Moral of the story, a great song recorded well on cheap gear will outshine a not so great song recorded on expensive gear with less skill. End of the day, the average consumer of music doesn’t care what was used to get the end result. All they know is they either like your music or they don’t. Great content as usual Graham.
BeatsBangTV my thoughts too, this was a cool unbiased shootout, thanks Graham. I have the B1 and rode nt2a, both quite bright for my vocal I have found. Most of the time end up using a sm58 clone, lol
I agree. As a music producer, I have a different ear. I want everything to sound near perfect. I have people who love good music. The technical side of engineering is cared for seldomly.
The most affected area that will take cake of cheap bs expensive When a person sings too loud above the mic clip threshold then things get messy with cheap
It's no way you can judge that by this video, because you don't know how the source sounds like. The only way to know how flat a microphone's EQ is by testing it recording a white noise coming out from studio monitors. Because white noise is perfectly flat and neutral.
@@andrewt248 Still your judgement is invalid because you don't know how the actual sound source like. I don't want to repeat my advice because i know you're close minded. Bye bye.
Melodica - I understand your point but since white noise was not used, to test, all we have to compare is his vocal. Knowing that; what is your opinion on the differences and similarities between the two microphones?
The brightness of the C1 makes it very hard to tuck it in a mix even after saturation. It sticks out like a sore thumb. The TLM is on another level, not 10 times better but gives something that the C1 can't
TLM is too expensive but C1 also working well. And doing job well like TLM. There is no big difference. Never spend money without skills. No use. But if u r rich guys u can go for TLM . And another gear. Like audio interface APPOLO . save money
There's definitely a pretty big difference between these two mics and back to back you can't deny the TLM 102 sounds objectively better. Do you need it for recording? Definitely not, but I think the budget mic used in this example was not the best one to put up against the Neuman because I've heard budget mics that can stand up to the tLM 102 better than this one. I get his point, I agree you don't need pricey gear tomake music, just a bad matchup between these two mics.
@@MJ_Pictures_Studio There are better alternatives as Crystal Dennis Music said. Lewitt, Warm audio and more. Besides that, the plugins that were used (Slate) are also very expensive so basically you don't save money. C1 was good when I was 15 and I was recording with my friends. If you want to be a singer or record professionally then it's an investment that you have to make. If you record on and off, then renting is a better option. You can save money on interfaces and software but not on microphones. And I learned this the hard way.
Yeti. Agreed. The first thing I do on a bright mic is EQ out the so-called "presence peak" and then EQ and process according to the needs of the source.
I used to work for Sennheiser. In the shop we had a jig that we put the shotgun (condenser) mics in to test them. We’d run a frequency sweep and display a chart on a screen (like the response chart you’d get packed with the mic). They were never exactly the same but if the capsule was too far off or the electronics were defective we’d replace parts until the trace was within normal limits (of course we’d keep the best ones for ourselves and our friends). The transducer we used in the jig was nothing more than a headphone capsule from an HD 414 headphone (if you remember those). The jig kept it a constant distance from the mic, and then we just swept the frequency with an oscillator. I don’t see why no one does that today - and eliminate all the guess work over which mics sounds better. Even when we mix with EQ we’re only seeing how much gain or boost we apply - not the effective (modified) frequency response curve we are creating. That would be a lot more useful.
If it was a blind test I would have the C1 ahead of the game - it's brighter and I prefer it. Lovely track and I really like your voice - a wee touch of Sting, which is high praise indeed.
He is very likable, and his info and tips are really inspiring. It's refreshing to see someone talk recording without adding a gear tax on it. Spend this to sound better.
The Neumann gives more options and has a larger spectrum. The Behringer just sounds a bit plasticky. In my opinion it really lacks low end. I listened on my wireless Sony headphones. If the Behringer's imperfections (after processing) compared to the Neumann are so audible on such cheap headphones, I'm afraid they will stick out quite a bit on my studio monitors. If you are in a pinch the C1 can be useful, however if I had to choose between the two I'll always choose the TLM 102.
Ya. I feel bad when these guys dont level with people about gear. Youre not going to get a vocal to sit right recorded on a Behringer. Not going to happen. The gear is just as important as the knowledge and experience. You cant skimp anywhere. But I also know that his audience is not pro audio guys. Theyre guys making due in their basements and their bedrooms so with that in mind it makes sense. I guess it bums me out that seems hes given people an impossible mission.
@@thetruthchannel349 I was talking about this last week. I have the Nuemann U87, I also have a cheap Cad microphone. I noticed that you can't really tell them apart if you know how to mix. His demonstrations was accurate.
@@thetruthchannel349 If he made a video and didn't disclose what type of mic he used, you wouldn't know the difference. What you're talking is nonsense.
The c1 was my first mic. It's a good mic and it can sound even better than the tlm for some purposes, especially when you are working on moderate volumes. For very loud music it might fall over the place. I remembered working with the tlm in a commercial studio and saying "I can get this result in my studio", and I was right.
Well, as far as I can see the difference between those is about as much as a large diaphragm condenser can differ. The TLM is not only different in eq but far superior considering transient clarity as far as one can tell via youtube. If that kind of quality difference is worth your hard earned money is a complete different story for sure.
Agree, TLM is one mid scoop from ready. With C-1 i felt that it needed de-esser and there was some distortion in the the esses overall. But once he said that he liked the C-1 sound right away, it kind of tells us what kind of sound we are looking for.. and for that the C-1 was better right out of the gate. I'm full convert of "price doesn't matter as much" group, i've had my awakening in that area over a decade ago on bit larger double blind, week long mic shootout (2nd cheapest won, NT1, 5 times less than what came second) but this time, i would pick the TLM.
I preferred the raw sound of the Neumann, but I always thought you could make up a lot in post. And you proved it. As I am purely an amateur, and a dub one at that, I appreciate that. Thanks.
