Why Dawkins is wrong | Denis Noble interview

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 มี.ค. 2024
  • In this interview, esteemed biologist Denis Noble explains why our approach to biology is the wrong way around.
    We thought that the sequencing of genetic information would unlock vast developments in medical cures for a whole host of illnesses. However, sequencing the genome alone hasn't revolutionised medicine. Denis Noble argues that we have our treatments the wrong way around. Instead, we need to recognise that genes are not on/off switches, and move beyond dualism in Biology.
    Watch world-famous scientist Richard Dawkins go head-to-head with celebrated biologist Denis Noble as they debate the role of genes over the eons at iai.tv/video/the-gene-machine...
    00:00 Introduction
    00:26 Why does the idea of genetic determinism have such a lasting appeal?
    06:13 What do you see as the fault of this gene-centric Neo-Darwinian picture?
    11:22 How did Darwin's view get distorted by Neo-Darwinism?
    14:18 What is the alternative to genetic determinism?
    17:55 Can determinism come from the environment?
    22:37 What do you make of CRISPR and human enhancement?
    24:53 What is the biggest question in molecular biology at the moment?
    Oxford Professor and one of the pioneers of Systems Biology, Noble developed the first viable mathematical model of the working heart in 1960.
    #DenisNoble #GeneticDeterminism #NeoDarwinism
    The Institute of Art and Ideas features videos and articles from cutting edge thinkers discussing the ideas that are shaping the world, from metaphysics to string theory, technology to democracy, aesthetics to genetics. Subscribe today! iai.tv/subscribe?Y...
    For debates and talks: iai.tv
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  • @TheInstituteOfArtAndIdeas
    @TheInstituteOfArtAndIdeas  9 หลายเดือนก่อน +50

    Watch world-famous scientist Richard Dawkins go head-to-head with celebrated biologist Denis Noble as they debate the role of genes over the eons at iai.tv/video/the-gene-machine?TH-cam&+comment&

    • @bengeurden1272
      @bengeurden1272 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      Dawkins doesn't go "go head-to-head with" with this guy. What kind of superficial TH-cam channel this has become...

    • @welingkartr416
      @welingkartr416 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      Wonderful interview! Thanks a lot. I appreciate the interviewer too, who leads the conversation so logically and very well, making even a layman like me appreciate what is being discussed.
      I had tried reading Richard Dawkins' "The Selfish Gene" years ago, but couldn't complete reading it, for I felt he placed the Gene on a pedestal. Almost made it an all-omniscient, new God hidden deep in every cell that knew its way through every challenge that evolution and nature threw at it. Denis Noble's interview brings out interesting, logical details that are far more appealing.

    • @laurier3348
      @laurier3348 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Ya, but he's old

    • @winifredherman4214
      @winifredherman4214 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      @@welingkartr416 I've read all of Dawkins. The Selfish Gene was fantastic!

    • @welingkartr416
      @welingkartr416 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@winifredherman4214 I know. Many people liked it-and like it to this date- and people recommended it, but somehow I found the idea of an apotheosized gene, problematic.

  • @martinlawrence8427
    @martinlawrence8427 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +91

    What a treat to listen to Professor Noble!

    • @OnceTheyNamedMeiWasnt
      @OnceTheyNamedMeiWasnt 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      One day you too will be a professor and we will say the same about you.

  • @znarfranzi
    @znarfranzi 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +143

    I am glad to see that there are so many comments. The clash of paradigms is important for the advance in science, as Thomas Kuhn wrote in his book on scientific revolutions. Denis Noble has put forward a contrasting and more holistic one to the currently prevailing and highly reductionistic molecular biology. In my opinion, you have to have a basic understanding of systems biology to fully grasp what Denis Noble says. He also gave a good advice to his former student to keep these ideas to himself. If, as a young scientist, you do not stick with the main paradigms of the time, you get no positive reviews and, as a consequence, no funding. Denis Noble now is in a position to do so and he merits all the attention and reflection that he can get.

    • @mathiaschaves7604
      @mathiaschaves7604 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +26

      My hypothesis is that the system of peer-review have this effect of reinforcing the status quo making more difficult to disruptive work to be published due to rejection of such ideas. Other problem may be that the way we avaliate the goodnes of a scientist is heavily skewed towards those who produce more pappers and have more citations. This makes difficult to new clever minds to be heard and appreciated.
      However I don't have data to prove or chalenge my point.

    • @upturnedblousecollar5811
      @upturnedblousecollar5811 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      In my opinion, you're both trying to sound more intelligent than you actually are.

    • @znarfranzi
      @znarfranzi 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      @@mathiaschaves7604 Well, Lynn Margulis admitted submitting her famous endosymbiosis paper perisitently to more than ten jounals until a sympathetic editor accepted it for publication ....

    • @alexappleby8677
      @alexappleby8677 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      It's actually quite sad that the "pressure to publish" system that has been created encourages over-skeptisism, cultish thought and gatekeeping preventing new thought.😢

    • @terencefield3204
      @terencefield3204 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Do not to clash your paradigms in frnt of me sonny, there are ladies present.

  • @pyxxel
    @pyxxel 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

    I absolutely love having access to brilliant minds here on the cyberspace! Listening to Noble and other amazing minds is a real treat and a feast for a hungry mind. Thank you!

    • @pyxxel
      @pyxxel 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Jbat-xf5pv I am totally wrinkled! In fairness I wanted to write "on the internet" but changed my mind without changing the sentence structure. Thanks for your valuable contribution to the discussion!

  • @folee_edge
    @folee_edge 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    I love this channel. It totally challenges me to review my assumptions without degrading logical thought or scientific methodology. THANK YOU.

  • @alienspotter422
    @alienspotter422 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +60

    A joy to listen to this noble man. Thank you.

    • @induchopra3014
      @induchopra3014 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      I like his openness. His open mind. Thats amazing. A scientist with open mind is rarei

    • @jasontoddman7265
      @jasontoddman7265 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Pun unintended?

  • @DiscipleOfHeavyMeta1
    @DiscipleOfHeavyMeta1 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +110

    Very dialectical. This is the kind of talk we need more often. These reality checks.

    • @vernonhedge4530
      @vernonhedge4530 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      I found it botnobaglasmic.

