The SAM wouldn't have caught the F22 and would have been taken out almost immediately by the Raptor or the Himar. That was the USA being kind to Russia. The conversation wasn't, "Please turn off your SAM system." The conversation was, "Listen turn off the SAM or kiss it goodbye and face the embarrassment."
While the main reason both for asking the SAM to be turned off and it actually being turned off was diplomatic. I wouldn't be so sure the SAM wouldn't have been able to inflict casualties before being destroyed. The F22 were probably safe, but I doubt they had anti-radiation missiles equipped or on hand, while the helicopters and the F15s would have been vulnerable. And I use the term probably because it doesn't matter how stealthy your aircraft is if you are complacent about it and leave the weapon bay open, like the Nighthawk did in Yugoslavia.
@@Muaddibize agreed it might have scored a kill but then it would have died for sure and not much else would have changed and that's assuming it's best himars and apaches are pretty dang accurate also tat the end of the video is kinda nil cause the usa does have plans and ability to simply destroy AA networks and as recent events have shown russian AA isn't that competant and likley would fall in the usual way
@@Muaddibize Its difficult to believe that aircraft in the vacinity of SAMs don't have HARMs available. If the SAMs hadn't been turn off they'd been taken out before anything vulnerable had been exposed. And now... we know they just aren't that good and are vulnerable to even the lowest level tech.
@@Muaddibize anti-radiation missiles? What do you mean about Yugoslavia? How do you know so much information? I would like to know why USA only cared about an oilfield and did not help the beleaguered Syrians who have been bombarded for years and I don't know how any are still alive. Reportedly, the devilish Syrian leader Assad used Russian support to flatten what was left of the opposition's buildings and infrastructure, much as they did in Chechnya - and now Ukraine. Then some of the Syrian refugees in Turkey were killed in sub-standard housing on earthquake fault lines.
Three things the US tends do better than anyone else: Counterbattery, SEAD (suppress enemy air defense), and Night Ops We do need to gear up faster to counter mass, cheap drones ourselves though....without spending every last penny on fancy pants, overpriced, too-few to deploy Raytheon & BAE countersystems.
@@WindFireAllThatKindOfThing I'd assume the US military is already working on anti-drone capabilities, if not already having Ukraine try some of our earlier stuff.
@@RognornYT Exactly this! The United States is, and has always been, AHEAD OF THE GLOBAL DRONE GAME! We were using combat-caliber drones to bomb Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan 25 years ago, before most countries even had any idea what Drones actually were!
@@RognornYT Oh sure, but they're all big ticket platforms with outrageous pricetags and physical dimensions that won't see widespread use at the Platoon level or below on patrol until enough bodies have piled up high to get the message across to AMC that we need cheap, man portable solutions to deploy en masse. Otherwise they're useless anywhere but guarding some Brigade TOC on a FOB
The way I heard the story was more succinct. The group of Marines detected the Russian column and the American liaison contacted the Russians saying that a Russian column was approaching. The Russian replied that there were no Russians in that area, and the American replied,"Understood." After the bombs and shells had stopped and the smoke cleared away, the area was checked and the consensus was there wasn't even an ant left alive. The American again contacted the Russians and said, "You were correct. We checked and there aren't any Russians in this area." The Russian didn't reply, just hung up his phone.
The SAM system would have just been taken out had the russians declined to shut it down. The US told them as much when they made the phone call. The response would have taken a bit longer but not by much.There was only one system in that area and the US knew exactly where it was.
M48, M57, M57E1 or even M39A1 ATACMS all have a max range of 300KM. S300 and S400 both have a coverage radius of around 40KM, so they'd have been positioned near enough to Kasham to be within easy reach of ATACMS, and probably most GMLRS rockets (I misspoke about GLSDB earlier). The F-22 and F-15E would be more than a match for the Su-34s on standby. The radar on the Sukhoi would be able to get a lock on the F-15E, so they'd be focused on them while the Raptors were lining up kill shots.
I’m guessing any F22s are still trying to not get too involved. Probably around for electronic support and other passive support, otherwise Russia would probably use the su57 etc and then we have all out war between US and them with both using primary forces… and it’s clear that both us and them intend to use only the most disposable forces possible, kinda like politicians
This was the amount of support 50 US servicemembers could call in on the other side of the planet, that is less than half a platoon. Imagine what a Division could call in... or God forbid, an entire Corps.
The main issue is sustainability. At least when you're not blowing away some third world country. What pace can be sustained by US industrial infrastructure? Currently not great.
I kept laughing as he brought up more and more firepower. "reaper drone,tube artillery, 4 apache helis, 30 mm cannons eliminating 200, ac-130 gunships, b-52 bombers, f-15s, f-22s". Like America just gave them the tiniest sprinkle of our All-Purpose seasoning.
The issue with the s.a.m. wasn't the inability to operate in its presence, it was the political ramifications and escalation taking it out would cause.
Putler seems to have something in common with Adolfo Hilter - he thinks that generals know nothing and that he, and only he can make the right decisions. The road seems to only go one way - downhill.
