Are Autistic People Rude? | Autism Experiences
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 พ.ย. 2021
- Hi! I’m Claire, and this is my channel, Woodshed Theory. Here you will find the awkward ramblings of an adult autist. I love being creative and sharing my experiences with you. Subscribe to see more DIYs, Discussions, and Bunnies on your feed!
If you are on the spectrum, chances are you have been called rude more than a few times in your life. Today I wanted to discuss if ASD people are really rude or is it just a misunderstanding.
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This video was much needed. Currently struggling with feeling like I’m an asshole after finding out I have autism/reflecting on how often people have disliked my tone and find me rude. It’s both frustrating af and relieving to learn more about autism and learn about these experiences from other people that matches mine. Thank you
thank you for sharing! i still think about the stuff i've said
She basically changed my name to asshole 😅
I'm bingeing this stuff too fam, I love actually knowing what's wrong with me after 35+ years of confusion. I'm inspired to become a creator myself now.
“No, I’m not being a dick, I am just being honest..” this is abuser logic..
That depends of the context and the scenario you're in and you *know it*
One of the things which seems to be part of the way I am, and you referred to it in passing for you too, is how much time I spend planning interactions - mapping out in detail what I'll say, what facial expression I'll adopt, thinking about possible directions a conversation may take. I don't think that NTs really do this, apart perhaps from things like interviews. For us, everything is like a performance, but even then we can't really anticipate everything, and I think it may be when we have to extemporise that the wheels can come off. We get caught off balance and say something untoward.
The other side of this is the endless rumination on what happened, going over it to try to work out from first principles what took place, what did it mean, could I have done that differently? I can recall with crystal clarity so many situations, right back to early childhood,. Yes, I corrected teachers and professors, yes, I said things so blunt as to stop conversation cold. Yes, I hurt and alienated people. I like to think that I have learned from these.
I am looking forward to your take on the way we tend to see all humans as our equal. I've always felt that the way NTs are all bound up with hierarchy and status was a bit odd, really. I mean I observe it as an interesting phenomenon, but more or less as an anthropologist from another planet rather than a participant.
Thank you!
Hi Daniel thank you for your thoughtful comment. I have to really be careful, now that I am more aware, not to practice or go over conversations before/after the fact. I can get caught up for hours.
I can relate alot to your comment. I used to plan and rehearse every interaction. I slowly learned to be more spontaneous and just shoot from the hip. I think I've swung too far in the direction of no-planning because I walk into interviews without doing more than a cursory glance at the job description. That can really backfire on me since I'm not socially adept, but at the same time I no longer worry in advance about upcoming events and dont dwell too long on the results. It's very peaceful for me to live this way rather than how I was before.
I hope all my asd people will find systems that work best for them and thrive in their own way.
Get out of my damn head 😅
I get called rude ALL THE TIME, yelled at at work in front of people, it’s never intentional, but here i am… “you’re so rude!!! You just burst into people’s offices and start talking!!” It hurts.
This is video is out of sight great Claire. There are things I regret saying going back to age 5 that still make me cringe, kinda a ocd thing. But mostly it's jokes that people didn't get, or things that were misinterpreted. My nervousness and flat affect are often misinterpreted as well, and I can see it happening so clearly. Or sometimes its seen as being dumb or sometimes I can seem arrogant, one thing is for sure Nothing will be interpreted for it is. But if I was rude I was frustrated, but I might have Meant it, lol.
You are correct, some of it is def. tied into OCD.
I have a feeling that occasional perceived rudeness by NTs is actually a sign of self actualization in an autistic person. At least from my perspective. I have very rarely been called outright rude, but the times that I was so deeply scarred me that I developed cptsd from the constant anxiety of possibly offending someone by accident. I had it in my head that hurting someones feelings was the absolute worst thing you could ever do. I grew up undiagnosed and with a constant fear of being rude so deep that I developed a completely fake personality. I feel like half a person tbh. I wish I had learned so much earlier that rudeness is not some unforgivable sin, and it is okay to misunderstand or misread people. NTs do it too. Autistic traits are human traits, and there should be no extra shame in them when they happen to be negative ones.