    • @jikkh2x
      @jikkh2x 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Go back to mismanaging your garden tankie

    • @andywomack3414
      @andywomack3414 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      What reality does this check?

    • @samjackgreen
      @samjackgreen 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      (dialectical would mean he intentionally presents two conflicting viewpoints, as a method to arrive at the truth.)

    • @johnschuh8616
      @johnschuh8616 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Dawkins is a true believer. Noble is a scientist.

  • @uingaeoc3905
    @uingaeoc3905 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +113

    Denis is one of those wonderful genuine intellectuals. I knew him 40 years ago at Balliol before his retirement.

    • @Dodgerzden
      @Dodgerzden 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      I've never even heard of him but your assessment is exactly my thoughts after listening to him for just a couple of minutes.

    • @willpeony5534
      @willpeony5534 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@Dodgerzden I never heard of Balliol.

    • @DanielJones-wj7mm
      @DanielJones-wj7mm 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      @@willpeony5534 : Don't worry if you have not heard of Balliol. It's a small insignificant college of Oxford University which was founded in 1263 by John de Balliol of Bernard Castle, Durham and which has produced five Nobel Laureates. smh.

    • @elizabethcsicsery-ronay1633
      @elizabethcsicsery-ronay1633 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@DanielJones-wj7mm Good answer , I had a girlfriend who had a Rhodes scholarship from America to Balliol.

    • @john_mckinney
      @john_mckinney 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Let me think….how can I make this about me?

  • @aemrng
    @aemrng 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

    Great interviewer too. Congratulations even if we don’t know who you are. That’s how it’s done sir 🫡

    • @radwanabu-issa4350
      @radwanabu-issa4350 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Horrible interviewer with that sleepy too confident voice!

  • @olafshomkirtimukh9935
    @olafshomkirtimukh9935 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +47

    How lovely it is simply to _listen_ to such old school Englishmen! One hardly ever hears English being spoken so beautifully these days. And his command of the queen of tongues is the perfect vehicle for his ideas. Truly noble, Mr. Noble.

    • @yy3hh
      @yy3hh 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

      never thought there would be english supremacists

    • @mito88
      @mito88 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      ​@@yy3hh rule brittania

    • @bobtaylor170
      @bobtaylor170 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      @@yy3hh you're just eaten up with envy.

    • @batcollins3714
      @batcollins3714 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Bet you voted for Brexit too 😂😂😂😂😂

    • @serpentines6356
      @serpentines6356 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      I love listening to good spoken English too.
      Roger Scruton, also one of my favs. His talks on the value of beauty are so needed in this modern world.
      "Why Beauty Matters".
      So important.
      American actress Betty Davis was an outstanding speaker.

  • @stevemawer848
    @stevemawer848 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    How nice to see an interview without cutting to shots of the interviewer nodding sagely while the interviewee talks. Correct priorities here!

  • @fraserwebster8761
    @fraserwebster8761 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +53

    I worked with Professor Noble about 15 years ago as an intern on one of his video production projects. A really interesting man, someone who when he speaks, a room listens. Glad to see he's still going strong and well. If you're reading this (I highly doubt that you are) I hope you're well, and thank you for teaching me so much!

  • @skarphld
    @skarphld 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    That was magnificent. Thank you so much.😊

  • @DarkForcesStudio
    @DarkForcesStudio 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    God please bless me with Denis Noble's clarity of thought when I'm 86.

  • @geo24793
    @geo24793 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

    Absolutely amazing and illuminating interview! Really well informed and well put questions from the interviewer and obvious genius in the responses - 10/10

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      I don't find misrepresenting Dawkins amazing at all, let alone well informed or illuminating.

    • @BearGryllsSpoofs
      @BearGryllsSpoofs 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      ⁠@@ConserpovI’m just slowly getting in this gentleman and Dawkins. What is particularly misrepresenting within this video?

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@BearGryllsSpoofs
      Noble, apparently, didn't even read Dawkins' books past the title.
      Noble straw-mans Dawkins and then just repeats Dawkins' own points as his "rebuttal".
      "Dawkins rejects epigenetics", "Dawkins is a genetic determinist/reductionist" are just most ludicrous examples.

    • @kammonkam4905
      @kammonkam4905 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@Conserpoviai likes to give a platform to pseudo intellectuals good at only serving word salad. It is easy to win accolades by being verbose.

  • @Allen1029
    @Allen1029 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

    Wonderful man. We need to continue cultivating minds like his.

  • @zarathustra8789
    @zarathustra8789 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +78

    Such a pleasure to listen to this extremely informative conversation. Thank you.

    • @terjehansen0101
      @terjehansen0101 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Nobody cares. Why do you write these generic one liners ?

  • @christophercousins184
    @christophercousins184 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +159

    Kind of confusing for me... It's been a while, but as I recall Dawkins didn't claim that sequencing the human genome would solve all of our medical problems in his book, "The Selfish Gene." Dawkins' book is a "zoomed-out" general narrative about the complexity of genetic expression leading to speciation in the environment and, as Noble says himself, is probably the best book out there explaining NeoDarwinism.
    It seems to me, what we are learning about epigenetic function and environmental impacts expand on Dawkins' thesis and doesn't necessarily contradict any claims he made there... Sure there are details that are off, but the book still works as an excellent and very accessible book on evolution.
    Other than that, his claims are fairly reasonable (though, general), but I do feel Dawkins got "straw-manned" (I know for certain that Dawkins does not believe that our genetic make up solely determines our behavior).
    I have to look up the debate/discussion between these two and, hopefully, I'll be able to understand Noble's objections more clearly.

    • @zah936
      @zah936 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Thanks

    • @Paul_C
      @Paul_C 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      Darwin couldn't have an 'opinion' about genetics: It wasn't known in his era. So neo-darwin is a nonsensical term😊

    • @christophercousins184
      @christophercousins184 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      @@Paul_C Yes, he wouldn't have used the word gene but he asserted there were mechanisms governing inherited traits. But I was referring to Dawkin's book, "The Selfish Gene."
      I also am not a fan of the label "Neo-Darwinism," but went ahead and used it in this context as I didn't want to wade into that argument.
      best to you.

