What if you are eating one of those weird tacos they used to sell at Taco Bell, where they painted the inside of a soft taco with refried beans and wrapped it around a hard taco...? Probably some kind of abomination.
"Your magic system is nothing, it serves ZERO purpose. You should scrap your magic system, NOW! And give somebody else a piece of that ink and paper that's still brand new so we can read better stories made by someone more talented. Cause what are you here for? To write good stories? Throw that away! I mean that with a hundred percent with a thousand percent."
Magically-produced problems that can only be solved through ordinary/physical means is an interesting idea. Could be good for general storytelling or serve as an analogy for modern issues that are so complex as to appear arcane or godly
As an author, magic systems are the bane of my existence. I always come up with one and then realize that it's pretty cliche and probably not worth following through with. I think the biggest and hardest lesson that I still have to learn is that even for the author its ok if the magic is soft. Even as the author you don't have to understand it. This doesn't mean that you should just let your characters have random crazy powers with no inherent consistencies, (although I suppose if you really wanted to you could do that as well) but it's ok if you don't know everything. A lot of stuff comes out in the writing of the book itself. This video earned you a sub 😄
That doesn't really matter. People don't read books for the magic system, they read it for the characters and stories. If your magic feels like a deus ex machina every time, then it does detriment from the story. But that is due to its usage, not a property of the magic system itself.
Sorry for the wall. Magic systems are easy to make. I'm not a writer, but when thinking of making a story I think of a function someone can do, and explore what the character would do with it compared to other characters, the main idea is the ease of use or utility or responsibility of using it. Just use something with clear rules anyone can use vs rules only advanced people would consider. I made magic rules based on magic classes in fictional mysticism such as wizards vs witches vs warlocks. I wrote so much it might even be too complicated for anyone I'm explaining it too. An example is light and sound existing due to frequency. What if you could whistle with enough power so precise that the air carrying the sound visually change color. This was based on a real disorder where some people can smell color and taste heat. Because they are backed by frequency, you can use light to affect sound as well. So a flashlight that sounds like a roaring explosion or a song that can let blind people see.
@@furyberserk That's really interesting! And your fine with the wall 👍 (I'm 17 years old so maybe it's just that I don't have enough experience to write a magic system that has all the characteristics I'm looking for) But I would disagree I guess because of the uniqueness I'm looking for in the magic system I want to create. Yes, magic is about function but its hard to find a function that isn't too functional. (Like magic systems involving Telepathy, Flight, Invisibility, etc) Because they directly solve a problem a normal human has with no drawbacks. (of course you can add drawbacks but then you have to explain WHY they have those drawbacks and most times the answer comes down to the power being tied to their physical strength or 'power bank' which I have always felt to be a bit of a cop-out (personal opinion). I think Brandon Sanderson described it perfectly on his lecture on Magic systems when he said that a magic system is not defined by what they CAN do with their powers but what they CAN'T. (And why they can't, when they can't, when they actually CAN, why they can actually can do it etc) But back to the point, the key is making a functionally imperfect magic system that can't do what the magic user wants to do perfectly so that the character has to make up for the lack of ability with character development (The key to all best character arcs after all is making the poor protagonist work for their meal after all) Side note: That magic system is really interesting and creative! You should try writing a short story or something about it if possible! (I would be willing to read of course lol)
@God Slayer It's hard for me to imagine what it would feel like to use magic. Like what's limiting people from constantly spamming magic? What does it feel like to be low on mana? The easiest way for me to understand that is basically using magic makes you tired the more you use it at once
I'd argue The One Ring is also pretty soft. It makes _hobbits_ turn invisible, but it does different things for members of other species. It seems to amplify the natural talents of a person on the basis of their species, but how that would manifest for a given species is not clear until we get an instantiating example from the text.
I dunno how well explained this is in tolkien's work, but this is the explanation I read and that makes sense to me: In the world of LotR some beings are more powerful than others. Gandalf is more powerful. Elves are more powerful than humans. Hobbits are weak. It's a very hierarchical world. What the ring does is multiply your power. See what Galadriel says when she is about to take the ring from frodo. She would have become a continent shattering power. Because her high power would be multiplied. Gandalf with the ring would have just been apocalypse. But hobbits aren't that powerful, so the ring adds just a bit of stuff. That explanation is pretty _hard_
I like the idea of magic systems like JelloApocalypse used in Epithet Erased, because it's a "hard magic system" whose rules depend on the type of magic. For example, the Soup Epithet can only be used for soup-related attacks, but there is no defined limit to what that soup could be made from. Scalding hot lemon juice, hot sauce, and salt in a pot could still be soup if you really wanted it to be, and it would sure hurt to have that poured into your eyes or a cut. Point is, the rules are flexible, but restricted by a theme.
@@HippoEnjoyer It's basically that the system itself has no rules except that all the magic must follow its OWN rules. So every single user of that magic is essentially following a different set of rules that define how they can use their powers, but that doesn't mean there AREN'T rules, it just means they vary from person to person.
I think there's room to discuss hard and soft magic as post-completion classifications. It's useful to tell someone else that a system is hard or soft when discussing the finished story, but as you were saying, attempting to use one can lead to the reader or writer getting the opposite. Cupcake batter and cake batter are the same until you've baked them solid. If you say "I'm going to make cupcakes, so I'll split it into eight parts" but those eight parts each fill a cake pan, you've made an eight-layer cake. Which is fine and might be the best form your batter could have taken, but no one is going to look at it and say "those are cupcakes." So focus on making the batter good and having a wide variety of pans I guess?
A taco has a hard shell and is soft on the inside. It’s hard on the exterior, but is soft on the interior. Your taco analogy is perfect. It’s hard on how you gain access to magic, but soft on its uses and how it works.
My absolute favorite magic systems have been a mix of both hard and soft magic, with the soft being the effects on the world and the hard being the cost (sacrifice of some sort).
Found this channel recently and you're by far the most down to earth, straightforward and generally helpful writing advice channel i've seen. And you know one piece too?! It really doesn't get much better than that! But seriously though, amazing work, keep at it please!
I would say the actual master of making 'Magic' systems that function to Enhance, Accentuate, and Punctuate story telling beats and plot points while being believable and functional is a writer called WildBow. His work utterly transformed my understanding of designing and Utilizing power systems within a story. His 'Super hero' world setting makes psychological issues and traumas into Superpowers, while his 'Urban fantasy' setting has magic based on the attention of the Spirits being paid to how a character lives their lives, gives their word, and the intersection between what they specifically say and what they actually mean and desire. He's written multiple books in each setting, some of which are Tolkien/Brandon Sanderson levels of length. I recommend looking them up some time.
I absolutely love that you differentiate between how well the author understands it vs how well the audience understands the magic system. I've been making that distinction for quite a while and and I don't see it discussed enough. I've talked to a lot of people who want a softer system, but wind up creating something super inconsistent because they don't understand it themselves, and they think they're not supposed to. (Don't get me wrong, as said at the end, if that works for you go for it, but it doesn't for a lot of people)
Sanderson made that distinction when he first brought up the idea of hard vs soft magic. He also said that ALL good magic systems the author understands. He said that shortly after he brought up the dichotomy of hard vs soft. And people then went on to say that he was saying ONLY hard magic systems were good... Which he wasn't at all. What really should make one question the effort his listeners put in before complaining is that he listed as an example of a good rule: "All magic must be cool."
@@SirSpence99 yeah that's the problem with people taking Sanderson's teachings but only from clips, and references to it. The context gets lost somewhere alond the lnes
@@SirSpence99Sbd even that is just his opinion. You really don't have to understand how you magic "system" works, if you can keep narrative consistency without it. It's so annoying how many people who are in fantasy worldbuilding places thake Sanderson's personal preferance as gospell.
@@SirSpence99 Nah, I did. I just disagree with the core tenet if "magic should be understood by the author" and hate that you allways have to discuss this in relation if Sanderson.
I feel like I should mention that magical metaphysical tacos are an actual plot device in the adventure zone lmao. Like it's a journey to get there, but it is literally "eat a taco, get superpowers" and I think you'd find that funny.