Wagner never had the touch to begin with. It's much the same with the Russian army in Ukraine, using old equipment, a core of better trained soldiers and waves of meat in the form of convicts, and no regard for your own casualties.
The US knew about the SAM site. The US had aircraft that it used against opposition in the theatre, and included the most advanced fighter in the US inventory. Therefore, you may take it as a given that there were SAM suppression systems such as HARM missiles immediately available. The call to the Russians was very likely underscored by the fact that the alternative to not shutting down the SAM site was to lose it.
Turning off that s300/400 SAM system was a win win scenario. Uncle Sam didn't have to waste time and money on a SEAD run, and Ivan didn't lose their expensive SAM system.
I was almost leaning towards the idea that they COULDN'T turn it on....some Major Boris might've sold the power cord to plug it in for Vodka and Hooker money
Before the attack: Russian to his American counterpart- "There are NO Russian forces in the area". After the attack: American to his Russian counterpart- "Confirmation; there ARE no Russian forces in the area". 😂
The US would perhaps be somewhat delayed in the rescue of their countrymen if needed to take down the SAM battery first, but the outcome in this instance would likely have been the same. The problem though is what consequences it might have give, in a wider confrontation between US and Russia as a result of the open hostility.
Russia would have gotten its' ass kicked by the United States, rather than what they are currently undergoing in Ukraine. And Russia KNOWS THIS! They may talk a big game, but their actual game is... pretty mediocre.
No, it would have been obliterated within the same time frame of everything else that was sent to provide aide. A cruise missile would have been launched from the Persian Gulf which is where the 5th fleet resides.
We've already seen Russias air defense system is a joke. Surely the US air superiority would destroy those systems and though a delay in ground support they wouldn't prove too much of a hassle.
Nope, F-22's would have taken out the SAM systems using HARMS. Russian SAMs are not capable of getting a lock or shooting down a Raptor. Then the US would have destroyed all Russian aircraft in the vicinity. More difficult? Yes. But doable by the US. This must have been conveyed to the Russians during the phone call to convince them it would be better to turn off their SAMs.
Uh. I dont think the raptor is as invincible as some beleive but the japanese really really want it and theyre about at technologicly advanced as countries get. I know its against the law to sell raptors but i feel we should give them something close. Ithink we should produce some yf23 and share some to only our closest allies. Maybe help pay for em by increasing production numbers most likley lowering individual cost
@@Qbgarden the reason we don't sell them is because it would be near impossible to shoot them down of one of our allies betrayed us a good example of this is during ww2 when Japan withdrew from the Washington naval treaty and since the Japanese navy was trained by the British navy they were some of the best in the world which is why the us struggled against the Japanese navy in the early stages of the war
I wish the RU SAM system would have stayed on and operational.......that would have made this battle even more special. We have seen what HIMARS has done to RU Sam's in UKR.......
If only Czar and greatest of Great Khans Putin could see this video, and actually understand the content. He is, however the kind of ruler that Machiavelli castigated and warned against. Putin thinks that menacing NATO is a winning strategy, when that means facing not only the US but Sweden, Finland, Poland and possibly Japan as well. Russia is a pigmy pretending to be a Goliath, and Putin fases not only the world's dominant military [the US] but countries that have a hatred of Russia from before the US even existed. The Poles remember Russian partitions, occupations and atrocities, and would very much like their winged hussars, now in tanks, to re-occupy Moscow. The Swedes and Finns as well remember Russian occupations and territorial seizures, and have their own desire to rectify the past. All of the countries on Russia's borders would dearly like to teach Russia the meaning of "Do not do to others what you would not want others to do to you." Russia complains about others disliking and attacking them, but they could easily change that by abandoning their bad behavior.
As to the SAM sites, one version of the story I heard was that the Americans asked the Russians if they had any troops operating in the area. The Russians said "no", because they still felt like they could keep Wagner as a secret associate. The Americans then said "Cool, we're conducting close air support operations at the spot you don't have any guys, so pretty please don't point your SAMs at us." The Americans didn't necessarily 'convince' the Russians not to fire their missiles, but the Russians trapped themselves into not supporting the Wagner elements.
Batlte Of Kasham is basically Command and Conquer Generals Running the Airforce General with FULL UPGRADES and Dumping everything on a massive enemy formation outside your base!
What I found most impressive was the lengths Western Media went to keep the story on the down-low. It approaches almost Cover-Up so as not to Inflame Tensions territory. Somebody high up in the White House musta made some phone calls and threats to keep this story about US and Russians in conflict out of the headlines.
The F-22s were no doubt providing 'high-cover' and watching that russian air base. I doubt if the U.S. 'asked' that the SAM system be turned off > more like, 'turn it off or lose it to drones.
The air defenses that Russia had would have only delayed what happened. HARM missiles could have taken those out and then the US would have had the same advantages. It would have slowed the drone and Apache attacks but the F-22s and F-35s could have gotten in and knocked those out. I don't know if this would have been in time to help the soldiers but I'm sure a few missiles could have been spared to slow their advance.
