If it aint broke don't fix it , I have been hunting with my 3006 for 40 years and it definitely does a great job short and long range ! Thanks Ron for giving my old favorite some love !
Been using an Browning A-bolt .270 for 40 years. One time a friend and I were both using 150 grain remington core locked rounds. He had 06 and me .270. I shot a buck in the heart and it dropped instantly. The next day, same spot same distance he hit a buck in the heart, it bucked a little and he shot it again same spot, still didn't stop it. Then a round in the neck. I'm by no means am talking bad about 06, it is more versatile. This was our experience.
@@jamesdmyrick5809 Don't blame the '06 for sure. I've shot deer with the same gun/caliber, either .270 or 30-06 over the years, and seen drastically different results from a bang-on shoulder shot. Some drop dead on the spot, one took off running and I nailed it again within an inch of the first shot (minor miracle), and it still got up and covered another 20 yards. One stood still as if he had not been hit, and after another hit right on target, slowly keeled over dead. My conclusion is that if you want to be sure they don't run, you'll have to shoot them in the head.
Same here. I’ve been hunting deer, bear, and hogs with the same R-7400 30-06 since I was a teen. It looks like hell but it gets the job done. I killed 5 hogs out of a single sounder with it once and my wife calls the picture of me with all five hogs “he ran out of bullets”. Lol
I've used my Rem. ADL .30-06 for everything from ground squirrels (with 130-grain HPs) to Alaskan moose and caribou (200-grain Sierras) and not once has it let me down. At 71, my hunting days are over, but that 700 .30-06 will never leave my gun case.
Same here, with my dad's say so and help I saved and saved and bought a Rem 700 BDL.30-06 when I was 13. I have epoxy bed the ac;tion and refinished the stock on it. I'm close to 40 now and I will keep it until I die!
I've had my Husqvarna 30-06 for a large part of my 70 years, and it has never failed me. It has served me well. But then, I'm not into wasting my money just to have the latest and greatest. I love the caliber!
Recently picked up a Husqvarna in .30-06, manufactured in 1956. Getting one inch groups at 100 yrds. I think the shooter can do better. The rifle is a keeper.
@Bryce Keylon Husqvarna made very accurate, high quality rifles. Many sold under names life JC Penny back in the day. They stopped producing firearms in 1972, if I'm not mistaken. Mine is from the 1950's.
@Bryce Keylon yes til 1968 I think. The model 46 uses a small ring 1896 Swedish mauser. The model 640 and 1640 used fn98 commercial actions supplied by the Belgian to Sweden as war repayment. The 96 small rings are chamber in 6.5x55 and 9.3x57 and the 98 large rings are chamber 220 swift, 270win, 30-06, 8mm and 9.3x62
Thanks for this video, as I am 72 and have been hunting with the '06 for most of my life. Always found all the 06 family easy to load and pretty adaptable to many powders and bullets and remain accurate. About 15 years ago I discovered the 338-06 and did some hunting in Montana and Wyoming. I find I now use my 338-06 as much as my beloved 30-06. Again, thanks, youngsters just don't understand the attraction to this fine old cartridge.
My son got himself a model 1917 ("American Enfield") made by Remington in 1917. I hate to say it, but the poor thing was sporterized. They milled off the iron sights for some reason so she's scope only, but we both love her. She's the only rifle my son will hunt with even though I build custom flintlock firearms. So yeah, the youngsters do love a 30-06 if they can find one and afford it if they do.
I am also an old dude and have been hunting with an 06 for most of my hunting life. I discovered the 35 Whelen a few years back and have been impressed with the loads I can produce for it. Two rifles I will never relieve myself of are my 7x57 and my 30-06. I can't say which of those I would select if I could only have one. I've owned most of the popular magnum calibers and now own none of them cuz I don't need them.
If it wasn't for the 30/06 many cartridges would have never been born. Personally my favorite is the .280 Rem. I inherited my Grandpa's old 30/06 Springfield sporterized. Every year it goes on a hunt on the nicest days. I know he would love it so it's like taking Gramps with me.
@@actionjksn And it depends on what you want to accomplish. If I was going on a brown bear hunt and going to use an 06 derivative case, the 256 newton would be FAR down the line.
Loved the video about the grandpa 30-06. i have used it my whole life in southtexas, and it's offspring my personal favorite the 25-06 when its loaded right with the right bullet it can't be beat. They got it right in 1906, and we are still trying to make it better to this day and still can't make that all around best cartridge because they had it right the first time
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
What you have will do you well down there i worked down there for many years dont waste you money on something that you dont need if you have them 3 guns you are definitely good there
The 6.5-06 is a smoker. I had to build one out of curiosity. It works well for pronghorn hunts! I don't shoot it that often anymore. I like to mention its performance to 6.5CM fans who like to make wild claims.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
Ruger action 280 is what I own. Shoots that 140 -145 grain very well. I'll admit I got caught up in marketing at the time but knowing what I know now and how well the gun performs I have no regrets. I have not it out hunting in over 15 years but I believe it's time to show it some love. Never should have sold my 270 or any other firearm I own. Always keep them!
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
Thanks for the history lesson. This year I picked up a CVA Scout in 35 Whelen. I've been loading everything from 180 - 250 grain bullets and they all shoot well. Props to it's Daddy.
The 30-06 is such a fantastic cartridge that it achieved mundanity. That's impressive. If you ever needed a default cartridge that could conceivably do everything? The 06 can make it happen. It can be a light varmint round, a heavy Elk round, a competition round, a general woods round, a paper-plinker. Just phenomenal. My favourite of its derivatives is still the 280 and 280ai. Maybe the best non-magnum round as far as I'm concerned.
.338-06 A-Square really does drive a somewhat heavier bullet at impressive velocity, without going up the caliber chain. But, it's so obscure. A-Square closed its doors many years ago. The .308 Winchester family is also extensive.
I have a 35 Whelen that is a wonderful cartridge. Out to 250-300 yards it is a heavy hitter. I have a 760 Remington and a O3-A3 Converted to 35 Whelen both are accurate with 30-06 plus a bit more kick.
@@nedrgr21 A-Square was a company that used to exist. They built some rifles, developed some wildcat cartridges for Saami approval. It's really no different than calling a cartridge by another name, like Ruger or Nosler or Hornady. The Ackley improved cartridges is a completely separate thing.
@@williamrauch4464 yeah I don’t really see the point of the 338-06 while the whelen exists, I just wish there were some newer bullets to extend that range a hair. I want to build one sometime regardless.
My two favorite 30-06 offspring are the 25-06 and tyhe 35 whelen. The 25 is great for reaching out and touching critters at long range and tyhe 35 Whelen is just a beast to just slam critters to tyhe ground and not get back up!
I wish that Remington had left the 280 with the 7mm Express name change. It just sounds cooler and I think that might have improved the popularity of the 280. I was just a little kid when they changed the name and I thought that the 7mm Express was an awesome name for the times. In reality, the 30-06, 270 and 280 are nearly identical in performance. I was raised a 270 fan, but a lot of friends and family were 06 guys and I never knew anyone that had a 280. We would always argue and debate about which one was better, but in reality there's not enough difference to make a difference. I agree with you. A deer can't tell the difference between a 243 or a 375 . Dead is dead after all. I've never got the "overkill " saying. You can't overkill anything. It's dead or it's not. Keep up all the great videos Ron. You're the fix that all of us cartridge nerds need. Without you we'd be going into cartridge withdrawal. I've never been that interested in what kind of rifle, shotgun or handgun that uses a particular cartridge, just the cartridge itself. The primer, powder and bullet is what gets the job done, not the firearm itself. Until the next one stay safe and good hunting.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
True that. I did the same to get a 6.5-06 (98M action). The 6.5-06 takes backseat to no other 6.5 cartridge. I also built a 6.5x55 on a Vz 24 action as a kid gun. Over the years, there have been a bunch of young ones take their first deer with it. I use that gun a lot now because of a bad shoulder and age.
