💖💖
"Swear to god Martha the neighbors just dumped a rabbit costume covered in blood into their trash. I told you these binoculars would pay off!"
There's also a point in the book where Bigwig says to general Woundwort, "Silflay hraka, u embleer rah," and if you'd been paying attention to the rabbit language thus far, you know that roughly translates to: eat shit, sir. Also, the bright eyes song slaps.
"Eat shit, you stinking prince"
"Embleer" is a little more nuanced than "stinking", though that's the closest human equivalent. Because it refers to the smell of a fox, it is both "stinking" but goes beyond that to align Woundwort as an elil/enemy. So maybe "embleer rah" is both "stinking/shitty leader" but also "evil leader".
@@nataliekmaguire, sounds like it also has a tinge of "fierce", thus coming down to "bad boy", perhaps?
"Eat shit, you stench-ridden chief" is a better translation, I think.
The song is undeniably great. If the name Simon or Garfunkel is attached, odds are your ears are in for a good time!
I remember my parents dumped me and my sister off at the cinema I was 5 she was 10. It was a form of cheap babysitting for my parents so they could go off and have a good time. It was a double feature of Water ship Down and Ralph Bakshi's Lord of the Rings. It was absolutely terrifying. Parents couldn't get away with it in this day and age.
😱 That's a LOT of childhood trauma (& flat-out weird-ass cinema) in one sitting! Yikes...
My grandparents did that my my dad and his sister
As someone who used to work in a cinema, it's absolutely something parents can and will still do. Our only restriction as employees is making sure the kids met the requirements of the age rating, otherwise they're not allowed in (which caused some controversy when parents dropped 10 year olds off for a 12A).
In what way can’t parents “get away with it these days”? Both of those films are not age restricted
@@thomsboys77 dumping a 5 and 10 year old off alone for two full length movies? Are you saying that parents could do that today?
"here's a quick summary" well, it was quick, and it made me laugh my head off
The holy trinity of violent and depressing animal films we stumbled across as children: Watership Down, Plague Dogs, and Felidae >:’)
Excellent video! As an animator, I love when you cover animated adaptions! The film does such a good job with translating the horrors of the book to the screen. The animation at the beginning of the film explaining the rabbit’s lore is some of my favorite stylized animation to date.
If you ever tackle Plague Dogs or Felidae, I fear what the “quick synopsis of the books” sections of your videos are going to look like! Lol
A Tennelle spotted in the wild!!! Big agree, I’d love to see a Plague Dogs video 👀
Plague Dogs I feel is a tad tamer compared to Watership Down but DEAR LORD Felidae is graphic, not made for kids whatsoever.
Woah, tennelle in a dominic noble video. I shouldn't have been surprised but it was.
I enjoyed watching all of those movies. I've read watership down but was unable to finish plague dogs. I was unaware Felidae had a book but I'm definitely interested. Now that I'm older I plan on reading these as I buy them. Mrs.Frisby and the rats of NIMH was a great book too. I remember loving the movie as a child. Now if only warrior cats and guardians of ga'hoole would get a proper animated adaptation. I forgot to mention Kenneth oppels Silverwing as well. His series got a children's TV show but it's heavily watered down when compared to the books.
What about the secrets of NIMH
Velveteen Rabbit: "This will be the saddest story about a rabbit ever written." CLASSIC!
Monty Python's Holy Grail: "This bunny is the most deadly creature ever in the history of everything." CLASSIC!
Watership Down: "Both of you hold my carrot juice." CLASSIC!
Children : "Why do you hate us?"
The best stories for children leave scars, I guess.
I wish I could find my copy velveteen rabbit. It had top tier art. I remember the background of the cover being pink.
I read Grimms’ fairy tales as a child and I wasn’t scarred 😆
British children are encouraged to plunge into the darkness. I guess they figure that's how they win World Wars or something. 😅
I feel Watership Down is not a movie that you should just leave your kids in front of as a babysitter, the way most parents do in the States. It's a movie a parent should watch with them, so that they can help them to process and come to terms with what they're seeing and the harshness portrayed on screen.
It works better as something to be actively engaged with, not passively partaken of.
All the world is your enemy if they catch you they will kill you…but first they must catch you!
I loved that Richard pulled no punches with his work especially with plague dogs.
"by the way, there's a low-hanging bridge you should know about." I lost it at how utterly niche that joke is.
