An interviewer coming into an interview prepared, having read the work of the person he's interviewing, knowing stuff about their background and shared history, is what separates a good interview from a bad one. This was a great interview
@@TheAureliac Yeah, his interview with Tiffany Haddish about her book "The Last Black Unicorn" was a really good example of that, aside from the obvious rapport between the pair.
I love the part about the myths surrounding the Civil War. We've really done ourselves a disservice in this country by not looking at the real Civil War. (Ken Burns aside) We allowed the people in the states that were on the losing side to create those myths about it. (Something that Germany did not do after World War 2) We allowed the war to be glamorized to the point that it stopped being real. It was not the Blue and the Grey. It was not the Yankees versus the Rebels. It was not the Union versus the Confederates. It was the United States of America versus states which had illegally seceded. The Army of the United States fought against an army made up of citizens who represented the states which had seceded illegally. By taking up arms against the United States Army that group of people committed treason. They were pardoned by Andrew Johnson for that treason on December 25th 1868 in one of his final acts as president. And the easiest way to tell this story is by looking at the state of Virginia which held the Confederate States capital of Richmond. Virginia didn't secede until April 17th, 1861. That was when a vote was taken by the Virginia Secession Convention in Richmond. They had convened the convention on February 3rd of 1861 to determine what to do after some states had seceded before then. Should they secede or not? Was secession legal or not. These were issues which were brought up and discussed by the attendees. And the conclusion of the convention was that secession was illegal. That they would only take a vote to secede if Lincoln called up troops to put down the rebellion of the states that had seceded. The attack on Fort Sumter happens on April 12th and 13th. Lincoln immediately calls up 75,000 troops after the Fort surrendered on April 13th. Then the Virginia convention calls for a vote on secession. But let's remember something important. By firing on Fort Sumter, a federal fort, the group of people who did that committed treason. So the Virginians who voted for secession were supporting that and joining in on the treason. They consciously chose to do that. But only 2 years earlier on October 16th 1859, John Brown led a group of men in an attack on a United States Military depot in Harper's Ferry, Virginia. Their goal was to gain arms and create a slave rebellion in Virginia and other southern states. After taking control of the arsenal the group was surrounded and attacked by local townspeople, state militia and eventually a company of US Marines led by Brevet Colonel Robert E Lee. On October 18th that company attacked and quickly captured the remaining raiders. Robert E Lee became a hero to Virginia and the other Southern states for stopping this group and putting down the rebellion. The state of Virginia then tried and executed John Brown and 4 others for treason against the state of Virginia. So let's understand this fully now. Virginia seceded knowing full well that it was illegal. They seceded after Fort Sumter was fired on by a group of people in open rebellion against the United States of America. An act of treason. And only 2 years earlier a similar act committed upon them resulted in a trial for treason and an execution of those involved by them. And the person who was the hero in putting down the act of treason would then lead an army of traitors against the Army of the United States of America. The total deaths in the raid on Harper's Ferry was 10. Total US Army combat deaths in the Civil War was 140,000. Essentially Robert E Lee was responsible for over 100,00 US Army lives lost. The war itself in total cost the lives of at least 650,000 Americans. In essence this "glorious" and "romanticised war" cost the lives of 650,000 Americans. It started with an illegal act of treason for which the president of the United States of America 7 years later would pardon the traitors. And our country then allowed those who had engaged in the treason to create a false myth around the war in an attempt to legitimize their crime and lionize the traitors. Even going so far as to erect statues to them in public. We allowed them to romanticize the institution of slavery and to lie about its effects and then we allowed them to create discriminatory laws after slavery ended. This is our history. This is the shame we must all understand. But we do not have to continue it. Nor should we continue to allow the lies to be spread about it.
Please educate me on this, I am not a US citizen, so I didn't learn any of this in school (or maybe only briefly, as a side note), so I am not biased in that sense. My only bias is lack of knowledge.… What I know, I learned here and there, documentaries and stuff. My understanding was that the USA (i.e. union states) did, as you point out, primarily fight of a segregation. And being against slavery, was primarily to weaken the south's economy which heavily relied on cheap work force. Sure, there where humanists who actually thought that slavery was inhumane etc. but that was not the main motivation. Is that correct? I am doubting now, because I hear Coates say in this interview, that the war _was_ about slavery and he seems to have done a fair amount of research. Reading your comment above supports my knowledge, as the US army had fought off a slave rebellion, or what could have resulted in one, shortly before the outbreak of the civil war. So I can only assume, that they didn't actually care (so much) about ending slavery per se but rather didn't want to loose territory in the south, possibly also because there was a lot of agriculture goods in the south? And simply because no country wants parts of its states to segregate. Is that adequate? Thnak you!
@@stulora3172 The principal properties the Southern states were fighting preserve were to keep enslaved people (they considered property). The territory was only secondary because of the Missouri Compromise which determined which new states would be a slave state or not. Read about Missouri Compromise for more information concerning territory determination prior to the Civil War.
