Makes sense the grapes from planes shouldn't be too powerful since it's only a $500 crosspath, but damn didn't expect a downgrade lol Check out more update buffs in previous videos here: th-cam.com/video/gegySnqaPac/w-d-xo.html
@@amphiapple7890 sharpening stone still works on the entire tower (it works on xx2 bomb shooters and even the 400 and 500 engi sentries despite being able to pop lead)
Well, I think the fighter plane from 400 boat do more damage than 410 and 420 probably due to the radical damage buff (1 to 2) during this update, so the fighter plane of 410/420 boat in 37 update can still possibly outperform those in 36 update.
@@craigstephenson7676There is way better ddts killers than the aircraft carriers, and a tower becoming worse than before should not happen with crosspathing.
They’re balancing the double shot with future upgrades in mind, pirate upgrades are already really good, with the 3 canons and hooks, and now destroyer fixed 2x attack speed on everything plus another dart, Having 10 grapes fired 2x would he extremely good, and even just having 6 firing at 2x is more damage than 10 at 1x speed.
it's technically a buff for top path, the 6 grapes not the planes. The grapes are only 6 now but fired at 2x speed so it's 12 grapes in the same amount of time that it was 10 before. it's mostly a nerf to middle path.
@@lihavalokki5705 I think the alch buff doesn't run out faster. The attack speed of the Destroyer wasn't changed, but now also applied to the grapes. The main attack that drains the alch buff are the darts and they weren't changed
Just occured to me: I think the reason hot shots is so much worse is cause they specifically buffed the dart attack of the base aircraft carrier in this same update. They increased the radial darts from 1 damage to 2, presumably because they figured without that buff hot shots would be too good by comparison. But most of the damage from hot shots is damage over time, which doesn't stack. Without the DoT they only do 1 damage, while the normal radial darts now do 2. In theory hot shots should be slightly better cause in most other ways they're similar (same pierce, 8 spread projectiles vs 6 focused ones), but that one change makes the base carrier just better
@@jasonbechdolt386 huh Yeah you're right, I tested it myself and they seem to do 2 damage with no DoT. Also tried normal grapes and they were the same, so I guess the hot shot upgrade adds nothing beyond visuals? And the main reason it's worse is actually just that it's fewer projectiles (guess cause of the way monkey aces fly past their target the forward spread doesn't help any over radial darts)
the 360° attack that they do without having to be aiming at a bloon (i'll call it their passive attack) is replaced by the grapeshots, but the rapidfire attack they do when aiming at bloons is still there. it's basically the same as the main tower except the grapeshots fire constantly. if they added grapeshots on TOP of the passive attack and kept it the same, it would be way more powerful
Why question this of all things? Not the fact of monkeys popping balloons in the most random places on earth? If your gonna question the small things, you gotta question the big things 🤣
I wasnt too sure if it was an upgrade or not in terms of raw numbers but goddamn if it isnt visually an upgrade when you spam aircraft carriers and the whole screen is filled with grapeshot
The lower damage is mainly because of the pierce difference between the boat darts and grapes. If NK insist on having this change, they should at least match the pierce of the darts with grapes so that it isn't a downgrade. They could also increase the planes grape projectiles count to match the darts so that the grapes are a straight upgrade(against non-purples). Also buying hot shot grapes was probably a detriment as the fire damage isn't worth losing the sharp damage typing which would otherwise benefit from +1 damage and pierce from sharpening stone.
Would the reason why the grapes seemed to make the Aircraft Carrier weaker be that the grapes have lower pierce than the darts? Just wondering because I'm sure that the darts have way more pierce, and the test in the video showed the two crosspaths in action against r98. If that's the case then this would mean that NK gave the tower a single target crosspath and a pierce/camo crosspath, which I honestly really like.
The radial darts deal 2 damage while the grapes only deal 1. The pierce is the same for both of them though. Worthy of note is that the plane’s grapes don’t set bloons on fire
That would totally kill crosspathing as you'd always go mid path. Mid path is still generally better thanks to the boat gaining grapes, but if you're in a situation where the boat is going to do little damage compared to the planes/ you need camo, then bottom path is a usable choice. The way they did it is far more interesting gameplay wise, just adding the grapes would've been boring.
@@mreli_ I literally said mid path is better because the boat gets so strong. Even though the planes are slightly weaker, it's worth making them weaker for the boat itself to become so strong.