A single volley of ATACMS would have taken it out no problem. So the delay would have been insignificant. The US would just have held back some of the aircraft and relied on himars and stealth fighters to prevent any advancement until the AA system was kaput.
We haven't seen this since the Falaise Pocket during the Normandy Campaign in the Western Front during WWII when US and the Allies crushed the German Forces.
Correction: while there was a pocket, U.S. and British commanders wanted to avoid friendly fire, leaving a gap wide enough for hundreds of thousands of Germans to escape.
I agree with some of the other commenters here, I doubt the SAM would have been capable of doing more than take a couple Reapers drones out at best before one of them took it out, long before the manned aircraft entered the scene. I imagine Reapers are either far better now or already have a replacement in the works and would be effective against multiple SAMs working together, especially if they are being operated like they have been in both Ukraine and in Russia itself.
The US knew where the SAMS were. As has been shown in Ukraine, even their best systems are open to attack. With Stealth fighters, drones, and even cruise missiles, fixed assets like a SAM site are easy prey for US weapons.
That makes no sense. They denied there were Russian troops in that area. Even if they had refused to deactivate the Sams, it would be obvious they were lying and the USAF would just wipe out those Sams then proceed to wiping out the Wagner group. Maybe an extra few minutes wasted but the outcome was the same non the less.
That SAM system wouldn't have lasted 10 minutes against F-22, F-35 and A-10 attacking them. If there was a near peer battle... that SAM was the first casualty period.
I'm sure the HIMARS on standby near Kasham had ATACMs in the arsenal alongside GLSDB munitions, and as we've seen in combat in Ukraine, S300, S400 and S500 have proven incapable of reliably intercepting ATACMS or GLSDB, so if the Russians had not acceded to the State Department request to turn off the SAM radars, the results would have been similar. And that's before factoring in the presence of F-22 and F-15E in theater. The F-15 is more than capable of wild weasel missions, and while low band radar on Russian SAMS would let them know that a stealth aircraft is in the area, the high band radar needed to acquire a firing solution would only have a brief window to acquire a lock, when the weapon bay doors on the Raptor open up to release their ordnance, by which time they're as good as dead.
In an actual confrontation between US and Russian forces, the real question is whether the Russians would be willing to switch _on_ their SAMs in the first place. I have to imagine that after the first few days and hundreds of US SEAD strikes, even a force as comically incompetent as the Russians would probably figure out to keep that radar switched off.
The last part of this video forgets that before the start of the Gulf War, Iraq had one of the most robust air defense systems in the world. The opening days of the air war consisted of stealth and specialty aircraft dismantling that system and then the rest of the air campaign was unopposed air dominance.
If the Russian SAMs were not deactivated (being that they were Russian), they’d have just been another target, and it’d have been a wider conflict. As you said, when it was clear to Russia that Wagner Group was attempting to engage American forces (perhaps unwittingly) Wagner was left without Russian support and twisting in the wind, as they weren’t regular military.
If the US couldn’t take out the SAMs for some reason it would have changed the battle. However that would have revealed that it was the Russians attacking and that was an act of war.
That's saying something about their confidence in the airspace. Spookies and Spectres are very, very vulnerable to even obsolete MANPADS and antique anti air guns, to say nothing of modern, full size missile systems
@@davebeins2593 I met a guy on a job a while ago who is every definition of the word gun nut. I'm the same way but with computers. So we were kind of information brokering: you teach me guns I'll teach you hardware. And one of the first things he told me was "if your gun collection cannot be described as an 'arsenal': you need more guns.". 🤣
Russian army cheif had a beef with Wagner before so he was the one giving American greenlight to attack Wagner and Wagner wasn't under Russian in Syria
For the same reason we have to move our artillery batteries after almost every fire mission: Because you'll catch counterfire in moments. Active radar systems are shockingly vulnerable and like turning on a giant spotlight to the sky when you flip the power switch.
it´s easy to say that you won a fight when you have 3 plus attack helicopters all special forces of the US and artillery against 500 plus poorly trained men and some shitty early age bmp´s .
@@owen-trombone Afghanistan and the area the Taliban would retreat to in Pakistan would take a severe turn into the depths of wholesale genocide to achieve anything resembling "victory". It's not a good looking scenario. But, The Bush administration had to look like it was "Doing Something" so stuck the US and it's military into a land that is largely unchanged for the last couple of thousand years and likely remain as it is for the next couple of thousand. It's pretty much the way the Allies defeated the Nazis and the Japanese empire. It's kind of frowned upon these days. Civilian casualties in the millions, I mean.
Messing with members of special forces of the United States is BAD for your overall health! As these Wagner Group & their friends are about to learn. Let's face it some people have to learn the hard way. These troops are very well trained! And are overall BAD asses...... SAM's in Vietnam where dealt with by Wild Weasels.
I don't understand how this channel can pump out such vast amounts of content so quickly, it worries me about how much research could possibly be being put into each one when they come so fast. Like when a restaurant brings your food too quickly...