Stephen Colbert is hands down one of the best interviewers. This was a very insightful talk. Will definitely be reading this book. Whoopie... should take lessons from Mr. Ta-Nehisi. This is how you properly promote your book, not by being rude.
@@JohnComeOnMan - You've never seen an "interview" with Chris Matthews. He never lets his "guests" get more than a few words in edgewise. Terribly frustrating.
@@JohnComeOnMan - His show is when I run errands. IF something interesting happens on his show, I'll see it on TH-cam or as a clip in another show. Saves me lots of frustration.
I visited one plantation, didn't have an official tour, but just couldn't deal with the reality of people who were property. Later, I realized that I had been to other plantations, but shit changed, so they didn't look the same. Some were whole neighborhoods, campuses of schools, hospitals, colleges. Pervasive, insidious history.
@@Mikejr91 "Get Over It???!!!" Explain in Ur OWN word's what that 3 word ridiculously redundant statement actually means to you🙄??? I'm extremely interested in hearing U expound🤔... Just be prepared for ME to shut Yo Ignant Azz down Tho!!! NOW,,,, explain URSELF??!!
just learned there was a burial ground upon which some of Wall Street in NY is built on. There's communities that are currently under man-made lakes. The past and present are still connected, even if you are not aware of it.
The point Ta-Nehisi made about not resisting the facts but resisting the implications of the facts is what we see now with those who revere DJT. Found that a very striking observation and very relevant to current times.
Literally having a black male literary hero in my time incorporating OUR actual history & state of being thereof being because of ACTUAL HISTORY is making my heart shake n shake again!!!!!!!!!!!! LOVE LOVE LOVE COATES & HIS PATHOLOGY!
Wonderful interview. An interviewer who is actually interested and can listen to answers and an interviewee with something to say and a wonderful way of saying it.
Used to read his articles every week when attending Howard U in 96-98 where he wrote for the school paper when I was there. Very engaging writer. Knew he would be prominent since back then.
I was so excited to watch this interview! Mr. Coates is so articulate and personable. I purchased his book Between the World and Me for my son, he loved it! I can't wait to order The Water Dancer!
this is a really amazing interview. coates is so knowledgeable about how language forms ideas in the reader. i've rarely heard people talk about this outside of academia and he does it so eloquently as well. love his question back to stephen as well, really wonderful conversation.
When in the south we went to a plantation with a man who’s great or great great grandfather was a slave. As we walked by the slave cabins I had the strangest feeling like I was walking among people I couldn’t see. the feeling was complete dread it was very overwhelming I can still feel it to day when I think of it and that was over 40 years ago
He's done his research for sure. That's a long time to learn about when slavery began and who finally opposed it. He'll stop at nothing to keep a country in the dark about blacks' history of slaveholders. You can learn more in a day than he'll ever let on. Trust me, if you're white he hates you. And if you're black he wants you as a thought slave tied to the past.
Wow! Great interview! Two very intelligent men discussing an important issue, seen through the lens of a well written book. I am going to buy this book.
I don't get it. isn't the whole point of going to a plantation to talk about enslaved people? this elephant is sooo visible. instead: would you look at that architecture! at auschwitz no one raves about the great railroad leading to it.
@@debbiedoodiedandi 🤦♀️"how dare they ruin my fun day filled with memories of how great this greatest nation on earth is." pulling yourself up by your own bootstraps my ass.
Some white people are uncomfortable with the idea that their ancestors could've done these sort of things, so they for whatever reason get defensive on their behalf and get insulted when slaves are talked about. It's in my opinion another weird American trait. Germans were taught about the cause of WW2 and their students were taken to concentration camps, and no lies were told about the history. Like the civil war being split between the two factions American politics is the same. One side is okay with talking about it but the other side (Conservatives) mostly in the south where these plantations are have had control of those areas for hundreds of years and have decided to minimize their ancestors role in slavery.
@@adamtak3128 Agreed. A former colleague of mine (RIP) always said that he was told by his southern-born spouse that the fact that her family had owned slaves was never to be asked about or discussed. He was from western Pennsylvania and was various curious; but he acknowledged her wishes for the sake of peace. Me being black, I kinda looked at her differently after that.
@@adamtak3128 In Germany I lived a bout ten miles from Dachau and the Concentration Camp. The majority of Germans mentally separate themselves from NAZIs. This does two things. They don't have to feel personally responsible for the atrocities. Second, The security structure gets a lot less push back when enacting anti - NAZI laws and initiatives. This is one of the reasons why the statues are so important here. People are still personally identifying with them.
I stood in the Lincoln Memorial, re-reading what's inscribed on the wall. Not The Gettysburg Address but The 2nd Inaugural. It talks specifically about slavery as the cause for the Civil War but I had to keep reading it, to let it sink in. #TaNehisiCoates
I read between the world and me as an assigned book for my literature class and I didn't expected to like it so much. The author really has a nice way of writing and captivating the reader while tackling real hard issues in American society that most (white) people don't want to acknowledge.
