6:00 yeah you cannot have spaces between text and asterisk in order to bold things. ***abc*** is valid markdown for bold. ** abc ** is not bold, it's just plain text.
calls and sms are hard.... this is why twilio has such a market. if you are region specific, then you can do it yourself... but they make it easy... (eg, if you do it yourself you need to find a sip/voip provider first - then you could deploy something like freeswitch - sbc for voip - you can then build a esl service to do stuff like twilio can do...) but its a lot more work and costly if you are doing a little amount of calls/smss .... however if you are going to do like 10k min pm.... then you need someone or a team dedicated to maintaining it... so would be more cost effective for scale to do it yourself. but if you are going multi-region, then you are going to have to partner in each region and follow regs for telco partners probs... :(
Just use AWS SMS. And for calls personally I like AWS Connect along with AWS Lex. They both have APIs, but also dashboards. I’d be happy to provide more info if you’d like to stick with AWS
@@dreamsachiever212 i'm really enjoying using textbelt for a small project (SMS only). though, i wouldn't recommend it for a large project that needs more control over the numbers
How was SST ION setup? I tried it a month ago in the expectation of switching from SST's old setup, and I got some misc errors (and too busy to track down). FWIW, using postmark for 5 years if you need paid service, has been terrific deliverability (which I heard over the years is not the case with SES).
Cool video, I like the concept but feels like too much work imho, I like the Simplicity of setting up resend and sending emails directly. I do have a question tho, why do we need to pay OO upfront? If it's just a wrapper on top of SES and wont i be needing to pay aws for ses use on my acct?
Hey! Author here. The VPC's should only be set up if you deploy with the SST_DEPLOY=true flag. This deploys the container to ECS via SST. I don't recommend that though. In the "full AWS hosting with SST" guide I recommend hosting the container elsewhere and only using SST to set up the SES -> SQS pipeline. If you experienced something else let me know as it's a bug! Thanks :)
@@liltechnomancer Oh, okay, got it -- I missed the flag. (side note: The Github still mentions the deployment flag as an upcoming feature) Thanks for the super fast response; I got one of the $99 pros :D
The JavaScript ecosystem is a forest of SaaS products for basic features (auth, emails, etc), which is one of the few reasons why I only use JS for UI. Will check this out though.
It is nice thing to have alternative, I suppose... But does it really have to be so complicated? What happened to good old "log into smtp server and just send" workflow?
Hello Cody, you said you are using Railway for this? Why don't you use Hostinger VPS or AWS? Do you use different host for different stuff? For example I know you mention in some of your videos using Coolify+Hostinger VPS, would you rather choose Railway over that?
It depends on what you mean by pricey I think it cost maybe $10 to host on railway with a post Grass database and a deploy next year app. If you need a free database, Superbase provides two free databases or you could use Turso with sequel light, but at some point you’re gonna have to pay for hosting
This is actually pretty neat because setting up a mail service is the most buggiest thing you can do nowadays as I have heard from many DevOps. But what I am more interested in, why not use a own VPS to send emails and use AWS for that? I am afraid of AWS invoices because they "can" explode as you know for yourself and they aren't really calculatable.
AWS SES has email IP trust from all service providers like Gmail. Emails generally work on a whitelist system rather than black list. So hosting from a VPS or your home IP won’t be whitelisted. So all of your emails have a very, very high chance of going straight to spam. Whereas SES has very high deliverability and won’t be as likely to go to users spam. You can setup account rules and budgets aswell as billing alerts to avoid costs. Make sure to read the pricing page, and read it again, and read the bottom pricing examples. SES is good and cheap. That’s why like you say DevOps will likely always say self hosting and setting up mail services is just a pain in the ass. I’d be happy to share more info if you need any, I love to see new people to AWS
Hosting your own emails is a terrible idea. Aside from the plain fact that your email ports are likely closed, maintaining an email server when not actively involved with the development of it is impossible. Better off to get a cheap email address at 10-20 bucks a year and transfer email from your own domain to that address through cloudflare.
