RMS Oceanic (1899) | The Pinnacle of 19th Century Shipbuilding
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 มิ.ย. 2020
- White Star Line's RMS Oceanic was the final word in merchant shipbuilding of the 19th century. She was the largest ship in the world when she was completed, but only for a short time as the world of shipbuilding was in the middle of a transition and technological explosion.
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Sources:
'Oceanic: White Star's Ship of the Century,' Mark Chirnside
'Falling Star: Misadventures of White Star Line Ships,' John P. Eaton and Charles A. Haas
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Wow thanks for this. My great grandfather worked onboard Oceanic, in the engine room. He was one of the people who stayed after the war began because he adored the ship. My grandfather told me that the loss of Oceanic was one of the worst experiences his dad ever had. I have inherited hundreds of happy pictures from his career onboard.
Very interesting. Did he serve on any other White Star ships? When you say pictures, do you mean actual photographs? There aren’t very many pictures of Oceanic, especially taken aboard the ship. I’d be very interested in seeing them if you ever wanted to share.
@@TheGreatBigMove Well from what I recall that was the first ship he ever served on. After the ship went down I know he was in the merchant marine where he remained till he met a girl on shore leave and then left for good, got married and moved to NY city.
The photos are of him and his mates mostly. They were discouraged from taking photos of areas of the ship they were not supposed to be in from what I recall of 30 year old conversations with my grandfather. Most of it is from the crew mess areas, quarters, on the top deck and engine room areas. I know my great grandfather was obsessed with photography.
I will have to look in the storage unit and find the boxes but sure I would be happy to share. I will get back to you once I find the stuff. 😊
@@zodden01 Well, he got to serve on a great ship, even if it was his only one. I would appreciate that if it isn't too much trouble! Feel free to email me any time (email available on my channel page).
@@TheGreatBigMove I will and thanks for the GREAT channel! I just discovered it and I can't stop watching. Finally youtube recommends to me something I really like lol....
@@zodden01 I'm glad you're enjoying the videos! I certainly enjoy making them.
The Oceanic is one of my favourite white star liners
Good to see Oceanic finally getting her due. She was an incredible vessel. Not to mention extremely attractive.
Poo
The oceanic always had something special to me, I just love how she looks!
All hail the stepchickens
Bernardo Matos yes sir
Yeah, looked more like a yacht than an RMS . .
I love her
I really love how design philosophies carried over to the Olympic class liners. White Star ships are so pretty.
not just White Star ships. almost all ships constructed by Harland & Wolff had this overall aesthetic. :)
I dunno quite why, but the caption, "JP Morgan hitting a photographer with a stick" made me laugh.
LOL
Quite a striking comment.....
Yeah dat should be thumbnail of a try not to laugh video
He hated people taking photos of him that weren't very careful ensuring they were flattering. His nose was the most likely cause
Taking care of unruly journalism...
Although RMS Oceanic was a teensy weensy bit slow, it’s still one of my favorites.
F
O
R
E
V
E
R
.
It was not SLOW!!!! How dare you!!
What's impressive about Oceanic is in just 15 years, she carried over 184,000 passengers westbound to New York
From 1899 to 1914, Oceanic made 372 crossings, and carried a total of 309,006 passengers for an average of 831 per crossing, according to Mark Chirnside’s book about Oceanic.
Thats westbound + eastbound...
Oceanic, Olympic, and Titanic had great clean profile that I preferred that you couldn’t find on a lot of other ships...
Right... too many life boats just muck things up.
Yeah the big four looked strange with their broken up superstructure
And Britainnic
astrofission
What do you mean?
imagine if the oceanic III was completed.
Beautiful little ship. Love the Victorian interiors.
Little?? Hardly!
It was the biggest ship in the world at that time, and it's a big ship even by today's standars. But it's a beautiful ship, I agree on that.
@@connorpusey5912 Little by ocean liner standards. The biggest ocean liner today is Queen Mary II, at 1,132 feet. The biggest fictional liner, if that counts, was Iconic, at roughly 2,214 feet. Still, Oceanic II is strongly sized at 704 feet.
@@connorpusey5912 Every time i see or hear someone referring to a ship as "little" i want to put a clip of Commander Worf on the Enterprise E bridge after the battle against the Borg in :D
@@kellykimble665 Downvoted for mentioning the fictional liner. What was the point of that?
