It's not just goths who changed from then to now, it's people and society in general. In the 90s, life was about going out and doing things, seeing things, having new and beautiful experiences. Now, people want to stay inside and utilize technology. That's something I greatly miss about that time period.
Also, there is a great obsession with image now. I have noticed some famous internet goths won't give you the time of day unless they think you are as attractive as they are or have as much fame as they do, no matter how nice you are to them. There was a time not too long ago in which children were taught to not judge a book by its cover, but now we have people in the goth subculture judging other goths by their outward appearance. How "goth" you look or how hot you are. That person they find ugly or looking like a mall goth just might be the most goth person ever and someone very kind and fun to be around. This is more of a reflection on modern day society than goths specifically. In the 80s and 90s, I think goths suffered more persecution than they usually do now so we tended to be less judgmental toward other goths because we knew how it felt to be judged harshly based on appearances (unless you were in junior high or high school. A lot of kids liked to throw around "poser" for silly reasons). These days, people compliment goths more often than they insult them in a lot of areas, so there is a disconnect somewhere in the way of empathy.
I agree. You see a very common sense of nostalgia for the 70's, 80's, and 90's among all kinds of people from punks to metalheads to goth and so on. For me, I even miss the 2000's, even though I was just a kid. We used to throw parking lot shows where we would have a couple bands play and there would be at least 30 people who would come down to see the show. Nowadays, there isn't as much of that commitment or sense of comradry and brotherhood. I seen it happening in some places but not as often as it used to.
see thats exactly why there's SUCh a need to revitalize society, culture and arts!!! We need to externalize our desires more and remind people of the good feelings, oxytocin and dopamine release when you go out and party especially in a particular scene where everyone has a place to fit in. Once the younger generation get a taste for that, they wont let go. We can do it!!
That is something I always say to everybody, but no one seems to understand. Real life was outside, it was very unlike to stay at home saturday night. We used to plan weeks later what we were going to do on weekend. Today, if you go to a club, bar or Pub, bands are playing to no one because everybody is at home watching netflix, covid made it even worse. Also people are more worried about taking photos of themselves and posting on instagram than enjoying the moment and friends. It is so ridiculous. I feel so sad, and I miss the 90s and early 2000s a lot.
I love the surprised look I get from people when I tell them I used to take ballet for six years and that I cosplay. Most people assume goths only do “goth” things. Why be a square when you can be a cube?
It’s the internet. And I’m not anti-internet. But when I went to goth/industrial clubs (1993-2000ish), things were underground. You went for the atmosphere, the experience, to hear the music, to make connections with like-minded people...it wasn’t “exclusive” necessarily but was an underground community. Now everything is at your fingertips. Social media has supplanted face-to-face communities, you can find any rare record, remix, etc., in like 2 seconds instead of digging endlessly through records and cassettes in stores. Some of what the internet has brought is really amazing. But some things have died or changed as a result. It just is what it is.
@@bf13137 Absolutely. It's not an edgy, super underground club that only goths know about if any wannabe goth with an internet connection can find it in 3 seconds. Back then you got invited by those already acquainted. Its like the magic trick that you found out about. It loses its magic and it's Wonder once you know how the trick is done. The internet has done this with all kinds of things. I remember any early 2000s people would tell me about clubs and I would be super interested because it seems like some kind of underground exclusive thing that you had to be invited to. I think what the internet all of that mysticism has been debunked and revealed to the public so now we know that it never was any magic that this is what it was always about it's always about money and marketing and blah blah blah. I think the internet just illuminated that fact and took away the magic like a done with so many other things
I really miss the club culture of the 80's. The scene in Houston was really inclusive since hard core punk, dance techno, goth and rockabilly all shared the same music venues. The goth crowd would should up to punk shows, punks would go to Goth night; and everyone got along for the most part. All of that really started to change in the late 90's though. Kinda sad. :(
Its still like that. I just went to a local punk show at a rockabilly club lol. Another time I went to a punk show at this underground spot with no address and I was amazed at how inclusive they were when the hispanics had their lil Cumbia parties in between the sets. Although I can say, the spark sure doesn't feel all there at all, yet at the underground lot, it felt like the closest you could get to an experience that is of the scene back then
i’m 15 so i can’t comment on the club scene but i still feel the fear of being deemed unauthentic/poser. and i’m really caught up in it it’s a shame. if i ever listen to something not goth and enjoy it i actually feel kind of guilty and fake. this toxic mentality needs to end ugh.
Nobody should feel guilty for liking something other than goth. I'm pretty sure where the stigma comes from to begin with is when people call things that aren't goth, "goth". Like saying you're goth because you listen to Marilyn Manson, as an example. Well, that's not goth. You're not goth. If you are into *actual* goth music and the goth scene/community to whatever extent, then whatever else you listen to or do doesn't matter.
Gurl, Britney Spears. Be you and who cares if that makes you "goth." It's more important to be you then to fit into any stereotype. Be you honey. If that means listening to Britney Spears, wearing all black, and loving to surround yourself with spooky things then do it. I promise you'll be happier for it. ❤☠❤
Dear Angela, AMEN. Goth is goth. I live for the day that sense of wonder can be captured once again. I’ve only ever had “goth night” at a local bar called Mars Bar in Richmond, Virginia. An actual dedicated goth club was not around but damn it I hit goth night ever Wednesday at Mars Bar because it’s what I, and the other goths had. I never wanted those nights to end. You could wear any of the goth styles and it didn’t matter because we all knew why we were there. The sense of dissection hadn’t hit the subculture yet. I want to see that happen again. Thank you for this.
Remember revelations at twisters, or 1408 before that? I know I'm showing my age there, but those were my hay days... I got out of the scene about the time mars bar got going, but still listen to everything from back then. Kinda funny to see a local post... cheers.
I miss Mars Bar! 80s music and friends, we had such a great time back in the day. I went to Sacrosanct after it had moved to Fallout next door, which is thankfully still there. =)
Even I can see a dramatic shift from just a decade ago. There are more people who would rather sit outside the venue to drink and smoke just to say they went than those who go inside and actually want to have a genuine experience.
As an asthmatic and a cancer patient, I am so glad people can't smoke inside. I would never be able to go. I know what you mean though, Kiri. I never understood people who would just sit outside and smoke, or sit at the bar all night while amazing music was playing.
Exactly! This was never a comment on the smoking ban, I'm all for it. People can always run outside to have a smoke then go back inside to have fun, it's a comment on the people who only ever sit outside drinking and smoking and never actually take part in the event they most likely paid a cover charge to attend.
Why dictate how people should enjoy their night out? If they payed the cover and are buying drinks they are supporting the event. They may enjoy the atmosphere and music but not feel like dancing and that is ok. They might be there primarily to socialise too. Full dance floors are great but as long as people are enjoying themselves and keep coming back who cares? Some events are more laid back.
I'm one of those guys who sit outside to drink, and smoke. (not the whole time, but 2/3 or so). I do it because it's hard to converse over the music, and I go to socialize. (in some circles, there may be a pretentious "we're better than our club" nonsense but that's not why I do it)
aytakk Great point! I was responding to the dialogue in the video about that lost "magic" of the event. Part of it could simply be getting older but I was commenting on the fact that I generally see more people outside the venue these days than in it & that may be why. Of course people are free to do what they want at an event so long as they're not hurting anyone.
This all needed to be said. It irks me to no end when I start a discussion online about how goth music and gothic aesthetic and literature can sometimes go hand in hand, then people come out of the woodworks to tell me how wrong I am for drawing such a comparison or making such an example. “Anything that existed before 1979 isn’t goth, it’s gothic,” they say. They somehow thinks that invalidates the examples of inspiration that goth musicians take from gothic literature. Goth music doesn’t exist in a vacuum like these people seem to think it does. These people seem to believe that “Spleen and The Ideal” and “De Profundis” of the amazing work of Dead Can Dance were just randomly pulled out of someone’s ass by a goth musician. Charles Baudelaire wrote that volume in “Les Fleurs du Mail”, named “Spleen et le Idéal” and the poem “De Profundis Clamavi” (Latin for “From the Depths I Cry”). Why is it so wrong for “goth” and “gothic” to be interchangeable? Shouldn’t it help unite us instead of divide us? The difference is two letters: “I” and “C”. Yet now, it’s causing fights and put-downs. I see a huge problem here. It’s a collective experience and aesthetic of the amazing spectrum of goth music, literature, mindset, and being united under an incredible love for things dark, beautiful, sensual, and mysterious. Why can’t we just take that shit and get along? And I fucking hate the fashion police. They can take a bottle of hairspray and shove it up their ass if they say I look like a poseur for sporting my naturally curling, untested hair. I’m just doing what Poe described as “Setting full force of the Homeric epithet of ‘Hyacinthine.’” Amazing video, as always, babe. I love how hard you are trying to unify this fragmented subculture.
If you want to know the reason why the two somewhat split, it's pretty simple. Darkly Inclined/Dark Romanticism being conflated as the same thing as Goth. I'm pretty sure you've run into those people who think Goth is not about the music and think that you don't have to listen or like any Goth music to be a Goth. As long as you wear black, pile on the eye shadow and lipstick, and listen to Metal or classical music, you're a Goth and if anyone says otherwise, they're an elitist. This kind of thinking is what really annoyed Goths and just made them want to distance themselves from these people who were falsifying their scene for the sake of attention and popularity (The "Mall Goth" trend of 2003-2006 is a good example of this). That's pretty much the main factor that contributed the divide because the thing is. While Angela's experience definitely reflects the good and chill time of the 80s and 90s club scene, it also helped that the people were on the same page. They knew that if someone liked things like Gothic literature, imagery, etc, they would also be a fan of Goth music and vice versa. There was no need to for a distinction to be made in those times until the Darkly-Inclined and "Fashion Goths" tried to come in and change the meaning of the scene in the 00s.
"Darkly-Inclined" is just a term used to describe people who are purely just into the dark and macabre but tend to not have interest in the Goth subculture as in they don't listen to the music associated with the scene.
Do you think those people just haven't heard any of the music or just haven't found a goth band/artist that they like?...I don't see why somebody wouldn't like any of the music at all if they were so into the dark and macabre..
I have been wishing for a very long time that I could step back into the 90's for a bit(and not turn back into a toddler) because I have always wanted to experience something like this. By the time I was old enough to go to clubs it was way past the 2000's.
