2019/2020 LEC were rly competitive cause G2 and FNC were rly pushing each other. These 2 teams were above the rest and constantly challenged each other to be even better. Yes, G2 always came on top, but FNC still put best fights and pushed G2 to improve while now there are no 2nd team, who would as good and could push G2.
also during 2018 2019 LCK was in a mess - meaning they "Only" had to compete vs LPL - still stacked teams putting in the work was insane for the region; they never got back to that - with missmanagement and players chasing the bag
2018-2020 was really special, 3 years in a row where we had 2 teams getting into semis and actually competing with the best of the best. nowadays nobody seems to want to compete anymore.
2019/2020 fnc is the nemesis FNC, ever since nemesis leave FNC, the org become too much drama and lose the sense of wanting to win, While its true nemesis always lose to caps during that time, but nemesis doesnt lose to other team midlaner and they constantly rival each other vs g2 Fnatic fan doesnt want to admit this
Rogue win worlds 2022; like malrang has the perfect style; even if he gets invaded by midnavi who iirc looked bad vs inspired before, he can still come back
Oscar did well over Wunder considering the team environment etc, Alphari and Selfmade weren't looking to play, Nemesis was offered in the LEC this year by at least one team, and Bwipo was offered by at least 2
I mean he does have a point, we went from players like Selfmade, Bwipo, Broxah, Wunder, Perkz, Jankos, Nemesis.. at worlds to players like Nisqy...Chasy, Sheo..Nuc,
Nisqy shouldnt be allowed to play on any International stage in his career. He has shown too many Times Thaz He dosnt deserve it. Just let him be decent in lec and then bench him for msi and Worlds
Western orgs just ran out of money with few exceptions. And since majority of teams are on a budget, most rosters suck, meaning no competition. I'm not sure if franchising is at fault, or western investors just realised they wouldn't be able to get money back.
@@ccc-eb3yk They have a big enough market to support the franchising model, and had a far more developed esports scenewhen franchising was introduced ( which was years after lcs and eu lcs were franchised)
The problem is not about franchising. EU and NA needs to widen the teams playing if they want competitions. Maybe increase it to 15 teams instead of 10.
@@re-crafted2993 lck doesnt have a big enout market bro. teams except for geng g hanhwa and t1 all ran out of money so they dropped their player and replace them with challengers players or more 'cheap' players. and that was not enough for most of them so lck had to introduce salary cap.
@@EmenussGOamazinghonestly speaking, I think the FNC roster was better. Especially since they could swap Bwipo and Soaz as desired depending on the matchup. The problem was NO ONE was beating Theshy and rookie that year, it was solo lane meta and they were the absolute best in the world by that point
People are hard coping thinking that FNC doesnt beat KT. IG was 1 aa away from beating KT 3-0. Just a reminder that that KT was losing to Afreeca in the LCK, and C9 stomped them. Then FNC stomped C9. Hell probably even G2 2018 beats KT man. The beat RNG after all, but people just want to cope for some reason. FNC 2018 was super legit.
@@AtlasAdvice254 You're being biased. Literally not one player on FNC 2018 was better than 2019 G2. Caps 2019 > Caps 2018 as well. You can argue prime Soaz vs Wunder, or prime Hyli vs Miky, etc but their 2019 versions vs 2018 versions(For fnc) were just better straight up. G2 also had much more draft/playstyle flexibility than FNC which was the initial reason Caps left FNC in the first place.
the problem in lec imo is that there is a fucking lot awful players that somehow get there and they just occupy the spot while teams are too scared to look for someone new / don't have money to try out new talents / have really bad scouting
Just look at each league's Mid lane depth. In LCK, they have Chovy, Faker, Showmaker. LPL has knight, scout, rookie, doinb. The only competitive midlaner in LEC is Caps and prime Perkz, the rest are mediocre fools who steals paychecks like Nisqy, Humanoid, Larssen.
@@johnnyairplane2896 HAVE YOU LIKE SEEN VETHEO ??? That guy, has been absolute fucking menace. He looked like staight out of top 1 LPL roaster mid laner in Heretics. Odoamne, Jankos, Vetheo, Patrik and Jacktroll would own JDG with right coaching staff, like VeigarV2 and LS maybe. We have good players that are filled with players like Evi and it makes whole team look bad. Honestly heretics looks like top 2 roaster if Evi is gone, swap bot lane and it's top 1
One thing I notice is that team play doesn’t click as well with western teams as much as eastern teams. Eastern players consistently set their teammates up and juggle aggro in team fights. Western teams should really review these games as they leave them selves susceptible to tps, lane prio leading into rotation and lack of reliable set up within their comps. I don’t think the players are bad it just seems like 5 solo queue players instead of a real team.
“it just seems like 5 solo queue players instead of a real team.” Absolutely spot on. Western culture is all about ego and 1v9 mentality, that’s not gonna end well in a 5v5 game. Meanwhile Asian culture is all about collectivism and teamwork. We’ll never be able to compete.
@@abcdefghilihgfedcba i think here the nepotism comes into play, players are worried about their contract, rather than focused on actually playing the game, also I heard stories where a player can't have input and be critizing teammates because thats not "how u work in a team". Look at Trymbi picking alistar, both Noah and the coach of fnatic said it was bad, so why did they let him pick that? Imagine Noah or the coach having balls and telling trymbi to shu up and pick Blitz or any other support there. Western teams are more worried of politics and friendships while Eastern teams actually try to win the game
That's kinda of what happen to Brazil every year. I'm not trying to draw direct comparisons between Brazil, North America, and Europe, but there’s considerable potential for improvement if teams would cease repeatedly signing underperforming players out of sympathy.
I don't think it's out of sympathy but rather the same corporate low risk decision making that you see in big business. The team/board don't want to risk losing investors money so they prefer to go with a safe bet by picking a player that they know can guarantee a reasonable performance, rather than risking signing an unproven up and coming player who might end up flopping on stage or in big games.
Nepotism is so rampant it’s actually insane, if you have friends in high places in esports they can and will get you a job regardless of qualification. I’m no pro player so I haven’t seen the very top but I have seen the lower level positions in NA teams where people actually don’t do and have no idea how to do their jobs but hey they are friends with the owner or co owner or an investors kid
A lot of bad takes here imo. The league is bad and there's no competition but G2 literally stopping the competition from playing is "just business, they'll do anything to win?" "We just need a roster of good players, nothing else matters" is what NA has been trying for the last like 7 years and look how good they are. Super teams of the best players you can find just brought together haphazardly with bad coaches and management get shit results. On the contrary, the teams that perform best at worlds from NA year after year are the teams of NA talent with good synergy together (historically C9, this year NRG), even if the individual players are not necessarily the best in the league. Looking at KR teams that win worlds, it's the same story a lot of the time. Will anyone really say that Crown was better than Faker in 2016? Was Pyosik the best jungler at worlds last year? The players do have to be some of the best of course but there's so much more to it than that. I can't speak to the points about corruption and nepotism, but just looking at the history of league esports, building super teams is not the answer.
um....bro...your na talent team nrg has a foreign botlane....and c9 never had a succesfull all na team. jensen is not american. in their current roaster they have exactly 1 american player.
They need good players… it’s that simple. Crown was not better than Faker, but he was still solid. Pyosik spiked at the right time and for awhile was one of the best junglers in LCK. Like you need good players, yes mentality is key… but you are not gonna compete with LCK with people like Nuc, because it just doesn’t work, they just aren’t good enough.
@@PeoplePleaser578but there do not exist more than a handful of non asian players that are world class. It's a different mentality about training and grinding. So yes, this is a very bad limited take. Saying "blame all the noncompeting teams" and then say "get better". Bullshit if I ever heard it. Furthermore the stomps LEC endured were 80 percent on shotcalling and team map macro. But Nemesis doesn't understand this, probably why he isn't in LEC anymore.
g2 stopping perkz and rekkles did not make the region worse. if you think 2 players can make 9 teams/45players worse, your mind is absolutely in the gutter. also your point in the end is that "building super teams is not the answer", which contradicts your point about g2 in the first place? we all saw how perkz and vitality performed, so how is it g2's fault again?
@@johnnamkeh1290 Yes if you actually listened to what he said instead of just assuming that he is wrong. He is talking about the fact that there are a number of players that could and have compete with Asian teams and don’t have teams through varying reasons. Same as the whole thing about macro is due to poor management and coaching… rosters poorly put together (Fnatic, Vitality, XL, Heretics, Koi) rosters that had 0 chance of competing (Astralis)… those are a thing. Yes you absolutely can say those 2 things together. Why would you keep Dajor or play with Sertuss… when you know you aren’t competing for a title? No they really weren’t… you did not watch the LEC if you think that is the case - G2 could literally win without ever relying on Macro because they just skill diffed everyone, the ones that could compete skill wise - were so badly organised, badly managed and badly coached that they were in absolute chaos the whole year (Fnatic, Vitality). Like imagine listening to everything he said and assuming he is wrong because you don’t like him. Let’s ignore the fact that Nemesis could have been on Heretics with Bwipo this year… but turned down an offer from them after spring season.
I was watching Fakers stream back in 2022, and he mentioned something about how he thinks the EU has drastically underperforming lately in the major stages because he thinks G2 is well coached and prepared team, therefore they do not have any other team with proper competition, scrim, improve, individually and as a team, meantime they in Korea , each year have at least 4 teams he finds himself and t1 learning, pushing each other to be better. so I think until eu won't have at least 2-3 decent teams , as faker said, we kinda are su*king at the major stage for the time being, hopefully, that changes one day. Hopefully, eu teams (managers) stop milking sponsors cash, and doing nonsense with teams and rather focus on creating a competitive roster with the best eu players and treating them properly.
Teams are bleeding money, popular players are stealing paychecks. The most competetive non-g2 rosters in last years have been helped by new players emerging into the scene. I don't want to see another overpricing perkz and going 10th. We're not gonna get better in just one year. This has to be a long process. The truth probably is that 2019 was a fluke, the gap now is as big as it ever was and 2018-2019 was just a once time event. We should just get used to how it currently is
EU was competitive. Then G2 sent perkz to NA and rekkles to ERL. It being a "business move" doesn't mean it didn't fuck the entire region. G2 made the region worse. You can't now complain that you have no competition and no way of getting better when you ensured that. That's what happens when your business moves are only short term good. Same can be said about the scumbag in rogue who fucked over odo and MAD blocking elyoya from going to fnc. We are actively making "business decisions" which make the region weaker and then the orgs are surprised that EU gets fucked at worlds. Enjoy not getting revenue and making much less money because of your smart decisions.