Wow I’m so sorry for your experience it’s so relatable to me. I mostly feel like it’s easier to avoid people than most likely offend them
Not everyone is autistic. Only autistic people behave that way. Stop trying to accuse normal people of having your condition
@@MarcusB-lz4lvthey did no such thing! All they said is that NTs can have the same problems, that doesn’t make them autistic. And why call them normal as if autism is something wrong? It’s just a different neurotype
There's a quote that says "people will forget much of what you say, and do...but they will never forget how you made them feel." I think this is generally true. If you make people feel like shit, they will avoid you. Not the end of the world...but keeping friends does require some tact.
I have on a few occasions. But I suppose there are lots of people that have. I knew a person that was genuinely nice saying they were rude to others. Thats irksome,cause they were very likeable
This is awesome! You be preachin' to the choir here, but imma sinngin' along.🎉
I’m on the autism spectrum, and I also have complex PTSD. And I’m sure people would think I was rude. Especially because of my CPTSD. But I love kindness.
Right? All I want in the world is peace and kindness so when I’m told I’m rude I just don’t believe it
@@WoodshedTheory do you think you could do a video on autism and trauma?
@@siennaprice1351 I can absolutely talk more about it - I do have a video getting a little bit into it
@@WoodshedTheory I just know that people who are on the spectrum are more susceptible to bullying and abuse. I think people with physical disabilities are susceptible to that stuff too. I have a physical handicap, but I don’t dare share it publicly because I’ve been bullied for it and asked such ignorant questions about it.
My dad is autistic. he is very rude to me but I have been dealing with it my entire life.
i'm sorry to hear you are having an issue with your father
@@WoodshedTheory he can be very kind and loving too which is the weird thing lol.
I still love him but he can say very offensive things to me, but I have learned to not take offense to it. My coworkers have always complimented me on how patient i am with rude customers, and I think it’s because i have learned how to deal with it over the years
Tell him that when he said something it is hurting your feelings and you’d like him to not say it again
It is stifling how much suicide, suicide attemtps and molestation accompanies those of us with asbergers... dealt with this my whole life... our gullible, innocent, ignorant selves are bullied and told to stop being so sensitive.
This literally explains my life and struggle and nearly all women misdiagnosed as bipolar or borderline personality or narcissistic or learning disabled
To say the pain of being misunderstood, disliked, hated, judged, condemed, criticized, reprimanded, called crazy/wierd/different/quarky/stupid, a bitch, inconsiderate of others feelings, self pitying, pathetic, fake, domineering, to sensitive, over reacting, not listening, lying, and asked to be someone I'm not in order to please social norms has and
is excruciating is an Understatement
I'm incredibly grateful for the few around me that get me even though I burn them out (imagine being in my life of trauma with this misdiagnosed issue your whole life) and then being told your not allowed to be confident or proud of self when most others have no idea the momenumental effort I've displayed to be a citizen in society and not blow my brains out cause the world doesn't want who I LOVE to be but they find uncomfortable and hurtful
I'm extremely grateful I've always had music and dance as an outlet... bc it's safe to stim, be loud /expressive and Alone as a dancer, singer where others can watch and enjoy my gifts rather then be hurt/burned by them
Please society stop putting us down just because we physically "look" normal but don't act normal... to many of us ALL neurotypicals seem boring, constrained, inauthentic, robotic, programmed, predictable, judgmental, snooty, privileged, unintelligent, tricksters/lying for pleasure and self righteous. You have no idea how much Accomdating WE are doing for how annoying your social events and shawllow small talk is to us.... we just don't shit on it all the time the way you do on us. We show up for YOU not for ourselves. If it was up to us we'd stay home and play with our animals and our own imaginations.
Thank you for this comment it is so helpful
I relate with everything you mentioned
It's hard to be in a world of NT people who don't understand what you are going through
@@kencarson7310 That is not fair!!!