I was around in the 80s, those days where we were ‘alternative ‘.... I still head out to goth clubs, and for me in Melbourne, Australia in 2018, I am feeling quite a lot of magic is returning...
Goth clubs in the 90's = A safe haven for dark minded outcasts who like Goth Rock, Darkwave, and Industrial music. Goth clubs in the 2000's and onward = Just another place where you feel judged.
For several years, I identified as goth but it wasn't until about a year ago when I realized I had no clue what goth was. Growing up in a small town with no goth scene, I had never heard Bauhaus or The Cure or anything else about the subculture. It wasn't until I came across your channel (and your music playlists) that really opened the doors for me. Before that, I knew about the fashion, about Poe and the internal desire to buy halloween decorations to put on display all year round, but I didn't even know goth was a genre of music (though unbeknownst to me, some artists that I was into were actually goth like The Birthday Massacre, Johnny Hollow and Voltaire). At first I didn't have any interest in the music but then I actually listened to it and, well, I love it! The whole subculture has this beautiful allure to it that's so indescribable and it just makes me want to listen, to learn and to know more. I've been hooked onto other goth channels, as well as, listening to The Belfry's podcasts. Even though I don't have a local scene, it just makes me want to try harder to find some way into the subculture and to help keep it alive. I don't want to ramble anymore, so I will end with a thank you. Thank you Angela for helping me get a good start on my dark and gothic journey and I hope you keep doing what you're doing because a lot of us baby bats appreciate it. :)
I think the Batcave was on 30th street and if I remember correctly that's where your hardcore goths went to. I wore black but never rocked the makeup (I thought I would have looked stupid), I felt I would have caught shit if I went there. I admit it was around '97 I stopped going because there were too many pretentious people (especially dudes) walking around. Still I miss those days I had so much fun hanging out and meeting up with 'club friends' as Angela put it.
I feel kind of robbed that I missed out on this sort of atmosphere. My city never had much of a goth scene, but there used to be a club I would go to called The Wreckd Room, which played a lot of industrial and occasionally strayed into darkwave territory. It was a tiny, mostly undecorated (besides a few band posters with blacklights on them) basement with a capacity of maybe 60 people, which I don't think I ever saw it reach more than once. It closed down a few years ago because the owner was losing money keeping it open or someshit. The scene there was often very elitist and unwelcoming and people didn't generally do a lot of talking to each other, but I loved to go there and stomp around and dance like an idiot underneath the shitty lasers and strobelights anyways. Another place used to be around called Dissent, which had to close its' doors and reopened at a different location under a different name, sticking around for a couple of years before closing due to some drug business happening there. Another place opened briefly called Moon Over Marin which was a good place for metal and industrial and so-called "gothic metal", nifty place with mirrored walls that used to be the entry hall to an old theatre that was mostly demolished, but they also ended up closing due to a variety of insurance issues. Pretty much the only place that stayed open more than 5 years was the Wreckd room, and it was never really a goth club, more of an "alternative" club.
Kind of wish I could go back in time and experience what it was like being goth in the 90's. I wish the toxic idea that you're being a poser if you like anything that is unrelated to the goth subculture makes you a poser did not exist... I always have this thought in the back of my head that I'm being a poser if I don't listen to goth music everyday or dress goth. Kind of frustrating, but hopefully one day I will no longer have that thought. Also, I love the way you explain things in your videos and are so inclusive!
I've gone to the Castle many times!, first time on Halloween a few years ago. I went with two friends intending to go there but they didn't want to wait in line or go in the end. I was so sad and was about to turn away but a couple dressed in matching clockwork orange outfits called to me saying you can hang with us for the night. I was taken a back, and I'm usually shy around strangers but I took a chance and said yes. It turned out to be a fun magical night, filled to the brim with people. Although there definitely was a mix of types of people, but everyone was all having fun together and enjoying the vibe. So glad that was my first experience and can't thank that nice couple enough.
The Castle is my home club and I am exceptionally thankful to have it close enough by that I can still get to it when I get the urge to get my dance on. Been going since 1995 when I turned 18. It's also the longest running single genre club in the area at 26 years strong. Last time I went I did feel the magic slowly dissipating but I will always be fortunate to have that readily available to me as I grew up.
You can never re-capture the magic of being new. But we can run events now and pass that magic on to the new people today. Hopefully they will do the same thing for others too.
Something we need to be careful of. Too much nostalgia can kill things. If new people think everything sucks now because the 80s/90s is so overhyped online, they may not even give the current events IRL a proper go. As great as it all was back then we can't have it back. We live in a different world and need to adjust with it. But that doesn't mean we can't have awesome stuff now.
I can understand that. The whole point really is to show that if it existed once before there's no reason why it can't be that way again. I don't think that things suck, but comparatively there's a huge difference and that's down to us and the younger generation. They don't realize how many of the cards they actually hold and just by showing up they can make a world of difference.
I'm starting to think this skin care thing is a cover up and you're really a vampire or something. I was 2 years old in 98 and you don't look that much older than me.
I certainly think the clubs are missing that feeling of "wow, this is home, these are my people" along with that element of "danger" like anything could happen, I only get that nowadays from a local dive bar called Monstercade that plays alot of different dark music.
I love your discription of the feel when enter the club. My mom took me to funhouse, I well under age. I went to batcave daily when also well underage lol. So I got to experience the late 90's early 2000 of the scene. I felt the same way walking in event and seeing the people and sound and the red tinted lights. I can go on for ever. Including the way the night felt as it was ending. The night was so embracing groups would break off and travel the still dead city together clinging on to feelings we had the entire night before sun rise. What I feel the Goth community fell short through out the years is the embracement of positive change. And you mention the very same thing in the same. Like a simple song of Neuroticfish- coming to take me away. It was fun. People laughed and skipped and it just brought people together. Instead of picking apart the differnce of a Victorian Goth and steam punk. P.s GREAT SHOUT OUT!!! Ian Ford and Sean! Red Room! PEOPLE! Go out and enjoy what we have left so we can grow long term down the road! Don't be shy! If you never experienced or never listened to Gothic cultured music. You might find something you love in it....... Or someone! This is Bears. From a fellow New Yorker who traveled the tri state for goth events I personally loved the video. Thanks!
Thank you for sharing the video of "The Castle"! My first goth club experience was in the summer of 1997 at the Castle. My friends and I had just graduated high school and we drove almost an hour away just to experience the night. Thereafter, almost every Friday and Saturday nights for many years, no matter where I lived Orlando,Saint Augustine, Daytona Beach, Miami, I still drove all the way to Ybor to dance the night away because it was so addicting. Sadly it's been awhile since I have gone to any clubs, life gets in the way, but it would be amazing to recreate the magic and energy that we had in the 90s. Thank you for creating your channel about the goth culture and sharing your experience.
You should go. I am a veteran of the 90's NYC scene who lived in the Tampa area for a little while, and it does have that same "leaving the world behind" feel that the Bank, Mother, and Limelight had. I think the reason the NYC scene lost that feel was Giuliani's crack down on the clubs. There really aren't any huge weekly goth-industrial nights anymore like there used to be. It now tends to be monthly events that have to keep changing location, or be in really small venues where they don't get to really leave a distinct footprint. The Castle has been there 25 years and has always been an alternative club, so you don't have that feeling that they just threw up some red and black sheets on the wall to make it feel goth, because tomorrow it has to be a hipster bar.
Love this video! I loved hat that guy had to say about seeing the beauty in darkness and appreciating it because you cannot have light without darkness. The yin and the yang concept, I have always believed in this. Great message
Thanks so much for this! I'm a Bank alumni ('97 / '98) as well as Pyramid, Coney Island High, Opera etc around the same time. There was truly something magical at that time - a sense of camaraderie for sure!
2:34 from what I’ve heard plus what I know of the time that goth was forming, the clubs was how people got together. It’s how you got inspiration for your style, how you found new music, how you hung out with friends, and how you made new friends. Before the internet things like this, communities, really depended on people physically coming together. Idk how people not know this but at the same time I’ve been watching videos by older goths since I was 18/19 and I’ve even read a book or two by those considered elder goths plus my mom was in the scene in her youth. So maybe I just find it easier than some to understand this. I’ve had similar experiences with things like Pride, where you get to be with people who understand you, where you get to learn new things and make new friends, and just have fun all while doing it.
Call me a poser, call me a faux-goth, call me whatever the hell you want. So long as I am enjoying myself, and not impeding on anyone elses fun in any way aside from trivial things like how I'm dressed, why should I care what anyone else thinks of me. You are a wonderful person who has inspired many. If the rest of the loud and proud individuals in this culture were even half as open as you, this subculture would feel so much more unified.
You gave a shout out to Black Tape for a Blue Girl! I love them still. How I miss Vampiricus and Club Noire. DJ Xian was great. She'd play the goth standards, but then throw in some Japanese goth rock or even disco and no one lost it. We'd just dance. And thanks for making the point that goths come in all shapes, sizes and colors. I never cared, but I feel for baby bats of color who think there's no place for them.
Glad you made this video, I’ve always thought being goth/alt was cool but I was raised super religiously so I didn’t get into the scene until I was 18 and it’s super lonely cause ppl think I’m a poser haha
Hell you have a point .I was there in the 90s and went back to a club i used to go to after about a 15 year gap . Was it me or the club ? I came to the conclusion the atmosphere had gone . People are now educated by the internet .Goth has become a fashion statement as in you should buy all this . We had no money , we just wanted to have fun meet friend dance and drink a lot . Now Its all logged filmed and allied on the phone . We were reckless and sometimes stupid ,but had fun
I nearly fell out of bed at 10:28 “Gee i hope they didn’t misunderstand me and think i am a member of a Germanic tribe that LISTENS TO BUILDINGS” BAHAHAHAHA i’ve had my couple minutes to get the laughs out but they just keep on coming, i don’t quite know why that sentence was so funny to me😂💗
I'm the same way! Sometimes just the way a sentence is put together has the ability to set me off and I'm laughing on and off everytime I think about it!
