I’ll like and sub Owen - I like arguments made against the fist-in-glove relationship between western neoliberalism and large monopolies. What I’d like to see from someone with your standing and platform is a call to something other. If you’re making an argument for Marxist or Leninist ideology, can you please make a call-to-arms instead of being a flea on the shoulder of the undeniably long-arm of the status-quo? tl;dr: are you actually calling for revolution, or are you grandstanding as a contrarian, anti-establishment figure to make a living It’s a serious question. We need leaders. You might not be it - but I don’t see you directing attention to anyone that may be. Are there none - or are you grifting on obvious problems, and an anxious proletariat?
This is getting more complicated by the day. Before I donate I need to know if the Tory media is the same media as the pro-war media and are both the same as the pro-capitalist media. If not, I shall need to split my donation. I can't afford 3 x £100 / month.
As a developer I should point out, it’s not just state funding that generated the algorithms in your phone, there’s also huge amount of unpaid open source development going on many many big libraries are maintained by the community rather than big corporates
You also know that you are in a job of a limited time as AGI and quantum computing will easily replace you and many others. Silicon Valley and the owners of the capital in Silicon Valley will rule the world sadly. Data is the new gold and platinum …….
@user-td5pt9nw9n What if we all just unplugged, stopped using the Internet? Then what? Alot of us depend on the Internet granted, but if those who directly didn't depend on it, it could be a great way to stop control. You can only be monitored if you are online.
Open source is a prolific example of how anarchism works great enabling decentralized agents to peacefully coordinate towards utilitarianism. Also, open source operates within capitalism very well, as capitalism is the fuel that enables people to have more time and incentives to work on open source code
And humans not only have finite skills, these skills actually diminish over time eventually. Everyone should study a bit of physics. Nothing comes free, nothing lasts forever, things change physical state often. Full metal alchemist is very cool for young ones to wrap their head around it. It's a constant juggle for a positive outcome. Sometimes conflict is inevitable as well. I know very little about physics, regrettably.
@@globalist1990The statement that our skill diminish over time is contradicted by the facts. Science is improving, exponentially in fact. Including Physics. What we do with that knowledge, what might be called wisdom, now that seems to be decreasing...
The resources might be finite but our technological advance and how we use resources is infinite! Once we develop sufficiently to become muktiplanetary we will have no resource problems.
@@kgh065, Incorrect. This is near religious levels of fantasy. That you can pretend technology will make our resources infinite is both hilarious and sad. Technology will free us from over consumption and overuse, "IF" that is how we use it. Which will require people to change culture and perception. People will be forced to change, and the sooner that happens the less dramatic it will have to be. Pull your head out, it's stuck way up there.
@@joeallen9104 I dunno, I haven’t quite gotten that far yet! Perhaps a clever AI system that keeps track of resource allocation, allowing people free access to goods and services as long as they’re only consuming their fair share? Or just… whatever they do in Star Trek to handle resource allocation and maintain a moneyless economy 😂 Live long, and prosper 🖖
Great interview Owen. I think Grace and Gary Stevenson are two crucial voices, to bring about the economic changes that are required, to create a fairer society!
@igakoga2481 then give it up.If you condemn but still use every product of capitalism, you have a disconnect with your principles a.k.a. A hypocrite. From the device you are using to the wifi/ISP to send this comment, to the nice tumbler of the video host, to the nice clothes of the guest plus the convenience to get these things are all products of capitalism. It may not be most perfect socio-economic system but it works. This is why we have laws, taxes and tariffs to reign in its abuse. Btw, did you have a conflict of conscience when you bought your device? Or when you clicked post? Because, following your logic (a fallacy, albeit) you have been part of exploitation. And you have made it worse by grandstanding yourself. If there is no conflict of conscience, then we have a word for it: HYPOCRISY.
@@eKoush, Ah yes, the postmodern nihilist has entered the conversation... Since you don't exist, please cease to assert your non-existence onto the rest of us.
Just to add a note: privatising the means of production is Capitalism, therefore it leads to monopolies. Wealth is in the hands of a few. On the other hand, nationalising the means of production is socialism. Wealth belongs to the people. Our taxes support society for example the NHS, as it used to be. The people owning the wealth will do anything to hang on to their wealth as we can see now. Politicians are the puppets of the Capitalists. Thanks for this great stream.
_"Just to add a note: privatising the means of production is Capitalism, therefore it leads to monopolies."_ Wrong. It literally does not. It is the Government and regulations, that lead to monopolies. If the industry is regulated, then regulators (who themselves have a government sponsored monopoly to “regulate” markets) can, and inevitably do, sell their special powers to the highest bidder to put up barriers to entry to would be competitors, and to provide legal insulation to would-be lawsuits against their Jr. partner. Thus, as an industry becomes regulated, the larger companies tend to become insulated from normal market and legal corrective forces. Ironically, politicians use the symptoms of regulated industries to justify more regulation. All highly regulated industries are cartelized for this very reason…there are no exceptions. And, dark comically, almost all examples of “Why Capitalism doesn’t work” come from highly regulated industries!
@@Historia.Magistra.Vitae. Or anyone who takes valuable land and defends it with violence. Governments will show up no matter what. This idea that governments cause all problems isn't going to lead you anywhere productive.
imo THE major issue with social media/state spying of us on our internet is its ability to sniff out and potentially snuff out any grass roots political movement before it gets any meaningful traction. extremely serious issue as there is NO WAY the TPTB could ever dream of not using that power in order to protect and maintain the status quo.
The fact that our countries people can’t even decide where their taxes should or shouldn’t go is infuriating It’s like people aren’t allowed to eat out of their own bowls of food
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz I live in Germany where the politicians from left to right all support Israeli’s genocide against Palestinians. It’s kinda hard to choose, makes you desperate
Every system is flawed. The flaw is the human narcissist opportunists who will always gravitate to positions of power, and will always take rather than give. History shows this clearly, but people only see what they want to see. Really enjoyed this interview.
I think it's that every system is flawed as soon as there's a part in it that doesn't belong there( or just "doesn't feel like it"), like for example humans not feeling connected to nature anymore. It seems that it's our nature to destroy systems that we came from while simultanously creating systems that over time will bring ourselves down.... circle jerk of destruction kinda
EXCELLENT TITLE, totally encapsulates EXACTLY what Capitalism strives to be, all power in the hands of one "winner/dictator", at the expense of everyone else, no matter how that power was obtained by the "winner" Great video, great interview
This gives me hope that we can not only learn from the disasters of the right but also of the left. I think we have plenty of reasons to fear both and also learn and move forward in a fairer way, together.
perrfect. lets start fairness with your assets. we will force you to live with homeless, force you to liquidate your surplus finances, force you to share your car, and redistribute all your items to those with less than you. lets let you feel the effects of your own ideas. LOL
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz …how can anyone be forced to live with homeless people? If they live with you, they are _by definition_ not homeless. It’s a logical impossibility.
the socialists would advocate for "placing" homeless people into peoples homes against their will -- all in the name of equality. how are people so ignorant to follow the ideas of people like Grace Blakeley? pure insanity. @@DissociatedWomenIncorporated
Excellent discussion! Grace makes the complication and insanity of the contemporary capitalist political economy understandable and also makes the case for socialism seem imminently reasonable and logical!
please look up Thomas Sowell. Grace lied repeatedly during this video. it was really pathetic. and no, the boeing planes crashed out of the usa because the airlines declined the training that is required by boeing and the FAA inside the USA. what a disgusting lie she told to slander capitalism. shes a coward.