The most elegant ship in my eyes! Low lines! Very very clean looks!
Yes. White Star liners were generally slower than the Cunarders, but looked fast and sleek.
As a former lightship sailor, it was a great pleasure to see one sailing past at the bottom of the screen. I served on WLV612 for a year in the early 70's. This was when she was stationed at Blunt's Reef off of Cape Mendocino CA. Thanks for the recognition. Much appreciated.
"Lightship sailor"? Is that like being "captain" of an HMS "shore establishment"? Or maybe "pilot" during "ground training"?
I loved your post...
It took a lot to take that tough old girl down but she did it and nobody had to die. Although the question is when they said that they were salvaging as much as they could off of the boat where were they putting it. I wonder if they got on land and started it putting it on land until another ship came to save them?
@@deeremeyer1749 Lightships are still at sea, even though they are mostly stationary. Don’t get them confused for lighthouses; they serve similar roles but they are also different and one is significantly more dangerous.
"The smoking room was lit.." nice
Lmao
I was thinking the same thing lol.
More so on the Hindenburg, which actually did have a special lounge
Does that mean it is lit.... fam? XDDDDDDD
As I saw this comment as he said that
Its weird looking at these pre-titanic period ships, they look really low down in comparison. It's a shame none of them exist today as they're time capsules. Also £160 in 1900 is about £20,000/$24,000USD in 2020.
160$ in 1914 is 4207$ in 2020 so if the 160 was in 1900 it would not be that much difference from 1914
smartasset.com/investing/inflation-calculator#dFM3Ppl6ZT
More like pre Lusitania ships coz that ship started the trend of ships with giant super structures
only on in existence SS Great Britain
Golden Life Gaming
Not really. Oceanic has a pretty large superstructure. You mean a more solid-looking superstructure? Because that’s what it seems like to me.
“Low down”? What do you mean by that exactly? Oceanic looked pretty big to me.
What a wonderful presentation. You brought the Oceanic to life for me. Until now, I always thought she was dull, but you gave her personality. Thank you!
- Actually, it was found that Oceanic's long length compared to her relatively narrow beam caused excessive vibrations at 21 knots, so the ship was forced to sail at around 19.5 knots in service.
- Construction of her intended sister was first proposed in October 1899, but the death of Thomas Ismay the following month postponed the order and Bruce Ismay eventually cancelled it, instead diverting the resources into the the "Big Four" (Celtic of 1901 (originally ordered by his father before his death), Cedric of 1903, Baltic of 1904 and Adriatic of 1907)
-Oceanic's loss was blamed on poor leadership due to the fact that, during her brief time as a merchant cruiser, she actually had two captains. She was officially commanded by Navy Captain William Slayter, but her previous merchant master Henry Smith was still on board with the rank of Commander and the two men argued, often countermanding each other without the other's knowledge when they relieved each other on watch (sometimes even countermanding the one in command on the spot), to the point that the crew didn't know who was actually in overall command of the vessel. This was the case on the morning of her grounding. David Blair (of Titanic fame) was the ship's navigator and made the incorrect navigational fix that originally put her on her incorrect course. Commander Smith disagreed with Slayter's command to "skirt the island" and instead plotted a course out to sea (which would have saved her), but Slayter, noticing the change in heading, arrived on the bridge and countermanded Smith, ordering the helmsman to stay on their current course in a hasty and poorly informed judgement call. She soon ran aground on the Shaalds of Foula, an incredibly shallow and rocky reef that comes within feet of the surface and is notorious for being practically invisible in calm waters.
Commander Smith, once ashore, looked back at his wrecked ship and naively stated that she would remain stuck on the reef as a monument, but an islander, familiar with the Shetland weather, was said to have cynically replied "I'll give her two weeks." Sure enough, two weeks later, the ship had been swallowed by a Shetland storm, famed for their ferocity, and had disappeared into the sea, her broken remains scattered across the seabed to this day.
- The wrecking was covered up by the government out of embarrassment that a world famous and beloved ocean liner had been lost a mere two weeks into naval service in broad daylight in calm, friendly waters due to the incompetence of her own crew and so wasn't known about publicly until after the war had ended.
It's not clear where the claim that 'Oceanic's long length compared to her relatively narrow beam caused excessive vibrations at 21 knots, so the ship was forced to sail at around 19.5 knots in service' comes from. I found no primary source evidence of this although it is mentioned in various secondary sources.