The Danish F-16s and the Ukrainian pilots will have trained to be able to control a completely different air force, as everyone knows, Ukraine was part of the old Soviet Union, and therefore it was limited how many Fighter Jets Ukraine had, and they were, after all, old Russian built MIGs, but now the Danish F-16 and the newly trained Ukrainian pilots, and the rumor says they are already in the air at the front, and because the old Danish F-16 fighters are being modernized, they are doing fantastically against the Russians MIG's or the few Russians have actually left!
An anti-radiation missile (ARM) is a missile designed to detect and home in on an enemy radio emission source. Typically, these are designed for use against an enemy radar, although jammers and even radios used for communications can also be targeted in this manner.
What is important to note though is that Wagner was NOT taken out but actually became even more important in Ukraine. It took Putin to take out Prigozhin. I don't understand why militaries never seem to look into the future when fighting their conflicts.
Everyone talking F22 but I like to think the Apaches would of just taken out the anti air defenses, though this approach would be a different event, a different battle but I’m sure the results would be the same
If our people knew what we had it would scare the hell out of us my kin were Navy people what they told me and they didn’t know all i know,but what they said back then it scares me for all the world…
Ukraine is developing low cost drone capability at an incredible rate. They simply knock up another idea and see what happens. Anything useful gets better engineering until the next idea comes along. The Raytheon/BAe cost plus method will never keep up.
If Russia had used their SAM system they would have 1 less SAM system.
Not just one. The US has an escalated deterrent police that dates back to the Regan administration.
@@twelvewingproductions7508 yeah good point.
I watched another video on this and it said if they had not turned them off US was prepared to use cruise missiles from nearby ships
The SAM wouldn't have caught the F22 and would have been taken out almost immediately by the Raptor or the Himar. That was the USA being kind to Russia. The conversation wasn't, "Please turn off your SAM system." The conversation was, "Listen turn off the SAM or kiss it goodbye and face the embarrassment."
While the main reason both for asking the SAM to be turned off and it actually being turned off was diplomatic. I wouldn't be so sure the SAM wouldn't have been able to inflict casualties before being destroyed. The F22 were probably safe, but I doubt they had anti-radiation missiles equipped or on hand, while the helicopters and the F15s would have been vulnerable. And I use the term probably because it doesn't matter how stealthy your aircraft is if you are complacent about it and leave the weapon bay open, like the Nighthawk did in Yugoslavia.
@@Muaddibize agreed it might have scored a kill but then it would have died for sure and not much else would have changed and that's assuming it's best himars and apaches are pretty dang accurate also tat the end of the video is kinda nil cause the usa does have plans and ability to simply destroy AA networks and as recent events have shown russian AA isn't that competant and likley would fall in the usual way
@@Muaddibize Its difficult to believe that aircraft in the vacinity of SAMs don't have HARMs available. If the SAMs hadn't been turn off they'd been taken out before anything vulnerable had been exposed. And now... we know they just aren't that good and are vulnerable to even the lowest level tech.
They're more worried about HARM missiles exploding those SAM sites.
@@Muaddibize anti-radiation missiles? What do you mean about Yugoslavia? How do you know so much information? I would like to know why USA only cared about an oilfield and did not help the beleaguered Syrians who have been bombarded for years and I don't know how any are still alive. Reportedly, the devilish Syrian leader Assad used Russian support to flatten what was left of the opposition's buildings and infrastructure, much as they did in Chechnya - and now Ukraine. Then some of the Syrian refugees in Turkey were killed in sub-standard housing on earthquake fault lines.
If that S400 was not shut down, the HIMARS would have paid it a visit. Make no mistake.
Three things the US tends do better than anyone else: Counterbattery, SEAD (suppress enemy air defense), and Night Ops
We do need to gear up faster to counter mass, cheap drones ourselves though....without spending every last penny on fancy pants, overpriced, too-few to deploy Raytheon & BAE countersystems.
@@WindFireAllThatKindOfThing I'd assume the US military is already working on anti-drone capabilities, if not already having Ukraine try some of our earlier stuff.
@@RognornYT Exactly this! The United States is, and has always been, AHEAD OF THE GLOBAL DRONE GAME! We were using combat-caliber drones to bomb Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan 25 years ago, before most countries even had any idea what Drones actually were!
@@RognornYT Oh sure, but they're all big ticket platforms with outrageous pricetags and physical dimensions that won't see widespread use at the Platoon level or below on patrol until enough bodies have piled up high to get the message across to AMC that we need cheap, man portable solutions to deploy en masse. Otherwise they're useless anywhere but guarding some Brigade TOC on a FOB
I think it was some coward stuff because it was 500 to 50
Even if they were cleared to help, the ending would stay the same. They saved themselves some real embarrassment that day.
The way I heard the story was more succinct. The group of Marines detected the Russian column and the American liaison contacted the Russians saying that a Russian column was approaching. The Russian replied that there were no Russians in that area, and the American replied,"Understood." After the bombs and shells had stopped and the smoke cleared away, the area was checked and the consensus was there wasn't even an ant left alive. The American again contacted the Russians and said, "You were correct. We checked and there aren't any Russians in this area." The Russian didn't reply, just hung up his phone.