Currently, the system has no basis in anything. In the past it was gold, but politicians and people on the stock exchange wanted to make money without limits, so the system is empty.
I used to think this way. Left and right, theory against theory. Then I began to learn that deep down it's just people and groups of people who gain power. I was reading Whitney Webbs astonishing book 'Nation under Blackmail', that as well as 'Supermob' bu Gus Russo. It is very instructive to see where our presidents came from. Ronald Reagan for example, probably the start of the current Neoliberal movement. Came from MCA and was essentiall owned by Lew Wasserman, a man with extensive supermob ties. He was groomed throughout his policital career by this group, until finally they got him into the presidency.
Not so. Capitalists will use either. The terms mean little in practical reality, both have been co-opted. What we are left with is simply a means of division.
What she is describing is monopoly capitalism, a phenomenon that Marx did not llive to see but Lenin et. al. described from the 1920's onwards. This stage of capitalist development has produced companies of a size that neither Marx nor the founders of neoliberalism could even dream of when they theorized capitalism. Today the biggest employers in the world are the US und Chinese armed forces and Wall Mart, each with over 1.5 million employees plus millions more of contractors. These are centrally planned and organized operations that fly in the face of Milton Friedman's assertion that economic activity cannot be coordinated on such a massive scale.
We need a separate unattached government to govern the government 😫 keep then in check, regulated corruption, investigate dodgy dealings, hold then accountable.
Yes. But how do we organise and form communities that can push back against our current economic system? This analysis of the problem is great, and the conclusion that we should organise is inspiring - but how do we do it? Who is going to organise the organising? And I'm not going down some animal farm critique here...I genuinely mean it: How are we going to organise so that we can become a credible challenge to the current gross imbalance of power. Any suggestions - beyond 'social media' - will be read with intense interest.
shocker. a socialist uses capitalism, not socialism to build their own wealth. such hypocrisy by Grace. oh-- and she lied about the Boeing air crashes.
…have you any idea how much Amazon interferes with the democratic process in the US?!- it’s alarming. I only know about it from books I’ve read…purchased from Amazon?! - at least they haven’t started suppressing criticism….yet…
I loved Grace Blakely’s A World to Win , really pleased to see her here, Owen. I had an ‘aha’ moment as she spoke about how we have all been fooled into individualism and so stand alone powerlessness- contrasted to the deep, unremitting internal cooperation of every powerful body. From corporations to Tories to Kings…. None would survive if they stood alone. Imagine a king without an absolutely loyal court….
I have run my own small business here in the usa for the past 25 years. i also went to college for business back in the day. Nothing Grace said here is true or factual about capitalism. and she 100% lied about Boeing planes that crashed overseas. those airlines declined the training boeing recommended. She lied about this to allow herself to slander capitalism. That was absolutely disgusting.
I am deeply concerned about the ramifications of the genocide in Gaxa, orchestrated by Western countries and America. This egregious act will undoubtedly reverberate politically, economically, and in terms of security for generations to come. How can the champions of democracy be complicit in such heinous war crimes? Will history ever absolve the West of this grave injustice, In the age of globalvillage ?.....
Boeing would never do anything bad, surely. No reason to suspect that they had anything to do with the sudden totally unsuspicious death yesterday of the whistleblower during the trail into Boeing safety
Grace lied about Boeing. its was already released that those planes were outside the usa, and the airlines declined the training that was offered by boeing -- which would have prevented the software misuse. But-- Grace blames capitalism because it sells her narrative. so grossly dishonest.
You could try going to North Korea, Venezuela or Cuba and your wish could come true 🤣. Let’s face it, every time socialism has been tried (Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot etc), it has failed time and time again and resulted in untold misery, death and destruction. Or will you say that was never true Socialism 🤣🤣? By the same token, one could say we have never had true capitalism. Capitalism sure isn’t perfect, but in a world where humans are imperfect, it is the by far the best system currently available.
It's doomed in the same way that feudalism was - it was a necessary step in the growth of civilization that will eventually run its course and become irrelevant. I think after the next 3 major tech booms (AI, quantum computing, and nuclear fusion), growth will end, most of the population won't be able to work traditional jobs for a wage, and we'll truly enter a post-scarcity era. That's when the bourgeoisie will become irrelevant, just as the feudal aristocracy became irrelevant in the 1700's. So, in short, yes, it is "doomed". But this isn't unique to capitalism.
I was watching a thing Gary Stevenson put out the other day where he talked about social housing and he made more or less the same point from a different angle that Grace does.
The government giving bailouts to corporations is not Capitalism thats Socialism. In fact corporations are government entities. The government loves corporations because they hire employees that pay flat taxes.
Love the thesis of her argument being not to get the state to control everything but to place emphasis on democracy and grassroots efforts. I’m trying to get closer with my community to do my part. Great guest and segment! I will have to check this book out!
she is advocating for socialism. that's advocating for "we are the government, and we know what's best for you-- better than you know what's better for you" -- socialism is disgusting. the only successful nations on earth are capitalist, not socialist. LOL
This is a stupid, lazy argument. For a start THIS system had been in place for century upon century and does not work, and is killing the planet. It has had plenty of time to prove itself as working for everyone and not just rich people. It is obvious something else is necessary. The reason you cant point to other systems working well is because of the historical global ubiquity of capitalism. So...let's try something else. Socialism can work, and indeed did for early humans all the way up until agrarian culture. It also works qell on a micro level unofficially, between people. We have an innate sense of fairness. We split bills with our friends. We help our neighbours put shelves up then they help help mow the lawn. In markets, we barter. If everyone had a universal basic income, crime would drop massively, art would proliferate, no one would he starving. People could still get rich perhaps, but not at the exploitative expense of others. If we keep going this way, there will soon be trillionaires even as people in wealthy societies starve.
The left need to champion democratic change, in its own organisations, in the workplace, the community and the state. People need to be involved to greater degree in everything that affects their lives. Replacing the greedy capitalist class with a small gang of organised political operators is not the answer.
The Pound has been losing Value against the Dollar for Decades, i remember back in the 70s when we were not far off £1=$2. An interesting stat i heard recently is that since 2000 the Dollar has lost 54 Cents of its Value, so just how much has the Pound lost?
not one thing grace said was factual. not one. she even lied about the boeing crashes out of the usa. those airlines declined the training that was offered by boeing. thats what caused those two planes to crash. how pathetic how you people on the left are so horribly misinformed.
She lost me when she dismissed the notion that capitalism is being corrupted by financiers at the top. Has she not heard of insider trading or hedge funds? She is smart but not that smart.
That we ask the question like this shows how much we are conditioned to think within the boundaries of an economic system, that consumes more than there actually is. Capitalism will end. And it will take our society with it. It is going to be extremely ugly and will cause a lot of collateral damage. But it will definitely end.
I said this when Northern Rock got Bailed out but the treasury. The two opposing economic models are state control vs market led. Once public money is used to prop up failing banks, then it is the state controlling.
Not read Grace's book yet as Paperback out tomorrow but another great critique of the effects of capitalism and neoliberalism is: The Divide: A Brief Guide to Global Inequality and its Solutions by Jason Hickel | 17 May 2018
@owenjonestalks to answer your question at 25min, I would point you towards the Venus Project. It is the best option I've seen and provides a multi-prongued solution.