I grew up with the 30.06; watching and helping my dad develop his hunting rounds for an Enfield and a Springfield that he'd sporterized. The round he came up with utilized IMR 4831 with a maximum powder load and 150 grain bullet for accuracy and maximum mushrooming. Along about 1988, my brother-in-law called me and told me he had found a gun I really needed to buy. It was a Winchester Model 70 Featherlight chambered in .280 Improved and built by a couple of brothers in a local Reno gun shop. I bought it and started hunting with it, the 140 grain Nosler Partition is an extremely deadly round, one shot and it's down. The 30.06 is without a doubt one of the most versatile rounds ever made. One of the other rounds my dad would load was a 120 grain hollow point...it was a very quick round, great for varmint hunting. Thanks for you very informative videos!
The year was 1888, and the m88 cartridge was invented by the German Rifle Testing Commission. The cartridge is known by most as the 8x57 Mauser. As far as I can determine, it was the first cartridge with a .473 case head diameter. That makes it the parent cartridge of all the cartridges you covered in this video. The case head diameter is the factor that determines cartridge lineage. As long as the offspring cartridges have a .473 case head, they are the product of the original cartridge with that case head diameter. You can lengthen, shorten, squeeze down, blow out, change shoulder angel, but as long as the case head measures .473, it was derived from the M88 cartridge. I know you said you weren’t going to talk about before the 30/03. However, I think credit is due to the real parent, not the step parent.
@@wisconsinfarmer4742 The royalties to Mauser were not because of the 30-06 cartridge but because of patent infringements in the design of the 1903 Springfield rifle. The 8x57 cartridge was designed by the German government for use in Mauser action rifles. The 7x57 cartridge and rifles were designed by Paul Mauser.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
For deer and antelope sized game the .243 Winchester is great. Have taken more than 100 deer with the .243. The .270 is absolutely awesome for deer sized game up to elk sized game. Some people use it for even larger game, than elk. It works. But for the largest of North American game, I personally would start at the 30-06 as a adequate cartridge. I'm not a fan of the belted magnums. But if I ever felt like I needed something larger than the 30-06 it would be the .35 Whelen or the .338 Winchester Magnum.
All of the cartridges I mentioned before are adequate for anything in the America's. Possibly with the exception of large bears. But they have been taken with these cartridges more than we will ever know. The .270, 30-06 are premium hunting cartridges. Nothing more is needed in the America's.
Amazing as always Ron! I love how you present the innovation and quirks of the minds of the industry. Pretty spectacular stuff. Thank you for simplifying it for us.
There’s a reamer out there designed to adapt it to the newest long target bullets way out long too, I’d consider building the AI version next time I’m building a gun. tighter neck, longer throat, softer lands and such. Designed by nate Foster, made by manson. But of course you don’t need it, it’s just a slight modernization of something that’s so hard to beat. Every time I think of picking up a 300 win I just think why? I’m never going to hunt elk at 700, let alone with a rifle I don’t want to practice with. If an 06 or a 7mm can’t do it I’m going to at least 35 cal, and then you’re out of versatile gun territory.
It seems to me that the 240 Weatherby is based on the old '06, with Weatherby adding one step to the case forming by swaging a belt onto the '06. Also, if I recollect correctly there was also a 400 Whelen.
It is. Not only for caliber but available ammunition.. It's a very capable rifle. The trick is matching gun, ammo and target. You shooting 100 yrds. Or 400? You shooting paper or elk, or moose? Reliability and Accuracy are everything. You know when you squeeze that trigger, you know where that bullets going to hit. I've personally ditched semis. Because of maintenance and Accuracy. You can run multiple rounds through a pump or bolt action pretty fast . Not that you need to unless duck hunting etc. 06 is a good caliber. My 2nd rifle. Up the ante to 300 win mag. A dream. But 06, long barrel, good scope. Bolt action.. Can't beat it.
I have been hunting with a Ruger M77 MKII All Weather in 30-06 for almost 30 years. It has never failed me. Love the 30-06. It might have a little more recoil but I don't mind.
I built a 6mm-'06 rifle once. FN Mauser action (it had pitting underneath, so it was cheap - $25 IIRC), 6mm BR barrel I bought off a friend for $10 (it was a 24" bull barrel with Mauser threads on it already!), 2nd grade Bishop stock with wide fore-end (2nd grade since some of it was heartwood). Rented the reamer off an ad in Shotgun News, had a gunsmith friend turn the barrel down a little and mount it in the receiver and put some scope mounts on the receiver. Free-floated the barrel, finished the stock. A gun shop half an hour away had boxes of Winchester brass they sold by the pound - it was fun searching for .270, .30-'06 and .25-'06 brass. I actually got Lee to make me a special 6mm-'06 Lee Loader by putting a .243 top on a .30-'06 bottom. Necked down the brass of a friend's press with a .243 die. What was the point of all this? I'd located 10-15 pounds of the old surplus H4831 powder and just wanted to use it in something that could shoot 1 inch groups at 100 yards cheaply - in essence, a cheap, highly accurate plinker for water-filled tin cans. I found data for the 6mm-.284 and IMR4831, used that as a starting point. It was fun working up loads for it, I mainly shot 75 grain Hornady hollow points. We chronographed it once, I forgot what we got. It was a fun rifle. It was capable of 3/4" groups. A little bit of change from the other rifle I always took to the range, a 10-22.
Despite being a big fan of the 300WM and the 300WSM… I have to agree with you. Got my first aught six rifle last year, an X-bolt in 270WIN… and it’s sick!!! Cheers.
I know of the .338-06 Ackley Improved. It required the additional shoulder length of the .280 to achieve the correct case length. It is a great shooter on a Winchester model 70 frame. Mild recoil in a 200 grain bullet.
At one point, Remington rebranded the 280 to the 7mm express. I believe that was about the time that they introduced the 7mm-08. Did not catch on and they soon reverted back to calling it the 280.
Winchesters take on the 7mm-08 was a great cartridge called the .284 Win. Major difference was its rebated rim. I had one in the Savage Model 99F. Sweet combination.
I custom built my own 280 back in the early 1980’s. Got all the parts, Oberndorf Mauser action, Douglas air gauged barrel, Timney trigger in a Bishop Alaskan stock. After following “The Accurate Rifle” by Warren Page I put together the best rifle I’ve ever shot. A handloaders game for sure. Today it spends most of its time in the vault but I always manage a day in deer season with it. IMO way better than it’s parent!
Thank you Ron for this very enlightening video. I would like to see a series of these types of family histories covering the .308 family, the .300/.375 H&H family, etc. Also where some of the newer cartridges got their starts like the WSSM, Ruger and Remington high velocity cartridges.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
As a young man, just moved to Alaska in the '60's, I was big on ideas and very short on money, I bought, with almost no information and even less sense, an 8mm-06 Mauser, for 120 bucks. But, it came with dies and some components, and as the years went by and I became the owner of more knowledge and even more rifles...I can't say I ever found anything markedly better, especially with some RWS heavies. It turned out to become the village 'loaner', bringing home a lot of meat for a lot of people. I gifted it to a pilot friend when I left Alaska, but built another for myself, although, can't say it's needed down here.
Great video, Ron. My first rifle was a 30-06 pump for whitetail; I still have it. I've taken deer, elk, pronghorn and moose with it. I have owned a 25-06, 270, and 280 AI. Loved them all. The 338-06 is fascinating; might get one of those next from E R Shaw.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
My dad passed his Springfield 30.06 and his Winchester model 70 .270 down to me when he passed away. I've never felt the need to buy anything else for hunting. I have lots of other guns, but these are my only two hunting rifles.
@@jmgates09 That is kind of what I was thinking. I just don't have any experience with that particular cartridge, but I do have some experience with other 7mm cartridges and find that for whatever reason that particular size diameter projectile really preforms well overall.