Ebby C The reason why this country will never totally heal and why there will always be underlying divisiveness is because we as a people haven't resolved the history of our nation; the good, the bad, and all points in between. As long as we skirt around the issues we will NEVER heal. Those of us who reconcile ourselves to our past are the ones of us who can explore the issue without rancor or self loathing or hatred against each other. Without that, America will always have that elephant in the room. I admire the Germans in that they admitted that Hitler and the Nazi party were a very dark part of their history. They tell the true and horrible stories matter of factly when giving tours. Because of the stigma against them and their past the German people have become some of the most friendly and tolerant people now. Due to their growth I doubt they have to worry about history ever repeating itself. Here in America we have a lot of growing up and acceptance of ownership to do before we will ever grow as the multicultural super power we are supposed to be.
Lisa, so good to read your post. If you would look up Pete Buttigieg's comprehensive approach to wholistically addressing systemic racism? It's called *_The Douglass Plan_* and look for the pdf _white paper_ which is at least 8 pages but might be 18. He explains the interweaving of issues rather than bandaids that make whites feel good. Being "white" (really, I'm slavic) I am thrilled with the Douglass Plan because it explains how the AA experience has been "another country" and how to provide the opportunities to change that. He covers these areas: economic (e.g., making more credit available), educational (e.g., highly paid elementary black teachers), health (e.g., teach doctors about their biases re pain symptoms), criminal justice (too many to note). These are just examples of his systemic approach. I hope you read it and discuss with your community.
We have so much entertainment, food, access to education that it’s hard to understand there is a history so bad that it’s been hidden by some who wish it would all just go away. We need to hold onto and highlight the memory of what this country was founded on: not liberty, not slavery, but hypocrisy.
If you haven't read his Black Panther run, go read it, it's amazing. So yeah, technically this book isn't his first fiction, but it's his first original fiction, that's true!
Ta-Nehisi will be buying your book and enjoy trying to work out the facts from fiction, kudos on your persistence and patience in writing your book and on the difficult topic it covers. 😊💖
What a good point he made about plantations: can you imagine going to Auschwitz and hearing about the architecture? Gross! Hard to believe we’ve tried to bury the hurtful legacy of chattel slavery and been successful at it
I grew up in Yankee Land (Wisconsin) in the 70’s and 80’s and I’m astonished that there is anyone who would have the audacity or the ignorance to say the civil war was NOT about slavery. I don’t doubt that it happens/ed but, really, what was the Civil War about if not slavery?!?
"They were not human to me. Black, white, or whatever, they were the menaces of nature"- Black supremacist Ta-Nehisi Coates talking about 9/11 first responders
I didn't know about black panther, but he did captain America recently too. It had some interesting storylines/themes etc, wonder why the comics weren't mentioned. Seems like a really interesting guy though, I didn't realise he had such a wide body of work.
@@tinalulumack378 and JloveLamar (To be clear, when I said "Black Panther", I meant the comic book of that name, not the movie.) Obviously I know the difference. But the words used were "First piece of fiction". "Piece of fiction" is a broad category that includes everything from novels to short stories, to comics to SONGS. If he had said "First fictional novel", he'd be correct, but "First piece of fiction" is just objectively untrue, and considering that Stephen refers to his work with Marvel in the other half of this interview, it's a weird exclusion.
The Civil War started for one main reason: The South was becoming a mind-boggling economic powerhouse due to all the slavery and the cotton industry and the sale of it to Europe. The North, very dependent on the south at that time for it's textiles and refineries overall didn't want to lose a south that was looking at becoming it's own sovereign nation. Why would Lincoln allow ALL THOSE TAX dollars to be lost. TAXES was what it all was about - ENDing SLAVERY was a means to enforce the south not becoming a sovereign nation (Dixieland) . Lincoln said in his 1861 inaugural address he didn't feel inclined to end slavery - but his concern through his administration were tax payments as I remember. Look it up.
Chiefjetsonofflare Sigh. Income tax may have started in 1913. There were other taxes before. "No taxation without representation" came around 150 years before. Whether it was slavery or the wealth created through the work of slaves, it comes down to one side wanting to hold on to it and one side wanting to assert power. If it was only about not losing taxes, why abolish slavery? The south's economic power ended both because of the end of slavery and the huge number of war dead and wounded.
Fiction can only communicate real facts, if the person writing, and directing, understands what facts they are pushing as fiction. Look at star wars, while george lucas, understood what he was trying to portray. The people whom brought star wars, have totally ruined the ideas of it. Yep, fiction can portray truth as fiction, but only if the person writing and directing the piece, understands it well enough, to send it out as a metaphor in another guise.
Not saying comic books aren't real literature either, but there's an obvious difference between writing your first fiction novel vs your first comic book.
