I can’t say how insanely happy I am to see this video do so well. And, due to this success, I’ve decided to set up a Discord server! If you’d like to join, here’s the link: discord.gg/f24MTV2WgN I’ll be posting video announcements for when they come out, and it’s hopefully a good place for everyone to come and chat, so hopefully I’ll see you there!
I was gonna say, it clashes okay, has 3 attack weight (unlike the others) and refunds its SP cost, how is it ass? To be fair though he may be referencing Threadspin 2, which might not refund as much.
@@iamraginghard4486 that's murder on the warp train express. specifically referring to learning about W corps singularity through the random lines the IDs say
They mention it in the prologue before your first gacha roll as well for the tutorial, having burned through dante's notes after unlocking it recently I quite like how a lot of the mechanical stuff you do in game are actually a thing. As far as I can tell the only thing that isn't cannon is the fights since they constantly make reference to the sinners getting got lmao
You know I think some of canto 6/7 would be kind of a problem, specifically: Canto 6 -Heathcliff? can be kind of rough without winning early clashes to accumulate some sanity as he does give himself sp really quickly and his skills gets a bit relentless later on -Nelly have some scary clashes and a forced stagger mechanic. Also that evade might caught you off guard like the first run. Probably won't be much of a problem though... Canto 7 -The barber gets really scary if you can't kill her fast enough and she starts using her high rolling aoe unbreakable skills -Dulcinea is...Dulcinea. Arguably even worse for this team as it lacks healing and low damage means wedging thorns will make you take even more damage -Rose hunter : not killing the lasso in one turn makes rupture stack up really quickly -Trio : I don't know tbh. Barber still uses her aoe unbreakable skill down the line but it was barely a problem compared to her going solo -Sancho : again, I am not sure about it. The only scary thing is possibly the phase change skills rolling really high I feel ? -Quixote : you literally can't use base Don... Also it's a notorious fight for a reason So yeah, I think things will get more interesting down the line, keep it up !
6 is definitely something I'm worried about, specifically the problem you mentioned about Nelly, Binds Technique is a hell of a DPS check and I'm not particularly sure if the Base Sinners can get over it. I'm not exactly sure how we'll fare against either of the Heathcliffs either, but hopefully it's enough to pull through. Then yeah, Canto 7 terrifies me. It'll definitely be interesting to see what the Base IDs can pull off. But we'll see when we get there!
@@coopsbomb4 Erlking is more of less the same as Other Heathcliff haha. Canto 7's difficulty definitely comes from the 2 bosses before the dungeon. After that, it's debatable.
@@coopsbomb4Dulci is not particularly horrendous, the fight gives a ton of ego resources and most attacks are not particularly nasty. Barber is also not too bad. Bloodfiend trio is way easier than it seems, managed to first try clear it in 11 turn with base only.
There's already at least one streamer (DemoonicWolf) who has already done this entire challenge up to the start of Canto 7, and I have seen other channels do Canto 7 itself (barring the mandatory loaner segment the game provides for) separately. So it's DEFINITELY possible, 100%, it purely comes down to whether Coops is capable of it or not.
Excellent video if not for one glaring flaw - you don't seem to be aware that Offense/Defense Level give/lose clash power for every 3 value, not one for one. Additionally, Evade never loses power, and enemies never get Offense Level bonuses to their attacks based on the level differense for Evade. Meaning - Evade rolls its pure coin against pure enemy skill.
I was wondering how Ryoshu could roll a 16 on her skill 3 when it rolls 14 max (technically 15). She is still really good for damage. I love [combat start] gain 2 slash damage up.
One of the things I love about Limbus Company is that every character is designed to be used. Even if 2 star IDs aren't the strongest, they're still VERY useable and some of them are even really strong! Sometimes I'll even give my 2 star IDs the first skill slots so they can get the spotlight they deserve, and some of them are SURPRISINGLY good when you do that. Like the Zwei units (not Zwei South Sinclair) for example.
Actually, the dialogue sometimes reference the ID tech the sinners use. I forgot when, but there were some moments where some people mentioned it, and then just goes "eh, probably company secret"
It was actually brought up in the most recent canto. The sinners don't don IDs when they're in presence of other people because they need to keep that kind of technology a secret.
I did a refight of dulci with only base id and ego and holyshit that was much tougher than i remember. Probably the hardest fight in retrospect. Even more annoying without durante. Albeit using a full team of 12 level 50 and U4 base IDs would allow for some much appreciated leniency.
Not really, base sinner just EXTRA SUCK Against bloodfiends Weak to lust, 4 sinners, weak to gluttony 4 sinners, weak to wrath 3 sinners And resistances arent better when concidering enemy weaknesses. Anithing in this fight (except blood bags) will stagger you on clash lose, or kill you, don especially will be decimated by the hunters The worst is the enemy SP generation, gotta focus on the bloodfiend and live blood bags alive. Next problem is healing, withouth persuance or fluid sack basicly imposible, or doable will sacrificing 6+ sinners Dungeon is so much easier tho.
As someone who only use base sinners but not ego, nicolina and Matt are the hardest fight due to 0 ego resources and sanity snowballing, while nicolina striaght up snow balls unless you win every clash and evade the unclashables, which means mersault who cant evade is an issue when he's there for chains of others.