The .308 Winchester and .25-06 can't be beat here in both East Texas and South Texas for deer, hog and javelina. Short or long ranges, they both put meat in my freezer. Thanks Ron!
The 280 Ackley Improved is the all around champion of long distance and adequate weight for deep penetration. Like the 20 gauge 3 inch with tungsten shot is the best all around shotgun gauge.
I have a friend who made his own wildcat 375-06. It was a pretty potent cartridge. If I remember correctly I believe he used the Ackley Improved idea for the case too.
Hey Ron, great video. That 8mm example you have is actually the 8mm Gibbs. The 8mm-06 is no different Looking than the 30-06 just necked up. It's one of my favorite. Shooting a 200 grain accubond @2800 fps. Perfect medicine for Canadian moose!
So much could be said of any of the “ought sixes”. The “__-insert cartridge-____ strikes a perfect balance of…”. So many do so well. But the 8mm is just very different from all the others it has it’s own rare place for those that want something no one else has
Interesting observation. I sent that cartridge to Mr. Spomer, it was from a gunbroker purchase of ammo & rifle. The boxes were labeled 8mm-06 and 8mm Shultz, all in the same configuration as you saw. I never have found any reference to the 8mm Shultz, have you heard of it?
Hello Swedish mauser. My only hunting rifle is a 1938 Persian Mauser made by BRNO. It was rechambered to 8mm-06. It also recieved a beautiful tiger maple stock, barrel shortened to 24" turned down bolt and updated safety. I purchased it for C$375.00 knowing it would be a handload only proposition. With 200 grain Accubonds I have it shooting 2840 fps. The rifling looks like new still. I'd love to know the history of this old rifle, but I'll just enjoy it. So far 2 deer. Next fall moose.
I love all of this cartridge talk! This channel just popped up in my algorithm and it reminds me of earlier days when I'd read through my old 'Cartridges of the World' books for knowledge 🙌🏻😂 Good times! Keep up the great content!
Couple o' remarks... Back when I was a metallic reloading newbie (had been reloading shotshells for several years) in the lat 1970's, I picked up a copy of the Hornady Handbook which I still have to this day. The book contained load data for the 30-06 improved, and I have never forgotten the results they obtained. The round was able to duplicate standard 30-06 velocities - but never exceed them - but required heavier powder charges to accomplish as much. On the topic of wildcats... I was around during the days when folks were suddenly swept away with 17 caliber fever. Some, like the 17-223, were nice little rounds. However, some even toyed with the 17-06. Always made me think of an old pot bellied stove with only a 1/2 pipe. Some tried it, but I wouldn't have wanted to even stand close to that.
Excellent piece of history Ron! Thank you so much. A co-worker told me an interesting story the other day and correct me if I'm wrong. In a vague sort of way, the 30-06 has another child, although not made from the 30-06. He told me that the 50 BMG is a "magnified" replica of the 30-06! I stared at it for a long while and I think he's right 😁. Sure, looks like it to me...
Ron, thank you for the bit of history. While listening to the video, it crossed my mind like many times that calibers evolve, driving the development and industry. However 'old' calibers, for instance a 6.5Swede, 270 Win, 7mm Mauser, 30-06, or even the. 303British, are not less powerful, adequite or effective since new an faster calibers have seen production... they are still hot and very relevant for the use of hunting, with ammo available all over the globe. Sertainly better bullets and powders developed the past decade or two, with handloading, you can preduce a very healthy performance even from old calibers. So, to all the young and new shooters - don't hesitate to take your grandpa's hunting gun with its wooden stock out to the wild places and bring back your buck... the experience will fill your mind with something more precious than a shiny new gun that can hit a gong at 'long range'.
The sheer number of cartridges based on this case that are really great performing cartridges, shows that this case capacity strikes a very good balance. Up to .35 cal and down to .25 cal, you can toss about any bullet you love and drive it fast enough to get results.
Great topic Ron! Im a fan of the 30-06 family and currently uses 25-06, 6.5-06, 6.5-280 ackley, 270win, 7x64 brenneke, 280 ackley, 30-06, 30-06 ackley, 8x64 brenneke, 8.5x63 reb and 35 whelen. The most interesting of them is the 8.5x63 that is close to a .340 gibbs!
One point I'll add about the 280rem is what also helped with it slow to the start is remington did the snae thing with the 280 by also calling it the 7mm express so it put them in the same situation as they did with the 6mm when they initially called it the 244rem. Still out of the 06 kids the 280rem is my favorite
Isn't it nice to have so many options. Do you remember the 30-06 acceletator ? A 55 grain bullet traveling at 4080 fps. I believe it was a 223 bullet. Thank you Ron for this video, very interesting. I would love to see more parent cases videos.
@@wendellbell6164 Yes, I think that is what I was told many years ago when I was given this cartridge for my collection. I think they were a bit of a flop. And here is something for you - In my country they are illegal to discharge. My country is paranoid about silencers and such like. My govt thinks gun owners are all wanna-be terrorists.
@@adelarsen9776 America is trying to get that way , but we have our secound amendment of our constitution that helps alot. We fight for our rights non stop.
@@wendellbell6164 I support you and your constitution. MAGA - 2024. I love Americans and America but your deep state is corrupted. I know you know that 🙂 I wish you good health, prosperity and freedom.
I have a pristine 1917 Enfield by Remington with a Douglas supreme barrel which has given me a 9mm spread at 100metres with a 220 grain bullet., and comfortably out shoots a lot of modern rifles.
Ron, Great episode! I’m a huge fan of all these cartridges! I just wanted to make a slight correction: the 35 Whelen can push a 200 grain bullet about 250 feet faster than a 30-06 can. The 35 Whelen is an extremely efficient round!
I have a sporterized 1903 Springfield that has been re-barrelled with a new A3 barrell and accurize for light magnum loads. Using 57 gr of 4831SC Hodgen powder, a 165 gr. Barnes STX bullet, and Winchester magnum LR primers, I punch consistent groups of about 1" at 100 yds. and 1 1/2 groups at 200 yds. It is my deer killer and it works well. I am still trying to tighten my groups with a little fine tuning. That is the advantage of hand loading. As a side note, my 7.65 Model 91 Mauser is shooting ammo using converted 3006 brass. With some research, I found the information needed to make the conversion and with patience, have successfully converted 100 casings that work quite well.
Actually, it should be the 8x57 family as it was first as a rimless bottleneck in 1888. Then the 7.65x53 ( 1891) the 7x57(1893) then the .30-03, which was the parent round of the. 30-06 and the .270 WCF. History takes it from there. The .473 head rimless bottleneck case began with the 8x57.
The 30.06 is my favorite. In my 70 years I've tried many different calibers and it's still my go to round for hunting. Notice how many old timers prefer it and learn from their years of wisdom!
Not quite, jimmy. It began as 280 Remington, then changed to 7mm Rem. Express for a few years, then changed back when this confused everyone. For a second they were even going to change it to 7mm-06. A few rounds were labeled that on the headstamp, but they never went to market.
I inherited a late 80's model of the 742 Woodsmaster from my grandfather as well. When loaded with 180gr Core Lokt it's an absolute devastating round on whitetails. Never fails to drop on their ass.
Great video. One wildcat you did not mention was the 22-06. I was thinking you missed the 400 Whelen but you printed you missed it. It uses the same bullet diameter as the 40 s&w. I have a second year production 54 Winchester. Looking at and playing with the 270 case I think it was based on the 03 case not the 06 case. When 270 case is necked to 30 caliber it is the correct length for an 03 case. Don’t know and in long run don't matter.