@Angela I love this. I know I am late the party here. This all rings true! My dancing really started in LA and OC in 1988. This discussion really hit the mark for me. I danced through the 90s in LA, SF, SB, SLO. It was always stepping into an immersive atmosphere. 2005 I drove across the US West to East and then back, zig-zagging to visit as many goth clubs as I could - while looking for a school.Thank you Vamp List!
Wow i can't believe you brought up the castle! I just recently moved up to west CT but i used to love going over to the castle when I had the chance, although it isn't nearly as cool as it looks in those clips
This video was extremely refreshing for me to hear. I’m scared of even trying to embrace my “dark side” at times because sometimes? I don’t WANT to dress this way, I might feel colorful one day, or I might say “hey I feel like listening to some nostalgic boybands!” And I’m young.. I feel inauthentic. I’m suppose to be boxed and and ONE THING AT ALL TIMES, otherwise I’m a poser. Why can’t we be many things? The 90’s seemed much more accepting.
I have to say this.. there was literally a feeling of magic in the air in the 90s! I just couldn't do anything because I was a baby. But I could FEEL IT!!!!!!!!!!!! I remember LITERALLY having a thought at age two: "Mannn I wanna go out and party.. but I'm a baby. I have to wait." That video of the club omg I can feel it. I'm just happy I was born at that time because at least I can feel it based on era. I'm very empathic. I have always said that the 90s just had this spark. It seep into mainstream too, Gloria Estefan, Sade etc. It was an exciting time. That needs to come back.
I agree and attribute this to losing our youthfulness. I remember walking into the club, leaving the world behind and dancing all night long, only stopping to rehydrate.
I was one who likes offbeat music I really did not label myself back then you could go clubbing not hardly obsess about getting hurt or killed in violence today you would not attempt to do that at least not often as a lifestyle sad this generation is one of technology not quality of life or much else
Our local goth night (Charlottesville, VA) has old school goths and baby bats and all kinds in between. We love it that way. And the music varies a lot!
I totally agree, and I think the other thing is self awareness(for example draping yourself over a tombstone with roses in total earnest vs. finding it cheesy and ironic in the present) Basically what you said about goth being nitpicked to the point of disintegrating, there's only one way to be goth and it's set in stone now. Goth back then was fast and loose and if you knew goth, you were it, no one in the 80s and 90s were arguing what is or isn't goth because it didnt need to be said or explained!
I had a fake ID too to experience the NYC goth scene. Maybe it is because we grew up in the same area, the same time the same clubs. I can attest that that what she says is the same things I experienced, and we would also change up our style based on the club night/mood/event, and we did plan all week for the event/club night. There was that magic like you say. Maybe it was partly because goths were so shunned by popular opinions and the club you weren't treated like an outcast. It was outcasts being with their people. Maybe some of that is gone because we aren't really outcasts anymore, which was us as goths enduring and showing people that we should be excepted. This has turned new younger goths to now say goth clothing doesn't need to be part of the scene, and you can be goth without dressing up, or you can be goth without the music. Yet in the 90s goth club scene you would plan your outfit way in advance of the goth night. You and all your friends would decide what to wear and it was important to you. Sometimes you go with your friends to a far away goth night. Get a hotel, do eachothers makeup. You prepped for just one goth event and you couldn't wait to dance to your favorite songs, see your club friends, and also admire everyones outfits. I feel like there are newer goths that are fine with encouraging others that they don't have do any of that, that they can pick and choose what they feel like doing feom the scene and still be called goth. They are essentially picking apart the scene and trying to make it that everyone has to be included because they want the label without actually embracing what goth is and newer goths calling people elitists because they get worried then they telling people they can be goth while essentially not being goth. We used to look up to older elder goths because they were goth, they were right, they had the real like experience. I have seen a trend where internet goths, and new goths will try and tell people who have been goth for over 2 decades that they aren't goth, or that the 90's goth bands aren't goth. They try to act like they know more than the people who lived it everyday. I honestly think the encouragement of the lack of dedication to the scene is why that magic is dying. I don't feel there is anything wrong with telling people who either love the music and the scene so you want to be committed to it. It doesn't feel forced and it makes you happy to be committed to it. If being committed to something you love is too much work...maybe you don't love it and maybe you just aren't goth. That isn't a bad thing. We don't need to baby and except every person or we are going to lose the scene itself. We don't have to pander to those who only want to put in enough effort to gain the label of goth and nothing else. If you love it then it is amazing and fun, and not hard. It makes you happy to be goth, it makes you happy to listen to the music, it makes you happy to make yourself up. If those things feel forced to you in anyway than you probably just aren't goth, and there is no same in that. It isn't some great offense to not be goth. Just because it is all of a sudden some cool and edgy thing to be, doesn't mean someone should try and force themselves to fit goth because if you don't naturally love goth than maybe it's not for you. Back in the 90s goths got hate for being/dressing goth by main media. They weren't getting props, and likes. They were being called freaks, ugly, fags. They got daily harrassment by non goths. The only people who typically complimented you were other goths. I think this trying to except everyone just because they want the label of goth and the fear of being called an elitist if you don't just pander to peoples needs to be included and gain the title is what is taking away that magic. Goth wasn't a popularity contest. I would say in my opinion the people in high school who were popular and shunned others for being goth, but now it is popular to be goth, and in the 90's it was popular for girls to look like barbie. So, if the people who are doing it for only the popularity are being blindly excepted, then it will change the scene and the people who are apart of it. There is also too much internet goth experts who mislead people, and too much conflicting information. If you want to know more about goth and truly experience it. Go out and experience it if you can. Go to a club. The best way to learn is to actually do it like the 80's and 90's goths did. We were teaching ourselves. We didn't couldn't just go online and read things. There is too much misinformation online, and it is too overwhelming. I can tell what is BS and what is truth because I have lived it for about 22 years now. Angela is a goth youtuber that I can attest to her knowing what she is talking about and because her experiences are very similar to mine and so I know she doesn't BS and she is very straightforward. If I were new to the goth scene I would listen to her because she isn't a fake TH-cam. Her responses and posts are very honest, and you can count on her to give you genuine elder goth experiences, which is something more newer goths are likely to make up and act like they just know it all.
Fun times at gothic festival here in Finland... the DJ knew how to make the night fun. We sang along to the popular kid's tv show tune, we sang along to ghengis khan etc. I've never had so much fun in a club.
This is so refreshing to hear, and rather validating. I grew up with a strict dad who basically dictated everything down to what color of clothes I could wear (my prom dress was a white satin and velvet Victorian gown from Hot Topic - my mom bought it for me while I was visiting her, he gave me crap for it) and basically assigned me the role of "princess" (minus the glam). I'm Goth at heart but obviously never stepped too far outside of the box of public conventionality because I was too sensitive to deal with the consequences (my friends would NEVER describe me as goth but they would describe me as a little "off"). The magic was always in my head and heart, but over the years it seems to have faded, as everyone else seems to have noticed. I decided to search for it and this is the first place I landed. Thank you
Dam! i visited the Castle in the mid 90's a few times. Back when there was a large grass feild for parking and no buildings around the Castle....Times have changed there outside and inside big time. When I got back to Tampa in the early 2000's a ton of changes were made in the area. Also inside the Castle there is/was a new room for special events. 2 dance floors, the big one upstairs and the outside patio dance floor next to the bar. Good times.
Thanks again, Angela, for the great video and your insight on the Goth/Gothic subculture. You've mentioned so many good and relevant points, and I totally agree with you on all of them. I think we are the same age ;) I've been in the scene since mid 90s and I see and feel the change. I also remember that 'magic' feeling when you entered the club in 90s early 00s. I think nowadays people have become very individualistic and selfish in a way, and social media plays a big role in that 'division' issue that you are referring to. But on the other hand, you are using social media to talk about our beautiful scene, educate people and share the love for the music. Thank you for doing that!
I don't think it's disappeared completely. I go to an alt club in my area and it's the first club I've ever enjoyed going to. The people are interesting ( a big older crowd as well) and they are friendly and welcoming. The music is amazing. I dance for hours there and I also get that sense of "dread" when the night is coming to an end. Obviously I wasn't there in the 90s to compare, but today's scene feels just as magical to me, even if it's much smaller and harder to find. My love of the music comes from my mom was goth in the 90s in London.
I enjoy hearing about the scene back then as I was too young (born in 87) to have been able to go to anything like that or have access to one when I was old enough due to being in such a rural area in the South.
It was not until last year that I went to my first goth club, and i felt just like that. I walked in and stopped. I thought, I'm with people like me! Everyone was so welcoming and with so much understanding of me being new to embracing who I am. I feel like I found a family. Maybe the magic is not quite dead!
1:50 YEP exactly. All wee talked about during the week was the friday, who's coming, where to meet before, what to wear and getting ready together etc...
There was a very large goth scene in Denver, during the mid to early 00’s, but it slowly fizzled out. I was looking for something new in 97’ since the Alternative/Grunge scene was dead and buried and so were many of it’s singers. I went to my first Goth night at a local club in Boulder called Millennium, behind the Target. I think I wore ripped jeans and a flannel tied around my waist but wasn’t totally shunned due to my waist long dyed black hair. I looked around the packed bar, knew a lot of the 80’s synth pop and liked the other stuff. I was already a fan of industrial. The next day I went to the used clothing store to buy whatever black clothing items I could afford on a retail employee’s budget of 8 bucks an hour, it was 1997. I checked out the much larger scene in Denver at The Snake Pitt and 1082 Broadway. Wow, there was nothing like Sunday night’s at 1082. People were fairly respectful of others and 95% of the crowd in there Sunday finest dark clothing. In time the scene died in Boulder and shifted to many different bars in Denver. The Church was popular which is an actual old Gothic Church converted multi level bar/dance club. Another bar tried to have a goth night 5 times a week and sadly help destroy the diversity of the scene. I eventually walked away from the scene due to it being the shadow of it’s former self and an annoying ex gf. Before I left Boulder and the country in 2019, there was maybe one or two goth nights a month and the occasional concert to dress up for. The last event I attended was Goth Prom in 2018, and joined the ranks of the Elder Goths. I just turned 50 and live in a country that has never heard of a goth, but have an amazing soundtrack on all of my devices. The scene in the 90’s that I experienced could never be replicated and I only wish I had more photos.
Thanks for putting this video up. I've felt this way going out to dance nights in the past few years, which is one of the reasons I moved to NYC 10 years ago - for the better alternative nightlife. Hoping that the magic comes back.