There is a super easy fix for this buff you just make the grapes fire slightly slower and add back the darts in all directions Or if you wanna keep just the grapes either more pierce or like 50 percent more attack speed
I've used the updated carrier once so far and read the patch notes, did not realize the grapes replaced the forward firing darts, i thought it still had those and that the grapes just replaced darts that sprayed out around the planes like normal aces, giving it better forward facing damage bc it reduced the spread
I'm pretty sure the Double Shot description change happened before 37.0. Probably because even before this update it didn't actually double the middle path bombs.
3:45 it's actually a nerf due to the massively decreased alch buff uptime, unless you are using permabrew destroyers (Not sure if that's what he goes, haven't watched the rest of video)
"Oh no, it's using 2 projectiles of my 40 instead of 1" Bloonjitsu + caltrops, who literally doesn't lose any uptime, even with near/max shinobi army: I have no weeknesses
The change to the tier 3 I really like and I ended up doing a 2megapops challenge with the 3-2-0 and it was one of my favorite 2 megapops I've ever done
I think it would be neat if the planes kept the radial spray of darts, but also gained a small spray of grapes in the front, maybe only like 4 or something
ngl when i saw another ytber making a vid about the grapes i legit thought it was clickbait for a mod video, only seeing ISAB making a vid abt it made me realise it wasn't a mod
isab you said that call to arms only effects towers close to it but in patch 35 they made it so it is now a global buff so they explains the extra high pop counts on the towers.
Sorry to say the sharping stone does not effect hot shot grapes, what with them not being sharp damage, it just adding pierce to the main attack sadly.
@@josardoleon6894 yes but before when you buy it you automatically lose the buff like with any upgrade that can't be sharpened and cannot use stone on it
Its a shame as plane boat i feel has always been the weakest as pirate lord is pirate lord and bottom path greeds and now they've just made it worse when it really needs a buff
I was always under the impression that the radial attack was useless. When I read the patch notes I was excited for something more useful but here we are...
Wait but something doesn't make sense most of the damage when Moabs are around is from the missile right so if it loses the missile it's bad if not it's better cause it's still a moab poper but it cleans up
3-2-0 boat wasn't shooting grapes with the same attack speed as darts? As far as i remember destroyer upgrade ALSO apllied to grapes and shot them with great speed even without that "pseudo-nerf update", they just needed an excuse to reduce the amount of grapes per shot, because lets be honest - 10 grapes per shot were shredding most waves + if you had some source of camo detection, that 320 boat could carry you through many waves only by itself, without any buffs.
You need 4-2-0 alchemist on your carrier only wayyyyy early in the game instead of super late, and make sure there's only carrier within alch range otherwise it won't work.
Makes sense the grapes from planes shouldn't be too powerful since it's only a $500 crosspath, but damn didn't expect a downgrade lol
Check out more update buffs in previous videos here: th-cam.com/video/gegySnqaPac/w-d-xo.html
Im glad that they buffed the buccaneer
@@Saneo9 fr
hmmmm
You nerfed your own sharpening stone by buying hot shot, 410 is stronger
@@amphiapple7890 sharpening stone still works on the entire tower (it works on xx2 bomb shooters and even the 400 and 500 engi sentries despite being able to pop lead)
I was so surprised when the update dropped and the planes were worse in every way. It was so funny
Well, I think the fighter plane from 400 boat do more damage than 410 and 420 probably due to the radical damage buff (1 to 2) during this update, so the fighter plane of 410/420 boat in 37 update can still possibly outperform those in 36 update.
@@whatiskz1557 It's just really weird that by upgrading to the grape shot you are actively making your fighters worse. Not a lot of upgrades do that
@@lifetake3103but you are trading them being worse for popping DDTs
@@craigstephenson7676There is way better ddts killers than the aircraft carriers, and a tower becoming worse than before should not happen with crosspathing.
@@DemiCape the tower still does more damage when you factor in the main attack, but it’s still pretty goofy
Double shot should add more than one extra grape, and the mini plane grapes really need some buff xD
They’re balancing the double shot with future upgrades in mind, pirate upgrades are already really good, with the 3 canons and hooks, and now destroyer fixed 2x attack speed on everything plus another dart,
Having 10 grapes fired 2x would he extremely good, and even just having 6 firing at 2x is more damage than 10 at 1x speed.
it's technically a buff for top path, the 6 grapes not the planes. The grapes are only 6 now but fired at 2x speed so it's 12 grapes in the same amount of time that it was 10 before. it's mostly a nerf to middle path.