Your comment assumes a vacuum. The person who maye these calls for G2 isnt actively involved in the business anymore. Others have to figure out ways on how to deal with that fallout. Carlos wouldnt have cared or found different ways.
In individual esports it’s not bogged down by this shit so the best players get the best results plain and simple, as long as they can travel to the event. Lots of regions have representation ie in fighting games. Something like Pakistan in Tekken or Mexico in King of Fighters will never ever happen with how the league esports environment is set up
Well it's harder for the lower teams to compete cause big money orgs acquire the big name players. G2, Fnatic, Vitality have deep pockets so they can collect the big names in the league more easily than others. Like try convincing Caps to play for a team like Astralis. When even your big market teams start performing badly, then your league is in trouble.
@@Avvura how does that prove that it's not a money thing? When players win titles they have the bargaining power to demand for a higher salary. The team on the other hand doesnt magically get the money to pay all 5 players a higher salary someone will have to go unless there are players who dont mind not having a salary increase after winning a title
It was spoiled by the franchise system, which completely stopped the progress of all teams, they are not looking for newcomers, either old players or foreign players play from year to year, before each team had a certain fear that they will be replaced by other teams from the Challenger League, but now even the last team will be in the plus thanks to advertising and so on, and the LEС is stagnating
diamond is 100% right and also has the right to speak about this,when he was playing m5 and clg eu were able to compete with asian teams,when m5 went to worlds they were the favorites,during his time there were fanatic,gambit,clg eu,maybe sk,but you got 4 teams you thing were able to make it out of groups,now you look at 1 team who can make it out of groups 1 shacky team,and the rest are play in material,when you watch LEC and then watch lck/lpl you see a clear difference in quality ...EU is going the NA way without the imports,but then again,EU is dealing with different problems now which arent esport related and you should feel it,not only in esport but in different sports like football and science aswell
I'm not a pro, but from my point of view of the WORLD and how different countries population and cultures are. EUW and NA are too unambitious + they don't have the same drive and endgoal that Koreans and Chinese do about the game. It's like Nemesis said IF IT IS TRUE. If they're at home collecting paychecks now and not pushing to win next worlds right now, improving their talent, getting new AMBITIOUS players etc etc what's the point? Nowadays people at worlds just go "oh hope we get an easy team so we can MAYBE survive one more swiss stage matchup, or MAYBE we're lucky and win against this and that so we at least get this far. What kind of shitty mentality is that, idk if that's just the casters but it feels like that mentality is reflected in SOME of the players. Not to mention if teams are not pulling their competitive weight to a region, they will also dull the other teams, dragging themselves and everyone else down by not trying to be competitive with each other. This is why people who retire to NA from KR or EUW seem to perform worse. Even Faker would go dull if the competition is too far below his level. It's a lot like Riots matchmaking in ranked, if you get constantly locked with players who run it down, scream ff15 and int, your own play will get worse over time, in any elo.
Truth. At the end of the day it’s a culture problem, Asian culture is just so much better suited for League than western culture. We will never be able to compete.
It's a problem that won't be fixed in a year, our players as a whole are getting gapped basically everywhere. Of the 4 games in which an LEC team beat a western team 3 were against a 4th seed and 3 needed some magic or major ints from the other team to win. Overall level of LEC strength has been deteriorating for years to what we see now. If this is to be fixed it needs to be a long term goal. 2025 I expect will look very similar to this year.
I mean vitalitys only investment Was perkz and upset. Kaiser was washed even before, bo is coinflip with a champ Pool of sejuani/maokai and on top they got the worst kr academy top they could get.
Do you think how much money Vitality spent on Bo ? This guy dont play pro league for 2 years and no team in LPL need him. Photon is LCKCL player i dont think he get that much either. I think Vitality only spent big on Perkz and he is overrate as fk , anyone know that instead of get high potential midlane they choose overdate franchise player .
i played on amateur teams (1st division) for 5 years and nemesis is spot on with management being incompetent. 4 out of 5 teams have been absolute dogtrash
Hard to believe coming from “swaggingswagster”. The problem with League players is that they play soloq 24/7 thinking they’re the main character and need to 1v9 every game and they’re always right, then you get to comp play and suddenly it’s a 5v5 environment where they’re all dogshit because they’re not used to playing the actual game with teammates. Asian culture on the other hand is all about teamwork so they understand how the game is supposed to be played as a 5v5, the west will never catch up.
Havent watched Nemi talk much ever since he left LEC and now seeing him talk like this, I say he matured so much and I hope an LEC team picks him up soon. If only there was a team besides G2 that has the balls and the capability to built a roster with him in it. I can only hope.
@@spicesmuggler2452maybe there's a problem that teams can't monetize players? Like pay them well and enable them to get money by streaming and ads? Like T1 and many others are doing?
@@ImaskarDono You have a valid point but you have to understand that Korean orgs underpay their players compared to LPL, LEC and LCS since forever. That is also the reason why you see so many Korean pros playing abroad, they get payed better for lesser competitiveness.
@@ImaskarDono To respond to your main point; You cant make Nemesis play in a pro enviroment if he does not want to do so. Its his own decision. And as much as twitch chat wants him to do it, he just fakes it all and will never return playing pro again. He can make money for his next 3 families streaming on Twitch, why would he want to compete and lose years of his life stressing and hoping then get matchmade with some third class support or jungle? He is smart and made the right decision but to dangle it in front of his audience is a bit low if it happened (he will never play pro ever again).
There is simply not enough talent in EU. C-tier imports like JeongHoon, Malrang, Photon, Chasy, Noah are top 5 in their positions in LEC. None of them would have even 1% chance of winning LCK. The fact there are 50-60% of players in LEC who are MUCH worse than them shows how fucking bad the situation is.
This is what it all comes down to. The old guard that propped up the league, especially in 2018-2019 are retiring or degrading and there are almost no new rookies replacing them that could ever dream of matching them at their prime. I can’t even imagine what the LEC will look like when players like Caps and Mikyx retire.
Most of the games in season by LPL & LCK is B03, in EU AND NA both region played B01 and in playoffs they play B03 i think this is a helpful if LEC, LCS played B03 in seasons not just in playoffs to practice them in international competition and LPL have 20 Teams in 2022 DOINB played 5 games of B05 and still he did not make to worlds in 2022 or 2021 i think. the point is MORE GAMES! and at least 3 international event to expose the current meta to each other cuz the Worlds is boring its always same region pft
Completely agree. Not only for the players but the coaches too. When you have more BO3 or BO5 games you get more drafting experiences and how to work your way out of a pinch. This competitive scene is over a decade long and I have NEVER understood how every region can have different formats of game numbers and compete evenly on an international stage.
True, Eu Na is just a waste of worlds spot. Like how stupid is this two region sends 7 team :D Just give them a 3 spot total they are just ruining the tournament, I prefer Tes edg and Hle over any western team
@@armi5219i'm not following lck/lpl (until now i'm going to do way more^^), but i'm pretty sure seeds 5-8th of both divisions tend to be way more dangerous and consistant than any of Western teams earning false bunch of seeds, except for G2. As G2 fan really disappointed but lucid, take my Samurais on lck/lpl league for 4 years from now, we will construct war machine
I always used to think EU coaches etc. were total frauds and I'm glad time's proved me right. Personally stopped being too invested into the LEC and League as a whole when I realized we'll never win until we have players who can match their eastern counterparts in terms of handskill (=never).
Dude has a point that LEC is corrupted and beside G2 other teams dont try to win that hard but theres no excuse to G2 going 0-2 vs NRG. They played like shit that day and it cost them not leaving swiss stage. It was actually skill issue.
the team managers, coaches, etc., don't understand what it takes to win at the game & they're leading players astray. the community shits on players who "underperform" but a massive part of it is mismanagement. tons of actually good players being completely lead astray by people who have no business coaching or managing anything.
I've been following LoL since Season 2 with Gambit and CJ Entus Frost. 10 years later and EU&NA are still at the same level against the LPL and LCK. Western teams are still at rock bottom. The biggest LoL change is now you don't need as much skill since there are new champions who just dominate, no matter if skill or not. EU>NA or NA>EU is the same, both are bad. I would change EU and NA to a wildcard region, they don't bring anything to the table. Nothing. I am just a spectator, so who cares.
Just look at each league's Mid lane depth. In LCK, they have Chovy, Faker, Showmaker. LPL has knight, scout, rookie, doinb. The only competitive midlaner in LEC is Caps and prime Perkz, the rest are mediocre fools who steals paychecks like Nisqy, Humanoid, Larssen.
always has been. NA knows their region is shit, OCE is just OCE, only region that has been coping for the past 7 years is EU. NA > EU or EU > NA, doesn't matter, we will always still lose to KR/CN superteams every worlds like it has been for the past 10 years and it will always be that way.
@@thymn4384 bro league was created in the west and it's been around for over a decade. if western players were ever going to be anywhere near the same level as the east it would have happened by now. eastern culture simply cultivates more potent talent than the west.
I mean the game is also "dying" in the West. Not many New players, 90% of playerbase are casuals and the esport ecospace is so closed, that its way too Hard to get into lec for most ppl. Back in the day you would get in, if you where challenger, now you get gated by regional leagues where you dont even get much Money. So why drop out of school, for like 2,5k a month and you dont even know how long to you get to play there. I also think competetive games are kinda slowing down and esport in general aint in a good state rn
Asking people to blame players who didnt make worlds and are now sitting out the rest of their contract while there is no games being played sound really fucking petty. Every single LEC pro wants to go to Worlds and will try his best to get there during regular season. Yes its an issue for EU that they are far from being as internationally competetive as they were back in 2018-2020. But maybe it was also an absolute High point of EU talent. Two EU teams with fnatic and G2 with really great super talented rosters all in the prime of their carreers was something that is hard to achieve again. Caps for example was crazy during that time for both teams and was the closest a western player ever got to being the best in the world. Jankos, Wunder Bwipo, Perkz etc. all had their primes in those years. Europes Golden generation came short of winning worlds and now its hard to see how we can ever get to those high again.