So guys, I just bought the C-1 for home recording, got my little rig set up, guitar, mic and looking for a cheapish weighted 49key midi keys, but I can say that the C-1 is fantastic, I use Reaper for my recording and found that reaper has some great tools to mellow te sound of the mic, before hand I was using a USB mic which wasn't anywhere near as good as this and found that the quality of the C-1 is by far the best quality I have used over my friends studio mic there is hardly if any difference to the sound.... Honest opinion my C-1 vs my friends NW-800...... The C-1 out performs, maybe its my vocals but I feel that I get a better performance. PS I use for music vocal recording and also Voice over as an Actor and Musician. Hope this helps anyone who is new to the game
The Neumann gives a noticeably more intimate and personal sound to the vocal to my ears. But for $60 as a getting started mic... it certainly can work for new people starting out. I think that point if this video is to prove that there are no excuses for not being able to record good music and good vocals on your own with a very limited budget. Thanks!
I brought 2 several years ago and got them right before a gig! I used 1 as a over hang and the other on guitar amp!! OMG they I got for these mics made me go buy 8 more! Perfect for snare, hi hats Toms and horns!!! The best 60 bucks that you can spend!!!!! Hands down!!!!
To me, TLM sounds better for lead vocals (clarity), C1 for background (warmer)...but the C1 gets the job done, I have the C1 myself...I think it can be subjective depending on what sound you going for
Actually liked the sound of the Behringer C1 better after you eq'd it. Just prefered the brightness of it cutting through the mix without having to side chain at all.
I use C1 in my home studio and its been wonderful. But TLM102 means less work on the DAW. Even so, the vocalist should be great first and the engineer should know what they are looking for. Great Video!
Just a de esser and the behringer is golden! I’ve been looking at a c1. Excellent video! Just a little work you can make lower price points work incredibly well!
I think the tlm 102 suits females voices well that raspy pop sound translates in the Neumann from my experience. But the frequency response doesn’t suit all voices. But I would use that C1 gladly.
The expensive mic is definitely more neutral allowing you to dial the sound exactly how you want. However the cheap mic isn't bad after tweaking and still got good results!
At first i liked the $60 Behringer but after the EQ i think i preferred the $700 because it seems more full and richer. But once again it is amazing how good inexpensive Mics can be. I bought your recommendation the Samson C1 and it has been doing well. Your vids have really blessed me with info and experiential knowledge! Thanks my friend
@Jake de Jongh I think the difference is that it'd be easier to throw some saturation on the high end of the Neumann to get some sizzle than it would be to EQ out the harshness of the Behringer. My own experience is that it's often incredibly difficult to EQ out the harshness of cheap mics, even with something like Soothe.
The basket and carriage the condensers sit in make a huge difference in what a mic sounds like. A lot of these cheaper mics not only use cheap materials in their condensers but they use synthetic plastic metal mesh materials in the baskets and carriages themselves.
Tenor, soprano, base, acoustics in the room etc... there are many variables that plays and difference between these 2 cardiod microphones. Great video.
Ive used the C1 for almost 10 years now and it has never let me down. There are times where it sounds really cheap but with a quick fix I can make it sound hella clean
I like the sound of the C-1, but I may be biased since I have a C-3 (which I also bought from Sweetwater). I'm glad you did this comparison as it shows once again that expensive mics shouldn't be as expensive as they are. There is not a whole lot of difference between the C-1 and TLM.
Great comparison. Actually personally i prefer the mics that are warmer and fuller because i see most of them when you process them they sound kinda cheap in comparison with a more expensive mic that it is more durable to processing.
Love the video, and didn’t realize you could sing so well!! I finally got a $900 microphone, I still love using my $60 MXL because I know exactly where it’s weaknesses are!
A ‘better’ mic is relative to whatever the job or creative vision is. Some mics can get you there closer and faster, but it still depends on what you’re working towards
for this recording the b1 is definately better sounding since it cut through the beat quite nicely, but both mics are good its not about the price its about the textures you get with them.
At 60$ ... Behringer win by far. One more proof that the key element of any recording is the quality of the actual performance, be a vocalist, an instrument, a sound fx, whatever. And then, the knowledge and expertise of the engineer capturing that performance.
I really like the brightness of the c-1. The nuemann for such a drastic price difference isn't justifiable to drop $700 on, especially if you aren't a professional in a legit studio, it the end the c-1 is the over all winner cause the main consumer of that Mic is going to be hobbyist and bedroom studio musicians, now what if somebody like yourself as a professional, record a full record on this Mic? And released the record through sony or whatever, a professional engineer is going to make the c-1 sound like a million bucks and in the end people don't really care, as long as the music is good.
Sometimes that grit is what makes outstanding records. I’m currently producing a record for a client and I literally liked the idea of using a Fender P-Bass from the 90s and it sounds old. And I love it. Fun fact. The rest of the production is based on synths and virtual instruments. Except for guitars and vocals.
@@JesusArmasOficial That's a great approach. Maintaining some kind of human/imperfect element is very important because I think it helps you to connect on an emotional level and it adds life to a recording.
Lars Andreas Johansson totally. When I got that bass into the studio and played with it I figured that it sounded great to give that organic feel. Feeling used, old but rockin as well.
I like your videos, Graham, although this shootout suffers from the same thing almost every test or comparison suffers; knowing in advance. I like the blind test, where you play recordings from both contestants in random order and blind, so you don't know which is which. Then let your public decide what they think is the best or whatever. The results are amazing.
I genuinely loved my Behringer C1, which I bought in 2008 and lasted me until last year before suddenly dying after years of being battered about in studios and in bags n stuff. Replaced it with an Audio Technica AT2020 which I blagged for £72 with a sale coupon. Both are absolute bargains for bedroom producers like myself that just like to knock up home demo stuff or record band rehearsals. The C1 sounds really nice recording piano btw. I thought it was a great vocal mic, but not great at spoken word stuff because of it's brightness. I love how you demonstrated that the harshness can be mixed nice with a few plug ins. The C-1 and/or a cheap SM57 copy from Pyle or Stagg for around £15-£20, a free daw like CakeWalk or Reaper and a USB XLR interface are all you really need these days to record a decent sounding demo/home tape. It's amazing, int it? 20 years ago, the equipment these free VSTs and DAWs offer and decent mics would have cost an absolute fortune.
