When troubleshooting, I think about the odds, but also how easy a potential problem is to check. Yeah, the caps were not likely to be the problem, but were super easy to check.
I think its been mentioned by others but when using an Internal Combustion Engine to power a dive compressor you MUST ensure your compressor has a clean air source. CO contamination in tanks will kill. Partial pressure of CO increases with depth. No mater how careful you are with such a set up testing your tanks for CO with some like the Analytical Industries Palm CO Carbon Monoxide Analyzer would be a sensible precaution. You only need a small CO contamination to be deadly. The Compressed Gas Association, Inc. (CGA) and the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) established a standard for air. The standard known as ANSI/CGA G-7.1-2011 requires that the compressed air in scuba tanks have 10 ppm or less of CO, or .001%. Even at recreational diving’s maximum operating depth of 130 feet/40 meters (about 5 bar/ata), the partial pressure of CO (PCO) of 10 ppm would be at an acceptable level of .005%, or equivalent to 50 ppm of CO in surface air. A contaminated tank containing just 800 ppm of CO might not immediately present symptoms at the surface, but at a depth of 99 feet/30 meters (4 bar/ata), the same tank of air could prove deadly within 30 minutes (0.08% x 4 bar/ata = PCO 0.32 bar/ata, or equal to breathing 3,200 ppm [0.32%] of CO in surface air).
@@SVSeeker You did right by checking caps. Only takes a min. Be careful, I know of a place that filled tanks and 2 divers didn't come home. Their boat was found anchored at a reef. Divers were found dead on the bottom with tanks empty. They were only 30 ft. It was ruled ran out of air. I can free dive 30 ft. I know that caustic acid was stored in open containers close to where the tanks were filled. I've dove for 35 years, things can go sideways quick. Another dive shop filled tanks in a building were the intake air was on the front of the building at the parking lot. Not to be a smart ass but be careful. A little fuck up can kill someone. SV Seeker looks good.
@@SVSeeker Sarcasm aside pilots are killed every year due to CO leaks in fully serviced aircraft. It's true that ICE powered dive compressors are often used without incident, but it only takes one gasket leak or othe inadvertent contamination of inlet air to end in tragedy. Also you mentioned on of the the advantages of powering this way is portability. Moving such set up is again not inherently doomed to cause death destruction and the end of worlds but its raises the risk. Bottom line testing your tanks is the best way to avoid any potential issues. You also have many followers and just because you are carful does not mean others may not imitate without understanding the risks. If you are the only one diving on tanks you fill do what you like, but if you are filling other peoples tanks then do the right thing and test the tanks. I am not trying to say you are doing or going to do something stupid or obviously dangerous, just pointing out this type of set up need constant vigilance. Good luck and i hope you get on the water soon.
I love the fact you never seem to get flusted when things don't work. You just go through the why and the how and figure out what the problem is, A great example of critical thinking which to many of our people don't know how to do. thank you for those real life teaching classes. Just say in RC
If you are doing enough things then you get accustomed to it. And sooner or later it will work. Failure is just a step in the process. Embrace it, and squeeze the shit out of it.
@@mattlibby4490 it just sounds wrong to me lol like looking at an obvious typo . i guess ive watched too many docs or spent too much time messing with circuits
Damnit! Sometimes the chase doesn't result in a catch... The diesel version may wind up as a better solution in the long run. Time will tell. I hope you had a great Christmas Doug. I also hope Santa delivers your final insurance paperwork.
Wow! Every video I watch I learn more and more!! But I still wonder if any human on the planet can decipher such a complicated system?? I'm kind of glad you're still on land to figure all this out! Patience might be a lifesaving blessing!
@@SVSeeker It could happen without noticing first hand. My scuba school never had any problems with their air quality until someone parked near the compressor's air inlet and left the engine running. Some of the exhaust mixed in the air and everyone got the surprise once under water.
My bet would be on how the motor works, there needs to be a Centrifugal clutch inside of the motor which disengages the start caps. Every time you engage the clutch you stall the motor and the start capacitors are get contacted again that might be cause the flickering. Worth a try would be a Time based Relay which contacts the starting caps. P.S. There are VFDs specially designed for single phase motors they aren't cheap though.
I second this idea. I bet that this is exactly what is happening. It would be an easy theory to test (and heck keep as a solution) with a simple switch inline to the start cap, once the motor is running, flip the switch to disable the start cap and engage the clutch.
Watching you test the compressor output with your finger made me think back to college, am I right in thinking you can blow air in to your bloodstream by putting your finger over a high pressure air pipe?
Haven’t watched the channel in a long time cause I fell behind and got overwhelmed. Can’t believe it’s at port finally. It’s come a damn long way because of an insane amount of people. Pretty cool.
Don't forget power factor. If that generator is a .8 PF then you can only use approximately 80% of the nameplate rating. ...but I'm sure you know that.
Doug, have you considered a dual use diesel like an irrigation/water pump or portable generator ? Then you would have a means of pumping serious water ( 4" dia hose ) for sinking boats and if it includes a power takeoff so it could be set up to drive the diving compressor too...
I like The idea of A diesel engine that could run the compressor as well as a high-volume water pump to have on board, I think you able to move load volumes of water could come in very handy
My suggestion is you position a diesel between the compressor and second load such that you can swap loads by unhooking one belt and hooking up the other.
I have an Akin compressor that came with a 11hp homda gas motor. When I contated the dealer they recommended a 7.4 HP electric. I didnt have one so I used a 5 HP single phase. I have used it running for almost 10 years. And certain times of the year we would fill 14 plus tanks at a time and have had no issues. You might try a 5 HP motor that the genset can power.
Hey for the future. A typical three jaw universal chuck usually only holds up to .002 TIR and are often much worse. For something like this coupler where a bit of runout will cause vibration and stress on the components, use the four jaw and dial it in. Also you are assuming that the OD of the coupler is true to the bore. That may or may not be the case. Better would be to put the stub shaft in the chuck, dial it in and clamp the coupler on it. Assuming there was enough length to pull it off.
How those meters measure capacity is a known voltage over time. When they go bad they have a Internal short which causes them to take longer to charge, which makes them read higher.
I'm sure it's been asked already (but I didn't go back that far)... Is the starter-switch (inside motor) working? It's a centrifugal switch inside the motor that kicks the starter capacitors in/out of circuit (black caps are starting, silver cap is running). If starter-switch is bad, the motor would be trying to start on running coils alone. This would result in very low (comparitvely) torque.