I miss the 90s goth clubs. Ours was on a Sunday night here and i went every Sunday for years. I ended up going back years later and it felt like I never left. I wish they still had that place. Last goth night I went to was a mix between metal and more modern music. I remember the "kinderbats" (that's what we called the young ones) that I was with complained when anything old came on but I was like "finally"
Thank you for being such a positive figment of my youth and happiest memories. I'm glad you enjoyed this. I hope it helps people get out and enjoy themselves.
It is a joy and an honor that I could be a part of your life, even through a song or a passing moment, but especially as a figment of youth and happiest memories. I mean that truly. The work you are doing now is insightful, meaningful, and, most importantly, real. Again, you have my thanks for everything you have done and are doing. I wish you all the best.
I'm so glad I found your channel! The Bank was my first goth night also, back in July of 1998. I was spending the summer with my 1st love, I was 19 * a grunge girl fresh out of small-town Georgia. The closest thing I'd ever experienced to goth was watching The Craft, lol. My boyfriend's best friend & his ex took me out shopping & I purchased my first spiked collar. I wore my first see-through shirt that night. My life was completely changed after that. The only song I danced to that night was "Intergalactic" by Beastie Boys, lol. And then a Nitzer Ebb, song I think, came on & I was in shock because everyone got on the dance floor, formed a circle & started dancing. But they were all doing the exact same dance. I called it goth line dancing. It was very strange. I've never seen anything like it before or after. LOL
I came into the scene later around 99 but Batcave and ZenWarp and those nights were some of the best times of my life and I judge every club I go to now against those clubs and those DJs
Great memories of the Bank, especially the basement at the Bank. It was there that I discovered great music. I still have the postcard that I had Patrick write songs on. I'm looking at one right now. Kiss the Whip and Sin (dead souls rising, still my favorite goth song!)
It’s weird to hear it called slave collar. I agree with you. I’ve heard someone say I’m not a building, so you should know the difference between goth and gothic. My first response was “Huh?”
Lead by a leash huh? Dang, maybe that's what I need to do if I go to a Goth event, bring a leash and find available Goth men wearing collars with an O-Ring to clip it to snag me a Goth man lol Kidding of course haha.
Hailing from Toronto here. I grew up with a bunch of alternative kids around me in the city. Although clubs have closed, I'm seeing a renaissance of the scene here, or perhaps I'm more eager to participate. I think it comes in waves. 5 clubs and shops shut down over 10 years and then slowly a bunch more pop up. Lately I've noticed great events are on the climb with a mix of old and new music (for a while it was just a lot of throwback nights). I'm excited to see new blood in these venues, because even 5 years ago it was a thin crowd. That said, I know what you mean regarding that sense of awe walking into your first goth night. For me, it was an event called Darkrave that spun goth/industrial/ebm/darkwave/etc. There would be a lineup of kids outside, even in the winter for these events. And my best friend and I would hover downtown after shopping or hanging out until around 9pm when it happened, just to gawk at the outfits until we were old enough to get in. I was lucky. That mid-2000s rebirth was my highschool experience, but it dies off sometimes and now we're seeing it come back a bit more in Toronto, at least. I think channels like yours are helping with that. So thanks! You've even been a part of my own refreshed enthusiasm for goth events since the way you see the scene is a lot like I see it. It's honestly been so exciting to see more like-minded people talking about the scene. I think you understand it really similarly to the way that I do. 🖤🖤
In my situation I might have to go to a goth club by myself and make goth friends there but it's so nerve racking. I hope to meet people who share my interests or have my friends (who aren't goth) follow me or I'm gonna have to push myself to go on my own, either way I'm reaching a club for sure.
OMG! I used to go to the Castle in Tampa for Goth/Industrial Night in the '90s and I remember them putting it on the news. It was so much fun. I really miss it! BTW, you are so cute! I love bats too. Love your channel. Stay spooky, girl!!!!!! :)
So happy I got to experience the early 90’s in Detroit @ Leland City Club and the late 90’s at The Castle in Tampa. What magical places, times and music. I wouldn’t want to trade it for anything.
DJ Patrick and Father Jeff have been around since The Bank (and probably before then). They still spin at Necropolis, a goth dance night, every first Saturday in midtown Manhattan! I was born in the 90’s so wasn’t able to experience all the magic, but with what is left, Necropolis seems to still have some of it. 🖤
I just thought of a possible reason why the "magic" may be missing for some. When us oldies were new we had little to go by before attending an event. A flyer, an ad in a zine or local street mag, maybe some positive word of mouth or a community radio ad/music show. So we turn up not knowing what to expect. More hype and optimism than negatives. Nowadays thanks to the internet, we have videos and images from years worth of events from all over the world, fashion blogs, music playlists and more. So we start to compare things and pick it apart, exposing the flaws and negatives. Little wonder if people have done that, they might attend with a pessimistic attitude before stepping through the door. And that's even if they bother stepping through the door. Not saying this is your experience but it is worth thinking about. Odd thoughts at 3:30am.
I became a *member* of the Gothic subculture around my early 20's....and now I'm 40 (born 1978) so that make me half of my whole life a Goth! It all started off when I was on a birthday party and my friend has a catalogue from the shop Large (who still exsist!) and I was flipping trough it...and there it was....beautyfull velvet dresses and skirts and corset tops! And that was the beginning! We had just installed the internet at my parents house, so when I got home I dive in to the World of Goth! And it felt as if I was finally....HOME....I liked a great deal about the music, the clothing, the aesthetic.... just the whole thing!! In my browsing I became aware there was a location called the Baroeg in Rotterdam in The Netherlands where they held Goth nights, and because Rotterdam was not to far from the city I lived...I spend a lot of my weekends there and became friends with people I still speak today via Facebook, and with that group we get to other venue's like Gotham in Amsterdam and other cities....I do not remember them where they where held ATM, due to Brain Fog... But the Baroeg was our *Go To* place, and like you said in your video, Angela, sometimes between 2 Goth songs the DJ played a goofy or a very mainstream song everybody knows and Goth or not...everyone fillled the floor and we danced and have fun!!! When Goth was a *thing* in the mainstream in the late 90's and begin 2000...and when it wasn't *IN* anymore...it was so sad to see that a lot of Goth Nights became not a weekly or montly thing but there came a rise in HipHop Nights...and then Goth Nights got cancelled...or even more sadly.....venues closed!!! Only Baroeg is still open so far as I know...but when I look at the Agenda...it is a mix of Death/Terror/Doom Rock etc etc...and only 1 *Goth* thing called Wave Fest once in a while..... But I live not near The Baroeg anymore so I haven't a clue about what kind of events there are now....
YES! You mentioned The Castle! I go there every Friday and Saturday. I love that place, it feels like home away from home. Free expression without repression... they are just giving that shit away at the door (: Also, I am in love with your aesthetic. Keep on keepin on sista.
I grew up in the 70s, and the 80s, long before these stupid things we all hold in our hands became commonplace! The internet and technology has killed much of the "magic" within the subculture... Thanks to social networking and other interactive sites, you can don your "monster suit" (makeup) in the comfort of your own home, make a video stream about whatever is on your mind, do a few hours on social networking, (maybe) chat with others for awhile, and that's it! You log off, take off the makeup, and you're done for the night... Things were different back in the day because you HAD to "Get up, get ready, get out, and go to" if you wanted to get deep into the scene...There was no other way around it...
![Type O Negative - Love You To Death [OFFICIAL VIDEO]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xD5No_JRrZw/mqdefault.jpg)
It's not just goths who changed from then to now, it's people and society in general. In the 90s, life was about going out and doing things, seeing things, having new and beautiful experiences. Now, people want to stay inside and utilize technology. That's something I greatly miss about that time period.
Also, there is a great obsession with image now. I have noticed some famous internet goths won't give you the time of day unless they think you are as attractive as they are or have as much fame as they do, no matter how nice you are to them. There was a time not too long ago in which children were taught to not judge a book by its cover, but now we have people in the goth subculture judging other goths by their outward appearance. How "goth" you look or how hot you are. That person they find ugly or looking like a mall goth just might be the most goth person ever and someone very kind and fun to be around. This is more of a reflection on modern day society than goths specifically. In the 80s and 90s, I think goths suffered more persecution than they usually do now so we tended to be less judgmental toward other goths because we knew how it felt to be judged harshly based on appearances (unless you were in junior high or high school. A lot of kids liked to throw around "poser" for silly reasons). These days, people compliment goths more often than they insult them in a lot of areas, so there is a disconnect somewhere in the way of empathy.
I agree 100%... it was the best decade
I agree. You see a very common sense of nostalgia for the 70's, 80's, and 90's among all kinds of people from punks to metalheads to goth and so on. For me, I even miss the 2000's, even though I was just a kid. We used to throw parking lot shows where we would have a couple bands play and there would be at least 30 people who would come down to see the show. Nowadays, there isn't as much of that commitment or sense of comradry and brotherhood. I seen it happening in some places but not as often as it used to.
see thats exactly why there's SUCh a need to revitalize society, culture and arts!!! We need to externalize our desires more and remind people of the good feelings, oxytocin and dopamine release when you go out and party especially in a particular scene where everyone has a place to fit in. Once the younger generation get a taste for that, they wont let go. We can do it!!
That is something I always say to everybody, but no one seems to understand. Real life was outside, it was very unlike to stay at home saturday night. We used to plan weeks later what we were going to do on weekend. Today, if you go to a club, bar or Pub, bands are playing to no one because everybody is at home watching netflix, covid made it even worse. Also people are more worried about taking photos of themselves and posting on instagram than enjoying the moment and friends. It is so ridiculous. I feel so sad, and I miss the 90s and early 2000s a lot.
I love the surprised look I get from people when I tell them I used to take ballet for six years and that I cosplay. Most people assume goths only do “goth” things. Why be a square when you can be a cube?
I find both those things to be quite goth to do.
but I get your point. lol
Everything you've said makes me pine for the old days. Things were so much better for goths back then.
it seems like everything has lost its magic
It's called growing up.
They say the world didn't end in 2000 but has anyone ever really been happy since then?
Miss Murder I was born in the wrong generation cause everyone I know it’s just sad and overworked, no time to hang out with friends anymore...