Dudes was a pro player and multi seasonal challenger on different servers. Plus rank 1 on EUW. I ain’t saying he’s always right but he kinda knows his shit
@@Intoxicated4768Remember when he said Doinb is one of the weakest mids of the tournament and then got hard gapped by Doinb? The Doinb that then reshaped the League meta and macro on his own to win worlds. By Leadership.
EU thinking all the excuses as possible. Its not about the corruption, its about the degrade of getting new talents. Those owners or management of respective teams are just simply bad at scouting nothing more nothing less.
Honest question.. why wont LEC hold their playoffs in Korea xD.. it would actually give them a chance scrimming against korean teams (like 3rd to 8th) and play korean soloq? Because I actually think the gap is so high, because G2 has no chance to practise in EU.. the teams are just not good enough. So when they face asian teams they get compeletely stomped.
G2 may be the best performing team in LEC history, but it is also the most corrupt. Imagine playing politics with the roster and management just because you don't like how popular the other player is.
i didnt get hype about Hans Sama. He had really bad year in NA and it all seemed to me like he cant play under the pressure. Mikyx transformation from very mid support in excel to S tier LEC support is also hilarious to me. And btw i think that back then Advienne played better than Mikyx in Excel jersey.
Did you read what i said? I was talking about time when Mikyx played in Excel. He definitely didn't upgrade their roster back then. Iam not saying that Advienne is good or bad, i just said that he played better league than him when they were in Excel.
@@PeoplePleaser578Who are those exactly? Perkz, Gilius, Jizuu, Finn are free agents. Jack, Jankos are on a team. Dom is a streamer by his choice and Yamato is a LFO coach (also working for KC and G2 content creator). Most of the sack aren’t pros because they have no other choice. They legit dont get picked up. Imagine noone picking gilius up
@@anonymouswarlord102 Perkz is good and was one of the best performing mids in EU. Jackspectra, mechanically is very good his issues were with his nerves and he struggled to mesh with his team… to claim players like Perkz are bad is hilarious
LEC and LCS has talents, but much of the teams didn't have any balls to support and bring it up instead constantly staying with overpaid players with little impact and bringing past prime imports. And the fact eco-system is not good either (EMEA masters was being too popular that much of young talents doesn't want to go LEC and LCS... well u know what happen to their second tier leagu)
problems : . Closed league, meaning companies have no reason to perform since most of their revenue is coming from league sponsors . Too small cash prizes compared to sponsors, leaving no reason to perform again . lack of league passion of some teams in LEC (a good illustration is some teams choosing a player that has been performing average/low in lec for 5 years in a row, therefore has no hope to do very good this year. But at least they are sure he is not expensive and won't be horrible). . lack of knowledge by some coaching staffs, some choices of roster are completly shit (for example vitality promoting daglas). . unconfirmed coaching staffs in LEC. FNC's draft was also horrible yesterday. . No ability for teams except top 3/4 to align a good roster, despite having like 6-7 good players by role in EU.
we could have 7-8 very good teams contesting playoffs for example : current G2 roster current FNC then make 5-6 good teams, with equilibrium of strong and weak side players with : top : adam photon chasy wunder odo cabochard jgl : yoya jankos inspired bo selfmade markoon mid : lider nisqy nemesis perkz larssen vetheo adc : caliste upset carzzy crownie comp jezu supp : hyli labrov jeonghoon targamas doss limit Then full some bottom lec teams, but with an actual chance of being good with high ceiling potential players : top : venour destroy jgl : sheo cinkrof peach mid : sertuss toucouille abedagge (would have not included him but his last split is good, and his peak in S04 was also good) adc : patrik kaori flakked jackspectra unforgiven kobbe supp : idk supp is very bad in EU But we are most likely gonna end with 3/4 good rosters, like this year because teams coaching staff are horrible
The problem is .. the players aren't really well verse on certain champions .. also, once an EU team win game 1, they tend to autism draft game 2 and when they lose they crumble.. the game is simple, you get 1 scaling meta adc, CC oriented support, utility DPS mid and tank/utility jungle.. top can be what compliments the comp.. Neeko is really good but so is Orianna/Sylas, for JG JARVAN, Seju, Maokai, then Rell / Renata / Rakan for support ..
It is really not that easy.. If it was that easy we wouldve had an western team win worlds.. But its actually hard to outdraft or get a good draft against asian team.
Your take is bad, EU teams go even on micro plays against asian teams a lot of the time. Just look at all EU games they start losing after 20 min. Bad plays, terrible calls, weird decisions and baron flips. Has nothing to do with champ knowledge and everything with macro knowledge. Also drafting really isnt that easy because your prio changes depending on your opponent.
G2 literally consciously trying to make their opponents weaker during offseasons. of course they are part of the problem... I don't think he should blame some teams more than others
This is absolutely true. Look at DRX and Weibo both 4th seed teams in difficult regions. There is such a small gap in skill between teams 1-10 in those regions. Honestly if G2 was in those regions they wouldn't even make worlds.
Not really a hot take imo, since FNC trip to the finals in 2018, EU has only had 1 team that can do anything at all, and that is obv G2, and when they are bad we have to send teams like Mad and Rogue to Worlds which are so poor it actually hurts sometimes. Mad took advantage of G2 playing poorly in LEC but never had a chance at Worlds, when they were considered top5 team by LEC casters, I honestly thought they were joking, finding out they were serious made me question the game iq of LEC casters, yes you do have to hype up your regions teams, but going into Worlds 2020 or 2021 (not 100% sure which of these 2 years it was they called Mad top5) thinking Mad is top 5, when there are 8 teams from LPL and LCK is a disgrace to your int egrity as a caster and expert-
I love people of Twitch chat and reddit: but G2 is ok org now because Carlos is not there anymore - like do you have a memory of a goldfish? Literally not even a year ago G2 fucked over Jankos and because of that he had to play for Heretics...
its not just business, they have literally ruined/weakened their region by fucking over good players. They were greedy for short term results so they killed their competition by sending them elsewhere lol. And now the consequences of that are showing
people mention 18 and 19 FNC and G2 - sure that looked the best on paper cause "somehow" they made finals but Id argue S5 6 are better examples, cause they actually made it into semis with mostly good play, having teamwork etc. not really needing cheese. Still the orgs are just doomed, and as such the wrong players work together and the staff is also a mess... EU just has better players and had better base structure before it got fcked - so they at least beat NA till this year... now we have to see, inting orgs and less money - lets see lets see
100% agree LEC ruin started at the peak but at that time we wouldn’t have never noticed. Nepotism killed the league and the new format ? The new format is not a positive change for teams and players but i guess it’s better for viewers (?) . 60% of lec players should lose their job or go in minor EUM regions and get replaced by new talent . 2 seasons and u have 2 top tier rosters
What you guys fail to understand is that this is a business. Organizations have to be interested in making money and saving money rather than being competitive. Paying shitloads of money for players that might improve your team isnt always the most financially reasonable decision. Solid finances = long term stability.
There are only 5 good players in Europe? Selfmade in shit? 113 is better no? Let's go to the mid lane we have player like nemesiss, jizuke, fking magifelix (18 year 4 acc in top 10 challenger eu in different role) No team has invested in psychologists and everything to follow him and make him grow and solve his communication problems and anxieties. He have potentional for come better the caps. But hey lider is better no? We have yamato on stream and have hiarnam to assistant coach, but the problem is for sure the g2 roster, wunder out for oscarin bc the fnc cant do a good roster. And I only mentioned players under 23 years old, and for 3 years these players have done nothing (they were 20 years old very young), it continues to convince you that g2 is to blame
The fact that some best EU player not in the best team is funny, n some best player not even in a team... Also the EU team i know is really good as 5 man team, doing insane team fight eventho they getting gapped at lane... But now? getting gapped at lane n still get rolled at teamfight... More like Duo Rank, jg+mid/top & adc+sp... But hey Nemesis doing pretty good as a streamer, good for him, n i dont think he is gonna back to competitive...
@@ThomasMueller999 Apparently the guy is not only awful to work with, he has his ego not in check. G2 lost to NRG, a team that is in a "worse" region that has a "worse" SoloQ experience, but has a giant coaching staff and a great support system for the players, which the base of a good team. According to him, Palafox and Dockla, were just that great all along, even when they have said in the interviews numerous times that the coaching staff is the real highlight of all of his. For me the guy is just copping that is not his fault that he is not in any team, and he is relegated to just grind SoloQ while "less than him" players get to compete.
Franchising is just an american sport shit system. Do it like counter-strike where a soloq stack team has a chance to compete at the highest level if they are good enough. A league with no relegation is stupid and teams lower tier teams have no reason to even try to improve. In counter-strike we constantly see new teams and new players reach the top stage because it is actually competetive and all players have a chance to reach it if they are good enough. LEC has 10 teams with 5 players each meaning 50 players. Getting the chance as a rookie is so small. Fuck franchising, it is just anti-competition. Underperforming teams need to fear for relegation, underperforming players must fear for being dropped and new players must have an easier way to reach the top. My recomendation would to make 2 main leagues, LEC and LEC2, the bottom 2 (10th and 9th) teams in LEC is replaced by the top 2 teams in LEC2, the 8th placed team in LEC has to play a bo5 against the 3rd place team in LEC2 and the winner gets the LEC spot. The bottom 3 teams in LEC2 are kicked out and the now remaining 3 spots in LEC2 is rewarded through an open qualifiers system similar to counter-strike where practically anyone good enough has a chance. This system would make it way more competetive, underperforming teams must fight for survival. It also gives new players a chance to be recognised.
Checked it up, No wonder its all been downhill since then, litteraly EUs last good worlds performance was right during the switch xD. Franchising can eat ass.@@MylesTheDoctorMahajan
I'm not sure why you act like they don't when we literally have multiple teams that's built around a single player and multiple roster changes due to players wanting changes. Jankos literally got kicked from G2 because of disagreements with Caps.
Football players dont practice 24 hours a day. But they train specific things. Like defens, shoting, dribling, Longball. Analising Old games with VR, so they can Watch what they did wrong in the situation. And also ligting and traning. I pretty sure if you only scrim as a team you will never get better. Cause if you only scrim you are coasting on your excisting knowledge about the game.
