6502 childhood dream come true (+VGA, Pi Pico, and Lode Runner too)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ธ.ค. 2022
- It was always my dream since childhood to build a computer.
This is the story of my hobby activities over the past 2 years and the host of new skills picked up along the way.
The story starts with the Ben Eater 6502 kit: eater.net/6502
The ACIA datasheet is here: www.westerndesigncenter.com/w...
Source code for Wozmon can be found here: www.sbprojects.net/projects/a...
Create your own version of Microsoft Basic for 6502:
www.pagetable.com/?p=46
Logisim is a free digital logic simulation tool:
sourceforge.net/projects/circ...
KICAD download:
www.kicad.org/download/
Retro Ports: Apple II Lode Runer for the Coco 3 Beta 2: retroports.blogspot.com/2014/0...
Lode Runner - 1983 Apple ][ port to the Tandy CoCo 3 by Mark McDougall:
• Lode Runner - 1983 App...
@DavePoo Emulating a CPU in C++ (6502) videos: www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...
Klaus2m5's 6502 functional tests: github.com/Klaus2m5/6502_65C0...
V. Hunter Adams VGA on Pico blog post: vanhunteradams.com/Pico/VGA/V...
ebadger/BadgerFrotz: Frotz Z-machine ported to a Raspberry PI Pico designed to run on the ebadger LodeRunner platform (github.com):
github.com/ebadger/BadgerFrotz
@GeorgeFoot The World's Simplest TTL Video Card?
• The World's Simplest T... - เกม
I lost count of how many times my jaw dropped watching this. That’s raw motivation! Wow.
Thanks!
from never doing hardware to a 4 layer board? nice stuff dude
Thanks!
Isn’t 4 layer the easy, lazy solution to distribute power? From the EEVLOG I learned that with through-hole routing is criss cross on the surfaces. Like in a breadboard: internal is vertical, then there is space for your horizontal colored wires.
@@ArneChristianRosenfeldt if it works does it really matter? its not a final product of any kind
@@akamadman203 I just say that the hi tech solution is easier. If you need to save any penny in a series production, you try to reduce this to two layers like Nintendo had done with the N64.
@@ArneChristianRosenfeldtHaving just designed my first PCB, yes. I had a choice between figuring out some clever way to route traces between top and bottom (because too many traces needed to overlap) without causing lots of EMI, or just switching to 4 layer. I probably saved myself weeks by switching to 4 layer.
If this doesn't go viral, either within the maker circle or the retro-gaming/emulation circle, then... then... then life isn't fair! This was an amazing feat. I'm interested in owning my own Lode Runner Appliance.
Thanks. Please send mail to Eric.badger@gmail.com
Seems life isn't fair...
Wow. I am speechless. I am without speech.
A huge journey in a tiny video. Beautiful man!
Congratulations Eric. I am in the same rabbit hole. After 25 years of software engineering, I am starting to use my electrical engineering degree again, recalling my younger years, and having a lot of fun learning. Hope to see more videos from you.
Best luck - any project you're focused on?
do a YT search on the Agon Lite SBC - aimed at retro hobbiest. It uses the Zilog eZ80 as it's CPU. This is backwards compatible to the Z80 but also has a 24-bit mode where can address up to 24MB. And there's an 8-bit base register so that multiple 8-bit Z80 programs can be loaded into that address space for some multi programming fun.
Me thinks this Zilog eZ80 CPU is just the bees knees for designing new hobbiest retro-themed SBCs around.
Give it a thought for next projects that up the ante over 6502 systems.
"If you want to learn an instruction set, build an emulator" is so, so true.
And Xbox 360 Achievements. Well done, young Skywalker.