Getting a great preamp will do the trick to any mic is something that I've learned recently but when you record you have to preform your lyrics and imagine how you want them to sound then make that happen.
Honestly the comments are correct what makes the TLM way more worthy is the fullness because it’s more room to work with in the EQ process, where as the C1 Forces a harsh brightness almost artificially into the mix
I'm mixing and mastering those "c1" recordings quite a lot. The problem is that it's very hard to make it cut through the loud instrumental (i'm mostly work with edm) without making mid/high super harsh. You just have a lot more room to boost the vocals the way you need with Neumann. but...ofc if you on a budget - get c1 and keep your eye on the peaks cuz it can distort quite bad on high peaks
Thanks man. This video helped me a lot. I have the C-1 and was debating on spending more money for a better mic before I get started. For sure not gonna stress it anymore and just jump right in and do work.
C1 on a well written song and mixed well should be fine.If you can afford the 102 by all means buy it, but always try to make what you already have sound good.
I remember when I got the Antares mic modeller. By and large, I was ridiculed for thinking that it was actually able to model those high-end mics. A couple years later I saw Todd Rungren used it on one of his cds. Now plug ins for everything is all the rage. Shows you how wrong common thought can be.
I am a singer and currently using SAMSON C01u USB Condenser Microphone and want to upgrade my home vocal recording setup. I am confused with the following microphones: 1. Lewitt LCT 240 PRO 2. Lewitt LCT 440 PURE 3. AKG P120 4. AKG P220 Note : I don't have a treated room. Looking forward for your suggestion.
Hi. You sing closer to the Newman, then add a dB to it, which make it peak in the loudest transients. If we sing a little closer to the C1, we can recover some low frequencies and maybe some transients. Not 10x difference.
Another great video. I prefer the Neumann. It's proven that a cheap mic can sound professional however I was listening very carefully at both after Gram processed them and there is something about the each mic's capsule that I could notice, maybe it has to do with each mic's max spl.
Great video Graham! As always everything defaults to the performance first, then you can throw the glitter on the tracks. Of course, the more expensive mic sounds better but my budget won't allow it. Still using my 30 years old SM 58 and 57.
I agree. Good recording result is highly related to personal skills. For high quality microphones we pay for the build quality and features as well as the sound quality. Thank you for the great and very useful video.
The C1 was pretty close but felt it needed maybe some dynamic Eq in upper mids or some BX Refinement.. I guess the moral of the story is the more expensive mic needs less work to get it to sound more “polished”.. some EQ and compression and the Neumann was on point .. C1 needed some Stephen Slate on there (i was wondering if you’d pull out some VTM on the C1)
To your point, yes, the SOUND quality overall, if you're buying well known mics, even low price, will be great and will be a matter of EQ. However, and this is the actually big thing, mics will generally have a huge gap on how much db they can support. If you have a singer with a really loud, potent, voice you'll be in trouble most likely if you're using low price mics. You could decrease gain, volume while capturing, yes, but you'll also loose frequencies there. So yes, in general, might never be an issue, but sometimes that loud capture you need to make might be troublesome and ending up loosing quality. There are, though, low price mics that will also support high dB capture.
Great vid man! Can’t fuck with the Neumann though. I had the 103 and like the 102 better but now I have the U87 but these days I been using the Slate VMS.
The TLM leaves much more room to shape your vocal to your liking. The C1 sound bright but it's like a brightness that's baked into the recording. If your budget allows I would definitely recommend the TLM over the C1
Love to see that i am not only person whose fighting with harshness in beheringer microphones But thanks to you now i have solution from my favourite teacher ❤️❤️ Love from india ❤️
It might be the headphones im on, and also i know TH-cam screws up audio anyway. The C1 sounds a little noisier when your singing (but that might be the mid bump you are referring to). It's definitely not 10 times the difference though.
LOL. I have a B-1 at my home studio and I only record scratch vocals there... maybe I should put a little more effort into my recording instead of expecting my engineer to do all my hard work at his studio ^_^;
I love it when you cant hold the mask: "So what's the point of all this? (giggles) the point is as usual...." It must be hard to hear yourself say the same thing so many times, just to give us a clear message :D It's working though. Havent bought new gear in about 3 years now, and now I'm finally getting a little acoustic treatment set up, instead of buying new monitors, pedals and gear in general. You can really get far on very limited budgets nowadays! Just like your videos show us again and again! :) Thank you teaching me stuff the last 5-6 years.
The C1 is a little brighter and slightly harsh in the higher frequencies, whereas the TLM 102 sounds a little more warm and smooth. However, with a little EQing and De-Essing, the C1 will definitely suffice.
At my studio, the main TLM 102 microphone, an excellent microphone, the tracks recorded on it through Focusrite Scralett 2Gen several times hit the Russian top 10 Apple Music, and the total advances exceeded $ 50K. Today I already work with RME Babyface Pro FS, a terrific interface, I recommend it. P.S. I apologize, there may be problems with my English.
Graham whenever I have doubts I always refer to your inspiring videos.. You have time and time again demonstrated it not about the price of the gear. It is your ability to manipulate it to accomplish what u need. 👍👍👍👍👍
if you record pink noise of both mics and use a matching eq software to match the C1 pink noise to the Neuman's. I'm pretty sure you will get a crazy result.
The 10k plus in the C1 sounds a bit distorted. I have a couple NT1s that have that same type of compressed-mesh basket and I think you actually get in-basket echo that distorts the phase of the HF because the basket isn’t evenly open, it’s more compressed toward the body of the mic. Only really high frequencies will do this because the length of the sound wave at that frequency is short enough to bounce about in the basket.