It’s the internet. And I’m not anti-internet. But when I went to goth/industrial clubs (1993-2000ish), things were underground. You went for the atmosphere, the experience, to hear the music, to make connections with like-minded people...it wasn’t “exclusive” necessarily but was an underground community. Now everything is at your fingertips. Social media has supplanted face-to-face communities, you can find any rare record, remix, etc., in like 2 seconds instead of digging endlessly through records and cassettes in stores. Some of what the internet has brought is really amazing. But some things have died or changed as a result. It just is what it is.
@@bf13137 Absolutely. It's not an edgy, super underground club that only goths know about if any wannabe goth with an internet connection can find it in 3 seconds. Back then you got invited by those already acquainted. Its like the magic trick that you found out about. It loses its magic and it's Wonder once you know how the trick is done. The internet has done this with all kinds of things. I remember any early 2000s people would tell me about clubs and I would be super interested because it seems like some kind of underground exclusive thing that you had to be invited to. I think what the internet all of that mysticism has been debunked and revealed to the public so now we know that it never was any magic that this is what it was always about it's always about money and marketing and blah blah blah. I think the internet just illuminated that fact and took away the magic like a done with so many other things
I really miss the club culture of the 80's. The scene in Houston was really inclusive since hard core punk, dance techno, goth and rockabilly all shared the same music venues. The goth crowd would should up to punk shows, punks would go to Goth night; and everyone got along for the most part. All of that really started to change in the late 90's though. Kinda sad. :(
Popularity took hold and attitudes began to shift. It's a shame :(
Its still like that. I just went to a local punk show at a rockabilly club lol. Another time I went to a punk show at this underground spot with no address and I was amazed at how inclusive they were when the hispanics had their lil Cumbia parties in between the sets. Although I can say, the spark sure doesn't feel all there at all, yet at the underground lot, it felt like the closest you could get to an experience that is of the scene back then
im so happy i was a kid in the 80s.back then newwavers,,new romantics,,goths all got along and hung out together.
i’m 15 so i can’t comment on the club scene but i still feel the fear of being deemed unauthentic/poser. and i’m really caught up in it it’s a shame. if i ever listen to something not goth and enjoy it i actually feel kind of guilty and fake. this toxic mentality needs to end ugh.
Where do you live?
Angela Benedict philadelphia
Nobody should feel guilty for liking something other than goth. I'm pretty sure where the stigma comes from to begin with is when people call things that aren't goth, "goth". Like saying you're goth because you listen to Marilyn Manson, as an example. Well, that's not goth. You're not goth. If you are into *actual* goth music and the goth scene/community to whatever extent, then whatever else you listen to or do doesn't matter.
Gurl, Britney Spears. Be you and who cares if that makes you "goth." It's more important to be you then to fit into any stereotype. Be you honey. If that means listening to Britney Spears, wearing all black, and loving to surround yourself with spooky things then do it. I promise you'll be happier for it. ❤☠❤
Julie Niskala hey I'm from Philly too 🖤 I don't go out much to events because I feel the judging too (or maybe cuz of my paranoia, Idk heh)
Dear Angela, AMEN. Goth is goth. I live for the day that sense of wonder can be captured once again. I’ve only ever had “goth night” at a local bar called Mars Bar in Richmond, Virginia. An actual dedicated goth club was not around but damn it I hit goth night ever Wednesday at Mars Bar because it’s what I, and the other goths had. I never wanted those nights to end.
You could wear any of the goth styles and it didn’t matter because we all knew why we were there. The sense of dissection hadn’t hit the subculture yet.
I want to see that happen again. Thank you for this.
Remember revelations at twisters, or 1408 before that? I know I'm showing my age there, but those were my hay days... I got out of the scene about the time mars bar got going, but still listen to everything from back then.
Kinda funny to see a local post... cheers.
I miss Mars Bar! 80s music and friends, we had such a great time back in the day. I went to Sacrosanct after it had moved to Fallout next door, which is thankfully still there. =)
Damn I'm in Richmond Virginia and I've been meaning to find goth clubs and stuff in the VA area.
I wish I could have experienced the goth clubs like you had. I've been going to goth clubs for 10 years and I've never felt welcome.
Even I can see a dramatic shift from just a decade ago. There are more people who would rather sit outside the venue to drink and smoke just to say they went than those who go inside and actually want to have a genuine experience.
As an asthmatic and a cancer patient, I am so glad people can't smoke inside. I would never be able to go. I know what you mean though, Kiri. I never understood people who would just sit outside and smoke, or sit at the bar all night while amazing music was playing.
Exactly! This was never a comment on the smoking ban, I'm all for it. People can always run outside to have a smoke then go back inside to have fun, it's a comment on the people who only ever sit outside drinking and smoking and never actually take part in the event they most likely paid a cover charge to attend.
Why dictate how people should enjoy their night out? If they payed the cover and are buying drinks they are supporting the event. They may enjoy the atmosphere and music but not feel like dancing and that is ok. They might be there primarily to socialise too. Full dance floors are great but as long as people are enjoying themselves and keep coming back who cares? Some events are more laid back.
I'm one of those guys who sit outside to drink, and smoke. (not the whole time, but 2/3 or so). I do it because it's hard to converse over the music, and I go to socialize. (in some circles, there may be a pretentious "we're better than our club" nonsense but that's not why I do it)
aytakk Great point! I was responding to the dialogue in the video about that lost "magic" of the event. Part of it could simply be getting older but I was commenting on the fact that I generally see more people outside the venue these days than in it & that may be why. Of course people are free to do what they want at an event so long as they're not hurting anyone.
This all needed to be said.
It irks me to no end when I start a discussion online about how goth music and gothic aesthetic and literature can sometimes go hand in hand, then people come out of the woodworks to tell me how wrong I am for drawing such a comparison or making such an example. “Anything that existed before 1979 isn’t goth, it’s gothic,” they say. They somehow thinks that invalidates the examples of inspiration that goth musicians take from gothic literature. Goth music doesn’t exist in a vacuum like these people seem to think it does. These people seem to believe that “Spleen and The Ideal” and “De Profundis” of the amazing work of Dead Can Dance were just randomly pulled out of someone’s ass by a goth musician. Charles Baudelaire wrote that volume in “Les Fleurs du Mail”, named “Spleen et le Idéal” and the poem “De Profundis Clamavi” (Latin for “From the Depths I Cry”). Why is it so wrong for “goth” and “gothic” to be interchangeable? Shouldn’t it help unite us instead of divide us? The difference is two letters: “I” and “C”. Yet now, it’s causing fights and put-downs. I see a huge problem here.
It’s a collective experience and aesthetic of the amazing spectrum of goth music, literature, mindset, and being united under an incredible love for things dark, beautiful, sensual, and mysterious. Why can’t we just take that shit and get along?
And I fucking hate the fashion police. They can take a bottle of hairspray and shove it up their ass if they say I look like a poseur for sporting my naturally curling, untested hair. I’m just doing what Poe described as “Setting full force of the Homeric epithet of ‘Hyacinthine.’”
Amazing video, as always, babe. I love how hard you are trying to unify this fragmented subculture.
If you want to know the reason why the two somewhat split, it's pretty simple. Darkly Inclined/Dark Romanticism being conflated as the same thing as Goth. I'm pretty sure you've run into those people who think Goth is not about the music and think that you don't have to listen or like any Goth music to be a Goth. As long as you wear black, pile on the eye shadow and lipstick, and listen to Metal or classical music, you're a Goth and if anyone says otherwise, they're an elitist.
This kind of thinking is what really annoyed Goths and just made them want to distance themselves from these people who were falsifying their scene for the sake of attention and popularity (The "Mall Goth" trend of 2003-2006 is a good example of this).
That's pretty much the main factor that contributed the divide because the thing is. While Angela's experience definitely reflects the good and chill time of the 80s and 90s club scene, it also helped that the people were on the same page. They knew that if someone liked things like Gothic literature, imagery, etc, they would also be a fan of Goth music and vice versa. There was no need to for a distinction to be made in those times until the Darkly-Inclined and "Fashion Goths" tried to come in and change the meaning of the scene in the 00s.
Kai Decadence
what does " Darkly-Inclined " mean?
"Darkly-Inclined" is just a term used to describe people who are purely just into the dark and macabre but tend to not have interest in the Goth subculture as in they don't listen to the music associated with the scene.
Exactly this as well.
Do you think those people just haven't heard any of the music or just haven't found a goth band/artist that they like?...I don't see why somebody wouldn't like any of the music at all if they were so into the dark and macabre..
I have been wishing for a very long time that I could step back into the 90's for a bit(and not turn back into a toddler) because I have always wanted to experience something like this. By the time I was old enough to go to clubs it was way past the 2000's.
I was around in the 80s, those days where we were ‘alternative ‘.... I still head out to goth clubs, and for me in Melbourne, Australia in 2018, I am feeling quite a lot of magic is returning...
It is. People are getting excited again
Goth clubs in the 90's = A safe haven for dark minded outcasts who like Goth Rock, Darkwave, and Industrial music.
Goth clubs in the 2000's and onward = Just another place where you feel judged.
We gotta bring that sense of belonging and community back.
Angela Benedict I couldn't agree more.
For several years, I identified as goth but it wasn't until about a year ago when I realized I had no clue what goth was. Growing up in a small town with no goth scene, I had never heard Bauhaus or The Cure or anything else about the subculture. It wasn't until I came across your channel (and your music playlists) that really opened the doors for me. Before that, I knew about the fashion, about Poe and the internal desire to buy halloween decorations to put on display all year round, but I didn't even know goth was a genre of music (though unbeknownst to me, some artists that I was into were actually goth like The Birthday Massacre, Johnny Hollow and Voltaire). At first I didn't have any interest in the music but then I actually listened to it and, well, I love it! The whole subculture has this beautiful allure to it that's so indescribable and it just makes me want to listen, to learn and to know more. I've been hooked onto other goth channels, as well as, listening to The Belfry's podcasts. Even though I don't have a local scene, it just makes me want to try harder to find some way into the subculture and to help keep it alive. I don't want to ramble anymore, so I will end with a thank you. Thank you Angela for helping me get a good start on my dark and gothic journey and I hope you keep doing what you're doing because a lot of us baby bats appreciate it. :)
Yooo I had to think for a second to make sure I didn’t write this, except the bit about the small town lol
You hit the nail on the head describing what it felt like entering the goth club....I had that same feeling with the Bank.