    • @livrowland171
      @livrowland171 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      Dawkins has said as humans we are not obliged to just act due to programming by our genes and can be better than that, as far as I recall. But his book was written before recent discoveries I epigenetics so it wouldn't be surprising if parts might be out of date.

    • @alexappleby8677
      @alexappleby8677 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      Reading between the lines, I think Noble's critique of Dawkins is that his ideas are routed in determinism. I think if Dawkins were to have written the Selfish Gene now, it still would have been a deterministic text, just that the mechanisms would have been more complex taking into account heritable and non-heritable epigenetics (though obviously this is just my opinion). I think what Noble is saying is that the way in which biomolecular systems employ stochastic methods means that we cannot look at the human system in a deterministic way. It is my opinion that one day we will know enough about epigenetics and the insane myriad of RNA species to apply a more deterministic view of the human system, OR at least some of the subsystems. Though I do think Noble has a point about the chaotic fluid dynamics of very complex biomolecular processes may prevent us from ever applying a deterministic view to SOME (which is where I disagree with Nobel) biological subsystems.

  • @musicloverlondon6070
    @musicloverlondon6070 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Just a couple of minutes into the video and already I'm having to look up words - and that's a good thing! 😊That's part of the value of these uploads. Thank you.

  • @Resmith18SR
    @Resmith18SR 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    We as a species will always be continuously searching for the facts about our genetic mechanisms and history and hopefully continue to make general progress in regards to it. Preventing cancer, Alzheimer's, heart disease and all the most common forms of disease and mortality are and will be much closer in the next century. The amazing thing is that it all works and we don't have to understand completely how it works.

  • @giangosdrakoulas
    @giangosdrakoulas 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    The problem is that he is not describing the mechanism which allows the organism to be creative and not determined. How?

    • @andyzola
      @andyzola 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Because he is talking out his ass and the rubes are cheering

  • @theaudioman4446
    @theaudioman4446 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    you can feel the aura of a true intellectual listening and seeing Prof Denis Noble, awesome!

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      True intellectuals don't use fallacies.

    • @johndoolan9732
      @johndoolan9732 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      See talking to pattern recognition untangle and string just by predictability with the whole scientific community tell me 1 year in understanding how learn work as 1

  • @earFront
    @earFront 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

    The original Dr WHO has graced us with an interview about the nature of the universe.

    • @blakebronte1544
      @blakebronte1544 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I can see the likeness. 👍🏼🌟

    • @thesufi
      @thesufi 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      William Hartnell lives on!

    • @Si_Mondo
      @Si_Mondo 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I'm not even a Dr Who fan, and I saw how you got there immediately 😂

  • @keithtomey5046
    @keithtomey5046 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    'Interesting...but Einstein wasn't trying to shock the world - he was trying to match observations to theory..& succeeded to a good extent. 'Creative in a very positive way. (Dot)

    • @julienbilodeau6159
      @julienbilodeau6159 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Same for Beethoven ! this idea of trying to shock is infantile.

  • @rustycalvera977
    @rustycalvera977 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    what joy.....how fascinating it is to listen to this very interesting man.

  • @StardustAnlia
    @StardustAnlia 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Creativity as a physical process is mentioned here, but is important to make the distinction between creativity and free will. I have never seen free will expressed as a physical process without losing its classification as free will.

    • @bg1616
      @bg1616 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Free will could be an illusion 🎶

  • @OneFurlongTooLong
    @OneFurlongTooLong 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Great interview, excellent choice of questions.

  • @heisenberg6921
    @heisenberg6921 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻…a pleasure to hear this talk by Prof. Noble…

  • @davidhunt313
    @davidhunt313 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Having discovered only at the age of 57 that I am *_autistic_* and have been such since conception,.. how can I still believe in libertarian free will and reject biological determinism??!?
    I can choose my actions,.. but not my desires?!? It was quite a shock to me to realize my Libertarianism largely followed from my autistic affliction and not my choice?!?

  • @alanjenkins1508
    @alanjenkins1508 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +31

    All he is saying is that life is complicated and multi layered with redundancy and there is a lot about it we do not understand. Well yes. However, but we have to start somewhere.

    • @johnscanlon8467
      @johnscanlon8467 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      He also makes specific neolamarckist claims.

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      You seem to be right aboot that...

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      But yeah, Scanlon might also have a point....

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@johnscanlon8467 I said: Scanlon may also have a point.......

    • @shanemac7185
      @shanemac7185 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Yes, exactly.

  • @warshipsdd-2142
    @warshipsdd-2142 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    Very good discussion, still leaves the why anything and deeper thoughts on being able to percieve untouched.

    • @ironwilltattooclub6116
      @ironwilltattooclub6116 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      The stochasticism explains the CHOOSING and the INTELLIGENT UTILIZATION of stochasticism for a functional purpose?? Nope. I think these guys are good scientists but poor philosophers. He’s trying to stay within his materialistic framework while undermining himself with his observations.

    • @dukeallen432
      @dukeallen432 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      We just don’t know. It’s though not an intelligent being and more, not magical being created by insecure humans.

  • @ismailhakkisulucay4596
    @ismailhakkisulucay4596 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Wonderful conversation indeed👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

  • @Al.S.
    @Al.S. 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Thank you, Professor Noble

  • @keaton718
    @keaton718 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    "When the Facts Change, I Change My Mind. What Do You Do, Sir?". I don't know who said that first, but Dawkins has said it a lot.
    The gene therapy cures may be in short supply, but we are now coming up with a lot of gene therapy treatments at least. If your disease didn't previously have a treatment then you'd still be very thankful.

  • @Ian.Does.Fitness
    @Ian.Does.Fitness 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +47

    What an incredibly interesting and informative video! Denis Noble is indeed a genius! He managed to explain some of the most complicated things simply enough to give me at least a rudimentary understanding. Excellent questions from the interviewer too! 🙏

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      This "genius" is only a genius at misrepresenting Dawkins.

    • @Ian.Does.Fitness
      @Ian.Does.Fitness 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@Conserpov How silly. The man has differing opinions. He isn’t representing or misrepresenting Dawkins. He’s representing himself and his ideas borne from many years studying in his field.