@ronaldreagan-ik6hz because it's doing wonders for humanity right now? Did you even learn what TVP proposes or do you just have the urge to unecessarily express your ignorant point of view?
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz putting hedge fund managers in charge of the country - oh we have look where that got us. Throw in some VIP lanes in too in this post Brexit dystopia too
research on socialism? No one can honestly deny that capitalism has been more successful than socialism. this is also massively proven with the immigration disaster from all over the world right now. where are all those people triying to immigrate to? yeah, capialtist countries-- not socialist countries. lol. @@anab0lic
I don't buy the idea that technological advances are now slower and that this is due to overconcentration of markets. Any one who grew up in the 1960s and 1970s has seen the most miraculous advances in technology. Not only that, but increasingly the synergies from R&D and technological advances in different disciplines are having an even greater impact and causing some kind of exponential advance. I accept that in many economies this is not yet playing out as productivity increases, but there are lots of different reasons for that. In the medium to long term my guess is that these impacts will feed through. Their economic and social effects may not be as beneficial as many techno-enthusiasts imagine. What your speaker does not seem to appreciate about R&D driven technology and science sectors is the huge sunken costs and the huge risks involved in developing new high-tech products. Only giant corporations have deep enough pockets. Investment capitalists have long been enthusiastic about the SME 'one idea' tech start-up company. But as someone from a certain city investment bank told me, for every successful such firm, they expect nine failures. Their investment in such companies was strictly on a portfolio basis, and high risk was normal. Once such a little start-up is successful it needs yet more deep pockets to expand and roll out production. At this point they are often bought up by a giant corporation in a similar sector with the resources to make full use of the new technology.
I have produced a non-capitalist economic theory called the Economics of Needs and Limits (ENL). This, or something like it, will be required to supersede the current system. (No link because YT will delete this.)
franky none of this matters because capitalism is about to expire anyway once we fully automate majority of jobs it's impossible to continue capitalism so finding flaws of capitalism when we already used it up it's kinda too late
What we have is corporatism not capitalism. - Capitalism would let any company fail, not be saved by govts. - Capitalism wouldn't allow lobbying. - Capitalism is about the strongest winning, not propped up by protectionism. - Capitalism is about true marketing; giving the consumer, what they when they want it, where they want it at the price they are willing to pay. In a true free market, only these companies would win. - Capitalism would call in the state debts once they get out of control. Corporatism is a mixture of corporations and governments working hand in hand. (The military industrial complex is the worst example of corporatism; govts starting wars, so that companies they have an interest in, can make profits off weapons sales and rebuilding after each war).
No! "Corporatism" is an unavoidable consequence of capitalism because capitalism will always lead to the accumulation of capital in increasingly fewer hands. It's the "goal" capitalism to eradicate competition! "Corporatism" is in fact the rule of the financial capital over the industrial capital and this stage was already reached at the beginning of the 20th century but two world wars provided a "reset". It's the "natural" end stage of capitalism which doesn't mean it will somehow automatically grow into socialism but it might change into an authoritarian system (neo-feudalism).
In the US it is not capitalic system..it is closer to oligarchies..the state is in cahoots with the BIG business. When they fail..they are expecting to be bailed out..if they one..they keep the profits
Woe is me, I'm middleclass and can't afford to buy my grownup kids a house. So, finally we admit what many people have been saying for decades. Capitalism is terrible. Take a moment and imagine how bad life must be for the people in far away places who live in poverty making the things that make our lives so comfortable.
You are right when you say that capitalism is terrible, and the condition thereafter you describe is called unequal exchange, a key component of imperialism. *Materially* , what makes you think that a middle class actually exists under capitalism?
@@kuramobay2445 probably middle class (as a class) never existed. That is why "middle class" condition shifted so easily in a few years. What defines for you "middle class"? There is an objective income? A specific number of houses you can buy? Or, instead, it's an arbitrary sub-division made to hide the fact that, materially, exist only two classes, one of owners of means of production and one of workers offering their labour in exchange for a wage.
Grace... I doubt you'll see this question, but if you do, and if you'd answer, would you say that the book is mostly focused on the UK economy, or would you call it equally relevant to others around the world? Do I need a copy of this in my local public library in the U.S.? Have you guys read "These are the Plunderers" by Gretchen Morgenson? Thoughts?
Will there be an audiobook? If not I’ll read it, but I admit anymore I listen to my books.. Far as capitalism, of course it will end. Marxists may have gotten it wrong many times over on “the final crisis”, but the dynamism of capitalism doesn’t mean the internal contradictions aren’t real, and ultimately terminal. Question is, do we get socialism just bc capitalism will end? The answer is, not unless we’re organized and fighting for it. Join an org, join a union, work on organizing your workplace if it’s not union, get involved in your community, do anything you can IRL to further our ability to organize the working class. Also, read theory.. don’t get lost in it at the expense of action, but at least get a foundation with theory, and study the history of working class/proletariat movements across the globe.. Without some foundation in theory and history, we are subject to the same pitfalls of the past. I’m no scholar or great comrade, but the most basic study over the last five years has convinced me of all this. Look forward to the book! ✊✌️
To be fair hardcore proponents of capitalism like Yaron Brook would agree that the economic system of the UK is not capitalism it's a mixed economy and very much worse for it. They would say it's not capitalist enough. It would be great to see a debate between him and this lady.
Anyone who argues free markets in a capitalist system is arguing for growing inequality and minority control. Argue free markets in an economy with a foundation of worker coops and they’d have some kind of case. But that’s left wing of the political spectrum, and there’s a reason that’s never a thing from the capitalist elite and the right wing hiding behind free market rhetoric. There’s a reason you don’t see pure capitalism in a Liberal democratic system. It makes so many people miserable, you need a dictatorship to fully implement it. Capitalism is the problem with free market arguments, and anyone who argues for it comes across as a shill in the pocket of the minority exploiting the majority. Under capitalism, free markets will only ever be imposed upon the weak. The capitalist elite will always use the state for its own benefit; whether laws, wars, subsidies, public funding. The free market capitalism of the right wing is about that minority putting themselves beyond democratic constraint of the population, minimising their costs and maximising their wealth. So no, you’ll probably never see such a debate.
Great topic and speakers. Have we found the female alternative to OJ? I could hardly keep up with what was said, even thought I had put it on double speed. So much info to get across, will have to get the book as I need to understand this proper. 🙏🏻
At its most basic - any society built upon an exploitative economic system will have huge inequality and minority rule. Exploitation comes from dividing the economic system into two groups - owners and workers. Ownership is used to take ownership and control of the surplus away from the people who produced it. This separation of work from ownership is the root cause. This is the mechanism for concentrated wealth and political power - slavery, feudalism, capitalism being 3 examples. As is centrally planned socialism, which swaps one form of concentrated economic decision making for another. The more concentrated, the more unequal and undemocratic. The more broad and diverse the economic ownership and decision making, the more equal and democratic. Which is why a foundation of worker coops fixes the root cause of inequality and minority rule. It removes the mechanism that leads to concentrated wealth and power.
Almost all of the problems with the 'system' could be solved simply by making it financially worthwhile for people to SHARE the jobs we would almost all democratically agree we NEED to have done and work much less. No more building the mansions, yachts and pleasure rockets to space, etc. for the rich but actually sharing in doing only the things WE agree WE all need. Think of the insanity of people building some people mansions when other people are homeless.
is it fair that some people work their entire life to become CEO of a company at 60 years old? is it fair that the best professional athletes get paid lots of money? is it fair that a high school dropout builds a small business into a multi-million dollar venture? all of this is fair. all of it is from freedom from capitalism, not the oppression of socialism.