Ron, excellent show again, as always. You stated, as a lot of people have, that the 270 Win was created by Winchester necking the 30-06 down. But, would it not be more correct to say that the 270 Win is really a 30-03 necked down? The 30-06 SAAMI case length is 2.494". The 270 Win AND the 30-03 both have a case length of 2.54". So the question is, when creating the 270 Win, did Winchester use the 30-03, or did they take a 30-06 and lengthen it back to 2.54, the same as the 30-03 was? Do you happen to know the history on this one? Thanks!
What can't you do with a fully modern .30-06 rifle and ammunition? In it's fully modernized form, it does even more than it did when it achieved full legendary status about a half century ago.
love this channel..hahaha..I want a 30 odd six .. I've owned a few 25-06 and love them..ive only owned 1 30-06 rifle in my life..a 1903A3 CMP match rifle..I sold it..Like a fool and have regretted it ever since.. It was butter ..so easy to shoot..and shoot accurately.. I'm a lefty and left eye dominant..shoot and work bolt with lefthand ..its odd but feels very natural to me...I miss that rifle..
The .30 Rimless and the beauty .30-40 Krag. Absolutely one of the smoothest rounds I’ve ever had the fortune to shoot. I’ve always wanted a 1885 High-Wall chambered in either .303 British or the .30-40Krag.
I have an early 80's model Rem 742 semi-auto Woodsmaster .30-06 I inherited from my grandfather that I've used for whitetails since I was a kid in the late 90's. My go to load is the Rem 180gr Core Lokt round that I've been using successfully through the duration, it's an excellent "put em' on their ass" round. Last year I had to source used/2nd hand ammo off the web due to shortages, a local older gentleman literally saved my season selling me 2 boxes of Core Lokt off Armslist. I've flirted with switching to 6.5CM round as the ballistics are fantastic. I would have to give up my semi-auto capabilities or hunt w/ an AR platform riffle and get torn to shreds by the fellas at deer camp 😂. The Ol' dirty .30 never fails to deliver out to 300yrds and will most likely be the only rifle I ever use, besides a .30-.30 lever I'll occasionally use on drives.
Bought my 30-06 700 BDL in 1973 and been loving on it ever since. I miss two factory loadings. The 220 grain round nose Core Lokt was a real elk hammer and the 22 cal sabot round. It wasn't as accurate as a dedicated varmint round but it was a way to plink away at prarie dogs without having to buy a different rifle. That's real important for a kid on a kid's budget looking for any hunting opportunity year round. I actually used the sabot round to acquire the nickname " The Squirrel Assasin" by using it to drop a 10 squirrel limit from an Oak grove from accrass a cornfield at about 250 yards. A total waste of ammo because I could have gone into the grove with a 22 and done the same thing but I just loved shooting that 06 :) Over the years I've owned the 25, 270 and 280 and have had several elk hunting clients who packed the 35.
Several years ago Mississippi changed their definition of a primitive weapon to include breach loading rifles within certain calibers. The 2 most popular ammunition have been the 35 Whelen and 45-70. I’ve bought the CVA 35 Whelen and have been very pleased with it.
If it aint broke don't fix it , I have been hunting with my 3006 for 40 years and it definitely does a great job short and long range ! Thanks Ron for giving my old favorite some love !
Been using an Browning A-bolt .270 for 40 years. One time a friend and I were both using 150 grain remington core locked rounds. He had 06 and me .270. I shot a buck in the heart and it dropped instantly. The next day, same spot same distance he hit a buck in the heart, it bucked a little and he shot it again same spot, still didn't stop it. Then a round in the neck. I'm by no means am talking bad about 06, it is more versatile. This was our experience.
@@jamesdmyrick5809 Don't blame the '06 for sure. I've shot deer with the same gun/caliber, either .270 or 30-06 over the years, and seen drastically different results from a bang-on shoulder shot. Some drop dead on the spot, one took off running and I nailed it again within an inch of the first shot (minor miracle), and it still got up and covered another 20 yards. One stood still as if he had not been hit, and after another hit right on target, slowly keeled over dead. My conclusion is that if you want to be sure they don't run, you'll have to shoot them in the head.
Same here. I’ve been hunting deer, bear, and hogs with the same R-7400 30-06 since I was a teen. It looks like hell but it gets the job done. I killed 5 hogs out of a single sounder with it once and my wife calls the picture of me with all five hogs “he ran out of bullets”. Lol
@@hondolane31259pm 8pm
@@jamesdmyrick5809 I've shot a few deer myself, and although both are fine, I'd prefer the aught six.
I've used my Rem. ADL .30-06 for everything from ground squirrels (with 130-grain HPs) to Alaskan moose and caribou (200-grain Sierras) and not once has it let me down. At 71, my hunting days are over, but that 700 .30-06 will never leave my gun case.
Never say never my friend, just go out and take things slow on your next trip out!
I'm 66, and my hunting days are just restarting, although I will be using that parent of the .30-03 he didn't talk about, the 7x57 Mauser.
Same here, with my dad's say so and help I saved and saved and bought a Rem 700 BDL.30-06 when I was 13. I have epoxy bed the ac;tion and refinished the stock on it. I'm close to 40 now and I will keep it until I die!
Just mount a camera on the old Rem and you can take the drag factor out of hunting.
I've had my Husqvarna 30-06 for a large part of my 70 years, and it has never failed me. It has served me well. But then, I'm not into wasting my money just to have the latest and greatest. I love the caliber!
Recently picked up a Husqvarna in .30-06, manufactured in 1956. Getting one inch groups at 100 yrds. I think the shooter can do better. The rifle is a keeper.
I have a Husqvarna in 270win. It still group very well for 70 year old rilfe. Its one those rifles I will never get rid of.
@Bryce Keylon Husqvarna made very accurate, high quality rifles. Many sold under names life JC Penny back in the day. They stopped producing firearms in 1972, if I'm not mistaken. Mine is from the 1950's.
@Bryce Keylon yes til 1968 I think. The model 46 uses a small ring 1896 Swedish mauser. The model 640 and 1640 used fn98 commercial actions supplied by the Belgian to Sweden as war repayment. The 96 small rings are chamber in 6.5x55 and 9.3x57 and the 98 large rings are chamber 220 swift, 270win, 30-06, 8mm and 9.3x62
@@waynelovejr.1005 The import and sold tradewind of tacoma
Thanks for this video, as I am 72 and have been hunting with the '06 for most of my life. Always found all the 06 family easy to load and pretty adaptable to many powders and bullets and remain accurate. About 15 years ago I discovered the 338-06 and did some hunting in Montana and Wyoming. I find I now use my 338-06 as much as my beloved 30-06. Again, thanks, youngsters just don't understand the attraction to this fine old cartridge.
Oh we do, we're just rare.
My son got himself a model 1917 ("American Enfield") made by Remington in 1917. I hate to say it, but the poor thing was sporterized. They milled off the iron sights for some reason so she's scope only, but we both love her. She's the only rifle my son will hunt with even though I build custom flintlock firearms. So yeah, the youngsters do love a 30-06 if they can find one and afford it if they do.
@@PhonkinPlants Not really rare, just unable to afford a rifle that you'd be proud to show off.
I am also an old dude and have been hunting with an 06 for most of my hunting life. I discovered the 35 Whelen a few years back and have been impressed with the loads I can produce for it. Two rifles I will never relieve myself of are my 7x57 and my 30-06. I can't say which of those I would select if I could only have one. I've owned most of the popular magnum calibers and now own none of them cuz I don't need them.
@@mikeblair2594 I hate people who sporterize rifles, ir just ruins those beautiful rifles.
If it wasn't for the 30/06 many cartridges would have never been born. Personally my favorite is the .280 Rem. I inherited my Grandpa's old 30/06 Springfield sporterized. Every year it goes on a hunt on the nicest days. I know he would love it so it's like taking Gramps with me.
Those rounds are a joke, the 256 Newton rules them all that's the only thing I bother with because I need maximum performance.
@@actionjksn there are many cartridges that "out perform" the 256 newton.