I lived in the Bank.
I'd say I was a regular from '93 to '97, I remember always going into Trash & Vaudeville to grab a pass on the way there.
I think the Batcave was on 30th street and if I remember correctly that's where your hardcore goths went to. I wore black but never rocked the makeup (I thought I would have looked stupid), I felt I would have caught shit if I went there. I admit it was around '97 I stopped going because there were too many pretentious people (especially dudes) walking around. Still I miss those days I had so much fun hanging out and meeting up with 'club friends' as Angela put it.
Totally agree with the convenience, I lived in Elmhurst - Queens and the subway was right there. Got off West 4th or near Cooper Square and off I was.
I feel kind of robbed that I missed out on this sort of atmosphere. My city never had much of a goth scene, but there used to be a club I would go to called The Wreckd Room, which played a lot of industrial and occasionally strayed into darkwave territory. It was a tiny, mostly undecorated (besides a few band posters with blacklights on them) basement with a capacity of maybe 60 people, which I don't think I ever saw it reach more than once. It closed down a few years ago because the owner was losing money keeping it open or someshit. The scene there was often very elitist and unwelcoming and people didn't generally do a lot of talking to each other, but I loved to go there and stomp around and dance like an idiot underneath the shitty lasers and strobelights anyways. Another place used to be around called Dissent, which had to close its' doors and reopened at a different location under a different name, sticking around for a couple of years before closing due to some drug business happening there. Another place opened briefly called Moon Over Marin which was a good place for metal and industrial and so-called "gothic metal", nifty place with mirrored walls that used to be the entry hall to an old theatre that was mostly demolished, but they also ended up closing due to a variety of insurance issues. Pretty much the only place that stayed open more than 5 years was the Wreckd room, and it was never really a goth club, more of an "alternative" club.
Kind of wish I could go back in time and experience what it was like being goth in the 90's. I wish the toxic idea that you're being a poser if you like anything that is unrelated to the goth subculture makes you a poser did not exist... I always have this thought in the back of my head that I'm being a poser if I don't listen to goth music everyday or dress goth. Kind of frustrating, but hopefully one day I will no longer have that thought. Also, I love the way you explain things in your videos and are so inclusive!
I've gone to the Castle many times!, first time on Halloween a few years ago. I went with two friends intending to go there but they didn't want to wait in line or go in the end. I was so sad and was about to turn away but a couple dressed in matching clockwork orange outfits called to me saying you can hang with us for the night. I was taken a back, and I'm usually shy around strangers but I took a chance and said yes. It turned out to be a fun magical night, filled to the brim with people. Although there definitely was a mix of types of people, but everyone was all having fun together and enjoying the vibe. So glad that was my first experience and can't thank that nice couple enough.
The Castle is my home club and I am exceptionally thankful to have it close enough by that I can still get to it when I get the urge to get my dance on. Been going since 1995 when I turned 18. It's also the longest running single genre club in the area at 26 years strong. Last time I went I did feel the magic slowly dissipating but I will always be fortunate to have that readily available to me as I grew up.
You can never re-capture the magic of being new. But we can run events now and pass that magic on to the new people today. Hopefully they will do the same thing for others too.
aytakk This is what makes me hopeful! All we can do is show them and hope they're receptive. There are so many who are. We just need to get them out.
Something we need to be careful of. Too much nostalgia can kill things. If new people think everything sucks now because the 80s/90s is so overhyped online, they may not even give the current events IRL a proper go.
As great as it all was back then we can't have it back. We live in a different world and need to adjust with it. But that doesn't mean we can't have awesome stuff now.
I can understand that. The whole point really is to show that if it existed once before there's no reason why it can't be that way again. I don't think that things suck, but comparatively there's a huge difference and that's down to us and the younger generation. They don't realize how many of the cards they actually hold and just by showing up they can make a world of difference.
I'm starting to think this skin care thing is a cover up and you're really a vampire or something.
I was 2 years old in 98 and you don't look that much older than me.
I wish i was 2 in 98 :) i was 18 lol.
Same :)
It might just be good genetics, not smoking, and staying out of the sun!
Staying out of the sun being the biggest one IMO. Lots of elder goths don't have a ton of wrinkles because of the pale aesthetic.
Lol I was 5 in 98 XD
If goths judge other goths by anything it’s their taste in music.
It’s always a good day when Angela uploads🖤🖤
I certainly think the clubs are missing that feeling of "wow, this is home, these are my people" along with that element of "danger" like anything could happen, I only get that nowadays from a local dive bar called Monstercade that plays alot of different dark music.
I love your discription of the feel when enter the club. My mom took me to funhouse, I well under age. I went to batcave daily when also well underage lol. So I got to experience the late 90's early 2000 of the scene.
I felt the same way walking in event and seeing the people and sound and the red tinted lights. I can go on for ever. Including the way the night felt as it was ending. The night was so embracing groups would break off and travel the still dead city together clinging on to feelings we had the entire night before sun rise.
What I feel the Goth community fell short through out the years is the embracement of positive change. And you mention the very same thing in the same. Like a simple song of Neuroticfish- coming to take me away. It was fun. People laughed and skipped and it just brought people together. Instead of picking apart the differnce of a Victorian Goth and steam punk.
P.s GREAT SHOUT OUT!!! Ian Ford and Sean! Red Room!
PEOPLE! Go out and enjoy what we have left so we can grow long term down the road!
Don't be shy! If you never experienced or never listened to Gothic cultured music. You might find something you love in it....... Or someone!
This is Bears. From a fellow New Yorker who traveled the tri state for goth events I personally loved the video. Thanks!
Thank you for sharing the video of "The Castle"! My first goth club experience was in the summer of 1997 at the Castle. My friends and I had just graduated high school and we drove almost an hour away just to experience the night. Thereafter, almost every Friday and Saturday nights for many years, no matter where I lived Orlando,Saint Augustine, Daytona Beach, Miami, I still drove all the way to Ybor to dance the night away because it was so addicting. Sadly it's been awhile since I have gone to any clubs, life gets in the way, but it would be amazing to recreate the magic and energy that we had in the 90s. Thank you for creating your channel about the goth culture and sharing your experience.
The Castle is still so much fun. I don't get to visit very often, unfortunately.
I want to go!
Saturday they are having a Vampire Ball
I still haven't gone, my dad promised to take me when I turn 18 though.
You should go. I am a veteran of the 90's NYC scene who lived in the Tampa area for a little while, and it does have that same "leaving the world behind" feel that the Bank, Mother, and Limelight had. I think the reason the NYC scene lost that feel was Giuliani's crack down on the clubs. There really aren't any huge weekly goth-industrial nights anymore like there used to be. It now tends to be monthly events that have to keep changing location, or be in really small venues where they don't get to really leave a distinct footprint. The Castle has been there 25 years and has always been an alternative club, so you don't have that feeling that they just threw up some red and black sheets on the wall to make it feel goth, because tomorrow it has to be a hipster bar.
The Castle still has the look but the "magic"that was in the air in the late 80's early 90's is missing there as well now.
Love this video! I loved hat that guy had to say about seeing the beauty in darkness and appreciating it because you cannot have light without darkness. The yin and the yang concept, I have always believed in this. Great message
Thanks so much for this! I'm a Bank alumni ('97 / '98) as well as Pyramid, Coney Island High, Opera etc around the same time. There was truly something magical at that time - a sense of camaraderie for sure!
2:34 from what I’ve heard plus what I know of the time that goth was forming, the clubs was how people got together. It’s how you got inspiration for your style, how you found new music, how you hung out with friends, and how you made new friends. Before the internet things like this, communities, really depended on people physically coming together. Idk how people not know this but at the same time I’ve been watching videos by older goths since I was 18/19 and I’ve even read a book or two by those considered elder goths plus my mom was in the scene in her youth. So maybe I just find it easier than some to understand this. I’ve had similar experiences with things like Pride, where you get to be with people who understand you, where you get to learn new things and make new friends, and just have fun all while doing it.
Call me a poser, call me a faux-goth, call me whatever the hell you want. So long as I am enjoying myself, and not impeding on anyone elses fun in any way aside from trivial things like how I'm dressed, why should I care what anyone else thinks of me.
You are a wonderful person who has inspired many. If the rest of the loud and proud individuals in this culture were even half as open as you, this subculture would feel so much more unified.
You gave a shout out to Black Tape for a Blue Girl! I love them still. How I miss Vampiricus and Club Noire. DJ Xian was great. She'd play the goth standards, but then throw in some Japanese goth rock or even disco and no one lost it. We'd just dance. And thanks for making the point that goths come in all shapes, sizes and colors. I never cared, but I feel for baby bats of color who think there's no place for them.
Glad you made this video, I’ve always thought being goth/alt was cool but I was raised super religiously so I didn’t get into the scene until I was 18 and it’s super lonely cause ppl think I’m a poser haha
Hell you have a point .I was there in the 90s and went back to a club i used to go to after about a 15 year gap .
Was it me or the club ? I came to the conclusion the atmosphere had gone .
People are now educated by the internet .Goth has become a fashion statement as in you should buy all this .
We had no money , we just wanted to have fun meet friend dance and drink a lot .
Now Its all logged filmed and allied on the phone . We were reckless and sometimes stupid ,but had fun
I nearly fell out of bed at 10:28 “Gee i hope they didn’t misunderstand me and think i am a member of a Germanic tribe that LISTENS TO BUILDINGS” BAHAHAHAHA i’ve had my couple minutes to get the laughs out but they just keep on coming, i don’t quite know why that sentence was so funny to me😂💗
I'm the same way! Sometimes just the way a sentence is put together has the ability to set me off and I'm laughing on and off everytime I think about it!
@@angelabenedict same
that made me laugh too
@Angela I love this. I know I am late the party here. This all rings true! My dancing really started in LA and OC in 1988. This discussion really hit the mark for me. I danced through the 90s in LA, SF, SB, SLO. It was always stepping into an immersive atmosphere. 2005 I drove across the US West to East and then back, zig-zagging to visit as many goth clubs as I could - while looking for a school.Thank you Vamp List!
