I have something to offer when it comes to the Grawl Fractal. After watching your video, it got me thinking about GW1 a bit. If we look in the past, I think we could look at the Cathedral of Flames. The first bit that got me was the fact that both Murakai's boss area and the Grawl boss area are both heart shaped! Murakai summons minions and so does the grawl. Grawl reside in the charr home lands and could easily snatch humans for a necrotic sacrifice. The transformation from past to present is
You should also note that the entire place looks like an abandoned mine. Maybe the humans are workers from a nearby village previously working there searching for powerfull artifacts or something. And the grawl found it and started to worship the powers hidden inside, whatever it might have been.
If we're strictly talking capital-"v" volcanoes (rather than just areas with volcanic activity), I think there's a strong argument to be made that this fractal takes places at Mt. Hrangmer, where the Flame Legion first encountered the titans. Considering that the final transformation undergone by the champion shaman has a demonic element to it, it's worth wondering if these grawl encountered a titan that somehow went rogue after Abaddon's fall, and began to worship it in exchange for fire magic.
WP, your theory could be spot on here. It very well could be showing us the "Hill Giant" invasion that the Dwarves fended off. The Devs have said the fractals are not only the past of Tyria but that things get muddled in there as well so odd combinations can occur.
I have a guess at the volcano fractal. In guild wars 1 there is a volcanic area at the NE corner of eastern front in ascalon where it looks like like a part of the world's crust was torn open during the searing. It wouldn't be a stretch that that could be under that, and there are grawl and humans nearby.
that could fit in with the whole imitation theory, those sons of svanir being inspired by the little dwarf who fended them off in the past. Though I do feel the dwarves and norn both having knowledge about each other before EotN cannot be ignored. They both seemed to have known that the other race existed but not much about each others culture. In fact Ogden even says how aggressive and mean norn are when you see your first one.
Personally I think we actually do play a role in the fractals even though we are only visually transformed in a couple. I think they only chose to change our forms for a similar reason to the underwater statues: it was just cool. I think in all other scenarios everyone in the fractal sees as whatever originally carried out the actions that we carry out.
My take on the Snowblind Fractal is, contrary to the video, that the Sons of Svanir found in the Fractal are one of the first tribes to have been formed, and that what we're seeing is the formation and rise of the Sons of Svanir. Lornarr may be an individual leader, "blessed" by Jormag- or have been the very founder of the Sons of Svanir. It may be that they don't even go by the name of the Sons of Svanir until later. The enemies may just be called Sons of Svanir because of gameplay mechanics.
We aren't actually time travelling, in a few of the fractals you can actually see the Mists around us and quite possibly other "copies" of the fractal floating around ... specifically Jade Maw and Uncategorised.
After watching the queen ceremony again, I think the sabotage was done by the countes or has something to do with it. It is something she will do, she said so herself, also how did she know where the lady was hiding, she knows a lot about the watch knights mechanics, she was also very cam when everyone was running and panicking. Also she has a lot to gain if she gets rid of the queens lab dog. she will take his place. Putting all this into account, I think she is the one behind it all.
i think you have to remember that the fractals aren't accurate representations of the past. a lot of imagery, locations and time periods end up clashing together and ending up as the fractals we explore (as said in an interview). it's how there's elonian and ascalonian imagery in the underwater fractal. so there can be some potential inconsistencies and misinterpretations.
a bit off, and I haven't pieced it together, but the correlations so far have been pretty interesting. :) Maybe the grawl were worshiping Murakai!? Who knows? I don't know if there's much lore to work on, but that may help, and who knows if the heart shaped arenas were even intended! I would love to hear any feed back you'd have on this theory if you find yourself interested. Thanks WP for your awesome videos!
But as any historian knows, stories change through time. And soon enough this Lornar wasn't only dwarven of mind, but also dwarven of physicality. Soon enough his battle against the other norn wasn't a battle of rights, but was a battle of arms. So the story of Lornar the dwarf was born. Lornar wasn't perfect though, and when the dragon's corruption seized his allies, all he could do was give in himself.