"Just business" is disgusting to say when we are speaking of elevating the region. No hate to nemesis in particular, but that expression has no place in a healthy environment. Same thing with other sports, where breaking a leg is preferable to a player outplaying you. Disgusting really, when "business" makes the decisions those who pay are the players/athletes and the fans.
ye its turbo sad bcs NRG played like turbo shit with their lucky draw and against MAD they looks like some challanger team with their turbo shitty macro thats why everyone is mad xD
Well KOI kicked Odoamne (top3 toplaner) and Trimby right after their success to become a mediocre sht team. MAD got Nisqy who was decent before but got gapped in NA and a garbage import top/most unstable bot ever. Vitality to be honest tried, but got unlucky with BO probably fixing games and team not working. TH got fking Evi for top a mediocre mid and bot untill the end when the ygot it together too late. XL somehow managed to look good considering how bad everyone else is, and probably because Odoamne is actually good. And G2 is unable to clean up their play after months of "practicing", who the fk knows what theyve been doing with their time. Not to mention the dumb points system with 3 splits that makkes sure the last tournament doesn't even have the most recent strongest 4 teams in it. IS IT REALLY THAT SURPRISING THAT WE SUCK?
I see a lot of ppl saying the good players just stream and the bad get signed To be frank why should ppl like nemesis sign for a shit team whrn he can stay streaming earning similar caoin but with much less stressing?
LEC is the worst major region now. All those cocky players - like Humanoid trash talking NA on stage - got their lesson. Overconfident, underperforming, zero initiative and game plan. Know your place. I’m from EU btw
we kick 2 NA teams OUT dont act like NA is any better than EU xDD. what happend vs NRG is biggest mistery ever bcs after their game against MAD i thougt this is worst NA 1st seed ever
@@radmiral9048 we kick 2 NA teams that’s fact but NRG best NA team kicked G2 best EU team that’s also fact. I’m from EU I’m big FNC fan but this year I feel totally disappointed.
Just stop the damn G2 copium bruh, they havent had a single game win that wasnt thrown by their opponents (sure props to punishing their mistakes, but its not how you want to win). Even fucking FNC managed to win games on their own terms. G2 is similar as the rest of EU just not good enough to compete, they've been scrimming top asian teams for weeks now and even bragged about their good winrate yet when it matters they all shat themselves. NRG beat them 2-0 while they are in an even worse performing league regionally and internationally.
NRG also only won games that were thrown by G2 though. Do you think for a second that G2 performing at their absolute best ever lose to NRG? They just looked like they were a clash team, idk the reason for that, but they weren't playing anywhere near the top of their game.
@@darkdemon9013 thats what I mean, like they play really well and win a lot of scrims cus of it but when it actually matters at worlds they just choke. You cant just say "oh the lack of competition in EU made them unable to compete" while they legit beat these teams in scrims. They get a 2-0 start because of 2 throws from the opponents which then I guess gave them to much false confidence, they didnt learn from their mistakes and their opponents abused them. G2 got gifted a free quarter finals and they shat themselves, which actually makes me glad they didnt get it in round 5 either.
No competition and G2 still lost to MAD in spring and almost lost to XL in summer, what a bs.. just excuses. Problem is lack of games on stage, in LEC should be more Bo3 and Bo5s
Whaaaaaat ? Corruption in lol pro playyyy ? This has been the case since closed leagues lmao. People who are surprised by this need to ask themselves how tf they didnt see it for over 10 years.
i will tell you why lec losses to the east, the answer is quite simple. there are around 8 months of domestic leagues a year. lec teams scrim 5 games/day 3 days a week. lck and lpl teams play 9 games a day in scrims, 7 days a week on odd weeks, and 6 days a week in even weeks. 8 months =32 weeks, 16x3+16x4=112 days. this is how much more eastern teams play(ignoring that they play more games on a day). "work smarter not harder) is a true concept, but not like this.
public and org should just stop making change every year, like G2 did good not making change imo, and a team I thought could be trouble if they keep their roster was BDS, like they aren't shiny but if they did stick together they would improve, I guess worlds were too much for them teams wise....
Look at g2 and bb they bought him hyped him like crazy made a lot of money off him naming him too father. And he goes to words and get gapped evry game.its sad to watch rly. Dunno like europe have good players but guys playing in lec are mostly shit. Like g2 2k19 showed europe can compete. But let me tell you who will make more money for g2 talented good top player or some bb that ppl know is streming and brings fans to g2? U anserw that and u will know why we losingm
I'm so tried of this argument of saying its all the teams below when the teams at the top dont try and improve their own region and will only say its the ones below them that cause it
If somehow BLG wins worlds G2 fans copium can say wait G2 actually lost to number 1. the swiss was actually the final boss. Same thing happened with Sunning, DK, FPX G2 biggest loses was vs 1st or 2nd best teams..
this is one of the hardest copes in gaming. teams shouldnt get better by seeing what works against competition. And even then g2 almost lost to Koi in elimination. if the competition is weak how come g2 are still scraping through stage games in LEC?
If you keep saying that the problems in EU is the players, you havent's understood a thing since 2021. And next years is going to be the same thing or even worse
the reason g2 is not that good internationally is because nobody is challenging them literally. they have no competition on their own region. every other team is so fucking shit g2 can int and still win every game cuz theyre just still better. every other team is mismanaged to the point where they dont just work.
Western teams are so bad because soloq ladders are fucking horrible, wintrades in masters+ are ruining the integrity of the game, zero point in grinding when you play against scripters/wintraders/boosted/bought accs literally 80% of your games, riot has completely neglected the high elo community for years and atp its too far gone to recover even IF they did give a fuck, which they dont. so you have soon-to-be pros playing against boosted/bought acc 58% wr GM's who are actually d2 and stomping them and then they get picked up by a team and play against other LCS players who are also mid and don't perform as well against boosted accs (obv) and then it turns out they arent as good as they seemed in soloq but they're on contract with their team for 2 years so the org cant just kick them out, which is also why western teams are always completely different after a couple of years because the org knows this player is shit compared to other regions but they're stuck with them until contract runs out or they do kick the player and then have to pay a shit load of money for breaking contract. the reason KR/CN do so well is because they have very strict rules, KR needing KR SSN to play so boosting/bought accs are pretty rare and CN has the super server which creates a very competitive environment, their soloq ladders are as pure as you can get compared to NA/EU. what i would personally do to try and help cleanse the western soloq ladders is bring back placements for d4-masters, put an MMR cap or reduce the LP gains on fresh 30s so you dont have d4 andys hitting masters 200 lp by coinflipping because of +30/-15 lp, add vanguard to league to get rid of all the fucking donkey brained lvl 32 acc scripters, and finally, hire actual high elo players to determine if someone is wintrading which you dont even really need a high elo player, even a bronze could tell some of these people are wintrading.
Ah yes, lec is corrupt because I can't play in a top team and my ego won't let me go to a bottom team like Crownie and build back up lmao people like you will never be winners
2019/2020 LEC were rly competitive cause G2 and FNC were rly pushing each other. These 2 teams were above the rest and constantly challenged each other to be even better. Yes, G2 always came on top, but FNC still put best fights and pushed G2 to improve while now there are no 2nd team, who would as good and could push G2.
Also LCK still was catching up to rune reforged meta. 2019 LEC was giga overrated.
also during 2018 2019 LCK was in a mess - meaning they "Only" had to compete vs LPL - still stacked teams putting in the work was insane for the region; they never got back to that - with missmanagement and players chasing the bag
2018-2020 was really special, 3 years in a row where we had 2 teams getting into semis and actually competing with the best of the best. nowadays nobody seems to want to compete anymore.
2019/2020 fnc is the nemesis FNC, ever since nemesis leave FNC, the org become too much drama and lose the sense of wanting to win,
While its true nemesis always lose to caps during that time, but nemesis doesnt lose to other team midlaner and they constantly rival each other vs g2
Fnatic fan doesnt want to admit this
Rogue win worlds 2022; like malrang has the perfect style; even if he gets invaded by midnavi who iirc looked bad vs inspired before, he can still come back
People like Wunder, Nemesis, Selfmade, Alphari, Bwipo dont have a job, that just shows u that teams in LEC dont care about being competitive
Oscar did well over Wunder considering the team environment etc, Alphari and Selfmade weren't looking to play, Nemesis was offered in the LEC this year by at least one team, and Bwipo was offered by at least 2
Tbf Oscar has good potential
wunder and bwipo ok but the rest doesnt deserve to ever have played competitively maybe alphari was good 20 years ago
Wunder Bwipo yeah, the rest are bad players, cmon now
@@renji6461how are nemesis and selfmade bad exactly? I can certainly see them outperforming the bottom half of current lec teams.
I mean he does have a point, we went from players like Selfmade, Bwipo, Broxah, Wunder, Perkz, Jankos, Nemesis.. at worlds to players like Nisqy...Chasy, Sheo..Nuc,
Nisqy has been a high level player for years shut the fuck up loser. jesus christ. does it pay to be a cunt or is it just a hobby of yours?
true
Tbf Sheo was a rookie and did better then all the existing jglrs except the top teams
Nisqy shouldnt be allowed to play on any International stage in his career. He has shown too many Times Thaz He dosnt deserve it. Just let him be decent in lec and then bench him for msi and Worlds
Did you really Name Broxah a good player?
Franchising went great riot keep it up
Western orgs just ran out of money with few exceptions. And since majority of teams are on a budget, most rosters suck, meaning no competition. I'm not sure if franchising is at fault, or western investors just realised they wouldn't be able to get money back.
irrelevant topic. lck/lpl teams are all Franchised
@@ccc-eb3yk They have a big enough market to support the franchising model, and had a far more developed esports scenewhen franchising was introduced ( which was years after lcs and eu lcs were franchised)
The problem is not about franchising. EU and NA needs to widen the teams playing if they want competitions.
Maybe increase it to 15 teams instead of 10.
@@re-crafted2993 lck doesnt have a big enout market bro. teams except for geng g hanhwa and t1 all ran out of money so they dropped their player and replace them with challengers players or more 'cheap' players. and that was not enough for most of them so lck had to introduce salary cap.
I just hate people calling 2018 FNC lucky, they beat IG in groups , EDG in quarters and stomped C9 that beat Afreeca
One of the best rosters ever overshadowed by the hype machine of g2
@@EmenussGOamazinghonestly speaking, I think the FNC roster was better. Especially since they could swap Bwipo and Soaz as desired depending on the matchup. The problem was NO ONE was beating Theshy and rookie that year, it was solo lane meta and they were the absolute best in the world by that point
People are hard coping thinking that FNC doesnt beat KT.