@@sirdogs8766 Is it really a buff without having a perma brew tho? Your alch buffs also drain twice as fast.
Idk maybe a grape plus 1 pierce buff for miniplanes
@@lihavalokki5705
I think the alch buff doesn't run out faster. The attack speed of the Destroyer wasn't changed, but now also applied to the grapes. The main attack that drains the alch buff are the darts and they weren't changed
Just occured to me: I think the reason hot shots is so much worse is cause they specifically buffed the dart attack of the base aircraft carrier in this same update. They increased the radial darts from 1 damage to 2, presumably because they figured without that buff hot shots would be too good by comparison. But most of the damage from hot shots is damage over time, which doesn't stack. Without the DoT they only do 1 damage, while the normal radial darts now do 2. In theory hot shots should be slightly better cause in most other ways they're similar (same pierce, 8 spread projectiles vs 6 focused ones), but that one change makes the base carrier just better
The hot shots actually don’t seem to be inflicting their debuff at the moment
@@jasonbechdolt386 huh
Yeah you're right, I tested it myself and they seem to do 2 damage with no DoT. Also tried normal grapes and they were the same, so I guess the hot shot upgrade adds nothing beyond visuals? And the main reason it's worse is actually just that it's fewer projectiles (guess cause of the way monkey aces fly past their target the forward spread doesn't help any over radial darts)
Since the grapes don't replace the darts fired by the main tower, they should probably consider keeping the darts fired by the planes.
the 360° attack that they do without having to be aiming at a bloon (i'll call it their passive attack) is replaced by the grapeshots, but the rapidfire attack they do when aiming at bloons is still there. it's basically the same as the main tower except the grapeshots fire constantly.
if they added grapeshots on TOP of the passive attack and kept it the same, it would be way more powerful
Who even flies the mini planes? Mini monkeys? And how are the grapes stored?
Yes
Why question this of all things? Not the fact of monkeys popping balloons in the most random places on earth? If your gonna question the small things, you gotta question the big things 🤣
@@downest1 like what?
Slave children monkeys thats who flies the planes
@@downest1why not? Just because some things make no sense doesn't mean we should ignore all other problems
Truly a plane moment of all time.
Agreed
@@caydenkillian8904 Agreed
@@arnandoferdian5098Agreed
At first I thought it was going to be an additional attack with the darts
5:00 ISAB bought the discount village, I’m glad he’s not kidnapped anymore! Welcome back ISAB :)
They should make middle path buff grape count back to 10, or at least 8 imo
Yeah because the upgrade name is "double shot"
double shot doesnt double shots
just like armor piercing darts cant pierce armor
🙁
I wasnt too sure if it was an upgrade or not in terms of raw numbers but goddamn if it isnt visually an upgrade when you spam aircraft carriers and the whole screen is filled with grapeshot
The lower damage is mainly because of the pierce difference between the boat darts and grapes. If NK insist on having this change, they should at least match the pierce of the darts with grapes so that it isn't a downgrade. They could also increase the planes grape projectiles count to match the darts so that the grapes are a straight upgrade(against non-purples).
Also buying hot shot grapes was probably a detriment as the fire damage isn't worth losing the sharp damage typing which would otherwise benefit from +1 damage and pierce from sharpening stone.
I've always thought that the mini planes should fire grapes, but I never thought it'd be a downgrade
Sad moment for this cross path. I did enjoy it a good bit before the update. It wasn’t crazy strong, but could be useful at times.
Would the reason why the grapes seemed to make the Aircraft Carrier weaker be that the grapes have lower pierce than the darts? Just wondering because I'm sure that the darts have way more pierce, and the test in the video showed the two crosspaths in action against r98. If that's the case then this would mean that NK gave the tower a single target crosspath and a pierce/camo crosspath, which I honestly really like.
the problem is that there are so many more darts
Also the grapes spread so they're kinda worse for single target anyway
The radial darts deal 2 damage while the grapes only deal 1. The pierce is the same for both of them though. Worthy of note is that the plane’s grapes don’t set bloons on fire
@@cornonjacoband the radial darts don't spread?
The accuracy is worse.
Why would they remove the darts? Just keep the darts and add the grapes
That would totally kill crosspathing as you'd always go mid path. Mid path is still generally better thanks to the boat gaining grapes, but if you're in a situation where the boat is going to do little damage compared to the planes/ you need camo, then bottom path is a usable choice. The way they did it is far more interesting gameplay wise, just adding the grapes would've been boring.