@@oSpam I see, but having a payment limit that stops your Service when hitting it is not the Solution to the "expensiveness". So far I've used Hosting Services with inbuild E-Mail Service for noreply Emails of a Web Application that Notifies the users. That works quite well but we are talking maybe about 2k active daily users on that Project. But let's imagine you wanna start a bigger SAAS Project that involves 100k active users you might want a own dedicated Mail service. At some point I think every Mail Service must have start somewhere right? So having a clean VPS, a not blacklisted IP is a good starting point and at least as @TheSuperBoyProject pointed out, ofc you have to stay active on that Service to keep it up2date, against exploits, and whatever Management may be required to do so. So in comparision - I didn't checked the SES prices yet - but for my workaround right now we are talking about 2-3 EUR monthly within the web-hosting costs without having a limit (as it seems?) and mails get delivered promisingly. Where as having Gmail as SMTP seems to be problematic for a couple users (different project/customer) - for customers that really want a cheap solution that doesn't need a high demand dedicated service you can do this I guess but I also advice to get someone involved that really knows what he is doing, as I do it for my dev stuff. I am most times honest with all I can offer. And whatever I do as a Fullstack Dev, I do it at a perfectionistic level (which can be sometimes a pain in the ass because I stick to details that noones cares or sees).
cody stop recommending me good tools Iy spending too much on my side projects and infra 🤣 . things aside, how are you liking Railway for your VPS setup?
railway seems to work fine for the most part. I've noticed sometimes I have to manually refresh their dashboard though... not sure what's going on there.
I found unsend while making 00! Me and him actually talk a lot and I helped him identify some ways to improve unsend. Were all on the same team in my mind.
Worth adding the differentiating factors not just that he’s your mate 😂 - ie one is deployed using a LAMP stack and the other is using pheonix deployed as a container so able to deploy and scale easier. Though sendy is cheaper even in comparison to the early bird of 00 and sendy seems to be more targeted towards marketing based emails with brands vs 00 which is more developer focused where your users and metadata might be somewhere else and you might want to make use of react-email with it vs sendy utilising basic html templates
I think that is really a good idea but with bad execution. It's trying to do everything. Infrastructure should not be created by the package itself, we have better tools like cloudformation or terraform for this, and should be optional at least, and if possible, there should be better docs. Internally it's creating it's own VPC for this, are we crazy?😅 Having to proxy the emails through that server to add tags when that's something you can configure SES to do. IMO this app should just grab the emails from a S3 bucket and subscribe to sns. Just provide the UI, put as opt in the infra.
The package uses sst with uses pulumi to setup all the aws related resources. I’m not sure what you’re talking about. The idea is one can clone and run one command to have a fully functional aws ses wrapper, along with mailing list capabilities
@@WebDevCody Depends ~ If your domain is trusted with DKIM,SFP, signed and your mail service uses/supports TLS - then gmail doesn't seem to mind since you already have a rep. But if you are setting up a new domain, then as long as you have history (which you'd build up from above with your IP) then it would trust it quicker. I migrated our postal instance from an IP to another IP recently, and we just made sure IP wasn't in a blacklist... gmail accepted it immediately. Postal makes sure a bunch of the todo items are done so you have good email deliverably. BUT : make sure you aren't on a Blacklist and separate your marketing IP vs your transactional IP. I think that is my biggest advise. Marketing IPs have a much higher chance of being blocked/limited. So there are a bunch of extra rules you need to follow (re content and some other stuff) - to make sure it doesnt get marked as spam. Transactional emails are easier, since they are usually related to an action of sorts. These have a bit more flexi since no one is going to unsub/report spam for a login notification ... they'll just delete it. But a mail of specials for the day might cause more issues. The biggest thing is to follow best practice guidelines and you don't have deliverability issues :)
show some support on producthunt www.producthunt.com/posts/00-1
done, already bought it! however really bad UX after buying as it shows you literally nothing
ELIXIR MENTIONED
Haha
6:00 yeah you cannot have spaces between text and asterisk in order to bold things. ***abc*** is valid markdown for bold. ** abc ** is not bold, it's just plain text.
ah nice thank you
Is there a twilio alternative with calls and SMS that you know? (Possibly opensource or dirt cheap)
calls and sms are hard.... this is why twilio has such a market. if you are region specific, then you can do it yourself... but they make it easy...