The Depths of Tyria? The final room in the video just really looks like the end Eotn boss room structure. Lots of Volcanoes are not active, and could be disguised as mountains. Could be Maelstrom like everyone's saying, but I don't think humans would venture that south, they wanted to go to Kryta whenever crossing the Shiverpeaks.Seeing as there's only a few humans, I'm guessing they were traveling west from Ascalon. What about the giant skull the Grawl is on? There's a dragon head in the depths
I am a little curious - since it has been confirmed that all fractals were in the past. I would swear that the uncategorised one took like part in the future - showing what happens to Rata Sum, not to mention that it had parts of the city in it, and the funny cat golems - You can see TOM in Proxemics lab, while in the fractal you see Old TOM, like this was how the golem ended up? Perhaps they do not all take part in the past?
You missed a important thing a dev said, something how the fractals don't resemble 1 place ,but can be multiple places/realities blended into eachother, like the ascaloian ruins in the underwater fractal.
Hey WP, i had an idea the other day:what if you got a statue of your character that only appeared to you in your race's city after completing a certain fractal?After all, the fractals happen in the past, so if you did something really significant in one, you could have a statue built for your or something like that, let's say you're a charr, you complete the fractal and the statue appears in the Black Citadel,and if you did it again, it would refresh the statue to your new look.
Presumably because he thinks we are from the fractal itself rather than another team brought in from (the real) Tyria. It's worth bearing in mind that he is quite quite mad at this point, having been abandoned by Dessa so long ago.
He managed to persuade the norn to turn their backs to the dwarves and leave them alone. As such he was revered by the dwarves as a hero, one or more dwarves might even have said "Lornar, even though you are not built like we are, clearly you are one of us in mind, Lornar Dwarvenfriend." Over the centuries the dwarves kept telling stories about how Lornar managed to save them from the other norn.
Morrowind's soundtrack is one of the most beautiful musical compositions created in the past 100 years. Honestly, the finest classical music nowadays is in video games. And our nowadays Mozarts, Beethovens and Wagners are people like Jeremy Soule, Jason Hayes and Russel Shaw.
The idea that Fractals all take place in the past, and how we are time travelers intervening with events which could end in catastrophe... I dont know, I think Dessa is a Tyrian time-lord.
There's a Norn event chain in Wayfarer Foothills which ends in killing a Svanir shaman to unsummon a greater ice elemental which looks like the one from the fractal.
I think there's an Ice Elemental in the Norn Starting zone. I'm pretty sure the World Boss there starts summoning one, when the additional Events with the Portals start. I have yet to see the ice Elemental spawn though.
you mentioned that the norns came to the south in the name of conquest.I think that is totally flaw because norns always declare themselves as hunters,nomads etc.I think even the Jormag could convince this race to forget their old ways and become a tactic army.
I'd love to know whether we're meant to just be experiencing the past in these fractals or if we're literally going to the past, unknowingly to Dessa. A lot of the fractals dont really make sense if we're just meant to be witnesses as it basically means what we do never happened.
There was speculation that these Grawl might be worshiping Primordius since the Grawl Shaman looks similar to a Destroyer Harpy. All speculation. This theory is cool, though kind of a stretch since it might be just a case of developers working with existing assets and just modifying them a bit. (The "Indie" skeleton can be found in at least 2 other places in Tyria)
There is a waterfall in the Volcanic Fractal. 20:41 I doubt that there are waterfalls near such a volcano in Fire Island Chains/Fire Heart rise. Looks like a volcano somewhere in the tropical Mount Maelstrom area to me.
Another interesting video, I have a different hypothesis to the Lornarr conundrum. What if the Hill Giants really were norn and that the documented meeting was the very first time the two races met? It speaks for itself that there would be quite a bit of animosity and xenofobia between those two races. Maybe the Norn decided to wipe the dwarves out, and upon their clashing, only one norn defended the rights of the dwarves. That norn was Lornar.
the repeatedly filling lava-bowls remind me of the last "mission" of EotN. the chamber of primordus, just without him. maybe some grawl found an asuran portal after primordus has risen. did he even leave his place?
You definitely deserve it! You really appreciate Gw2 and what the developers are creating and you share that with the internet! You deserve a mini! MiniWoodenPotatoes!