"Vulture capitalism is just capitalism." - Grace Blakeley Whew! I was withholding my like until she said that, bc: Capitalism demands, encourages, and rewards ruthlessness, no matter the circumstance, no matter who wields it. - Me
Oh, stop with this BS already SMH The UK is the country furthest away from the Eurasian borderland countries that created their own version of Socialism using their particular environmental and social influences. The UK does not have that mentality. It's 2024, give it a rest, what countries did miles away, may years ago does not reflect on the UK's trajectory. Stop with this insane fear-mongering. We are Eurasian SMH
@@terry6985 agreed - and you would have to look very hard indeed to find any political parties in the former eastern block that said anything left-wing in their manifesto !
Learn that there’s many, many models of socialism. Also learn that any concentrated form of economic ownership and decision making is bad for for the ordinary citizen, regardless of socialist or capitalist. Also realise that all capitalist, feudalist, slavery forms are concentrated. Not all socialist forms are. And it’s about economic foundation, more than the entire system
As Grace said getting organised is key, that's what history shows. The "easiest" route is through the work place via trade unions. This is itself a Herculean labour because so many workers are anti union. That is also understandable, like politics and these other entrenched organsations, unions have little insentive to do much with low membership, workers then have this self defeating tendancy to say why bother they do nothing. Also people keep banging on about taking back control, well why don't you start with taking back control of your work place via your branch? The unions also need to be dragged kicking and screaming, unless of course you are happy with the status quo.
Owen, looking young might be an ADHD thing. I did for years, although now 56 I might be showing age rather more. Lovely to hear/see Grace, she was always great on Tyskysour, thanks
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Mate if your enjoying capitalism as much as the rest of us that drink container is laced with copious amounts of alcahol..... ;-{D
I’ll like and sub Owen - I like arguments made against the fist-in-glove relationship between western neoliberalism and large monopolies.
What I’d like to see from someone with your standing and platform is a call to something other.
If you’re making an argument for Marxist or Leninist ideology, can you please make a call-to-arms instead of being a flea on the shoulder of the undeniably long-arm of the status-quo?
tl;dr: are you actually calling for revolution, or are you grandstanding as a contrarian, anti-establishment figure to make a living
It’s a serious question. We need leaders. You might not be it - but I don’t see you directing attention to anyone that may be.
Are there none - or are you grifting on obvious problems, and an anxious proletariat?
This is getting more complicated by the day. Before I donate I need to know if the Tory media is the same media as the pro-war media and are both the same as the pro-capitalist media. If not, I shall need to split my donation. I can't afford 3 x £100 / month.
It is so wonderful to find a channel where I agree wholeheartedly! (: I love this channel, thank you so much for it! Another great conversation!
@@freemangriffin4953 Seek help.
As a developer I should point out, it’s not just state funding that generated the algorithms in your phone, there’s also huge amount of unpaid open source development going on many many big libraries are maintained by the community rather than big corporates
Open source software is an excellent counter to the idea that innovation requires a profit incentive, as capitalists always try to say.
You also know that you are in a job of a limited time as AGI and quantum computing will easily replace you and many others.
Silicon Valley and the owners of the capital in Silicon Valley will rule the world sadly.
Data is the new gold and platinum …….
@user-td5pt9nw9n What if we all just unplugged, stopped using the Internet? Then what? Alot of us depend on the Internet granted, but if those who directly didn't depend on it, it could be a great way to stop control. You can only be monitored if you are online.
Open source is a prolific example of how anarchism works great enabling decentralized agents to peacefully coordinate towards utilitarianism. Also, open source operates within capitalism very well, as capitalism is the fuel that enables people to have more time and incentives to work on open source code
This is fabulous news, work which I’m sure society is grateful for as I am🙏👍
Captilism relies on infinite growth but we live on a planet with finite resources.
And humans not only have finite skills, these skills actually diminish over time eventually. Everyone should study a bit of physics. Nothing comes free, nothing lasts forever, things change physical state often. Full metal alchemist is very cool for young ones to wrap their head around it. It's a constant juggle for a positive outcome. Sometimes conflict is inevitable as well.
I know very little about physics, regrettably.
@@globalist1990The statement that our skill diminish over time is contradicted by the facts. Science is improving, exponentially in fact. Including Physics. What we do with that knowledge, what might be called wisdom, now that seems to be decreasing...
The resources might be finite but our technological advance and how we use resources is infinite! Once we develop sufficiently to become muktiplanetary we will have no resource problems.
@@kgh065, Incorrect.
This is near religious levels of fantasy.
That you can pretend technology will make our resources infinite is both hilarious and sad.
Technology will free us from over consumption and overuse, "IF" that is how we use it.
Which will require people to change culture and perception.
People will be forced to change, and the sooner that happens the less dramatic it will have to be.
Pull your head out, it's stuck way up there.
@@kgh065 space is not cost effective. Certainly not yet, and probably not ever. Space is really hard and expensive.
Wealth MUST be taxed, hoarded wealth must be transferred back into the broader population
Just abolish money.
@@DissociatedWomenIncorporated And what will replace it?
FYI I'm not an annoyed right-winger lashing out, I'm genuinely curious.
That will help for a while. But as long as we keep capitalism we'll end up back here, and worse.
@@joeallen9104 I dunno, I haven’t quite gotten that far yet! Perhaps a clever AI system that keeps track of resource allocation, allowing people free access to goods and services as long as they’re only consuming their fair share? Or just… whatever they do in Star Trek to handle resource allocation and maintain a moneyless economy 😂 Live long, and prosper 🖖
That's what happened after WW2 and it worked
Great interview Owen. I think Grace and Gary Stevenson are two crucial voices, to bring about the economic changes that are required, to create a fairer society!
Gary made millions from the financial trading sector, and now lives very comfortably whilst telling others that socialism is the answer 😂😂😂😂
@@wam-yx1vs He is clearly a great deal more intelligent than you.
@@pierremartini2229 Evidently so, I but do you think he would be happy with re-distribution of his wealth?
@@wam-yx1vs I have no doubt he would be very happy to pay much higher taxes in order to create a far more civilised society.
Name one socialist society in the world thats as safe and prosperous as any western capitalist nation? you fool.
Capitalism is the Oroborus serpent that ultimately devours itself..
Totally!!!!@
Nope. not at all. capitalism is only destroyed by progressive government -- then the result is everyone suffers. hmmmmm
And all of us in that process….
That's socialism......
Interesting. The poorest people in the world would do anything to live under the freedom of capitalism. You utter fool
Keep going Owen. You’re an honest man who stands up for what’s right.
an honest many would not have let this misinformed woman lie horribly about capitalism for 37 minutes straight. pathetic.
It's strange how so many of the poorest people defend capitalism.
According to Nye the genius of the Tories is to convince the people to vote against their own interests.
Sadly the conditioning works strongly - especially on those with vulnerable minds.
It's also strange those who are comfortable in a capitalist society tend to complain about capitalism.
@igakoga2481 then give it up.If you condemn but still use every product of capitalism, you have a disconnect with your principles a.k.a. A hypocrite. From the device you are using to the wifi/ISP to send this comment, to the nice tumbler of the video host, to the nice clothes of the guest plus the convenience to get these things are all products of capitalism.