IG was 1 aa away from beating KT 3-0.
Just a reminder that that KT was losing to Afreeca in the LCK, and C9 stomped them. Then FNC stomped C9. Hell probably even G2 2018 beats KT man. The beat RNG after all, but people just want to cope for some reason. FNC 2018 was super legit.
@@AtlasAdvice254 You're being biased. Literally not one player on FNC 2018 was better than 2019 G2. Caps 2019 > Caps 2018 as well. You can argue prime Soaz vs Wunder, or prime Hyli vs Miky, etc but their 2019 versions vs 2018 versions(For fnc) were just better straight up. G2 also had much more draft/playstyle flexibility than FNC which was the initial reason Caps left FNC in the first place.
Rookie and TheShy weren't at that MSI 2018, if Fnatic was better than G2, why didn't they win MSI? Tell me @@AtlasAdvice254
the problem in lec imo is that there is a fucking lot awful players that somehow get there and they just occupy the spot while teams are too scared to look for someone new / don't have money to try out new talents / have really bad scouting
+1
G2 worked hard and lost
@@dragonplayz6606You can't win with Broken Brain.
Just look at each league's Mid lane depth. In LCK, they have Chovy, Faker, Showmaker. LPL has knight, scout, rookie, doinb. The only competitive midlaner in LEC is Caps and prime Perkz, the rest are mediocre fools who steals paychecks like Nisqy, Humanoid, Larssen.
@@johnnyairplane2896 HAVE YOU LIKE SEEN VETHEO ??? That guy, has been absolute fucking menace. He looked like staight out of top 1 LPL roaster mid laner in Heretics.
Odoamne, Jankos, Vetheo, Patrik and Jacktroll would own JDG with right coaching staff, like VeigarV2 and LS maybe. We have good players that are filled with players like Evi and it makes whole team look bad. Honestly heretics looks like top 2 roaster if Evi is gone, swap bot lane and it's top 1
One thing I notice is that team play doesn’t click as well with western teams as much as eastern teams. Eastern players consistently set their teammates up and juggle aggro in team fights. Western teams should really review these games as they leave them selves susceptible to tps, lane prio leading into rotation and lack of reliable set up within their comps. I don’t think the players are bad it just seems like 5 solo queue players instead of a real team.
“it just seems like 5 solo queue players instead of a real team.” Absolutely spot on. Western culture is all about ego and 1v9 mentality, that’s not gonna end well in a 5v5 game. Meanwhile Asian culture is all about collectivism and teamwork. We’ll never be able to compete.
@@abcdefghilihgfedcba i think here the nepotism comes into play, players are worried about their contract, rather than focused on actually playing the game, also I heard stories where a player can't have input and be critizing teammates because thats not "how u work in a team". Look at Trymbi picking alistar, both Noah and the coach of fnatic said it was bad, so why did they let him pick that? Imagine Noah or the coach having balls and telling trymbi to shu up and pick Blitz or any other support there.
Western teams are more worried of politics and friendships while Eastern teams actually try to win the game
"comfort breeds weakness" -knife cat
That's kinda of what happen to Brazil every year. I'm not trying to draw direct comparisons between Brazil, North America, and Europe, but there’s considerable potential for improvement if teams would cease repeatedly signing underperforming players out of sympathy.
I don't think it's out of sympathy but rather the same corporate low risk decision making that you see in big business. The team/board don't want to risk losing investors money so they prefer to go with a safe bet by picking a player that they know can guarantee a reasonable performance, rather than risking signing an unproven up and coming player who might end up flopping on stage or in big games.
Nepotism is so rampant it’s actually insane, if you have friends in high places in esports they can and will get you a job regardless of qualification. I’m no pro player so I haven’t seen the very top but I have seen the lower level positions in NA teams where people actually don’t do and have no idea how to do their jobs but hey they are friends with the owner or co owner or an investors kid
Diamondprox speaking Facts
НАШ СЛОНЯРА
Similar problem was with LCL when it still existed. In its late years it was a pain to watch.
A lot of bad takes here imo. The league is bad and there's no competition but G2 literally stopping the competition from playing is "just business, they'll do anything to win?" "We just need a roster of good players, nothing else matters" is what NA has been trying for the last like 7 years and look how good they are. Super teams of the best players you can find just brought together haphazardly with bad coaches and management get shit results. On the contrary, the teams that perform best at worlds from NA year after year are the teams of NA talent with good synergy together (historically C9, this year NRG), even if the individual players are not necessarily the best in the league. Looking at KR teams that win worlds, it's the same story a lot of the time. Will anyone really say that Crown was better than Faker in 2016? Was Pyosik the best jungler at worlds last year? The players do have to be some of the best of course but there's so much more to it than that. I can't speak to the points about corruption and nepotism, but just looking at the history of league esports, building super teams is not the answer.
um....bro...your na talent team nrg has a foreign botlane....and c9 never had a succesfull all na team. jensen is not american. in their current roaster they have exactly 1 american player.
They need good players… it’s that simple. Crown was not better than Faker, but he was still solid. Pyosik spiked at the right time and for awhile was one of the best junglers in LCK. Like you need good players, yes mentality is key… but you are not gonna compete with LCK with people like Nuc, because it just doesn’t work, they just aren’t good enough.
@@PeoplePleaser578but there do not exist more than a handful of non asian players that are world class. It's a different mentality about training and grinding. So yes, this is a very bad limited take. Saying "blame all the noncompeting teams" and then say "get better". Bullshit if I ever heard it.
Furthermore the stomps LEC endured were 80 percent on shotcalling and team map macro. But Nemesis doesn't understand this, probably why he isn't in LEC anymore.
g2 stopping perkz and rekkles did not make the region worse. if you think 2 players can make 9 teams/45players worse, your mind is absolutely in the gutter. also your point in the end is that "building super teams is not the answer", which contradicts your point about g2 in the first place? we all saw how perkz and vitality performed, so how is it g2's fault again?
@@johnnamkeh1290 Yes if you actually listened to what he said instead of just assuming that he is wrong. He is talking about the fact that there are a number of players that could and have compete with Asian teams and don’t have teams through varying reasons. Same as the whole thing about macro is due to poor management and coaching… rosters poorly put together (Fnatic, Vitality, XL, Heretics, Koi) rosters that had 0 chance of competing (Astralis)… those are a thing. Yes you absolutely can say those 2 things together. Why would you keep Dajor or play with Sertuss… when you know you aren’t competing for a title?
No they really weren’t… you did not watch the LEC if you think that is the case - G2 could literally win without ever relying on Macro because they just skill diffed everyone, the ones that could compete skill wise - were so badly organised, badly managed and badly coached that they were in absolute chaos the whole year (Fnatic, Vitality).
Like imagine listening to everything he said and assuming he is wrong because you don’t like him. Let’s ignore the fact that Nemesis could have been on Heretics with Bwipo this year… but turned down an offer from them after spring season.
I was watching Fakers stream back in 2022, and he mentioned something about how he thinks the EU has drastically underperforming lately in the major stages because he thinks G2 is well coached and prepared team, therefore they do not have any other team with proper competition, scrim, improve, individually and as a team, meantime they in Korea , each year have at least 4 teams he finds himself and t1 learning, pushing each other to be better. so I think until eu won't have at least 2-3 decent teams , as faker said, we kinda are su*king at the major stage for the time being, hopefully, that changes one day. Hopefully, eu teams (managers) stop milking sponsors cash, and doing nonsense with teams and rather focus on creating a competitive roster with the best eu players and treating them properly.
G2 could try and practice more in Korea then
Teams are bleeding money, popular players are stealing paychecks. The most competetive non-g2 rosters in last years have been helped by new players emerging into the scene. I don't want to see another overpricing perkz and going 10th. We're not gonna get better in just one year. This has to be a long process. The truth probably is that 2019 was a fluke, the gap now is as big as it ever was and 2018-2019 was just a once time event. We should just get used to how it currently is
@@haen2456LOL
@@sharpasacueballThey should create an international region where teams can fight each other out of worlds.
A lot of teams would vastly improve.
EU was competitive. Then G2 sent perkz to NA and rekkles to ERL. It being a "business move" doesn't mean it didn't fuck the entire region. G2 made the region worse. You can't now complain that you have no competition and no way of getting better when you ensured that. That's what happens when your business moves are only short term good. Same can be said about the scumbag in rogue who fucked over odo and MAD blocking elyoya from going to fnc. We are actively making "business decisions" which make the region weaker and then the orgs are surprised that EU gets fucked at worlds. Enjoy not getting revenue and making much less money because of your smart decisions.
Your comment assumes a vacuum. The person who maye these calls for G2 isnt actively involved in the business anymore. Others have to figure out ways on how to deal with that fallout. Carlos wouldnt have cared or found different ways.
Team environment is more important than the player roster. We have seen it time and time again, be it in EU or NA...
In individual esports it’s not bogged down by this shit so the best players get the best results plain and simple, as long as they can travel to the event. Lots of regions have representation ie in fighting games. Something like Pakistan in Tekken or Mexico in King of Fighters will never ever happen with how the league esports environment is set up
Well it's harder for the lower teams to compete cause big money orgs acquire the big name players. G2, Fnatic, Vitality have deep pockets so they can collect the big names in the league more easily than others. Like try convincing Caps to play for a team like Astralis. When even your big market teams start performing badly, then your league is in trouble.
You don't even need big budget be competitive, when top teams even fail at basics.
Rogue won Summer and then yeeted off their top and support
It's not a money thing
Plus LEC has shown again and again you can bring up regional talent
The issue is everything else. Roster construction, coaching, etc.