You fell deeply down the rabbit hole, didn't you 😄
No end in sight
@@thecodesorcerer 😃
late to the party but this video had me smiling from ear to ear. Seeing the entire journey was just delightful and reminds me of some many fun projects I have done in a similar fashion.
stuff like this make you really appreciate those who did this back in the 60s 70s and 80s
You mentioned several of my favorite builders/channels and hit on every bit of tech I like... The algo is good today. :)
1:48 Eric Badger: "A close second was Ultima IV"
Me: "Thou art a cad and a bounder. Thy presence is an affront. Thou art low as a slug!"
I take it you’re an Ultima IV fan. It is a masterpiece in my opinion.
This is just amazing
This is incredible
I watched one of Ben Eater's videos some time ago (the Let's Build Video Card), but didn't understand too much due to not following from start and never having done any serious engineering on my own. Couple years passed and I saw this video. Then I started watching Ben Eater series from start, interrupting from time to time to re-watch this video as my understanding of what you're saying grows more complete. Now, after watching this video maybe 10 times, I think I'm going to create my own 6502 computer.
Thanks for the inspiration!
Yes!
woah! 🤯 Amazing...
Thank you
You have fine tuned the ratio between information and visual data perfectly! Even though the pace is high in your video, at no time did I think "What was that?" nor did I feel the need to rewind. Excellent work!
Man, your video resonates so much with me =) I also watched Ben Eaters videos without an electrical engineering background at the beginning of the pandemic and had to start tinkering right away. This kickstarted such a rewarding hobby for me. Since then I build his 4 Bit breadboard CPU, started modding it over and over and ended up building a whole computer around a Z80. Just the other month I saw a video of a guy building Pong from chips, so I had to do this too. Thank you very much for sharing this great video and you are absolutely crazy (in a positive way), for taking it so far. Kudos!
That's so cool! I just built the Ben Eater 65c02 project. Bought the 8 bit (4 bit?) computer kit. Right now I'm working on learning KiCad while designing a PCB for the 65c02. Maybe I'll do the clock module too while I'm at it. This morning I ran across the pre-made W65C02SXB and was enjoying reading the data sheet and the schematic and actually understanding most of what I saw, which was awesome. It makes me want to do more projects too like Z80 (like following John's Basement) or another channel I saw building one with an 8088. But I also want to make my own little computer (cyberdeck) with a Pico as the base. I have to stay focused on one project at a time haha. Oh yeah I also want to create a Forth (it lets you move from assembly to high level language quickly and easily, while using very little memory) for one or more of those computer (or just run an existing one).
@@drivers99 It's a rabbit hole, isn't it? I really like your Forth idea; reminds me of a video I saw about a guy who took Ben Eaters 4 Bit SAP-CPU and extended it until he was able to compile C code for it. (I think it was mainly turning it into an 8 Bit one and adding a Stack module.)
Well this is awesome. That Pico case is gold!
This is incredibly cool and inspiring! Awesome work and great video too!
Impressive amount of work, my congratulations! Thanks you for the links!
This is Killer, My Adult ADHD Engineer butt couldn't comprehend this but always wanted to make an apple 2 and find an old case to repurpose;
Great Job! Hit that Sub button! Keep it Up
5:56 that's some cga-esque snow right here
This is deeply impressive work. Wish I was this clever.
Thanks!
very cool! I am impressed and envious of your dedication and skill!
Thank you very much!
IT was fascinating watching your progress! Thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Loved it.
I was a hardware tech back in the day.. Lode Runner was my favorite game. Have tossed some ideas around, but you are beyond my wildest plans! Good work!
I am interested in a Loderunner box.
You don't give up! Great stuff 👏
Thank you 🙌
...there's no 'off' on the genius switch! You are amazing Sir!
Wow, thanks!
Done up in blueprint blue.it’s like a dream come true.
Saw your booth at the PRGF, didn't have enough money at the time to support your project but I'm excited to see that a video about this and the progress you've made since then.
Hope to see you this year
I am truly impressed. You have a serious amount of drive and I truly applaud your dedication. Lode Runner was the first game that I spend 4 hours straight on in 1983 on a C-64. I still love the game, Email incoming.