My experience would be with 440 volt 3-phase systems. In 1979 we start motors (40 KW and up) using "across the line" starting. When the Mechanics increased the motor load without upgrading the motor, we migrated to "Star-Delta starters" before smart motor controllers became available. An induction motor would draw a t least 300% of the nameplate current draw at start up. Your genset voltmeter seems to be relatively stable( indicating the genset is not overloading) making me wonder about the size of the conductor feeding the distribution panel and also the conductors feeding the motor. Conductor size is particularly critical in installations with long cable runs. Just my 2 cents worth.
@@SVSeeker In that case the problem may lie on your source of power. Somebody mentioned pf (power factor). Source and load must have identical pf. Running a motor on a lower pf makes it sluggish. Even the line frequency has an effect. Combine the two????? Maybe I need more education.
Hello @SV Seeker. I assume many people have already suggested you try a 10HP 3P motor paired with a VFD (like a GS4-2030 from Automation Direct). I recently did such a set-up on my home air compressor as I only have 1P (or, split phase as you say) power, but I have programmed my VFD to 'soft start' the 3P motor with my limited power supply, and then I use another setting on the VFD to alter the frequency to maintain a set Current draw at the motor. At low PSI, the motor is over-driven so I get nice fast air up to about 120PSI, but as the pressure rises, the VFD starts reducing frequency to keep current to the motor constant (and within my available power supply) , all the way up to my pressure switch cut-out. I get maximum possible air flow given my power supply. No clutches, and the 3P has way more torque than a 1P motor for turning a compressor while starting up. You could avoid the nuisance of clutches or blow off valves that you will need with a diesel.
Yeah, I was thinking this would be a good idea too, especially since you could have different programmed power limits (and therefore speeds) for running it off the inverters, 10K gen, VMAC or some other source. I'm sure it's already been mentioned, so Doug must have some specific reason for wanting to go down the diesel engine route
@@SVSeeker Haha fair enough. It would be good if you could find a motor and inverter for a good price on industrial surplus or used, but as you said the diesel engine route has its own advantages too.
@Fluffy Hamster What's your point? You could most likely run it on 1KW or less if you ran it slow enough through a VFD. The Compressor doesn't *need* 10HP to work, that's just what it needs to run at full rated speed.
Just go with the flow, as you usually do (there must be a end reason). A sailing channel fought years trying to make a DYI generator work, to finally give-in to a production unit.
Hey Doug try adding another 50uf capacitor beside the other. That may give you that extra oomf needed to start that compressor. Just tie it in parallel to the other run capacitor. The wrapped capacitors are start capacitors and the silver one is a run capacitor or can be used as a start run capacitor. I think it's worth a shot and they aren't very expensive and can be there quick on Amazon.
@@SVSeeker yes that I understand but the capacitor will give it that oomph needed to carry on and get the compressor moving. That's why I suggested it. That motor is needing a second of pulling probably 50 amps just to get the compressor moving but the capacitor will reduce that need.
Hi Doug - it was my bet that you were trying to encourage.😉 But elimination is an important part of fault finding so well done for actually taking the few minutes to test those capacitors to establish a fact.👍
He asked me for a bet too 🙂, what I learned from training and experience is to start troubleshooting with the easiest and cheaper options, but is just me I don't live enough.
So if your machining in the boat, wouldn't all the chips fall down under and clog the bilge pumps? Is there a filter for the pump? I bet cleaning all that out is a real pain
10 years from now..........................yep, we are getting closer to launch. Now I just need my doctor to give me the green light to leave the nursing home to watch it put in the water.
That 3rd stage on your Bauer, needs to have high pressure to operate. Thats why compressor starts with funny noises, and why you shouldnt run it with no hose on, for anything but few seconds. Its pretty low position where you put it, you need space under compressor, for condensation water tank/bottle. I advise mounting automatic manifolds for this discharge, as you probably wont be hanging out near compressor, when its running.... yeah, I filled up 10s of 1000s of scuba tanks in my time.
My name is Ronald Simonis and was a Bauer dialer for 20 years and during that period I had to put down many dive shops in the use of a generator. I am familiar with the problems you experience with the compressor when it is connected to a generator. When the compressor is switched on, the electromotor requires full power, if this is 7 Amp. the generator must supply 7 amp. when the compressor is switched on, which the generator does not do. The reason for this is that the speed of the generator is too low and that it takes too long for the generator to get up to speed to deliver the 7 Amp. The best way to solve this is to put a petrol or diesel engine in front of the compressor. The soft start has no influence on the speed of the generator, but on the speed of the electric motor of the compressor
Hi Doug, don't put your dive compressor on deck unless you have a very shaded area. Scuba Tanks can become very finicky charging in direct sunlight. Always charge below decks and store below decks. Many blessing to get in the water soon from Northern Israel. Keep the sails up and the keels under water in all your travels, nice job.
I think this wasn't a fail, it was just an education. You know now more than you did, the motor worked, the clutch got working, the generator worked. They just weren't right for each other. And the pictures of all the stuff viewers and followers did, makes me so happy. You people have done great things. Keep on doing that.
I think lol, non-contributory means regardless if you have more then one insurance at the end if you need to clame you will have to given up their right to any proportion of contribution from any other insurance policy available and can clame from the primary insurance only.
We used to use bronze keyways for safety,when something would bind the brass keyway would give,new supervisor told us to use steel keyways,and oh boy we destroyed allot of expensive machinery.😱😱😅
Hey Doug! A triple phase motor with a Frequency Inverter will work a lot better ! One thing to have in mind is that single phase motors have very little starting torque, so your idea of adding the clutch was perfect to overcome this. (btw, I personally had never seen a frequency inverter working with a single phase motor + capacitors, so I might have missed some important info) Another thing to have in mind is that maybe your capacitors are too small for the load surge you're having when you engage the clutch, usually single phase motors have a "starter" and a "Permanent" capacitor and you'll need to decouple the "starter" once you've reached full speed. You may be able to fix your problem this by adding a "starter" capacitor that only engages once you go below a certain RPM (not sure if it will work but you may give it a try if you wish to give this motor another chance! There are relays made specifically for this purpose, I'm not sure how they're called in english but in portuguese we call them "Relê ALNICO") And regarding the 6Amps you're seeing while not loaded, that's quite a lot for its power, but it's fine as it has capacitors. If you replace it with a true triple phase motor, you'll reduce this a lot, it'll be a lot more efficient. Most Frequency inverters are able to change a single phase input to a triple phase output, but that will depend on the power/size of the inverter (E.g.: CFW03 made by WEG, a Brazilian company) I used to work fixing frequency inverters in a company and later on I worked on Atlas Copco, designing the electrical system for Diesel powered air compressors, so I might be able to give you a little help :) If I missed some point or said anything wrong, sorry about it! I had watch the video real quick and without audio
Absolutely. When will your check get here? And I think soft start is a ramp of the voltage, nothing doing with the frequency so it works on single phase or 3 phase.