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      ​@@Ian.Does.Fitness
      _> The man has differing opinions._
      No, the man egregiously misrepresents another man's position.
      The man is disingenuous.
      Clearly, you neither read any of Dawkins' books nor listened to what Dawkins had to say, so you are in no position to judge.
      Other than that Noble can represent himself all he wants - as someone who doesn't understand evolutionary biology, that is. But this is crossing another line.

    • @Eromasta6
      @Eromasta6 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Dawkins is a fool

    • @chrisevans1255
      @chrisevans1255 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Conserpov precisely

  • @haydenwayne3710
    @haydenwayne3710 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Excellent episode!!! Thank you.

  • @EdMcF1
    @EdMcF1 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    He really should frame his points with the briefest of introductions for those of us not aware of the tedious debates that form the background to this.

  • @andrefelixstudio2833
    @andrefelixstudio2833 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +26

    Very interesting and a intellectual conversation!

  • @dawnemile7499
    @dawnemile7499 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Denis Noble is so sharp despite his age.

  • @ttecnotut
    @ttecnotut 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I just discovered Noble and I love him

  • @Rhibb23
    @Rhibb23 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Denis seems to be wanting to say that we have some kind of will and can choose the outcome of our stochastic processes, yet I don't see how that can be. If the inner processes are stochastic, and so are the external ones where does the will come in? Are we to say our will is ultimately random? How would we call that will?

  • @dosesandmimoses
    @dosesandmimoses 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

    Excellent explanation! I would have thoroughly enjoyed taking your course at university! Too many physiologist’s and biologist’s lectures focus primarily on mechanisms instead of the process of interactions between the systems. Gratitude!

    • @artlessons1
      @artlessons1 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      agreed ./thats why he is also a musician.

  • @alexappleby8677
    @alexappleby8677 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

    I think there is great merit in both the top down (phenotype down) and bottom up (genome up) approaches. I slightly disagree that the bottom up approach has "failed", though I do concede that the top down approach will probably yield therapeutics much more quickly at the moment. I believe it is crucial for both methods to be employed as we will learn much more about the space between, the epigenetics, from attacking the problem in both directions. The major failure of the bottom up approach was one of hubris, to predict with such fanfare that they would "solve" all problems and diseases within decades. Only to realise of course that the mammalian and particularly the human system is so much more complex than anyone expected. As for the philosophical point, I believe by carrying out both approaches, we will find areas where things are much more deterministic Vs stochastic, and other areas where things are more stochastic. As certain sub-systems will be more complex than others.

    • @MrCmon113
      @MrCmon113 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      There is no "top down" at all. There is no amino acids that accumulate and then get written into RNA and then DNA. That's just not how evolution works.
      >to predict with such fanfare that they would "solve" all problems and diseases within decades
      I have no clue what you're talking about, but The Selfish Gene doesn't include any such predictions.
      >is so much more complex than anyone expected
      No. Everything that remains of an organism is the gamete. That's why taking the replicator's perspective is the only thing that makes sense of evolution.

  • @metamorphosis9958
    @metamorphosis9958 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Fantastic Interview .
    Really enjoyed it .
    Very smart man ...

  • @tanned06
    @tanned06 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

    A lot of valuable insights being poured out by Prof Denis Noble indeed!

  • @kennethttt5ttt548
    @kennethttt5ttt548 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

    Excellent talk! Informative on many levels.

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Ah well, what can I say....

    • @oskarngo9138
      @oskarngo9138 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @16:05
      Nobel is Wrong...
      A person’s “mood” is highly dependent on the “physical” state of the body; ... which is “indirectly-dependent “ on one’s genes and Not on freewill...
      Exp.. when one is hungry (body lacking sugar/energy) and/or one is stressed (body flooded with stress hormones);
      ...one tends to be much More in a bad /Non-Charitably Mood than when one is full/not-stressed/etc...
      There are many examples where a person suffered brain damage;... and their mood; behavior; essence changed...!
      Anyway; Nobel and Dawkins really differ in Nuances;...
      ... they both reject the “God-hypothesis”....!

    • @kennethttt5ttt548
      @kennethttt5ttt548 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@oskarngo9138 I'm actually an expert in body/mind connection. There is an influence between body experiences and psychological views certainly, but especially in trained people, it is not an overwhelming influence. The same can be said in reverse; psychological states can strongly influence body states and even body capacities. Try doing five years of day to day Tai Chi Chuan and Meditation. I can't think of anything Noble said that would deny issues like brain damage. Neo-Darwinism and Behaviorism both have portions of their explanation of the world which later experiments proved to be highly questionable or simply wrong. As for God, as mentioned in the video, Pascal created a dualistic approach so that anything "spiritual" was left to the church and anything "physical" was left to science. This was taken as a matter of dogma, not as a scientifically studied hypothesis that is either proved or disproved. Part of that was Pascal's assertion that mind/consciousness does not affect matter. This is simply false as many examples have shown.

  • @seandonahue8464
    @seandonahue8464 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I thought this may be some sort of click bait thing. He actually was bringing up some great points! I really like this channel. I wish rational debate and discussion was more popular on the wider internet!

  • @markgamache6377
    @markgamache6377 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    How does an agent select among stochastic alternatives? The process is deterministic or stochastic there is no ‘choice’.

  • @FlavioLanfranconi
    @FlavioLanfranconi 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +72

    This is SO refreshing, to hear good AND well formulated and grounded thoughts !
    Thank you!

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      Wrong. It's full of logical fallacies and misrepresenting Dawkins.

    • @user-rk4nx1dx1l
      @user-rk4nx1dx1l 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@Conserpov Uh? He's not trying to misrepresent Dorkins, he just knows that bit more about the subject under discussion. IMHO

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@user-rk4nx1dx1l
      _> he just knows that bit more about the subject under discussion_
      He does not know nearly enough about genetics and evolutionary biology to challenge Dawkins.
      In fact, most real geneticists and evolutionary biologists routinely facepalm at his statements.
      _> He's not trying to misrepresent_
      Clearly, you didn't even read Dawkins' books, so your opinion on the matter has zero value.

    • @kipling1957
      @kipling1957 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Conserpov Facepalming is an entirely predictable left-brained trait.

    • @Baalaaxa
      @Baalaaxa 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Conserpov Care to provide some examples of said fallacies, and how is he misrepresenting Dawkins?