When I was a kid my pet rabibit, Silky died. Dad came in and found me crying in bed. He was nice and asked if I wanted to be read to, I said “yes”. Poor man then asked me what I was reading, and I said “Watership Down”, and just burst into floods again! 😂 He then just went for my mum.
I loved it though, it was my favourite book and the film was my favourite film. Thanks Dom, love hearing your perspective. 😀
I think all of us can relate to "My heart has joined the Thousand, for my friend stopped running today."
I remember my uncle gave the movie to my brother and I for Christmas. He had never read the book and just assumed since it had talking animals then it must be safe to give to children. Certainly raised some eyebrows at that Christmas dinner when I asked questions about “rabbit Jesus”
The name Watership Down just sounds like a shipwreck, just by the title alone, I would be previewing the content for kids, lol.
Ah yes, "talking animals are good for children" How Warrior Cats doesn't appear on lists of commonly challenged/banned books.
@@AbsolXGuardian add Redwall to that list
My dad got a set of the books and movie all in one when I was young, because he'd grown up with the first book, but lost it due to damage
@@AbsolXGuardian let's not forget fritz the cat
I stumbled onto Watership Down when I was about 13 and immediately fell in love with it, reading it twice in the first month. I was transported by the lore and the rabbit language; it all felt so magical to me. I still feel transported when I read it. It's a lifetime favourite.
I think "worthy of the name" would be a good award for extremely accurate adaptations
After watching the animated movie I went to bed and was legitimately afraid that a Rabbit was gonna pop out and kill me in my sleep. I was not ready for how dark and violent Watership Down was.
I had the same reaction but it lasted every single night for atleast 3 years. I was 6 when a freaking grown adult who had seen the whole film before decided it'd be a great choice for movie night with two small children.
Same. One of teacher wanted to treat us to a movie. So she played this movie having never seen it. She then left the class and we didn’t know how to turn it off. So we all sat and watched this movie
Ps this was kindergarten and I swear to god I have a light rabbit phobia, I realized this because Roger from ‘Who framed Roger Rabbit’ makes me very uncomfortable
I have 2 rabbits. Can confirm I go to sleep with that same fear every night.
The opposite of "In name only" should just be "A Watership Down" in honor of this adaptation
_"Silflay hraka, u embleer Rah..."_
Film or book, Bigwig was one bad rabbit.😎
Another note on Bigwig since Bakshi's LoTR was mentioned, we essentially had Boromir in lapine form thanks to Michael Graham Cox voicing Bigwig.
It always felt complete hearing Hurt and Cox in both films growing up, and they're both missed, but their work is our memorial.
Never expected to hear “bunny” and “intimidating” in the same sentence, but here we are
You haven’t met the Killer Bunny 🐰 have you then….
Here's an idea of an antonym to "In Name Only": Page to Script
As in the story is so faithful it's as if the pages of the book became the pages of the script.
Aside from that, I loved this film, although the gore never really bothered me strangely. I still prefer it to the recent Netflix adaptation, even though that one had more time to detail some of the scenes from the book.
I like this one, simple, to the point, and more importantly I can imagine the Dom saying this
This is a good idea! I think 'Page for Page' would also work as scripts and books both have pages and it mirrors the common expression word for word
@Joseph Douek from what I heared not. they seemed to have changed the characters severely, giving the iconic scene where Fiver finds Hazel due to his vision to another character and the animation looks pretty cheap. seems like they have blown their budget on the voice cast. from what I've seen, they strayed pretty far from the book. Then again, I've only seen a summary and not the whole thing.
@Joseph Douek Not really, it mainly follows the film but with slightly updated graphics, as well as a younger cast of voice actors. The only difference is that some of the main characters get a bit more of a distinct personality (like Hazel being a leader and Bluebell telling jokes), and others less so.
Even with the updated graphics, there's less style and the film is much tamer in comparison.
On the plus side (for Dom's sake) it doesn't have a music video mid-way through.
I'm so jealous of people like yourself who can think of these great names for things.
"There's a dog lose in the woods" is one of the best lines, such a great callback. Watership Down was my favorite movie as a kid and it became my favorite book. I reread it every Winter.
that line haunted me
It's basically OG "They have a cave troll".
@@AndreNitroX It still pops up in my mind.
@@G12G4 NOOOOOooooooo!
Oh, damn! That line gives me goosebumps even 40 years later: I'd forgotten why I fell in love with this book in the first place.