Lying is a sin, so it was our duty to make them honest
lol what would merica do without their tech
Nothing. But what would the Russians do without their people?
@@Chorizotacosbaby Same thing they did before all the "tech" win wars, did you forget?
@@ChorizotacosbabyYou think we all should go back to swords and chariots?
The SAM system would have just been taken out had the russians declined to shut it down. The US told them as much when they made the phone call. The response would have taken a bit longer but not by much.There was only one system in that area and the US knew exactly where it was.
If F22s were in the air, I seriously doubt the S400 would've lasted long.
@mikeck4609 I know, aunt it cool!
@nemesisproject399 They're not lasting long...without F-22 or F-35. Destroyed daily by 35 yrs old, obsolete ATACMS.
M48, M57, M57E1 or even M39A1 ATACMS all have a max range of 300KM. S300 and S400 both have a coverage radius of around 40KM, so they'd have been positioned near enough to Kasham to be within easy reach of ATACMS, and probably most GMLRS rockets (I misspoke about GLSDB earlier).
The F-22 and F-15E would be more than a match for the Su-34s on standby. The radar on the Sukhoi would be able to get a lock on the F-15E, so they'd be focused on them while the Raptors were lining up kill shots.
The Ukraine war shows that the S400 is not able to shoot down HIMARS missles, so how would they able to shoot down a F22 Raptor?
I’m guessing any F22s are still trying to not get too involved. Probably around for electronic support and other passive support, otherwise Russia would probably use the su57 etc and then we have all out war between US and them with both using primary forces… and it’s clear that both us and them intend to use only the most disposable forces possible, kinda like politicians
This sunshine story never gets old :D
It continues to pay dividends in encouraging overconfidence about Next Time.
This was the amount of support 50 US servicemembers could call in on the other side of the planet, that is less than half a platoon. Imagine what a Division could call in... or God forbid, an entire Corps.
You mean less than half a company. A US Army rifle platoon is about 40 soldiers.
@@blastulae50 soldiers + complete
The main issue is sustainability. At least when you're not blowing away some third world country. What pace can be sustained by US industrial infrastructure? Currently not great.
I lost it when the B52s turned up.
You didn't think Grandpa buff would miss it did you
😂 talk about overkill
I kept laughing as he brought up more and more firepower. "reaper drone,tube artillery, 4 apache helis, 30 mm cannons eliminating 200, ac-130 gunships, b-52 bombers, f-15s, f-22s". Like America just gave them the tiniest sprinkle of our All-Purpose seasoning.
Holy shit.
At 13:32, a fighter fires his AK immediately across the path of others on his side running forward. Great training.
Shhjhhh. Vlad thinks it's working. Lol
I know, right?
I saw that too! Scared the hell out of me!
Russian officers: go fight you’ll be fine
Mercenary: sir it’s the Americans
Cringe
@@zusanli251 no you
Wagner got smoked
long before that conversation ever happened.
Even international legion scared of themselves
The issue with the s.a.m. wasn't the inability to operate in its presence, it was the political ramifications and escalation taking it out would cause.
Imagine getting beaten so hard that your country issues you a medal just for surviving it
The "Lucky Dog Medal" is a legend amongst the Russian Armed Forces! lol
awarding a medal for forces they claimed werent russian. pretty fuckin stupid.
@@nomercyinc6783 "second most powerful military" lol
participation medal
Wagner: "Onward, comrades, our mighty tanks-"
*F-16s, F-22s, B-52s, Apache choppers take off...*
Wagner: "WHERETHE FCUK ARE MY TANKS???"
The Taureg did the same to Wagner in the Sahara just using small arms. Wagner has lost its touch since Putin took full control of it.
it's like putin is incompetent, everything he touches becomes rubble
Like everything else he's touched lately
Putler seems to have something in common with Adolfo Hilter - he thinks that generals know nothing and that he, and only he can make the right decisions.
The road seems to only go one way - downhill.
Putin is like a reverse Midas - everything he touches turns to shit.
Wagner never had the touch to begin with. It's much the same with the Russian army in Ukraine, using old equipment, a core of better trained soldiers and waves of meat in the form of convicts, and no regard for your own casualties.
The US knew about the SAM site. The US had aircraft that it used against opposition in the theatre, and included the most advanced fighter in the US inventory. Therefore, you may take it as a given that there were SAM suppression systems such as HARM missiles immediately available. The call to the Russians was very likely underscored by the fact that the alternative to not shutting down the SAM site was to lose it.
I doubt Russia was concerned about the SAM site.
@@davidelliott5843 The concern is not about protecting the SAM site. Look farther away and into the future. Think strategically instead of tactically.
Turning off that s300/400 SAM system was a win win scenario. Uncle Sam didn't have to waste time and money on a SEAD run, and Ivan didn't lose their expensive SAM system.
I was almost leaning towards the idea that they COULDN'T turn it on....some Major Boris might've sold the power cord to plug it in for Vodka and Hooker money
Before the attack:
Russian to his American counterpart- "There are NO Russian forces in the area".