  • @aljoschalong625
    @aljoschalong625 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Very interesting and insightful. I just don't think Dawkins would contradict that much.

    • @kalijasin
      @kalijasin 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Dawkins is not even a biologist. He has a DPhil and DSc. Those are not biology degrees.

    • @aljoschalong625
      @aljoschalong625 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@kalijasin He got his PhD in zoology and his DSc is a doctorate in science which goes beyond a PhD.
      What is your concern? That he ridicules - and rightly so - muslims (even deaf ones), christians and all the other spreaders of memes of delusions?

  • @marianmoravcik9262
    @marianmoravcik9262 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I really love to hear these arguments.

  • @crawkn
    @crawkn 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

    This was a much more technical, as opposed to philosophical, investigation than I expected. I like the acknowledgement about the probabilistic nature of human physiology due to our liquid medium. Chemical processes which are enacted in very small spaces, such as the mitochondria, approach designed determinism more closely than those which must act over greater distances. So in place of logic, we have probabilistic feedback loops, which function fairly well in aggregate but are quite hit or miss on smaller scales.

  • @martinbennett2228
    @martinbennett2228 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    Denis Noble's account of the creativity of Beethoven seem be that magic happens. I would like an explanation from him why he cannot be a new 'Beethoven', if the creativity is not the function of biology and the environment.
    As a musician he is probably aware of the close links between many of the major composers: between JS Bach and his sons (particularly CPE), Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Liszt, Mendelssohn and others we find threads of environmental connections. Beethoven in a different environment could not been Beethoven.

    • @cameronlapworth2284
      @cameronlapworth2284 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Yes bethoven wouldnt have had a brian without DNA coding it into place.

    • @off6848
      @off6848 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      What is a "different environment" here? Some of these guys lived in different countries far away. I don't understand your question

    • @andyzola
      @andyzola 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Because he is a charlatan. I also get nonce vibes.

    • @christopherellis2663
      @christopherellis2663 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      It's a nicely constructed piece of rhetoric, but what is your hypothesis?

    • @ciupenhauer
      @ciupenhauer 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ​@@andyzola it doesn't count if the young girl is a robot!!

  • @psychologicalprojectionist
    @psychologicalprojectionist 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +97

    I think he misrepresents what Dawkins says.
    What he is saying is the genome isn't a code, I agree.
    I don't think Dawkins claimed it was any more than a replicator that is selected for its ability to get replicated.
    There is some genetic determinism, but it is not straightforward, absolute and environment plays apart. I don't think NeoDarwinism is genetic determinism.
    I don't think anyone imagined medical solutions were going to come out of the sky from sequencing work.
    I think "genetic determinism " is a strawman. I would love to know if Dawkins ever used the phrase.

    • @tjejojyj
      @tjejojyj 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I completely agree.
      Q: “What do you see as the fault of this gene-Centric new-Darwinian picture?”
      A: ~“it promised to cure disease but failed”.
      Who promised that? Did Richard Dawkins?
      There is an obvious paradox in having a gene that will kill the host for neo-Darwinians since it for that gene to propagate it needs the host to survive.
      My understanding of the neo-Darwinian position is that there are many genes and they can have competing effects on behaviour, the extended genotype. Whether a behaviour is “advantageous” depends on the history of the organism and the context of the action.

    • @yoso585
      @yoso585 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Yeah. At the base, it’s all the same. Very complex in the end as it is with absolutely everything. The discoveries never end.

    • @brechtkuppens
      @brechtkuppens 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

      Yes, he is over-selling some new additions to scientific knowledge, as if they revolutionize the entire discipline. Never have I read any advocacy of strict genetic determinism from Dawkins, he is strawmanning him.

    • @martinwilliams9866
      @martinwilliams9866 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      Genetics determines potentiality, enviroment determines actualization!

    • @psychologicalprojectionist
      @psychologicalprojectionist 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @Martin Williams and junk DNA determines nothing.
      Also the environment includes the cell and its contents, which is partially determined by genes.

  • @peteypeterson80
    @peteypeterson80 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    What an interview! Fascinating.

  • @mlh3604
    @mlh3604 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    He uses the chances of human mind to perform this multilayer systemic way of thinking. A beautiful man.

  • @eensio
    @eensio 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

    The title gives the wrong impression about Dawkins. Why?

    • @grantm6514
      @grantm6514 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

      Because it gets clicks.

    • @eswn1816
      @eswn1816 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      ​@@grantm6514
      "Clickbait" on TH-cam is ubiquitous!

    • @riccardodececco4404
      @riccardodececco4404 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      The title is spot on - which part of the discussion didn´t you get?

    • @thethe1
      @thethe1 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Dawkins is wrong in every point of Darwinism. He don't understand clearly Darwin's theory.

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@riccardodececco4404
      _> The title is spot on_
      Can you name one thing that Dawkins actually said and is shown wrong in this video? You can't.

  • @ianjones7266
    @ianjones7266 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Very interesting, complicated and thought provoking. I'm of for a long think.👍

  • @peterlemer
    @peterlemer 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    where does dawkins say there is a program in the genome?

  • @erdwaenor
    @erdwaenor 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

    How incredibly Educated is this person. Certainly, not just a Scientist -and nothing against being a Scientist by the way which is a great thing, but we are never 'only this or that'. Thanks for the people on *iai* for this jewel interview.

    • @SueFerreira75
      @SueFerreira75 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Agreed and for me, this and other similar discussions highlight how far the tenets of a liberal and wide education emphasizing logic and rationalization has diminished.

    • @instamdgram
      @instamdgram 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      It's amusing to call a scientist "educated"!

    • @erdwaenor
      @erdwaenor 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ​@@instamdgram Ironically! It is important that scientists as well as non-scientists, become more aware of the challenges (but also of the usefulness) of a broader education.

    • @instamdgram
      @instamdgram 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@erdwaenor where is the irony in that? To simplify, you cannot be a scientist unless you're educated. I guess you're talking on a different wavelength or I'm (gladly) "uneducated" to understand the relevance of broader education in "this" context.

  • @AndrewWilsonStooshie
    @AndrewWilsonStooshie 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +96

    I don't think Dawkins has ever suggested behaviour is determined by genes alone.