Voyage data for the year 1900 shows that she averaged more than 19.5 knots on her westbound crossings and, if we take into account that, on average, the current was against her, then her speed through the water would have been over 20 knots. This was during a year when White Star's rival, Cunard, had concerns about coal supplies and labour, and monitored a reduction in speed for a number of ships including Teutonic and Majestic.
Paul Heenan you got that on google people are not dumb
@@mark_chirnside Longer propeller shaft, more vibration. Probably 19.5 knots revolutions was just below vibration resonance peak conditioned by varying resonance factors. Load, draft, jazz beat etc. Rear engine VW Beetles had little vibration above 50 knots.With radio off.
@@Mrbobinge There is no primary source evidence this was the case. Moreover, the data I have provided demonstrates Oceanic was run at more than 19.5 knots.
@@mark_chirnside Point taken. My frivolous comment was more a poke at relative design practices of those times. Sensors and computers of today would likely predict precise source and magnitude of each additive vibration towards destructive resonance. My old oscilloscope would've saved many a reputation. Me seatime 20 years, 9 ships, all oceans.
The content in this video made me feel like I was in the time period. I feel so much closer to the time period and to the Oceanic and the ships of her time. Such a tragic end.
Pls, talk about the Teutonic. She was the beginning of a new phase for the White Star with the introduction of 2nd Class. She-s also the inspiration for the German Liners. She was also a beautiful ship for her time.
Tiago Alves yess
Really? Never heard of it!
indeed! lovely ship. i believe the first major ship to introduce second class was city of new york of 1888, around a year before teutonic. however teutonic was the first white star liner originally and successfully built with it.
@@carlosiiideespana3712 Ships already had been carrying a second class since the 1850s
And the last White Star Liner to hold the Blue Riband.
For a turn of the century vessel, “Oceanic” had a very modern...almost cruise-ship” look to her. One can easily picture her tied up in port in modern day St. Thomas USVI.
I think she'd stick out, though in a good way. She didn't have much superstructure compared to modern cruise ships.
For the vessel to have survived for a month being repeatedly ground and pounded on the rocks was indeed a testament to it's design, the strength of the hull, together with the overall build integrity, I believe that very few ships could have survived such a prolonged ordeal.
Good video, interesting, informative and entertaining, with good narration and imagery. Subscribed.
It was "grounded" on a "reef" in calm weather and flat water and didn't get "pounded" by jack shit until 3 weeks after "grounding" by a "gale" that didn't even last a full day and only "two weeks after the incident" (i.e. getting "pounded" by a "gale") that piece of shit was "overnight" somehow "swallowed by the sea".
Yeah. A real marvel of "naval architecture" and "world class" so-called "British" shipbuilding it was. From "grounded" to "gone" as a result of a single "gale" in 35 days or less.
If only there was a Wikipedia article about the "Shaalds" so we could see what kind of "rocks" she was "pounded" on and what kind of "sea" she was "swallowed up" by. Overnight. On a "reef".
@@deeremeyer1749 1. No need for so many sets of quotes. I felt like I was saying: It was GROUNDED on a REEF in calm weather and flat water.
2. Oceanic was an actual marvel. Even without the waves, water corrodes and weakens. And even if she was stuck on a reef, I'd still count it as grounded.
3. You're way overdoing this. You could just say: It wasn't actually destroyed for a while, as she was in calm waters until 3 weeks later. It also was on a reef, and didn't actually hit rocks.
You have a great in depth story here. Of course there was going to be another Oceanic. A 1050 foot liner was designed for White Star in 1927-1928. The keel was laid in 1928. She was going to be diesel powered. The depression and a financial scandal scuppered her. The existing hull was dismantled. Rumour has it that some of her steel may have ended up in the Brittanic and Georgic.
1:54 Thats just an amazing shot. So interesting to see the framing alone.
1:22 I wonder if that scale model still exists.
If I’m not mistaken it exists today at the London Science Museum, could always be a different model.
Oh cool i am subbed to your channel and had no idea you were interested in this stuff.
i also wish i had this model
The group 'Titanic Honor and Glory' sells 1/1000 scale models of Oceanic. They're small (21.4cm) but highly detailed.