The statues in the underwater fractal remind me of the sculpture "Vicissitudes" (Google it, it's quite beautiful) off the coast of Mexico. Also adding my congratulations on your second legendary ... you do keep these things quiet. =)
I've come across a thread that states that they are two different people, Lornar was the dwarf and Lornarr was the Norn. Probably the Norn's parents were mirin' Lornar so much that they named their son after him, like how people nowadays name their kids Jordan or LeBron xD
Probably been pointed out to you repeatedly already, but just in case... There are two ice elementals you fight of the grand and less humanoid form you're talking about. One is miniature and summoned in the finale of the weather machine Asura personal story. The other attacks the players in the finale of the Frozen Maw event chain. I'm surprised at how many players don't look up. You don't fight it directly, but a massive ice elemental causes the huge storm AoEs during that battle.
But it's pretty close to Orr, so there are undead running around. Plus there are a ton of earth elementals and other stuff that cause me to think that Mount Maelstrom is a terrible place to live
Well as for the shaman fractal couldn't it simply be underground? Didn't see any light above. The grawl becomes a Destoyer harpie doesn't it? Though I suppose it could just be using the skin.
well it is, but fractals represent what happened in the past, maybe its all the way back when Zhaitan didnt wake up .. or Risen still didnt come to Mount Maelstorm.
The music is beautiful but really distracting sometimes. T__T Such a shame.. Btw, did you forget Mt. Maelstrom when you were talking about volcanoes? D: I mean, I haven't seen any grawl there recently.. but who knows what happened in the past! Oh and.. when you started killing the first mobs in the icy fractal.. I was like: Wow.. those mobs' HP are MELTING. How can you do SO much dmg with only two.. oh wait.. Lv 1 fractal? Oh.. Couldn't do that with 2 ppl only anyway, though, hahaha.
If Fractals are all in the past, then what about the Asura Fractal? It seemed to be about a future Rata Sum.. And nice Elder Scrolls music, by the way :)
what if Lornar became corrupted by Jormag in order to save his people from the norn, which turned him into his norn like form, then Jormag and his army of corrupted took over so the norn were pushed to the south, to sum up my theory the corrupted/icebrood came before the sons of svanir and Jormag tempted Lornar (like he did to svanir)
love the lore vids cart wat for the next and my forts on the Volcanic Fractal is wot if it simple than u think wot if the grawl sharman is the ferst destroyer in tyria.
I have something to offer when it comes to the Grawl Fractal. After watching your video, it got me thinking about GW1 a bit. If we look in the past, I think we could look at the Cathedral of Flames. The first bit that got me was the fact that both Murakai's boss area and the Grawl boss area are both heart shaped! Murakai summons minions and so does the grawl. Grawl reside in the charr home lands and could easily snatch humans for a necrotic sacrifice. The transformation from past to present is
The use of "The Road Most Travelled" from Morrowind to musically accompany the section in the forest is brilliant!
You should also note that the entire place looks like an abandoned mine. Maybe the humans are workers from a nearby village previously working there searching for powerfull artifacts or something. And the grawl found it and started to worship the powers hidden inside, whatever it might have been.
If we're strictly talking capital-"v" volcanoes (rather than just areas with volcanic activity), I think there's a strong argument to be made that this fractal takes places at Mt. Hrangmer, where the Flame Legion first encountered the titans. Considering that the final transformation undergone by the champion shaman has a demonic element to it, it's worth wondering if these grawl encountered a titan that somehow went rogue after Abaddon's fall, and began to worship it in exchange for fire magic.
WP, your theory could be spot on here. It very well could be showing us the "Hill Giant" invasion that the Dwarves fended off.
The Devs have said the fractals are not only the past of Tyria but that things get muddled in there as well so odd combinations can occur.
I don't really think I deserve it, but I appreciate the gesture.
I have a guess at the volcano fractal. In guild wars 1 there is a volcanic area at the NE corner of eastern front in ascalon where it looks like like a part of the world's crust was torn open during the searing. It wouldn't be a stretch that that could be under that, and there are grawl and humans nearby.
that could fit in with the whole imitation theory, those sons of svanir being inspired by the little dwarf who fended them off in the past.
Though I do feel the dwarves and norn both having knowledge about each other before EotN cannot be ignored. They both seemed to have known that the other race existed but not much about each others culture. In fact Ogden even says how aggressive and mean norn are when you see your first one.
Personally I think we actually do play a role in the fractals even though we are only visually transformed in a couple. I think they only chose to change our forms for a similar reason to the underwater statues: it was just cool. I think in all other scenarios everyone in the fractal sees as whatever originally carried out the actions that we carry out.