After the attack:
American to his Russian counterpart- "Confirmation; there ARE no Russian forces in the area".
😂
To be fair, America has lots of experience fighting terrorists
The US would perhaps be somewhat delayed in the rescue of their countrymen if needed to take down the SAM battery first, but the outcome in this instance would likely have been the same.
The problem though is what consequences it might have give, in a wider confrontation between US and Russia as a result of the open hostility.
Russia would have gotten its' ass kicked by the United States, rather than what they are currently undergoing in Ukraine. And Russia KNOWS THIS! They may talk a big game, but their actual game is... pretty mediocre.
No, it would have been obliterated within the same time frame of everything else that was sent to provide aide. A cruise missile would have been launched from the Persian Gulf which is where the 5th fleet resides.
Then the AC-130 came. Then the B-52 bomber. Do I need to finish watching the video?
They were still busy spending their killstreaks, but stopped short of the Nuke and EMP
@@WindFireAllThatKindOfThing now it makes sense. Thank you
They got hit by the biggest unhealthcare system in the world
We've already seen Russias air defense system is a joke. Surely the US air superiority would destroy those systems and though a delay in ground support they wouldn't prove too much of a hassle.
😂😂😂
Funniest thing is russia gave out a medal for surviving the us
*surviving a group of 30 soldiers 😂😂
Nope, F-22's would have taken out the SAM systems using HARMS. Russian SAMs are not capable of getting a lock or shooting down a Raptor. Then the US would have destroyed all Russian aircraft in the vicinity. More difficult? Yes. But doable by the US. This must have been conveyed to the Russians during the phone call to convince them it would be better to turn off their SAMs.
Uh. I dont think the raptor is as invincible as some beleive but the japanese really really want it and theyre about at technologicly advanced as countries get. I know its against the law to sell raptors but i feel we should give them something close. Ithink we should produce some yf23 and share some to only our closest allies. Maybe help pay for em by increasing production numbers most likley lowering individual cost
Strike packages setup to bomb a high value target would have harm missiles on board but CAS planes I doubt would.
@@Qbgarden the reason we don't sell them is because it would be near impossible to shoot them down of one of our allies betrayed us a good example of this is during ww2 when Japan withdrew from the Washington naval treaty and since the Japanese navy was trained by the British navy they were some of the best in the world which is why the us struggled against the Japanese navy in the early stages of the war
I don’t think f-22’s are capable of shooting HARMS.
The stealth planes would have destroyed the air defense
I wish the RU SAM system would have stayed on and operational.......that would have made this battle even more special. We have seen what HIMARS has done to RU Sam's in UKR.......
lmao, the russian bear is more of a dead cub like that which robert kennedy jr dropped in central park.
If only Czar and greatest of Great Khans Putin could see this video, and actually understand the content. He is, however the kind of ruler that Machiavelli castigated and warned against. Putin thinks that menacing NATO is a winning strategy, when that means facing not only the US but Sweden, Finland, Poland and possibly Japan as well. Russia is a pigmy pretending to be a Goliath, and Putin fases not only the world's dominant military [the US] but countries that have a hatred of Russia from before the US even existed.
The Poles remember Russian partitions, occupations and atrocities, and would very much like their winged hussars, now in tanks, to re-occupy Moscow. The Swedes and Finns as well remember Russian occupations and territorial seizures, and have their own desire to rectify the past. All of the countries on Russia's borders would dearly like to teach Russia the meaning of "Do not do to others what you would not want others to do to you." Russia complains about others disliking and attacking them, but they could easily change that by abandoning their bad behavior.
As to the SAM sites, one version of the story I heard was that the Americans asked the Russians if they had any troops operating in the area. The Russians said "no", because they still felt like they could keep Wagner as a secret associate. The Americans then said "Cool, we're conducting close air support operations at the spot you don't have any guys, so pretty please don't point your SAMs at us." The Americans didn't necessarily 'convince' the Russians not to fire their missiles, but the Russians trapped themselves into not supporting the Wagner elements.
Batlte Of Kasham is basically Command and Conquer Generals Running the Airforce General with FULL UPGRADES and Dumping everything on a massive enemy formation outside your base!
The story of the Battle of Khasham will never get old.
What I found most impressive was the lengths Western Media went to keep the story on the down-low.
It approaches almost Cover-Up so as not to Inflame Tensions territory.
Somebody high up in the White House musta made some phone calls and threats to keep this story about US and Russians in conflict out of the headlines.
Basically, the wagners have learnt the lesson of F--- around and find out.
The F-22s were no doubt providing 'high-cover' and watching that russian air base. I doubt if the U.S. 'asked' that the SAM system be turned off > more like, 'turn it off or lose it to drones.
The air defenses that Russia had would have only delayed what happened. HARM missiles could have taken those out and then the US would have had the same advantages. It would have slowed the drone and Apache attacks but the F-22s and F-35s could have gotten in and knocked those out. I don't know if this would have been in time to help the soldiers but I'm sure a few missiles could have been spared to slow their advance.