I as an NT was sexually abused by family and my mothers boyfriends, physically assaulted, locked in basements and starved for 1 -2 days at a time, bulled in school, made fun of for being poor and dirty, and for the color of my skin. YOU ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE SUFFERING IN THIS WORLD!! MANY NT PEOPLE ARE ALONE AND STRUGGLING AS WELL.
Please stop this and have some kindness in your heart.
So everyone should treat you kindly even though you think those horrible things about all NTs? What a joke
You people should be thanking normal people for treating you as well as we do. You literally wouldn’t survive if not for our support.
Apparently all my co-workers hate me because I'm rude.
Oh no! I am sorry if they feel that way. It is easy to be misunderstood.
This is an excellent vid and you touched on pretty much everything I wanted to explore within this topic! You articulated everything perfectly and you seem really sweet!
My father was autistic but he never knew, He had many many autistic traits as do I. One of our last moments together, we were talking and he was vaguely going over different events of his life that must’ve been not so good, he didnt go much into detail only as he was a dignified private man but I'll never forget him saying "Ive always been so misunderstood all my life" in a sad and somber tone". It broke my heart because I understood that feeling so well having felt that way through out my life from a child to an adult. Now I know why. I wish he was here to get diagnosed and perhaps knowing would have brought some form of clarity and validation and understanding to his life.😢❤
I have a friend that is autistic. Today he saw me eating a cupcake with a spoon and went on for like three minutes about how I’m so weird for that. Our other friend (we are a friend group of three) it seems like a joke at first, but then I knew that it wasn’t anymore when he kept going on for minutes when my other friend stopped talking about it. After he left the room, he was telling a lot of other people in our school about how I was weird for eating a cupcake with a spoon. I’m upset about him talking behind my back, but I think that it’s his autism.
I would speak with him about it directly
@@WoodshedTheory thank you. How do I talk to him about how I’m upset that he talks all of the time too, Sind rive been friends with him he talk’s constantly and interrupts too. I’m thinking that those are his traits too since he seems unaware about it. Should I ask him to talk a little less, or should I just let it be? I don’t want to hurt his feelings.
@@Blu3b3rrymuffinnit's kinder to risk hurting his feelings. Because if you don't say "hey, this has been bothering me, and it doesn't seem like you're being a good friend when you do these things." then he's not going to catch on, and he'll keep doing it. After a while, you won't be happy to see him and will try to avoid him. And now he's lost a friend, but still has no idea why.
Better to just say it. Often what seems mean and way too brutal to a NT will be just right for ASD.
@@er6730 ok, thank you so much. I really appreciate the honest advice. I feel like a lot of people just think I’m a bad person so thank you for the good advice
Tbh that is pretty weird
I can relate, basically in every point. I'm so autistic. Someone called me rude because when they asked me something, I replied sincerely. I didn't realize they expected a nice lie. I'm sincere no matter what. I'm not able to say a lie.
I understand completely. I didn't realize sometimes there is an expectation to lie.
@@WoodshedTheory Yes, like during a job interview.
I remember I got asked in Sunday school as a child "Do you ever think before you speak?" and I haven't stopped overanalyzing everything before I say it since. 😅
Umm yeah I heard that all the time as a kid
for me thinking and speaking is same thing for me
@@WoodshedTheory what are you talking about child? You are still very much a very young one.. You centennial kids are in such a rush to grow that you don't enjoy your youth..
She’s literally an adult
Good
I think your take on this is spot on. Let's just say I have indeed had many learning opportunities. Thankfully I'm pretty good at learning.
Something I think impacts this, as well as seeming to be dishonest or defensive, is body language. If we are anxious, or uncomfortable, especially if we avoid eye contact, that is visible.
They can only assume this is how we feel about them or the subject matter. The same comment from a calm, comfortable, and seemingly interested person is interpreted very differently.
When I feel anxious or etc I will tell the person why (I'm autistic/social anxiety) . They may then choose to try and understand me better. I also then feel more comfortable and am better understood to begin with.