@@lux132 ùùùý
0:32 aside of the now laid up and forgotten Great Eastern
Dude!
I heard on a history of Lightoler that he loved the Oceanic so much that he salvaged a clock off of her before she sank to remember her by.
These old ocean liners had beautiful lines. Would of loved to have sailed on them.
I can see why Lightoller liked her so much. She was a strong ship.
3:00 I’m sure that room was hella lit 🔥
Awesome shot of her portside at 7:50.
You're doing a wonderful job! Wish you all the best!
Thank you very much for making this video collecting, so many image, and presenting so many elements and incidents your summary of the life of this ship. As well as citing sources in the description.
I can definitely see the beginnings of the style used on the more famous Olympic class ships. It’s really neat to see that taking shape in the 1890’s. Oceanic is such an underrated ship. Also those construction photos were amazing. Some I’ve never seen before!
my great grandfather was born in 1899, cool year. cool video, 121 years later to watch
Very interesting. The Olympic class shared a lot of visual ques with this vessel.
A short video on the ship's intended successor in name (begun but cancelled after the wall street crash) would be good too :-) .
Any White Star ship built between 1889 and 1910 (so Teutonic right up to Olympic) look similar to each other because they were all designed by Alexander Carlisle, who gave the ships their signature "White Star look" with their clean lines and towering, raked funnels.
@@paulheenan9098 All true. My favorite of the Carlisle ships the Oceanic for one reason. The beautiful knife edge bow.
Thanks for all of your efforts in researching and properly documenting the lives of these beautiful ships. We all appreciate you!
Such an elegant ship, both inside and out.
How many lifeboats did (1899) oceanic had in total.
My grandfather immigrated to America on this ship. Luckily they didn't pass the health exam for their previous ship, the Titanic. Excellant video.
Fascinating. Thank you for making and posting this video!
There is a book about the salvage /scraping of oceanic . Called the other titanic?.people were tough in those days. A great read
There's a book about her conception and career, too.
I always like to think the RMS Oceanic as an ancestor of the Olympic class, her clean lines and design really looks like the ones seen on the Olympic class, specially the forecastle and the poop deck on both ships the Oceanic and the Olympic are the same
Oceanic was an ancestor of the Big 4 which were ancestors of the Olympic class.
awesome love it
what an ERA to live.
this was a peace of ART, now days no one build like that !
I don't know what it is about ships like these and steam engine powered machines in general, but I've always loved them. One of my first words was - I kid you not - coal-furnace.
Thanks for this lovely video of Oceanic! I thoroughly enjoyed every moment. What a grand ol' gal, and your history narrative is so compelling and informative 👏
Great job on the video, looking forward to more!
Great stuff! I love these kinds of vlogs. Greetings from Norway!
Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching.
Great video! Very informative. Such a beautiful ship.
This was an excellent watch.
After watching this I want to drive over to Long Beach and take the Queen Mary tour again... Thanks for posting, you and your team do a great job at putting videos together.
Fascinating. Thanks for a great video.
I just wanted to say thanks, that was a super interesting video with awesome facts I’ve never heard after years of searching out videos on the same subject. :)
Thank you . Keep up the Great work 100%
When my father see the Oceanic and he says: "Hey this ship looks a mini version of the Titanic..."
Well...
Oceanic *
Tell him it's ss nomadic that's the mini titanic
All through white stars steamers in the design and bridge area you can certainly tell they are related.
Showing the menu of 1st class was a nice touch. Thanks
Excellent! My Dad sailed on the RMS Franconia of the Cunard Line from Liverpool to New York on her final voyage. She apparently carried Churchill to Yalta during WWII which was in an article that I found in my Dad's passenger book.
I enjoyed that. Thank you.👍🏻
Beautiful ship!
I love older ocean liners they look like great floating homes. And they also have better style than cruise ships of today.
Great video! Keep it going! :)
Fantastic video!
Very well done video! Informative, entertaining and well researched!!
Thanks, Joe!
Wonderful history lesson, thank you.
Great video ..Really well made ...Kept my interest to the end ...Fantastic .. Thank you for posting ..
Excellent history lesson! Many thanks.
I really Love this Channel
I love old liners
Its a shame none of these ships were preserved, I use to drink in a bar called the Mauritania which was lined in its restaurant and bar with large amounts of the Mauritania cruise ship having been bought and installed after the ship was scrapped.