Why does the riot teaser have weiwei at the end of the Fnatic vs g2 trailer likes he going to clap them. Nice rigging riot
@@Avvura how does that prove that it's not a money thing? When players win titles they have the bargaining power to demand for a higher salary. The team on the other hand doesnt magically get the money to pay all 5 players a higher salary someone will have to go unless there are players who dont mind not having a salary increase after winning a title
It was spoiled by the franchise system, which completely stopped the progress of all teams, they are not looking for newcomers, either old players or foreign players play from year to year, before each team had a certain fear that they will be replaced by other teams from the Challenger League, but now even the last team will be in the plus thanks to advertising and so on, and the LEС is stagnating
Riot is corrupt -> teams are corrupt -> game changes made for pro play is corrupt -> Account boosted players in EU NA SEA representing the region.
diamond is 100% right and also has the right to speak about this,when he was playing m5 and clg eu were able to compete with asian teams,when m5 went to worlds they were the favorites,during his time there were fanatic,gambit,clg eu,maybe sk,but you got 4 teams you thing were able to make it out of groups,now you look at 1 team who can make it out of groups 1 shacky team,and the rest are play in material,when you watch LEC and then watch lck/lpl you see a clear difference in quality ...EU is going the NA way without the imports,but then again,EU is dealing with different problems now which arent esport related and you should feel it,not only in esport but in different sports like football and science aswell
+1 to the point that LEC is not interesting to watch. The quality is not on par with LCK.
I'm not a pro, but from my point of view of the WORLD and how different countries population and cultures are. EUW and NA are too unambitious + they don't have the same drive and endgoal that Koreans and Chinese do about the game.
It's like Nemesis said IF IT IS TRUE. If they're at home collecting paychecks now and not pushing to win next worlds right now, improving their talent, getting new AMBITIOUS players etc etc what's the point? Nowadays people at worlds just go "oh hope we get an easy team so we can MAYBE survive one more swiss stage matchup, or MAYBE we're lucky and win against this and that so we at least get this far. What kind of shitty mentality is that, idk if that's just the casters but it feels like that mentality is reflected in SOME of the players.
Not to mention if teams are not pulling their competitive weight to a region, they will also dull the other teams, dragging themselves and everyone else down by not trying to be competitive with each other. This is why people who retire to NA from KR or EUW seem to perform worse. Even Faker would go dull if the competition is too far below his level. It's a lot like Riots matchmaking in ranked, if you get constantly locked with players who run it down, scream ff15 and int, your own play will get worse over time, in any elo.
Truth. At the end of the day it’s a culture problem, Asian culture is just so much better suited for League than western culture. We will never be able to compete.
It's a problem that won't be fixed in a year, our players as a whole are getting gapped basically everywhere. Of the 4 games in which an LEC team beat a western team 3 were against a 4th seed and 3 needed some magic or major ints from the other team to win. Overall level of LEC strength has been deteriorating for years to what we see now. If this is to be fixed it needs to be a long term goal. 2025 I expect will look very similar to this year.
this had the mourinho vibe:"if i speak, big trouble"
to be fair. vitality really did try lol. they made every possible move they could have and it didnt workout. it sucks but as for the rest i agree.
vitality just overspent with biggest names they could get, and formed dysfunctional roster.
I mean vitalitys only investment Was perkz and upset. Kaiser was washed even before, bo is coinflip with a champ Pool of sejuani/maokai and on top they got the worst kr academy top they could get.
Agreed
Vitality tried
They did for the players, but they massively dropped the ball in terms of coaching, analytics and management.
Do you think how much money Vitality spent on Bo ? This guy dont play pro league for 2 years and no team in LPL need him. Photon is LCKCL player i dont think he get that much either. I think Vitality only spent big on Perkz and he is overrate as fk , anyone know that instead of get high potential midlane they choose overdate franchise player .
i played on amateur teams (1st division) for 5 years and nemesis is spot on with management being incompetent. 4 out of 5 teams have been absolute dogtrash
Hard to believe coming from “swaggingswagster”. The problem with League players is that they play soloq 24/7 thinking they’re the main character and need to 1v9 every game and they’re always right, then you get to comp play and suddenly it’s a 5v5 environment where they’re all dogshit because they’re not used to playing the actual game with teammates. Asian culture on the other hand is all about teamwork so they understand how the game is supposed to be played as a 5v5, the west will never catch up.
Havent watched Nemi talk much ever since he left LEC and now seeing him talk like this, I say he matured so much and I hope an LEC team picks him up soon. If only there was a team besides G2 that has the balls and the capability to built a roster with him in it. I can only hope.
Team cant pick him up if he doesnt want to play competitively. He just wants to make money on Twitch.
@@spicesmuggler2452maybe there's a problem that teams can't monetize players? Like pay them well and enable them to get money by streaming and ads? Like T1 and many others are doing?
@@ImaskarDono You have a valid point but you have to understand that Korean orgs underpay their players compared to LPL, LEC and LCS since forever. That is also the reason why you see so many Korean pros playing abroad, they get payed better for lesser competitiveness.
@@ImaskarDono To respond to your main point; You cant make Nemesis play in a pro enviroment if he does not want to do so. Its his own decision. And as much as twitch chat wants him to do it, he just fakes it all and will never return playing pro again. He can make money for his next 3 families streaming on Twitch, why would he want to compete and lose years of his life stressing and hoping then get matchmade with some third class support or jungle? He is smart and made the right decision but to dangle it in front of his audience is a bit low if it happened (he will never play pro ever again).
There is simply not enough talent in EU. C-tier imports like JeongHoon, Malrang, Photon, Chasy, Noah are top 5 in their positions in LEC. None of them would have even 1% chance of winning LCK. The fact there are 50-60% of players in LEC who are MUCH worse than them shows how fucking bad the situation is.
This is what it all comes down to. The old guard that propped up the league, especially in 2018-2019 are retiring or degrading and there are almost no new rookies replacing them that could ever dream of matching them at their prime. I can’t even imagine what the LEC will look like when players like Caps and Mikyx retire.
Most of the games in season by LPL & LCK is B03, in EU AND NA both region played B01 and in playoffs they play B03 i think this is a helpful if LEC, LCS played B03 in seasons not just in playoffs to practice them in international competition and LPL have 20 Teams in 2022 DOINB played 5 games of B05 and still he did not make to worlds in 2022 or 2021 i think. the point is MORE GAMES! and at least 3 international event to expose the current meta to each other cuz the Worlds is boring its always same region pft
Completely agree. Not only for the players but the coaches too. When you have more BO3 or BO5 games you get more drafting experiences and how to work your way out of a pinch.
This competitive scene is over a decade long and I have NEVER understood how every region can have different formats of game numbers and compete evenly on an international stage.
True, Eu Na is just a waste of worlds spot. Like how stupid is this two region sends 7 team :D Just give them a 3 spot total they are just ruining the tournament, I prefer Tes edg and Hle over any western team
@@armi5219i'm not following lck/lpl (until now i'm going to do way more^^), but i'm pretty sure seeds 5-8th of both divisions tend to be way more dangerous and consistant than any of Western teams earning false bunch of seeds, except for G2.
As G2 fan really disappointed but lucid, take my Samurais on lck/lpl league for 4 years from now, we will construct war machine
It's pretty interesting how before 2019, when lec had way less money in it, EU rosters and development was way better.
I always used to think EU coaches etc. were total frauds and I'm glad time's proved me right. Personally stopped being too invested into the LEC and League as a whole when I realized we'll never win until we have players who can match their eastern counterparts in terms of handskill (=never).
Dude has a point that LEC is corrupted and beside G2 other teams dont try to win that hard but theres no excuse to G2 going 0-2 vs NRG. They played like shit that day and it cost them not leaving swiss stage. It was actually skill issue.
It was only mental and draft issue. For sure not skill issue 😂😂
the team managers, coaches, etc., don't understand what it takes to win at the game & they're leading players astray. the community shits on players who "underperform" but a massive part of it is mismanagement. tons of actually good players being completely lead astray by people who have no business coaching or managing anything.
I've been following LoL since Season 2 with Gambit and CJ Entus Frost. 10 years later and EU&NA are still at the same level against the LPL and LCK. Western teams are still at rock bottom.
The biggest LoL change is now you don't need as much skill since there are new champions who just dominate, no matter if skill or not.
EU>NA or NA>EU is the same, both are bad. I would change EU and NA to a wildcard region, they don't bring anything to the table. Nothing.
I am just a spectator, so who cares.
Just look at each league's Mid lane depth. In LCK, they have Chovy, Faker, Showmaker. LPL has knight, scout, rookie, doinb. The only competitive midlaner in LEC is Caps and prime Perkz, the rest are mediocre fools who steals paychecks like Nisqy, Humanoid, Larssen.
LEC was shaped just like Carlos wanted. Only one good team and FK the others.
so basically, west is doomed for the rest of the history of league for eternity. 😂
yes
always has been. NA knows their region is shit, OCE is just OCE, only region that has been coping for the past 7 years is EU. NA > EU or EU > NA, doesn't matter, we will always still lose to KR/CN superteams every worlds like it has been for the past 10 years and it will always be that way.
You can not predict, the future. just look at other esports, sometimes regions or teams rise up.
@@thymn4384 bro league was created in the west and it's been around for over a decade. if western players were ever going to be anywhere near the same level as the east it would have happened by now. eastern culture simply cultivates more potent talent than the west.
I mean the game is also "dying" in the West. Not many New players, 90% of playerbase are casuals and the esport ecospace is so closed, that its way too Hard to get into lec for most ppl. Back in the day you would get in, if you where challenger, now you get gated by regional leagues where you dont even get much Money. So why drop out of school, for like 2,5k a month and you dont even know how long to you get to play there.
I also think competetive games are kinda slowing down and esport in general aint in a good state rn
Asking people to blame players who didnt make worlds and are now sitting out the rest of their contract while there is no games being played sound really fucking petty. Every single LEC pro wants to go to Worlds and will try his best to get there during regular season. Yes its an issue for EU that they are far from being as internationally competetive as they were back in 2018-2020. But maybe it was also an absolute High point of EU talent. Two EU teams with fnatic and G2 with really great super talented rosters all in the prime of their carreers was something that is hard to achieve again.
Caps for example was crazy during that time for both teams and was the closest a western player ever got to being the best in the world. Jankos, Wunder Bwipo, Perkz etc. all had their primes in those years. Europes Golden generation came short of winning worlds and now its hard to see how we can ever get to those high again.
only discovered nemesis a few days ago but he has quickly become one of my most trusted sources of league knowledge
Dudes was a pro player and multi seasonal challenger on different servers. Plus rank 1 on EUW. I ain’t saying he’s always right but he kinda knows his shit
@@Intoxicated4768Remember when he said Doinb is one of the weakest mids of the tournament and then got hard gapped by Doinb? The Doinb that then reshaped the League meta and macro on his own to win worlds. By Leadership.