I had a friend whose dad had the same name as the author and, as it was my favorite book, I was in awe of him. But I was too scared to ask him about it or have him sign my copy or anything. He was rarely there when I visited and usually just said hi before going to his back room which made him feel unapproachable. One day, I asked my friend what it was like having an author for a dad and they said "what are you talking about? My dad's a ___" (honestly can't recall what the dad actually did). We got into a small argument over it until the mom got involved and thought it was hilarious. Apparently, the dad didn't even read books much less write them. Anyway, that's the day I learned that people can have the same name and not be the same person.
the fact that the story was originally conceived as something to entertain two little british girls causes all the violence and terror to make WAY more sense
Considering what rabbits do to each other in real life, especially the babies, this is probably the most accurate interpretation ever written.
here is to an adult (richard adams) not lying to you for a change!
Yeah, rabbits are brutal as hell. Like, it’s arguably easier and less risky to introduce two unfamiliar pit bulls to each other than two unfamiliar rabbits, especially if they’re unaltered. The depiction of gendered behavior with meek, gentle females is really funny to me tho, females are often the most aggressively territorial and will often throw down harder than males will
I've heard hamsters can be pretty vicious as well, which is why you should never put two of them in the same cage.
@@runningcommentary2125 happened to my friend a few months ago. She adopted two juvenile brothers and the breeder assured her that they were “bonded” and could cohabitate (red flag. Infant sibling hamsters will enjoy each other’s company but adults DO NOT bond and they get violently territorial after maturity). Woke up one morning to find one of the hamsters cozily sleeping inside the hollowed out carcass of his brother.
This book was magical for me, especially since I grew up in the country. I never had a problem with the "gore," since it was pretty accurate to the real life of wild animals that I encountered every day.
Same!
Yeah I'm always shocked more by anyone who has problems with it.
Ah, OK, yeah I honestly wondered what was the issue there.
I now recall that I plucked the chickens when they stopped running around after grandma's beheading so...
@LTNetjak magical comment. Loved every word of what you spoke
I was always enchanted by the beautiful descriptions of the English countryside in the book. Even when it described how in the summer the blue sky was 'as thick as cream' as compared to it looking more watery in the winter. And that's without all the plants! Things I'd never seen before making me feel like I was taking a walk out there.
This is like sitcom-logic where Dom gets increasingly attractive every season.
Spring Dom: Meh ...
Summer Dom: Oh.
Fall Dom: Wow-
Winter Dom: OMG!
I probably watched this cartoon 100 times in my childhood. There should be a word for "Animated shows ostensibly for children, but are really dark--so for children who are comfortable with a lot of grim drama?"
I was so into this movie. I eventually read the book, but I just have so much nostalgia for this film.
Idea for the new clause: The 'Both are Bunnies' clause.
Since to my knowledge this is the first time LIA has had to make up a new clause for a movie that so heavily follows the plot of the book, it seems fitting to have it reference the first instance. Both are bunny's , both are Watership down.
I love this one.
I was thinking "Basically the Book" which is BtB but close to BaB
@@KristopherBel that makes way more sence I can't lie-
Aw Both are Bunnies is way cuter than my suggestion.
A choice for the opposite of "In Name Only" could be "Obsessively Loyal"
This was a fun watch. My Mom read me Watership Down as a bedtime story, and I was excited to see the network TV premiere of the 1978 movie. The thing is, it didn't ever traumatize me. I grew up reading Grimm's fairy tales, Greek mythology, and watching nature documentaries. I knew that nature is harsh and brutal and that rabbits have it exceptionally tough, so the brutality in the book struck me as very authentic. and the lapine protagonists' tenacity in the face of such a cruel world was very inspiring. Something that I admired a lot.
It was very anti-Disney in that way, and that was refreshing. Especially seeing an animated movie that wasn't from Disney in an era where they dominated.
So the usual hyperbolic reaction to the book's violence always struck me as odd. A bit overstated.
just in regards to the blooper at 18:55 if any childrens book was going to win the "Carnage" award it would be this one lol
Suggestions for opposite of In Name Only:
"It's All There"
"In Name, Plot, Dialogue, Theme, and Concept Only"
"Every Word on Screen"
"They Filmed the Book"
"Most Faithful of Adaptations"
Ooh, ‘They Filmed the Book’- I like that one!