This is very insightful. I have two stories with very different magic systems: The first one is very ritual magic. You complete an extensively lengthy ritual, and you sometimes gain powers. The lengthy ritual is to summon a demon or horrible entity, with which you make a deal, and get something in return. The second one is more esoteric because it's not fully understood, but has very clear rules and limitations: Magic does not affect the physical world, only the mind of people, and only in certain ways according to the "form" of the wizard. And for the purpose? I never thought of that explicitly until now, but I had clear ideas from the beginning: The first one is meant to be difficult and dangerous, because it's for a cynical mystery story in which being a witch or wizard is not glamorous or easy. You stay up late completing difficult rituals and reading arcane tomes only to summon a demon that may or may not trick you and end your existence, not counting the many unintended consequences that can only be solved using the same dangerous magic... (Funny enough, the lengthy rituals sometimes involve cooking recipes) The second one is more basic: I want to write a story like Death Note, full of plots, schemes, political intrigue, mystery and magnificent bastardry. And mind tricks and illusion magic with very tight rules that can be used in creative ways are the obvious and logical choice. Thanks for the video! It's very cool and truly helped me see my stories in a new perspective.
"removing a problem is different from solving the problem" this phrase resonates with me greatly and something that I've thought about before but I was unsure of how to word it. Thank you for giving my ideas a conduit to help others understand.
Magical realism is one of my favourite fantas things, taking some basic spells and fleshing out its rules and limitations, then considering all of its in-world consequences and implications. Because this is my method, magic and worldbuilding are incredibly interwoven for my projects. Cool video tho, mainly commenting to boost this vid. ¡Keep it up!
I like magic that show characters progression in the way of knowledge, like the way a child doesn't know the truth of the universe but a accomplished scientist knows more and can manipulate nature more.
I have been thinking about this a lot while working on a story lately. What do I want the magic to do? How sharply do I want to define the limits of magic? If I choose to be vague, how much can I get away with before it feels like the answer is always “do some magic?” You cover the topic well Great vid, I hope you keep it up.
The writer not knowing about his own magic system is actually a super interesting system of "open lore" that anyone can imagine or write their own ideas for. Basically Warhammer 40k and SCP
Love how you popped in with the "hi, it's me, I'm editing" the way your videos flow with things like this are amazing and unique the train of thought makes perfect sense to me
As a person who never wrote an actual single story other than fantasies in their own mind, I would say that magic is just unexplained science, most times. Even the lack of rules can be a rule itself, and all that matters is consistency. If people don’t understand how it works, why? Because not many can use it? Because its rules are too complicated fot the human mind? As long as the explanation is logical, we can assume the magic has rules, they’re just hidden from everyone (even the writer may not know these rules). This is different from when the writer establishes rules and then breaks them with no explanation (usually for plot convenience), since the magic system in this case is the explanation of the weirdly coincidental events instead of a system WITH an explanation One of my favourite “shows” has a magic system that seems completely soft at first, but is actually mostly hard, despite the fact that the magic system is literally classed as magic because it follows no rules of the real world (the story takes place in modern day real life). Even so, there are limits and explanations for every little thing that happens surrounding it
that's a solid way of understanding it! also if you don't mind, what is the show/book you're referencing? (looking for something new to watch/read and magic in a modern setting is usually fun)
@@m.ubaidaadam ah, if you don’t know Portuguese, I’m afraid it would be difficult to watch. The “show” I talked about isn’t actually a show, it’s a Brazilian Tabletop RPG that is streamed live on Twitch. However, there is a dedicated team that is adding English subtitles to each episode (which range from 3-5 hours usually). It’s called Paranormal Order (Ordem Paranormal in Portuguese) and it has 4 main seasons and 3 spin-offs. The basis of the story is that the Paranormal doesn’t come to our reality easily, due to the pillars of logic that society has built. But with enough fear and suffering, Entities from a dimension called Other Side can manifest into the world as terrible creatures. It’s a brutal world, and since it’s a RPG, it means not even the narrator of the story knows what the main characters will do, and main characters dying isn’t an uncommon event. It’s very different from the normal structure of a story in other media, but it works extremely well since the characters feel extremely real, so getting attached is easy after the first few episodes The thing about the “magic system” which is the Paranormal itself, is that it seems completely soft in the first and second season. Impossible creatures appear, Cultists can cast Rituals to do impossible things. But by the third season, we learn that there are many defined rules in the Other Side, but I won’t spoil them here since figuring them out is really fun. If you still plan on watching, I’d recommend starting with the second season unless you really really want to start with the first, because in the first season, the narrator and players weren’t as experienced as they were today, so there were many things that could’ve been better. The first season is getting a remake as a graphic novel, but I don’t think that it will be translated as of release. And there’s also a game coming out this year, and I think it will be translated
@@titadogelo5090I don't speak Portuguese but I'll still check it out on twitch. also a game based on it does sound very interesting, thanks for the recommend!
@@m.ubaidaadam the subbed videos are on youtube on a channel named either Lives do Cellbit or Ordem Paranormal. The game, Enigma of Fear, releases this semester and will be about investigation and exploration, like a Silent Hill / Resident Evil combined with Outer Wilds
I have heard a sort of evolution on the "hard vs soft" which just adds a different axis of "rational and irrational". On these axis I saw them basically split two factors usually associated with the hard and soft and separate them, like the hard/soft is tackled in how its shown to the reader in the plot and the rational/irrational is more or less the lore and the background and how its shown there. For instance, under this quantrint system, a Hard/Irrational system would have quite a lot of what rules are there to be shown in the plot, but the rules are far from intricate or complex, like how a lot of(but obviously not all) superhero stories show their ability sets. The limitations and rules for a Hard/Irrational system are not there to serve the worldbuilding so much as the plot, and there are rules there for what it can due within that plot. While a Soft/Irrational would be what is thought of as a more conventional Soft Magic system, in that the magic only does what is nessisary for the plot, and it doesn't have as much grounding on the worldbuilding persay, and as far as the LoTR trilogy is considered, I would agrue that it mostly lives there, or at least seems like it(its only once you get into the wider material that it seems to actually be more of a Soft/Rational system instead). While in the Inverse, a Soft/Rational System will likely have a lot of background and lore in why the magic works like it does or what limits and consequences it has, but when shown and used in the actual plot it merely serves the Plot itself. Lastly the Hard/Rational system will likely be the most complex, while also being the most in your face about it, as its rules and limitations are connected both in the plot and the world so heavily. Due to there being two Axis, you could do what you are talking about in this video as well, but effectively expand it even further, to just throw out a bunch of random numbers, a story's magic system could be 80% rational, 20% irrational, 60% soft, and 40% hard, or something to that effect.
This really helped me think about my magic system in a new way! I was struggling with defining it as "hard magic or soft magic" because it was kind of both. Thinking about what parts of the magic is "problem solving" versus "Whimsy" really helps me go at it with a better understanding of what I want from it. Thank you!
Haven't finished the vid yet, but had to stop and give props for the awesome reference to Avatar... NOT the blue people one, the GOOD one. You have earned my respect for that!
Don't know how long you've been doing this, but I'm glad it popped up in my recommendations. Love the presentation and energy you deliver. Looking forward to more videos!
The portion of the video talking about how the ring is more hard while gandalf is more soft reminds me of a tabletop game called Tiny Dungeon, which has two major magic systems, one more soft and one more hard. Maybe you are spell-touched and you can mostly do whatever but it's never very strong or even particularly consistent and maybe you're a spell-reader who is a lot more limited not just in what they can do but how often they can do it, but you gain the advantage of consistency and knowledge. What a player (the audience) decides to be can depend on what they want magic to do for them, if they want their character to have magic at all.