Thanks!
Quite an achievement! Also, nice video editing
Thanks!
Nice job. The biggest challenge is keeping your hobby from being just more work. I built 8 bit cpu, was going to expand memory, but it's on the back burner, as I've shifted to doing machining and metal working for hobby, currently. Welding is proving similar to sharpshooting, breath and sight picture are weirdly similar to keeping a consistent distance and bead size on the welding. never enough time if you have too many hobbies.
I know what you mean. I try to keep it fresh by continually learning and adding new skills. Welding and metal work is actually on my list!
what a journey! well done sir.
Glad you liked it!
Very interesting to learn about your journey of building a 6502 computer and running Lode Runner on it! Your video has a nice pace and I like the editing and your voice-over.
Thanks Dion! You did a great job on the LodeRunner 2600 game btw. I wish I'd grabbed a photo with you. Are you planning on attending the PRGE again this year? Any new homebrew 2600 games in the works? Any other projects?
@@thecodesorcerer Thanks, Eric. Yes, I hope to visit PRGE again this year and then make sure we make a photo :) So cool to know that you helped backing up the original LR source code. I don't have new homebrew 2600 games in the works; currently I'm spending my spare time on restoring an old Out Run arcade cabinet.
Good job! I've subscribed and will keep watching!
Awesome, thank you!
Pumping something out of the Pico/MMBasic myself. It's closest to the ZX-Spectrum/Psion with potentials for sensors, keys, displays. I hate all the wiring and tests with failures. The cutest construct is a PWM Throttle for a BEC (RC) which could become automatic one day and for now it's just up and down + emergency stop (3 keys) and I enjoy a propeller under my command. It's just showing -99 to +99% on a display and looks like a tiny PC. My idea with it is a servo tester, but I would like to mount a propeller on an RC car and such construct is a bit confusing, still.
My computer love path is literally identical to yours regarding owned systems, except I would never dream of creating hardware. You would have made Jay Miner proud!
This was great fun to watch!
Thank you
such an adventure, great job!
Thanks so much!
a retro computing hobbiest over achiever - kudos!
Great job!
I’m interested in the appliance! Nice work.
Send mail to Eric.badger@gmail.com
Fantastic work.
Thank you! Cheers!
The algorithm sent me because I've been learning to program an Atari 2600, but this is next-level!
awesome work
Thank you! Cheers!
Awesome project.
Thank you!
You crammed a lot of info into this video!
Looks like you gained a lot of valuable info in this quest.
LR is a good benchmark for 8-bit machines and is a good game, I'm partial to an offshoot of the game (Lode Runners Rescue) as it was the first iso game that I saw in my youth running on a C-64.
Cheers,
Thanks!
Just stumbled across this video but thank you for sharing as it’s amazing to see what people develope. I’ve always enjoyed retro machines especially when we all had to know just some basic commands to get it to do the most basic of stuff. These days we only have to click on an icon and it’s all done for us. Maybe you can emulate another great 6502 computer called the BBC B micro from Acorn. Keep up the work you have done some amazing cool things :) regards from across the pond… the remote Scottish Highlands
Cheers!
I'm attempting to do the same thing with a 6809 chip. This is a very inspirational video. I am too feeling intimidated doing my first PCB with KiCad.
It is so worth it, and in retrospect not as hard as it seemed to be. Do it! 6809… hmm CoCo?
@@thecodesorcerer I am Welsh, so I would say Dragon 32 :)
@@cthutu best computer name ever
@@thecodesorcerer both Dragon 32 and Coco were based off the Motorola reference so they quite similar.
6809 has MUL. So please show off some DSP audio stuff and 3d !
I love that processor, it was the first chip I learnt to program in assembler
I still feel like it has the best use of flags. Once a CPU has a barrel shifter, flags are only useful for ADC and a for loop.
LDA sets the zero flag. This promotes zero termination of strings. This lead to a lot of bugs.