It may not be most perfect socio-economic system but it works. This is why we have laws, taxes and tariffs to reign in its abuse.
Btw, did you have a conflict of conscience when you bought your device? Or when you clicked post? Because, following your logic (a fallacy, albeit) you have been part of exploitation. And you have made it worse by grandstanding yourself. If there is no conflict of conscience, then we have a word for it: HYPOCRISY.
@igakoga2481
The real question is : "Is humanity doomed because of capitalism ?"... and the answer is : "Yes, it is".
Capitalism is doomed. Humanity can move on.
We will either be subjugated back into feudalism, or we will break our chains.
No it big government socalism that sucks
Yup, Trump was the elites Manchurian candidate and the crony crapitalist Lolbertarians really played all the “patriots” 🙄
@@coopsnz1There is no socialist government in the west.
Wrong. Humanity is in a pickle because of crony "capitalism" .
"The rich people are getting richer and the poor stay poor"
That is the problem.
Yes, agreed. This is inherent in Capitalism: Capitalist Owner class does really well, the rest of us (workers) - not so much.
it's not a problem because this is not even real.
@@eKoushgood bot.
@@eKoush, Ah yes, the postmodern nihilist has entered the conversation...
Since you don't exist, please cease to assert your non-existence onto the rest of us.
Black hole economy.
The best thing we can do at the moment is educate ourselves and organise.
conservative capitalists build strong nations, progressive socialists destroy nations.
We don't have capitalism in the UK, we have a slavocracy, where most work long hours for low wages and high stress!
Same thing
That is capitalism.
There's a system where you don't need to work to provide a service for others?
In purity, true capitalism would care, invest and support the well-being of its workers...almost becoming socialist in reality?@@jgmediting7770
100%!agree with you.. workers in this cesspit of a country are just slaves.
Just to add a note: privatising the means of production is Capitalism, therefore it leads to monopolies. Wealth is in the hands of a few. On the other hand, nationalising the means of production is socialism. Wealth belongs to the people. Our taxes support society for example the NHS, as it used to be. The people owning the wealth will do anything to hang on to their wealth as we can see now. Politicians are the puppets of the Capitalists. Thanks for this great stream.
_"Just to add a note: privatising the means of production is Capitalism, therefore it leads to monopolies."_
Wrong. It literally does not. It is the Government and regulations, that lead to monopolies. If the industry is regulated, then regulators (who themselves have a government sponsored monopoly to “regulate” markets) can, and inevitably do, sell their special powers to the highest bidder to put up barriers to entry to would be competitors, and to provide legal insulation to would-be lawsuits against their Jr. partner. Thus, as an industry becomes regulated, the larger companies tend to become insulated from normal market and legal corrective forces. Ironically, politicians use the symptoms of regulated industries to justify more regulation. All highly regulated industries are cartelized for this very reason…there are no exceptions. And, dark comically, almost all examples of “Why Capitalism doesn’t work” come from highly regulated industries!
_"Wealth is in the hands of a few."_
Wealth can be in the hands of anybody who is able to provide society something they are willing to buy.
_"Politicians are the puppets of the Capitalists."_
They are the puppets of the Government. Nothing to do with Capitalism whatsoever.
@@Historia.Magistra.Vitae. Or anyone who takes valuable land and defends it with violence. Governments will show up no matter what. This idea that governments cause all problems isn't going to lead you anywhere productive.
monopolies are illegal under capitalism. nice try
Thank you for interviewing another brilliant woman 😊
Nothing this woman said was even fractionally true or remotely accurate
Thank you Owen and Grace for all your valuable efforts
nothing Grace said was factual or valuable. lol
There’s no value in socialism
imo THE major issue with social media/state spying of us on our internet is its ability to sniff out and potentially snuff out any grass roots political movement before it gets any meaningful traction. extremely serious issue as there is NO WAY the TPTB could ever dream of not using that power in order to protect and maintain the status quo.
The fact that our countries people can’t even decide where their taxes should or shouldn’t go is infuriating
It’s like people aren’t allowed to eat out of their own bowls of food
then dont support people like this lady on the extreme left.
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz I live in Germany where the politicians from left to right all support Israeli’s genocide against Palestinians.
It’s kinda hard to choose, makes you desperate
Every system is flawed. The flaw is the human narcissist opportunists who will always gravitate to positions of power, and will always take rather than give. History shows this clearly, but people only see what they want to see.
Really enjoyed this interview.
So let's not try to improve anything. Moral of this story. No wonder some choose a different story, with room for improvement.
no group of people are more narcissistic than entitled and indoctrinated liberals.
I think it's that every system is flawed as soon as there's a part in it that doesn't belong there( or just "doesn't feel like it"), like for example humans not feeling connected to nature anymore. It seems that it's our nature to destroy systems that we came from while simultanously creating systems that over time will bring ourselves down.... circle jerk of destruction kinda
EXCELLENT TITLE, totally encapsulates EXACTLY what Capitalism strives to be, all power in the hands of one "winner/dictator", at the expense of everyone else, no matter how that power was obtained by the "winner"
Great video, great interview
please list the marxist utopias around the world? i'll wait. lol
Nothing lasts forever
Even cold november rain
Ozymandius
Untrammeled greed seems to!
yes. socialism has proven to be a loser.
Yeah. Like socialism
This gives me hope that we can not only learn from the disasters of the right but also of the left. I think we have plenty of reasons to fear both and also learn and move forward in a fairer way, together.
perrfect. lets start fairness with your assets. we will force you to live with homeless, force you to liquidate your surplus finances, force you to share your car, and redistribute all your items to those with less than you. lets let you feel the effects of your own ideas. LOL
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz …how can anyone be forced to live with homeless people? If they live with you, they are _by definition_ not homeless. It’s a logical impossibility.
the socialists would advocate for "placing" homeless people into peoples homes against their will -- all in the name of equality.
how are people so ignorant to follow the ideas of people like Grace Blakeley? pure insanity. @@DissociatedWomenIncorporated
Excellent discussion! Grace makes the complication and insanity of the contemporary capitalist political economy understandable and also makes the case for socialism seem imminently reasonable and logical!
please look up Thomas Sowell. Grace lied repeatedly during this video. it was really pathetic. and no, the boeing planes crashed out of the usa because the airlines declined the training that is required by boeing and the FAA inside the USA. what a disgusting lie she told to slander capitalism. shes a coward.
Currently, the system has no basis in anything. In the past it was gold, but politicians and people on the stock exchange wanted to make money without limits, so the system is empty.
I used to think this way. Left and right, theory against theory. Then I began to learn that deep down it's just people and groups of people who gain power. I was reading Whitney Webbs astonishing book 'Nation under Blackmail', that as well as 'Supermob' bu Gus Russo. It is very instructive to see where our presidents came from. Ronald Reagan for example, probably the start of the current Neoliberal movement. Came from MCA and was essentiall owned by Lew Wasserman, a man with extensive supermob ties. He was groomed throughout his policital career by this group, until finally they got him into the presidency.
Left and right of the political spectrum literally relates to groups of people against groups of people. Namely economic owners and workers.
Not so. Capitalists will use either. The terms mean little in practical reality, both have been co-opted. What we are left with is simply a means of division.