Fiction allows you to explore all sorts of things that people aren't ready to deal with in non fiction. Scifi (not that this book is scifi, but you get the point) is basically built on that premise. Can't deal with racism head on without massive social blowback? Paint one guy black and white, and the other guy white and black, and stick them in space.. bingo.
Coats has it backwards: fictional storytelling is a convenient tool for communicating myths, distorting facts, and misconstruing implications. What is lost on these armchair humanists is that family separations occur in the countries of origin, and what occurs in the countries of destination, such as in the U.S., is a sorting out of intentions and identities en route to family reunification either in the country of origin (e.g .via deportation, repatriation) or in the country of destination (e.g. via authorized temporary or long-term stay for qualifying family members). Suffice it to say, that comparing involuntary migrant slaves to voluntary unauthorized or refuge-seeking migrants is ridiculous and a clear example of myth-making and distortion of facts.
Well, _technically,_ no, the Civil War was _not_ fought over slavery; it was fought over freedom. It was fought over the southern states' _freedom_ to own _slaves._ Every state that seceded declared as much in their constitution.
As did the rest of us, Coats' editor realized that Coats' non-fiction was actually fiction, so might as well dispense with the facade and just write fiction, even though Coats' fiction is actually even more fictional.
An interviewer coming into an interview prepared, having read the work of the person he's interviewing, knowing stuff about their background and shared history, is what separates a good interview from a bad one. This was a great interview
Yeah, that whoopi interview was so bad, Made me cringe.Colbert handled it so gracefully though.
It's part of what I loved about Jon Stewart. Trevor Noah has usually read a good bit of whatever he's discussing as well.
@@sid294 I loved the interview with Whoopi. They carried on like siblings.
@@TheAureliac Yeah, his interview with Tiffany Haddish about her book "The Last Black Unicorn" was a really good example of that, aside from the obvious rapport between the pair.
I love the part about the myths surrounding the Civil War. We've really done ourselves a disservice in this country by not looking at the real Civil War. (Ken Burns aside) We allowed the people in the states that were on the losing side to create those myths about it. (Something that Germany did not do after World War 2) We allowed the war to be glamorized to the point that it stopped being real. It was not the Blue and the Grey. It was not the Yankees versus the Rebels. It was not the Union versus the Confederates. It was the United States of America versus states which had illegally seceded. The Army of the United States fought against an army made up of citizens who represented the states which had seceded illegally. By taking up arms against the United States Army that group of people committed treason. They were pardoned by Andrew Johnson for that treason on December 25th 1868 in one of his final acts as president.
And the easiest way to tell this story is by looking at the state of Virginia which held the Confederate States capital of Richmond. Virginia didn't secede until April 17th, 1861. That was when a vote was taken by the Virginia Secession Convention in Richmond. They had convened the convention on February 3rd of 1861 to determine what to do after some states had seceded before then. Should they secede or not? Was secession legal or not. These were issues which were brought up and discussed by the attendees. And the conclusion of the convention was that secession was illegal. That they would only take a vote to secede if Lincoln called up troops to put down the rebellion of the states that had seceded. The attack on Fort Sumter happens on April 12th and 13th. Lincoln immediately calls up 75,000 troops after the Fort surrendered on April 13th. Then the Virginia convention calls for a vote on secession.
But let's remember something important. By firing on Fort Sumter, a federal fort, the group of people who did that committed treason. So the Virginians who voted for secession were supporting that and joining in on the treason. They consciously chose to do that. But only 2 years earlier on October 16th 1859, John Brown led a group of men in an attack on a United States Military depot in Harper's Ferry, Virginia. Their goal was to gain arms and create a slave rebellion in Virginia and other southern states. After taking control of the arsenal the group was surrounded and attacked by local townspeople, state militia and eventually a company of US Marines led by Brevet Colonel Robert E Lee. On October 18th that company attacked and quickly captured the remaining raiders. Robert E Lee became a hero to Virginia and the other Southern states for stopping this group and putting down the rebellion. The state of Virginia then tried and executed John Brown and 4 others for treason against the state of Virginia.
So let's understand this fully now. Virginia seceded knowing full well that it was illegal. They seceded after Fort Sumter was fired on by a group of people in open rebellion against the United States of America. An act of treason. And only 2 years earlier a similar act committed upon them resulted in a trial for treason and an execution of those involved by them. And the person who was the hero in putting down the act of treason would then lead an army of traitors against the Army of the United States of America. The total deaths in the raid on Harper's Ferry was 10. Total US Army combat deaths in the Civil War was 140,000. Essentially Robert E Lee was responsible for over 100,00 US Army lives lost. The war itself in total cost the lives of at least 650,000 Americans.
