My conlang Kohee has mourning terms, which I like well enough from natlangs, but it does something unique with them. If all members of a node on the family tree pass away, an aunt and an uncle for example, the family tree splits, and all of your cousins from that aunt and uncle get new terms to identify them as being disjointed from your own family in some way.
I'm greatly intrigued by this Mantab system you've introduced to me, and as someone who's only seen the family-tree type diagram and kinship terminology, it has opened up a new streak of inspiration to change a few things in my worldbuilding. I am glad the videos of yours bring this out of me! Good job
I'm not sure that it is strictly matrilineal, as lineage is determined through both the mother and father(s). In terms of the diagrams, I just chose to mark the birth mother because that's easily knowable, and prevents clutter by not having lines connecting all potential parents with all potential children! :)
Idk about it being a precursor to irl changes. Matrilineal systems are actually very common irl. *However* you should not confuse matrilineal systems with matriarchal political structures: which are much much rarer. A matrilineal system *does not* mean that women are actually allowed to wield power: only that they confer titles and property on their male children. In particular, it places high status women at even more risk of being violated and abused: because in a matrilineal system they are even more valuable to men with political ambitions. Matrilineality frequently coincides with things like bride kidnapping and child marriage. On the flip side, low status women are frequently overlooked and forced into celibacy or into sex work if their parents die.
I really like the term "deep siblings". Kinship and time direction are both useful for defining a conculture, and this is a fun way to use both in one phrase!
I deal with this in the 'consequences' video, but in brief: positions of authority are usually held jointly between 2-3 people, which ensures that all the knowledge can be transferred to someone's "successor" before they leave; and while most political offices will be held by 3 people at once, there is always a default single person who holds authority for emergencies.
Also how do descendant of mantab related to new member of mantab. You said mantab system can technically go on indefinitely but this does bring oddities. For example, a mantab member have children and 100 year later their descendant lives while that member already died but new member still come. Do the descendant still called them "parent"?
Another interesting thing you could possibly add in future versions of the language would be making a distinction between siblings born of the same mother and different mothers. Kinda like calling your siblings of your same mother your "true" siblings and all the others your "half" or "step" siblings. Just something to keep in mind.
I can't tell if this is worldbuilding a fictional world, or talking about an existing real world culture. Probably a good sign, if you are making fiction.
The narration says time is perceived as passing upward while the images show the passage of time going downward. It's a bit distracting from the subject matter, which is detailed and complex.
True, however I have drawn them this way with time running downwards for two reasons. Firstly, this is not a diegetic diagram created by someone within the Bjark'ümii culture. Secondly, in imitation of conventional kinship diagrams, I have drawn them with younger 'generations' lower in the diagram and older 'generations' higher in the diagram. I hope this explains things!
In Nivaclé (natlang) Ego's generation is Dravidian, with cousin terminology using Hawaiian structure. That whole "six or seven kinship systems in natural languages" thing that you'll often hear isn't actually perfectly accurate, instead it'd be more accurate to say there are six or seven common subsystems which can be strung together. Love the video btw
My conlang Kohee has mourning terms, which I like well enough from natlangs, but it does something unique with them. If all members of a node on the family tree pass away, an aunt and an uncle for example, the family tree splits, and all of your cousins from that aunt and uncle get new terms to identify them as being disjointed from your own family in some way.
I'm greatly intrigued by this Mantab system you've introduced to me, and as someone who's only seen the family-tree type diagram and kinship terminology, it has opened up a new streak of inspiration to change a few things in my worldbuilding. I am glad the videos of yours bring this out of me! Good job
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it's rly cool how many conculture writers work with this type of matrilineal kinship, I wonder if that's a precursor to some irl changes
I'm not sure that it is strictly matrilineal, as lineage is determined through both the mother and father(s). In terms of the diagrams, I just chose to mark the birth mother because that's easily knowable, and prevents clutter by not having lines connecting all potential parents with all potential children! :)
...
Idk about it being a precursor to irl changes. Matrilineal systems are actually very common irl. *However* you should not confuse matrilineal systems with matriarchal political structures: which are much much rarer. A matrilineal system *does not* mean that women are actually allowed to wield power: only that they confer titles and property on their male children. In particular, it places high status women at even more risk of being violated and abused: because in a matrilineal system they are even more valuable to men with political ambitions. Matrilineality frequently coincides with things like bride kidnapping and child marriage. On the flip side, low status women are frequently overlooked and forced into celibacy or into sex work if their parents die.
I really like the term "deep siblings". Kinship and time direction are both useful for defining a conculture, and this is a fun way to use both in one phrase!
Will the consequence video be uploaded soon? Really like the concept.
Thats vey cool, how would such a system fit into inheritable positions like kingship or other occupations.
I deal with this in the 'consequences' video, but in brief: positions of authority are usually held jointly between 2-3 people, which ensures that all the knowledge can be transferred to someone's "successor" before they leave; and while most political offices will be held by 3 people at once, there is always a default single person who holds authority for emergencies.
@@Lichenthefictioneer i don't know how to find the 'consequences' video
@@digitaldritten That would be because I have no made it yet! Script is done, but video is not in progress yet due to other projects.
Yes. I'd love to see the religious or theological ideas that are affected by the kinships ideas.
When a child grows up, do they choose to join a mantab then? How much do they maintain ties to the mantab of their birth mother?
Wonderful video! This is a wonderful perspective on how kinship could arise in a con-culture.
Can't wait for more stuff, rigam~
I thought it was a real world system for most of the video. Excellent language and thought process
Fascinating system. Looking forward to your next video.
Fascinating
Also, I love the number feature in the kinship terms, does that extend to the rest of your nouns?
Yup! Nouns are by default either inherently singular or inherently plural, and thereafter (if needed) take plural or singulative endings respectively.
What happen to the children of the mantab? And what of the children of the children? Do they create new mantab?
Also how do descendant of mantab related to new member of mantab. You said mantab system can technically go on indefinitely but this does bring oddities. For example, a mantab member have children and 100 year later their descendant lives while that member already died but new member still come. Do the descendant still called them "parent"?
Are subtitles activated in your video? They're always helpful, so it's likely that I miss them
Very interesting!
nice! I love the atmospheric fire and cricket noises and the system is so interesting!!
Another interesting thing you could possibly add in future versions of the language would be making a distinction between siblings born of the same mother and different mothers. Kinda like calling your siblings of your same mother your "true" siblings and all the others your "half" or "step" siblings. Just something to keep in mind.
I had thought about doing this, but in the end decided not to in order to create a greater sense of coherence among the siblings :)
Very interesting! I like the unconventional way to reckon the family structure that your world build has
I can't tell if this is worldbuilding a fictional world, or talking about an existing real world culture. Probably a good sign, if you are making fiction.
The narration says time is perceived as passing upward while the images show the passage of time going downward. It's a bit distracting from the subject matter, which is detailed and complex.
True, however I have drawn them this way with time running downwards for two reasons. Firstly, this is not a diegetic diagram created by someone within the Bjark'ümii culture. Secondly, in imitation of conventional kinship diagrams, I have drawn them with younger 'generations' lower in the diagram and older 'generations' higher in the diagram. I hope this explains things!
@@Lichenthefictioneer Yes, I guess I expected it to be "in world," but you're right that it is more traditional to show generations going downward.
In Nivaclé (natlang) Ego's generation is Dravidian, with cousin terminology using Hawaiian structure. That whole "six or seven kinship systems in natural languages" thing that you'll often hear isn't actually perfectly accurate, instead it'd be more accurate to say there are six or seven common subsystems which can be strung together.
Love the video btw
Tfw the kin ships
YEA FIRST