"forgot the adaptation part" if it's to the movies detriment
In reference to a meme that went around, this movie is BOOKSLAPPED! Someone made sure this followed the book exactly by slapping the director/writer with the book.
First of all; I did really enjoy the video, but CAN WE PLEASE TALK ABOUT VIOLET?? Look, I understand that a movie has to cut "some" stuff when adapting a book to a 1½ hour film. But when you ONLY cut away the humor and the nice moments, but keep ALL the violent parts as well as needlessly emphasize the gore, then I (personally) don't think you're doing the source material justice. A great example being *Violet* . There's a scene in the movie with a rabbit being taken by a bird of pray while eating grass, and Fiver sadly states "Violet is gone". ...but here's the thing though; there was NO RABBIT NAMED VIOLET IN THE BOOK. And NO RABBIT WAS TAKEN BY A BIRD. In other words, the movie decided to add a rabbit and a scene for the sole purpose of having MORE. BUNNIES. DIE. It's also worth mentioning that while *Blackavar* was torn to bloody shreds by Woundwort in the FILM (4:49), he ABSOLUTELY survived in the book, fighting bravely in the battle of Watership Down, and becoming friends with Holly and a rabbit called Silver afterwards.
That being said, I can appreciate the movie as its own thing. But I had a completely different experience reading the book.
One thing I very selfishly think the movie could have benefitted from was to keep my favorite character: *Bluebell* . He was the reason why Holly managed the long journey to Hazel's colony (as Holly was severaly wounded), and he was very much the comic relief in the book. Telling outragous stories and making puns and just being a delightful little dude who genuinly lightened the room whenever he was in it. But again, I strongly feel like the movie was going for a melancholic and grimmer take on the book, in which case it's understandable that he was the first character to be scrapped for the film adaption.
I think she was there to pretend that they weren't just a bunch of bro's who left to start a new Warren and forgot that they needed females for that to happen. 1 girl and 7 guys and then she dies because she wandered too far from the group. Woo seventies values!
I mentioned this in an earlier comment too-the movie was good, but a really faithful adaptation would be the Australian radio play from the early 1980s. The only thing about that that I didn't like was that the actor who plays Bigwig sounds a bit old
@@lucie4185 Isn't that the problem, though? It's always bugged me that adaptations tried to add female characters to the first half, when the Big Turning Point is literally the realization that *women are important* -- that without some does, their new warren literally has no future. Watering down the sausage fest of the first half is necessarily watering down the realization and the entire *second* half. It's hardly the only book that started with the guys' journey and then followed up with the journey that involved women (Pilgrim's Progress comes to mind), and yeah, they could've given the women more agency in the second half, but the worth of the women for the furtherance of their entire group shows the omission starkly enough on its own.
I mean if you think about it, the driving force of the second half, the thing that makes them actually willing to stand up against the most terrifying rabbit in existence (short of the Black Rabbit, and Woundwort might actually be scarier because unlike Death, *he's* not natural), is that their lives are not as important as the lives of the does they're trying to save. Effectively, the women are worth sacrifices by the men. It's not a message of equality, but it's still one that affords women a level of importance that the rabbits didn't think about at the start of the tale.
@@Arkylie I agree completely about the role of females in the book, the recognition that all they have done is pointless if the Warren has no future is vital. My comment was more specifically about Violet being invented and then killed in a particularly pointless manner in the film.
She acts like the way Clover in the book is described which is fine for Clover because she has lived her life in a cage and around humans so wouldn't know that death comes from the sky but Violet being from Sandleford should be aware to watch for birds when out in the open.
One of my favourite books when I was younger and I loved the cartoon too. I was never traumatised by the cartoon or book, I guess cause I watched bbc wildlife documentaries, so understood that this was just how things are for wild animals. I actually appreciate how Adams pulled no punches with his writing.
“Greek legends like the Aeneid.”
Dante Alighieri: **INCOHERENT ROMABOO SCREECHING**
Other Greek legends include Beowulf, Táin Bó Cúailnge, and the Poetic Edda
@cak01vej Joined closely by The Cask of Amantiago, Dune and the Mahabarata
Now now, lest not leave out the most famous Greek legend of all.
The Bible.