In essence this "glorious" and "romanticised war" cost the lives of 650,000 Americans. It started with an illegal act of treason for which the president of the United States of America 7 years later would pardon the traitors. And our country then allowed those who had engaged in the treason to create a false myth around the war in an attempt to legitimize their crime and lionize the traitors. Even going so far as to erect statues to them in public. We allowed them to romanticize the institution of slavery and to lie about its effects and then we allowed them to create discriminatory laws after slavery ended. This is our history. This is the shame we must all understand. But we do not have to continue it. Nor should we continue to allow the lies to be spread about it.
Please educate me on this, I am not a US citizen, so I didn't learn any of this in school (or maybe only briefly, as a side note), so I am not biased in that sense. My only bias is lack of knowledge.… What I know, I learned here and there, documentaries and stuff.
My understanding was that the USA (i.e. union states) did, as you point out, primarily fight of a segregation. And being against slavery, was primarily to weaken the south's economy which heavily relied on cheap work force. Sure, there where humanists who actually thought that slavery was inhumane etc. but that was not the main motivation. Is that correct? I am doubting now, because I hear Coates say in this interview, that the war _was_ about slavery and he seems to have done a fair amount of research.
Reading your comment above supports my knowledge, as the US army had fought off a slave rebellion, or what could have resulted in one, shortly before the outbreak of the civil war. So I can only assume, that they didn't actually care (so much) about ending slavery per se but rather didn't want to loose territory in the south, possibly also because there was a lot of agriculture goods in the south? And simply because no country wants parts of its states to segregate. Is that adequate?
Thnak you!
Are you saying he shouldn't have pardoned them ?
@@stulora3172 The principal properties the Southern states were fighting preserve were to keep enslaved people (they considered property). The territory was only secondary because of the Missouri Compromise which determined which new states would be a slave state or not. Read about Missouri Compromise for more information concerning territory determination prior to the Civil War.
@@whisperinthenight absolutely correct
I cannot believe you took the time to put this together. It has proved to be very insightful.
Stephen Colbert is hands down one of the best interviewers. This was a very insightful talk. Will definitely be reading this book. Whoopie... should take lessons from Mr. Ta-Nehisi. This is how you properly promote your book, not by being rude.
Stephen Colbert and Graham Norton are the best interviewers because they actually let the guests TALK!
Charlie Rose was the worst on that score.
@@JohnComeOnMan - You've never seen an "interview" with Chris Matthews. He never lets his "guests" get more than a few words in edgewise. Terribly frustrating.
@@zinaj9437 Yeah, he's awful too. I can't watch hosts who do that.
@@JohnComeOnMan - His show is when I run errands. IF something interesting happens on his show, I'll see it on TH-cam or as a clip in another show. Saves me lots of frustration.
Seth Meyers too!
I visited one plantation, didn't have an official tour, but just couldn't deal with the reality of people who were property.
Later, I realized that I had been to other plantations, but shit changed, so they didn't look the same. Some were whole neighborhoods, campuses of schools, hospitals, colleges.
Pervasive, insidious history.
Get over it. It was 250 years ago.
This is powerful!
@@Mikejr91 No response necessary....
@@Mikejr91
"Get Over It???!!!" Explain in Ur OWN word's what that 3 word ridiculously redundant statement actually means to you🙄??? I'm extremely interested in hearing U expound🤔... Just be prepared for ME to shut Yo Ignant Azz down Tho!!! NOW,,,, explain URSELF??!!
just learned there was a burial ground upon which some of Wall Street in NY is built on. There's communities that are currently under man-made lakes. The past and present are still connected, even if you are not aware of it.
Never read anything by Ta-Nehisi Coates but going to order this. What a fine interview.
He's great!
His contributions to the Black Panther comic series are awesome, too!
Anna 93 . I like him too. Humble
His reads hold you solid and NEVER DISAPPOINTS.... Can't wait to purchase this one.
Read what he says about the 9/11 first responders in “Between the World and Me.” It’s sickening.
The point Ta-Nehisi made about not resisting the facts but resisting the implications of the facts is what we see now with those who revere DJT. Found that a very striking observation and very relevant to current times.
Jon Baptiste and crew always have the best entrance music for guests. “Giant Steps” for Ta-Nehisi is absolutely perfect!
Literally having a black male literary hero in my time incorporating OUR actual history & state of being thereof being because of ACTUAL HISTORY is making my heart shake n shake again!!!!!!!!!!!! LOVE LOVE LOVE COATES & HIS PATHOLOGY!
Wonderful interview. An interviewer who is actually interested and can listen to answers and an interviewee with something to say and a wonderful way of saying it.
Used to read his articles every week when attending Howard U in 96-98 where he wrote for the school paper when I was there. Very engaging writer. Knew he would be prominent since back then.
I was so excited to watch this interview! Mr. Coates is so articulate and personable. I purchased his book Between the World and Me for my son, he loved it! I can't wait to order The Water Dancer!
I did not know Mr. Coates but he is a highly intelligent, interesting and insightful man. What an engaging interview.
Two very captivating humans sitting here.