Wow i can't believe you brought up the castle! I just recently moved up to west CT but i used to love going over to the castle when I had the chance, although it isn't nearly as cool as it looks in those clips
This video was extremely refreshing for me to hear. I’m scared of even trying to embrace my “dark side” at times because sometimes? I don’t WANT to dress this way, I might feel colorful one day, or I might say “hey I feel like listening to some nostalgic boybands!” And I’m young.. I feel inauthentic. I’m suppose to be boxed and and ONE THING AT ALL TIMES, otherwise I’m a poser. Why can’t we be many things? The 90’s seemed much more accepting.
Thanks for featuring the Castle! That’s been my haunt for 25 years! In fact, I’m taking my daughter there in July for her 18th birthday!
omg that clip! I love the girl dressed all in flowing white... so beautiful 😍
I have to say this.. there was literally a feeling of magic in the air in the 90s! I just couldn't do anything because I was a baby. But I could FEEL IT!!!!!!!!!!!! I remember LITERALLY having a thought at age two: "Mannn I wanna go out and party.. but I'm a baby. I have to wait." That video of the club omg I can feel it. I'm just happy I was born at that time because at least I can feel it based on era. I'm very empathic. I have always said that the 90s just had this spark. It seep into mainstream too, Gloria Estefan, Sade etc. It was an exciting time. That needs to come back.
I agree and attribute this to losing our youthfulness. I remember walking into the club, leaving the world behind and dancing all night long, only stopping to rehydrate.
I was one who likes offbeat music I really did not label myself back then you could go clubbing not hardly obsess about getting hurt or killed in violence today you would not attempt to do that at least not often as a lifestyle sad this generation is one of technology not quality of life or much else
Our local goth night (Charlottesville, VA) has old school goths and baby bats and all kinds in between. We love it that way. And the music varies a lot!
I totally agree, and I think the other thing is self awareness(for example draping yourself over a tombstone with roses in total earnest vs. finding it cheesy and ironic in the present) Basically what you said about goth being nitpicked to the point of disintegrating, there's only one way to be goth and it's set in stone now. Goth back then was fast and loose and if you knew goth, you were it, no one in the 80s and 90s were arguing what is or isn't goth because it didnt need to be said or explained!
It’s just nice to be somewhere with people who understand you and love the same things....
🖤🖤🖤
I had a fake ID too to experience the NYC goth scene. Maybe it is because we grew up in the same area, the same time the same clubs. I can attest that that what she says is the same things I experienced, and we would also change up our style based on the club night/mood/event, and we did plan all week for the event/club night. There was that magic like you say.
Maybe it was partly because goths were so shunned by popular opinions and the club you weren't treated like an outcast. It was outcasts being with their people. Maybe some of that is gone because we aren't really outcasts anymore, which was us as goths enduring and showing people that we should be excepted. This has turned new younger goths to now say goth clothing doesn't need to be part of the scene, and you can be goth without dressing up, or you can be goth without the music. Yet in the 90s goth club scene you would plan your outfit way in advance of the goth night. You and all your friends would decide what to wear and it was important to you. Sometimes you go with your friends to a far away goth night. Get a hotel, do eachothers makeup. You prepped for just one goth event and you couldn't wait to dance to your favorite songs, see your club friends, and also admire everyones outfits.
I feel like there are newer goths that are fine with encouraging others that they don't have do any of that, that they can pick and choose what they feel like doing feom the scene and still be called goth. They are essentially picking apart the scene and trying to make it that everyone has to be included because they want the label without actually embracing what goth is and newer goths calling people elitists because they get worried then they telling people they can be goth while essentially not being goth. We used to look up to older elder goths because they were goth, they were right, they had the real like experience. I have seen a trend where internet goths, and new goths will try and tell people who have been goth for over 2 decades that they aren't goth, or that the 90's goth bands aren't goth. They try to act like they know more than the people who lived it everyday.
I honestly think the encouragement of the lack of dedication to the scene is why that magic is dying. I don't feel there is anything wrong with telling people who either love the music and the scene so you want to be committed to it. It doesn't feel forced and it makes you happy to be committed to it. If being committed to something you love is too much work...maybe you don't love it and maybe you just aren't goth. That isn't a bad thing. We don't need to baby and except every person or we are going to lose the scene itself. We don't have to pander to those who only want to put in enough effort to gain the label of goth and nothing else.
If you love it then it is amazing and fun, and not hard. It makes you happy to be goth, it makes you happy to listen to the music, it makes you happy to make yourself up. If those things feel forced to you in anyway than you probably just aren't goth, and there is no same in that. It isn't some great offense to not be goth. Just because it is all of a sudden some cool and edgy thing to be, doesn't mean someone should try and force themselves to fit goth because if you don't naturally love goth than maybe it's not for you. Back in the 90s goths got hate for being/dressing goth by main media. They weren't getting props, and likes. They were being called freaks, ugly, fags. They got daily harrassment by non goths.
The only people who typically complimented you were other goths. I think this trying to except everyone just because they want the label of goth and the fear of being called an elitist if you don't just pander to peoples needs to be included and gain the title is what is taking away that magic.
Goth wasn't a popularity contest. I would say in my opinion the people in high school who were popular and shunned others for being goth, but now it is popular to be goth, and in the 90's it was popular for girls to look like barbie. So, if the people who are doing it for only the popularity are being blindly excepted, then it will change the scene and the people who are apart of it. There is also too much internet goth experts who mislead people, and too much conflicting information.
If you want to know more about goth and truly experience it. Go out and experience it if you can. Go to a club. The best way to learn is to actually do it like the 80's and 90's goths did. We were teaching ourselves. We didn't couldn't just go online and read things. There is too much misinformation online, and it is too overwhelming. I can tell what is BS and what is truth because I have lived it for about 22 years now.
Angela is a goth youtuber that I can attest to her knowing what she is talking about and because her experiences are very similar to mine and so I know she doesn't BS and she is very straightforward. If I were new to the goth scene I would listen to her because she isn't a fake TH-cam. Her responses and posts are very honest, and you can count on her to give you genuine elder goth experiences, which is something more newer goths are likely to make up and act like they just know it all.
Fun times at gothic festival here in Finland... the DJ knew how to make the night fun. We sang along to the popular kid's tv show tune, we sang along to ghengis khan etc. I've never had so much fun in a club.
Shout out to The Castle, my very first Goth club experience when I was 17!!! Miss that f$#king place!!! 🖤
This is so refreshing to hear, and rather validating. I grew up with a strict dad who basically dictated everything down to what color of clothes I could wear (my prom dress was a white satin and velvet Victorian gown from Hot Topic - my mom bought it for me while I was visiting her, he gave me crap for it) and basically assigned me the role of "princess" (minus the glam). I'm Goth at heart but obviously never stepped too far outside of the box of public conventionality because I was too sensitive to deal with the consequences (my friends would NEVER describe me as goth but they would describe me as a little "off"). The magic was always in my head and heart, but over the years it seems to have faded, as everyone else seems to have noticed. I decided to search for it and this is the first place I landed. Thank you
Dam! i visited the Castle in the mid 90's a few times. Back when there was a large grass feild for parking and no buildings around the Castle....Times have changed there outside and inside big time. When I got back to Tampa in the early 2000's a ton of changes were made in the area. Also inside the Castle there is/was a new room for special events. 2 dance floors, the big one upstairs and the outside patio dance floor next to the bar. Good times.
OMG that news clip! ASHEN FASHION
I've never heard that term!
Thanks again, Angela, for the great video and your insight on the Goth/Gothic subculture. You've mentioned so many good and relevant points, and I totally agree with you on all of them. I think we are the same age ;) I've been in the scene since mid 90s and I see and feel the change. I also remember that 'magic' feeling when you entered the club in 90s early 00s. I think nowadays people have become very individualistic and selfish in a way, and social media plays a big role in that 'division' issue that you are referring to. But on the other hand, you are using social media to talk about our beautiful scene, educate people and share the love for the music. Thank you for doing that!
Videos like this are so fucking important.
I wish I could dance cuz then I would go to goth nights more...lol and I have so much social anxiety
I don't think it's disappeared completely. I go to an alt club in my area and it's the first club I've ever enjoyed going to. The people are interesting ( a big older crowd as well) and they are friendly and welcoming. The music is amazing. I dance for hours there and I also get that sense of "dread" when the night is coming to an end. Obviously I wasn't there in the 90s to compare, but today's scene feels just as magical to me, even if it's much smaller and harder to find. My love of the music comes from my mom was goth in the 90s in London.
I enjoy hearing about the scene back then as I was too young (born in 87) to have been able to go to anything like that or have access to one when I was old enough due to being in such a rural area in the South.
It was not until last year that I went to my first goth club, and i felt just like that. I walked in and stopped. I thought, I'm with people like me! Everyone was so welcoming and with so much understanding of me being new to embracing who I am. I feel like I found a family. Maybe the magic is not quite dead!
1:50 YEP exactly. All wee talked about during the week was the friday, who's coming, where to meet before, what to wear and getting ready together etc...
There was a very large goth scene in Denver, during the mid to early 00’s, but it slowly fizzled out. I was looking for something new in 97’ since the Alternative/Grunge scene was dead and buried and so were many of it’s singers. I went to my first Goth night at a local club in Boulder called Millennium, behind the Target. I think I wore ripped jeans and a flannel tied around my waist but wasn’t totally shunned due to my waist long dyed black hair. I looked around the packed bar, knew a lot of the 80’s synth pop and liked the other stuff. I was already a fan of industrial. The next day I went to the used clothing store to buy whatever black clothing items I could afford on a retail employee’s budget of 8 bucks an hour, it was 1997. I checked out the much larger scene in Denver at The Snake Pitt and 1082 Broadway. Wow, there was nothing like Sunday night’s at 1082. People were fairly respectful of others and 95% of the crowd in there Sunday finest dark clothing. In time the scene died in Boulder and shifted to many different bars in Denver. The Church was popular which is an actual old Gothic Church converted multi level bar/dance club. Another bar tried to have a goth night 5 times a week and sadly help destroy the diversity of the scene. I eventually walked away from the scene due to it being the shadow of it’s former self and an annoying ex gf. Before I left Boulder and the country in 2019, there was maybe one or two goth nights a month and the occasional concert to dress up for. The last event I attended was Goth Prom in 2018, and joined the ranks of the Elder Goths. I just turned 50 and live in a country that has never heard of a goth, but have an amazing soundtrack on all of my devices. The scene in the 90’s that I experienced could never be replicated and I only wish I had more photos.