Hello hello I beated the whole game with only Base IDs, although i did use EGO, mainly for Mersault because boy Pursuance has helped me a lot. Oh, also Outis with Ivory Queen
@SFKOLD okay, here we go. Ricardo (because i didn't know how he worked), Clam, Trio (same reason as Ricardo), Matt, Heathcliff? and Dulcinea. The canto 7 final boss isn't that dificult because... Well, Don can't die and you can go solo after everyone is dead. The easiest fight was duel Carmille by far
@@evandropaschoalini5940 The hardest fight for me was the 18 carmilla fiends fight. Took me more than 25 tries. Paula and camille took 7 tries, and i got hella lucky on the last one. Constant unavoidable true hp% damage every turn is absolute bullshit when no healing or great AoE ego.
Sorry I just realized something big: You **massively** misinterpreted the numbers / mechanics for defense skills! Having a + or - defense level is not going to lop numbers off like you think it is, Don's Evade floor is NOT 0 for example. The only impact it will have is small adjustments to damage taken and maybe, with very large differences, cause a numbers interaction when specifically going Defense Vs. Clashable Defense.
Yeah that was a very large mistake on my behalf, I was incredibly mistaken about Offensive and Defensive levels as a whole which has (thankfully) been cleared up now. Going forward I'll remedy that mistake, thank you for pointing it out!
it should however be noted that defense-offense level difference can raise the value of a defensive skill in the same vein as offense level in clashing (you can see this directly by having a high level ID use their defensive in the first exp lux, for example)
I took on this challenge as well. faust and ryoshu and mersault are the most valuable base ids in my opinion. the only fight I'm not sure is possible is don quixote because technically you can slot don in the 12th slot and umm just don't deal with it. I've done all the other fights but this one fight is probably impossible
As the person who actually beaten 90% (RR1-3 and previous mds are not beaten)of the game with base ids and ego only. It's not possible cuz Last fight in Canto 7 prevents you from using base Don, although you could probably make Don last deployed in backup, so it can be like semi true base ids only
The only battles you might get stuck at are Bamboo Hatted Kim and 6-34. The rest shouldn't be much of a pushover, besides some Canto 7 fights being endurance battles
Yeah I did think about that problem after beating Canto 7, and sadly Don has to be part of the initial 6 lineup and is immortal like Ishmael is for Ricardo until every other Sinner is dead. Although there are two options I've thought of that I'll go into more when I get to that part of the game: 1. Use a Don that's equivalent to Base Don (I know for a fact Shi Don can solo Don Quixote seeing as that's how I beat him the first time around, and Shi Don has quite a lot of focus on Haste application like Base Don does) 2. Wait for a Sancho/Don Quixote Don Quixote ID to release seeing as that's the closest to what Base Don is at that moment in time I prefer the first for the challenge of it, but I may do both just to see the differences. Sancho Don may actually be harder if she doesn't end up getting an Evade Skill for her defensive skill
@@patapon3rules first of all, Kim is simply a struggle where you might need to do several resets Second of all, you would still need to get lucky enough for evade to hit heads several times Third of all, she can't fuel her own ego(lust and wrath required)
@@Bruhgaming-bz2si That's my bad. I assumed you were referring to Event Dungeon Kim. Regular Kim should be easy enough though. Event Kim is significantly buffed compared to his outside dungeon version and you already start at 45 SP on that one. I just cleared him with 2 slots on Ryoshu and everyone else guarding or countering who was resistant to either slash, sloth or pride. When I was doing my no pull + no support run. I just used Ryoshu + Shi Ish + Rodion + Sinclair with those 3 really just being meatbags for Ryoshu to scale up. You can easily drop Shi Ish for the pure baseD ID run.
Hey im a base Sinner/EGO player. I say it is possible to beat it all canto using it currently. Idk if future canto will be more harder. So far PM recommended lvl have been correct at the right lvl but some say it need lvl 48 and next stage it will be lvl 45. It a Normal encounter so it not as bad. Anyways good luck on your journey to beat them all, you will understand some deep mech hidden in this game.
Where are you getting some of your clash numbers for these characters? Meursault S1 clashes at 8??? Outis S1 Clashes at 12??? Are you confusing Offense Level for Clash Power? And in either case, when gaining Clash Power because of the difference between your Offense Level and the enemy's Defense Level, Clash Power only goes up. Clash Power can never go _down_ from Offense Level being less than the target's Defense Level, only from negative status effects or some kind of skill effect like Seven Outis's skills making the enemy have -2 Clash Power. If this wasn't the case, Mirror Dungeon Hard would be physically impossible when the enemies regularly end up with 60 Defense Level. For those who don't know, you gain 1 Clash Power for every 3 Offense Level over your enemy's Defense Level. So if your Offense Level is 12, and the enemy's Defense Level is 9, you gain 1 Clash Power. 12 - 9 = 3
I was informed that Offence Level didn’t work like I thought it did. Originally I thought that for every difference in Offence Level one power would be given to the person with the higher level, but I was recently informed that it’s actually every 3 difference. I’ve fixed the mistake for the future, but for now the values I state are horribly off. Base Meursault is actually a great Base ID other than the Speed.
@coopsbomb4 Yeah, learning these things can be confusing sometimes. If it makes you feel better, I've been playing since launch and I just learned what "Offset" means. (When you have a defense skill target an enemy defense skill, it'll cancel both defense skills. However, it won't cancel counters. It works both ways however, you can have one of your side's counters cancel an enemy defense skill free of charge.)
You gain clash power by 3 diference is BOTH offense level Defense is only use in defense skills and damage calculation. Thus why meurasault could do an 11, but with lower offense the enemy gets 1-2 power making it a 9 effectivly. Playing underelevel has its adventages for SP gain, but is always preferable to be at 1 level under the enemy.