Romaboo??? 😂😂💀💀💀💀💀
@@gateauxq4604 Dante was obsessed with Rome to the point of being compared to a weaboo. Anything not Roman he literally wrote into hell
Re: the magnificent John Hurt: our family first got to know of him as Caligula, in the mini-series "I, Claudius", where he acted alongside such wonderful talents as Brian Blessed, Sian Phillips, George Baker, Patrick Stewart (with hair and playing a villain) and of course Derek Jacobi as Claudius. Hurt's Caligula ran away with the show whenever he was featured. It took our family a little while to accustom ourselves to hearing the voice of Caligula coming out of Aragorn and Hazel.
God I love "I, Claudius." That shit was "Game of Thrones" before everyone jumped on that bandwagon.
@@emilyarmstrong83 So true! And Livia was Cersei on steroids.
@@emilyarmstrong83 way back when everyone was raving about The Sopranos, I said, I don't need to watch a show about an Italian crime family because I watched the original: I CLAVDIVS
You should check out *10 Rillington Road* and *The Shout*
He will for ever be the voice of the aids adverts for me...
I've just realised, I first read the book before the film came out and when I feed our rabbits I still tell them I've brought "flayrah". (Richard Adams' rabbit word for the best food)
I mean, Adams winning the "Carnage" Medal for this book would be appropriate.
Some ideas for names for immensely accurate adaptations:
either "Found in Adaptation" or "a Watership Movie"
I only saw the movie in my early twenties, but read the book when I was 12/13, an age where I was old enough to understand the story and some of it subtext, but not nearly old enough to understand all of it. I mostly remember how scary General Woundwort was, not because he was the books 'villain', but because he was scary in a very real kind of way, in a way humans in real life can be scary too, which made him so scary to me.
Another what very much stuck with my was this books representation of death, the black rabbit of Inlé as it's grim reaper, wherein was both the fear of death and the fight to stay alive, but also somehow it was not scary or menacing, neither good nor bad, it just was. It had a very much 'when we die, we die' kind of feeling to death in the book, wherein the way to die was a lot more scarier than death itself, and that somehow really surprised me and felt weirdly comforting to 12 year old me (in fact I wanted to start a rock/metal band in high school called Black Rabbit, named after this character).
Yes! I remember when Bigwig hears Captain Holly wailing his name, and thinks it's the Black Rabbit. He becomes frozen is fear, but accepts his impending doom, saying something like "When he calls you, you have to go."
I distinctly remember watching this in my pajamas while eating coco pops back in 1996 when I was only 4. I absolutely loved this film as a kid and I loved the book when I read it as an adult. Not entirely sure what that says about me if I didn't find this disturbing when I was 4 but there you have it!
God, I love Bigwig. "My Chief Rabbit has told me to stay and defend this run, and until he says otherwise, I shall stay here."
Glad to see that i'm in the company of Adam's daughters in my love for Bigwig. 'Survived by the power of grumpiness' 😂
One aspect of the book that I loved that didn't really come across in the film was Woundwort being utterly dumfounded to learn that Bigwig wasn't the chief. They definitely referenced it in the film, but we get to hear book Woundwort thoughts and learn how he took this to mean there was an opponent even bigger and tougher than Bigwig that he was yet to face, and that he'd have to marshal the entirety of his Owsla to surround and take down this terrible beast. He couldn't conceive of a rabbit leading through anything other than brute force, and he didn't even realise he'd MET the chief already - that small rabbit who'd limped away after the failed negotiation.
I love Bigwig, too. When we first started dating, my boyfriend would often call me that name because he knew I loved the character. I’ve been trying to get him to read the book. Also, yes, when Bigwig admits he’s not the chief and the general’s reaction is “Oh, crap!” it’s amazing to see. Also love Fiver scaring the daylights out of Vervain without even having to fight as another amazing moment. This book is amazing
When I read the book, I always had to refer to the glossary to the lupine language. But soon, due to its repetition, I began to realize I was _learning the language._
By the time came up the line, "Silflay h'raka, u embleer rah," I all but cheered, knowing precisely what the sentence meant.
I was horribly disappointed in the movie version in which that powerful line was simply reduced to the word H'raka, which on its own wasn't exactly much of an insult.
I'm sorry, what does "Silflay h'raka u embleer rah" mean? I've never read the book and I just got curious to watch this as to the movies - let's say- reputation.
@@Wungolioth thanks!
I've been learning it over the last 15 years too, for a while I was using H'raka to swear so I wouldn't get yelled out but I still use Frith a fair bit, interchangable with God and F-Rick. Yes. Frick, totally XD
When humans are so finicky with language you have to use Lapine to be able to express yourself XD Got me made fun of in school but eh.