This is a really cool breakdown of systems in a way I had not seen before! One book I recommend that puts this into practice is supreme magus terrible name but it uses a system of magic that has hard rules but neritively is so flexible as to encompass tens of characters core character traits and wis bang boss fights all while building interesting situations and teaching us more about the magic without internal inconsistencies highly recommended
I've written and soft-coded so many magic systems throughout my writing career, and to be honest: I never get tired of it. It's magic! Part of the appeal is that it CAN be made to work so many different ways! One of my favorite systems I haven't had a chance to use yet is: "Spells are bound to incantations, and thus to language. That's why for any long-term spell - or even just spells we want to pass down for posterity - we prefer to write them in dead languages like Latin; it makes the spells more stable, since they're less likely to change over time."
As a DM for table top gaming, it's a real challenge to make magic feel magical. You need rules to keep it playable, but it's all too easy to loose that mysticism and mystery in the process.
You can think of magic as some horror story protagonist: you do not understand the ghost shits, but you certainly can try to understand them and lose your mind while doing it. And sometimes, even if you understand the magic, it might so alien for any human mind to truly grasp it. For the effect of horror, you only need to scare people, but sometimes, you can use specific rules of magic to contradict the deductions of the characters. There is no need for readers to know WHAT the rules are, and the effect, so as you said the "function", should be the center part of using "magic" in your story.
Writing magic, I've found, means you commit yourself to losing that sense of awe because as you're the one defining it, you know all it can or can't do in your story and why. The wonder only really remains for the audience. Hard or soft, so long as it works with the story you're trying to tell, I don't think anyone is really going to worry about defining it to the minute detail.
Two things: The first: you're a really intelligent guy, and I like hearing your ideas, they're very insightful. I'm glad I found your channel The second: the more I hear about Sanderson the more I like him. He seems like a genuinely cool dude.
TH-cam recommended the worldbuilding mistakes video to me a lot and for a while I didn't watch it because the thumbnail made me think it'd be some argument about dragons and I've heard so many prescriptive takes about dragons (how many legs, can they fly, all that that you've probably also heard) and I didn't want to hear another one. Eventually I went "eh I'll watch it, I might end up angry but at least I'll know" and then it was actually super helpful stuff and the rest of this channel has been really good too so I'm glad I decided to watch it. Also fun to find another cosmere fan :D
Glad to be here before this channel totally blows up. (And before tacos become the default metaphorical device for explaining magic systems, and maybe writing in general.)
Imagine being able to influence your surroundings and fait just slightly by just your thoughts. Irony often makes me feel like i can do that only to the opposite of the thing i want to happen happens
One thing that can further expand on this is using magic to "cause problems." I've been thinking of one of my favorite games called Vagrant Story. The whole story is set in a long dead city that effectively had a magic mini-apocalypse that causes all sorts of obstacles for the hero. Things like navigating un-natural disasters, dealing with enemies and areas that have absorbed that magic (eg undead and spirits), and dealing with antagonists that are trying to harness said magic for their own ends. The story centers around trying to unravel the mysteries of the city (what happened and how to use it to solve your own problems) while trying to accomplish your original goals throughout the game. It's particularly interesting, because it's a hard magic system that almost seems (or perhaps is) a character in and of itself.
I love writing magic systems, almost all my short stories have one or sometimes two, but after watching this I realize a problem I was making; I was trying to either define every possible rule of a magic system or I wouldn't define anything and end up with a Dues ex Machina system. This video has gave me the insight I needed to not write horrible or rigid magic systems anymore.
I had a magic system in a novella I wrote which had multiple interpretations. One group did not apply many rules and just understood it as mystical and another group tried to define everything with their science and because of that it grew in different ways. The scientific group ended up only being able to use part of it and thought that it was mostly an unusable force because they were not able to define it.
So one thing that I've seen pointed out a few places is that Sanderson usually describes Hard Rational systems and Soft Irrational systems, and while it can be difficult to write soft rational systems a lot of classic fantasy is Hard Rational for instance a lot of the 80's and 90's fantasy stuff had a very dungeons and dragons feel to it, and more recent Harry Potter esc, and so you knew what spells the wizard had and roughly what those spells could do, but there was no rational connection between throwing bolts of glowing light that could harm the undead and conjuring a ladder, and banishing a demon, and summoning a talking cat.
Yeah, I try to write very squishy magic. There are rules out in place to manage the chaos for better understanding of the power at your fingertips. It’s like art: there are classes to learn skills and challenge ideas, but overall, art is entirely dependent on the individual
This video is incredibly interesting to me because it represents the closest thing I've seen to a video on magic systems that thinks about magic systems in a way comparable to my own. I've shared 2 parts of my theory on power systems on r/worldbuilding, and at the core of my power system theory are what I call the 3 F's of power system design: Function, Form, and Failstates. It's not a perfect analog since my power system theory leans more heavily the worldbuilding aspect while your philosophy on magic systems lean more towards the storytelling aspect and "function" in my world represents the capabilities of the power system rather than the purpose of the magic system within the story and/or world, but it's the closest thing I've found when every other idea on magic systems has focused so hard on that hard/soft dichotomy.
For me the perfect magic system is Nasuverse one. It's very complicated and sometimes controversial at glance, but more you try to understand it, more you realise that it makes sense. It has both hard "rules" and soft "fuck your rules". And it make perfect correlation between magic and science.
What has worked for me is to work out behind the curtain how I think the magic should work so that when it pops up for the story/game world it flows, it always works as I want it to even if I don't let others in on just why it works, just so there is to me a reason it will work. If I do it right its like why dose this monitor turn on when I press the button? I don't know why I don't ask about it but it works and my life moves on all the better because it dose I don't need to know the physics of LCD flat panels just that they are there.
Magical taco analogy is fun to think about. The shell is the range magic has, it isn't a burrito so couldn't say make everyone in the city begin dancing uncontrollably, but some shells are hard and other soft. The hard shell taco takes longer to cast but the effects last longer while a soft shell taco is quick but falls apart. The cost of course to the caster is the spiciness of the spell, some spells are like bell peppers completely safe, while others are like ghost peppers and habeneros, a considerable amount of spicy that the more tacos eaten the more the caster feels those effects if they aren't used to them, and then of course you get really spicy tacos the ones that you feel like you are burning. It is a mistake, however to say that only those who ate spicy tacos growing up could handle them, other dishes while not necessarily being magic is able to help the mind, body, or soul with casting. I wouldn't say Thai food is the same as a taco but it is most definitely spicy and so someone growing up eating the metaphysical thai curry could learn about the magic tacos and handle the spicy cost of casting. Then what is in the taco is made up of what you want to affect and how you want to affect it, the taco can only hold so much and anything that falls out of the taco can't be put back in. The magic taco could be a one to one effect for every ingredient, like adding sliced avocados so the magic will be green lightning, but then someone will come up and point how their taco has pineapples in it, and then thinking "it's bad enough pineapples were placed on pizza, but why did you put it on a taco, get them out of my tacos now!" but still here they are with the taco with pineapples and need to figure out what spell fits or if there is a magical effect not used yet. I know already said tomato is for turning person into an animal, but pineapple is also a fruit so maybe it turns them into fictional animals? No that doesn't make sense because in this world a dragon is just as real to them as a tiger or wolf is for us. This pineapple just doesn't work and shouldn't be allowed, but making it some kind of forbidden magic just seems too interesting, well could be magic forbidden for different reasons, what if instead of thinking pineapples as a type of spell think of it again like what is affected and the taboo. We can say maybe the avocado is part of a person's mind that controls their state of mind to be calm or agitated so you eat the metaphysical taco to maybe charm someone to listen to you to be relaxed, however the pineapple is more like a person's free will manipulating how they think as though they are your puppet and because of that pineapple doesn't go on tacos as a way of protecting society. It is taboo. But pineapple found in other dishes not pizza or taco that could still be spicy could maybe show how these things when not placed in magic taco shells could be valid. Finally witn eating tacos your stomach gets full and need to digest before casting more, some eat one taco and get full while others get a plate of 6 or 7 before they feel the fullness, but the rule of taco is the stuff in has to stay in the shell or in you, any magic that falls out becomes lost, or maybe residual magic grease is left behind, like a city tower where the guards quickly and easily cast a barrier spell because the same spell is cast there every day that even though it's a hard shell spell to last 24 hours the residual magic of the meats and veggies that falls out of the shell remains there which also helps guards around the city tower cast spells to have protected armor or catch criminals, so thieves learned not to get too close to these places. Also some could use magic to find out what sorts of spells had been used in the place, like sensing magic was used to raise an undead army. But the magic taco eaten by the person is what makes magic manifest from some world of abstract possiblity to happening in the physical world of the story, that is why illusion is so strange because it is like the veil between what could be and what is, like a flour tortilla vs a corn tortilla being a division of various types of magic. Of course a person must eat a taco so they can be ready for the magic of the universe to flow through them as a conduit. Breakfast tacos only available between 6 AM and 10:30 AM, after those hours spells for things like going back in time to undo a mistake you made won't work, so not only is it Spicy but also you can't go before 6 AM so whatever you did yesterday you can't fix and after 10:30 you got to be careful. This is very fun to think about.