@@SVSeeker oh boy I really wish I could go there and help you! But now I'm living in the Netherlands and my wife would be really mad at me for going so far hahaha I don't have much experience with soft starters, only with frequency inverters, so I had to study a little bit and you are absolutely correct! Soft starters will reduce voltage while not changing the frequency. I think that can be one of the causes of your problems, as you're essentially reducing power/torque. With frequency inverters you wouldn't have this problem as you'd be changing only the RPM, without messing around too much with the torque/power
Definitely a prick of a challenge. Your perseverance is good to see though! Had a similar setup at an off grid paintball place. Might have been a 20kVA genny and a 7.5kW electric compressor, three phase. It was direct online so tripped out the electronic protection on the generator (undervoltage) most times you'd try to start it. Had to drop the under voltage limit, and crank up the generator output voltage to get it to start reliably. The other issue they had is that generator was running the whole site, and when the compressor was off it might have had a fridge and a few lights on it. I only went back there once but I heard along the grapevine the genny caught on fire (my guess would have been from running with no load for a majority of the time). They replaced it with... a bigger genny. If I played my cards right I'd have put the compressor on a 3 phase soft starter as the generator ran it fine, just couldn't start it. VFD would have been too expensive. But alas they didn't want to spend the money and it cost them a generator in the end. Good luck!
Hi Doug could the VMAC run a hydraulic motor to run this? Sure if you know the specs the vmac is putting out you could calculate the hyd motor needed or I could do this for you. Could also determine if it’s possible with the pressure and flow of the VMAC pump.
Just a thought but does the compressor have a dump valve so the motor can ramp up to speed before a load is placed on it. I suppose a 3 phase motor would be better suited to the compressor then a vfd could be used to adjust starting torque
No, it's not connected to tanks so there is no pressure building up. And I'd try a 3 phase if I had on but my 3 phase generator is only 8K so I think I'd be back in the same spot. We'll give the 10hp diesel a go first.
I don't know anything about Scuba compressors, but the can't be too much different from air tool compressors. Do they have a head pressure release for easier starting ? Using a clutch on a electric motor is "unusual". Some air compresses vent to atmosphere until they build up sufficient pressure (a couple of seconds). If the compressor can spin at a lower RPM and still create sufficient pressure, you could just use a smaller drive pulley.
That's good news I believe. Here is some info on your term. It sounds like they aren't asking for additional language. Which is Good. I think? LOL "The NONCONTRIBUTORY part means that the policy will not seek contribution from any other policy in order to cover the claim. So, this policy is responsible for paying the claim to the extent of its insurance coverage. Only IF its limits are exhausted could the rest of the claim then be tendered to another party involved".
Can you have a couple of big bottles type oxygen and fill smaller from them? Not full pressure but I wonder how much you can fill before it gets to little?..
@@jorgensalomonsson6739 Yeah, scuba shops often have a large bank of cylinders. We don't have room for them. Here is Rob's setup: th-cam.com/video/f_kUjQZg5gU/w-d-xo.html
It is just like making third phase with capacitors, with uneven load on real phases makes everything ruined. This weird solution used by just 2/3 of the world - line power is capable of driving motors directly with perfect load distribution and phase shift, it is making some sense
I have the same compressor with the 9 hp Yanmar diesel. That's probably the way to go for you. The only downside is that it creates a TON of waste heat. I run it in my garage with the exhaust piped outside. I try to run it in the early mornings during the summer to mitigate some of that. I use a cheap CO monitor near the intake to make sure I don't get any CO from an unnoticed exhaust leak in my tanks. Its a great compressor I got mine military surplus (Was part of a Drone launcher) and added the filtration with the help of Alan at Max-Air.
Usually there is some sort of decompression lever on the compressor itself so you can get all the mass spinning then slowly close the lever and put it under load.
Well, that sucks! Get a nice big generator that will power the rest of the boat and the compressor. Just a thought what gauge wire is run to the motor from the generator and I would assume it's short right?
I would suggest contacting Bauer technical support. Even though you do not have a high pressure air hose connected to the air out fitting of your compressor, the Bauer filters and separators are designed to have a substantial amount of inlet air pressure at the filter BEFORE the filter will allow air into it. My guess is there is a spring loaded valve that causes this minimum pressure to develop before air is able to flow into and through the filter. You might think that you are starting the compressor without a load when you really are developing pressure through all three stages because of the filter minimum inlet pressure deal. You have an extremely high quality HP breathing air compressor but I suspect that you might simply need a dump valve installed prior to any filters and have it open to insure there is "no load" being created by the compressor stages. This may very well allow you to eliminate the electro-magnetic clutch that you installed, might also allow you to eliminate the soft start device for the motor.
@@SVSeeker I made no comment or reference to the cleanliness of "Ocean air" or its suitability for use with SCUBA. I suggest that you read the specifications for the filters installed on your compressor, primarily the larger one that contains the molecular sieve material, it also contains an activated charcoal and may contain other materials as they are available configured with a variety of different filtering agents. You will learn that the tower will NOT allow air into it until it meets a minimum pressure. I believe it is in the area of 300psi, but I would have to refer to one of my Bauer manuals to give you the exact pressure. Unless there are unloaders on each of the three cylinder heads (which there are not) the pistons start to develop pressure as soon as the crankshaft is rotated, this is why I suggested installing a dump valve before the filters to insure no pressure build. I have Bauer Tower filters on my Worthington V2A4 compressor as well as water separators for each of the three high pressure stages and a low pressure filter for the first stage. I also have electronically controlled unloaders to insure the motor is allowed to start without any load. Good luck
My AC compressor was having trouble starting due to age. They stuck another starter cap on and it's been going for 2 years since. Maybe adding another cap might reduce the starting load enough. Diesel sounds like a good option though. Have you seen that new rotary motor going around youtube. 35lbs 150 hp and up to 25k rpm. It'd be pretty neat to have one of those that runs of hydrogen produced by excess solar power.