I prefer the Behringer C1 I had that microphone and someone borrowed it and didn’t return it. It sounds good enough to cut through the mix with similar Eq processing, I like the brightness. Thanks for sharing.
At 17:27 i realised you sing this fragment a bit differently on those 2 mics. In the "$60 mic footage" you sing "BUTCH U" and the "$700 mic footage" you sing "BUhh U" which makes more subjective difference, since you add really sharp tones to your singing in one microphone, and really flat to the other, and this affects the way you mix since you MAKE IT SEEM the more expensive one is flatter, and the other is sharper. I am no musician, I am no singer, i am no content creator, but still, this makes me automatically feel different for those.
What I like depends on my needs, which is the source and where it's supposed to go. I had a wonderful time getting voices almost exactly where I needed them with a Neumann CLM563+M7 (little bottle and round capsule) once. That thing could not be proximity-spoiled. Other mics required more care in placement and speaker location. I like both these mics, but the less time I have or the less capable someone is at EQ'ing, the more the microphones output should match what you need. At least that has been my experience.
For a shoot-out like this, might it be possible to have both mics set up the same distance from the singer? That way, exactly the same performance is recorded at the same time.
True, that would have been more "scientific". I would have liked it if he'd done it that way. But still, I think the performances were very much in the same ballpark, and the differences between the mics was pretty obvious.
My first condenser mic was the Behringer C-1U. At the time tho I dont use eq to mix my vocals because I was a beginner. Now, I sold it to my friend and use an AKG 120 and 220 microphone which I find brightens my vocals a little bit too much. idk I might get another microphone. I need to try one that has more body and not brightness.
There is almost no difference on my Galaxy A5 2017. I can hear that the tlm 102 is smoother in the higher range while the behringer is sharp and little bit harsh. Neumann gives nice flat sound so you can play with the eq. Thanks for this comparison. Greetings from Poland.
Some time ago I recorded two albums in home. I started with a $100 mike (Behringer C-3) and was very frustrated because all vocals were getting crappy. I was about to get out and buy an EXPENSIVE one when I just remembered about the $10 bucks SM-57 clone (from a crazy brand called GPA) that I had purchased but never used. Of course it wouldn't hurt anyone to give it a try. Long story short I plugged it in and the vocals just became awesome. I immediately sold the C-3 and since then I use this cheapo mike for all my recordings. Who could explain this?
From the jump i liked the $60 mic for the brightness and even with the plugins but The $700 has warmer sound to it. Also, tho its not my style of music at all. Great sounding voice.
Great video! I have been trying out all the mics at the studio I work at to see what sounds best on my voice. So far the Neumann U87 is winning. The Manley is next up, and the Sony C800 is last which I know a lot of people like this mic, but it is too bright for my vocals, almost sounds brittle sometimes.
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When I click on the link it times out. But when I add www. before StudioGearGuide.com then it works. Just an FYI. I can't wait to check it out!
what's the title of this song? and where can i buy it ?
Bro I wanna hear this song
Instead
Nks for this video, guess I just keep my C1 lol, and bye me some studio Monitors
You have cured my "it is not the fault of my skills, it is the fault of my gear" syndrom and pushed me to just work harder. Precious content.
haha, that's good news! i had to keep upgrading just to learn that it was actually my mix & master at fault, not the mic
Moral of the story, a great song recorded well on cheap gear will outshine a not so great song recorded on expensive gear with less skill. End of the day, the average consumer of music doesn’t care what was used to get the end result. All they know is they either like your music or they don’t. Great content as usual Graham.
BeatsBangTV my thoughts too, this was a cool unbiased shootout, thanks Graham. I have the B1 and rode nt2a, both quite bright for my vocal I have found. Most of the time end up using a sm58 clone, lol
I agree. As a music producer, I have a different ear. I want everything to sound near perfect. I have people who love good music. The technical side of engineering is cared for seldomly.
The most affected area that will take cake of cheap bs expensive
When a person sings too loud above the mic clip threshold then things get messy with cheap
Ain't that the truth, brother.
totally agree w/u
I'm using the C1 right now on an EP. It's honestly serving me just fine!
I feel like the Neumann has a flatter, more natural EQ curve, but that doesn't mean that is the best thing for every vocalist in every track.
It's no way you can judge that by this video, because you don't know how the source sounds like.
The only way to know how flat a microphone's EQ is by testing it recording a white noise coming out from studio monitors.
Because white noise is perfectly flat and neutral.
@@melodica5407 I said FLATTER, as in relative to the other mic in the comparison, not absolutely flat.
@@andrewt248 Still your judgement is invalid because you don't know how the actual sound source like.
I don't want to repeat my advice because i know you're close minded.
Bye bye.
@@melodica5407 I'm not closed-minded. You are not perceiving what I am communicating. He says the same thing in the video. Bye bye.
Melodica - I understand your point but since white noise was not used, to test, all we have to compare is his vocal. Knowing that; what is your opinion on the differences and similarities between the two microphones?
You can get the Behringer used for 20 bucks. Insane.
I did . that's why I was watching this . it was an impulse buy when I was browsing for pedals at a pawn shop . glad I grabbed it .
The price of the new Behringer C-1 is now in Russia $ 35
the price of a new one, in brazil, is 400/500R$ :(
Türkiye'de 400 lira amk :(
@@laziiner1682 And now is 600/700R$ haha, i'm crying ;-;
Behringer C1: the first condenser mic I ever bought back in 2006. What an amazing mic for the price! Still a workhorse till today.
I'd love to hear the whole song. Got a great groove.
There isn't huge difference between microphones anymore. If they are, a simple eq tweak can change that.