@@FrostyTheCookie but now middle path is useless
@@mreli_ I literally said mid path is better because the boat gets so strong. Even though the planes are slightly weaker, it's worth making them weaker for the boat itself to become so strong.
@@FrostyTheCookie 3-2-0 or 3-1-0 exist
There is a super easy fix for this buff you just make the grapes fire slightly slower and add back the darts in all directions
Or if you wanna keep just the grapes either more pierce or like 50 percent more attack speed
I've used the updated carrier once so far and read the patch notes, did not realize the grapes replaced the forward firing darts, i thought it still had those and that the grapes just replaced darts that sprayed out around the planes like normal aces, giving it better forward facing damage bc it reduced the spread
Nope, it replaced the 360 degree 8 dart spread, not the main guns, grapes have better single target, but way less pierce, so its worse against groups
Was I the only one that was yelling at isab to USE JAR OF PICKLES in the last like 6 rounds-
I'm pretty sure the Double Shot description change happened before 37.0. Probably because even before this update it didn't actually double the middle path bombs.
"one of the balance changes of all time"
-ISAB 2023
3:45 it's actually a nerf due to the massively decreased alch buff uptime, unless you are using permabrew destroyers
(Not sure if that's what he goes, haven't watched the rest of video)
"Oh no, it's using 2 projectiles of my 40 instead of 1"
Bloonjitsu + caltrops, who literally doesn't lose any uptime, even with near/max shinobi army: I have no weeknesses
The destoyer change is not a buff, as it was always paired with alchemist, and its alchemist uptime has now been heavily reduced. :(
never seen a single person using the alch with the destroyer
@@byMDRMHow though. The alch is literally one of the best towers to pair with destroyer
I knew that the DPS was less. The 520 also now shoots much less darts with the fighter planes than before. it's a really big nerf.
Devs didnt intend it to be a nerf, they wanted the tower to stay just as powerful, but failed to realize that grapes would lack pierce
Imagine if the aircraft can shoot grapes. Now that would be great to see. If only the grape planes shot grapes twice as fast.
The change to the tier 3 I really like and I ended up doing a 2megapops challenge with the 3-2-0 and it was one of my favorite 2 megapops I've ever done
>give planes an extra attack
>they become worse
Truly an NK moment of all time
truly a grape moment of all time
Sharpening stone doesn't affect the hot shot grapes because they are fire type, not sharp.
I think the new balance changes are to make the bottem cross path look more appealing
It should be the opposite because merchant is so used
@@asmael4456 yeah, it should be. But at least the idea of the mini planes shooting grapes sound fun
I think it would be neat if the planes kept the radial spray of darts, but also gained a small spray of grapes in the front, maybe only like 4 or something
I love how planes in this game can shoot grapes lol
I genuinely burst into laughter when I saw it
A small plane can shoot tens of thousands of grapes that are half the plane's size without ever restocking
ngl when i saw another ytber making a vid about the grapes i legit thought it was clickbait for a mod video, only seeing ISAB making a vid abt it made me realise it wasn't a mod
isab you said that call to arms only effects towers close to it but in patch 35 they made it so it is now a global buff so they explains the extra high pop counts on the towers.
Nooo I loved the grape shot with double shot, it looked satisfying for some reason and cool😂
Thank you ISAB for graping all over the bloons.
Groping*
/j
@@iDontReallyKnowTbh Pause
@@iDontReallyKnowTbh Chocking
@@legendarytronic7774 Continue
Downgrade in damage but probably an upgrade in terms of causing the game to lag.
Sorry to say the sharping stone does not effect hot shot grapes, what with them not being sharp damage, it just adding pierce to the main attack sadly.
7:44 Since when can you use the sharp on a ship with hot shots? Before you can't
It still affects the darts
@@josardoleon6894 yes but before when you buy it you automatically lose the buff like with any upgrade that can't be sharpened and cannot use stone on it
Its a shame as plane boat i feel has always been the weakest as pirate lord is pirate lord and bottom path greeds and now they've just made it worse when it really needs a buff
I feel like the grapes from planes should fire the rate as the main carrier but that's just me
7:15 yup, that's r95
Thank you ISAB for popping the bloons as ISAB
I was always under the impression that the radial attack was useless. When I read the patch notes I was excited for something more useful but here we are...