I think I watched this 5 times in two days just to fully absorb and think about this because it's such a different (and helpful!) way to think about magic systems. And because you are very soothing to listen to! I'll probably watch this a few more times as I keep on working, just for the different perspective from all the hard v soft videos. And that one video I found that added rational and irrational to the hard/soft graph. Also half expected there to be a soft v hard taco joke somewhere, but the whole point of the video was to throw the soft/hard magic systems out the window so it wouldn't have made much sense xD
Just saw this, that was great! Thanks for your insight! Nice to see my own perspective isn't too far off from someone else's! (but yours is much better worded than mine!)
One of my favorite magic systems was Warhammer. - I’m a little bias as I used to write for GW. The winds of magic, ley lines etc… some “hard” some “soft”. Some psychic. And Arcane is the best damn thing I’ve seen in a decade. I always wrote & DMed with a basic yet flexible foundation of how the world of said story works. It always worked well for me.
Super inspiring video! Got me thinking that a fun way to subvert all of this is to make the change between hard and soft magic explicitly part of the story. You start in an oppressive society where magic is used to restrict people more than free them. Magic is used to deny magic to others, brainwash them, and stop them from even doing basic things. The main character joins a rebel group, and their means of resistance is to find loopholes in the restrictive magic, functioning as a hard magic system. As institutions of oppression are destroyed, the rules governing and restricting magic are lifted. To the end, the characters have to ask themselves - should some restrictive magic remain? Or should humanity remove all boundaries, allowing thought alone to mold reality in any way? Is it right for them or others to decide where such boundaries are?
When I was 4, I had a dream about Cinderella. Hear me out, if I didn't have that ONE dream, my life would be totally different. Well, not THAT different, but just hear me out. That dream somehow led to me creating a magic wizard with a pink wand that could conjure up anything they wanted. Or that I wanted, that's the character I used to use in my light sleep. I'd use my dreams and ideas to add to this world and I did that until around 3-4 years back. I dunno what happened, I just stopped. I also had a pixie that I'd have follow me around IRL (I was a weird child, still am) but that also kinda stopped after a bit too. Until recently where I saw an animatic and was finally inspired enough to get back into my imaginary worlds. A few weeks before seeing this animatic, I went back to a story I just couldn't seem to start. Back when I was younger, I'd only add to the stories whilst I was asleep, and that habit carried on into when I first started this story, which must've been around 5 months ago? And then I realised I can just do it during the day as well lol. The best part and what really kicked things off was when I made my own music playlist, and from there started creating stories from the music I listened to. Around 5 months and 13 crafted stories later, I have decided I'm gonna get serious about this and create a magic system (I actually wanted to get serious 3 months ago when I was working on the storyline to "Bubble of The Gods" (shut up I know it's a shite title) and I have done work to get there, it's just I REALLY want to do it now, like my dopamine spikes are concerning). So Magic System. And there's my weird story on my why brain decided storytelling was going to be my biggest love and regret TL;DR screw you Cinderella, I now make stories
This one of the best channels i've ever seen about writing This helped me a lot working in my game (im a dev) so i'll add the taco in it as a reference to this helpfull video Thanks!
In case you want to know, the main function of my magic system is to add more uniqueness, power and possibilities to the characters (Since the system works with the soul of the person (Personality, tastes, hobbies, memories and past experiences)). Furthermore, the system is explained with a minimum of science and fantasy.
I found your channel last video and I've been in love with your content ever since. The wacky analogies and the niche references (well I guess not so niche, but still) are what I really enjoy. Keep up the great content!
I like having a mix of hard and soft. Like, hard magic is wizards (and MCU sorcerers) who have to learn rituals and spells and hand-signs and material components and artefacts, while also having High Elves who are magical beings who can do a lot of things on a whim, without spells and rituals.
As an aside, I am reminded of "Dungeons and Dragons: Honour Amongst Thieves". D&D is a pretty hard magic system, because it is a game, but the movie took some liberties with the limits of some magic shown (like the shapeshifter tiefling being able to shapeshift more than twice a day). The movie clung close to the game, but took some gentle liberties because it worked for the story, and the medium it was told in.
Sanderson's hard and soft magics are good concepts for a worldbuilder to begin the thinking process, I think it's eyeopening when you go to that rabbit hole but in the Wonderland, there's much more.
What I like about Stands from JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure is they have rules, rules can broken on purpose, however since they’re manifestations of the soul, there’s usually a good reason if they’re breaking rules.
ALL HAIL THE TACO 🙌🏾
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The Adventure Zone Balance is one of the best stories ever (not) written, fight me in the streets!
I love the name Gandledore
Taco based magic system in which the magic system switches between hard and soft depending on if the taco is hard shell or soft shell.
good idea
Food magic where the truth is whether some foods belong into certain categories or other ones
Average Magic: 🚫
🌮 Magic:🍷🗿
What if you are eating one of those weird tacos they used to sell at Taco Bell, where they painted the inside of a soft taco with refried beans and wrapped it around a hard taco...?
Probably some kind of abomination.
@@arcadiaberger9204 Gordita .. yep was just about to mention it but i saw your post =)
I like that it feels like you speaking to a singular person rather than an audience, it really helps me digest what you're saying.
The thumbnail got me like “you should build a magic system NOW”
"Your magic system is nothing, it serves ZERO purpose. You should scrap your magic system, NOW! And give somebody else a piece of that ink and paper that's still brand new so we can read better stories made by someone more talented. Cause what are you here for? To write good stories? Throw that away! I mean that with a hundred percent with a thousand percent."
There is a third kind of magic in Magical Realism genre, that is all about "creating problems" for the characters and not solving them.
lol
Magically-produced problems that can only be solved through ordinary/physical means is an interesting idea. Could be good for general storytelling or serve as an analogy for modern issues that are so complex as to appear arcane or godly
Kind of like the ring from lotr
I think that's one of Brando Sando's rules: Unknown magic can't solve a problem, but it can create them.
Isn't that Colombian literature???
As an author, magic systems are the bane of my existence. I always come up with one and then realize that it's pretty cliche and probably not worth following through with. I think the biggest and hardest lesson that I still have to learn is that even for the author its ok if the magic is soft. Even as the author you don't have to understand it.
This doesn't mean that you should just let your characters have random crazy powers with no inherent consistencies, (although I suppose if you really wanted to you could do that as well) but it's ok if you don't know everything. A lot of stuff comes out in the writing of the book itself.
This video earned you a sub 😄
That doesn't really matter. People don't read books for the magic system, they read it for the characters and stories.
If your magic feels like a deus ex machina every time, then it does detriment from the story. But that is due to its usage, not a property of the magic system itself.
Sorry for the wall.
Magic systems are easy to make.
I'm not a writer, but when thinking of making a story I think of a function someone can do, and explore what the character would do with it compared to other characters, the main idea is the ease of use or utility or responsibility of using it. Just use something with clear rules anyone can use vs rules only advanced people would consider.
I made magic rules based on magic classes in fictional mysticism such as wizards vs witches vs warlocks. I wrote so much it might even be too complicated for anyone I'm explaining it too.