The brightness of the C1 makes it very hard to tuck it in a mix even after saturation. It sticks out like a sore thumb. The TLM is on another level, not 10 times better but gives something that the C1 can't
TLM is too expensive but C1 also working well. And doing job well like TLM. There is no big difference. Never spend money without skills. No use. But if u r rich guys u can go for TLM . And another gear. Like audio interface APPOLO . save money
There's definitely a pretty big difference between these two mics and back to back you can't deny the TLM 102 sounds objectively better. Do you need it for recording? Definitely not, but I think the budget mic used in this example was not the best one to put up against the Neuman because I've heard budget mics that can stand up to the tLM 102 better than this one. I get his point, I agree you don't need pricey gear tomake music, just a bad matchup between these two mics.
@@MJ_Pictures_Studio There are better alternatives as Crystal Dennis Music said. Lewitt, Warm audio and more. Besides that, the plugins that were used (Slate) are also very expensive so basically you don't save money.
C1 was good when I was 15 and I was recording with my friends. If you want to be a singer or record professionally then it's an investment that you have to make. If you record on and off, then renting is a better option. You can save money on interfaces and software but not on microphones. And I learned this the hard way.
Yeti. Agreed. The first thing I do on a bright mic is EQ out the so-called "presence peak" and then EQ and process according to the needs of the source.
@@MJ_Pictures_Studio The TLM is worth every single penny.
I used to work for Sennheiser. In the shop we had a jig that we put the shotgun (condenser) mics in to test them. We’d run a frequency sweep and display a chart on a screen (like the response chart you’d get packed with the mic). They were never exactly the same but if the capsule was too far off or the electronics were defective we’d replace parts until the trace was within normal limits (of course we’d keep the best ones for ourselves and our friends). The transducer we used in the jig was nothing more than a headphone capsule from an HD 414 headphone (if you remember those). The jig kept it a constant distance from the mic, and then we just swept the frequency with an oscillator. I don’t see why no one does that today - and eliminate all the guess work over which mics sounds better. Even when we mix with EQ we’re only seeing how much gain or boost we apply - not the effective (modified) frequency response curve we are creating. That would be a lot more useful.
I have the C1.
Haven't used it yet, but it will have to come out of the box now and play.
If it was a blind test I would have the C1 ahead of the game - it's brighter and I prefer it. Lovely track and I really like your voice - a wee touch of Sting, which is high praise indeed.
ill Factor feat. Graham Cochrane you dont know me
He is very likable, and his info and tips are really inspiring.
It's refreshing to see someone talk recording without adding a gear tax on it. Spend this to sound better.
The Neumann gives more options and has a larger spectrum. The Behringer just sounds a bit plasticky. In my opinion it really lacks low end.
I listened on my wireless Sony headphones. If the Behringer's imperfections (after processing) compared to the Neumann are so audible on such cheap headphones, I'm afraid they will stick out quite a bit on my studio monitors.
If you are in a pinch the C1 can be useful, however if I had to choose between the two I'll always choose the TLM 102.
Ya. I feel bad when these guys dont level with people about gear. Youre not going to get a vocal to sit right recorded on a Behringer. Not going to happen. The gear is just as important as the knowledge and experience. You cant skimp anywhere. But I also know that his audience is not pro audio guys. Theyre guys making due in their basements and their bedrooms so with that in mind it makes sense. I guess it bums me out that seems hes given people an impossible mission.
@@thetruthchannel349 I was talking about this last week. I have the Nuemann U87, I also have a cheap Cad microphone. I noticed that you can't really tell them apart if you know how to mix. His demonstrations was accurate.
Dante, that is nonsense.
@@thetruthchannel349 If he made a video and didn't disclose what type of mic he used, you wouldn't know the difference. What you're talking is nonsense.
Dante if you own a U87 I am an old 4 track Tascam.
The c1 was my first mic. It's a good mic and it can sound even better than the tlm for some purposes, especially when you are working on moderate volumes. For very loud music it might fall over the place. I remembered working with the tlm in a commercial studio and saying "I can get this result in my studio", and I was right.
Well, as far as I can see the difference between those is about as much as a large diaphragm condenser can differ. The TLM is not only different in eq but far superior considering transient clarity as far as one can tell via youtube. If that kind of quality difference is worth your hard earned money is a complete different story for sure.
Agree, TLM is one mid scoop from ready. With C-1 i felt that it needed de-esser and there was some distortion in the the esses overall. But once he said that he liked the C-1 sound right away, it kind of tells us what kind of sound we are looking for.. and for that the C-1 was better right out of the gate. I'm full convert of "price doesn't matter as much" group, i've had my awakening in that area over a decade ago on bit larger double blind, week long mic shootout (2nd cheapest won, NT1, 5 times less than what came second) but this time, i would pick the TLM.
I preferred the raw sound of the Neumann, but I always thought you could make up a lot in post. And you proved it. As I am purely an amateur, and a dub one at that, I appreciate that. Thanks.
So guys, I just bought the C-1 for home recording, got my little rig set up, guitar, mic and looking for a cheapish weighted 49key midi keys, but I can say that the C-1 is fantastic, I use Reaper for my recording and found that reaper has some great tools to mellow te sound of the mic, before hand I was using a USB mic which wasn't anywhere near as good as this and found that the quality of the C-1 is by far the best quality I have used over my friends studio mic there is hardly if any difference to the sound....
Honest opinion my C-1 vs my friends NW-800...... The C-1 out performs, maybe its my vocals but I feel that I get a better performance.
PS I use for music vocal recording and also Voice over as an Actor and Musician.
Hope this helps anyone who is new to the game
The Neumann gives a noticeably more intimate and personal sound to the vocal to my ears. But for $60 as a getting started mic... it certainly can work for new people starting out. I think that point if this video is to prove that there are no excuses for not being able to record good music and good vocals on your own with a very limited budget. Thanks!
I just learned that the frequency response charts are even more important than I had ever realized. Also important is the self-noise level of the mic.