@@Wungolioth no, the word choice there is Silflay not vreer
@@Enriqueta_Fuentes I apologize, I checked the glossary online, the OP had it right, couldn't even find vreer in there, vair is to pass droppings, and I did have embleer wrong as well, I guess this goes into the "confidently wrong" file. I'm an old dude, but I fess up when I have a senior moment
"Shitting your mind-pants" : Perfect. Also, how about 'As Loyal As Possible' as a name for faithful adaptations?
What I really love about this movie is how closely the animation manages to capture the movements of real animals, rabbits in particular. I'm thoroughly impressed by it, even having read the book way before seeing the movie.
There's a great Hop Along song about _Watership Down._ "The General, buck-toothed, bright eyes frothing red/Baltimore, you on the floor, me on the edge of the bed./We saw him in one brutal gesture tear that rabbit open,/And you turned to me. 'Isn't this supposed to be for children?'/So strange, to be shaped by such strange moments."
This was one of my favorite books as a kid; I always heard that the movie was a horrifying trauma fest lol, so it's nice to see how they compare!
Wait, the "Well-Dressed" people?
There's a couple in my hometown with "HRUDUDU" and "HRUDU2" license plates for their two cars. I take a picture every time I see them.
One pretty significant change comes at the tail-end (sorry). As you said, in the book, it was El-ahrairah's spirit that came for Hazel in the end--pretty much the equivalent of King Arthur coming to an Englishman on his deathbed and saying, "Party in Avalon tonight, Gawain's bringing the keg, wanna come?" It showed just how exceptional a Chief Rabbit Hazel was, that he could have this honor. We know it was El-ahrairah because of the description of starlight in his ears--a callback to one of the stories-within-a-story we got during the novel. In the movie, it was clearly the Black Rabbit, whom we'd seen in the beginning and during the "Bright Eyes" sequence. The implication here was that the Black Rabbit came for Hazel as he'd come for any dying rabbit--but that he was honoring Hazel by inviting him to be part of his guard. I can kind of see why they did this--they cut out most of the El-ahrairah stories except the creation myth, and most audiences would have forgotten what he looked like from the beginning of the movie.
That "scream" Fiver made in the book was also a callback to one of the stories--a tale about El-ahrairah outwitting a farmer's bumbling dog. Fiver used the words the dog did in the story--in his trance, he was literally channeling a dog and barking and howling like one, scaring off the rabbits. They probably played this down in the movie because, again, they cut that story and it wouldn't have made any sense to suddenly have this rabbit bark like a dog.
I’ve read the story several times and I never realized that about Fiver’s scream! Richard Adams was brilliant!
Ah, one of my favourite animated films! Also, the voice actor for Bigwig, Michael Graham Cox, voiced Boromir in Ralph Bakshi's The Lord of the Rings. So both he and John Hurt starred in two gory animated films in the same year. Weird, huh?
I have been waiting years for you to do this adaptation, and you didn't disappoint. Very nice episode.
Some things I think we're worth covering - Blackavar being casually killed by Woundwort in the film (he survived the book), adding in a doe named Violet who escaped from Sandleford with them just to have her snatched by a hawk (she didn't exist in the book), Fiver terrifying Woundwort's second in command with a matter-of-fact prophecy of his death in the book, and a few events being out of order in the film.
Like Holly joining the group before they reached Watership Down & having already encountered the Efrafans
Yeah a fair amount of stuff was actually changed! Blackavar’s death makes me so mad - did he not suffer enough?
@@stargirl7646 I guess to give him something to do? He was an expert tracker in the books, & fought one of the Efrafan officers
@@stevensonstopmotion2031 Should also be noted that it wasn't the Efrafans that beat the crap out of Holly, it was Cowslip's warren, who did it for simply being associated with the travelers who came through and made them think about their lot in life.
@@UsaSatsui When you look at the geography it doesn't make sense, that Holly left Sandleford days after Hazel, then was able to overtake them & get all the way & Efrafa & back
The rabbits legends were my favorite part of the book, I loved how at the end of the book Hazel's story is being told as an El-Ahrairrah tale!
"Prince with a thousand enemies, if they catch you, they will kill you... but first they must catch you." Is practically the perfect closing line for a rabbit origin myth.
Growing up in America with Eastern European parents from Romania they LOVED Watership Down they gave me the book at the age of twelve I loved, loved the book and loved the film.