@@SVSeeker Ah, I see. Even with that pulley ratio, wow. Could you move the clutch to the compressor side to use the inertia of the big pulley? Maybe even add some weight to it.
I had a job when I was in my teens where I worked at a Dive shop. I manned the air source and filled tanks then moved those tanks from the back of the store to the front. (Tank ape) I was constantly bleeding the water capture mechanism so no water would enter the tanks. Do you have a way of capturing the water before it goes into the tanks?
@@SVSeeker Yes, I've seen it on harbor craft all over the world. The US Navy uses it on garbage scows and other literage craft. It's really caked up on some of them. A lot cheaper than epoxy.
Going to a direct diesel makes sense from an efficiency standpoint too. Instead of going diesel -> rotation -> electricity -> rotation -> work, you’d just go diesel -> rotation -> work
@@SVSeeker are you planning on any sound deadening at all or will you just avoid the room when engines are running? Hopefully with solar and wind you won't need to run them very often at all!
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Space is tight, but is there anyway the Vmac diesel could run it directly. Off an extra pulley, shaft drive, ect?
When troubleshooting, I think about the odds, but also how easy a potential problem is to check. Yeah, the caps were not likely to be the problem, but were super easy to check.
My thought as well. The peace of mind you get by checking the easy stuff, and knowing that that is not your problem, is so worth it.
Yeah easy to check especially as a possible fix before spending time on the phone tracking down parts and milling them all to fit.
Because the odds said it was a complete waste of time. And it was.
I think its been mentioned by others but when using an Internal Combustion Engine to power a dive compressor you MUST ensure your compressor has a clean air source. CO contamination in tanks will kill. Partial pressure of CO increases with depth. No mater how careful you are with such a set up testing your tanks for CO with some like the Analytical Industries Palm CO Carbon Monoxide Analyzer would be a sensible precaution. You only need a small CO contamination to be deadly.
The Compressed Gas Association, Inc. (CGA) and the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) established a standard for air. The standard known as ANSI/CGA G-7.1-2011 requires that the compressed air in scuba tanks have 10 ppm or less of CO, or .001%. Even at recreational diving’s maximum operating depth of 130 feet/40 meters (about 5 bar/ata), the partial pressure of CO (PCO) of 10 ppm would be at an acceptable level of .005%, or equivalent to 50 ppm of CO in surface air.
A contaminated tank containing just 800 ppm of CO might not immediately present symptoms at the surface, but at a depth of 99 feet/30 meters (4 bar/ata), the same tank of air could prove deadly within 30 minutes (0.08% x 4 bar/ata = PCO 0.32 bar/ata, or equal to breathing 3,200 ppm [0.32%] of CO in surface air).
Fuck! I was going to use the exhaust to help fill the tanks. : )
@@SVSeeker You did right by checking caps. Only takes a min.
Be careful, I know of a place that filled tanks and 2 divers didn't come home. Their boat was found anchored at a reef. Divers were found dead on the bottom with tanks empty. They were only 30 ft. It was ruled ran out of air. I can free dive 30 ft.
I know that caustic acid was stored in open containers close to where the tanks were filled. I've dove for 35 years, things can go sideways quick.
Another dive shop filled tanks in a building were the intake air was on the front of the building at the parking lot.
Not to be a smart ass but be careful. A little fuck up can kill someone. SV Seeker looks good.
@@SVSeeker sarcasm goes a long way man! Really made me crack up on this one
If I remember correctly he talks about pulling the inlet air from outside the vessel for this exact reason, in an earlier video.
@@SVSeeker Sarcasm aside pilots are killed every year due to CO leaks in fully serviced aircraft. It's true that ICE powered dive compressors are often used without incident, but it only takes one gasket leak or othe inadvertent contamination of inlet air to end in tragedy. Also you mentioned on of the the advantages of powering this way is portability. Moving such set up is again not inherently doomed to cause death destruction and the end of worlds but its raises the risk. Bottom line testing your tanks is the best way to avoid any potential issues. You also have many followers and just because you are carful does not mean others may not imitate without understanding the risks. If you are the only one diving on tanks you fill do what you like, but if you are filling other peoples tanks then do the right thing and test the tanks. I am not trying to say you are doing or going to do something stupid or obviously dangerous, just pointing out this type of set up need constant vigilance. Good luck and i hope you get on the water soon.
I love the fact you never seem to get flusted when things don't work. You just go through the why and the how and figure out what the problem is, A great example of critical thinking which to many of our people don't know how to do. thank you for those real life teaching classes. Just say in RC
If you are doing enough things then you get accustomed to it. And sooner or later it will work. Failure is just a step in the process. Embrace it, and squeeze the shit out of it.
@@SVSeeker Elon Musk used this thinking to get to space. He’s one of my hero’s.
You probably already found this out, but the correct unit of measure is "microfarad" - named after Michael Faraday. Also known for the Faraday cage.
damn word for word what i was going to type lol minus my standard thanks for the video.
How many Microfarons in a Farad though?
You gotta admit, microfarons sound more fun, though... like a particle or something.
@@mattlibby4490 it just sounds wrong to me lol like looking at an obvious typo . i guess ive watched too many docs or spent too much time messing with circuits
@@MrKitesurfercharlie Each Microfaron is equal to four Macroronburgandy
Damnit! Sometimes the chase doesn't result in a catch... The diesel version may wind up as a better solution in the long run. Time will tell. I hope you had a great Christmas Doug. I also hope Santa delivers your final insurance paperwork.
Any chance of mounting the whole thing on deck ?
Thanks!
Been watching you for years you have got to be the most optimistic person I've ever seen and thanks again for that
Wow! Every video I watch I learn more and more!! But I still wonder if any human on the planet can decipher such a complicated system?? I'm kind of glad you're still on land to figure all this out! Patience might be a lifesaving blessing!
A man is truly happy when he’s working on a project
The air source for the scuba tanks is very important. You don't want foul oil stinking air. Or exhaust mixed in it.
Fuck! You mean I can't use the exhaust to help fill the tanks?
@@SVSeeker It could happen without noticing first hand.
My scuba school never had any problems with their air quality until someone parked near the compressor's air inlet and left the engine running. Some of the exhaust mixed in the air and everyone got the surprise once under water.
The boat the internet built that wont see the water
You really need to work on your self esteem.