(eg, if you do it yourself you need to find a sip/voip provider first - then you could deploy something like freeswitch - sbc for voip - you can then build a esl service to do stuff like twilio can do...) but its a lot more work and costly if you are doing a little amount of calls/smss .... however if you are going to do like 10k min pm.... then you need someone or a team dedicated to maintaining it... so would be more cost effective for scale to do it yourself.
but if you are going multi-region, then you are going to have to partner in each region and follow regs for telco partners probs... :(
exactly looking for an alternative especially SMS. For now I am leaning towards WhatsApp business api
Just use AWS SMS. And for calls personally I like AWS Connect along with AWS Lex. They both have APIs, but also dashboards. I’d be happy to provide more info if you’d like to stick with AWS
No guys, can't find it. That telephony sector is controlled by Illuminati, I guess. Joke aside, the phone number registration is regulated by govts
@@dreamsachiever212 i'm really enjoying using textbelt for a small project (SMS only). though, i wouldn't recommend it for a large project that needs more control over the numbers
How was SST ION setup? I tried it a month ago in the expectation of switching from SST's old setup, and I got some misc errors (and too busy to track down). FWIW, using postmark for 5 years if you need paid service, has been terrific deliverability (which I heard over the years is not the case with SES).
I haven't really tried ion much yet
Cool video, I like the concept but feels like too much work imho, I like the Simplicity of setting up resend and sending emails directly. I do have a question tho, why do we need to pay OO upfront? If it's just a wrapper on top of SES and wont i be needing to pay aws for ses use on my acct?
You don’t, it’s free to use. If you want the planned marketing or newsletter features that’s where you need get the pro plan
But you still need email server @@WebDevCody
@@WebDevCody Ok cool!
Is it possible to host double-zero on VPS like Coolify instead of AWS?
Yes
Just a heads up, the new default sst config sets up a VPC with two zones that costs $66 a month
Ew why?
Hey! Author here. The VPC's should only be set up if you deploy with the SST_DEPLOY=true flag. This deploys the container to ECS via SST.
I don't recommend that though. In the "full AWS hosting with SST" guide I recommend hosting the container elsewhere and only using SST to set up the SES -> SQS pipeline.
If you experienced something else let me know as it's a bug! Thanks :)
@@liltechnomancer Oh, okay, got it -- I missed the flag. (side note: The Github still mentions the deployment flag as an upcoming feature)
Thanks for the super fast response; I got one of the $99 pros :D
The JavaScript ecosystem is a forest of SaaS products for basic features (auth, emails, etc), which is one of the few reasons why I only use JS for UI. Will check this out though.
Using SES so simple to setup and configure.
Just do not add any ingress rules on the email manager. Then costs will go up.
If you add it to caprover all the docker/ssl stuff is magic and self hosted.
Loving the content about using services that can be self-hosted. Please make more of it! 🙌
could this work on a normal vps on hetzner
You can host is on hetzner but still need SES for sending
It is nice thing to have alternative, I suppose... But does it really have to be so complicated? What happened to good old "log into smtp server and just send" workflow?
If you don’t care about email deliverability, go ahead my friend.
Is it that complicated? I set it up in like 5 minutes
@@WebDevCody you deployed two different servers to end up using third party service still. Yes, that qualifies as complicated
@@virtual5754 👍
Whats the cost difference 00 vs resend?