What she is describing is monopoly capitalism, a phenomenon that Marx did not llive to see but Lenin et. al. described from the 1920's onwards. This stage of capitalist development has produced companies of a size that neither Marx nor the founders of neoliberalism could even dream of when they theorized capitalism. Today the biggest employers in the world are the US und Chinese armed forces and Wall Mart, each with over 1.5 million employees plus millions more of contractors. These are centrally planned and organized operations that fly in the face of Milton Friedman's assertion that economic activity cannot be coordinated on such a massive scale.
_"monopoly capitalism,"_
Doesn't exist ... then you go about naming Wall Mart, except there are many competitors for it in the US, like Target.
capitalism always wins for the individual
Is capitalism the issue, or broken government with no checks and balances or accountability?
We need a separate unattached government to govern the government 😫 keep then in check, regulated corruption, investigate dodgy dealings, hold then accountable.
Yes. But how do we organise and form communities that can push back against our current economic system? This analysis of the problem is great, and the conclusion that we should organise is inspiring - but how do we do it? Who is going to organise the organising? And I'm not going down some animal farm critique here...I genuinely mean it: How are we going to organise so that we can become a credible challenge to the current gross imbalance of power. Any suggestions - beyond 'social media' - will be read with intense interest.
We haven't lived in a capitalist system for almost a hundred years, so none of the concerns apply.
And where is the only place I can buy the book? Amazon.
shocker. a socialist uses capitalism, not socialism to build their own wealth. such hypocrisy by Grace.
oh-- and she lied about the Boeing air crashes.
…have you any idea how much Amazon interferes with the democratic process in the US?!- it’s alarming. I only know about it from books I’ve read…purchased from Amazon?! - at least they haven’t started suppressing criticism….yet…
no one buys from amazon or works for amazon outside of voluntary interactions. LOL. so much for interfering with democracy. @@stephensimpson8531
I loved Grace Blakely’s A World to Win , really pleased to see her here, Owen. I had an ‘aha’ moment as she spoke about how we have all been fooled into individualism and so stand alone powerlessness- contrasted to the deep, unremitting internal cooperation of every powerful body. From corporations to Tories to Kings…. None would survive if they stood alone. Imagine a king without an absolutely loyal court….
I have run my own small business here in the usa for the past 25 years. i also went to college for business back in the day. Nothing Grace said here is true or factual about capitalism. and she 100% lied about Boeing planes that crashed overseas. those airlines declined the training boeing recommended. She lied about this to allow herself to slander capitalism. That was absolutely disgusting.
Why do people on the left- follow such historically failed ideas? Nuts
No. Next?
I am deeply concerned about the ramifications of the genocide in Gaxa, orchestrated by Western countries and America. This egregious act will undoubtedly reverberate politically, economically, and in terms of security for generations to come. How can the champions of democracy be complicit in such heinous war crimes? Will history ever absolve the West of this grave injustice, In the age of globalvillage ?.....
will you condemn hamas? will you?
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz No.
@@atwcat9370 exactly. Genocide is perfect in your eyes. gross. sick. get out.
These voices are important so I bought the book.
this lady is so full of misinformation, her book will be worthless.
You bought a book through capitalist means from a socialist writer. - oh the duality of stupidity on the left.
Boeing would never do anything bad, surely. No reason to suspect that they had anything to do with the sudden totally unsuspicious death yesterday of the whistleblower during the trail into Boeing safety
before giving testimony in S. Carolina...
Grace lied about Boeing. its was already released that those planes were outside the usa, and the airlines declined the training that was offered by boeing -- which would have prevented the software misuse.
But-- Grace blames capitalism because it sells her narrative. so grossly dishonest.
Where has she been all my life 😮
The answer is yes.
Nope
"Vulture Capitalism IS just Capitalism" - YES!
I pray to live in a socialist society in my lifetime
You could try going to North Korea, Venezuela or Cuba and your wish could come true 🤣.
Let’s face it, every time socialism has been tried (Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot etc), it has failed time and time again and resulted in untold misery, death and destruction. Or will you say that was never true Socialism 🤣🤣? By the same token, one could say we have never had true capitalism.
Capitalism sure isn’t perfect, but in a world where humans are imperfect, it is the by far the best system currently available.
There is no such thing as "vulture capitalism" in the first place. It is called a mixed economy. Nothing to do with Capitalism.
@@TJ-Judgewhat’s stopping you from moving to a socialist society??
sure. socialism is a global success right? LOL
The poor are given benefits, the rich are given expenses.It's more expensive being poor than it is being rich.
That made zero sense.
then strive to become rich rather than strive to destroy the opportunity to become rich.
@@remoobko8440 It does but you obviously don't get it.
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz I am rich, in many ways, including cash, but that wasn't the point. You do understand my point don't you?
@@ZER0-- maybe your comment is your lack of clarity-- now that two people have told you this? hmmmm.
Hi ! What IS doom? A great opportunity for capitalism!
I hope so. 👍🏼
It's doomed in the same way that feudalism was - it was a necessary step in the growth of civilization that will eventually run its course and become irrelevant. I think after the next 3 major tech booms (AI, quantum computing, and nuclear fusion), growth will end, most of the population won't be able to work traditional jobs for a wage, and we'll truly enter a post-scarcity era. That's when the bourgeoisie will become irrelevant, just as the feudal aristocracy became irrelevant in the 1700's.
So, in short, yes, it is "doomed". But this isn't unique to capitalism.
capitalism will always be alive an well as it connects buyers and sellers voluntarily.
I was watching a thing Gary Stevenson put out the other day where he talked about social housing and he made more or less the same point from a different angle that Grace does.
nothing run by the government is ever free or uplifting.
Awesome discussion. It is encouraging to see discussions about decentralization and organizing outside state power.
this lady advocated for state controls. sure. thats been proven to be globally successful right? lol
The government giving bailouts to corporations is not Capitalism thats Socialism. In fact corporations are government entities. The government loves corporations because they hire employees that pay flat taxes.
Love the thesis of her argument being not to get the state to control everything but to place emphasis on democracy and grassroots efforts. I’m trying to get closer with my community to do my part.
Great guest and segment! I will have to check this book out!
she is advocating for socialism. that's advocating for "we are the government, and we know what's best for you-- better than you know what's better for you" -- socialism is disgusting.
the only successful nations on earth are capitalist, not socialist. LOL
Owen and Grace taking over the world would improve human lives dramatically. I would vote for you.
Sounds like tyranny. 🤷🏻♂️
But isn't a business run by centralized planning?
yes
Nationalize the banks.
Name one nation that has nationalization where the citizens are more free? you fool
Sure. That has always worked out well historically huh? Lol
Let’s nationalize your bank account. Others need it more than you.
Get organized out there comrades ✊✊
Better yet. How about you move? Fool
Owen, you are funny, name an alternative which has been successfully implemented?
This is a stupid, lazy argument.
For a start THIS system had been in place for century upon century and does not work, and is killing the planet. It has had plenty of time to prove itself as working for everyone and not just rich people.
It is obvious something else is necessary. The reason you cant point to other systems working well is because of the historical global ubiquity of capitalism. So...let's try something else.
Socialism can work, and indeed did for early humans all the way up until agrarian culture. It also works qell on a micro level unofficially, between people. We have an innate sense of fairness. We split bills with our friends. We help our neighbours put shelves up then they help help mow the lawn. In markets, we barter. If everyone had a universal basic income, crime would drop massively, art would proliferate, no one would he starving. People could still get rich perhaps, but not at the exploitative expense of others.