@@SVSeeker 😂
i have a 10hp china clone diesel I will give you that I have been trying to find a use for. just have to figure out how to get it to you from NC
Patience camp might be a blessing because you are able to fix lots of small problems
Yes. But it would be more fun on the water. : )
I've been following your channel since 2018;I'm from Suriname, South America. I'm hoping for The Launch as soon as possible!!
My bet would be on how the motor works, there needs to be a Centrifugal clutch inside of the motor which disengages the start caps. Every time you engage the clutch you stall the motor and the start capacitors are get contacted again that might be cause the flickering. Worth a try would be a Time based Relay which contacts the starting caps. P.S. There are VFDs specially designed for single phase motors they aren't cheap though.
I second this idea. I bet that this is exactly what is happening. It would be an easy theory to test (and heck keep as a solution) with a simple switch inline to the start cap, once the motor is running, flip the switch to disable the start cap and engage the clutch.
Yes, I can see that as likely the cause of the flicker. ...but I much prefer the diesel engine solution.
Watching you test the compressor output with your finger made me think back to college, am I right in thinking you can blow air in to your bloodstream by putting your finger over a high pressure air pipe?
Oh god! It's not going to be possible for me to build up that kind of pressure with my finger over it. You really need to turn down the safety sally.
Haven’t watched the channel in a long time cause I fell behind and got overwhelmed. Can’t believe it’s at port finally. It’s come a damn long way because of an insane amount of people. Pretty cool.
Don't forget power factor. If that generator is a .8 PF then you can only use approximately 80% of the nameplate rating. ...but I'm sure you know that.
Same with inverters. They’re never really what they’re rated.
Just a minor technical point.. the capacity of a capacitor is expressed in FARADS not Farons
No, I'm changing it.
Hey Doug I think your opening statement about insurance means that they’re not even considering giving you insurance. Yes/no?????
How is that pessimism working out for you? : )
@@SVSeeker The best of luck to you to. May all your dreams come true.
Love seeing the whole process, setbacks included. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to ya
Doug I love your approach and that you are not defeated by the failure of an idea.
Well, that sucks the electric clutch didn't work out like we thought it would... You'll get it figured out, you always do!
Yeah, me too. And the diesel engine is on order.
Thanks for that.
I must be trying very hard lately. 😄
Keep it up
Doug, have you considered a dual use diesel like an irrigation/water pump or portable generator ? Then you would have a means of pumping serious water ( 4" dia hose ) for sinking boats and if it includes a power takeoff so it could be set up to drive the diving compressor too...
Yeah we might indeed find other uses for a small Diesel engine now that we have to have one.
I like The idea of A diesel engine that could run the compressor as well as a high-volume water pump to have on board, I think you able to move load volumes of water could come in very handy
My suggestion is you position a diesel between the compressor and second load such that you can swap loads by unhooking one belt and hooking up the other.
@@currentliveoccupant : ) Apparently it looks a lot roomier on video than it really is.
@@SVSeeker was not implying in the same space it’s in now.
I have an Akin compressor that came with a 11hp homda gas motor. When I contated the dealer they recommended a 7.4 HP electric. I didnt have one so I used a 5 HP single phase. I have used it running for almost 10 years. And certain times of the year we would fill 14 plus tanks at a time and have had no issues. You might try a 5 HP motor that the genset can power.
Might be worth it if I had one. Did you drop the pulley size?
@@SVSeeker the gas motor had a 8 in pulley and I am running a 4.5 in pulley on the 5hp electric motor.
@@SVSeeker I took the 5 HP motor off a 80 gal shop compressor.
Hey for the future. A typical three jaw universal chuck usually only holds up to .002 TIR and are often much worse. For something like this coupler where a bit of runout will cause vibration and stress on the components, use the four jaw and dial it in. Also you are assuming that the OD of the coupler is true to the bore. That may or may not be the case. Better would be to put the stub shaft in the chuck, dial it in and clamp the coupler on it. Assuming there was enough length to pull it off.
And miss the fun?
How those meters measure capacity is a known voltage over time. When they go bad they have a Internal short which causes them to take longer to charge, which makes them read higher.
"Micro Fair-ahns" that made me chuckle. Thank you for that. I love this channel and thank you for everything you do.
I don't think that's how we should spell that. :)
@@SVSeeker it's the best phonetic way I could spell it. 😁
I'm sure it's been asked already (but I didn't go back that far)... Is the starter-switch (inside motor) working? It's a centrifugal switch inside the motor that kicks the starter capacitors in/out of circuit (black caps are starting, silver cap is running). If starter-switch is bad, the motor would be trying to start on running coils alone. This would result in very low (comparitvely) torque.
Yes it is. You can hear it when the motor starts.
My experience would be with 440 volt 3-phase systems. In 1979 we start motors (40 KW and up) using "across the line" starting. When the Mechanics increased the motor load without upgrading the motor, we migrated to "Star-Delta starters" before smart motor controllers became available. An induction motor would draw a t least 300% of the nameplate current draw at start up. Your genset voltmeter seems to be relatively stable( indicating the genset is not overloading) making me wonder about the size of the conductor feeding the distribution panel and also the conductors feeding the motor. Conductor size is particularly critical in installations with long cable runs. Just my 2 cents worth.
I think the key is that it started and ran fine using grid power over the same wiring.
@@SVSeeker In that case the problem may lie on your source of power. Somebody mentioned pf (power factor). Source and load must have identical pf. Running a motor on a lower pf makes it sluggish. Even the line frequency has an effect. Combine the two????? Maybe I need more education.
Love the videos! Been watching off an of for a few years!
Thanks for the Knowledge and entertainment
Always fun and informative! Thanks!!
holly shit where did you come from
Man I really like your spirit Doug!
Thanks. It's a work in progress.
I like your lathe and milling setup
Me too. Not a lot of power, but it eventually gets the job done.
The more I fiddle with junk trying to fix stuff the more I learn that washers fix just about every problem ;)
And here I though it was a hammer.
Heppy new year sv seeker
This reminds me when I fought repairing my maytag Neptune washing machine bearings.