I brought 2 several years ago and got them right before a gig! I used 1 as a over hang and the other on guitar amp!! OMG they I got for these mics made me go buy 8 more! Perfect for snare, hi hats Toms and horns!!! The best 60 bucks that you can spend!!!!! Hands down!!!!
To me, TLM sounds better for lead vocals (clarity), C1 for background (warmer)...but the C1 gets the job done, I have the C1 myself...I think it can be subjective depending on what sound you going for
Actually liked the sound of the Behringer C1 better after you eq'd it. Just prefered the brightness of it cutting through the mix without having to side chain at all.
I use C1 in my home studio and its been wonderful. But TLM102 means less work on the DAW. Even so, the vocalist should be great first and the engineer should know what they are looking for. Great Video!
Just a de esser and the behringer is golden! I’ve been looking at a c1. Excellent video! Just a little work you can make lower price points work incredibly well!
I think the tlm 102 suits females voices well that raspy pop sound translates in the Neumann from my experience. But the frequency response doesn’t suit all voices. But I would use that C1 gladly.
Thank you so much for this video, you helped me decide for the C1, which is the one I'm able to buy. thank you!
I thought the c1 was nice but I began to feel that my eardrums were going to burst. If I hadcto choose though I'd go with the c1
the power is in the mix the mic doesnt mean as much as people think i was using blu snowball for some time
The expensive mic is definitely more neutral allowing you to dial the sound exactly how you want. However the cheap mic isn't bad after tweaking and still got good results!
At first i liked the $60 Behringer but after the EQ i think i preferred the $700 because it seems more full and richer. But once again it is amazing how good inexpensive Mics can be. I bought your recommendation the Samson C1 and it has been doing well. Your vids have really blessed me with info and experiential knowledge! Thanks my friend
The Neumann still sound smoother even after you've done a lof of processing on the Behringer.
Why not. Because its too expensive . If it is same than what the use of buying expensive mic ?
@Jake de Jongh I think the difference is that it'd be easier to throw some saturation on the high end of the Neumann to get some sizzle than it would be to EQ out the harshness of the Behringer. My own experience is that it's often incredibly difficult to EQ out the harshness of cheap mics, even with something like Soothe.
The Neumann is a FAR superior mic. Thats why they dont use Behringer mics at Capitol or Abbey Road.
The Neumann sounds more natural to me. The Behringer sounds kind of thin and harsh and jarring to me.
The basket and carriage the condensers sit in make a huge difference in what a mic sounds like. A lot of these cheaper mics not only use cheap materials in their condensers but they use synthetic plastic metal mesh materials in the baskets and carriages themselves.
There's no way I'd spend $700 on a mic that a $60 mic with a little tweaking sounds as good as. Thanks for doing this comparison.
Got to consider build quality too.
Tenor, soprano, base, acoustics in the room etc... there are many variables that plays and difference between these 2 cardiod microphones. Great video.
Ive used the C1 for almost 10 years now and it has never let me down. There are times where it sounds really cheap but with a quick fix I can make it sound hella clean
I like the sound of the C-1, but I may be biased since I have a C-3 (which I also bought from Sweetwater).
I'm glad you did this comparison as it shows once again that expensive mics shouldn't be as expensive as they are. There is not a whole lot of difference between the C-1 and TLM.
Great comparison. Actually personally i prefer the mics that are warmer and fuller because i see most of them when you process them they sound kinda cheap in comparison with a more expensive mic that it is more durable to processing.
Love the video, and didn’t realize you could sing so well!! I finally got a $900 microphone, I still love using my $60 MXL because I know exactly where it’s weaknesses are!
help bro my mxl 770 sounds so thin and yhe high frequncy is just awful
Hey, Dust Bunny, Which MXL microphone are you referring to?
It’s the MXL 440
I’ve used it on almost every song I’ve ever recorded up until very very recently.
@@dustbunnys Thanks my Brother, GBY
A ‘better’ mic is relative to whatever the job or creative vision is. Some mics can get you there closer and faster, but it still depends on what you’re working towards
Both sound better than my scarlet 2i2 mic so a guess amma buy that Beringer for the $60
for this recording the b1 is definately better sounding since it cut through the beat quite nicely, but both mics are good its not about the price its about the textures you get with them.
Your voice is so good , man ! The song is amazing , congrats !!!
At 60$ ... Behringer win by far. One more proof that the key element of any recording is the quality of the actual performance, be a vocalist, an instrument, a sound fx, whatever. And then, the knowledge and expertise of the engineer capturing that performance.
I fully agree ;)
I really like the brightness of the c-1. The nuemann for such a drastic price difference isn't justifiable to drop $700 on, especially if you aren't a professional in a legit studio, it the end the c-1 is the over all winner cause the main consumer of that Mic is going to be hobbyist and bedroom studio musicians, now what if somebody like yourself as a professional, record a full record on this Mic? And released the record through sony or whatever, a professional engineer is going to make the c-1 sound like a million bucks and in the end people don't really care, as long as the music is good.
Underrated comment.
The C1 seems to have like a grit to it. The Neumann sounds smoother and n natural. Both would work😁
That's why I actually like the C1 better.😶
Sometimes that grit is what makes outstanding records.
I’m currently producing a record for a client and I literally liked the idea of using a Fender P-Bass from the 90s and it sounds old. And I love it.
Fun fact.
The rest of the production is based on synths and virtual instruments.
Except for guitars and vocals.
@@JesusArmasOficial That's a great approach. Maintaining some kind of human/imperfect element is very important because I think it helps you to connect on an emotional level and it adds life to a recording.
Lars Andreas Johansson totally.
When I got that bass into the studio and played with it I figured that it sounded great to give that organic feel.
Feeling used, old but rockin as well.
@@JesusArmasOficial 90's sound new to me. But I was born in the 70's. lol
I like your videos, Graham, although this shootout suffers from the same thing almost every test or comparison suffers; knowing in advance. I like the blind test, where you play recordings from both contestants in random order and blind, so you don't know which is which. Then let your public decide what they think is the best or whatever. The results are amazing.