Try the birthday party quest, pretty neat and fun
I thought I noticed that in a game recently …. Yeah … very nice
I was confused at first, thought it was a glitch
Destroyer 3-2-0 + Village 2-3-0 spam beats water CHIMPS maps so easily now
Its actually worse now, destroyer now shoots a bit less grapes per minute, and shoots more often, meaning alch buff wears off faster
It’s a nice change they nerfed the normal grape shot from the 3 0 0 but then buffed the planes and gave it grape shot
i suppose the general idea was to nerf 2-5-0 boat since grapes could pretty much 1-shot ceramics
hey isab, been watching you since BTD6 released! keep up the good work. love ya stuff as always!
yo I can shoot grapes now 👀
Modern military plane uses flaming grapes as projectiles, seems legit
What I don’t understand it shoots out fire, but it doesn’t ignite them only the ship does
Wait but something doesn't make sense most of the damage when Moabs are around is from the missile right so if it loses the missile it's bad if not it's better cause it's still a moab poper but it cleans up
funny boat is even funnier to look at now
I didn't look at the patch notes and this was kinda a funny surprise.
That's... Really weird but sort of makes sense. Even though it doesn't
A tier 4 shouldn't be able to beat chimps anyways, even with every buff
My brother in christ has never heard of the Wizard Monkey, the Super Monkey, the Heli Pilot, or of the Monkey Ace
2megapops was beaten with a tier 2 sub before airburst got nerfed to the ground
Only NinjaKiwi can grant a tower an extra attack and then be able to NERF it xD
Omfg guys are you for real??
Now waiting for navarch start shooting normal grapes with 1 pierce and damage each
Thank you Isab for shooting grapes from a plane.
13:20 BAD news? Final answer?
Thank you Isab for using the Aircraft carrier to "Grape" the bloons
Thankyou Isab, for showcasing one of the changes ever
He he, ig we are all gonna have to do a 2 megga pop challenge with the top path boat
3-2-0 boat wasn't shooting grapes with the same attack speed as darts?
As far as i remember destroyer upgrade ALSO apllied to grapes and shot them with great speed even without that "pseudo-nerf update", they just needed an excuse to reduce the amount of grapes per shot, because lets be honest - 10 grapes per shot were shredding most waves + if you had some source of camo detection, that 320 boat could carry you through many waves only by itself, without any buffs.
Great video, will we be seeing more wizard paragon content soon?
i think the 5 2 0 also needs a buff coz currently its only used as support
I was trying to get navarch so i placed a bunch of 4-2-0 boats and the amount grapes i saw crashed my game
10:29 Is it just me or are the grapes from the mini planes not affecting the DDTs? Or at least they're not applying DoT
They're not applying DoT to anything at all. Probably yet another bug or oversight in this update XD
Overclock doesn't affect the mini planes? Why not? Really doesn't make sense to me.
Sad, the 5 2 0 Buckner was my favorite tower in the game
You need 4-2-0 alchemist on your carrier only wayyyyy early in the game instead of super late, and make sure there's only carrier within alch range otherwise it won't work.
7:17 "Round 95"
This is just plane nuts. Grape nuts.
They've actually made Boat the best tower
No, every boat with grape crosspath got slightly nerfed, including all 5th tiers
@@josardoleon6894 Boat is still a really good tower
1:25 “Zzz Dart Monkey”
carrier flagship should have both the grapes and the darts
i wonder what do the 0-2-0 boats grapes taste like
kinda wish the 5th tier also spawned some pursuit helis
Does this for once make the 502 boat someone's ok biting?
You forgot the upgraded sharpening stone on the first run. I'm not sure how it works though.
Dabloon did it first so Isab had to do it on a harder map
2mp is can also be done on logs
If it was alc buff perfect the upgrade it was a lot better even tier 4 i mean top path tier 4 even planes.
We already seen Dabloon do this.
Love your vids keep up with the hard work ❤❤❤
13:45 imagine if the 69 cash run won
400 Alchemist really doesn't take a lot of pops even if you drop it early.
It really does tho, by the end of chimps runs my alch has around 60k pops
why did they even remove the darts to begin with
When I saw this the other day I was soooo confused
so you're telling me etien and boat is a free round 80 now
Grapes got nerfed across the board
Still waiting for degree 1 magus vs degree 100 magus
PERFECT TIMING I JUST FINISHED DINNERRRR
Why not crosspath the alch to 420?
This is really a plane moment
Buccaneers too good so they nerfed them, I always use merchantmen anyway
I was wondering why the frisbee kept getting bigger and bigger…
And then it hit me.
Bruh you didn't show or say whether the pop counts were good at the end???