@@ericquiabazza2608 You are misinformed. It is Offense Level vs Defense Level. It works both ways as the enemy's Offense Level goes against YOUR Defense Level. This is why 00 tank IDs like Zwei Faust can still clash against enemies in spite of a negative Offense Level, she has good Defense Level and applies more to herself and allies. If it was solely based off of Offense Level, then anything that doesn't have high Offense Level wouldn't be worth using.
You are actually a little incorrect: When clashing against an offensive skill with an offensive skill, it will COMPARE OFFENSE LEVELS. Then, whichever side has a higher offense level will gain 1 clash power for every 3 difference. Both sides can benefit from this, which is why some enemies will suddenly clash 30 at the end of a dungeon (i had casetti min roll like 27 not too long ago because i made a few mistakes and he ended up with 97 offense level from his buffs). While the actual clash power will never go DOWN down, the enemy's power can actually go up from this. The only exception for this power gain is when an offensive skill is attacking a defensive skill, the offensive side can NEVER gain power (but the defensive side still can!). The most important thing is that for clash power gain, SKILL LEVELS are used. The only time defense level (innate) is used is when taking damage, where it alters the amount of damage received (logarithmic with a limit of 100% alteration, see "Limbus Company damage formula".)
As a heads up, the audio on this video is VERY low. I usually hover around 20 volume on my pc and can hear things just fine with that, but I ended up needing to go all the way to 50 in order to properly hear everything.
I did this while I was going through the game (started towards the end of season 4) and it honestly wasn't that bad until Ricardo where I got my ass BEAT and used a support red mist Ryoshu and base Ish as some kind of tank. After that I started using red mist Ryoshu as a crutch when I couldn't beat a boss and like, I know she's a good ID but just the difference she made alone was insane. After that I started using Ryoshu a lot and the only really notable fight was the second encounter with Bamboo hatted Kim where I had to use bleed ego gifts and prayed my sinners would apply enough so he would deal with himself. Finally the boss that made me level my first IDs was Dulcinea. It's kinda funnt because the only reason I had so much trouble with her was because I completely misread what her status effects did and kept getting my sinners killed to her blooming thorn. Though now I am having fun messing around with the IDs with my favorites being Zwei Ish and the bloodfiend IDs with them being uptie 4.
I thought they do acknowledge that they do fight using the ID system, it's just that they will completely forgot ever doing it. iirc in the W corp side ep
did you just like. entirely miss that land of illusion hong lu refunds the sanity entirely after its use (The order of events is: clashes at 45 sanity (assuming you start there), spends 15 SP [Before Attack] (after the clash, before doing the damage roll), then heals 15 sp [After Attack].) This means that the damage roll is the only thing ever dropped to 80%, and even then it won't get lower at all. For a base E.G.O., it is quite good *other* than the fact that to fuel it i have to field yisang (my personal least favorite due to his rolls) and gregor (he's ok but i need to use a skill 1.)
However in this case the damage roll is the only thing that’s important here seeing as on both occasions we need to hit that maximum 25 damage to stagger/kill the enemies. The SP doesn’t permanently go down yeah, but it goes down enough to become a major problem
I'll be doing this too. Made a new account where I'm not allowed to use any alternate IDs, but I can spend Lunacy to get shards for the sake of UT4ing the Base IDs and Base EGOs. What are you going to do about the.... Canto 7 boss issue? I'm unsure what the ruling should be for that.
I'll deal with it when I get to it, but currently I have two differing thoughts about it, I'll either: - Try to find the closest Don to Base Don (likely Shi Don seeing as they've got a lot of Haste application like Base Don) - Use the special Don seeing as that is the closest to what Don would be at that point. I think for a purist the challenge is over at that point, but personally I feel either of those two options resolve the issue nicely.
@@coopsbomb4 I think I won't be doing the level recommendations namely due to the sinners needing every bit of offense and defense level up they can manage.
The only feedback i can think of is to actually show the boss fights, even if you have to speed them up a bit, or at least show the bosses dying. We never got to ser you beat pequod trio or the other bosses of canto 5 except ricardo.
I have almost cleared every fight with base sinners and ego, the hardest fight by far is [Try to guess the fight]. That fight took more than 25 tries..... To put into context, rr3 pequod trio took three attempts.
The beast MF gainst SP likes its free, heathcliff is a liability, and gaining ego resources for SP before gettibg decimated by turn 5 is a nightmare. Also, he does blunt-pierce damage, with bleed-fragile aplication, NO TANK will survive that. Meurasault can guard the whole fight, ignoring the bleed, yet the fragile brakes him in half
Until canto 5 is doable with even underlevel sinners aroun 3 levels under AFTER is when PM shenanigans begin MAX LEVEL ENEMIES WITH +5 OFFENSE LEVEL, making them efectivly 3-5 levels above the max. Would be until finish canto 6, time killing time is surprisingly easy, maybe to acojnt on using 3 sinners. Ps: the Beast will HUNT YOUR NIGHTMARES, Not Matt, not the dog, the BEAST. This trully show how Ego gathering in Dungeons is what enable base sinners runs to even be viable.
29:53 ok, HOW!? Quequec shield wasnt a treath!? WHAT!? Her counter will demolish your sinner, as is the main issue, getting enough damage to stop the guard. Meurasault can survive 2 turns of Ahab crazy harpoon, but not much more. How much you ego spam? That fight took me 8 tries Ricardo took 6, but i didnt know ishmael was inmortal and just reach the second treshold, pretty hard because base sinner damage SUCK, Tremor burst come in clutch PS: for the pearl use emiter, slime is weak to pride if i am not mistaken, AoE sanity gain, everythin you need, really emiter is preferable over land of illusion, land has this "i am sp positive at turn end" so use it to give hong lu Free SP turn 1 And use ishmael Snagharpoon, she is a clashe-interceptor, once she gets 30 SP goin she wont stop wining, also a decent tank.