Good comparison. 😊
And thanx again, that you put in focus, that it's performance and work that makes the sound - not the gear! 🙏
I genuinely loved my Behringer C1, which I bought in 2008 and lasted me until last year before suddenly dying after years of being battered about in studios and in bags n stuff.
Replaced it with an Audio Technica AT2020 which I blagged for £72 with a sale coupon.
Both are absolute bargains for bedroom producers like myself that just like to knock up home demo stuff or record band rehearsals.
The C1 sounds really nice recording piano btw.
I thought it was a great vocal mic, but not great at spoken word stuff because of it's brightness. I love how you demonstrated that the harshness can be mixed nice with a few plug ins.
The C-1 and/or a cheap SM57 copy from Pyle or Stagg for around £15-£20, a free daw like CakeWalk or Reaper and a USB XLR interface are all you really need these days to record a decent sounding demo/home tape.
It's amazing, int it?
20 years ago, the equipment these free VSTs and DAWs offer and decent mics would have cost an absolute fortune.
Getting a great preamp will do the trick to any mic is something that I've learned recently but when you record you have to preform your lyrics and imagine how you want them to sound then make that happen.
I'm so frustrated, because everyone seems to hear a difference expect me.
You gotta wear quality headphones to hear it. Pay attention to the high end of the c1 vs the TLM
Brilliant insight. I think this video really highlights the “start with the source” mentality we all should have, great vocal performance 👍
Honestly the comments are correct what makes the TLM way more worthy is the fullness because it’s more room to work with in the EQ process, where as the C1 Forces a harsh brightness almost artificially into the mix
I love the TLM102!!!
Me too. It's a great all rounder for me.
A lot of Freddie Mercury's vocals were recorded on that mic.
That mic SUCKS. I KNOW A FELLOW WHO HAS IT, and it's TERRIBLE TO ME. Real thin sounding.
@@lightafluident.9950 That's just like your opinion man.
It's not the gear, it's the music. Good video!
I'm mixing and mastering those "c1" recordings quite a lot. The problem is that it's very hard to make it cut through the loud instrumental (i'm mostly work with edm) without making mid/high super harsh. You just have a lot more room to boost the vocals the way you need with Neumann. but...ofc if you on a budget - get c1 and keep your eye on the peaks cuz it can distort quite bad on high peaks
Same problems im facing with C1
There is more of a difference with a higher end mic pre. That low end on the TLM 102 will have a more noticeable fullness.
dude, the track and your vocals are amazing!
The TLM 102 just gives you so much more to work with
Hey Graham I do fine with Behringer C-1 its not bad if Shure my SM58 is first on my desk buddy
5:48 on the C1 it suits your voice but that so-called "presence peak" is often bright but ironically lacking presence and air. Good video.
Thanks man. This video helped me a lot. I have the C-1 and was debating on spending more money for a better mic before I get started. For sure not gonna stress it anymore and just jump right in and do work.
C1 on a well written song and mixed well should be fine.If you can afford the 102 by all means buy it, but always try to make what you already have sound good.
I remember when I got the Antares mic modeller. By and large, I was ridiculed for thinking that it was actually able to model those high-end mics. A couple years later I saw Todd Rungren used it on one of his cds.
Now plug ins for everything is all the rage. Shows you how wrong common thought can be.
I am a singer and currently using SAMSON C01u USB Condenser Microphone and want to upgrade my home vocal recording setup. I am confused with the following microphones:
1. Lewitt LCT 240 PRO
2. Lewitt LCT 440 PURE
3. AKG P120
4. AKG P220
Note : I don't have a treated room.
Looking forward for your suggestion.
15 minute mark you nailed it. Sounds like a great tune on the way!
Check out his EP! He's got the example song he used in this vid and a few other bangers in it. 10/10
Hi. You sing closer to the Newman, then add a dB to it, which make it peak in the loudest transients. If we sing a little closer to the C1, we can recover some low frequencies and maybe some transients. Not 10x difference.
Another great video. I prefer the Neumann. It's proven that a cheap mic can sound professional however I was listening very carefully at both after Gram processed them and there is something about the each mic's capsule that I could notice, maybe it has to do with each mic's max spl.
Great video Graham! As always everything defaults to the performance first, then you can throw the glitter on the tracks. Of course, the more expensive mic sounds better but my budget won't allow it. Still using my 30 years old SM 58 and 57.
I agree. Good recording result is highly related to personal skills. For high quality microphones we pay for the build quality and features as well as the sound quality.
Thank you for the great and very useful video.
it would be fun if you inverse the poll of one of these and see how much of the sounds is vanishing
Awesome lesson Graham
The C1 was pretty close but felt it needed maybe some dynamic Eq in upper mids or some BX Refinement..
I guess the moral of the story is the more expensive mic needs less work to get it to sound more “polished”.. some EQ and compression and the Neumann was on point .. C1 needed some Stephen Slate on there (i was wondering if you’d pull out some VTM on the C1)
It's not the gear. It's all in the mix. Hardwork and you'll get insanely good results with really cheap gear. Expensive gear just saves you time.
To your point, yes, the SOUND quality overall, if you're buying well known mics, even low price, will be great and will be a matter of EQ. However, and this is the actually big thing, mics will generally have a huge gap on how much db they can support. If you have a singer with a really loud, potent, voice you'll be in trouble most likely if you're using low price mics. You could decrease gain, volume while capturing, yes, but you'll also loose frequencies there. So yes, in general, might never be an issue, but sometimes that loud capture you need to make might be troublesome and ending up loosing quality. There are, though, low price mics that will also support high dB capture.
Great vid man! Can’t fuck with the Neumann though. I had the 103 and like the 102 better but now I have the U87 but these days I been using the Slate VMS.