@@ThomasMueller999he said that doinb was bad at laning phase which was true
EU thinking all the excuses as possible. Its not about the corruption, its about the degrade of getting new talents. Those owners or management of respective teams are just simply bad at scouting nothing more nothing less.
lack of competition, and yet g2 got blown out by a team from a region with worse competition. it’s not the lack of competition.
Honest question.. why wont LEC hold their playoffs in Korea xD.. it would actually give them a chance scrimming against korean teams (like 3rd to 8th) and play korean soloq? Because I actually think the gap is so high, because G2 has no chance to practise in EU.. the teams are just not good enough. So when they face asian teams they get compeletely stomped.
G2 may be the best performing team in LEC history, but it is also the most corrupt.
Imagine playing politics with the roster and management just because you don't like how popular the other player is.
The amount of times Hans inted is criminal though.
i didnt get hype about Hans Sama. He had really bad year in NA and it all seemed to me like he cant play under the pressure. Mikyx transformation from very mid support in excel to S tier LEC support is also hilarious to me. And btw i think that back then Advienne played better than Mikyx in Excel jersey.
Did you read what i said? I was talking about time when Mikyx played in Excel. He definitely didn't upgrade their roster back then. Iam not saying that Advienne is good or bad, i just said that he played better league than him when they were in Excel.
I did, I agree with you.@@petrsilhavy7401
Its a problem when the best players in the region are sitting in the nutsack or streaming
Most of that by their own choices… like bro. Half those guy chose to not play.
@@PeoplePleaser578Who are those exactly? Perkz, Gilius, Jizuu, Finn are free agents. Jack, Jankos are on a team. Dom is a streamer by his choice and Yamato is a LFO coach (also working for KC and G2 content creator). Most of the sack aren’t pros because they have no other choice. They legit dont get picked up. Imagine noone picking gilius up
Wunder is alright but apart from that who else in the sack are good? No way u think perkz, gilius, jackspektra are even close to being good atm lol
@@anonymouswarlord102 Perkz is good and was one of the best performing mids in EU. Jackspectra, mechanically is very good his issues were with his nerves and he struggled to mesh with his team… to claim players like Perkz are bad is hilarious
@@PeoplePleaser578 you are still livin in 2019 honey im perkz fan but he is done getting gapped by everyone so please stop living in past
LEC and LCS has talents, but much of the teams didn't have any balls to support and bring it up instead constantly staying with overpaid players with little impact and bringing past prime imports. And the fact eco-system is not good either (EMEA masters was being too popular that much of young talents doesn't want to go LEC and LCS... well u know what happen to their second tier leagu)
if they didnt keep on change the old player, EU would stand a chance...
G2 with Caps, Perkz, Wunder, Jankos, Milkyx is the best team so far
?
Bwipo,Broxah,Caps,Rekkles,Hyli gaps that.
Do you realize the issue? Its Caps. Caps only.
@@ThomasMueller999gaps my ass. G2 2019>>>Fnc 2018.
Go cry somewhere else.
problems :
. Closed league, meaning companies have no reason to perform since most of their revenue is coming from league sponsors
. Too small cash prizes compared to sponsors, leaving no reason to perform again
. lack of league passion of some teams in LEC (a good illustration is some teams choosing a player that has been performing average/low in lec for 5 years in a row, therefore has no hope to do very good this year. But at least they are sure he is not expensive and won't be horrible).
. lack of knowledge by some coaching staffs, some choices of roster are completly shit (for example vitality promoting daglas).
. unconfirmed coaching staffs in LEC. FNC's draft was also horrible yesterday.
. No ability for teams except top 3/4 to align a good roster, despite having like 6-7 good players by role in EU.
we could have 7-8 very good teams contesting playoffs for example :
current G2 roster
current FNC
then make 5-6 good teams, with equilibrium of strong and weak side players with :
top : adam photon chasy wunder odo cabochard
jgl : yoya jankos inspired bo selfmade markoon
mid : lider nisqy nemesis perkz larssen vetheo
adc : caliste upset carzzy crownie comp jezu
supp : hyli labrov jeonghoon targamas doss limit
Then full some bottom lec teams, but with an actual chance of being good with high ceiling potential players :
top : venour destroy
jgl : sheo cinkrof peach
mid : sertuss toucouille abedagge (would have not included him but his last split is good, and his peak in S04 was also good)
adc : patrik kaori flakked jackspectra unforgiven kobbe
supp : idk supp is very bad in EU
But we are most likely gonna end with 3/4 good rosters, like this year because teams coaching staff are horrible
I really don't understand why Cash Prizes are so low.
It's not like Riot is poor or something.
G2 and FNC are consistently doing their bests wo enter the Worlds every year.
The problem is .. the players aren't really well verse on certain champions .. also, once an EU team win game 1, they tend to autism draft game 2 and when they lose they crumble.. the game is simple, you get 1 scaling meta adc, CC oriented support, utility DPS mid and tank/utility jungle.. top can be what compliments the comp.. Neeko is really good but so is Orianna/Sylas, for JG JARVAN, Seju, Maokai, then Rell / Renata / Rakan for support ..
It is really not that easy.. If it was that easy we wouldve had an western team win worlds.. But its actually hard to outdraft or get a good draft against asian team.
autism draft 💀
Your take is bad, EU teams go even on micro plays against asian teams a lot of the time. Just look at all EU games they start losing after 20 min. Bad plays, terrible calls, weird decisions and baron flips. Has nothing to do with champ knowledge and everything with macro knowledge.
Also drafting really isnt that easy because your prio changes depending on your opponent.
G2 literally consciously trying to make their opponents weaker during offseasons. of course they are part of the problem... I don't think he should blame some teams more than others
What?
@@Natural18 When G2 sold Perkz to C9 they allegedly added a clasue that C9 could not sell him to FNC for 3 years.
This is absolutely true. Look at DRX and Weibo both 4th seed teams in difficult regions. There is such a small gap in skill between teams 1-10 in those regions. Honestly if G2 was in those regions they wouldn't even make worlds.
Not really a hot take imo, since FNC trip to the finals in 2018, EU has only had 1 team that can do anything at all, and that is obv G2, and when they are bad we have to send teams like Mad and Rogue to Worlds which are so poor it actually hurts sometimes. Mad took advantage of G2 playing poorly in LEC but never had a chance at Worlds, when they were considered top5 team by LEC casters, I honestly thought they were joking, finding out they were serious made me question the game iq of LEC casters, yes you do have to hype up your regions teams, but going into Worlds 2020 or 2021 (not 100% sure which of these 2 years it was they called Mad top5) thinking Mad is top 5, when there are 8 teams from LPL and LCK is a disgrace to your int
egrity as a caster and expert-
I love people of Twitch chat and reddit: but G2 is ok org now because Carlos is not there anymore - like do you have a memory of a goldfish? Literally not even a year ago G2 fucked over Jankos and because of that he had to play for Heretics...
WHEN BROKENBLADE IS THE BEST TOP LANER IN YOUR REGION, YOUR REGION IS AWFUL.
its not just business, they have literally ruined/weakened their region by fucking over good players. They were greedy for short term results so they killed their competition by sending them elsewhere lol. And now the consequences of that are showing
people mention 18 and 19 FNC and G2 - sure that looked the best on paper cause "somehow" they made finals
but Id argue S5 6 are better examples, cause they actually made it into semis with mostly good play, having teamwork etc. not really needing cheese.
Still the orgs are just doomed, and as such the wrong players work together and the staff is also a mess... EU just has better players and had better base structure before it got fcked - so they at least beat NA till this year... now we have to see, inting orgs and less money - lets see lets see
zero motivation without relegation. enough
said
100% agree LEC ruin started at the peak but at that time we wouldn’t have never noticed. Nepotism killed the league and the new format ? The new format is not a positive change for teams and players but i guess it’s better for viewers (?) . 60% of lec players should lose their job or go in minor EUM regions and get replaced by new talent . 2 seasons and u have 2 top tier rosters
Time to rename the channel to "Neme POV"
Diamondprox is the goat. He was DUMPSTERING junglers in UOL 2016. Politics sent him away
What you guys fail to understand is that this is a business. Organizations have to be interested in making money and saving money rather than being competitive. Paying shitloads of money for players that might improve your team isnt always the most financially reasonable decision. Solid finances = long term stability.
G2 dismantled other teams to make their "super team" so yeah i blame g2 for destroying the competition in LEC
There are only 5 good players in Europe? Selfmade in shit? 113 is better no? Let's go to the mid lane we have player like nemesiss, jizuke, fking magifelix (18 year 4 acc in top 10 challenger eu in different role) No team has invested in psychologists and everything to follow him and make him grow and solve his communication problems and anxieties. He have potentional for come better the caps. But hey lider is better no? We have yamato on stream and have hiarnam to assistant coach, but the problem is for sure the g2 roster, wunder out for oscarin bc the fnc cant do a good roster. And I only mentioned players under 23 years old, and for 3 years these players have done nothing (they were 20 years old very young), it continues to convince you that g2 is to blame
The fact that some best EU player not in the best team is funny, n some best player not even in a team... Also the EU team i know is really good as 5 man team, doing insane team fight eventho they getting gapped at lane... But now? getting gapped at lane n still get rolled at teamfight... More like Duo Rank, jg+mid/top & adc+sp...
But hey Nemesis doing pretty good as a streamer, good for him, n i dont think he is gonna back to competitive...
at least Nemesis was a great WORLD challenging player. Totally forgot about that part.
Haha yeah. Always funny how people forget about the time he insulted Doinb and then got hard gapped by Doinb.
@@ThomasMueller999 Apparently the guy is not only awful to work with, he has his ego not in check. G2 lost to NRG, a team that is in a "worse" region that has a "worse" SoloQ experience, but has a giant coaching staff and a great support system for the players, which the base of a good team.
According to him, Palafox and Dockla, were just that great all along, even when they have said in the interviews numerous times that the coaching staff is the real highlight of all of his.
For me the guy is just copping that is not his fault that he is not in any team, and he is relegated to just grind SoloQ while "less than him" players get to compete.
True, but corruption and nepotism is omnipresent. It's not an e-sport specific occurance.