The song near the beginning is Sudden Death by Sightless in Shadow for anyone wondering.
Great gag btw Dom, that was a good laugh.
When I saw this movie as a kid it inspired me to adopt a rabbit to protect it from all the ... Everything
Mr Warren lived a long full life
I’m too young to have been traumatized by this but this comes across as a much bloodier version of warrior cats, which every elementary school girl loved in the early 2000s.
My brother had to read this for school in 9th grade. I borrowed it from him (I was in 5th grade) and read it, and LOVED it. It was so good. Then I watched the movie, and, again LOVED it.
Also, the Black Rabbit of Inle walks the land
Watership Down is the mark of grit in service of plot. Adams isn’t inserting gruesome details just to get a rise out of people, but to matter-of-factory convey what a sentient perspective would be for a small animal’s POV. He doesn’t talk down to anyone. He is bringing an experience to life.
I read my mom's copy of this book before I was even the right age to understand it fully. My childhood was rough, and I escaped into books. My travels with Hazel, Fiver, and the rest of the gang was magical. Then I've read it over and over again as an adult, and of course got even more out of it. It has a very special place in my heart.
Never watched the movie, I look forward to hear how it was different, and your opinions.
Please do Lost in Adaptation of The Count of Monte Cristo. The book is so beautiful and yet all of the adaptations miss a lot of really great points. I would love to see a video on it.
I assumed he already had? That's a good suggestion... He has done The Three Musketeers, though. Those films suffer the same problems as adaptions of that authors work...
@@markrogers6601 I agree... I've watched the most recent one and the 1970s one with Richard Chamberlain
@@bertybell4781 There was one in the nineties with Charlie Sheen, Keifer Sutherland and Tim Curry that was very much in the tone of Kevin Costner's Robin Hood. It was... Okay. It's on Disney+.
But it still suffers from the same problem. The Man in the Iron Mask with Leonardo Dicaprio is probably the best Musketeers adaption IMO.
He should do the anime version where the entire thing is set in the far future with space travels yet the overall story is basically the same
@@markrogers6601 i haven't seen any of the Three Musketeers films except for the Micky Mouse version.😂 lol I think that might be as far as I'm gonna go. The rest look a little sketchy.
My favourite part of Watership Down will always be when Big Wig mentions "MY chief rabbit" and General Woundwort essentially shits himself because what rabbit could be the boss of such a big and powerful warrior as Big Wig? I cry every time 😭❤️
Also the animation of El-ahrairah's story at the beginning was insanely powerful and captivating to me ever since I saw it as a child. I rewatched the film recently with my mum and it's just sooooo good!
I've never read the book but the film has indelibly seared itself into my brain as a child. My sister who is ten years older cannot watch it still.
So many good life lessons came from this film.
4:01 Unless I "feverdreamed" this movie (and soundtrack LP) as a child in the 80s it most definitely wasn't released in 1994. Wikipedia says 1978.
That jumped out at me too.
Ok, I was thinking the same thing. I was waaay too old to be called a child in 94, but I distinctly remember watching this on HBO (before that channel was 24 hours / day. . .yep, way back then) as a kid. For a minute I wondered if I had seen the movie in a vision like Fiver :-D
Definitely 1978. I saw it when I was at uni.
I'm glad I'm not the only one to be confused by this.
i went on a pilgrimage to watership down in 1998. "fun" fact, it's owned by andrew lloyd webber, and is a stud farm. the local pub thought we were off our rocker to walk there late autumn in the rain, but needs must. we didn’t see any rabbits, but left a small shrine for the black rabbit of inlè. 💖
Mind, I *love* the song Bright Eyes (Art Garfunkel's only solo success, I think), but it does stop the film dead. I get what they were trying to do (depict Fiver's grief over his brother's death & his confusion over his conflicting visions), but it wasn't the best way to do it.
And bluntly, I always get pissed at folks claiming that "it's not for children!" when something is violent or otherwise real. We're supposed to be teaching our kids of life, real life does not care about "children" when it comes to horrifying violence, and sanitizing stories & art only gives them a skewed, unrealistic view of the world that ends up sabotaging them in the long run.
Ah yes, this delightful little movie I was shown as a child by my overly enthusiastic mother that thought nothing of exposing her very young daughter to cute little bunnies ripping each other apart, being torn asunder by a rabid dog, and foul-mouthed sea fowl. My dreams are still haunted by the colony genocide sequence.