My take on the Snowblind Fractal is, contrary to the video, that the Sons of Svanir found in the Fractal are one of the first tribes to have been formed, and that what we're seeing is the formation and rise of the Sons of Svanir.
Lornarr may be an individual leader, "blessed" by Jormag- or have been the very founder of the Sons of Svanir. It may be that they don't even go by the name of the Sons of Svanir until later.
The enemies may just be called Sons of Svanir because of gameplay mechanics.
We aren't actually time travelling, in a few of the fractals you can actually see the Mists around us and quite possibly other "copies" of the fractal floating around ... specifically Jade Maw and Uncategorised.
After watching the queen ceremony again, I think the sabotage was done by the countes or has something to do with it. It is something she will do, she said so herself, also how did she know where the lady was hiding, she knows a lot about the watch knights mechanics, she was also very cam when everyone was running and panicking. Also she has a lot to gain if she gets rid of the queens lab dog. she will take his place.
Putting all this into account, I think she is the one behind it all.
there's still a hill giant in Lornars pass. spotted doing the achi where you feed his griffon hidden off route of one of the jumping puzzles
i think you have to remember that the fractals aren't accurate representations of the past. a lot of imagery, locations and time periods end up clashing together and ending up as the fractals we explore (as said in an interview). it's how there's elonian and ascalonian imagery in the underwater fractal.
so there can be some potential inconsistencies and misinterpretations.
a bit off, and I haven't pieced it together, but the correlations so far have been pretty interesting. :) Maybe the grawl were worshiping Murakai!? Who knows? I don't know if there's much lore to work on, but that may help, and who knows if the heart shaped arenas were even intended! I would love to hear any feed back you'd have on this theory if you find yourself interested. Thanks WP for your awesome videos!
But as any historian knows, stories change through time. And soon enough this Lornar wasn't only dwarven of mind, but also dwarven of physicality. Soon enough his battle against the other norn wasn't a battle of rights, but was a battle of arms. So the story of Lornar the dwarf was born. Lornar wasn't perfect though, and when the dragon's corruption seized his allies, all he could do was give in himself.
The Depths of Tyria? The final room in the video just really looks like the end Eotn boss room structure. Lots of Volcanoes are not active, and could be disguised as mountains. Could be Maelstrom like everyone's saying, but I don't think humans would venture that south, they wanted to go to Kryta whenever crossing the Shiverpeaks.Seeing as there's only a few humans, I'm guessing they were traveling west from Ascalon. What about the giant skull the Grawl is on? There's a dragon head in the depths
I am a little curious - since it has been confirmed that all fractals were in the past. I would swear that the uncategorised one took like part in the future - showing what happens to Rata Sum, not to mention that it had parts of the city in it, and the funny cat golems - You can see TOM in Proxemics lab, while in the fractal you see Old TOM, like this was how the golem ended up? Perhaps they do not all take part in the past?
You missed a important thing a dev said, something how the fractals don't resemble 1 place ,but can be multiple places/realities blended into eachother, like the ascaloian ruins in the underwater fractal.
Hey WP, i had an idea the other day:what if you got a statue of your character that only appeared to you in your race's city after completing a certain fractal?After all, the fractals happen in the past, so if you did something really significant in one, you could have a statue built for your or something like that, let's say you're a charr, you complete the fractal and the statue appears in the Black Citadel,and if you did it again, it would refresh the statue to your new look.
For some reason I was entirely unaware of the existence of the snowblind fractal. The mechanics are really neat.
Presumably because he thinks we are from the fractal itself rather than another team brought in from (the real) Tyria. It's worth bearing in mind that he is quite quite mad at this point, having been abandoned by Dessa so long ago.
He managed to persuade the norn to turn their backs to the dwarves and leave them alone. As such he was revered by the dwarves as a hero, one or more dwarves might even have said "Lornar, even though you are not built like we are, clearly you are one of us in mind, Lornar Dwarvenfriend." Over the centuries the dwarves kept telling stories about how Lornar managed to save them from the other norn.
Really been pumping out the GW2 videos these days, thanks for the hard work.
Wp, I freaking love your Lore vids. You have made me fall in love with the history of this game. I might even go and get GW1 at some point.
Morrowind's soundtrack is one of the most beautiful musical compositions created in the past 100 years. Honestly, the finest classical music nowadays is in video games. And our nowadays Mozarts, Beethovens and Wagners are people like Jeremy Soule, Jason Hayes and Russel Shaw.