@@actionjksn And it depends on what you want to accomplish. If I was going on a brown bear hunt and going to use an 06 derivative case, the 256 newton would be FAR down the line.
The 25/06 is a good cartridge that is easyish to find components to reload without all the case pressure.
@@fedup3582 Wrong.
Loved the video about the grandpa 30-06. i have used it my whole life in southtexas, and it's offspring my personal favorite the 25-06 when its loaded right with the right bullet it can't be beat. They got it right in 1906, and we are still trying to make it better to this day and still can't make that all around best cartridge because they had it right the first time
And im going to say i love these videos like this that you make, and i really dont like the shorts that yall are making
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
What you have will do you well down there i worked down there for many years dont waste you money on something that you dont need if you have them 3 guns you are definitely good there
That 25-06 is one of the best shooters I've ever had a chance to plink with
It's my whitetail deer round.
243 is my favorite
I have 2 25-06s. Both with 26in Douglas barrels. Shot just about all my deer and some elk with it over the yrs. Love it.
I run a .257wby mag on deer. Love it.
It's my go to for long range groundhog smacking when it's a little too windy for the 204
The 6.5-06 is a smoker. I had to build one out of curiosity. It works well for pronghorn hunts! I don't shoot it that often anymore. I like to mention its performance to 6.5CM fans who like to make wild claims.
A friend of mine has a custom in 6.5 gibbs, it is a real smoker.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
Ruger action 280 is what I own. Shoots that 140 -145 grain very well. I'll admit I got caught up in marketing at the time but knowing what I know now and how well the gun performs I have no regrets. I have not it out hunting in over 15 years but I believe it's time to show it some love. Never should have sold my 270 or any other firearm I own. Always keep them!
280 is second to none,but I don't have one,but I do have 3006s
280 Remington 140 gr bullet rules
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
@@kennardjohnson7875 280AI is what the 280 should have been.
@@jamesmcneil3354 280AI is the 280 perfected.
Thanks for the history lesson. This year I picked up a CVA Scout in 35 Whelen. I've been loading everything from 180 - 250 grain bullets and they all shoot well. Props to it's Daddy.
The 30-06 is such a fantastic cartridge that it achieved mundanity. That's impressive. If you ever needed a default cartridge that could conceivably do everything? The 06 can make it happen. It can be a light varmint round, a heavy Elk round, a competition round, a general woods round, a paper-plinker. Just phenomenal.
My favourite of its derivatives is still the 280 and 280ai. Maybe the best non-magnum round as far as I'm concerned.
I love my 25-06 and the 30-06.
I never knew there were so many .24 caliber standard length cartridges based off the 30-06! Thanks for the informative video Ron.
There aren’t
The 338-06 is a fantastic round, it's one of those calibers that until you use it you won't understand why.
.338-06 A-Square really does drive a somewhat heavier bullet at impressive velocity, without going up the caliber chain. But, it's so obscure. A-Square closed its doors many years ago.
The .308 Winchester family is also extensive.
A Square took the 256 Newton and got it saami spec as the 6.5-06 A Square also.
I have a 35 Whelen that is a wonderful cartridge. Out to 250-300 yards it is a heavy hitter. I have a 760 Remington and a O3-A3 Converted to 35 Whelen both are accurate with 30-06 plus a bit more kick.
isn't the A square about the same as the Ackley Improved - haven't looked at 'em in years
@@nedrgr21 A-Square was a company that used to exist. They built some rifles, developed some wildcat cartridges for Saami approval. It's really no different than calling a cartridge by another name, like Ruger or Nosler or Hornady.
The Ackley improved cartridges is a completely separate thing.
@@williamrauch4464 yeah I don’t really see the point of the 338-06 while the whelen exists, I just wish there were some newer bullets to extend that range a hair. I want to build one sometime regardless.
My two favorite 30-06 offspring are the 25-06 and tyhe 35 whelen. The 25 is great for reaching out and touching critters at long range and tyhe 35 Whelen is just a beast to just slam critters to tyhe ground and not get back up!
Many years ago I took my first deer with a 270w... a couple years ago I built a 338-06 out of a savage 110... love the line up!!
270 win is my absolute favorite round to shoot Absultly love it
The 3006 was a outstanding parent, I love the 25-06 and the 338-06, my 25-06 has been with me most my life!
I wish that Remington had left the 280 with the 7mm Express name change. It just sounds cooler and I think that might have improved the popularity of the 280. I was just a little kid when they changed the name and I thought that the 7mm Express was an awesome name for the times. In reality, the 30-06, 270 and 280 are nearly identical in performance. I was raised a 270 fan, but a lot of friends and family were 06 guys and I never knew anyone that had a 280. We would always argue and debate about which one was better, but in reality there's not enough difference to make a difference. I agree with you. A deer can't tell the difference between a 243 or a 375 . Dead is dead after all. I've never got the "overkill " saying. You can't overkill anything. It's dead or it's not. Keep up all the great videos Ron. You're the fix that all of us cartridge nerds need. Without you we'd be going into cartridge withdrawal. I've never been that interested in what kind of rifle, shotgun or handgun that uses a particular cartridge, just the cartridge itself. The primer, powder and bullet is what gets the job done, not the firearm itself. Until the next one stay safe and good hunting.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
One of my favorite hunting rifles is an old Rem 721 in 30-06. Just a tack driver that is a joy to handle. Lots of mulies and elk!
Just finished a 35whelen using a 98 mauser action. Haven't sighted it in yet but I'm excited.
Thanks Ron. I have the 8/06 and a 6.5/06. Both 98M actions. My 6.5 is by all claims, a 6.5 PRC
True that. I did the same to get a 6.5-06 (98M action). The 6.5-06 takes backseat to no other 6.5 cartridge. I also built a 6.5x55 on a Vz 24 action as a kid gun. Over the years, there have been a bunch of young ones take their first deer with it. I use that gun a lot now because of a bad shoulder and age.
I grew up with the 30.06; watching and helping my dad develop his hunting rounds for an Enfield and a Springfield that he'd sporterized. The round he came up with utilized IMR 4831 with a maximum powder load and 150 grain bullet for accuracy and maximum mushrooming. Along about 1988, my brother-in-law called me and told me he had found a gun I really needed to buy. It was a Winchester Model 70 Featherlight chambered in .280 Improved and built by a couple of brothers in a local Reno gun shop. I bought it and started hunting with it, the 140 grain Nosler Partition is an extremely deadly round, one shot and it's down. The 30.06 is without a doubt one of the most versatile rounds ever made. One of the other rounds my dad would load was a 120 grain hollow point...it was a very quick round, great for varmint hunting. Thanks for you very informative videos!
I love my 3006. However that 280 is a very good cartridge and is still one of my all time favorites both to shoot and hunt with.
The year was 1888, and the m88 cartridge was invented by the German Rifle Testing Commission. The cartridge is known by most as the 8x57 Mauser. As far as I can determine, it was the first cartridge with a .473 case head diameter. That makes it the parent cartridge of all the cartridges you covered in this video. The case head diameter is the factor that determines cartridge lineage. As long as the offspring cartridges have a .473 case head, they are the product of the original cartridge with that case head diameter. You can lengthen, shorten, squeeze down, blow out, change shoulder angel, but as long as the case head measures .473, it was derived from the M88 cartridge. I know you said you weren’t going to talk about before the 30/03. However, I think credit is due to the real parent, not the step parent.
Mauser briefly got royalties for it, until they bumbled into ww1.
I have a Gewehr 88 hanging on my living room wall.
@@wisconsinfarmer4742 The royalties to Mauser were not because of the 30-06 cartridge but because of patent infringements in the design of the 1903 Springfield rifle. The 8x57 cartridge was designed by the German government for use in Mauser action rifles. The 7x57 cartridge and rifles were designed by Paul Mauser.
Thank you for that explanation of the wildcat offshoots of the fabulous 30-06. My personal favorite is the 35 Whelen.