    • @svenhanson398
      @svenhanson398 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Have you read the book. I have, he does according to my understanding of it. I see it as worse, humans are dismissed, its genes need to reproduce itself that matter, nothing else. And how he express it he give the genes an aim and that gives genes agency. That is having purpose, to reproduce itself. And to me that's falling into a form of modern animism. Its even in the title, The selfish gene, as if its a choice by genes to be altruistic or selfish and it chooses selfishness.

    • @celorfiwyn8193
      @celorfiwyn8193 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      Noble might very well be a good physiologist, but his ideas about evolutionary biology are simply not grounded in facts. He has repeatedly made statements that were either just somewhat wrong or absurdly erroneous about it.

    • @svenhanson398
      @svenhanson398 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@celorfiwyn8193 Yes, I do not know Noble and have just stepped by and found it interesting enough to stay a while. So my view is based on that and foremost my encounter with Dawkings text in the Seflish gene years ago. So all I can say is Dawkins just doesn't know what he is talking about when he goes so far in his extreme reductionism to postulate that humans are just another way for genes to make another step in their march towards the future in their attempt to survive. And on top of it give Genes agency. That is there was a choice to be made and selfishness was it, for the genes. Its plain stupid and I cannot now that years has passed by see anything but the rubbish I found in this more than 30 years back.

    • @ianmiell
      @ianmiell 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      Not only that, the end of the Selfish Gene marvels at our ability to move beyond our genetic destiny.

    • @svenhanson398
      @svenhanson398 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@ianmiell In the sense of manipulation you mean. Well, the whole thing with this is pretty dangerous to me, humans tinkering with is not really well understood yet, and many times for the narrow reason of profit, is just madness. Which we humans are very good at displaying too often for comfort.

  • @user-bp7go4zp2i
    @user-bp7go4zp2i 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    I agree with him. Scholars must be able to see things as a whole, not complexity in detail, but as a whole: there is logic.

  • @SandyCharlotte
    @SandyCharlotte 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Excellent discussion. Thank you.

  • @szyszkienty
    @szyszkienty 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    An interesting talk with a misleading and clickbaity title.

  • @MisterWillow
    @MisterWillow 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +22

    This is very interesting. Dennis has a point. I fear I don't see how this 'clashes' with Dawkins point of vies (selfish genes).
    As far as I can see both views are valid, worthwhile can can coexist.

    • @Scott_Hoge
      @Scott_Hoge 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      The video doesn't even challenge Dawkins' actual point. According to Dawkins, it is the *gene* that is the fundamental unit of selfishness, not the person. The part about being selfish one day and altrustic the next doesn't apply.
      In fact, Dawkins himself states that between two creatures possessing the same selfish gene, one may gracefully die for the other.

    • @RogerioLupoArteCientifica
      @RogerioLupoArteCientifica 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      the point where both viewpoints clash is about the agency. Denis is removing the gene from the exclusive cause of agency and is open to investigating all possible agents, whereas Dawkins is a staunch defender of genetic determinism. It gets clearer in their debate. Denis here is pointing out the "new" discoveries from epigenetics that should be incorporated into the debate but are not. Lamarck's ghost has been haunting evolutionary biology again for a long time now, but extremist Darwinists like Dawkins refuse to admit that.
      Denis' example of selfish or altruistic human behavior wasn't supposed to be related to the selfish gene at all. It was just an example of some of our numerous characteristics, all of which are not exclusively determined by genes, according to his point of view.

    • @cyberswine
      @cyberswine 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      The title is click-baity.

    • @Conserpov
      @Conserpov 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      _> Dennis has a point._
      His only point is a rather crude strawman.
      He clearly knows too little about genetics and evolutionary biology to challenge actual specialists like Dawkins.

    • @1SpudderR
      @1SpudderR 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Somehow Shakespeare’s works are written By Monkeys.......If you believe random dots will produce 6,000,000,000 genes and Trillions of living cells working in unison producing the pen and arm to write the sonnets down!? Still requires the “A Priori Miracle” !?

  • @gabrieltrasto4235
    @gabrieltrasto4235 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    There are different layers. The state of the art instrumentation should be the guide to what layer we should focus. By looking at a sample of transistors in a cpu, you may guess the computer is multiplying two numbers, but by looking at the assembler code, you know everything relevant.

  • @EugenioValdes
    @EugenioValdes 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

    He talks about a recent discovery of "tiny particles that carry DNA and RNA to the germline", I don't know what is he referring to, and I can't find anything related to it, can someone help me.

  • @tommason8104
    @tommason8104 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    As someone with a strong intellectual curiosity but with a very limited amount of knowledge of biological science, I found Denis Noble’s ideas and explanations both understandable and acceptable. I don’t say that in judgement of him, I say that as a complement to how he is capable of making very advanced scientific notions available to a common mind, such as mine.

  • @terencefield3204
    @terencefield3204 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Wonderful clarity of ideas rarely spread to the peasantry.

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Pleasantry; rhimes with

    • @terencefield3204
      @terencefield3204 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@fukpoeslaw3613 Not me sonny. I am rough and as non-oxford as it is possible to be. Thank God;.

  • @FrostSpike
    @FrostSpike 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Genes give the organism the potential for certain behaviours. Behaviours are then driven by the environment. What we don't understand is the execution engine that interprets the genes to derive those behaviours. The genes themselves partially code that execution engine, but a lot of it is just in the interplay of proteins and chemicals at a molecular, atomic, sub-atomic, and quantum level (which gives the truly stochastic mechanism). Sometimes external forces, like a minor viral infection, can recode that engine too.

  • @anttiharju3739
    @anttiharju3739 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Where during this interview was the point of the title of this video brought up? I quite like the channel, please don't start making clickbait titles, you're above it. And no, Dawkins is not above criticism, but that's beside the point

  • @arthurwieczorek4894
    @arthurwieczorek4894 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    0:28. Biological determinism means behavioral control and prediction---that's and prediction. So we are not talking here about determinism as an explanation after the fact.
    So he says control is within us, but not biological.?

  • @chrishoffman5610
    @chrishoffman5610 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    Very interesting. I did notice the speaker say in regards to spirit and mechanism that he could not conceive it therefore it doesn't make sense. He also utilized the musical score analogy which I think seems logical, however he is a musician. The thinker seems to find it hard to separate himself from his thoughts

    • @adamadappa
      @adamadappa 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Don't we all?