Even more amusing, my mother was a first grade teacher that decided to play this film to several years worth of children in her class. To this day I still wonder what exactly went through her head to make her think it was appropriate for that particular age group, and I'm also still amazed that she never got complaints from the parents all those years ago. Then I remember that Indiana Jones and The Raiders of the Lost Ark was rated PG here in the States. And so was Who Framed Roger Rabbit.
Oh Raiders of the Lost Ark doesn't hold a candle to THIS. Then again our elementary school teacher showed us Coraline so....
Same. Watched it as an adult, found out a recurring nightmare since childhood of rabbits getting gassed and squished was not 2000AD related (relatively bloody scifi and horror comic) but a spot-on recreation of the colony genocide.
You think THAT'S fucked up? For decades, the 1st animated movie adaptation of Watership Down was rated "appropriate for all ages" in the UK (until recently) !
Say what you want about this movie; Bright Eyes, the song that was in this film, is truly beautiful and moving.
I mean, when The Dom said he hated the “Bright Eyes” segment, I audibly screamed *”Really The Dom!”* because he made himself sound like an emotionless machine! I grew up on the Autism Spectrum, which can make us struggle to connect emotionally other people and concepts, but that entire sequence made me cry because I understood emotionally and mentally that it was a non-literal representation of Fiver’s memories of his beloved brother Hazel and his struggle to accept he could suddenly be gone just like that! I mean, as an Autistic person that’s been in school programs that separated me from the “normal” students and put me next to a bunch of other Neurodivergent kids, I saw so much of other people I have known all my life ( _and a bit of myself, too_ ) in Fiver, as his clairvoyance caused him to think differently from so called “normal” rabbits, so obviously I am definitely a bit more emotionally sympathetic and responsive to his character arc.
I love the animation for it where it mixes a colored pencil/charcoal look with the traditional hand-painted animation. And the song is honestly really pretty; maybe Dom doesn’t like Garfunkel 😆
@@LucyLioness100 It was Garfunkel’s only post Paul Simon hit he ever got for a reason. It’s one of the most thoughtful meditations of life and death I’ve heard in a song. A lot of people who otherwise *hate* solo Garfunkel at least like this song.
Perhaps "loyal to a fault" would be a good opposite of "in name only"? Or, "same soup, different pot?" "Visually/virtually unabridged"?
There's a few things I came to appreciate on a recent review of Watership Down:
The opening sequence is a flyover that goes from Watership Down to the start of the story. It tracks their journey in reverse.
The other is that very little is done as a Deus ex machina. Like the raft, they figure out how to float on the water with it and say they need to remember it. Later, they pass a boat on a creek so it's there but it looks like scenery. Then they need an escape during their pussy raid and they use the boat.
I appreciate little touches like that and it goes even further to push Adam's intent to not treat children like idiots. In a lesser story, every solution would have just popped out of thin air.
The Bright Eyes section is less than a minute long, and it's amazing, so sod you.
I've heard of this movie/book but never seen/read it, so I'm prepared to be dismayed. 😁
Oh hey same
It's not even that dark or gory... Or maybe I just think that as I never actually watched the film or read the book until I was an older child so I probably was more desensitised
You misspelled ‘destroyed’ 😭
🎵be prepared 🎶
This damn movie literally gave me /years/ of severe nightmares, lost sleep and anxiety as a kid. I will forever resent the adult who though that this was a good choice for a movie/pizza night with 6 year old me.
The bright eyes is wonderful
That plot summary is just class
I remember seeing this when I was 9, I had read the book a year earlier. The violence didn't really make an impression on me then but watching it again in my forties I'm like Damn! This is pretty violent !
Same. As a child I was rather unfased by it, perhaps because I didn't fully understand it and was used to seeing animals hunt and kill one another due to National Geography documentaries. I still remember it clearly though, but it gives me nightmares 20 odd years later.
Children are hardcore goths.
I was a weird kid, as I f**king loved, LOVED, the Watership Down the movie when I was 5 years old. LOL, I remember being upset at the time that G.I Joe never had anyone get shot when everyone had guns and I thought that was really unrealistic so the horrible death of rabbits film was a breath of fresh air.
You could call it a Bookslap adaptation, because they clearly had someone to slap the film makers with the book when they said "What if we changed this?"
Was NOT expecting that plot summary, oh my God, LOLing.