Feelings have their own truth. If you feel I was rude, my opinion on the matter is irrelevant. Fair or logical or not, I must try to keep you from feeling that way.
I'm glad I am not the only one who is still learning!
Wow! Again you have "hit the nail on the head". I am a 71 year old woman, self diagnosed a few months ago. My granddaughter has a hard time fitting in to the accepted mold for young girls. She had been diagnosed with different mental disorders that really didn't fit, finally she was tested for autism and determined to be autistic. I identified with her behavior at school, how she reacted to social pressure and really the way she thinks. I wanted to know more about this disorder in girls, I thought it was only detected in young boys who were non-verbal and hyperactive. My research blew me away leading me to my discovery that I am autistic. Thank you so much for your videos, I now know that I am just different not bad, lazy, rude or crazy.
I am so happy to have you here Geneva!
You're not autistic if you're self-diagnosed! You need to see a doctor
You lay this out so well.
Thanks!
This is a good video, thank you for making it. I have ASD and ADHD and I've run into this type of situation a lot throughout my life. Not so much since my diagnosis as I think a bit more now but I think it's basically like I'm walking on eggshells or causing myself additional stress by overthinking :/ At that point, my brain tends to be all over the place, even if it's offshoots of the primary topic. Have a nice day! :)
Hi Claire! I related so much with your video, thank you for it. I also wanted to comment on something you said in passing, and I would love to hear what you have to say about how we view all people as equals. This has both helped me and been a source of embarrassment through life (not good to call a police officer by their first name even when they just told you it! I thought that gave me the go ahead to do so, but nope!). I hope you do make a video about this topic!
Curtis I would have done the same thing if a police officer told me their name
:) YAY! Another video from you! I'll enjoy the video with a cup of coffee and a cookie! 🥰
Hello Niina, i thought you were saying you missed my coffee videos (more to come soon), but now I read it differently. Please enjoy your coffee and cookie and I will enjoy some as well.
@@WoodshedTheory 😄 Well, I really enjoy your coffee ☕️ videos too! 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
and sometimes i dont know why people are offended, because i cant understand those emotions they could feel
Yes, It is hard to understand another persons feelings when you don't feel those feelings.
I’m 48 and got a diagnosis last year. I’ve been called rude or direct(a neurotypical way of saying you’re rude that they think is nicer) a lot in my life. In my opinion the people that like the truth however brutal it sometimes can be will stick around the rest will disappear and I’m fine with that. I don’t particularly like to be lied to even if it’s a “white lie” constructed to make me feel better. As a result I don’t white lie or sugar coat anything anymore. For me having to adapt to social norms dictated by a neurotypical world causes burnout faster and I don’t want to be constantly burned out any more. People I want in my life understand why they are getting the truth from me always and they understand I want to hear a sincere opinion and not one they made up to appease neurotypical norms.
i get it i also am done with constantly being burnt out
Berry: I agree with not liking white lies constructed to make me/people feel better.
I have experienced conversations ending explosively while I'm being perfectly honest.
I find myself getting frustrated, because I can feel the other person not telling the full truth, or holding back. In the end I find out they were getting upset because I wouldn't stop pointing out the facts.
I find it all so confusing
(I think it is the double empathy problem)
@@1997Jeep Double empathy definitely plays a part. I also get “you’re so selfish you’re als way talking about yourself” which now prompts me to explain that’s how autists relate. Before it would end the conversation in pretty much the same way yours ended.
If it's about feelings or preferences and that kind of thing people aren't always sure what their truth is. Can take a lot of time and experience to formulate a true opinion.
This is my constant struggle. You have found a very nice way of describing Damian Milton’s Double Empathy problem. I’ll show this to my supervisor, next time I’m accused of being blunt.
Hey, awesome perspective. I have a couple points to contribute. You say there just needs to be more understanding, but 1. Other people don’t always know that ASD people can be unintentionally rude because of ASD. 2. Other people don’t always know who is or isn’t ASD. 3. You’re so right that feelings matter. This is all good in a social and family environment. It’s a very different context in the workplace, particularly when clients and customers are present. Thanks for listening.