  • @kiDchemical
    @kiDchemical 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I would classify what he calls creativity as a category of the mind, it's descriptive of a determinate set of behaviors within a determinate set of possibilities. I feel like he gives it a transcendental quality that it doesn't have.
    For me the determinacy comes from the field of possibilities that structures reality. Within this field, things are contingent based on the faculties of organisms and the particular stimuli organisms happen to come in contact with.
    To fully understand an organism you would need it's entire history, rather than just an analysis of the parts contained within it (in this regard I find Hegel's metaphysics helpful).

  • @taseenhaider3961
    @taseenhaider3961 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Appreciating limitation of our research and putting a different workmodel .

  • @MBY1952
    @MBY1952 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    שיחה מעולה. תודה רבה.

  • @lexunajinrui1340
    @lexunajinrui1340 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

    Voilà un homme qui en plus de son énorme connaissance ajoute une sagesse et un recul sur la vie qui devrait inspiré beaucoup de jeunes étudiants

    • @John-uh8kl
      @John-uh8kl 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Bien. Jrb. 🇬🇧

  • @jestermoon
    @jestermoon 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Darwin's shoulders are very high up there, feeling very comfortable in the world in which I live PTSD and all. Thx

  • @Azoria4
    @Azoria4 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Noble’s point about using chance to create novelty, particularly at 19:55 reminds me of what Keats calls ‘Negative Capability’.

  • @MrMikkyn
    @MrMikkyn 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    I love when an person who is knowledgeable in science also has a scholarly and big picture understanding of their field. Sometimes I find in the biology and medical field it is very much on the micro-level. It is not so visionary. Denis Noble brings history into the picture, and whole texts from authors and relates it back to physiology, evolution, and from that topic to healthcare. In other cases the endocrinologist will stick to that field, the microbiologist to microbiology, the geneticist to genetics, the epigeneticist to epigenetics, the neuroscientist to neuroscience, the general doctor to general medicine. He does not do that however. He has the intellectual holistic view or all the micro-disciplines.

    • @lawrence1318
      @lawrence1318 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      "I love IT when .... ". You can't say "I love when" unless you are meaning to say you love the actual time in and of itself.

    • @lawrence1318
      @lawrence1318 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@G.A.M.E. Er ... youtube corrects your grammar as you type. Are they nerds too? Or is it OK if they do it because they're the establishment but not OK for anyone else?
      You're a native English speaker, so speak English. You can't say in English: "I love when ....". You must say: "I love it when ...."
      So pull your head in, humble yourself, and stand corrected. The language is being butchered enough without adding your pithy little American changes designed to get everyone to copy you.

    • @foffjerkholes4995
      @foffjerkholes4995 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

      You really want to know they "seemed fixed on the micro level"? It's because biology, in it's entirity is unBELIVABLY COMPLEX AND THERE IS NOT NEARLY ENOUGH STUDENTS GOING INTO THE FIELD.

  • @kipling1957
    @kipling1957 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    He seems to be talking about dynamic complex systems, myriad feedback loops between all levels of physiology, the genome, molecules, with resultant unpredictable outcomes. A form of intelligence. Would love this man to converse with the likes of John Vervaeke, Michael Levin, Stephen Wolfram, Ian McGilChrist...etc.

    • @campbellpaul
      @campbellpaul 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Basically, all the things that future pharmaceuticals will bypass and ignore. The result will be catastrophic, of course!

    • @afterthesmash
      @afterthesmash 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I was shocked at the incongruity of your list of names until I realized that in addition to Michael Levin the philosopher (with racist inclinations) there is also Michael Levin the biologist, who seems like an all-around brilliant guy, on first inspection.

    • @SystemsMedicine
      @SystemsMedicine 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Hi Campbell. Various pharmaceutical companies (and of course pharmacy & biology departments at universities) have been working very hard to incorporate notions of complex biological pathways and systems biology into their drug discovery and evaluation processes for decades now. This stuff got underway at companies and universities in the last century. In some areas, the companies led the way. [It's time to catch up. Cheers.]

    • @MrCmon113
      @MrCmon113 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Well that's completely untrue.
      Genes get translated to RNA and then to proteins. Not the other way around.
      You're blabbering about "myriad feedback loops" and that gets you exactly nowhere.
      Genes are what actually lasts from generation to generation and that's why their perspective explains evolution and not the perspective of proteins.

    • @campbellpaul
      @campbellpaul 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@SystemsMedicine They just caught the most influential university in the world embellishing their research to support their data. I rest my case.

  • @mehmetsarikaya1157
    @mehmetsarikaya1157 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Great interview and wonderful explanations. Instead of "selfish gene", it should be "selfish proteins, including the enzymes and the systems they are working in." I made this point to Dawkins at a book signing after his talk on one of his books (which are all wonderful, BTW).. he just looked at my face, said nothing. I am so glad to have listened to Denis Noble. We use directed evolution to select peptides (tiny proteins) for a specific function within a given environment. It works like a charm.. not many people are doing it.. I don't know why (ignorance, lazy, sticking to one's path, etc.). As Denis Noble says, organisms are doing it all the time.. and we humans do it all the time.

    • @onedaya_martian1238
      @onedaya_martian1238 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Dawkins probably thought... "This chap doesn't understand that those enzymes/proteins/peptides come from genes! How will he be able to read this book ?"
      And he wouldn't be too far wrong. Denis Noble points out, implicitly I believe, that there is a trinity of components (pun not intended), the environment, the protiens/enzymes/plasmids/peptides/etc and the genes, which stochastically respond to each other in a nondeterministic way (overall!, but as best as possible, this is where he infers the process is "creative").
      So the answer that the proteins/enzymes/etc are selfish seems silly. The peptides/enzymes etc are simply the huge communicating mechanisms between the gene and the organizm. And this allows for the profound comment that this disposes of the need to believe in dualism. The body/cells/genes and the person/soul/physiology are each "selfishly" bound by the proteins, plasmids etc.
      What I think will be the next revelation after Dr. Noble's ideas are mainstream, is that the earth's biome, viruses, bacteria etc play an important role in manipulating, "communicating" and evolving our genes and our physiology !!