If we keep going this way, there will soon be trillionaires even as people in wealthy societies starve.
exactly
We need The Workers Democratically owning the Companies they work in! Workers have say in all decisions, wages etc....
Take a look at Ricardo Semler. It works well in his companies.
so you work hard and might want to buy a car or a holiday your going to stop people thanks owen
socialists are literally that stupid
The left need to champion democratic change, in its own organisations, in the workplace, the community and the state. People need to be involved to greater degree in everything that affects their lives. Replacing the greedy capitalist class with a small gang of organised political operators is not the answer.
The Pound has been losing Value against the Dollar for Decades, i remember back in the 70s when we were not far off £1=$2.
An interesting stat i heard recently is that since 2000 the Dollar has lost 54 Cents of its Value, so just how much has the Pound lost?
Ohh Grace .. .. ...sooooo smart .. .
not one thing grace said was factual. not one. she even lied about the boeing crashes out of the usa. those airlines declined the training that was offered by boeing. thats what caused those two planes to crash. how pathetic how you people on the left are so horribly misinformed.
Calling a socialist smart makes YOU incredibly stupid
She lost me when she dismissed the notion that capitalism is being corrupted by financiers at the top. Has she not heard of insider trading or hedge funds? She is smart but not that smart.
no, nothing she said is smart. someone like Thomas Sowell would destroy her career with one honest conversation.
That we ask the question like this shows how much we are conditioned to think within the boundaries of an economic system, that consumes more than there actually is.
Capitalism will end. And it will take our society with it. It is going to be extremely ugly and will cause a lot of collateral damage. But it will definitely end.
I said this when Northern Rock got Bailed out but the treasury. The two opposing economic models are state control vs market led. Once public money is used to prop up failing banks, then it is the state controlling.
Then vote for red in America
Your energy is admirable Owen.👏
Nothing is admirable about socialism- every
No, but socialism is.
Not read Grace's book yet as Paperback out tomorrow but another great critique of the effects of capitalism and neoliberalism is:
The Divide: A Brief Guide to Global Inequality and its Solutions
by Jason Hickel | 17 May 2018
asking a socialist to critique capitalism is laughable because socialism is a global failure.
Wow! Great analysis and explanation 👌🏽
no. thomas sowell would expose Grace as a lying fool.
Excellent interview, thankyou.
@owenjonestalks to answer your question at 25min, I would point you towards the Venus Project. It is the best option I've seen and provides a multi-prongued solution.
nahh. lets stick with capitalism.
@ronaldreagan-ik6hz because it's doing wonders for humanity right now? Did you even learn what TVP proposes or do you just have the urge to unecessarily express your ignorant point of view?
Private equity gouging on public contracts is a huge issue
is private equity illegal? nope
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz putting hedge fund managers in charge of the country - oh we have look where that got us. Throw in some VIP lanes in too in this post Brexit dystopia too
Then invest in it rather than hate on it. Fool
I love Grace. She's phenomenal.
really? name one country in the world that is successful because of her ideas? LOL.
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz you really haven't done much research on this subject have you buddy.
research on socialism? No one can honestly deny that capitalism has been more successful than socialism.
this is also massively proven with the immigration disaster from all over the world right now.
where are all those people triying to immigrate to? yeah, capialtist countries-- not socialist countries.
lol. @@anab0lic
Owen Jones - our “Anti Blofeld”
Oh what a beautiful cat!! 😻❤️
A beautiful
Face with a socialist brain will always be ugly
I don't buy the idea that technological advances are now slower and that this is due to overconcentration of markets. Any one who grew up in the 1960s and 1970s has seen the most miraculous advances in technology. Not only that, but increasingly the synergies from R&D and technological advances in different disciplines are having an even greater impact and causing some kind of exponential advance. I accept that in many economies this is not yet playing out as productivity increases, but there are lots of different reasons for that. In the medium to long term my guess is that these impacts will feed through. Their economic and social effects may not be as beneficial as many techno-enthusiasts imagine. What your speaker does not seem to appreciate about R&D driven technology and science sectors is the huge sunken costs and the huge risks involved in developing new high-tech products. Only giant corporations have deep enough pockets. Investment capitalists have long been enthusiastic about the SME 'one idea' tech start-up company. But as someone from a certain city investment bank told me, for every successful such firm, they expect nine failures. Their investment in such companies was strictly on a portfolio basis, and high risk was normal. Once such a little start-up is successful it needs yet more deep pockets to expand and roll out production. At this point they are often bought up by a giant corporation in a similar sector with the resources to make full use of the new technology.
capitalism always supports freedom of choice
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz If you can afford it. Freedom is measured in dollars. Else you are a slave.
I have produced a non-capitalist economic theory called the Economics of Needs and Limits (ENL). This, or something like it, will be required to supersede the current system. (No link because YT will delete this.)
We have returned to feudalism. This is just feudalism with extra layers of abstraction between the nobles and the commoners.
nope. the system is based on voluntary buyers and sellers. nice try.
Ngl I have a feeling it will end. There's much less people who own much more capital. I have a feeling it won't end well 😢
It won’t end well unless the hoarders give it up willingly… they won’t.
socialism is the failed idea, not capitalism.
Owen, would you be able to do a short video and interview an expert on Investor state dispute settlements?
franky none of this matters because capitalism is about to expire anyway once we fully automate majority of jobs it's impossible to continue capitalism so finding flaws of capitalism when we already used it up it's kinda too late
What we have is corporatism not capitalism.
- Capitalism would let any company fail, not be saved by govts.
- Capitalism wouldn't allow lobbying.
- Capitalism is about the strongest winning, not propped up by protectionism.
- Capitalism is about true marketing; giving the consumer, what they when they want it, where they want it at the price they are willing to pay. In a true free market, only these companies would win.
- Capitalism would call in the state debts once they get out of control.
Corporatism is a mixture of corporations and governments working hand in hand. (The military industrial complex is the worst example of corporatism; govts starting wars, so that companies they have an interest in, can make profits off weapons sales and rebuilding after each war).
yes. progressive government is the problem, not capitalism. LOL. those on the left are just too ignorant to understand this
No! "Corporatism" is an unavoidable consequence of capitalism because capitalism will always lead to the accumulation of capital in increasingly fewer hands. It's the "goal" capitalism to eradicate competition! "Corporatism" is in fact the rule of the financial capital over the industrial capital and this stage was already reached at the beginning of the 20th century but two world wars provided a "reset". It's the "natural" end stage of capitalism which doesn't mean it will somehow automatically grow into socialism but it might change into an authoritarian system (neo-feudalism).
Thank you both - great discussion.
discussion? all grace did was lie repeatedly about capitalism.
Just bought VULTURE CAPITALISM on audible 😊👍
In the US it is not capitalic system..it is closer to oligarchies..the state is in cahoots with the BIG business. When they fail..they are expecting to be bailed out..if they one..they keep the profits
only by trickery will you beat the greedy.
Woe is me, I'm middleclass and can't afford to buy my grownup kids a house. So, finally we admit what many people have been saying for decades. Capitalism is terrible. Take a moment and imagine how bad life must be for the people in far away places who live in poverty making the things that make our lives so comfortable.
You are right when you say that capitalism is terrible, and the condition thereafter you describe is called unequal exchange, a key component of imperialism.
*Materially* , what makes you think that a middle class actually exists under capitalism?
@@sentientnatalie That's what I said. Middle class parents can no longer afford to pay the mortgage deposit for their kids.