Honestly, I didn't find her counter to be an issue at all. Her shield only lasted two EGO moves and that was already enough to end the Hunt phase. Meursault quite literally only had to survive one turn of being hunted which he did quite easily thanks to me having used one of the two stated Chains uses on her prior. As for other general strategy, I just killed Starbuck before his insane amount of attacks could become an issue, then gunned down Ahab before she stood a chance of retaliation. In the future I'll focus more on fights that should pose a difficulty but don't just to go over my general strategy, at the time of writing the script I was far too shocked by just how easy the Trio was
I'm honestly displeased with how much hate Hong Lu's base ego gets, like why are people so much against a net positive SP ego that applies sinking to (often) multiple targets. Sure, it's not that great at clashing and gloom is a valuable ego resource, but it's almost never a bad move to use it, even if onesided. It's so unfortunate, great video though, very nice
Personally the thing that made me hate Hong Lu’s Base EGO is how expensive it is for not a lot. It costs the same amount as Representation Emitter for example, which shows you that PM really thought that Attack Weight was more powerful than it was, and although R.E. has the added benefit of healing the SP of your Sinners, Land of Illusion really doesn’t do that much other than inflict some Sinking. It’s a mediocre EGO, but when you need it to not die horribly that mediocrity quickly becomes a glaring issue
@@coopsbomb4 Its biggest upside, though, is that it effectively doesn't cost *any* sp to use, while Rep emmiter still leaves faust at a net -8 SP at u4 (which can be catastrophic considering her already eh rolls?
It's just not viable to use it outside of story dungeons and regular fights. There are 2 units that can feasibly feed it which are gregor and yisang. Yisang with a proper team eventually just only starts spamming crows eye view. Gregor is benched. Base Egos are important considerations, but overall Hong lu just doesn't have a good time in bosses if you only bring him for his ego. Hong Lu himself is insane tho.
@ However, in the moment between use and the end of the attack (where damage is calculated) that’s not refunded. And seeing as what we’re using it for is specifically it’s damage, that’s why it’s problematic
@@coopsbomb4 yeah thats just an unfortunate cost all egos bear, but i was specifically referring to you saying how subsequent uses would have a 15% lower heads roll. hong lu goes back to 45 sp after the attack lands.
@BigFellaDj I was meaning specifically for damage, and the reason that the chance gets lower is due to having to hit that same 80% chance over and over. Sorry if I misspoke there!
@@coopsbomb4 Sweet definitely subscribed. The later boss fights reminded me of some of the library of ruina No key page strategy's. Alot of the time if you go into the fights with an actual stratagy its not to hard. Good luck with Wild hunt and the sinking spam. also consider Yi sang ego is a mini chains of others so it might be worth using with his fast speed?
![A (Staggering) Overview of Tremor [Limbus Company]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/5BBL0bXe_mg/mqdefault.jpg)
![An Extensive Guide to Charge [Limbus Company]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/yemZAS3Pfa8/mqdefault.jpg)
I can’t say how insanely happy I am to see this video do so well. And, due to this success, I’ve decided to set up a Discord server!
If you’d like to join, here’s the link: discord.gg/f24MTV2WgN
I’ll be posting video announcements for when they come out, and it’s hopefully a good place for everyone to come and chat, so hopefully I’ll see you there!
Great!
bro forgot that Land Of Illusion heals hong lu's sp by 15 after attack
I was gonna say, it clashes okay, has 3 attack weight (unlike the others) and refunds its SP cost, how is it ass? To be fair though he may be referencing Threadspin 2, which might not refund as much.
Only downside is the 5 gloom cost tbh. Bit of an expensive EGO. Still far from bad though..
@Deasty yeah 5 glooms a lot but the sp refund is great
Canto 7 directly references sinners becoming their IDs during the fanghunt fight
pretty sure they also directly mention this in one of the extra stories
@@iamraginghard4486 that's murder on the warp train express. specifically referring to learning about W corps singularity through the random lines the IDs say
@@aaronoosterbeek2461it's also mentioned when Faust says "Dante, prepare the ID cards"
They are using the id card to become another Sinner that is completely same
They mention it in the prologue before your first gacha roll as well for the tutorial, having burned through dante's notes after unlocking it recently I quite like how a lot of the mechanical stuff you do in game are actually a thing.
As far as I can tell the only thing that isn't cannon is the fights since they constantly make reference to the sinners getting got lmao
WERE MAKING IT OUTTA THE BUS WITH THIS ONE
You know I think some of canto 6/7 would be kind of a problem, specifically:
Canto 6
-Heathcliff? can be kind of rough without winning early clashes to accumulate some sanity as he does give himself sp really quickly and his skills gets a bit relentless later on
-Nelly have some scary clashes and a forced stagger mechanic. Also that evade might caught you off guard like the first run. Probably won't be much of a problem though...
Canto 7
-The barber gets really scary if you can't kill her fast enough and she starts using her high rolling aoe unbreakable skills
-Dulcinea is...Dulcinea. Arguably even worse for this team as it lacks healing and low damage means wedging thorns will make you take even more damage
-Rose hunter : not killing the lasso in one turn makes rupture stack up really quickly
-Trio : I don't know tbh. Barber still uses her aoe unbreakable skill down the line but it was barely a problem compared to her going solo
-Sancho : again, I am not sure about it. The only scary thing is possibly the phase change skills rolling really high I feel ?