With 16 bit instructions on JRISC or SH2 it still hurts to waste too many bits on operands. Fusing the CMP and test instruction with branch allows us to cover a lot of use cases. Without flags, instruction re-ordering is easier. RISC is not foremost about the number of instructions. At least I say that we are allowed to specify if ADD listens to the carry flag and if it writes it. Then don’t re-order those ADDs.
Loop instruction from 8086 ?
It is so weird that there is no clear upgrade path from 6502. ARM is so complicated. I guess that 32 Bit instructions are necessary for the absolute addressing mode.
That's an interesting hobby you have.
Thanks
Heck yeah, this is super cool!
Thank you
Very interesting and amazing work, well done sir, the breadboard route is a very ambitious path - respect! My favs from the early 80´s were the same on the beloved Apple II - Lode Runner, Ultima IV (can not even understand today how many hours I spent on it). The Apple had some other games worth mentioning, Sabotage, Boulder Dash, Archon, MonteZumas Revenge, 7 Cities of gold to mention a few that also got some time put in to them.. ;)
Same here. Throw in Pinball Construction Set to make the hat trick.
Most impressive indeed! I'd love to purchase a LR build as well. :)
Email me at Eric.badger@gmail.com
Well done, it's great to see how this has all come together!
For counting in 7s, it's probably fine if it's just the addresses being done like that - you can make the least significant counter be a 4-bit one and make it wrap after 7, or initialise it to 9 whenever it reaches the terminal count, which I think wouldn't require any external logic
I can read a byte at a time but would need to have pixel clock such that 7 pixels are output per phi2 cycle. The high bit is a conditional palette bit. I think I’d need the pixel clock to run at 1.79MHz instead of 1.57. (Reading 8 bits and outputting 7). If I did 280x192 (apple hires) I think I’d need to use a 22.02813 MHz clock. Maybe 22MHz would be close enough. Not sure I could reliably generate the sync signals though.
I wonder if the algorithm thinks we're the same person?
W65C02S. Check.
Pi Pico. Two of them.
Iterating on EPROMs is lame. Indeed.
Woz monitor in 256 bytes. RP6502 monitor in 32 bytes.
VGA. Same, but no graphics mode yet.
Z-machine? On the 68000.
TH-cam. TH-cam.
Well done.
The similarities are uncanny. I enjoyed your recent video with the FPGA and Commodore keyboard.
Hi mate, I love this video, made with such love. Check out the rest of you videos now.
Thanks!
Hey Eric, I’d really love to buy a Lode Runner appliance! How awesome 😅
This is amazing, I am busy doing the nand2tetris course and would love to build a 6502 machine when I'm done. Unfortunately living in rural Africa means sourcing parts is nigh on impossible. Thanks for letting me live vicariously through you!
Where in Africa are you?
@@thecodesorcerer In the Kingdom of eSwatini!
fantastic!!
Thanks!
I love my Lode Runner box! BTW I'd have a strong personal interest in your Frotz project.. a friend does a lot of Frotz work and I write IF..
See you at PRGE 2023!
Definitely, I can send you a BadgerFrotz image if you'd like to flash it on your box
Great Memories !
for me , it was the Commodore 64 version !
along with ARCHON & JUMPMAN ,
i wanted to learn Basic to make my own games , HA !
enjoy that 8-bit goodness !
Archon is a favorite of mine
Nice!!
I am most interested in buying your 'load runner' kit and congrats, a good job well done.
To clarify, I’m selling the PI Pico based boxes that are running the emulator. They’re currently finished although I’ve been thinking about making into a kit. The “beast” 6502 computer + vga using TTL is still under development.
Send mail to eric.badger@gmail.com
Cool. You went through it so fast it seemed almost too easy. Each minute could be a separate video
Great work! I've personally written a few 6502 assemblers and emulators, but have always shied away from real hardware. Your work is a real inspiration! I've always wanted to make my own video card too.