A single volley of ATACMS would have taken it out no problem. So the delay would have been insignificant. The US would just have held back some of the aircraft and relied on himars and stealth fighters to prevent any advancement until the AA system was kaput.
My son was there and witnessed it first hand 😂
Did he get one of medals from Putin?
The largest weapon a fire team has is their radio.
Lightest weapon for all the destruction it can cause
you need to make a video about Ukraine's 3 day operation to liberate Kursk.
The American press doesn't want to cover that for some reason. 🤔🇺🇸
@@mikeevans7381for real I haven’t seen anything about besides on reddit
I love this. I am a veteran, and when I watched, i got scared. Then I realized, I was scared of myself. Scared of what a force I was once part of!
New subscriber here! Keep up the good work my friend.
We haven't seen this since the Falaise Pocket during the Normandy Campaign in the Western Front during WWII when US and the Allies crushed the German Forces.
Correction: while there was a pocket, U.S. and British commanders wanted to avoid friendly fire, leaving a gap wide enough for hundreds of thousands of Germans to escape.
This made my day.
I single SAM would offer no more difficulty than reaching forward and choosing a different missle
I agree with some of the other commenters here, I doubt the SAM would have been capable of doing more than take a couple Reapers drones out at best before one of them took it out, long before the manned aircraft entered the scene. I imagine Reapers are either far better now or already have a replacement in the works and would be effective against multiple SAMs working together, especially if they are being operated like they have been in both Ukraine and in Russia itself.
Those who managed to live got "participant" medals.
The reason they didn't use they SAM is because they did want to lose it.
Just to clarify more, 5:19 , that groups were (Wagner + syrian army + iranian militia in syria).
The US knew where the SAMS were. As has been shown in Ukraine, even their best systems are open to attack. With Stealth fighters, drones, and even cruise missiles, fixed assets like a SAM site are easy prey for US weapons.
Man i love this story
That makes no sense. They denied there were Russian troops in that area. Even if they had refused to deactivate the Sams, it would be obvious they were lying and the USAF would just wipe out those Sams then proceed to wiping out the Wagner group. Maybe an extra few minutes wasted but the outcome was the same non the less.
As soon as Buff came out it wasn't about winning the fight, it was about sending a message.
That SAM system wouldn't have lasted 10 minutes against F-22, F-35 and A-10 attacking them. If there was a near peer battle... that SAM was the first casualty period.
This video missed about 8 moments to include the motto regarding Russian history: "And then things got worse."
I'm sure the HIMARS on standby near Kasham had ATACMs in the arsenal alongside GLSDB munitions, and as we've seen in combat in Ukraine, S300, S400 and S500 have proven incapable of reliably intercepting ATACMS or GLSDB, so if the Russians had not acceded to the State Department request to turn off the SAM radars, the results would have been similar.
And that's before factoring in the presence of F-22 and F-15E in theater. The F-15 is more than capable of wild weasel missions, and while low band radar on Russian SAMS would let them know that a stealth aircraft is in the area, the high band radar needed to acquire a firing solution would only have a brief window to acquire a lock, when the weapon bay doors on the Raptor open up to release their ordnance, by which time they're as good as dead.
In an actual confrontation between US and Russian forces, the real question is whether the Russians would be willing to switch _on_ their SAMs in the first place. I have to imagine that after the first few days and hundreds of US SEAD strikes, even a force as comically incompetent as the Russians would probably figure out to keep that radar switched off.
The AGM-88 that Wild Weasels missions use would have neutralized that threat.
The last part of this video forgets that before the start of the Gulf War, Iraq had one of the most robust air defense systems in the world. The opening days of the air war consisted of stealth and specialty aircraft dismantling that system and then the rest of the air campaign was unopposed air dominance.
"How much air support do you need? "
" - Yes "
If the Russian SAMs were not deactivated (being that they were Russian), they’d have just been another target, and it’d have been a wider conflict. As you said, when it was clear to Russia that Wagner Group was attempting to engage American forces (perhaps unwittingly) Wagner was left without Russian support and twisting in the wind, as they weren’t regular military.
Spot on!
If the US couldn’t take out the SAMs for some reason it would have changed the battle. However that would have revealed that it was the Russians attacking and that was an act of war.
So Russia essentially abandoned their own troops by shutting down that S-400… 🤦
There was also a AC-130 gunship that took part.
That's saying something about their confidence in the airspace. Spookies and Spectres are very, very vulnerable to even obsolete MANPADS and antique anti air guns, to say nothing of modern, full size missile systems
The Russian government literally pulled a “Remember, no Russian” on Wagner 😂
The US just loves overkill.
They love picking on the weak because if they where to fight a proper military, they would have loss
Overkill is underrated
Always outgun an opponent.
@@davebeins2593 I met a guy on a job a while ago who is every definition of the word gun nut. I'm the same way but with computers. So we were kind of information brokering: you teach me guns I'll teach you hardware.
And one of the first things he told me was "if your gun collection cannot be described as an 'arsenal': you need more guns.".
🤣
It's called achieving superior and overwhelming firepower in order to dominate the battlefield
I’m loving these videos.