I took an old pump Remington. 30-06 and turned it into a 338-06, I put 200gr into, super nice
35 Whelen makes one of the best bear cartridges ever introduced, excellent cartridge for Black Bear
Have 4 of them. All are awesome cartridges. 25-06 Rem, 270 Win, 280 Rem and the 30-06.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
For deer and antelope sized game the .243 Winchester is great. Have taken more than 100 deer with the .243. The .270 is absolutely awesome for deer sized game up to elk sized game. Some people use it for even larger game, than elk. It works. But for the largest of North American game, I personally would start at the 30-06 as a adequate cartridge. I'm not a fan of the belted magnums. But if I ever felt like I needed something larger than the 30-06 it would be the .35 Whelen or the .338 Winchester Magnum.
All of the cartridges I mentioned before are adequate for anything in the America's. Possibly with the exception of large bears. But they have been taken with these cartridges more than we will ever know. The .270, 30-06 are premium hunting cartridges. Nothing more is needed in the America's.
Amazing as always Ron! I love how you present the innovation and quirks of the minds of the industry. Pretty spectacular stuff. Thank you for simplifying it for us.
I have been exploring new to me cartridges but it all seems to be leading me back to the 30-06. Hard to beat that classic.
There’s a reamer out there designed to adapt it to the newest long target bullets way out long too, I’d consider building the AI version next time I’m building a gun. tighter neck, longer throat, softer lands and such. Designed by nate Foster, made by manson. But of course you don’t need it, it’s just a slight modernization of something that’s so hard to beat. Every time I think of picking up a 300 win I just think why? I’m never going to hunt elk at 700, let alone with a rifle I don’t want to practice with. If an 06 or a 7mm can’t do it I’m going to at least 35 cal, and then you’re out of versatile gun territory.
A specialist will always beat a generalist.
It seems to me that the 240 Weatherby is based on the old '06, with Weatherby adding one step to the case forming by swaging a belt onto the '06. Also, if I recollect correctly there was also a 400 Whelen.
It is. Not only for caliber but available ammunition..
It's a very capable rifle.
The trick is matching gun, ammo and target.
You shooting 100 yrds. Or 400?
You shooting paper or elk, or moose?
Reliability and Accuracy are everything.
You know when you squeeze that trigger, you know where that bullets going to hit.
I've personally ditched semis.
Because of maintenance and Accuracy.
You can run multiple rounds through a pump or bolt action pretty fast .
Not that you need to unless duck hunting etc.
06 is a good caliber.
My 2nd rifle.
Up the ante to 300 win mag.
A dream.
But 06, long barrel, good scope.
Bolt action..
Can't beat it.
I got a bunch of them the 30/06 is just so hard to beat. I do like the 25/06, .270, and .280 are also awesome.
Great video! I love this type of content. I could listen to this all day.
I have been hunting with a Ruger M77 MKII All Weather in 30-06 for almost 30 years. It has never failed me. Love the 30-06. It might have a little more recoil but I don't mind.
Good stuff! I got the .270, and .35 Whelen..oh and a papa 30/06 keeping it in the family! 😉
I built a 6mm-'06 rifle once. FN Mauser action (it had pitting underneath, so it was cheap - $25 IIRC), 6mm BR barrel I bought off a friend for $10 (it was a 24" bull barrel with Mauser threads on it already!), 2nd grade Bishop stock with wide fore-end (2nd grade since some of it was heartwood). Rented the reamer off an ad in Shotgun News, had a gunsmith friend turn the barrel down a little and mount it in the receiver and put some scope mounts on the receiver. Free-floated the barrel, finished the stock. A gun shop half an hour away had boxes of Winchester brass they sold by the pound - it was fun searching for .270, .30-'06 and .25-'06 brass. I actually got Lee to make me a special 6mm-'06 Lee Loader by putting a .243 top on a .30-'06 bottom. Necked down the brass of a friend's press with a .243 die. What was the point of all this? I'd located 10-15 pounds of the old surplus H4831 powder and just wanted to use it in something that could shoot 1 inch groups at 100 yards cheaply - in essence, a cheap, highly accurate plinker for water-filled tin cans. I found data for the 6mm-.284 and IMR4831, used that as a starting point. It was fun working up loads for it, I mainly shot 75 grain Hornady hollow points. We chronographed it once, I forgot what we got. It was a fun rifle. It was capable of 3/4" groups. A little bit of change from the other rifle I always took to the range, a 10-22.
3006 family is the best ever hunting rounds, you can find better long range rounds, but hunting rounds, I’ll stick with the 3006 family.
Despite being a big fan of the 300WM and the 300WSM… I have to agree with you. Got my first aught six rifle last year, an X-bolt in 270WIN… and it’s sick!!!
Cheers.
@@trevorkolmatycki4042 I picked up an x-bolt 270 this year. rugged thang.
@@trevorkolmatycki4042 I've hunted with the 270 win. for 40+ years and have never regretted it.
You are spot on! 👍
Yes sir I agree 👍👍
I know of the .338-06 Ackley Improved. It required the additional shoulder length of the .280 to achieve the correct case length. It is a great shooter on a Winchester model 70 frame. Mild recoil in a 200 grain bullet.
At one point, Remington rebranded the 280 to the 7mm express. I believe that was about the time that they introduced the 7mm-08. Did not catch on and they soon reverted back to calling it the 280.
Winchesters take on the 7mm-08 was a great cartridge called the .284 Win. Major difference was its rebated rim. I had one in the Savage Model 99F. Sweet combination.
I custom built my own 280 back in the early 1980’s. Got all the parts, Oberndorf Mauser action, Douglas air gauged barrel, Timney trigger in a Bishop Alaskan stock. After following “The Accurate Rifle” by Warren Page I put together the best rifle I’ve ever shot. A handloaders game for sure. Today it spends most of its time in the vault but I always manage a day in deer season with it. IMO way better than it’s parent!
Thank you Ron for this very enlightening video. I would like to see a series of these types of family histories covering the .308 family, the .300/.375 H&H family, etc. Also where some of the newer cartridges got their starts like the WSSM, Ruger and Remington high velocity cartridges.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
.308 WIN and 7.62x51mm NATO both come from the 300 Savage which came from the .250-3000 Savage.
As a young man, just moved to Alaska in the '60's, I was big on ideas and very short on money, I bought, with almost no information and even less sense, an 8mm-06 Mauser, for 120 bucks. But, it came with dies and some components, and as the years went by and I became the owner of more knowledge and even more rifles...I can't say I ever found anything markedly better, especially with some RWS heavies. It turned out to become the village 'loaner', bringing home a lot of meat for a lot of people. I gifted it to a pilot friend when I left Alaska, but built another for myself, although, can't say it's needed down here.
Great video, Ron.
My first rifle was a 30-06 pump for whitetail; I still have it. I've taken deer, elk, pronghorn and moose with it. I have owned a 25-06, 270, and 280 AI. Loved them all.
The 338-06 is fascinating; might get one of those next from E R Shaw.
SORRY BUT I HAVE TO ASK, I AM A POOR ARGENTINE, BUT I ABOUT THINK I WILL BECOME RICH. SUPPOSE IT HAPPENS TO ME. THE ONLY 3 CALIBERS THAT I HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL WERE THE 223, THE 243 AND THE 270. IF I GOT RICH, I WONDER IF I WOULD GO TO AN EVEN 6-06, A 6/284, A 270 WSM AND I WONDER IF I WOULD NOT BE A VICTIM OF THE MARKETING USA, I ASK YOU WHO SHOOT SO MANY AND VARIOUS CARTRIDGES, WOULD IT BE WORTH IT??? OR WOULD I BE A VICTIM OF MARKETING???
My dad passed his Springfield 30.06 and his Winchester model 70 .270 down to me when he passed away. I've never felt the need to buy anything else for hunting. I have lots of other guns, but these are my only two hunting rifles.