Thank you for sharing good additional points.
Whether we ASD or neurotypical our feelings get hurt and are valid. I think you would agree that some people, when rude say "it's just the way I am" it invalidates our feelings.
Yes, I tried to emphasize in the video that it doesn’t matter if think you are rude or not, it’s the other persons feelings that matter. And that we have a responsibility to people not to hurt their feelings. Yes I agree it’s not alright to say “oh that’s just who I am” to allow that behavior
So many NT people say that or " I'm blunt". I avoid them because I believe they know that what they are saying is going to be hurtful, and just don't care.
@@shalisapartee433you can be blunt while not being rude.
I was once bullied by two autistic sisters. I was the Neuro nerd. Horrid kids. Back in 2009.
What if they’re rude and you try and explain to them that what they said hurt your feelings but they refuse to apologize because they feel like apologizing if you unintentionally hurt somebody’s feelings is a stupid social convention and so therefore they don’t see it as necessary? It just makes me feel like they feel like them being different makes it okay for them to be emotional bulldozers and that that should should just be okay.
I agree I dont think that ASD people should use their ASD as an excuse to be rude. We need to be understanding of eachother even if we dont always understand why what we said is rude - what matters is how we make people feel
What I hate is if they accidentally hurt our feelings, that's OK with them and we're expected to forgive them, but if we accidentally hurt their feelings, they will hold the grudge and keep pointing it out every chance they get for the rest of our lives.
@@raven4090 OMG yes!
I remember one time when I was called “very rude,” and it didn’t make sense, because I was only an average level of rude.
Haha often I’m like how can I be rude if it’s only the truth
This is such an autistic thing to say, it’s my favorite thing now!
But it’s true. If someone tells me I’m some level of rude that wasn’t intended or conveyed intentionally by me, I don’t understand it either. Even though I know that such measures are entirely subjective. In my mind I’m going to think exactly what you said in your comment, that “it doesn’t make sense, because I was only an average level of rude”.
Very isn’t a precise measurement so interesting that your autist tick kicked in to argue against something that can’t be quantified.
This so funny and relatable.😂❤
I used to be called rude when I was very young, but then that was replaced with blunt or very direct. Three things I learned a long time ago:
1) be up front with new people that I can come off as rude, but don't usually intend to be.
2) try to present the information tactfully one on one, outside the public eye, and try to ask probing questions to verify my own assessment's validity.
3) if 1 and two cannot lead to a more productive interaction or relationship then default to a professional only relationship and interact no more than needed. they are likely the kind of person that thinks that they are justified and just keeping it real when they speak, but I am somehow only ever rude or arrogant. Just leave them alone as the required manual adjustments and maintenance are strictly prohibited. ;)
Good points thanks for your input
Number 2 is a strategy I employ in the work environment. If I see something that appears to be wrong, I ask probing questions. Either the questions help the other person see the error in what they have done on their own, or I learn something and realize that I was the one on the wrong track. A win-win situation, and I don’t seem rude or arrogant for telling somebody straight out they have done something wrong.
One autistic person I know, describes it this way: "Sometimes things just fall out of my face!"
Exactly!
My question- is this something that can be taught in early stage/ younger child how to asses if they are being rude
Hi Mia, you know that is an excellent question. I am not totally sure as I am not a parent.
I have been trying to teach my daughter, just by explaining the situation from different points of view. I try very hard not to make her feel bad, but she truly doesn't understand why her friend is sad and she needs to know.😢 It's not on purpose.
I have had good success with saying something like "I think that the girl wanted to play with you. And she was feeling quite shy but she was brave and decided to come and ask you to play tag. And when you said 'no' and turned away from her, she felt rejected like you didn't like her and didn't want to play with her, and ran back to her mom for a hug. Is that what you were trying to tell her?"
And then it comes out that my daughter doesn't like tag but likes rolling down the hill, and she would like to play and was surprised when the girl ran away.