My question is why did the Russians agree to not use their surface-to-air missile capability?
Russian army cheif had a beef with Wagner before so he was the one giving American greenlight to attack Wagner and Wagner wasn't under Russian in Syria
Because if they turned them on the US would have had to destroy them. They cut their losses.
For the same reason we have to move our artillery batteries after almost every fire mission: Because you'll catch counterfire in moments.
Active radar systems are shockingly vulnerable and like turning on a giant spotlight to the sky when you flip the power switch.
They show great caution when being given an ultimatum by the USA.
it´s easy to say that you won a fight when you have 3 plus attack helicopters all special forces of the US and artillery against 500 plus poorly trained men and some shitty early age bmp´s .
Someone make a movie of this
Try using real footage, and ditch the stock stuff.
It's available, so why not?
Whatever you think of the USA military, the excel at putting together very effective strike packages - both short and long range.
I'd be asking quite a few questions if the most overbloated and overbudgeted military on the planet couldn't handle a ragtag groups of mercs.
The fact this battle happened proves some ppl still need to be reminded.
The US employs precision and overwhelming firepower. The principle of "Do it right the very first time" is kind of a maxim.
Oh really? Is that what happened in Afghanistan?
@@owen-trombone Afghanistan and the area the Taliban would retreat to in Pakistan would take a severe turn into the depths of wholesale genocide to achieve anything resembling "victory". It's not a good looking scenario. But, The Bush administration had to look like it was "Doing Something" so stuck the US and it's military into a land that is largely unchanged for the last couple of thousand years and likely remain as it is for the next couple of thousand. It's pretty much the way the Allies defeated the Nazis and the Japanese empire. It's kind of frowned upon these days. Civilian casualties in the millions, I mean.
War is always about minerals. Time to link trade to human rights.
Air defense changes the order and time frame in which things are done.
It does not necessarily change the outcome.
3:15 - Reading all the comments, then hear “Junta” with a hard J, instead of the proper “Hunta”.
Welp! All done with this.
I heard that too. Makes me think this is AI generated.
Messing with members of special forces of the United States is BAD for your overall health! As these Wagner Group & their friends are about to learn. Let's face it some people have to learn the hard way. These troops are very well trained! And are overall BAD asses...... SAM's in Vietnam where dealt with by Wild Weasels.
Explain the Taliban
You'd think the war would already be over with each video this channel puts out
I mean it kinda is when ukr can simply walk 30km deep into rus and break operational depth
This video is about slaughtered Wagner fighters in Syria
It's been over for years in some ways, everyone is just waiting for Russia to realise that
He sent grandpa buff and the kid fire savagery 😂😂😂😂
I don't understand how this channel can pump out such vast amounts of content so quickly, it worries me about how much research could possibly be being put into each one when they come so fast. Like when a restaurant brings your food too quickly...
They get a lot of shiz wrong
Ah yes the battle of "fuck around and find out."
To Wagner it is Red February, to the Americans it was just another Tuesday.
The Danish F-16s and the Ukrainian pilots will have trained to be able to control a completely different air force, as everyone knows, Ukraine was part of the old Soviet Union, and therefore it was limited how many Fighter Jets Ukraine had, and they were, after all, old Russian built MIGs, but now the Danish F-16 and the newly trained Ukrainian pilots, and the rumor says they are already in the air at the front, and because the old Danish F-16 fighters are being modernized, they are doing fantastically against the Russians MIG's or the few Russians have actually left!
HARMs would have worked against the Russian SAMS, although there might have been loss of aircraft.
An anti-radiation missile (ARM) is a missile designed to detect and home in on an enemy radio emission source. Typically, these are designed for use against an enemy radar, although jammers and even radios used for communications can also be targeted in this manner.
Yes to both.
The plan got punched in the face 😂
Wilhelm Richard Wagner was music composer from 1800¨'s and Hitler liked his work....
Future wars will use more drones. They are cheap and can be produced by the millions.
Wagner did not have SAM's.
They said themselves that.
Diplomats determined the outcome? Ohhhh no kidding
Russia: Those are not our soldiers.
US Military: Glad to hear it. Ice em.
also us: *kills themselfs in suicide*
Did the Russians turn off they SAM systems or did their troops not know how to turn them on?
Cool story just needs more dragons
What is important to note though is that Wagner was NOT taken out but actually became even more important in Ukraine. It took Putin to take out Prigozhin. I don't understand why militaries never seem to look into the future when fighting their conflicts.
Everyone talking F22 but I like to think the Apaches would of just taken out the anti air defenses, though this approach would be a different event, a different battle but I’m sure the results would be the same
If our people knew what we had it would scare the hell out of us my kin were Navy people what they told me and they didn’t know all i know,but what they said back then it scares me for all the world…
I've only ever hear it called the battle of conoco fields... And that map with the movements is not at all where it happened...
why do u put a buzzing in audio
Ukraine is developing low cost drone capability at an incredible rate. They simply knock up another idea and see what happens. Anything useful gets better engineering until the next idea comes along. The Raytheon/BAe cost plus method will never keep up.