An example is light and sound existing due to frequency. What if you could whistle with enough power so precise that the air carrying the sound visually change color. This was based on a real disorder where some people can smell color and taste heat. Because they are backed by frequency, you can use light to affect sound as well. So a flashlight that sounds like a roaring explosion or a song that can let blind people see.
@@furyberserk That's really interesting! And your fine with the wall 👍 (I'm 17 years old so maybe it's just that I don't have enough experience to write a magic system that has all the characteristics I'm looking for) But I would disagree I guess because of the uniqueness I'm looking for in the magic system I want to create. Yes, magic is about function but its hard to find a function that isn't too functional. (Like magic systems involving Telepathy, Flight, Invisibility, etc) Because they directly solve a problem a normal human has with no drawbacks. (of course you can add drawbacks but then you have to explain WHY they have those drawbacks and most times the answer comes down to the power being tied to their physical strength or 'power bank' which I have always felt to be a bit of a cop-out (personal opinion).
I think Brandon Sanderson described it perfectly on his lecture on Magic systems when he said that a magic system is not defined by what they CAN do with their powers but what they CAN'T. (And why they can't, when they can't, when they actually CAN, why they can actually can do it etc)
But back to the point, the key is making a functionally imperfect magic system that can't do what the magic user wants to do perfectly so that the character has to make up for the lack of ability with character development (The key to all best character arcs after all is making the poor protagonist work for their meal after all)
Side note: That magic system is really interesting and creative! You should try writing a short story or something about it if possible! (I would be willing to read of course lol)
The easiest way for me to understand magic is if its tied to stamina
@God Slayer It's hard for me to imagine what it would feel like to use magic. Like what's limiting people from constantly spamming magic? What does it feel like to be low on mana? The easiest way for me to understand that is basically using magic makes you tired the more you use it at once
I'd argue The One Ring is also pretty soft. It makes _hobbits_ turn invisible, but it does different things for members of other species. It seems to amplify the natural talents of a person on the basis of their species, but how that would manifest for a given species is not clear until we get an instantiating example from the text.
With Elves, it appears to amplify their intellect and magic
I dunno how well explained this is in tolkien's work, but this is the explanation I read and that makes sense to me:
In the world of LotR some beings are more powerful than others. Gandalf is more powerful. Elves are more powerful than humans. Hobbits are weak. It's a very hierarchical world.
What the ring does is multiply your power. See what Galadriel says when she is about to take the ring from frodo. She would have become a continent shattering power. Because her high power would be multiplied.
Gandalf with the ring would have just been apocalypse. But hobbits aren't that powerful, so the ring adds just a bit of stuff.
That explanation is pretty _hard_
I like the idea of magic systems like JelloApocalypse used in Epithet Erased, because it's a "hard magic system" whose rules depend on the type of magic. For example, the Soup Epithet can only be used for soup-related attacks, but there is no defined limit to what that soup could be made from. Scalding hot lemon juice, hot sauce, and salt in a pot could still be soup if you really wanted it to be, and it would sure hurt to have that poured into your eyes or a cut. Point is, the rules are flexible, but restricted by a theme.
So everything has rules, but those rules are specific to it, with no real overarching rules for the system?
@@HippoEnjoyer It's basically that the system itself has no rules except that all the magic must follow its OWN rules. So every single user of that magic is essentially following a different set of rules that define how they can use their powers, but that doesn't mean there AREN'T rules, it just means they vary from person to person.
I think there's room to discuss hard and soft magic as post-completion classifications. It's useful to tell someone else that a system is hard or soft when discussing the finished story, but as you were saying, attempting to use one can lead to the reader or writer getting the opposite.
Cupcake batter and cake batter are the same until you've baked them solid. If you say "I'm going to make cupcakes, so I'll split it into eight parts" but those eight parts each fill a cake pan, you've made an eight-layer cake. Which is fine and might be the best form your batter could have taken, but no one is going to look at it and say "those are cupcakes." So focus on making the batter good and having a wide variety of pans I guess?
Amazing analogy.
A taco has a hard shell and is soft on the inside.
It’s hard on the exterior, but is soft on the interior.
Your taco analogy is perfect.
It’s hard on how you gain access to magic, but soft on its uses and how it works.
you should specify your magic system NOW!
This got me laughing harder than it should have
My absolute favorite magic systems have been a mix of both hard and soft magic, with the soft being the effects on the world and the hard being the cost (sacrifice of some sort).
loved that one greek play where zeus came down and said "hey it's me, deus, and I'm here to ex your machina." Classic line!
Found this channel recently and you're by far the most down to earth, straightforward and generally helpful writing advice channel i've seen. And you know one piece too?! It really doesn't get much better than that! But seriously though, amazing work, keep at it please!
I get the feeling him and Hello Future Me would be an awesome duo
Is this the one Piece?
I would say the actual master of making 'Magic' systems that function to Enhance, Accentuate, and Punctuate story telling beats and plot points while being believable and functional is a writer called WildBow. His work utterly transformed my understanding of designing and Utilizing power systems within a story.
His 'Super hero' world setting makes psychological issues and traumas into Superpowers, while his 'Urban fantasy' setting has magic based on the attention of the Spirits being paid to how a character lives their lives, gives their word, and the intersection between what they specifically say and what they actually mean and desire. He's written multiple books in each setting, some of which are Tolkien/Brandon Sanderson levels of length.
I recommend looking them up some time.
Fancy seeing a Wildbow fan in the wild. Glad I'm not the only one whose mind kept going back to his stories over the course of the video.
Dude that’s crazy. I literally just started reading Twig a couple days ago and suddenly I find someone mentioning it.
@@rosaliewright1656 Oh yeah Twig is Awesome. One of my favorite of the Wildbow's books. Pale manages to edge it out as the best though.
I absolutely love that you differentiate between how well the author understands it vs how well the audience understands the magic system.
I've been making that distinction for quite a while and and I don't see it discussed enough. I've talked to a lot of people who want a softer system, but wind up creating something super inconsistent because they don't understand it themselves, and they think they're not supposed to.
(Don't get me wrong, as said at the end, if that works for you go for it, but it doesn't for a lot of people)
Sanderson made that distinction when he first brought up the idea of hard vs soft magic.
He also said that ALL good magic systems the author understands. He said that shortly after he brought up the dichotomy of hard vs soft.
And people then went on to say that he was saying ONLY hard magic systems were good... Which he wasn't at all.
What really should make one question the effort his listeners put in before complaining is that he listed as an example of a good rule: "All magic must be cool."
@@SirSpence99 yeah that's the problem with people taking Sanderson's teachings but only from clips, and references to it. The context gets lost somewhere alond the lnes
@@SirSpence99Sbd even that is just his opinion. You really don't have to understand how you magic "system" works, if you can keep narrative consistency without it.
It's so annoying how many people who are in fantasy worldbuilding places thake Sanderson's personal preferance as gospell.
@@i.cs.z You are a perfect example of someone who didn't listen to what he said, or what I said.
@@SirSpence99 Nah, I did. I just disagree with the core tenet if "magic should be understood by the author" and hate that you allways have to discuss this in relation if Sanderson.
That thumbnail is telling me to do something I shouldn't.
“The good one, not blue people.” I love you.
i feel like i just 10 minutes of pure knowledge injected into my brain
I feel like I should mention that magical metaphysical tacos are an actual plot device in the adventure zone lmao. Like it's a journey to get there, but it is literally "eat a taco, get superpowers" and I think you'd find that funny.
YOU SHOULD WRITE, NOW!
This is very insightful. I have two stories with very different magic systems:
The first one is very ritual magic. You complete an extensively lengthy ritual, and you sometimes gain powers. The lengthy ritual is to summon a demon or horrible entity, with which you make a deal, and get something in return.
The second one is more esoteric because it's not fully understood, but has very clear rules and limitations: Magic does not affect the physical world, only the mind of people, and only in certain ways according to the "form" of the wizard.