-Quixote : you literally can't use base Don... Also it's a notorious fight for a reason
So yeah, I think things will get more interesting down the line, keep it up !
6 is definitely something I'm worried about, specifically the problem you mentioned about Nelly, Binds Technique is a hell of a DPS check and I'm not particularly sure if the Base Sinners can get over it. I'm not exactly sure how we'll fare against either of the Heathcliffs either, but hopefully it's enough to pull through.
Then yeah, Canto 7 terrifies me. It'll definitely be interesting to see what the Base IDs can pull off. But we'll see when we get there!
@@coopsbomb4 Erlking is more of less the same as Other Heathcliff haha.
Canto 7's difficulty definitely comes from the 2 bosses before the dungeon. After that, it's debatable.
@@JazzTheOne That's reassuring to hear. And yeah, Dulciana is definitely going to pose some serious threat
@@coopsbomb4Dulci is not particularly horrendous, the fight gives a ton of ego resources and most attacks are not particularly nasty. Barber is also not too bad. Bloodfiend trio is way easier than it seems, managed to first try clear it in 11 turn with base only.
There's already at least one streamer (DemoonicWolf) who has already done this entire challenge up to the start of Canto 7, and I have seen other channels do Canto 7 itself (barring the mandatory loaner segment the game provides for) separately. So it's DEFINITELY possible, 100%, it purely comes down to whether Coops is capable of it or not.
Excellent video if not for one glaring flaw - you don't seem to be aware that Offense/Defense Level give/lose clash power for every 3 value, not one for one.
Additionally, Evade never loses power, and enemies never get Offense Level bonuses to their attacks based on the level differense for Evade. Meaning - Evade rolls its pure coin against pure enemy skill.
Oh wow, yeah I didn't know that at all. That's really useful to know for the future, thank you!
I was wondering how Ryoshu could roll a 16 on her skill 3 when it rolls 14 max (technically 15). She is still really good for damage. I love [combat start] gain 2 slash damage up.
The reason I don't play base ID because I love the 2 and 3 star design and not because they suck!
One of the things I love about Limbus Company is that every character is designed to be used. Even if 2 star IDs aren't the strongest, they're still VERY useable and some of them are even really strong! Sometimes I'll even give my 2 star IDs the first skill slots so they can get the spotlight they deserve, and some of them are SURPRISINGLY good when you do that. Like the Zwei units (not Zwei South Sinclair) for example.
@@senpyrothewizard8172mexinclair clashing lower than base
@@diaamooond i said they're useable, not necessarily the best. His support passive is amazing, and his dodge is great tho.
@@senpyrothewizard8172 i cant read can you repeat that
@@senpyrothewizard8172 mexin carried me through the first 3 chapter when the game came out
21:07 a fine red WHAT!!
Great video, just a correction, Land of Illusion does refund the 15 SP after the attack
This was very enjoyable and I’m looking forward to part 2!
@@HenryWallace-h7g Thank you! It’s actually quite close to release already (I may be able to get it done by Christmas in fact)
Actually, the dialogue sometimes reference the ID tech the sinners use. I forgot when, but there were some moments where some people mentioned it, and then just goes "eh, probably company secret"
It was actually brought up in the most recent canto. The sinners don't don IDs when they're in presence of other people because they need to keep that kind of technology a secret.
I played with base ids and base egos from canton 1-5 until I got stuck on ricardo and had to use my other ids
21:08 RED MIST REAL???
I did a refight of dulci with only base id and ego and holyshit that was much tougher than i remember. Probably the hardest fight in retrospect. Even more annoying without durante. Albeit using a full team of 12 level 50 and U4 base IDs would allow for some much appreciated leniency.
Not really, base sinner just EXTRA SUCK Against bloodfiends
Weak to lust, 4 sinners, weak to gluttony 4 sinners, weak to wrath 3 sinners
And resistances arent better when concidering enemy weaknesses.
Anithing in this fight (except blood bags) will stagger you on clash lose, or kill you, don especially will be decimated by the hunters
The worst is the enemy SP generation, gotta focus on the bloodfiend and live blood bags alive.
Next problem is healing, withouth persuance or fluid sack basicly imposible, or doable will sacrificing 6+ sinners
Dungeon is so much easier tho.
14:05 tipical base ryoshu moment
She either wins EVERY Clash or loses EVERY clash, gets staggered and dies
Cant wait to see more parts to this series!
I would love to see more of this.
As someone who only use base sinners but not ego, nicolina and Matt are the hardest fight due to 0 ego resources and sanity snowballing, while nicolina striaght up snow balls unless you win every clash and evade the unclashables, which means mersault who cant evade is an issue when he's there for chains of others.
Hello hello
I beated the whole game with only Base IDs, although i did use EGO, mainly for Mersault because boy Pursuance has helped me a lot. Oh, also Outis with Ivory Queen
What fights were the most difficult in your opinion?
@SFKOLD okay, here we go. Ricardo (because i didn't know how he worked), Clam, Trio (same reason as Ricardo), Matt, Heathcliff? and Dulcinea. The canto 7 final boss isn't that dificult because... Well, Don can't die and you can go solo after everyone is dead.
The easiest fight was duel Carmille by far
@@evandropaschoalini5940 The hardest fight for me was the 18 carmilla fiends fight. Took me more than 25 tries. Paula and camille took 7 tries, and i got hella lucky on the last one. Constant unavoidable true hp% damage every turn is absolute bullshit when no healing or great AoE ego.