If you would be willing to share schematics or other resources, I'd definitely be interested!
Happy to share. Kit was amazing at kicking off the hobby.
Very Nice!!
I'm on the same path (dev for 25 years, started on an Apple IIe, found Ben Eater, etc), but nowhere near your level of awesome.
You can do it!
thanks youtube algorithm! subscribed!
Awesome, thank you!
VERY cool video! I really enjoyed how you covered your journey. I'd love to see more detailed videos of how you worked through various aspects of your design.
I've been wanting to build the Ben Eater kit for some time now. Amazing how you took it to the next level.
Where can I get one of the Lode Runner appliances?
You should, it’s a blast. What would you like to see specifically? Please send me mail: Eric.badger@gmail.com
@@thecodesorcerer I'd love to see more on your PCB 6502 work and the video output. It was cool how you could see the interference in your early video work. Was that system data writing into video ram?
Thanks again for sharing.
In the v2 version, video and cpu RAM were separate. In v3 they’re shared. While clock was high, cpu would control video RAM. In order to have 4bpp the video logic needed to read from RAM at ~6MHz. Couldn’t get the timing just right at that speed. Newer version reads at 1.57MHz which creates a lot more timing grace.
Awesome! Hardware is nothing more than software in 3D ... says this old software guy. :)
I'd like to buy one, please!
Very interesting. I enjoyed playing doom on the sansa clip.
What’s sansa?
@@thecodesorcerer 1 inch x 2 inch tiny mp3 player with a square display.
So cool Eric! I love how you established the goal of running Lode Runner (such an awesome game!), and then just took one step at a time to get there. If I wanted to delve into learning hardware, do you consider the 6502 kit a good place to start?
Thanks Bro. 6502 kit and video series were super helpful. I’ve watched the 8 bit computer series. I have the kit but haven’t done it yet. You might want to start with the 8 bit kit.
Hey Eric,
I do love playing Lode Runner. I still have my original cart for the C-64,
and a disk with levels I made in my teens. I always wished the C-64 version
was blue like the original. So ya I'm interested in one of your LR Kit.
I'm Eric as well.
let's connect over mail, eric.badger@gmail.com
Hello there! Love your vids! May I know where you get infos concerning hardware text mode? I got a vga board but have no idea how to implement the hardware text mode
i am interested in a load runner gizmo, load runner is one of my favs too. also Mister FPGA i have 5 different systems that have load runner on it. the x68000 god computer i think is running the apple ][ version of it on the mister FPGA. Thanks for your work! -G
Send email to Eric.badger@gmail.com
Fantastic!!! I remember playing it on a apple II. Great simple game. How can I get one?
mail me at eric.badger@gmail.com
Cool.
Thanks
Love the video. You tube recommended it, and it was a great watch.
You mentioned about purchasing a load runner appliance at the end of the video. Any still available? If so, are you ok with international shipping?
Mail me at Eric.badger@gmail.com
To handle 7 bit wide blocks, just load a new byte into the output shift register earlier, and possibly rewire the parallel input to load the compatible bit position into the shift register output bit.
Almost any complex logic circuit can be built cheaper by programming it into a modern CPLD or FPGA, this is the modern equivalent of the "uncommitted logic array" chips that 1980s computer makers customized for fabrication, but available as single units with a 4 pin programming port or a connection to an external flash chip storing the logic design.
For this project I would consider FPGA to be cheating. That said I have an arty7 on my desk for a future project.
@@thecodesorcerer Hence my suggestion to use a CPLD or old school PAL instead of a large number of 741xx chips, such as 74166 pixel shift registers for the 7 or 8 bit formats of fonts and graphics. 6845 controller chips would be time appropriate but are hard to find these days.
This is great! I can't wait to see Loderunner running!
As for porting Frotz... is a computer even truly usable if you can't play Zork on it?