  • @herrrmike
    @herrrmike 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Dr. Noble is sharp as a tack. An excellent discussion.

  • @edmond4005
    @edmond4005 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

    So well explained, so clear, so insightful. Brilliant.

  • @mlambrechts1
    @mlambrechts1 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +20

    The evolution in cancer treatment based on genomics is phenomenal.

    • @christopherellis2663
      @christopherellis2663 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Simply stop eating carbs

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@christopherellis2663 literally carbs?

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Literally phenomenal?

    • @ciupenhauer
      @ciupenhauer 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      What was the evolution? In simple terms I could understand

    • @mimoslavich6639
      @mimoslavich6639 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@christopherellis2663 FALSE! Im a researcher and this is a myth at best. Stop eating simple sugars, and low complexity carbs sure. There are a multitude of amino acids, the building blocks of proteins, that are vastly more cancer promoting than carbohydrates. This type of low knowledge statement will almost certainly cause death in those with cancer. Depending on the cancer the following are a list of potential amino acids that can be targeted for limiting or entirely blocking during treatment - arginine, glutamine, glycine, serine, leucine, asparagine, and methionine. These are important to sustaining life, so its not advisable to limit these in your diet or body if you are healthy.

  • @nzsystems
    @nzsystems 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    One day the front-end developer went to the back-end programmer and told him that the most important part of the system is the GUI because it's closer to the user...

  • @greenbluemonkey
    @greenbluemonkey 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Very interesting. Even if you only absorb 50% of what he says its worth it to listen to this.

  • @foundational
    @foundational 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Loved it!

  • @duledaska2198
    @duledaska2198 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    Denis ability to clearly explain the topics and apply right analogy, in the function of better understanding of the concept he is explaining, is amusing.

  • @giuliobuccini208
    @giuliobuccini208 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Fascinating....
    I not completely agree with him, but his arguments are really stimulating and refreshing.

  • @RalphBrooker-gn9iv
    @RalphBrooker-gn9iv 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    There is a parallel problem I think in cognitive neuro-psychology which claimed that we’d be able to isolate the key modules of the biological architecture of mind (eg. speech, visual, knowledge, inference centres). Eg. it was claimed that Broca’s aphasia & Wernicke’s aphasia comprised a double dissociation of conceptual knowledge and syntactic knowledge. So, according to pathological data we can add to a flow chart of our ex hypothesis biological mental structure (the two functionally discrete aphasias) two modules: conceptual and syntactic knowledge, both modules being mutually independent of one another (ie. doubly dissociated, the so-called criterion for structural identification). The problem here is that the only reason we have to believe this is acceptance of the modularity thesis (roughly, by assuming before the fact the modularity of mind: that the mind is essentially a sort of complex biologically based computer on von Neumann architecture). But the pathological data - the seeming double dissociation of conceptual from syntactic knowledge ‘modules’ - is presented as corroboration of the modularity thesis. Without it we have no reason to accept modularity. So we have simply assumed before the fact the hypothesis that we intended to demo after the fact. The problem has a certain Humean (David Hume) twist to it.
    I also agree with David Noble and wonder if Richard Dawkins has push neo-Darwinism to an implausible from rationalism, the sought from which Dostoyevsky recoiled so vehemently in ‘Notes From The Underground’.

  • @quakers200
    @quakers200 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Seems like the interviewer is trying to create more controversy than illumination on the subject.

  • @weaseldragon
    @weaseldragon 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    The lack of effective treatments does not refute genetic determinism. The more parsimonious conclusion is that genetic determinism is simply more complex than predicted.

    • @daveblack2602
      @daveblack2602 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      And your evidence for that is what?

    • @nerdyali4154
      @nerdyali4154 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@daveblack2602 Reality.

    • @off6848
      @off6848 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@daveblack2602 Evidence isn't required he was forced to make this comment by causality

    • @brechtkuppens
      @brechtkuppens 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      It is the 2-way interaction of genes with the environment during the course of development that determines the outcome of said development

    • @off6848
      @off6848 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@brechtkuppens Why are we talking about it as if genes and environment are separate.
      Unless you're proposing a spiritual element everything is just dumb matter even genes which are made up smaller things that are just matter.

  • @chiguy2450
    @chiguy2450 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    WOW!! First time I actually heard someone speak what I always intrinsically felt even though I am uneducated and nowhere near the intellectual level to understand all that he is saying.

  • @poolschool5587
    @poolschool5587 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Nuanced discussion like this only makes is clearer to me how much is not yet clear (and perhaps never will or can be)

  • @Gottenhimfella
    @Gottenhimfella 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    15:42 I think he's invoking a false dichotomy (when he postulates that either genes determine behaviour, or if not, free will must do so). It seems plausible that genetics and epigenetics predispose a particular individual towards certain behavioural practices, but that nurture and free will also play vital roles.

    • @the_dark_one6052
      @the_dark_one6052 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Precisely. Nothing is black and white when it comes to biochemistry.

  • @No2AI
    @No2AI 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

    Always beneficial to share thoughts and ideas - the truth however is that we simply don’t know, no matter how intellectually the case is presented .

    • @johncampbell9216
      @johncampbell9216 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      We know better than this old liar.

    • @fukpoeslaw3613
      @fukpoeslaw3613 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      That's right!

    • @theuniques1199
      @theuniques1199 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      We know everything right now because we know that we exist right now including our belief that we may not know and that we may know by what means that we do exist by right now because we absolutely know that we exist as all of existence itself right now, summary: right now is always absolutely right now including the assumption(belief, illusion) by what means that we may exist by right now to know that we exist as all of existence itself absolutely right now.

    • @No2AI
      @No2AI 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@theuniques1199 in my view the only absolute is the ‘ I AM ‘ everything else I don’t know.

    • @yoso585
      @yoso585 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@No2AI Huge assumption

  • @fixfaxerify
    @fixfaxerify 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

    How is brownian motion of molecules in the body supposed to lead to "having a purpose"?

  • @eponaalbion
    @eponaalbion 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    How about Schumann Resonance and epigenetics as a factor to form the organism, also what 'memory', if any, would all these billions of cells have, an if any, for what timeframe?

  • @alejandrogarciarrubio4504
    @alejandrogarciarrubio4504 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    what a bad title to a good interview!