And for the purpose? I never thought of that explicitly until now, but I had clear ideas from the beginning: The first one is meant to be difficult and dangerous, because it's for a cynical mystery story in which being a witch or wizard is not glamorous or easy. You stay up late completing difficult rituals and reading arcane tomes only to summon a demon that may or may not trick you and end your existence, not counting the many unintended consequences that can only be solved using the same dangerous magic... (Funny enough, the lengthy rituals sometimes involve cooking recipes)
The second one is more basic: I want to write a story like Death Note, full of plots, schemes, political intrigue, mystery and magnificent bastardry. And mind tricks and illusion magic with very tight rules that can be used in creative ways are the obvious and logical choice.
Thanks for the video! It's very cool and truly helped me see my stories in a new perspective.
"removing a problem is different from solving the problem" this phrase resonates with me greatly and something that I've thought about before but I was unsure of how to word it. Thank you for giving my ideas a conduit to help others understand.
Mate's thumbnail be looking like a command to die NOW
And then we have the fate series. The amount of lore and systems are really absolute absurd. My man Nasu definitely high on that kinoko
I love your videos and I am not even remotely interested in writing a story myself but your style of presenting those concepts is awesome 🎉
Magical realism is one of my favourite fantas things, taking some basic spells and fleshing out its rules and limitations, then considering all of its in-world consequences and implications. Because this is my method, magic and worldbuilding are incredibly interwoven for my projects.
Cool video tho, mainly commenting to boost this vid. ¡Keep it up!
I like magic that show characters progression in the way of knowledge, like the way a child doesn't know the truth of the universe but a accomplished scientist knows more and can manipulate nature more.
I have been thinking about this a lot while working on a story lately. What do I want the magic to do? How sharply do I want to define the limits of magic? If I choose to be vague, how much can I get away with before it feels like the answer is always “do some magic?”
You cover the topic well
Great vid, I hope you keep it up.
Changed the way you write now ⚡⚡⚡
8:55 That too, Tacos are an analogy of Devil Fruits, but also an earlier form: Popey the Sailors Spinach.
The writer not knowing about his own magic system is actually a super interesting system of "open lore" that anyone can imagine or write their own ideas for.
Basically Warhammer 40k and SCP
Irregular at magic high school has my favorite magic system. Its so in depth and I love it.
Love how you popped in with the "hi, it's me, I'm editing" the way your videos flow with things like this are amazing and unique the train of thought makes perfect sense to me
I was already loving this video and then you included One Piece. The cherry on top.
30 Seconds ago uploaded? IM HERE AND EXCITED
Now my brain is making up a hard magic system around food... 😊
As a person who never wrote an actual single story other than fantasies in their own mind, I would say that magic is just unexplained science, most times. Even the lack of rules can be a rule itself, and all that matters is consistency. If people don’t understand how it works, why? Because not many can use it? Because its rules are too complicated fot the human mind? As long as the explanation is logical, we can assume the magic has rules, they’re just hidden from everyone (even the writer may not know these rules). This is different from when the writer establishes rules and then breaks them with no explanation (usually for plot convenience), since the magic system in this case is the explanation of the weirdly coincidental events instead of a system WITH an explanation
One of my favourite “shows” has a magic system that seems completely soft at first, but is actually mostly hard, despite the fact that the magic system is literally classed as magic because it follows no rules of the real world (the story takes place in modern day real life). Even so, there are limits and explanations for every little thing that happens surrounding it
that's a solid way of understanding it! also if you don't mind, what is the show/book you're referencing? (looking for something new to watch/read and magic in a modern setting is usually fun)
Like the fey, they're considered chaotic, but actually are in an absolute mess of rules
@@m.ubaidaadam ah, if you don’t know Portuguese, I’m afraid it would be difficult to watch. The “show” I talked about isn’t actually a show, it’s a Brazilian Tabletop RPG that is streamed live on Twitch. However, there is a dedicated team that is adding English subtitles to each episode (which range from 3-5 hours usually). It’s called Paranormal Order (Ordem Paranormal in Portuguese) and it has 4 main seasons and 3 spin-offs. The basis of the story is that the Paranormal doesn’t come to our reality easily, due to the pillars of logic that society has built. But with enough fear and suffering, Entities from a dimension called Other Side can manifest into the world as terrible creatures. It’s a brutal world, and since it’s a RPG, it means not even the narrator of the story knows what the main characters will do, and main characters dying isn’t an uncommon event. It’s very different from the normal structure of a story in other media, but it works extremely well since the characters feel extremely real, so getting attached is easy after the first few episodes
The thing about the “magic system” which is the Paranormal itself, is that it seems completely soft in the first and second season. Impossible creatures appear, Cultists can cast Rituals to do impossible things. But by the third season, we learn that there are many defined rules in the Other Side, but I won’t spoil them here since figuring them out is really fun. If you still plan on watching, I’d recommend starting with the second season unless you really really want to start with the first, because in the first season, the narrator and players weren’t as experienced as they were today, so there were many things that could’ve been better. The first season is getting a remake as a graphic novel, but I don’t think that it will be translated as of release. And there’s also a game coming out this year, and I think it will be translated
@@titadogelo5090I don't speak Portuguese but I'll still check it out on twitch. also a game based on it does sound very interesting, thanks for the recommend!
@@m.ubaidaadam the subbed videos are on youtube on a channel named either Lives do Cellbit or Ordem Paranormal. The game, Enigma of Fear, releases this semester and will be about investigation and exploration, like a Silent Hill / Resident Evil combined with Outer Wilds
The wheel of time is a good example of mixing soft and hard magic
im dying at how gandalf's name slowly spirals into nonsense. when i tell u i LOST it at gandoodle and gandaddy- 💀
I have heard a sort of evolution on the "hard vs soft" which just adds a different axis of "rational and irrational". On these axis I saw them basically split two factors usually associated with the hard and soft and separate them, like the hard/soft is tackled in how its shown to the reader in the plot and the rational/irrational is more or less the lore and the background and how its shown there. For instance, under this quantrint system, a Hard/Irrational system would have quite a lot of what rules are there to be shown in the plot, but the rules are far from intricate or complex, like how a lot of(but obviously not all) superhero stories show their ability sets. The limitations and rules for a Hard/Irrational system are not there to serve the worldbuilding so much as the plot, and there are rules there for what it can due within that plot. While a Soft/Irrational would be what is thought of as a more conventional Soft Magic system, in that the magic only does what is nessisary for the plot, and it doesn't have as much grounding on the worldbuilding persay, and as far as the LoTR trilogy is considered, I would agrue that it mostly lives there, or at least seems like it(its only once you get into the wider material that it seems to actually be more of a Soft/Rational system instead). While in the Inverse, a Soft/Rational System will likely have a lot of background and lore in why the magic works like it does or what limits and consequences it has, but when shown and used in the actual plot it merely serves the Plot itself. Lastly the Hard/Rational system will likely be the most complex, while also being the most in your face about it, as its rules and limitations are connected both in the plot and the world so heavily. Due to there being two Axis, you could do what you are talking about in this video as well, but effectively expand it even further, to just throw out a bunch of random numbers, a story's magic system could be 80% rational, 20% irrational, 60% soft, and 40% hard, or something to that effect.
"No taco, no magic" is a hilarious phrase! Great video!
This really helped me think about my magic system in a new way! I was struggling with defining it as "hard magic or soft magic" because it was kind of both. Thinking about what parts of the magic is "problem solving" versus "Whimsy" really helps me go at it with a better understanding of what I want from it. Thank you!
Haven't finished the vid yet, but had to stop and give props for the awesome reference to Avatar... NOT the blue people one, the GOOD one. You have earned my respect for that!
Don't know how long you've been doing this, but I'm glad it popped up in my recommendations.
Love the presentation and energy you deliver. Looking forward to more videos!