Neat stuff Ron. Personally since I have the 30-06, 270 and 25-06 I'd really like to get a hold of a nice old 280. Just because I can.
Excellent cartridge you will like
Get the ackley improved
280 might just be the best do all cartridge
@@jmgates09 That is kind of what I was thinking. I just don't have any experience with that particular cartridge, but I do have some experience with other 7mm cartridges and find that for whatever reason that particular size diameter projectile really preforms well overall.
I have a Browning.280 and the recoil is much less than my 30-06.
The .308 Winchester and .25-06 can't be beat here in both East Texas and South Texas for deer, hog and javelina. Short or long ranges, they both put meat in my freezer.
Thanks Ron!
My dad says he knew a guy in the 60’s that had a 22-06, said it was a wildcat that never shot very well, but there it was.
The 280 Ackley Improved is the all around champion of long distance and adequate weight for deep penetration. Like the 20 gauge 3 inch with tungsten shot is the best all around shotgun gauge.
I have a friend who made his own wildcat 375-06. It was a pretty potent cartridge. If I remember correctly I believe he used the Ackley Improved idea for the case too.
Almost a 400 when, but better, would be nice for Alaskan bear and perhaps buffalo, a definite leopard and lion cartridge with good bullets
There was a .375 Whelen as well
Hey Ron, great video. That 8mm example you have is actually the 8mm Gibbs. The 8mm-06 is no different Looking than the 30-06 just necked up. It's one of my favorite. Shooting a 200 grain accubond @2800 fps. Perfect medicine for Canadian moose!
8mm-06 sounds like a very efficient package for a cartridge that was a wildcat of convenience to solve a cartridge case and ammo shortage.
So much could be said of any of the “ought sixes”. The “__-insert cartridge-____ strikes a perfect balance of…”. So many do so well. But the 8mm is just very different from all the others it has it’s own rare place for those that want something no one else has
Interesting observation. I sent that cartridge to Mr. Spomer, it was from a gunbroker purchase of ammo & rifle. The boxes were labeled 8mm-06 and 8mm Shultz, all in the same configuration as you saw. I never have found any reference to the 8mm Shultz, have you heard of it?
I thought that shoulder looked a little abrupt.
Hello Swedish mauser. My only hunting rifle is a 1938 Persian Mauser made by BRNO. It was rechambered to 8mm-06. It also recieved a beautiful tiger maple stock, barrel shortened to 24" turned down bolt and updated safety. I purchased it for C$375.00 knowing it would be a handload only proposition. With 200 grain Accubonds I have it shooting 2840 fps. The rifling looks like new still. I'd love to know the history of this old rifle, but I'll just enjoy it. So far 2 deer. Next fall moose.
I love all of this cartridge talk! This channel just popped up in my algorithm and it reminds me of earlier days when I'd read through my old 'Cartridges of the World' books for knowledge 🙌🏻😂 Good times! Keep up the great content!
Couple o' remarks...
Back when I was a metallic reloading newbie (had been reloading shotshells for several years) in the lat 1970's, I picked up a copy of the Hornady Handbook which I still have to this day. The book contained load data for the 30-06 improved, and I have never forgotten the results they obtained. The round was able to duplicate standard 30-06 velocities - but never exceed them - but required heavier powder charges to accomplish as much.
On the topic of wildcats... I was around during the days when folks were suddenly swept away with 17 caliber fever. Some, like the 17-223, were nice little rounds. However, some even toyed with the 17-06. Always made me think of an old pot bellied stove with only a 1/2 pipe. Some tried it, but I wouldn't have wanted to even stand close to that.
Excellent piece of history Ron! Thank you so much. A co-worker told me an interesting story the other day and correct me if I'm wrong. In a vague sort of way, the 30-06 has another child, although not made from the 30-06. He told me that the 50 BMG is a "magnified" replica of the 30-06! I stared at it for a long while and I think he's right 😁. Sure, looks like it to me...
I think I read somewhere, that the 222 was a "shrunk" version of the 30-06.
Yes, John browning based the .50 bmg on the proportions of the 30-06.
Ron, thank you for the bit of history. While listening to the video, it crossed my mind like many times that calibers evolve, driving the development and industry. However 'old' calibers, for instance a 6.5Swede, 270 Win, 7mm Mauser, 30-06, or even the. 303British, are not less powerful, adequite or effective since new an faster calibers have seen production... they are still hot and very relevant for the use of hunting, with ammo available all over the globe.
Sertainly better bullets and powders developed the past decade or two, with handloading, you can preduce a very healthy performance even from old calibers.
So, to all the young and new shooters - don't hesitate to take your grandpa's hunting gun with its wooden stock out to the wild places and bring back your buck... the experience will fill your mind with something more precious than a shiny new gun that can hit a gong at 'long range'.
The sheer number of cartridges based on this case that are really great performing cartridges, shows that this case capacity strikes a very good balance. Up to .35 cal and down to .25 cal, you can toss about any bullet you love and drive it fast enough to get results.
Don't forget the .375
Great topic Ron!
Im a fan of the 30-06 family and currently uses 25-06, 6.5-06, 6.5-280 ackley, 270win, 7x64 brenneke, 280 ackley, 30-06, 30-06 ackley, 8x64 brenneke, 8.5x63 reb and 35 whelen.
The most interesting of them is the 8.5x63 that is close to a .340 gibbs!
Great lesson(s) here Ron, thank you for this video.
I'd love to see a "Family Tree" chart starting with the 8mm Mauser going out to the ends of ALL the branches to the present day.
One point I'll add about the 280rem is what also helped with it slow to the start is remington did the snae thing with the 280 by also calling it the 7mm express so it put them in the same situation as they did with the 6mm when they initially called it the 244rem. Still out of the 06 kids the 280rem is my favorite
I have the 270 Winchester and the 35 Whelen from this family of cartridges.
Thanks Ron I did ask for. This it's one of my favorite subjects😊
Started with a M1 Springfield in 30-06 ,then got a .270win Remington 700 ,been using it since 71 never failed me on whitetail deer 😁
Isn't it nice to have so many options. Do you remember the 30-06 acceletator ? A 55 grain bullet traveling at 4080 fps. I believe it was a 223 bullet. Thank you Ron for this video, very interesting. I would love to see more parent cases videos.
I have a .30-'06 Accelerator in my collection.
@@adelarsen9776 my understanding is they are not very accurate , but 4080 fps. I have a few boxes myself.
@@wendellbell6164 Yes, I think that is what I was told many years ago when I was given this cartridge for my collection. I think they were a bit of a flop.
And here is something for you - In my country they are illegal to discharge. My country is paranoid about silencers and such like. My govt thinks gun owners are all wanna-be terrorists.
@@adelarsen9776 America is trying to get that way , but we have our secound amendment of our constitution that helps alot. We fight for our rights non stop.
@@wendellbell6164 I support you and your constitution. MAGA - 2024.
I love Americans and America but your deep state is corrupted. I know you know that 🙂
I wish you good health, prosperity and freedom.
I have a pristine 1917 Enfield by Remington with a Douglas supreme barrel which has given me a 9mm spread at 100metres with a 220 grain bullet., and comfortably out shoots a lot of modern rifles.
Ron,
Great episode! I’m a huge fan of all these cartridges!
I just wanted to make a slight correction: the 35 Whelen can push a 200 grain bullet about 250 feet faster than a 30-06 can. The 35 Whelen is an extremely efficient round!
Fair point, but the higher SD and B.C. of the .308 will enable it to catch up and pass the .358 somewhere downrange.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors But at that point, aren't you getting past the point of ,generally considered, reasonable ranges?
🗣reasonable range depends on the SKILL of each shooter/hunter. 🤠
Out to 400 yards the Whelen is still winning, with a 200 grain bullet. which is my own imposed limit for taking game.