Hello @SV Seeker. I assume many people have already suggested you try a 10HP 3P motor paired with a VFD (like a GS4-2030 from Automation Direct). I recently did such a set-up on my home air compressor as I only have 1P (or, split phase as you say) power, but I have programmed my VFD to 'soft start' the 3P motor with my limited power supply, and then I use another setting on the VFD to alter the frequency to maintain a set Current draw at the motor. At low PSI, the motor is over-driven so I get nice fast air up to about 120PSI, but as the pressure rises, the VFD starts reducing frequency to keep current to the motor constant (and within my available power supply) , all the way up to my pressure switch cut-out. I get maximum possible air flow given my power supply. No clutches, and the 3P has way more torque than a 1P motor for turning a compressor while starting up. You could avoid the nuisance of clutches or blow off valves that you will need with a diesel.
A split phase to 3 phase vfd would work great, obviously with a 3 phase motor.
Yeah, I was thinking this would be a good idea too, especially since you could have different programmed power limits (and therefore speeds) for running it off the inverters, 10K gen, VMAC or some other source. I'm sure it's already been mentioned, so Doug must have some specific reason for wanting to go down the diesel engine route
Absolutely! When will your check arrive?
@@SVSeeker Haha fair enough.
It would be good if you could find a motor and inverter for a good price on industrial surplus or used, but as you said the diesel engine route has its own advantages too.
@Fluffy Hamster What's your point? You could most likely run it on 1KW or less if you ran it slow enough through a VFD.
The Compressor doesn't *need* 10HP to work, that's just what it needs to run at full rated speed.
Just go with the flow, as you usually do (there must be a end reason). A sailing channel fought years trying to make a DYI generator work, to finally give-in to a production unit.
I bet they learned a hell of a lot over that time.
Hey Doug try adding another 50uf capacitor beside the other. That may give you that extra oomf needed to start that compressor. Just tie it in parallel to the other run capacitor. The wrapped capacitors are start capacitors and the silver one is a run capacitor or can be used as a start run capacitor. I think it's worth a shot and they aren't very expensive and can be there quick on Amazon.
It's not a problem with getting the motor started. The problem is when the load is added.
@@SVSeeker yes that I understand but the capacitor will give it that oomph needed to carry on and get the compressor moving. That's why I suggested it. That motor is needing a second of pulling probably 50 amps just to get the compressor moving but the capacitor will reduce that need.
Do not launch your ship until you install your fishing pole holders and trolling outriggers!
What are you going to eat every day hamburgers?
well done with the clutch Doug.
Sure. Been better if it worked routinely. ...but now that I have it, I may add it to the diesel engine that is on it's way.
@@SVSeeker I guess if you go diesel you will need a new flue for the gasses but it will be really portable.
audience: Why is'nt Seeker launched yet? Doug: County issues *but in reality it is because the scuba compressor is'nt working*
Yeah that’s it. :)
Hi Doug - it was my bet that you were trying to encourage.😉 But elimination is an important part of fault finding so well done for actually taking the few minutes to test those capacitors to establish a fact.👍
He asked me for a bet too 🙂, what I learned from training and experience is to start troubleshooting with the easiest and cheaper options, but is just me I don't live enough.
And also a waste of time.
@@SVSeeker Fault finding needs patience and logic, definitive elimination is not a waste of time.😉
@@SVSeeker that's time well spent, you weren't sure that they are good because you tested them,
So if your machining in the boat, wouldn't all the chips fall down under and clog the bilge pumps? Is there a filter for the pump? I bet cleaning all that out is a real pain
Only if you're that slob that does not sweep up.
10 years from now..........................yep, we are getting closer to launch. Now I just need my doctor to give me the green light to leave the nursing home to watch it put in the water.
The value of the capacitor can read correctly but still have bleed through.
It's call cognitive dissonance when you just can not let go of an idea despite of the evidence.
That 3rd stage on your Bauer, needs to have high pressure to operate. Thats why compressor starts with funny noises, and why you shouldnt run it with no hose on, for anything but few seconds. Its pretty low position where you put it, you need space under compressor, for condensation water tank/bottle. I advise mounting automatic manifolds for this discharge, as you probably wont be hanging out near compressor, when its running.... yeah, I filled up 10s of 1000s of scuba tanks in my time.
Hey Doug , interesting video. Do you have enough hydraulic power to run the compressor? Could solve all sorts of problems. Cheers Warren
No. The main engine pump might be big enough but that way too big of an engine to be running.
🌻Thanks Doug, you give me patience. I’m trying to make my boiler run nice and it will happen. 🌻Kind Regards Chris Petkau
Glad to here that. Not everything works, but it's all educational.
Doug, Have a Happy New Year!
Thanks 👍
Start your generator with the generator breaker off, the brown out effect can destroy even LED lights, anything turned on etc.
Let's just see. : )
All said and done hope you have a well ventilated compartments
Did you fart? That was you?
Is the 10hp diesel's exhaust going to be plumbed into the main exhaust piping?
Yes, I'll likely just connect it to the condensate trap.
My name is Ronald Simonis and was a Bauer dialer for 20 years and during that period I had to put down many dive shops in the use of a generator.
I am familiar with the problems you experience with the compressor when it is connected to a generator.
When the compressor is switched on, the electromotor requires full power, if this is 7 Amp. the generator must supply 7 amp. when the compressor is switched on, which the generator does not do.
The reason for this is that the speed of the generator is too low and that it takes too long for the generator to get up to speed to deliver the 7 Amp.
The best way to solve this is to put a petrol or diesel engine in front of the compressor. The soft start has no influence on the speed of the generator, but on the speed of the electric motor of the compressor
Exactly my thoughts. To the designs credit it runs fine off grid power. And that 10hp diesel is on it's way.
Was always skeptical about the lathe/mill set up but that worked perfectly. Pretty useful for its footprint on the boat.
I think it will be fantastic. Wish it was more powerful but it beats the hell out of the mini-lath I started on.
@@SVSeeker you should be able to do anything a larger more powerful setup should it will just take more time and or thought
Hi Doug, don't put your dive compressor on deck unless you have a very shaded area. Scuba Tanks can become very finicky charging in direct sunlight. Always charge below decks and store below decks. Many blessing to get in the water soon from Northern Israel. Keep the sails up and the keels under water in all your travels, nice job.
Actually the plan is to have the tanks hanging in the water if possible. Or in the bath tub that is on deck.
Perseverance pays off!
Sooner or later. : )
I think this wasn't a fail, it was just an education. You know now more than you did, the motor worked, the clutch got working, the generator worked. They just weren't right for each other. And the pictures of all the stuff viewers and followers did, makes me so happy. You people have done great things. Keep on doing that.
How will you exhaust it? How does one exhaust a small engine in a contained space? Something like a dryer hose?