@@SFKOLD oh, yeah, those are nasty, i was lucky i didn't lose a lot of hp in the fights before
if i had a penny for every limbus challenge runs where Ambling Pearl is a twist villain in the narrative i'd have 2 pennies, which isnt a lot, but...
“Damn, that’s pretty easy”
Kim: I am not gonna sugarcoat it, “have +10 clash power if shield isn’t depleted”
Good luck on Canto 6!
Sorry I just realized something big: You **massively** misinterpreted the numbers / mechanics for defense skills! Having a + or - defense level is not going to lop numbers off like you think it is, Don's Evade floor is NOT 0 for example. The only impact it will have is small adjustments to damage taken and maybe, with very large differences, cause a numbers interaction when specifically going Defense Vs. Clashable Defense.
Yeah that was a very large mistake on my behalf, I was incredibly mistaken about Offensive and Defensive levels as a whole which has (thankfully) been cleared up now. Going forward I'll remedy that mistake, thank you for pointing it out!
it should however be noted that defense-offense level difference can raise the value of a defensive skill in the same vein as offense level in clashing (you can see this directly by having a high level ID use their defensive in the first exp lux, for example)
I took on this challenge as well. faust and ryoshu and mersault are the most valuable base ids in my opinion. the only fight I'm not sure is possible is don quixote because technically you can slot don in the 12th slot and umm just don't deal with it. I've done all the other fights but this one fight is probably impossible
As the person who actually beaten 90% (RR1-3 and previous mds are not beaten)of the game with base ids and ego only. It's not possible cuz
Last fight in Canto 7 prevents you from using base Don, although you could probably make Don last deployed in backup, so it can be like semi true base ids only
The only battles you might get stuck at are Bamboo Hatted Kim and 6-34. The rest shouldn't be much of a pushover, besides some Canto 7 fights being endurance battles
Yeah I did think about that problem after beating Canto 7, and sadly Don has to be part of the initial 6 lineup and is immortal like Ishmael is for Ricardo until every other Sinner is dead. Although there are two options I've thought of that I'll go into more when I get to that part of the game:
1. Use a Don that's equivalent to Base Don (I know for a fact Shi Don can solo Don Quixote seeing as that's how I beat him the first time around, and Shi Don has quite a lot of focus on Haste application like Base Don does)
2. Wait for a Sancho/Don Quixote Don Quixote ID to release seeing as that's the closest to what Base Don is at that moment in time
I prefer the first for the challenge of it, but I may do both just to see the differences. Sancho Don may actually be harder if she doesn't end up getting an Evade Skill for her defensive skill
@Bruhgaming-bz2si the solution for Kim is a max level ryoshu with TS4 base ego. She can actually solo him.
@@patapon3rules first of all, Kim is simply a struggle where you might need to do several resets
Second of all, you would still need to get lucky enough for evade to hit heads several times
Third of all, she can't fuel her own ego(lust and wrath required)
@@Bruhgaming-bz2si That's my bad. I assumed you were referring to Event Dungeon Kim.
Regular Kim should be easy enough though.
Event Kim is significantly buffed compared to his outside dungeon version and you already start at 45 SP on that one. I just cleared him with 2 slots on Ryoshu and everyone else guarding or countering who was resistant to either slash, sloth or pride.
When I was doing my no pull + no support run. I just used Ryoshu + Shi Ish + Rodion + Sinclair with those 3 really just being meatbags for Ryoshu to scale up. You can easily drop Shi Ish for the pure baseD ID run.
Hey im a base Sinner/EGO player.
I say it is possible to beat it all canto using it currently.
Idk if future canto will be more harder.
So far PM recommended lvl have been correct at the right lvl but some say it need lvl 48 and next stage it will be lvl 45. It a Normal encounter so it not as bad.
Anyways good luck on your journey to beat them all, you will understand some deep mech hidden in this game.
A youtuber named DemoonicWolf be like
Where are you getting some of your clash numbers for these characters? Meursault S1 clashes at 8??? Outis S1 Clashes at 12??? Are you confusing Offense Level for Clash Power? And in either case, when gaining Clash Power because of the difference between your Offense Level and the enemy's Defense Level, Clash Power only goes up. Clash Power can never go _down_ from Offense Level being less than the target's Defense Level, only from negative status effects or some kind of skill effect like Seven Outis's skills making the enemy have -2 Clash Power. If this wasn't the case, Mirror Dungeon Hard would be physically impossible when the enemies regularly end up with 60 Defense Level.
For those who don't know, you gain 1 Clash Power for every 3 Offense Level over your enemy's Defense Level. So if your Offense Level is 12, and the enemy's Defense Level is 9, you gain 1 Clash Power. 12 - 9 = 3
I was informed that Offence Level didn’t work like I thought it did. Originally I thought that for every difference in Offence Level one power would be given to the person with the higher level, but I was recently informed that it’s actually every 3 difference.
I’ve fixed the mistake for the future, but for now the values I state are horribly off. Base Meursault is actually a great Base ID other than the Speed.
@coopsbomb4 Yeah, learning these things can be confusing sometimes. If it makes you feel better, I've been playing since launch and I just learned what "Offset" means. (When you have a defense skill target an enemy defense skill, it'll cancel both defense skills. However, it won't cancel counters. It works both ways however, you can have one of your side's counters cancel an enemy defense skill free of charge.)
You gain clash power by 3 diference is BOTH offense level
Defense is only use in defense skills and damage calculation.