The TLM leaves much more room to shape your vocal to your liking. The C1 sound bright but it's like a brightness that's baked into the recording. If your budget allows I would definitely recommend the TLM over the C1
Noticed the C1 is on the mixbus channel and that normally would have effects on it already if im not mistaken
those lyrics is hitting bro dope sound
Love to see that i am not only person whose fighting with harshness in beheringer microphones
But thanks to you now i have solution from my favourite teacher ❤️❤️
Love from india ❤️
It might be the headphones im on, and also i know TH-cam screws up audio anyway. The C1 sounds a little noisier when your singing (but that might be the mid bump you are referring to). It's definitely not 10 times the difference though.
21:10 got a little too real for me. I have a c1 and will continue to blame it for all my short comings. Good day yo you kind sir.
LOL. I have a B-1 at my home studio and I only record scratch vocals there... maybe I should put a little more effort into my recording instead of expecting my engineer to do all my hard work at his studio ^_^;
Really well done. Fantastic job with this. Not just a head-to-head, but a short class in vocal processing.
c1 sounds more plug n play. throw Nectar on it and be done .
I love it when you cant hold the mask: "So what's the point of all this? (giggles) the point is as usual...."
It must be hard to hear yourself say the same thing so many times, just to give us a clear message :D
It's working though. Havent bought new gear in about 3 years now, and now I'm finally getting a little acoustic treatment set up,
instead of buying new monitors, pedals and gear in general. You can really get far on very limited budgets nowadays!
Just like your videos show us again and again! :) Thank you teaching me stuff the last 5-6 years.
The C1 is a little brighter and slightly harsh in the higher frequencies, whereas the TLM 102 sounds a little more warm and smooth. However, with a little EQing and De-Essing, the C1 will definitely suffice.
At my studio, the main TLM 102 microphone, an excellent microphone, the tracks recorded on it through Focusrite Scralett 2Gen several times hit the Russian top 10 Apple Music, and the total advances exceeded $ 50K. Today I already work with RME Babyface Pro FS, a terrific interface, I recommend it.
P.S. I apologize, there may be problems with my English.
@BobRocksBaby
this is in Russian and in Ukrainian
th-cam.com/video/uUbc2MUNloU/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/Adqv6HXHETc/w-d-xo.html
Graham whenever I have doubts I always refer to your inspiring videos.. You have time and time again demonstrated it not about the price of the gear. It is your ability to manipulate it to accomplish what u need. 👍👍👍👍👍
if you record pink noise of both mics and use a matching eq software to match the C1 pink noise to the Neuman's. I'm pretty sure you will get a crazy result.
The 10k plus in the C1 sounds a bit distorted. I have a couple NT1s that have that same type of compressed-mesh basket and I think you actually get in-basket echo that distorts the phase of the HF because the basket isn’t evenly open, it’s more compressed toward the body of the mic. Only really high frequencies will do this because the length of the sound wave at that frequency is short enough to bounce about in the basket.
I prefer the Behringer C1 I had that microphone and someone borrowed it and didn’t return it. It sounds good enough to cut through the mix with similar Eq processing, I like the brightness. Thanks for sharing.
At 17:27 i realised you sing this fragment a bit differently on those 2 mics.
In the "$60 mic footage" you sing "BUTCH U" and the "$700 mic footage" you sing "BUhh U" which makes more subjective difference, since you add really sharp tones to your singing in one microphone, and really flat to the other, and this affects the way you mix since you MAKE IT SEEM the more expensive one is flatter, and the other is sharper. I am no musician, I am no singer, i am no content creator, but still, this makes me automatically feel different for those.
What I like depends on my needs, which is the source and where it's supposed to go.
I had a wonderful time getting voices almost exactly where I needed them with a Neumann CLM563+M7 (little bottle and round capsule) once. That thing could not be proximity-spoiled. Other mics required more care in placement and speaker location.
I like both these mics, but the less time I have or the less capable someone is at EQ'ing, the more the microphones output should match what you need. At least that has been my experience.
For a shoot-out like this, might it be possible to have both mics set up the same distance from the singer? That way, exactly the same performance is recorded at the same time.
True, that would have been more "scientific". I would have liked it if he'd done it that way. But still, I think the performances were very much in the same ballpark, and the differences between the mics was pretty obvious.
My first condenser mic was the Behringer C-1U. At the time tho I dont use eq to mix my vocals because I was a beginner. Now, I sold it to my friend and use an AKG 120 and 220 microphone which I find brightens my vocals a little bit too much. idk I might get another microphone. I need to try one that has more body and not brightness.
I can see that that the C1 is going though the Mix Bus where there is a waves plugin, and the TLM isn't.
There is almost no difference on my Galaxy A5 2017. I can hear that the tlm 102 is smoother in the higher range while the behringer is sharp and little bit harsh. Neumann gives nice flat sound so you can play with the eq. Thanks for this comparison. Greetings from Poland.
Big difference man. You need to hear it on quality studio monitors and headphones. I can tell a difference on my phone
Some time ago I recorded two albums in home. I started with a $100 mike (Behringer C-3) and was very frustrated because all vocals were getting crappy. I was about to get out and buy an EXPENSIVE one when I just remembered about the $10 bucks SM-57 clone (from a crazy brand called GPA) that I had purchased but never used. Of course it wouldn't hurt anyone to give it a try. Long story short I plugged it in and the vocals just became awesome. I immediately sold the C-3 and since then I use this cheapo mike for all my recordings. Who could explain this?
From the jump i liked the $60 mic for the brightness and even with the plugins but The $700 has warmer sound to it. Also, tho its not my style of music at all. Great sounding voice.
Great video! I have been trying out all the mics at the studio I work at to see what sounds best on my voice. So far the Neumann U87 is winning. The Manley is next up, and the Sony C800 is last which I know a lot of people like this mic, but it is too bright for my vocals, almost sounds brittle sometimes.
Concept of the test was cool. Actually really enjoyed the vox takes, great job man