The idea that Fractals all take place in the past, and how we are time travelers intervening with events which could end in catastrophe... I dont know, I think Dessa is a Tyrian time-lord.
There's a Norn event chain in Wayfarer Foothills which ends in killing a Svanir shaman to unsummon a greater ice elemental which looks like the one from the fractal.
I can NOT get enough of these. I love your stuff man.
as i remember correctly the skeleton appears in 2 or 3 JPs. The one in Plains of Ashford and the one in the south of Malchor's leap
I think there's an Ice Elemental in the Norn Starting zone. I'm pretty sure the World Boss there starts summoning one, when the additional Events with the Portals start.
I have yet to see the ice Elemental spawn though.
you mentioned that the norns came to the south in the name of conquest.I think that is totally flaw because norns always declare themselves as hunters,nomads etc.I think even the Jormag could convince this race to forget their old ways and become a tactic army.
I'd love to know whether we're meant to just be experiencing the past in these fractals or if we're literally going to the past, unknowingly to Dessa. A lot of the fractals dont really make sense if we're just meant to be witnesses as it basically means what we do never happened.
There was speculation that these Grawl might be worshiping Primordius since the Grawl Shaman looks similar to a Destroyer Harpy.
All speculation. This theory is cool, though kind of a stretch since it might be just a case of developers working with existing assets and just modifying them a bit. (The "Indie" skeleton can be found in at least 2 other places in Tyria)
There is a waterfall in the Volcanic Fractal. 20:41
I doubt that there are waterfalls near such a volcano in Fire Island Chains/Fire Heart rise. Looks like a volcano somewhere in the tropical Mount Maelstrom area to me.
Another interesting video, I have a different hypothesis to the Lornarr conundrum. What if the Hill Giants really were norn and that the documented meeting was the very first time the two races met? It speaks for itself that there would be quite a bit of animosity and xenofobia between those two races. Maybe the Norn decided to wipe the dwarves out, and upon their clashing, only one norn defended the rights of the dwarves. That norn was Lornar.
the repeatedly filling lava-bowls remind me of the last "mission" of EotN. the chamber of primordus, just without him. maybe some grawl found an asuran portal after primordus has risen. did he even leave his place?
You definitely deserve it! You really appreciate Gw2 and what the developers are creating and you share that with the internet! You deserve a mini! MiniWoodenPotatoes!
I think the snow fractal could likely be in jormag's domain in the northern shiverpeaks
The statues in the underwater fractal remind me of the sculpture "Vicissitudes" (Google it, it's quite beautiful) off the coast of Mexico.
Also adding my congratulations on your second legendary ... you do keep these things quiet. =)
I've come across a thread that states that they are two different people, Lornar was the dwarf and Lornarr was the Norn. Probably the Norn's parents were mirin' Lornar so much that they named their son after him, like how people nowadays name their kids Jordan or LeBron xD
Abaddon is based on Prometheus too, gave mortals magic (fire) chained in torment for eternity.
Probably been pointed out to you repeatedly already, but just in case...
There are two ice elementals you fight of the grand and less humanoid form you're talking about. One is miniature and summoned in the finale of the weather machine Asura personal story. The other attacks the players in the finale of the Frozen Maw event chain. I'm surprised at how many players don't look up. You don't fight it directly, but a massive ice elemental causes the huge storm AoEs during that battle.
Gotta love the Morrowind soundtrack playing in the background! :)
WP, I dunno if you ever noticed this, but everytime I summon Rock Barrier on Scepter #2, they remind me of wooden potatoes :3
Ah, that Morrowind music. Still fits, because it's awesome.
But it's pretty close to Orr, so there are undead running around. Plus there are a ton of earth elementals and other stuff that cause me to think that Mount Maelstrom is a terrible place to live
The music was so well chosen, good job WP.
Well as for the shaman fractal couldn't it simply be underground? Didn't see any light above. The grawl becomes a Destoyer harpie doesn't it? Though I suppose it could just be using the skin.
well it is, but fractals represent what happened in the past, maybe its all the way back when Zhaitan didnt wake up .. or Risen still didnt come to Mount Maelstorm.
Love the Morrowind music. I've always thought that GW and TES music blend well together. Jeremy Soule is the best!