Thus why meurasault could do an 11, but with lower offense the enemy gets 1-2 power making it a 9 effectivly.
Playing underelevel has its adventages for SP gain, but is always preferable to be at 1 level under the enemy.
@@ericquiabazza2608 You are misinformed. It is Offense Level vs Defense Level. It works both ways as the enemy's Offense Level goes against YOUR Defense Level. This is why 00 tank IDs like Zwei Faust can still clash against enemies in spite of a negative Offense Level, she has good Defense Level and applies more to herself and allies. If it was solely based off of Offense Level, then anything that doesn't have high Offense Level wouldn't be worth using.
You are actually a little incorrect:
When clashing against an offensive skill with an offensive skill, it will COMPARE OFFENSE LEVELS. Then, whichever side has a higher offense level will gain 1 clash power for every 3 difference. Both sides can benefit from this, which is why some enemies will suddenly clash 30 at the end of a dungeon (i had casetti min roll like 27 not too long ago because i made a few mistakes and he ended up with 97 offense level from his buffs). While the actual clash power will never go DOWN down, the enemy's power can actually go up from this. The only exception for this power gain is when an offensive skill is attacking a defensive skill, the offensive side can NEVER gain power (but the defensive side still can!).
The most important thing is that for clash power gain, SKILL LEVELS are used. The only time defense level (innate) is used is when taking damage, where it alters the amount of damage received (logarithmic with a limit of 100% alteration, see "Limbus Company damage formula".)
I think adding text when you describe each of the skill would be a good idea
Working on going more in-depth in future episodes, hopefully the next video should have better quality in that context
Yes, reason?
please watch Demoonicwolf’s playthrough of limbus.
But....did the odyssey have a purpose....
The answer is yes i guess
Since i beat canto 6 and canto 7 bosses with only base id/ego
So yeah,i think is doable
Going for a base id run is cool and all but BL meursault claiming every balls ( both existent and non-existent ) with his counter is funny to me
As a heads up, the audio on this video is VERY low. I usually hover around 20 volume on my pc and can hear things just fine with that, but I ended up needing to go all the way to 50 in order to properly hear everything.
Yeah, I’ve taken it into account for the future. Hopefully it’ll be better next time!
I did this while I was going through the game (started towards the end of season 4) and it honestly wasn't that bad until Ricardo where I got my ass BEAT and used a support red mist Ryoshu and base Ish as some kind of tank.
After that I started using red mist Ryoshu as a crutch when I couldn't beat a boss and like, I know she's a good ID but just the difference she made alone was insane.
After that I started using Ryoshu a lot and the only really notable fight was the second encounter with Bamboo hatted Kim where I had to use bleed ego gifts and prayed my sinners would apply enough so he would deal with himself.
Finally the boss that made me level my first IDs was Dulcinea. It's kinda funnt because the only reason I had so much trouble with her was because I completely misread what her status effects did and kept getting my sinners killed to her blooming thorn. Though now I am having fun messing around with the IDs with my favorites being Zwei Ish and the bloodfiend IDs with them being uptie 4.
I thought they do acknowledge that they do fight using the ID system, it's just that they will completely forgot ever doing it. iirc in the W corp side ep
did you just like. entirely miss that land of illusion hong lu refunds the sanity entirely after its use (The order of events is: clashes at 45 sanity (assuming you start there), spends 15 SP [Before Attack] (after the clash, before doing the damage roll), then heals 15 sp [After Attack].) This means that the damage roll is the only thing ever dropped to 80%, and even then it won't get lower at all. For a base E.G.O., it is quite good *other* than the fact that to fuel it i have to field yisang (my personal least favorite due to his rolls) and gregor (he's ok but i need to use a skill 1.)
However in this case the damage roll is the only thing that’s important here seeing as on both occasions we need to hit that maximum 25 damage to stagger/kill the enemies.
The SP doesn’t permanently go down yeah, but it goes down enough to become a major problem
I'll be doing this too. Made a new account where I'm not allowed to use any alternate IDs, but I can spend Lunacy to get shards for the sake of UT4ing the Base IDs and Base EGOs.
What are you going to do about the.... Canto 7 boss issue? I'm unsure what the ruling should be for that.
I'll deal with it when I get to it, but currently I have two differing thoughts about it, I'll either:
- Try to find the closest Don to Base Don (likely Shi Don seeing as they've got a lot of Haste application like Base Don)
- Use the special Don seeing as that is the closest to what Don would be at that point.
I think for a purist the challenge is over at that point, but personally I feel either of those two options resolve the issue nicely.
@@coopsbomb4 I think I won't be doing the level recommendations namely due to the sinners needing every bit of offense and defense level up they can manage.
The only feedback i can think of is to actually show the boss fights, even if you have to speed them up a bit, or at least show the bosses dying. We never got to ser you beat pequod trio or the other bosses of canto 5 except ricardo.
I'll definitely do that next time, thank you for the feedback!
I have almost cleared every fight with base sinners and ego, the hardest fight by far is [Try to guess the fight]. That fight took more than 25 tries..... To put into context, rr3 pequod trio took three attempts.
Matt
@ Wrong
Dulcinea
@@Test-rv8us Its the 18 carmilla fiends node in canto VII dungeon.
The beast
MF gainst SP likes its free, heathcliff is a liability, and gaining ego resources for SP before gettibg decimated by turn 5 is a nightmare.
Also, he does blunt-pierce damage, with bleed-fragile aplication, NO TANK will survive that.