Different price model. 00 is software you pay for once and own.
It also has a free tier so if you just need a simplier way to setup ses and send emails you can do that
Hello, Why is your Discord link is marked as invalid? Do I need a particular requirement to be able to join?
Thanks in advance
Hello Cody, you said you are using Railway for this? Why don't you use Hostinger VPS or AWS? Do you use different host for different stuff? For example I know you mention in some of your videos using Coolify+Hostinger VPS, would you rather choose Railway over that?
I tend to use railway for everything recently
@@WebDevCody Is it too pricy if i want to deploy full apps with DBs? Or would you rather use something else for DBs?
It depends on what you mean by pricey I think it cost maybe $10 to host on railway with a post Grass database and a deploy next year app. If you need a free database, Superbase provides two free databases or you could use Turso with sequel light, but at some point you’re gonna have to pay for hosting
@@WebDevCody Thanks for answering Cody, I've been following your videos for a while, keep up!
hey cody! which keyboard you are using? name or just switch type
MacBook laptop one klack.app
@@WebDevCody why it feels better in video :D thanks
Klack app strikes again. 👀
Love ya!!!! Great job
😘 thanks babe!
This is awesome! At least for those interested in the extra work & free stuff.
Isn't it a pain to get production access on SES though?
It wasn’t for me so i can’t say
How do you always find good Open source projects?? I can only know one from others 😮
just scroll through twitter and get recommendations from people online
This is actually pretty neat because setting up a mail service is the most buggiest thing you can do nowadays as I have heard from many DevOps. But what I am more interested in, why not use a own VPS to send emails and use AWS for that? I am afraid of AWS invoices because they "can" explode as you know for yourself and they aren't really calculatable.
AWS SES has email IP trust from all service providers like Gmail. Emails generally work on a whitelist system rather than black list. So hosting from a VPS or your home IP won’t be whitelisted. So all of your emails have a very, very high chance of going straight to spam. Whereas SES has very high deliverability and won’t be as likely to go to users spam. You can setup account rules and budgets aswell as billing alerts to avoid costs. Make sure to read the pricing page, and read it again, and read the bottom pricing examples.
SES is good and cheap. That’s why like you say DevOps will likely always say self hosting and setting up mail services is just a pain in the ass.
I’d be happy to share more info if you need any, I love to see new people to AWS
Hosting your own emails is a terrible idea. Aside from the plain fact that your email ports are likely closed, maintaining an email server when not actively involved with the development of it is impossible. Better off to get a cheap email address at 10-20 bucks a year and transfer email from your own domain to that address through cloudflare.
@@oSpam I see, but having a payment limit that stops your Service when hitting it is not the Solution to the "expensiveness".
So far I've used Hosting Services with inbuild E-Mail Service for noreply Emails of a Web Application that Notifies the users. That works quite well but we are talking maybe about 2k active daily users on that Project.
But let's imagine you wanna start a bigger SAAS Project that involves 100k active users you might want a own dedicated Mail service. At some point I think every Mail Service must have start somewhere right? So having a clean VPS, a not blacklisted IP is a good starting point and at least as @TheSuperBoyProject pointed out, ofc you have to stay active on that Service to keep it up2date, against exploits, and whatever Management may be required to do so.
So in comparision - I didn't checked the SES prices yet - but for my workaround right now we are talking about 2-3 EUR monthly within the web-hosting costs without having a limit (as it seems?) and mails get delivered promisingly. Where as having Gmail as SMTP seems to be problematic for a couple users (different project/customer) - for customers that really want a cheap solution that doesn't need a high demand dedicated service you can do this I guess but I also advice to get someone involved that really knows what he is doing, as I do it for my dev stuff.