Between the World and Me is beautiful. It's a letter to his son so it's intimate and focused. I'm excited to see how this book flows!
Ditto!
this is a really amazing interview. coates is so knowledgeable about how language forms ideas in the reader. i've rarely heard people talk about this outside of academia and he does it so eloquently as well. love his question back to stephen as well, really wonderful conversation.
When in the south we went to a plantation with a man who’s great or great great grandfather was a slave. As we walked by the slave cabins I had the strangest feeling like I was walking among people I couldn’t see. the feeling was complete dread it was very overwhelming I can still feel it to day when I think of it and that was over 40 years ago
ChiefJestsonof flare where did u go? Which city and state??
This was a very enlightening and free-flowing interview. Nice one Stephen.
A book that Ta-Nehisi Coates spent 10 years on?? Yeah, definitely reading it.
He's done his research for sure. That's a long time to learn about when slavery began and who finally opposed it. He'll stop at nothing to keep a country in the dark about blacks' history of slaveholders. You can learn more in a day than he'll ever let on. Trust me, if you're white he hates you. And if you're black he wants you as a thought slave tied to the past.
Same here...like yesterday... I'm grabbing this one up!!!!
@@thenrepeat9124 Pssst... guess what? I peed in your white hood the other night!
@@yohei72 I'm going hunting with my friends. Wanna go?
This interview was critically important, thanks for doing this.
Mr. Coates is a National Treasure imho.
a National Trasure that bashed cops and firefighters on 911. Yeah sure.
Wow! Great interview! Two very intelligent men discussing an important issue, seen through the lens of a well written book. I am going to buy this book.
How do you know it's well written if you haven't read it?
Beautiful interview 🌈 a must read!
I don't get it. isn't the whole point of going to a plantation to talk about enslaved people? this elephant is sooo visible. instead: would you look at that architecture! at auschwitz no one raves about the great railroad leading to it.
Not only that, but some visitors are complaining now that some of these plantation tours are starting to talk more about the realities of slavery.
@@debbiedoodiedandi 🤦♀️"how dare they ruin my fun day filled with memories of how great this greatest nation on earth is." pulling yourself up by your own bootstraps my ass.
Some white people are uncomfortable with the idea that their ancestors could've done these sort of things, so they for whatever reason get defensive on their behalf and get insulted when slaves are talked about. It's in my opinion another weird American trait. Germans were taught about the cause of WW2 and their students were taken to concentration camps, and no lies were told about the history. Like the civil war being split between the two factions American politics is the same. One side is okay with talking about it but the other side (Conservatives) mostly in the south where these plantations are have had control of those areas for hundreds of years and have decided to minimize their ancestors role in slavery.
@@adamtak3128 Agreed. A former colleague of mine (RIP) always said that he was told by his southern-born spouse that the fact that her family had owned slaves was never to be asked about or discussed. He was from western Pennsylvania and was various curious; but he acknowledged her wishes for the sake of peace. Me being black, I kinda looked at her differently after that.
@@adamtak3128 In Germany I lived a bout ten miles from Dachau and the Concentration Camp. The majority of Germans mentally separate themselves from NAZIs. This does two things. They don't have to feel personally responsible for the atrocities. Second, The security structure gets a lot less push back when enacting anti - NAZI laws and initiatives. This is one of the reasons why the statues are so important here. People are still personally identifying with them.
Very thoughtful writer. I had never heard of him until now but am now definitely interested in reading his material.
Catch him on TH-cam recordings. He's skillful... Actually genius qualities.
We went to to the Whitney plantation. Just awful what we did. The Whitney is such an important place to go visit. God bless you Mr. Coates.
"Giant Steps" indeed...
Andrei R. Coltrane would’ve been...93 the 23rd.
Giant Steps was extremely vibey!!!
When I grow up, I want to enter a stage greeted with "Giant Steps".
A brilliant interview between two men who love the power of literature and the grace of knowledge. Thank you!
what a brilliant modest man. what a great interview.
Post slavery America still uses the same political tactics: family separation. “There’s no school like the old school.”
He is an excellent writer. Stephen did a great job
I enjoyed listening to this guest
I stood in the Lincoln Memorial, re-reading what's inscribed on the wall. Not The Gettysburg Address but The 2nd Inaugural. It talks specifically about slavery as the cause for the Civil War but I had to keep reading it, to let it sink in.
#TaNehisiCoates
I read between the world and me as an assigned book for my literature class and I didn't expected to like it so much. The author really has a nice way of writing and captivating the reader while tackling real hard issues in American society that most (white) people don't want to acknowledge.
I really admire how humble he is)
Giant steps on the intro is a nice touch
Mr Coates is one of the most important writers alive today. We are so lucky to hear him speak and learn from him.
i love this person....