Meurasault can guard the whole fight, ignoring the bleed, yet the fragile brakes him in half
Canto vii final boss fight 😔
i do like the vid itself but dang its quiet as hell
Until canto 5 is doable with even underlevel sinners aroun 3 levels under
AFTER is when PM shenanigans begin
MAX LEVEL ENEMIES WITH +5 OFFENSE LEVEL, making them efectivly 3-5 levels above the max.
Would be until finish canto 6, time killing time is surprisingly easy, maybe to acojnt on using 3 sinners.
Ps: the Beast will HUNT YOUR NIGHTMARES, Not Matt, not the dog, the BEAST.
This trully show how Ego gathering in Dungeons is what enable base sinners runs to even be viable.
red text comments blended in a bit, but other than that and mic, noice
29:53 ok, HOW!?
Quequec shield wasnt a treath!? WHAT!?
Her counter will demolish your sinner, as is the main issue, getting enough damage to stop the guard.
Meurasault can survive 2 turns of Ahab crazy harpoon, but not much more.
How much you ego spam?
That fight took me 8 tries
Ricardo took 6, but i didnt know ishmael was inmortal and just reach the second treshold, pretty hard because base sinner damage SUCK, Tremor burst come in clutch
PS: for the pearl use emiter, slime is weak to pride if i am not mistaken, AoE sanity gain, everythin you need, really emiter is preferable over land of illusion, land has this "i am sp positive at turn end" so use it to give hong lu Free SP turn 1
And use ishmael Snagharpoon, she is a clashe-interceptor, once she gets 30 SP goin she wont stop wining, also a decent tank.
Honestly, I didn't find her counter to be an issue at all. Her shield only lasted two EGO moves and that was already enough to end the Hunt phase. Meursault quite literally only had to survive one turn of being hunted which he did quite easily thanks to me having used one of the two stated Chains uses on her prior.
As for other general strategy, I just killed Starbuck before his insane amount of attacks could become an issue, then gunned down Ahab before she stood a chance of retaliation. In the future I'll focus more on fights that should pose a difficulty but don't just to go over my general strategy, at the time of writing the script I was far too shocked by just how easy the Trio was
Note,outis skill 1 only roll 9 skill 2 only roll 13
Not 12 and 16
Increase volume next time please
The volume of the whole video so low i still barely can heard anything on my phone
Definitely planning on it
Nice
I'm honestly displeased with how much hate Hong Lu's base ego gets, like why are people so much against a net positive SP ego that applies sinking to (often) multiple targets. Sure, it's not that great at clashing and gloom is a valuable ego resource, but it's almost never a bad move to use it, even if onesided. It's so unfortunate, great video though, very nice
Personally the thing that made me hate Hong Lu’s Base EGO is how expensive it is for not a lot. It costs the same amount as Representation Emitter for example, which shows you that PM really thought that Attack Weight was more powerful than it was, and although R.E. has the added benefit of healing the SP of your Sinners, Land of Illusion really doesn’t do that much other than inflict some Sinking. It’s a mediocre EGO, but when you need it to not die horribly that mediocrity quickly becomes a glaring issue
@@coopsbomb4 Its biggest upside, though, is that it effectively doesn't cost *any* sp to use, while Rep emmiter still leaves faust at a net -8 SP at u4 (which can be catastrophic considering her already eh rolls?
It's just not viable to use it outside of story dungeons and regular fights. There are 2 units that can feasibly feed it which are gregor and yisang.
Yisang with a proper team eventually just only starts spamming crows eye view.
Gregor is benched.
Base Egos are important considerations, but overall Hong lu just doesn't have a good time in bosses if you only bring him for his ego.
Hong Lu himself is insane tho.
9:49 doesnt lcb meursault have a 2 coin skill 1?
Yeah he does, my mistake there. Good catch
also this hong lu slander at 28:15 is insane, land of illusion heals the entire sp cost after use
@ However, in the moment between use and the end of the attack (where damage is calculated) that’s not refunded. And seeing as what we’re using it for is specifically it’s damage, that’s why it’s problematic
@@coopsbomb4 yeah thats just an unfortunate cost all egos bear, but i was specifically referring to you saying how subsequent uses would have a 15% lower heads roll. hong lu goes back to 45 sp after the attack lands.
@BigFellaDj I was meaning specifically for damage, and the reason that the chance gets lower is due to having to hit that same 80% chance over and over. Sorry if I misspoke there!
Hey great video. I would say you should improve the volume on your mic since you are very quiet. your almost as loud as the background music
Yeah, I’ve fixed that now for the future. Hopefully I should be easier to hear next time!
@@coopsbomb4 Sweet definitely subscribed. The later boss fights reminded me of some of the library of ruina No key page strategy's. Alot of the time if you go into the fights with an actual stratagy its not to hard. Good luck with Wild hunt and the sinking spam. also consider Yi sang ego is a mini chains of others so it might be worth using with his fast speed?
Thanks! Hopefully I’ll be able to get another video out soon, minor technical difficulties at the moment but hopefully nothing too serious
increase your mic volume, you are very soft
Man you didnt even really beat ricardo you stalled him out
Its 100% doable with meur and heath on 2 slots and saving 😮 2 Des Coups in each slot
28:15 95%, since sanity is taken AFTER ego use
EDIT: I WAS WRONG, DAMN IT
False. Sanity is taken after clash is won but before EGO is used.
Straight up wrong
@@Antonio-wh8lh yeah, after use
@@water5082 uploaded a clip, with hong lu base ego, clash is still 95%
@@Antonio-wh8lh FALSE!!! I did a mirror battle, got the double one coin move, used rocinante, won clash, then toss, then afterwords i lost sanity
neerd