So I try to encourage her to make a repair. "Why don't you go over and say something like 'do you want to roll down the hill with me?' She might say yes, or maybe she will want to cuddle with her mom some more."
I have been focusing on the repairing of a broken connection more than preventing the break. Because she just can't see it coming, but she can see when people are hurt. So why not show her that it can usually be fixed?
I have ADHD (not autism) and I will often impulsively say something that I regret as it leaves my mouth. However, it doesn't harm my relationships because I immediately react with horror and apologies and "that came out wrong!" Or I can fix the sentence to make it just awkward instead of offensive. This is easier for me because I use the same body language, context, and tone to communicate as nts do, so I know what's wrong.
However, I think that a prompt repair where she emphasizes connection and that she values the other person, will keep my daughter in friends. I hope so, she has a kind heart.
Good idea. Maybe in early childhood diagnosis this should be taught.
Thank you for this video. I have recently been told I am often rude. I had no idea and my initial response was that were being too sensitive. But I'm always up for self improvement and I am beginning to see just how big of a blind spot this is for me
I understand sometimes it is hard for me to understand why what I have done is rude too
This is the kind of nuance we need. Not “I don’t care about feelings”, not “people’s feelings should be valued above all else”.
I am detecting a conflation between 'facts' and 'specificity'.
perhaps
Oh man, I cannot agree enough with what you say here. I'm definitely better than I was, but suffice it to say my road to better social skills is paved in regrets, remorse, and embarrassment. I straight up did the "correct a professor in class" once, and I regretted it as soon as I opened my mouth. I remember being told that I "bit someone's head off," and I had literally no idea when that was or what they were referring to. None of it was intentionally rude. All that we can do when we take it on the chin like that, I suppose, is to pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, make sure the other party is alright, and take the whole thing as a lesson for the future.
Yea Stephen I can’t count how many times I have been told similar - like what did I do wrong? I was just being honest
I see the example of egocentrism. That people tend to see only their own perspective and therefore expect others to hold the same view.
I think its important when it comes to autism to reckognize that some people may be wired differently. Yet, at the end of the day, people are all human beings, regardless of their diagnose.
indeed
Love your hair looks good the color
Thanks I love it too
The hardest lesson to learn is that what I see as truth is usually just my opinion and the result of my cognitive bias. I still get kinda upset when I’m confronted though.
Interesting thanks for sharing
I have to make no small talk at all to not be able to be rude , most neurotypical people look at facial expressions to guide the conversation and when I look at peoples faces it just makes me stumble on my words and they think I’m slow or not confident. I found that I can focus more on conversations if I don’t look at people at all , but then I’m rude for not looking at them. People treat me like I’m mean or said something rude almost every human interaction I’ve had in my life, and it’s making me feel worthless not to mention if you go to places like tattoo shops or food places some people will purposely mess with your quality of service “ to teach you a lesson” I’ve had people I’ve dated tell others I’m mean but they never tell me to my face that something is hurting their feelings, I’ve been ostracized and bullied since birth and if that’s not happening a mate crime.
I’m really trying to not be mean to people when they’re mean to me but it’s hard at this point I have cptsd from being restrained and bullied so much for things I don’t know I’m even doing.
When I’m around other autistic people I get it cause they hurt my feelings and make me feel so horrible when I’m around them.
It makes me wonder if I should just not talk or be existing anymore. It’s a sad time here. Getting nothing I want in life and no means of support cause the people helping autistic adults think I’m rude and mean too and they do spiteful things because they want to teach me a lesson.
I wonder why this has happened to me I see everyone getting their dreams and here I am wishing I could just not feel worthless when grabbing a cup of coffee
Hi I'm sorry you are struggling with this. I hope you find some grace for yourself.
When I Say Nothing, When I say Something. Translations take time... energy... decompression... It's like walking on EggShells. /salute
i get it
Translating your ASD thought into a more palatable NT thought can be SO hard and when it is not "SO" hard it is still taxing and sometimes I just don't have the energy to do it, so I just don't communicate.
This is SUCH relatable content!