Ebby C The reason why this country will never totally heal and why there will always be underlying divisiveness is because we as a people haven't resolved the history of our nation; the good, the bad, and all points in between. As long as we skirt around the issues we will NEVER heal. Those of us who reconcile ourselves to our past are the ones of us who can explore the issue without rancor or self loathing or hatred against each other. Without that, America will always have that elephant in the room. I admire the Germans in that they admitted that Hitler and the Nazi party were a very dark part of their history. They tell the true and horrible stories matter of factly when giving tours. Because of the stigma against them and their past the German people have become some of the most friendly and tolerant people now. Due to their growth I doubt they have to worry about history ever repeating itself. Here in America we have a lot of growing up and acceptance of ownership to do before we will ever grow as the multicultural super power we are supposed to be.
Lisa, so good to read your post. If you would look up Pete Buttigieg's comprehensive approach to wholistically addressing systemic racism? It's called *_The Douglass Plan_* and look for the pdf _white paper_ which is at least 8 pages but might be 18. He explains the interweaving of issues rather than bandaids that make whites feel good. Being "white" (really, I'm slavic) I am thrilled with the Douglass Plan because it explains how the AA experience has been "another country" and how to provide the opportunities to change that. He covers these areas: economic (e.g., making more credit available), educational (e.g., highly paid elementary black teachers), health (e.g., teach doctors about their biases re pain symptoms), criminal justice (too many to note). These are just examples of his systemic approach. I hope you read it and discuss with your community.
We have so much entertainment, food, access to education that it’s hard to understand there is a history so bad that it’s been hidden by some who wish it would all just go away. We need to hold onto and highlight the memory of what this country was founded on: not liberty, not slavery, but hypocrisy.
This guy is brilliant
Yeah, 'people's perception is their reality'; escapism is a human past time
Powerful.
What a great interview
If you haven't read his Black Panther run, go read it, it's amazing. So yeah, technically this book isn't his first fiction, but it's his first original fiction, that's true!
His black panther run is just world building....
@@SkyFire2112 And? it's still fiction.
Ta-Nehisi will be buying your book and enjoy trying to work out the facts from fiction, kudos on your persistence and patience in writing your book and on the difficult topic it covers. 😊💖
What a good point he made about plantations: can you imagine going to Auschwitz and hearing about the architecture? Gross! Hard to believe we’ve tried to bury the hurtful legacy of chattel slavery and been successful at it
This was riveting.
This interview shows the difference between LSSC from the other late night lightweight subject matter covered, TY SC! :)
Really enjoyed listening to their enchanted.
Fascinating!!!!
I grew up in Yankee Land (Wisconsin) in the 70’s and 80’s and I’m astonished that there is anyone who would have the audacity or the ignorance to say the civil war was NOT about slavery. I don’t doubt that it happens/ed but, really, what was the Civil War about if not slavery?!?
LOVED Giant Steps as in the intro music
Giant steps!
"They were not human to me. Black, white, or whatever, they were the menaces of nature"- Black supremacist Ta-Nehisi Coates talking about 9/11 first responders
The giant steps play on. Epic.
Finally... Been saying this for years. They were people made into slaves. Thank you for finally bringing this point forward.
What Stephen doesn't seem to understand is that the sadness is neverending 0:56
deep
Love that Coltrain
Reading this!
Dude is too smart lol
I knew it just couldn't articulate it
I mean, you really can't say this is his first work of fiction. He did a run of Black Panther a few years back.
I didn't know about black panther, but he did captain America recently too. It had some interesting storylines/themes etc, wonder why the comics weren't mentioned. Seems like a really interesting guy though, I didn't realise he had such a wide body of work.
helen midgley I knew of Black Panther but not Captain America. Which run was that?
Those are comic books. This is his first fiction novel
You do the know the difference between a novel and a script for a film right? It is his first fictional novel!
@@tinalulumack378 and JloveLamar (To be clear, when I said "Black Panther", I meant the comic book of that name, not the movie.)
Obviously I know the difference. But the words used were "First piece of fiction". "Piece of fiction" is a broad category that includes everything from novels to short stories, to comics to SONGS. If he had said "First fictional novel", he'd be correct, but "First piece of fiction" is just objectively untrue, and considering that Stephen refers to his work with Marvel in the other half of this interview, it's a weird exclusion.
"Between the World & Me," was a masterpiece!
A masterpiece of bigotry and finger-pointing.
@@mutoneon You obviously didn't read it... I'll by you a copy if you like- Seriously I will!
They really played giant steps right there
The Civil War started for one main reason: The South was becoming a mind-boggling economic powerhouse due to all the slavery and the cotton industry and the sale of it to Europe. The North, very dependent on the south at that time for it's textiles and refineries overall didn't want to lose a south that was looking at becoming it's own sovereign nation. Why would Lincoln allow ALL THOSE TAX dollars to be lost. TAXES was what it all was about - ENDing SLAVERY was a means to enforce the south not becoming a sovereign nation (Dixieland) . Lincoln said in his 1861 inaugural address he didn't feel inclined to end slavery - but his concern through his administration were tax payments as I remember. Look it up.