Thumbnail all like "You should change the way you write magic NOW"
The portion of the video talking about how the ring is more hard while gandalf is more soft reminds me of a tabletop game called Tiny Dungeon, which has two major magic systems, one more soft and one more hard. Maybe you are spell-touched and you can mostly do whatever but it's never very strong or even particularly consistent and maybe you're a spell-reader who is a lot more limited not just in what they can do but how often they can do it, but you gain the advantage of consistency and knowledge. What a player (the audience) decides to be can depend on what they want magic to do for them, if they want their character to have magic at all.
This is a really cool breakdown of systems in a way I had not seen before! One book I recommend that puts this into practice is supreme magus terrible name but it uses a system of magic that has hard rules but neritively is so flexible as to encompass tens of characters core character traits and wis bang boss fights all while building interesting situations and teaching us more about the magic without internal inconsistencies highly recommended
I've written and soft-coded so many magic systems throughout my writing career, and to be honest: I never get tired of it.
It's magic! Part of the appeal is that it CAN be made to work so many different ways! One of my favorite systems I haven't had a chance to use yet is: "Spells are bound to incantations, and thus to language. That's why for any long-term spell - or even just spells we want to pass down for posterity - we prefer to write them in dead languages like Latin; it makes the spells more stable, since they're less likely to change over time."
YOU SHOULD WRITE FANTASY NOW!
No taco no magic.... I feel you man. I feel you
As a DM for table top gaming, it's a real challenge to make magic feel magical. You need rules to keep it playable, but it's all too easy to loose that mysticism and mystery in the process.
You can think of magic as some horror story protagonist: you do not understand the ghost shits, but you certainly can try to understand them and lose your mind while doing it.
And sometimes, even if you understand the magic, it might so alien for any human mind to truly grasp it. For the effect of horror, you only need to scare people, but sometimes, you can use specific rules of magic to contradict the deductions of the characters. There is no need for readers to know WHAT the rules are, and the effect, so as you said the "function", should be the center part of using "magic" in your story.
You should write like this NOW!
The amount of effort put into that screenshot at 9:57 cements my opinion that you need more subs. Glad that video popped off, this is fun stuff!
Inscribing your intent onto the tortilla, adding fillings that power it up, chilis for fire, guac for earth, etc.
These are really informative and insightful videos. I'm not a writer, but I'm gleaning more as a reader. Please keep making them!
You knew what you were doing with that thumbnail, didn't you
Writing magic, I've found, means you commit yourself to losing that sense of awe because as you're the one defining it, you know all it can or can't do in your story and why. The wonder only really remains for the audience. Hard or soft, so long as it works with the story you're trying to tell, I don't think anyone is really going to worry about defining it to the minute detail.
he really did go Low Tier God in the thumbnail.
Ngl, the thumbnail looked like a Low Tier God meme; when I read the title afterward, I split a seam, laughing at myself.
Two things:
The first: you're a really intelligent guy, and I like hearing your ideas, they're very insightful. I'm glad I found your channel
The second: the more I hear about Sanderson the more I like him. He seems like a genuinely cool dude.
TH-cam recommended the worldbuilding mistakes video to me a lot and for a while I didn't watch it because the thumbnail made me think it'd be some argument about dragons and I've heard so many prescriptive takes about dragons (how many legs, can they fly, all that that you've probably also heard) and I didn't want to hear another one. Eventually I went "eh I'll watch it, I might end up angry but at least I'll know" and then it was actually super helpful stuff and the rest of this channel has been really good too so I'm glad I decided to watch it.
Also fun to find another cosmere fan :D
I always wanted to see a story about a Magic apocalypse or magic post apocalypse.
Glad to be here before this channel totally blows up. (And before tacos become the default metaphorical device for explaining magic systems, and maybe writing in general.)
Imagine being able to influence your surroundings and fait just slightly by just your thoughts.
Irony often makes me feel like i can do that only to the opposite of the thing i want to happen happens
One thing that can further expand on this is using magic to "cause problems." I've been thinking of one of my favorite games called Vagrant Story. The whole story is set in a long dead city that effectively had a magic mini-apocalypse that causes all sorts of obstacles for the hero. Things like navigating un-natural disasters, dealing with enemies and areas that have absorbed that magic (eg undead and spirits), and dealing with antagonists that are trying to harness said magic for their own ends. The story centers around trying to unravel the mysteries of the city (what happened and how to use it to solve your own problems) while trying to accomplish your original goals throughout the game. It's particularly interesting, because it's a hard magic system that almost seems (or perhaps is) a character in and of itself.
I love writing magic systems, almost all my short stories have one or sometimes two, but after watching this I realize a problem I was making; I was trying to either define every possible rule of a magic system or I wouldn't define anything and end up with a Dues ex Machina system. This video has gave me the insight I needed to not write horrible or rigid magic systems anymore.
He explain things in the best way possible, keep doing videos please, you are the best
Love your vids man. You've got a knack for putting these concepts in a simple and easy to understand package
I had a magic system in a novella I wrote which had multiple interpretations. One group did not apply many rules and just understood it as mystical and another group tried to define everything with their science and because of that it grew in different ways. The scientific group ended up only being able to use part of it and thought that it was mostly an unusable force because they were not able to define it.
So one thing that I've seen pointed out a few places is that Sanderson usually describes Hard Rational systems and Soft Irrational systems, and while it can be difficult to write soft rational systems a lot of classic fantasy is Hard Rational for instance a lot of the 80's and 90's fantasy stuff had a very dungeons and dragons feel to it, and more recent Harry Potter esc, and so you knew what spells the wizard had and roughly what those spells could do, but there was no rational connection between throwing bolts of glowing light that could harm the undead and conjuring a ladder, and banishing a demon, and summoning a talking cat.
Ngl i never really understood soft v hard systems. This was really well explained.
The taco metaphor is hilarious, now I wanna read something with metaphysical taco powers XD
im writing a graphic novel and your videos are so helpful for my story!!! your channel is so underrated dude. MAGIC TACOS FOR THE WIN!!!
I actually quite like the idea of fiercly guarded family recipies for tacos, mixing with government requlations on food production.
This also applies to hard and soft sci-fi because as always, magic and technology are really the same thing just dressed up a little different.
Yeah, I try to write very squishy magic. There are rules out in place to manage the chaos for better understanding of the power at your fingertips. It’s like art: there are classes to learn skills and challenge ideas, but overall, art is entirely dependent on the individual
This video is incredibly interesting to me because it represents the closest thing I've seen to a video on magic systems that thinks about magic systems in a way comparable to my own. I've shared 2 parts of my theory on power systems on r/worldbuilding, and at the core of my power system theory are what I call the 3 F's of power system design: Function, Form, and Failstates. It's not a perfect analog since my power system theory leans more heavily the worldbuilding aspect while your philosophy on magic systems lean more towards the storytelling aspect and "function" in my world represents the capabilities of the power system rather than the purpose of the magic system within the story and/or world, but it's the closest thing I've found when every other idea on magic systems has focused so hard on that hard/soft dichotomy.
For me the perfect magic system is Nasuverse one. It's very complicated and sometimes controversial at glance, but more you try to understand it, more you realise that it makes sense. It has both hard "rules" and soft "fuck your rules". And it make perfect correlation between magic and science.
What has worked for me is to work out behind the curtain how I think the magic should work so that when it pops up for the story/game world it flows, it always works as I want it to even if I don't let others in on just why it works, just so there is to me a reason it will work. If I do it right its like why dose this monitor turn on when I press the button? I don't know why I don't ask about it but it works and my life moves on all the better because it dose I don't need to know the physics of LCD flat panels just that they are there.
I'm so glad that someone other than me is vocalizing that magic systems are not totally one way or the other.
Magical taco analogy is fun to think about.