I am most times honest with all I can offer. And whatever I do as a Fullstack Dev, I do it at a perfectionistic level (which can be sometimes a pain in the ass because I stick to details that noones cares or sees).
so only for aws? 🤒
For now yes, hoping to support more eventually.
cody stop recommending me good tools Iy spending too much on my side projects and infra 🤣 . things aside, how are you liking Railway for your VPS setup?
railway seems to work fine for the most part. I've noticed sometimes I have to manually refresh their dashboard though... not sure what's going on there.
You are the man! Appreciate this a lot!
I think they straight up copied unsend from unsend-dev? Even the UI is so similar
I found unsend while making 00! Me and him actually talk a lot and I helped him identify some ways to improve unsend. Were all on the same team in my mind.
If i remember correctly, resend upcharges ~3x more than SES at most price points. Definitely gonna check this project out.
So it's like Sendy 😢
yeah, similar tool but by someone I personally interact with so they get free press - having connections is good
Worth adding the differentiating factors not just that he’s your mate 😂 - ie one is deployed using a LAMP stack and the other is using pheonix deployed as a container so able to deploy and scale easier.
Though sendy is cheaper even in comparison to the early bird of 00 and sendy seems to be more targeted towards marketing based emails with brands vs 00 which is more developer focused where your users and metadata might be somewhere else and you might want to make use of react-email with it vs sendy utilising basic html templates
I was looking for something similar last week that's some good news
cool project but that name has terrible seo, I can't even get google to return a response related to this project
I think that is really a good idea but with bad execution. It's trying to do everything.
Infrastructure should not be created by the package itself, we have better tools like cloudformation or terraform for this, and should be optional at least, and if possible, there should be better docs. Internally it's creating it's own VPC for this, are we crazy?😅
Having to proxy the emails through that server to add tags when that's something you can configure SES to do.
IMO this app should just grab the emails from a S3 bucket and subscribe to sns.
Just provide the UI, put as opt in the infra.
The package uses sst with uses pulumi to setup all the aws related resources. I’m not sure what you’re talking about. The idea is one can clone and run one command to have a fully functional aws ses wrapper, along with mailing list capabilities
Heck yeah!
That's too much work for me .. I'll stick to resend
Soon you will be able to deploy with SST too, so it will be more or less one step. Still early days for the project!
Lol I just saw your comment and the post on Reddit.
All i'm saying is .... postal server.
We use it... we host it... we arent reliant on aws or any other provider for our mails.
Doesn’t it take a while for gmail to trust your ip and not flag it as potential spam?
@@WebDevCody Depends ~
If your domain is trusted with DKIM,SFP, signed and your mail service uses/supports TLS - then gmail doesn't seem to mind since you already have a rep.
But if you are setting up a new domain, then as long as you have history (which you'd build up from above with your IP) then it would trust it quicker.
I migrated our postal instance from an IP to another IP recently, and we just made sure IP wasn't in a blacklist... gmail accepted it immediately.
Postal makes sure a bunch of the todo items are done so you have good email deliverably.
BUT : make sure you aren't on a Blacklist and separate your marketing IP vs your transactional IP.
I think that is my biggest advise.
Marketing IPs have a much higher chance of being blocked/limited.
So there are a bunch of extra rules you need to follow (re content and some other stuff) - to make sure it doesnt get marked as spam.
Transactional emails are easier, since they are usually related to an action of sorts.
These have a bit more flexi since no one is going to unsub/report spam for a login notification ... they'll just delete it.
But a mail of specials for the day might cause more issues.
The biggest thing is to follow best practice guidelines and you don't have deliverability issues :)
Looks awesome but this is the worst branding ive ever seen
No one reads anything in the landing page anyway
more like based'est branding everest seenest tbh fam
At least you have heard of me 😂
@@liltechnomancer did he just pull a jack sparrow...........
I'll just simply use a SMTP and write an api wrapped around it, then done 😂 no Resend needed
You’re wayyy oversimplifying this. Email is not straightforward to implement.
Why don’t host it on ec2 ?
railway is cheaper