Likely just connect it to the main dry stack or us flex pipe and hang it out a porthole.
Troubleshooting sometimes is knowing what parts are good before you know which ones are bad.
That was awesome to watch. Now it’s time for a sandwich. Keep on keeping on!
I think lol, non-contributory means regardless if you have more then one insurance at the end if you need to clame you will have to given up their right to any proportion of contribution from any other insurance policy available and can clame from the primary insurance only.
Yeah, I did the google search too. : )
GREAT JOB MY MAN!
You're such an inspiration!
We used to use bronze keyways for safety,when something would bind the brass keyway would give,new supervisor told us to use steel keyways,and oh boy we destroyed allot of expensive machinery.😱😱😅
Trane condenser units normally have two caps for the compressor. The run cap would be like a a 35/5 and the hard start cap would be 160+.
Ok, but the motor is not having a problem starting. It's problem is taking the load.
if you take an old socket extension and grind it a hair, you can make a serviceable back-up chuck key on the quick and dirty.
I considered that but I have my new tools at the boat. So I ground down the screw driver. : )
Hey Doug! A triple phase motor with a Frequency Inverter will work a lot better !
One thing to have in mind is that single phase motors have very little starting torque, so your idea of adding the clutch was perfect to overcome this. (btw, I personally had never seen a frequency inverter working with a single phase motor + capacitors, so I might have missed some important info)
Another thing to have in mind is that maybe your capacitors are too small for the load surge you're having when you engage the clutch, usually single phase motors have a "starter" and a "Permanent" capacitor and you'll need to decouple the "starter" once you've reached full speed. You may be able to fix your problem this by adding a "starter" capacitor that only engages once you go below a certain RPM (not sure if it will work but you may give it a try if you wish to give this motor another chance! There are relays made specifically for this purpose, I'm not sure how they're called in english but in portuguese we call them "Relê ALNICO")
And regarding the 6Amps you're seeing while not loaded, that's quite a lot for its power, but it's fine as it has capacitors. If you replace it with a true triple phase motor, you'll reduce this a lot, it'll be a lot more efficient.
Most Frequency inverters are able to change a single phase input to a triple phase output, but that will depend on the power/size of the inverter (E.g.: CFW03 made by WEG, a Brazilian company)
I used to work fixing frequency inverters in a company and later on I worked on Atlas Copco, designing the electrical system for Diesel powered air compressors, so I might be able to give you a little help :)
If I missed some point or said anything wrong, sorry about it! I had watch the video real quick and without audio
Absolutely. When will your check get here? And I think soft start is a ramp of the voltage, nothing doing with the frequency so it works on single phase or 3 phase.
@@SVSeeker oh boy I really wish I could go there and help you! But now I'm living in the Netherlands and my wife would be really mad at me for going so far hahaha
I don't have much experience with soft starters, only with frequency inverters, so I had to study a little bit and you are absolutely correct! Soft starters will reduce voltage while not changing the frequency. I think that can be one of the causes of your problems, as you're essentially reducing power/torque.
With frequency inverters you wouldn't have this problem as you'd be changing only the RPM, without messing around too much with the torque/power
@@SVSeeker ooh btw, now I understood better, you're using a soft starter on a single phase motor, right? I got a bit confused on my first comment
thinking a push bearing and some sort of spring tensioner for the belt reduce friction and belt slipping ?
Definitely a prick of a challenge. Your perseverance is good to see though!
Had a similar setup at an off grid paintball place. Might have been a 20kVA genny and a 7.5kW electric compressor, three phase. It was direct online so tripped out the electronic protection on the generator (undervoltage) most times you'd try to start it. Had to drop the under voltage limit, and crank up the generator output voltage to get it to start reliably.
The other issue they had is that generator was running the whole site, and when the compressor was off it might have had a fridge and a few lights on it. I only went back there once but I heard along the grapevine the genny caught on fire (my guess would have been from running with no load for a majority of the time). They replaced it with... a bigger genny.
If I played my cards right I'd have put the compressor on a 3 phase soft starter as the generator ran it fine, just couldn't start it. VFD would have been too expensive. But alas they didn't want to spend the money and it cost them a generator in the end.
Good luck!
Hi Doug could the VMAC run a hydraulic motor to run this? Sure if you know the specs the vmac is putting out you could calculate the hyd motor needed or I could do this for you. Could also determine if it’s possible with the pressure and flow of the VMAC pump.
That pump is too small.
I wish the insurance company would hurry up. Ive watched from the beginning. Whats seekers 1st mission ?
Learn to sail. : )
@@SVSeeker Hahaha Doug lol
Just a thought but does the compressor have a dump valve so the motor can ramp up to speed before a load is placed on it. I suppose a 3 phase motor would be better suited to the compressor then a vfd could be used to adjust starting torque
No, it's not connected to tanks so there is no pressure building up. And I'd try a 3 phase if I had on but my 3 phase generator is only 8K so I think I'd be back in the same spot. We'll give the 10hp diesel a go first.
I don't know anything about Scuba compressors, but the can't be too much different from air tool compressors.
Do they have a head pressure release for easier starting ? Using a clutch on a electric motor is "unusual".
Some air compresses vent to atmosphere until they build up sufficient pressure (a couple of seconds).
If the compressor can spin at a lower RPM and still create sufficient pressure, you could just use a smaller drive pulley.
That is the difference. They do not start under load.
Well it sucks that the electric setup for the compressor was a bust.
On the plus side, we can now install a tool box underneath the vice bench.
Howdy Eric. No. I think I'll keep it there. At least to start with.
Why don't you just gear it down a smidge? Does the compressor have a minimum rpm that you are just barely making?
Yeah, that would work, but I really want to be able to fill an 80 in 9 minutes.
hey if that black thing with the pully going to spin is that cable going to rip off there?
th-cam.com/video/dmz9BkmKOl8/w-d-xo.html
That's good news I believe. Here is some info on your term. It sounds like they aren't asking for additional language. Which is Good. I think? LOL "The NONCONTRIBUTORY part means that the policy will not seek contribution from any other policy in order to cover the claim. So, this policy is responsible for paying the claim to the extent of its insurance coverage. Only IF its limits are exhausted could the rest of the claim then be tendered to another party involved".
Yeah, I googled it too. Thanks. : )
@@SVSeeker Yep got me curious and had to do a quick google and maybe save the next poor ignorant like myself some googling.