Early 1900s ocean travel is like the marvel cinematic universe with how much overlap there is. Here we have cameos from Titanic, Olympic, and all sorts of people and ships.
Great video. Lovely ship. Sad that they’re all gone.
Thank you so much for this wonderful video. My father came to the US on the Oceanic when he was six years old in 1911. His parents had a bit of money, so they might have traveled on second class.
Uwaaaa
I love this video so much
I can’t wait till he does one on mv britanic
Edit: thx guys from all of the likes this was my first top comment
She's one of my favorite ships, but it would be a short video. I will do it at some point, though.
The Great Big Move thanks btw I’m AJ from the fox star line FB group
@@TheGreatBigMove Please do a video about the rivalary between Hamburg America Line, Cunard Line and the White Star Line, maybe between the 1870's till the 1930's when Cunard and White Star joined together. I find it so interesting when you talk about the diffrences and priorities of the company's
That whould be cool
Isn't the MV Britannic a much later ship?
Wow! Can’t wait to see!
Jehovah's Witness Gospel fullness
rare photos..well done
i enjoyed this story more than I expected.
Well done presentation.
Thank you kindly!
A very detailed history of the Oceanic including interesting Titanic connections
Awsome dude
Great video
Well what can I say about this special cruicer... Such A nice one, A very beautiful. Thank s for this history dokument 👍😀
Amazing video! I love to see early White Star Ships. The Design Choices are so "clean" and beautiful in comparison to Cunard's. (My opinion xD).
Very detailed video! You do your research sir and for that I trust your information and subscribed.
Thanks, Rickey!
Good video good job on the pictures
The oceanic looked good with those two stacks
Can you do one about the R.M.S Queen Mary???
This ship has been where I live, how nice.
That was great!
Very nice!
Nice presentation.
Very well researched and presented. After my dad recovered from TB, his mom took him back to visit relatives in Czechoslovakia. They sailed out of New York to Hamburg on one of the German liners. This had to be in the early 1920s. I can't remember the name of the ship. After watching this, it makes me wonder what happened to all of the 1st class furnishings after the Oceanic was outfitted for naval duty. Did the stained glass and other furnishings go down with the ship?
I’m not sure how much of the furnishings and fittings were saved. I would imagine that any stained glass would have been abandoned, but that’s just speculation.
I wonder if Captain Herbert Haddock was related to Tintin's captain Haddock?
I don't watch videos about ships much (I'm more of a train guy) but they're very interesting and I admire your community's passion and knowledge.
I appreciate your videos a lot, they're very informative! Just a little note: This officer at 14:17 is not James Paul Moody, but Alphonse Martin Tulloch (Fifth officer of the Olympic). People seem to get it wrong a lot and misidentify the persons on this alleged "group photo" of Titanic officers, but these are in fact Olympic officers. Just pointing this out, for your future reference. Otherwise great video! The RMS Oceanic (II) is actually my favorite White Star ship (next to Titanic), because she's visually stunning and has such an interesting history. Keep up your quality work!
What is the thing about lack of firemen (coal shovelment) you mention? Any article about it?
If I remember correctly, the source I used for that is Mark Chirnside's book on Oceanic. There are other sources out there, though.
How about creating a server on discord, It would be a great way for us who enjoy ocean liners and other vessels to chat on.
I'm in an ocean liner discord. Do you want to join?
i would like the link too
Here's the link:discord.gg/fhuqv62
There discord servers without people going after each other throats like 5 year olds in a gang fight? I find that hard to believe, its either that or the admins are ban happy sociopaths.
I recently started a Facebook group. I realize that that's a little antiquated, so I'll look into Discord. I don't know much about it other than hearing about it from TH-camrs who do livestreams.
Shetland is a deadly place for ships even now, for example: the MV Braer and Green Lily
Being a ship enthusiast from Shetland, I know.
Very good commentary
Well done.
Wow, think about it, Olympic and Titanic, both built at Harland and Wolff Shipyard in Belfast, Northern Ireland, were yard numbers 400 and 401, planned in 1907. Then you have RMS Oceanic, which was laid down in 1897 and had the yard number 317. Crazy how many ships H&W built at the turn of the century. By the way, RMS Britannic was laid down November 30th, 1911 and was yard number 433.
You should do a video on the big four
I probably will