The shell is the range magic has, it isn't a burrito so couldn't say make everyone in the city begin dancing uncontrollably, but some shells are hard and other soft. The hard shell taco takes longer to cast but the effects last longer while a soft shell taco is quick but falls apart. The cost of course to the caster is the spiciness of the spell, some spells are like bell peppers completely safe, while others are like ghost peppers and habeneros, a considerable amount of spicy that the more tacos eaten the more the caster feels those effects if they aren't used to them, and then of course you get really spicy tacos the ones that you feel like you are burning. It is a mistake, however to say that only those who ate spicy tacos growing up could handle them, other dishes while not necessarily being magic is able to help the mind, body, or soul with casting. I wouldn't say Thai food is the same as a taco but it is most definitely spicy and so someone growing up eating the metaphysical thai curry could learn about the magic tacos and handle the spicy cost of casting. Then what is in the taco is made up of what you want to affect and how you want to affect it, the taco can only hold so much and anything that falls out of the taco can't be put back in. The magic taco could be a one to one effect for every ingredient, like adding sliced avocados so the magic will be green lightning, but then someone will come up and point how their taco has pineapples in it, and then thinking "it's bad enough pineapples were placed on pizza, but why did you put it on a taco, get them out of my tacos now!" but still here they are with the taco with pineapples and need to figure out what spell fits or if there is a magical effect not used yet. I know already said tomato is for turning person into an animal, but pineapple is also a fruit so maybe it turns them into fictional animals? No that doesn't make sense because in this world a dragon is just as real to them as a tiger or wolf is for us. This pineapple just doesn't work and shouldn't be allowed, but making it some kind of forbidden magic just seems too interesting, well could be magic forbidden for different reasons, what if instead of thinking pineapples as a type of spell think of it again like what is affected and the taboo. We can say maybe the avocado is part of a person's mind that controls their state of mind to be calm or agitated so you eat the metaphysical taco to maybe charm someone to listen to you to be relaxed, however the pineapple is more like a person's free will manipulating how they think as though they are your puppet and because of that pineapple doesn't go on tacos as a way of protecting society. It is taboo.
But pineapple found in other dishes not pizza or taco that could still be spicy could maybe show how these things when not placed in magic taco shells could be valid.
Finally witn eating tacos your stomach gets full and need to digest before casting more, some eat one taco and get full while others get a plate of 6 or 7 before they feel the fullness, but the rule of taco is the stuff in has to stay in the shell or in you, any magic that falls out becomes lost, or maybe residual magic grease is left behind, like a city tower where the guards quickly and easily cast a barrier spell because the same spell is cast there every day that even though it's a hard shell spell to last 24 hours the residual magic of the meats and veggies that falls out of the shell remains there which also helps guards around the city tower cast spells to have protected armor or catch criminals, so thieves learned not to get too close to these places. Also some could use magic to find out what sorts of spells had been used in the place, like sensing magic was used to raise an undead army. But the magic taco eaten by the person is what makes magic manifest from some world of abstract possiblity to happening in the physical world of the story, that is why illusion is so strange because it is like the veil between what could be and what is, like a flour tortilla vs a corn tortilla being a division of various types of magic.
Of course a person must eat a taco so they can be ready for the magic of the universe to flow through them as a conduit.
Breakfast tacos only available between 6 AM and 10:30 AM, after those hours spells for things like going back in time to undo a mistake you made won't work, so not only is it Spicy but also you can't go before 6 AM so whatever you did yesterday you can't fix and after 10:30 you got to be careful.
This is very fun to think about.
You're an excellent orator of these concepts. I really appreciate the work you do.
I was about to look this up and TH-cam recommended this, so I guess the algorithm knows me really well
I think I watched this 5 times in two days just to fully absorb and think about this because it's such a different (and helpful!) way to think about magic systems. And because you are very soothing to listen to! I'll probably watch this a few more times as I keep on working, just for the different perspective from all the hard v soft videos. And that one video I found that added rational and irrational to the hard/soft graph.
Also half expected there to be a soft v hard taco joke somewhere, but the whole point of the video was to throw the soft/hard magic systems out the window so it wouldn't have made much sense xD
You're telling me I'm not the only one who uses magic tacos as a plot device?
been a while since i found myself taking notes while watching a youtube video, really good shit!
Just saw this, that was great! Thanks for your insight! Nice to see my own perspective isn't too far off from someone else's! (but yours is much better worded than mine!)
One of my favorite magic systems was Warhammer. - I’m a little bias as I used to write for GW.
The winds of magic, ley lines etc… some “hard” some “soft”. Some psychic.
And Arcane is the best damn thing I’ve seen in a decade.
I always wrote & DMed with a basic yet flexible foundation of how the world of said story works. It always worked well for me.
Super inspiring video! Got me thinking that a fun way to subvert all of this is to make the change between hard and soft magic explicitly part of the story.
You start in an oppressive society where magic is used to restrict people more than free them. Magic is used to deny magic to others, brainwash them, and stop them from even doing basic things.
The main character joins a rebel group, and their means of resistance is to find loopholes in the restrictive magic, functioning as a hard magic system. As institutions of oppression are destroyed, the rules governing and restricting magic are lifted.
To the end, the characters have to ask themselves - should some restrictive magic remain? Or should humanity remove all boundaries, allowing thought alone to mold reality in any way? Is it right for them or others to decide where such boundaries are?
I've come up with a magic system so firmly soft that the people in the world I've made have created their own magic systems within the magic system
When I was 4, I had a dream about Cinderella. Hear me out, if I didn't have that ONE dream, my life would be totally different. Well, not THAT different, but just hear me out.
That dream somehow led to me creating a magic wizard with a pink wand that could conjure up anything they wanted. Or that I wanted, that's the character I used to use in my light sleep. I'd use my dreams and ideas to add to this world and I did that until around 3-4 years back. I dunno what happened, I just stopped. I also had a pixie that I'd have follow me around IRL (I was a weird child, still am) but that also kinda stopped after a bit too.
Until recently where I saw an animatic and was finally inspired enough to get back into my imaginary worlds. A few weeks before seeing this animatic, I went back to a story I just couldn't seem to start. Back when I was younger, I'd only add to the stories whilst I was asleep, and that habit carried on into when I first started this story, which must've been around 5 months ago?
And then I realised I can just do it during the day as well lol. The best part and what really kicked things off was when I made my own music playlist, and from there started creating stories from the music I listened to.
Around 5 months and 13 crafted stories later, I have decided I'm gonna get serious about this and create a magic system (I actually wanted to get serious 3 months ago when I was working on the storyline to "Bubble of The Gods" (shut up I know it's a shite title) and I have done work to get there, it's just I REALLY want to do it now, like my dopamine spikes are concerning). So Magic System.
And there's my weird story on my why brain decided storytelling was going to be my biggest love and regret
TL;DR screw you Cinderella, I now make stories
This one of the best channels i've ever seen about writing
This helped me a lot working in my game (im a dev) so i'll add the taco in it as a reference to this helpfull video
Thanks!
In case you want to know, the main function of my magic system is to add more uniqueness, power and possibilities to the characters (Since the system works with the soul of the person (Personality, tastes, hobbies, memories and past experiences)). Furthermore, the system is explained with a minimum of science and fantasy.
I love these videos because they focus on concept rather than craft. Loving the “story theory” rather than “writing rules”
You have the Most "good teacher" voice that i have ever heard
Good video
I found your channel last video and I've been in love with your content ever since. The wacky analogies and the niche references (well I guess not so niche, but still) are what I really enjoy. Keep up the great content!
I like having a mix of hard and soft. Like, hard magic is wizards (and MCU sorcerers) who have to learn rituals and spells and hand-signs and material components and artefacts, while also having High Elves who are magical beings who can do a lot of things on a whim, without spells and rituals.
As an aside, I am reminded of "Dungeons and Dragons: Honour Amongst Thieves". D&D is a pretty hard magic system, because it is a game, but the movie took some liberties with the limits of some magic shown (like the shapeshifter tiefling being able to shapeshift more than twice a day). The movie clung close to the game, but took some gentle liberties because it worked for the story, and the medium it was told in.
Sanderson's hard and soft magics are good concepts for a worldbuilder to begin the thinking process, I think it's eyeopening when you go to that rabbit hole but in the Wonderland, there's much more.
What I like about Stands from JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure is they have rules, rules can broken on purpose, however since they’re manifestations of the soul, there’s usually a good reason if they’re breaking rules.