Wow
Great projects! Couldn't understand what you said about the Atari HCS and C64 source code, though. I think you said "not" (still on floppies). Are they (as of now) lost forever, or already preserved? I assume the former.
As of now. Still only on floppies!
@@thecodesorcerer Oh, then my guess as what you were saying (hard to hear the last word in the sentence) was wrong. That's good news! So, they're still on floppies. I wonder if the company could be convinced to share them with one of us in the community, so that we can preserve that source code, as well. I have both systems with disk drives (many of Atari HCS and C64/128 and many drives) and would love to volunteer for that. That was so amazing that they did that with you. Most companies wouldn't do that.
Very Very Cool! Thanks for creating this video. I am interested in a Lode Runner appliance. In 1981 I was in HS, and I bought an Apple ][+ (48K, 1 disk drive, $2100) with my own hard-earned money. Lode Runner was the first game I purchased and I played the game for 100s of hours. The game still holds up today as a fun game to play. Thumbs up!, Subscribe.
Wow, $2100 in 1981 dollars is no joke. So glad you enjoyed it. Please send me mail at eric.badger@gmail.com and can work out arrangements.
Me and you are about the same. After I graduated HS and was going to tech school for EE, I bought an Apple 2e in 1983 for about the same price. Had the Koala pad, color monitor and all the other options. It was an upgrade from my Ti994a. I played the crap out of LR as well as Choplifter, Wolfenstein, Galaxia, pitstop, and the others but LR was one of my favorites that I also had 100s of hours in. FF to today and the last games I finished were FC6 and RE8. how things have changed. I was a big Doom, Quake and UT for years as wells as every COD but I'm pushing 60 so I am very selective and I don't even try to play games like WarZone anymore. Hands just don't work that fast anymore. But I do still watch the good streams on the tournaments. FYI, if you never played the TF2 single player campaign your missing one of the best stories/games ever made.
Why is the 1040ST mirror imaged in the opening intro? Minds boggle.
Missed that detail
My childhood dream was to hack "Robin of the Wood" - a ZX version by removing that annoying witch 🤪
Hi! When you ask about buying a Lode Runner machine, are you talking about the Pico, or the actual hardware?
Thanks for asking. It’s the PICO. The “beast” is still a work in progress and may be for some time.
With regards to the RAM access, traditionally this was done by the CPU accessing on low clock, GPU on high clock instead of using a dual interface RAM
Judging but what you did you already know that most likely xD
Yep! Except vice versa. GPU access is on low clock as of now.
C64 has extra SRAM for color attributes. This in turn required a way for the CPU to access them. What if we use SRAM to load the next line of attributes in the side borders?
Or do we want sprites? Maybe there would be a register to specify how much SRAM is loaded with attributes and how much with run-length encoded graphics for a sprite layer?
Yeah as good as Apple ][ graphics were at the time, I am still to this day, perplexed as to what won was smoking when he decided to setup the graphics modes and memory mapping for graphics on the Apple ][ at the time. In short, don’t bother trying to make it Apple ][ compatible unless you have some SM desire.
Haha, yeah. Woz is a madman. Too tempting to access the Apple II software library, so I’m doing it! Graphics are basically already working.
Where do you sell the loderunner pcbs/etc?
Email Eric.badger@gmail.com
How did you make he HW text mode?
Fonts are stored in a rom chip. 1 pin on the chip for each bit of the 8 bit ascii value from memory plus 4 pins indicating the screen row are combined to retrieve an 8 bit value representing the pixel pattern. That value is loaded into a shift register and out put on each cycle by pixel clock. VGA circuits are scanning through system memory. Maybe I’ll make a video describing it.
@@thecodesorcerer I would be interested in seeing a video about this topic :)
Did you say Portland? Surly you don't mean Portland Oregon?
Yep. Portland Oregon
You should change your channel's name to "Epic Badger"
You are too kind. Thank you.
無理はしないで がんばっていてほしいです。
7:21 Commodore and Atari source are what? Bad audio edit.
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