@@kuramobay2445 Define "middle class", and again, in a real material sense.
@@kuramobay2445 probably middle class (as a class) never existed. That is why "middle class" condition shifted so easily in a few years. What defines for you "middle class"? There is an objective income? A specific number of houses you can buy? Or, instead, it's an arbitrary sub-division made to hide the fact that, materially, exist only two classes, one of owners of means of production and one of workers offering their labour in exchange for a wage.
We don’t have Capitalism, have not had it In over a hundred years. Only watched the first two minutes, hope it gets figured out later in the video.
nope. capitalism is alive and well everyday all over the west.
Grace... I doubt you'll see this question, but if you do, and if you'd answer, would you say that the book is mostly focused on the UK economy, or would you call it equally relevant to others around the world? Do I need a copy of this in my local public library in the U.S.? Have you guys read "These are the Plunderers" by Gretchen Morgenson? Thoughts?
Great interview, I'm going to grab a copy of Vulture Capitalism right now! Cheers!
so you think marxism or socialism is the answer? LOL. you stupid people
Will there be an audiobook? If not I’ll read it, but I admit anymore I listen to my books..
Far as capitalism, of course it will end. Marxists may have gotten it wrong many times over on “the final crisis”, but the dynamism of capitalism doesn’t mean the internal contradictions aren’t real, and ultimately terminal. Question is, do we get socialism just bc capitalism will end? The answer is, not unless we’re organized and fighting for it. Join an org, join a union, work on organizing your workplace if it’s not union, get involved in your community, do anything you can IRL to further our ability to organize the working class. Also, read theory.. don’t get lost in it at the expense of action, but at least get a foundation with theory, and study the history of working class/proletariat movements across the globe.. Without some foundation in theory and history, we are subject to the same pitfalls of the past. I’m no scholar or great comrade, but the most basic study over the last five years has convinced me of all this.
Look forward to the book! ✊✌️
To be fair hardcore proponents of capitalism like Yaron Brook would agree that the economic system of the UK is not capitalism it's a mixed economy and very much worse for it. They would say it's not capitalist enough. It would be great to see a debate between him and this lady.
Anyone who argues free markets in a capitalist system is arguing for growing inequality and minority control. Argue free markets in an economy with a foundation of worker coops and they’d have some kind of case. But that’s left wing of the political spectrum, and there’s a reason that’s never a thing from the capitalist elite and the right wing hiding behind free market rhetoric.
There’s a reason you don’t see pure capitalism in a Liberal democratic system. It makes so many people miserable, you need a dictatorship to fully implement it.
Capitalism is the problem with free market arguments, and anyone who argues for it comes across as a shill in the pocket of the minority exploiting the majority. Under capitalism, free markets will only ever be imposed upon the weak. The capitalist elite will always use the state for its own benefit; whether laws, wars, subsidies, public funding.
The free market capitalism of the right wing is about that minority putting themselves beyond democratic constraint of the population, minimising their costs and maximising their wealth.
So no, you’ll probably never see such a debate.
Yaron would laugh at everything gracefully lies about. Lol
Great topic and speakers. Have we found the female alternative to OJ? I could hardly keep up with what was said, even thought I had put it on double speed. So much info to get across, will have to get the book as I need to understand this proper. 🙏🏻
At its most basic - any society built upon an exploitative economic system will have huge inequality and minority rule. Exploitation comes from dividing the economic system into two groups - owners and workers. Ownership is used to take ownership and control of the surplus away from the people who produced it. This separation of work from ownership is the root cause. This is the mechanism for concentrated wealth and political power - slavery, feudalism, capitalism being 3 examples. As is centrally planned socialism, which swaps one form of concentrated economic decision making for another.
The more concentrated, the more unequal and undemocratic. The more broad and diverse the economic ownership and decision making, the more equal and democratic. Which is why a foundation of worker coops fixes the root cause of inequality and minority rule. It removes the mechanism that leads to concentrated wealth and power.
❤❤❤
Activa los subtítulos automáticos en español. Muchas gracias.
Yes, yes! Please!
Yes eventually one way or the other it will collapse in on it's self, but it won't be pretty.
sure. the most failed ideology (socialism) is the global economic system of the future. LOL. stupid people.
Almost all of the problems with the 'system' could be solved simply by making it financially worthwhile for people to SHARE the jobs we would almost all democratically agree we NEED to have done and work much less. No more building the mansions, yachts and pleasure rockets to space, etc. for the rich but actually sharing in doing only the things WE agree WE all need. Think of the insanity of people building some people mansions when other people are homeless.
is it fair that some people work their entire life to become CEO of a company at 60 years old?
is it fair that the best professional athletes get paid lots of money?
is it fair that a high school dropout builds a small business into a multi-million dollar venture?
all of this is fair. all of it is from freedom from capitalism, not the oppression of socialism.
Grace B and Gary Stevenson 👍🏽 more of this for the collective consciousness..
name one country in the world where collectivism is successful and creates a free and robust middle class? name one? come on. name one?
Move to live amongst your failed ideas.
A boeing whistleblower died recently- see breaking points
Grace lied about boeing here. completely lied.
"Vulture capitalism is just capitalism." - Grace Blakeley
Whew! I was withholding my like until she said that, bc:
Capitalism demands, encourages, and rewards ruthlessness, no matter the circumstance, no matter who wields it. - Me
❤
speak to anyone who grew up in Eastern Europe in the 1970's & 1980's for their perspective on the joys of socialism....
Oh, stop with this BS already SMH The UK is the country furthest away from the Eurasian borderland countries that created their own version of Socialism using their particular environmental and social influences. The UK does not have that mentality. It's 2024, give it a rest, what countries did miles away, may years ago does not reflect on the UK's trajectory. Stop with this insane fear-mongering. We are Eurasian SMH
The mass exodus from east to west when the wall came down in 89 said it all..
The mass exodus from east to west when the wall came down in 89 said it all
@@terry6985 agreed - and you would have to look very hard indeed to find any political parties in the former eastern block that said anything left-wing in their manifesto !
Learn that there’s many, many models of socialism. Also learn that any concentrated form of economic ownership and decision making is bad for for the ordinary citizen, regardless of socialist or capitalist. Also realise that all capitalist, feudalist, slavery forms are concentrated. Not all socialist forms are. And it’s about economic foundation, more than the entire system
She mentions the isolation that I feel.
That’s Marx’s theory of alienation.
Grace lied repeatedly about capitalism. sad
As Grace said getting organised is key, that's what history shows. The "easiest" route is through the work place via trade unions. This is itself a Herculean labour because so many workers are anti union.
That is also understandable, like politics and these other entrenched organsations, unions have little insentive to do much with low membership, workers then have this self defeating tendancy to say why bother they do nothing.
Also people keep banging on about taking back control, well why don't you start with taking back control of your work place via your branch? The unions also need to be dragged kicking and screaming, unless of course you are happy with the status quo.
you can organize all you want. socialism is a global failure.
Owen, looking young might be an ADHD thing. I did for years, although now 56 I might be showing age rather more. Lovely to hear/see Grace, she was always great on Tyskysour, thanks
do you agree wtih Grace? do you think socialism is wise, despite its global failure? hmmmm
@@ronaldreagan-ik6hz It fails due to greed, not because it doesn't work.
Two people trashing capitalism via computers, microphones and a social media network all made possible by (check notes), capitalism.
Exactly
It has to be, otherwise we are!
How well has that worked around world? It hasn’t.