How much hydraulic power do you have? A hydraulic motor to drive the compressor?
Only 6 gpm at 2000 psi off the VMAC. We have a bigger pump on the main, but that would be very inefficient to run that thing.
@@SVSeeker If you don’t have enough bottles till next calm😄
Can you have a couple of big bottles type oxygen and fill smaller from them? Not full pressure but I wonder how much you can fill before it gets to little?..
@@jorgensalomonsson6739 Yeah, scuba shops often have a large bank of cylinders. We don't have room for them. Here is Rob's setup: th-cam.com/video/f_kUjQZg5gU/w-d-xo.html
Don't give up, cheers
No worries. Dad was a bulldog.
Imagine 3 phase power and delta/star switching as needed with two contractors :3
It is just like making third phase with capacitors, with uneven load on real phases makes everything ruined. This weird solution used by just 2/3 of the world - line power is capable of driving motors directly with perfect load distribution and phase shift, it is making some sense
I have the same compressor with the 9 hp Yanmar diesel. That's probably the way to go for you. The only downside is that it creates a TON of waste heat. I run it in my garage with the exhaust piped outside. I try to run it in the early mornings during the summer to mitigate some of that. I use a cheap CO monitor near the intake to make sure I don't get any CO from an unnoticed exhaust leak in my tanks. Its a great compressor I got mine military surplus (Was part of a Drone launcher) and added the filtration with the help of Alan at Max-Air.
Yeah. I got a Chinese 10 Hp on the way. I'll trade it for a Yanmar when I find one on a sinking boat.
Usually there is some sort of decompression lever on the compressor itself so you can get all the mass spinning then slowly close the lever and put it under load.
good vid again sir, cheers
No wonder it won’t start, there must be a depressurization valve somewhere, it’ll kill the motor if you try starting the compressor at full pressure
Why is the paint a different color under the capacitors? Looks like that maybe a refurbished electric motor. Maybe a time for a new motor.
You're just guessing now. It's brand new with less than 20 hours and runs the compressor fine when connected to grid power.
Well, that sucks! Get a nice big generator that will power the rest of the boat and the compressor.
Just a thought what gauge wire is run to the motor from the generator and I would assume it's short right?
Thank you for testing the caps. A missed diagnostic test keeps me awake at night. Merry Christmas!
I play the odds and sleep very well. :)
I would suggest contacting Bauer technical support. Even though you do not have a high pressure air hose connected to the air out fitting of your compressor, the Bauer filters and separators are designed to have a substantial amount of inlet air pressure at the filter BEFORE the filter will allow air into it. My guess is there is a spring loaded valve that causes this minimum pressure to develop before air is able to flow into and through the filter. You might think that you are starting the compressor without a load when you really are developing pressure through all three stages because of the filter minimum inlet pressure deal. You have an extremely high quality HP breathing air compressor but I suspect that you might simply need a dump valve installed prior to any filters and have it open to insure there is "no load" being created by the compressor stages. This may very well allow you to eliminate the electro-magnetic clutch that you installed, might also allow you to eliminate the soft start device for the motor.
There is no load without tanks attached, and it's hard to find cleaner air than ocean air. : )
@@SVSeeker I made no comment or reference to the cleanliness of "Ocean air" or its suitability for use with SCUBA. I suggest that you read the specifications for the filters installed on your compressor, primarily the larger one that contains the molecular sieve material, it also contains an activated charcoal and may contain other materials as they are available configured with a variety of different filtering agents. You will learn that the tower will NOT allow air into it until it meets a minimum pressure. I believe it is in the area of 300psi, but I would have to refer to one of my Bauer manuals to give you the exact pressure. Unless there are unloaders on each of the three cylinder heads (which there are not) the pistons start to develop pressure as soon as the crankshaft is rotated, this is why I suggested installing a dump valve before the filters to insure no pressure build. I have Bauer Tower filters on my Worthington V2A4 compressor as well as water separators for each of the three high pressure stages and a low pressure filter for the first stage. I also have electronically controlled unloaders to insure the motor is allowed to start without any load.
Good luck
Is the CNC's computer secured? It'd suck if it fell when Seeker is put in the water
There is time. : )
My AC compressor was having trouble starting due to age. They stuck another starter cap on and it's been going for 2 years since. Maybe adding another cap might reduce the starting load enough. Diesel sounds like a good option though. Have you seen that new rotary motor going around youtube. 35lbs 150 hp and up to 25k rpm. It'd be pretty neat to have one of those that runs of hydrogen produced by excess solar power.
Starting is not the problem. It's adding the load after it has started.
@@SVSeeker Ah, I see. Even with that pulley ratio, wow. Could you move the clutch to the compressor side to use the inertia of the big pulley? Maybe even add some weight to it.
I had a job when I was in my teens where I worked at a Dive shop. I manned the air source and filled tanks then moved those tanks from the back of the store to the front. (Tank ape) I was constantly bleeding the water capture mechanism so no water would enter the tanks. Do you have a way of capturing the water before it goes into the tanks?
Yes the Max-Air has traps and drain valves the do that automatically. "Tank Ape" -- I'm going to use that one. :)
Hey, that paint job is looking a bit faded. Is it getting a bit weather-worn, or just a play of light on the boat?
It's coal tar, and that's what it does. It's used on work boats and barges.
@@SVSeeker Yes, I've seen it on harbor craft all over the world. The US Navy uses it on garbage scows and other literage craft. It's really caked up on some of them. A lot cheaper than epoxy.
@@BarnacleBilltheSailor Exactly. Cheap and durable. Not a vanity boat coating.
How about hydraulic motors instead? Or would that not be fast enough or powerful enough through a belt reduction
I don't have a pump big enough for that.
Clutch idea worked then!
About 50% of the time :)
Please give some thought to securing you pc case to the right of the CNC. That thing will go flying when you hit waves.
There is time. : )
Going to a direct diesel makes sense from an efficiency standpoint too. Instead of going diesel -> rotation -> electricity -> rotation -> work, you’d just go diesel -> rotation -> work
Yes. Especially given that it should run off an engine less than 1/3 the size of the generator.
is it as loud in there as it sounds with the vmac going?
That was the 10K running, not the VMAC but they are about the same. I think the main engine is a bit louder. ....but yeah, that's full volume.
@@SVSeeker are you planning on any sound deadening at all or will you just avoid the room when engines are running? Hopefully with solar and wind you won't need to run them very often at all!