Franchising is just an american sport shit system. Do it like counter-strike where a soloq stack team has a chance to compete at the highest level if they are good enough. A league with no relegation is stupid and teams lower tier teams have no reason to even try to improve. In counter-strike we constantly see new teams and new players reach the top stage because it is actually competetive and all players have a chance to reach it if they are good enough. LEC has 10 teams with 5 players each meaning 50 players. Getting the chance as a rookie is so small. Fuck franchising, it is just anti-competition. Underperforming teams need to fear for relegation, underperforming players must fear for being dropped and new players must have an easier way to reach the top.
My recomendation would to make 2 main leagues, LEC and LEC2, the bottom 2 (10th and 9th) teams in LEC is replaced by the top 2 teams in LEC2, the 8th placed team in LEC has to play a bo5 against the 3rd place team in LEC2 and the winner gets the LEC spot. The bottom 3 teams in LEC2 are kicked out and the now remaining 3 spots in LEC2 is rewarded through an open qualifiers system similar to counter-strike where practically anyone good enough has a chance.
This system would make it way more competetive, underperforming teams must fight for survival. It also gives new players a chance to be recognised.
so............... what we used to be before franchising was a thing with relegations and everything.
Checked it up, No wonder its all been downhill since then, litteraly EUs last good worlds performance was right during the switch xD. Franchising can eat ass.@@MylesTheDoctorMahajan
bro this is dota dpc system LUL
Put GIGA in charge of a team and watch how fast they win Worlds
League was better when players had more of a say on who they have on their team. Synergy can’t be forced.
I'm not sure why you act like they don't when we literally have multiple teams that's built around a single player and multiple roster changes due to players wanting changes. Jankos literally got kicked from G2 because of disagreements with Caps.
Players say and influence shit all the time. And theyre also wrong all the time lol
commenting for nemesis is right
Football players dont practice 24 hours a day. But they train specific things. Like defens, shoting, dribling, Longball. Analising Old games with VR, so they can Watch what they did wrong in the situation. And also ligting and traning. I pretty sure if you only scrim as a team you will never get better. Cause if you only scrim you are coasting on your excisting knowledge about the game.
Good clip！！
honestly its simmilar how Korean Imports are basically NA level of play after a year simply cuz bad practice and less competitive environment
"Just business" is disgusting to say when we are speaking of elevating the region. No hate to nemesis in particular, but that expression has no place in a healthy environment. Same thing with other sports, where breaking a leg is preferable to a player outplaying you. Disgusting really, when "business" makes the decisions those who pay are the players/athletes and the fans.
So your saying lec is a shit region? Whats new in the last 3 years
You would hop G2 getting embarrassed by NA would be the wake up call EU needed.
EU mad bc their number 1 seed lost to NA at worlds. Ouch
ye its turbo sad bcs NRG played like turbo shit with their lucky draw and against MAD they looks like some challanger team with their turbo shitty macro thats why everyone is mad xD
Bottom teams are also doing business. Blame the system not the players
Well KOI kicked Odoamne (top3 toplaner) and Trimby right after their success to become a mediocre sht team. MAD got Nisqy who was decent before but got gapped in NA and a garbage import top/most unstable bot ever. Vitality to be honest tried, but got unlucky with BO probably fixing games and team not working. TH got fking Evi for top a mediocre mid and bot untill the end when the ygot it together too late. XL somehow managed to look good considering how bad everyone else is, and probably because Odoamne is actually good. And G2 is unable to clean up their play after months of "practicing", who the fk knows what theyve been doing with their time. Not to mention the dumb points system with 3 splits that makkes sure the last tournament doesn't even have the most recent strongest 4 teams in it. IS IT REALLY THAT SURPRISING THAT WE SUCK?
I see a lot of ppl saying the good players just stream and the bad get signed
To be frank why should ppl like nemesis sign for a shit team whrn he can stay streaming earning similar caoin but with much less stressing?
Nemesis on a Jonny Silverhand level of cooking rn
LEC is the worst major region now. All those cocky players - like Humanoid trash talking NA on stage - got their lesson. Overconfident, underperforming, zero initiative and game plan. Know your place. I’m from EU btw
we kick 2 NA teams OUT dont act like NA is any better than EU xDD. what happend vs NRG is biggest mistery ever bcs after their game against MAD i thougt this is worst NA 1st seed ever
@@radmiral9048 we kick 2 NA teams that’s fact but NRG best NA team kicked G2 best EU team that’s also fact. I’m from EU I’m big FNC fan but this year I feel totally disappointed.
lec system should be to blame i cant beleive a 7th seath got to worlds as a 3th seat euw team i mean waht is that man
I think, EU teams could definitely practice more. Work ethics are so much better in Korea.
Just stop the damn G2 copium bruh, they havent had a single game win that wasnt thrown by their opponents (sure props to punishing their mistakes, but its not how you want to win).
Even fucking FNC managed to win games on their own terms. G2 is similar as the rest of EU just not good enough to compete, they've been scrimming top asian teams for weeks now and even bragged about their good winrate yet when it matters they all shat themselves. NRG beat them 2-0 while they are in an even worse performing league regionally and internationally.
fnc looking good vs wildcard regions
@@AndersonAI still better than looking good against nobody at worlds i guess
NRG also only won games that were thrown by G2 though. Do you think for a second that G2 performing at their absolute best ever lose to NRG? They just looked like they were a clash team, idk the reason for that, but they weren't playing anywhere near the top of their game.
@@darkdemon9013 thats what I mean, like they play really well and win a lot of scrims cus of it but when it actually matters at worlds they just choke.
You cant just say "oh the lack of competition in EU made them unable to compete" while they legit beat these teams in scrims.
They get a 2-0 start because of 2 throws from the opponents which then I guess gave them to much false confidence, they didnt learn from their mistakes and their opponents abused them.
G2 got gifted a free quarter finals and they shat themselves, which actually makes me glad they didnt get it in round 5 either.
What G2 copium? He said G2 should still be blamed.
No competition and G2 still lost to MAD in spring and almost lost to XL in summer, what a bs.. just excuses. Problem is lack of games on stage, in LEC should be more Bo3 and Bo5s
Whaaaaaat ? Corruption in lol pro playyyy ?
This has been the case since closed leagues lmao. People who are surprised by this need to ask themselves how tf they didnt see it for over 10 years.
i will tell you why lec losses to the east, the answer is quite simple. there are around 8 months of domestic leagues a year. lec teams scrim 5 games/day 3 days a week. lck and lpl teams play 9 games a day in scrims, 7 days a week on odd weeks, and 6 days a week in even weeks. 8 months =32 weeks, 16x3+16x4=112 days. this is how much more eastern teams play(ignoring that they play more games on a day). "work smarter not harder) is a true concept, but not like this.
public and org should just stop making change every year, like G2 did good not making change imo, and a team I thought could be trouble if they keep their roster was BDS, like they aren't shiny but if they did stick together they would improve, I guess worlds were too much for them teams wise....
Look at g2 and bb they bought him hyped him like crazy made a lot of money off him naming him too father. And he goes to words and get gapped evry game.its sad to watch rly. Dunno like europe have good players but guys playing in lec are mostly shit. Like g2 2k19 showed europe can compete. But let me tell you who will make more money for g2 talented good top player or some bb that ppl know is streming and brings fans to g2? U anserw that and u will know why we losingm
Nemesis has got to have one of the most annoying voices and boring personalities in lol. Then again he speaks truth after truth so still here for it.
just saying Chovy at #1
is 300 lp ahead of 2nd hes slamming everyone rn
I'm so tried of this argument of saying its all the teams below when the teams at the top dont try and improve their own region and will only say its the ones below them that cause it
G2 fans trying hard to def them😂.
If somehow BLG wins worlds G2 fans copium can say wait G2 actually lost to number 1. the swiss was actually the final boss. Same thing happened with Sunning, DK, FPX G2 biggest loses was vs 1st or 2nd best teams..
Holy shit diamondprx spitting facts.
this is one of the hardest copes in gaming. teams shouldnt get better by seeing what works against competition. And even then g2 almost lost to Koi in elimination. if the competition is weak how come g2 are still scraping through stage games in LEC?
Imagine getting fisted by NA. That’s permanent demoralization. EU is cooked from here on out.
No teams play down to competition in every sport. It’s a much tougher transition when your competition is worse.
Ur region is dog shit
tbh we should blame soloq players that they are not better than korea soloq players
If you keep saying that the problems in EU is the players, you havent's understood a thing since 2021. And next years is going to be the same thing or even worse
the reason g2 is not that good internationally is because nobody is challenging them literally. they have no competition on their own region. every other team is so fucking shit g2 can int and still win every game cuz theyre just still better. every other team is mismanaged to the point where they dont just work.
Western teams are so bad because soloq ladders are fucking horrible, wintrades in masters+ are ruining the integrity of the game, zero point in grinding when you play against scripters/wintraders/boosted/bought accs literally 80% of your games, riot has completely neglected the high elo community for years and atp its too far gone to recover even IF they did give a fuck, which they dont.
so you have soon-to-be pros playing against boosted/bought acc 58% wr GM's who are actually d2 and stomping them and then they get picked up by a team and play against other LCS players who are also mid and don't perform as well against boosted accs (obv) and then it turns out they arent as good as they seemed in soloq but they're on contract with their team for 2 years so the org cant just kick them out, which is also why western teams are always completely different after a couple of years because the org knows this player is shit compared to other regions but they're stuck with them until contract runs out or they do kick the player and then have to pay a shit load of money for breaking contract.
the reason KR/CN do so well is because they have very strict rules, KR needing KR SSN to play so boosting/bought accs are pretty rare and CN has the super server which creates a very competitive environment, their soloq ladders are as pure as you can get compared to NA/EU.
what i would personally do to try and help cleanse the western soloq ladders is bring back placements for d4-masters, put an MMR cap or reduce the LP gains on fresh 30s so you dont have d4 andys hitting masters 200 lp by coinflipping because of +30/-15 lp, add vanguard to league to get rid of all the fucking donkey brained lvl 32 acc scripters, and finally, hire actual high elo players to determine if someone is wintrading which you dont even really need a high elo player, even a bronze could tell some of these people are wintrading.
Ah yes, lec is corrupt because I can't play in a top team and my ego won't let me go to a bottom team like Crownie and build back up lmao people like you will never be winners
Lol True