InviteTheLight Readings the civil war was in the 1861 ended 1865. taxes did not start until 1913 you look it up, your memory is💩
Chiefjetsonofflare
Sigh. Income tax may have started in 1913. There were other taxes before. "No taxation without representation" came around 150 years before.
Whether it was slavery or the wealth created through the work of slaves, it comes down to one side wanting to hold on to it and one side wanting to assert power. If it was only about not losing taxes, why abolish slavery? The south's economic power ended both because of the end of slavery and the huge number of war dead and wounded.
Wow, this episode really stands out, comparing with other over politicized and entertaining useless ones )
The Daily Show with Trevor Noah tries really hard to do a lot of powerful interviews like this one. It's worth checking them out!
@@AludraEltaninAltair Exactly! And I like that he touches some serious topics like global warming with that young girl invited.
Ta-Nehisi: ctrl + h = replace
First comment. Love this man.
Man, look how tall he is compared to Stephen when they shake hands. Is he like 6ft 5?
Is the band playing giant steps by John Coltrane in the beginning?
Ta-Nehisi Coates AND "Literary NBA Player"
A national treasure 🙏✊🏼✌🏼🌈💕
Funky Giant Steps!
I was hoping that this would be about his Cap comics.
No talk of him writing Black Panther? That’s why I clicked on this.
They talk about it here - th-cam.com/video/ptCo1TgHrDc/w-d-xo.html
Pamela Flynn thanks!
@@fearless4him595 You're welcome!
I’ve found much more truth in fiction works and fiction (at times in form of couching) in books sold as nonfiction.
Ta-Nehisi Coates AND "Chris Rock With A PhD"
Intelligent lovely man
Ta-Nehisi - I've got a tip for you, man. CTRL+F. That's how you find words in a document.
That Giant Steps was slow
That's not his first piece of fiction: he's written Black Panther and Captain America comics.
Yeah, they mention it here - th-cam.com/video/ptCo1TgHrDc/w-d-xo.html
Interesting first name.
That's why when I have writers block I use writethatscene.com because I know my story will be valuable to the world.
❤️❤️❤️❤️
Fiction can only communicate real facts, if the person writing, and directing, understands what facts they are pushing as fiction.
Look at star wars, while george lucas, understood what he was trying to portray. The people whom brought star wars, have totally ruined the ideas of it.
Yep, fiction can portray truth as fiction, but only if the person writing and directing the piece, understands it well enough, to send it out as a metaphor in another guise.
What is the music Jon is playing as his intro?
Doesn't Black Panther count has his first piece of fiction or ... is that ... real. Wakanda for Ever!!!!!!
In the part of the world where I come from the prefix Ta denotes Father of
So it would be Father of Nehisi
Thanks for educating me. I love stuff like that. Language is so interesting
Where are you from?
susanne anique Botswana
The Kalanga people in my country would refer to Susanne's dad as Ta Susanne
I've just finished listening to this book. Very beautiful visual writing. And I say yeah ametica owes reparations to my Black ancestors
If I had to nominate one person to speak for all black people, it would be Ta Nehisi Coates.
What a delight and relief after that Whoopi trainwreck. Articulate, urbane and engaging...
I thought he wrote black panther?
Not his first work of fiction! He wrote a lot of good Marvel comics!!!!
*fiction novel
That’s not real literature
Not saying comic books aren't real literature either, but there's an obvious difference between writing your first fiction novel vs your first comic book.
Fiction allows you to explore all sorts of things that people aren't ready to deal with in non fiction.
Scifi (not that this book is scifi, but you get the point) is basically built on that premise. Can't deal with racism head on without massive social blowback? Paint one guy black and white, and the other guy white and black, and stick them in space.. bingo.
Coats has it backwards: fictional storytelling is a convenient tool for communicating myths, distorting facts, and misconstruing implications. What is lost on these armchair humanists is that family separations occur in the countries of origin, and what occurs in the countries of destination, such as in the U.S., is a sorting out of intentions and identities en route to family reunification either in the country of origin (e.g .via deportation, repatriation) or in the country of destination (e.g. via authorized temporary or long-term stay for qualifying family members). Suffice it to say, that comparing involuntary migrant slaves to voluntary unauthorized or refuge-seeking migrants is ridiculous and a clear example of myth-making and distortion of facts.
First piece of fiction? Stephen - seriously- did you not read his arc on Black Panther?
Well, _technically,_ no, the Civil War was _not_ fought over slavery; it was fought over freedom. It was fought over the southern states' _freedom_ to own _slaves._ Every state that seceded declared as much in their constitution.
As did the rest of us, Coats' editor realized that Coats' non-fiction was actually fiction, so might as well dispense with the facade and just write fiction, even though Coats' fiction is actually even more fictional.
I like corn 🌽
Audience was sleeping hard