I have a sporterized 1903 Springfield that has been re-barrelled with a new A3 barrell and accurize for light magnum loads. Using 57 gr of 4831SC Hodgen powder, a 165 gr. Barnes STX bullet, and Winchester magnum LR primers, I punch consistent groups of about 1" at 100 yds. and 1 1/2 groups at 200 yds. It is my deer killer and it works well. I am still trying to tighten my groups with a little fine tuning. That is the advantage of hand loading. As a side note, my 7.65 Model 91 Mauser is shooting ammo using converted 3006 brass. With some research, I found the information needed to make the conversion and with patience, have successfully converted 100 casings that work quite well.
Actually, it should be the 8x57 family as it was first as a rimless bottleneck in 1888. Then the 7.65x53 ( 1891) the 7x57(1893) then the .30-03, which was the parent round of the. 30-06 and the .270 WCF.
History takes it from there. The .473 head rimless bottleneck case began with the 8x57.
.338-06 my favorite of the bunch. Well at least for today.
I love a 3006 180 grain it will do it all. 2800/2800
I almost bought a Newton in 256 Newton a few years ago on GB, I wished I’d have picked that one up…
Great video!
The 375 Whelen can match the 375 H&H’s original ballistics. Pretty good round nowadays!
This was very interesting. I got the 25-06, the 270, and then.284. I own a 25-06 and like it a lot... Thanks for the video!!
I would love it if you could do a history of Townsend Whelen. From what I can tell no one's done a video on the man. I don't know much about him.
As a guy who knows very little about rifle cartridges, I sure enjoy Ron and his presentation style. Thanks Ron, I learned again
. 270 my favorite just because of the 15% recoil reduction over the 30-06. Both great cartridges!
The 30.06 is my favorite. In my 70 years I've tried many different calibers and it's still my go to round for hunting. Notice how many old timers prefer it and learn from their years of wisdom!
I remember the .280 was first introduced as the 7 mm Remington Express. It didn't do well until they changed it's name.
Not quite, jimmy. It began as 280 Remington, then changed to 7mm Rem. Express for a few years, then changed back when this confused everyone. For a second they were even going to change it to 7mm-06. A few rounds were labeled that on the headstamp, but they never went to market.
I stand corrected Ron. Thanks.@@RonSpomerOutdoors
This makes me appreciate my late dad's old Remington Woodsmaster Model 742 chambered in 30-06 even more!
I inherited a late 80's model of the 742 Woodsmaster from my grandfather as well. When loaded with 180gr Core Lokt it's an absolute devastating round on whitetails. Never fails to drop on their ass.
Great video. One wildcat you did not mention was the 22-06. I was thinking you missed the 400 Whelen but you printed you missed it. It uses the same bullet diameter as the 40 s&w. I have a second year production 54 Winchester. Looking at and playing with the 270 case I think it was based on the 03 case not the 06 case. When 270 case is necked to 30 caliber it is the correct length for an 03 case. Don’t know and in long run don't matter.
an unbeatable round.
I have a 98 Mauser switch barrel in 30-06, 338-06 & 35 Whelen in a beautiful Monte Carlo walnut stock. It's a lot of fun.
I love my 280 Rem. Remington themselves pretty much killed the 280 Rem. When it’s time for a new barrel it’ll turn into a 280 AI.
Remington has done a number of ridiculous marketing flops over the years, in spite of how good the product was/is.
The 280 AI is the 280 perfected.
@@fedup3582 It's getting popular enough for a few factory brands to start chambering for it.
@@exothermal.sprocket not enough unfortunately, and factory loaded ammo is as sparse if not moreso.
You’re awesome, Ron. I always learn something.
Ron, excellent show again, as always. You stated, as a lot of people have, that the 270 Win was created by Winchester necking the 30-06 down. But, would it not be more correct to say that the 270 Win is really a 30-03 necked down? The 30-06 SAAMI case length is 2.494". The 270 Win AND the 30-03 both have a case length of 2.54". So the question is, when creating the 270 Win, did Winchester use the 30-03, or did they take a 30-06 and lengthen it back to 2.54, the same as the 30-03 was? Do you happen to know the history on this one? Thanks!
I love the 270 saying that I've shot the 25 06 in a couple of different rifles, sweat shooting never owned one at least not yet . Great stuff
What can't you do with a fully modern .30-06 rifle and ammunition? In it's fully modernized form, it does even more than it did when it achieved full legendary status about a half century ago.
Thank you Ron for explaining how the 30-06 served as a foundation for a host of effective cartridges.
my favorite caliber is the 25/06 it has impressed me for years and will always be my favorite round
My two favorite rounds first 270wsm and then 30-06 , thanks Ron for the history of the round that started all30-06
love this channel..hahaha..I want a 30 odd six ..
I've owned a few 25-06 and love them..ive only owned 1 30-06 rifle in my life..a 1903A3 CMP match rifle..I sold it..Like a fool and have regretted it ever since..
It was butter ..so easy to shoot..and shoot accurately..
I'm a lefty and left eye dominant..shoot and work bolt with lefthand ..its odd but feels very natural to me...I miss that rifle..
The .30 Rimless and the beauty .30-40 Krag. Absolutely one of the smoothest rounds I’ve ever had the fortune to shoot. I’ve always wanted a 1885 High-Wall chambered in either .303 British or the .30-40Krag.
I have a newer Uberti 1885 replica (the Courteney Stalking Rifle) in .303 British. Fantastic rifle!
Great video Ron! I stick with my 30-06 because it hunts everything! 110grain for Coyotes, 160s for whitetail and 220s for black bear! Good to go!
I have an early 80's model Rem 742 semi-auto Woodsmaster .30-06 I inherited from my grandfather that I've used for whitetails since I was a kid in the late 90's. My go to load is the Rem 180gr Core Lokt round that I've been using successfully through the duration, it's an excellent "put em' on their ass" round.
Last year I had to source used/2nd hand ammo off the web due to shortages, a local older gentleman literally saved my season selling me 2 boxes of Core Lokt off Armslist. I've flirted with switching to 6.5CM round as the ballistics are fantastic. I would have to give up my semi-auto capabilities or hunt w/ an AR platform riffle and get torn to shreds by the fellas at deer camp 😂. The Ol' dirty .30 never fails to deliver out to 300yrds and will most likely be the only rifle I ever use, besides a .30-.30 lever I'll occasionally use on drives.
I love my 30-06 it’s one rifle that I’ll never sell
Another very informative video. Thank you. I'm not intentionally trying to collect them all but I have a .25-06, a .30-06 and a .35 Whelen.
Sort of a perfect trifecta. The 25, 30, and 35 caliber rounds have always worked exceptionally for me.
Did not know all of those came from the .06...well done, thank you...
I made an 8mm Gibbs,270 Gibbs and a 6.5 Gibbs and all shoot very good
I have a Remington model 721 with a 28" .30 Gibbs barrel. Shoots great, and is a screamer!
Bought my 30-06 700 BDL in 1973 and been loving on it ever since. I miss two factory loadings. The 220 grain round nose Core Lokt was a real elk hammer and the 22 cal sabot round. It wasn't as accurate as a dedicated varmint round but it was a way to plink away at prarie dogs without having to buy a different rifle. That's real important for a kid on a kid's budget looking for any hunting opportunity year round. I actually used the sabot round to acquire the nickname " The Squirrel Assasin" by using it to drop a 10 squirrel limit from an Oak grove from accrass a cornfield at about 250 yards. A total waste of ammo because I could have gone into the grove with a 22 and done the same thing but I just loved shooting that 06 :) Over the years I've owned the 25, 270 and 280 and have had several elk hunting clients who packed the 35.
"Collect them all!" You read my mind lol.
Several years ago Mississippi changed their definition of a primitive weapon to include breach loading rifles within certain calibers. The 2 most popular ammunition have been the 35 Whelen and 45-70. I’ve bought the CVA 35 Whelen and have been very pleased with it.