Congrats on your second legendary!
maybe its volcano in Mount Maelstrom ? that zone looks like its ok for humans to live in.
One of the devs specifically said it wasn't a future Rata Sum.
WP, out of curiosity, what is the name of the version or remix of song played at 9:00
There's a giant skeleton wearing a fedora at the end of one of the Ore jumping puzzles.
ah how i miss stealing all of the spoons in balmora to these lovely songs :D
But non of them are the size of the Earth Elemental that you face in the human tutorial, or the Ice Elemental in the Fractal.
Loving the Morrorwind background music
WP, would you mind to make your videos into podcast versions as well?
Hey WP what's your response to being petitioned as getting your own reference NPC in GW2?
what if the volcanic fractal occurs in Mount Maelstrom and the reason the shaman became fiery is because of Primordous corruption?
Giving fire to the humans sounds a lot like giving magic to humans. Abbadon relation?
already been stated by devs that it is not rata sum also you can see that it is smaller and has less technology
The music is beautiful but really distracting sometimes. T__T Such a shame..
Btw, did you forget Mt. Maelstrom when you were talking about volcanoes? D: I mean, I haven't seen any grawl there recently.. but who knows what happened in the past!
Oh and.. when you started killing the first mobs in the icy fractal.. I was like: Wow.. those mobs' HP are MELTING. How can you do SO much dmg with only two.. oh wait.. Lv 1 fractal? Oh.. Couldn't do that with 2 ppl only anyway, though, hahaha.
Hi wooden, why didn´t you pick your achievement´s prizes?, excellent videos BTW
If Fractals are all in the past, then what about the Asura Fractal? It seemed to be about a future Rata Sum..
And nice Elder Scrolls music, by the way :)
i like the pissing on graves idea.
Wooden potatoes, you're my inspiration for getting my legendaries :D
Been so long since I last watched this video
You should make an Guild Wars 2 audio book. I like your narrative style.
Sorry, only the first ten people get a prize!
Could the volcanic fractal be in Mount Maelstrom, that is after all a volcano we know about, and I'd not say that it's far from civilization...
However... I'd like to point out that the Lornarr here is spelled differently than the Lornar from stories, which might point to a different person.
Jeremy Soule composes for both GW, and TES.. does anyone else notice the music from Morrowind in the background? Awwwwww yeaaaah.
I'd Love to see npc called "Woody Potty Toe" he'd be like durmand in gw1 . in gw3 there would be "Woody's Priory"
That would be awesome if we could play as dwarves for this mission like the dulfy fractal were you play as charr ;)
also back in guildwars 1 ogden used to know that the "hill giants" are norns and not hill giants
what if Lornar became corrupted by Jormag in order to save his people from the norn, which turned him into his norn like form, then Jormag and his army of corrupted took over so the norn were pushed to the south, to sum up my theory the corrupted/icebrood came before the sons of svanir and Jormag tempted Lornar (like he did to svanir)
Yep. What if the Mount Maelstrom was a mine or something like that once in the last 500 years?...
And the climb to 1080p begins...
There should be fractals that cover content from GW 1.
nah there was that one cave that had icy parts behind it
Well you don't really have an impact on the past. You are just experiencing it. So those statues don't really make sense
Maybee Sons of Svanir of the first time the Jormag was awake? So ever longer ago
you're in luck! You can try it this weekend... won't let me send a link but go to the GW2 website and sign up
need more lore videos. Moar. MOARRR!!!!!!!
The volcano could just be mount maelstrom in the past.
But what if the NPC was an unassuming farmer near a field of potatoes that when harvested by a player gave wood logs instead? ;)
Is it just me, or does it look like Asura walk exactly like Penguins?
1:52 totally a potato in the first bag in the bottom left (doesn't seem in-game?).
I did not expect that.
love the lore vids cart wat for the next and my forts on the Volcanic Fractal is wot if it simple than u think wot if the grawl sharman is the ferst destroyer in tyria.
I laughed too hard when you fell at 3:05 :D
So I wasn't going crazy when I heard that.
Music from Morrowind?
Haaha, love the way you pronounce "Jotun" ^^ Btw, great video WP!
WP why don't you do a show called guild wars 2 what ifs. I already got an idea; What if the Charr didn't exist?
of course you do, don't be too modest.
Mt.Maelstrom?