Thanks for putting this video up. I've felt this way going out to dance nights in the past few years, which is one of the reasons I moved to NYC 10 years ago - for the better alternative nightlife. Hoping that the magic comes back.
Perfect description of the goth clubs in the 90s...it was mesmerising!
I miss the 90s goth clubs. Ours was on a Sunday night here and i went every Sunday for years. I ended up going back years later and it felt like I never left. I wish they still had that place. Last goth night I went to was a mix between metal and more modern music. I remember the "kinderbats" (that's what we called the young ones) that I was with complained when anything old came on but I was like "finally"
Thank you for this, Angela.
Thank you for being such a positive figment of my youth and happiest memories. I'm glad you enjoyed this. I hope it helps people get out and enjoy themselves.
It is a joy and an honor that I could be a part of your life, even through a song or a passing moment, but especially as a figment of youth and happiest memories. I mean that truly. The work you are doing now is insightful, meaningful, and, most importantly, real. Again, you have my thanks for everything you have done and are doing. I wish you all the best.
I'm so glad I found your channel!
The Bank was my first goth night also, back in July of 1998. I was spending the summer with my 1st love, I was 19 * a grunge girl fresh out of small-town Georgia. The closest thing I'd ever experienced to goth was watching The Craft, lol. My boyfriend's best friend & his ex took me out shopping & I purchased my first spiked collar. I wore my first see-through shirt that night. My life was completely changed after that. The only song I danced to that night was "Intergalactic" by Beastie Boys, lol. And then a Nitzer Ebb, song I think, came on & I was in shock because everyone got on the dance floor, formed a circle & started dancing. But they were all doing the exact same dance. I called it goth line dancing. It was very strange. I've never seen anything like it before or after. LOL
I came into the scene later around 99 but Batcave and ZenWarp and those nights were some of the best times of my life and I judge every club I go to now against those clubs and those DJs
Well stated Indeed. a fine ending to a hard-night's work for me : ) Thank You Angela!
Great memories of the Bank, especially the basement at the Bank. It was there that I discovered great music. I still have the postcard that I had Patrick write songs on. I'm looking at one right now. Kiss the Whip and Sin (dead souls rising, still my favorite goth song!)
It’s weird to hear it called slave collar. I agree with you. I’ve heard someone say I’m not a building, so you should know the difference between goth and gothic. My first response was “Huh?”
You'd attach a leash to the ring. Every now and again you'd see someone being lead with the leash attached.
Lead by a leash huh? Dang, maybe that's what I need to do if I go to a Goth event, bring a leash and find available Goth men wearing collars with an O-Ring to clip it to snag me a Goth man lol
Kidding of course haha.
I took one of my friends on a walk to the library twelve years ago. lol
I picked up some vampire novels too. Cliche, but a lot of fun.
Wow haha
thank you for presenting me eyes of the nightmare jungle !!
Paying it forward
Being around Angela's age. I always thought that goth was the noun form and gothic the adjectival form.
As in 'I am a goth in my gothic dress."? Yeah, I can see that working.
Angela Benedict yea, that's pretty much how I've always used the words
I've definitely done that myself. It's just weird seeing them split into different things. It makes conversing a minor challenge.
Wow. The Castle is my go-to spot. Weird to see it 25 years ago compared to now.
This video was so awesome and interesting again. Angela is my favorite youtuber at this time.
Hailing from Toronto here. I grew up with a bunch of alternative kids around me in the city. Although clubs have closed, I'm seeing a renaissance of the scene here, or perhaps I'm more eager to participate. I think it comes in waves. 5 clubs and shops shut down over 10 years and then slowly a bunch more pop up. Lately I've noticed great events are on the climb with a mix of old and new music (for a while it was just a lot of throwback nights). I'm excited to see new blood in these venues, because even 5 years ago it was a thin crowd.
That said, I know what you mean regarding that sense of awe walking into your first goth night. For me, it was an event called Darkrave that spun goth/industrial/ebm/darkwave/etc. There would be a lineup of kids outside, even in the winter for these events. And my best friend and I would hover downtown after shopping or hanging out until around 9pm when it happened, just to gawk at the outfits until we were old enough to get in. I was lucky.
That mid-2000s rebirth was my highschool experience, but it dies off sometimes and now we're seeing it come back a bit more in Toronto, at least. I think channels like yours are helping with that. So thanks! You've even been a part of my own refreshed enthusiasm for goth events since the way you see the scene is a lot like I see it. It's honestly been so exciting to see more like-minded people talking about the scene. I think you understand it really similarly to the way that I do. 🖤🖤
In my situation I might have to go to a goth club by myself and make goth friends there but it's so nerve racking. I hope to meet people who share my interests or have my friends (who aren't goth) follow me or I'm gonna have to push myself to go on my own, either way I'm reaching a club for sure.
OMG! I used to go to the Castle in Tampa for Goth/Industrial Night in the '90s and I remember them putting it on the news. It was so much fun. I really miss it! BTW, you are so cute! I love bats too. Love your channel. Stay spooky, girl!!!!!! :)
I guess I'll have to start going to goth nights again and straighten shit out. \m/
( LOL at the way your bat moves at 10:56 )
So happy I got to experience the early 90’s in Detroit @ Leland City Club and the late 90’s at The Castle in Tampa. What magical places, times and music. I wouldn’t want to trade it for anything.
That was like a good TED talk. Very well done.
Amen, this is SO spot on! It's just not the same😢
DJ Patrick and Father Jeff have been around since The Bank (and probably before then). They still spin at Necropolis, a goth dance night, every first Saturday in midtown Manhattan! I was born in the 90’s so wasn’t able to experience all the magic, but with what is left, Necropolis seems to still have some of it. 🖤
I just thought of a possible reason why the "magic" may be missing for some. When us oldies were new we had little to go by before attending an event. A flyer, an ad in a zine or local street mag, maybe some positive word of mouth or a community radio ad/music show. So we turn up not knowing what to expect. More hype and optimism than negatives.
Nowadays thanks to the internet, we have videos and images from years worth of events from all over the world, fashion blogs, music playlists and more. So we start to compare things and pick it apart, exposing the flaws and negatives. Little wonder if people have done that, they might attend with a pessimistic attitude before stepping through the door. And that's even if they bother stepping through the door.
Not saying this is your experience but it is worth thinking about. Odd thoughts at 3:30am.
We do have quite a lot of tech these days. Funny you mention flyers...
this video gave me chiiilllsss! you explained everything so well. i would die to be a goth in the 90s :-(
I became a *member* of the Gothic subculture around my early 20's....and now I'm 40 (born 1978) so that make me half of my whole life a Goth!
It all started off when I was on a birthday party and my friend has a catalogue from the shop Large (who still exsist!) and I was flipping trough it...and there it was....beautyfull velvet dresses and skirts and corset tops! And that was the beginning! We had just installed the internet at my parents house, so when I got home I dive in to the World of Goth!
And it felt as if I was finally....HOME....I liked a great deal about the music, the clothing, the aesthetic.... just the whole thing!!
In my browsing I became aware there was a location called the Baroeg in Rotterdam in The Netherlands where they held Goth nights, and because Rotterdam was not to far from the city I lived...I spend a lot of my weekends there and became friends with people I still speak today via Facebook, and with that group we get to other venue's like Gotham in Amsterdam and other cities....I do not remember them where they where held ATM, due to Brain Fog...
But the Baroeg was our *Go To* place, and like you said in your video, Angela, sometimes between 2 Goth songs the DJ played a goofy or a very mainstream song everybody knows and Goth or not...everyone fillled the floor and we danced and have fun!!!
When Goth was a *thing* in the mainstream in the late 90's and begin 2000...and when it wasn't *IN* anymore...it was so sad to see that a lot of Goth Nights became not a weekly or montly thing but there came a rise in HipHop Nights...and then Goth Nights got cancelled...or even more sadly.....venues closed!!!
Only Baroeg is still open so far as I know...but when I look at the Agenda...it is a mix of Death/Terror/Doom Rock etc etc...and only 1 *Goth* thing called Wave Fest once in a while.....
But I live not near The Baroeg anymore so I haven't a clue about what kind of events there are now....
True , Goths have variety taste in music and Goth clothing or mixed it together, is about having fun and being comfortable in your own skin.
thnk u ..... happy new year evey one
This video is everything. Love your channel's content ❤️❤️❤️
Preach!
I love your videos. Keep it up!
I'm always waiting for the next video! Nice video.
7:24 a look into the scene in the 90’s, a cat, AND my fav Bauhaus song (so far)? This is such a treat, I mean that honestly
Ian Ford was/is a fantastic DJ.
He also spun on the main floor of Albion AKA The Bat Cave.
I have to say, you are a joy to listen to..and easy on the eyes. You rep it well , good talk
I'm happy you enjoyed it!
Monday- Control Factory
Tuesday- Hack
Wednesday- Helter Skelter
Thursday- Perversion
Friday- Stigmata / Clockwork Orange / Dark Wave 80s
Saturday- Asylum / Sinomatic
Sunday- Velvet / Bar Sinister
I can definitely see a conga line at a Cruxshadows show. That tracks.
YES! You mentioned The Castle! I go there every Friday and Saturday. I love that place, it feels like home away from home. Free expression without repression... they are just giving that shit away at the door (: Also, I am in love with your aesthetic. Keep on keepin on sista.
this is so true about the magic and feleing like you were visiting worlds back then
I grew up in the 70s, and the 80s, long before these stupid things we all hold in our hands became commonplace! The internet and technology has killed much of the "magic" within the subculture... Thanks to social networking and other interactive sites, you can don your "monster suit" (makeup) in the comfort of your own home, make a video stream about whatever is on your mind, do a few hours on social networking, (maybe) chat with others for awhile, and that's it! You log off, take off the makeup, and you're done for the night... Things were different back in the day because you HAD to "Get up, get ready, get out, and go to" if you wanted to get deep into the scene...There was no other way around it...
I could listen to you talk all day your voice is so inviting
I spent a lot of my weekends at The Bank and The Limelight. I miss my youth!!