Heather I totally understand. Sometimes it's like "that was rude" and i'm like... but I thought it was filtered! lol
Its still new to me im going to get a Autistic diagnose, I have traveled throught time, and i just figured out there is social cues, no one have never told me or what that is, im a divigen rude surfer, i dont have the boundries as nerotypical people. christ, there is now an explanation why i dont cry and i Breake. Woodshed Theory, I love listening to your teachings✊❤
Thanks for your kind words! I was also taken aback when I understood things were going on socially differently than I was perceiving
@@WoodshedTheory you are so welcome, for me it was a lightbolb explosion to wake up to being not told the truth about me/my❤
As a person with mild ASD, I am often afraid of saying the wrong thing.
Thanks Claire, interesting video. Here's a thing, how about neurotypical people learn to be more honest about things!
We are "normally" told we are being rude when it is a "tone of voice" situation. If everyone had a similar sound (tone) to their voice then there wouldn't be any rudeness, just honesty and factually.
Being deceitful isn't nice, but calling one group out for that would be classed as being wrong, but calling out a whole neurotype out as being rude is ok!
Yes don't get me started on this....
Yeah I totally get you.
Yes, as a NT your tone of voice is seen as arrogant and dismissive. You also refuse to learn and demand NT put in all the effort. And all of your past hurts are placed on people who do not even know you.
This is why I hate my ASD co-worker.
Took me soooooo long to learn about universal honesty.
I always try to tell ppl that integrity and intentions will eventually become obvious. But I often put people off so much that they never get to know me well enough to learn how sincere I’m trying to be.
I feel like being straight forward is all we can do. If you were hurt, be honest about the fact that I said something they felt was harmful.
Social norms disagreeing with us doesn't make us rude. It's both our part to put in the effort to understand.
Neurotypicals just normalize lying.
They interpret lies as kindness when it fakes caring
That’s an interesting take. Lots to think about
@@WoodshedTheory it’s the truth, neurotypicals are short sighted and easily misled
Everyone wants a true friend but when they get one, they don't want to listen to them...
@@Gaming.Gamer. lol yes. You will find your tribe amongst fellow neurodivergents
Incorrect. You are conflating malicious deceitfulness with expressed emotional intelligence in order to read a situation to soften/reduce/diffuse a potentially negative outcome. Why would you do the latter? A host of reasons for which many autistic people can struggle with understanding a need for ergo your generalisation.
It is not without purpose. Human being have evolved this way in order to be able to live with one another with reduced opportunities for conflict. Specificity (what many autistic people call 'facts' is not necessarily, required to give someone a morale boost.
Example:
My autistic student really struggles with her executive function. However she is in a mainstream school and will have to sit for final exams soon. She does no revision and while she has excellent visual recall, ad a keen and intelligent mind, will not use revision guides, did not attend revision session set exclusively for her, will not return to missed work, will not complete classwork - memory and recall is good, but not sufficient to produce the grade she wants and needs to proceed in her education.
In order to bring her attention to a place where she is aware that she needs to do more, or find a way to collaborate with her support team to improve her organisational methods I could either do
a.) Flat out tell her that existing effort is not good enough, counter-productive, inefficient, likely to lead to a less than optimal outcome (like I would with her fellow NT classmates) OR
b.) Soften the news by highlighting what she is good at and encouraging her to draw on those successes and try to apply them more widely and more often.
The 1st method will UNDOUBTEDLY instigate anxiety and lead to a shutdown within an hour of this kind of delievery and will ALMOST CERTAINLY result in the desirable outcome being avoided.
The 2nd method will inflate her ego and acknowledge a strength which will hopefully add a motivation/incentive to try to replicate that outcome.
The 2nd method is a half truth, but avoids negative consequences (or at least tries to) whereas the 1st is a full truth, but will encourage a negative consequence.
The adage is a harsh full truth vs a soft half truth (a white lie - one intended to minimise harm). The 1st could be cruel (but factual or even necessary) but the 2nd IS kinder (and could bring about a more collaborative effect, rather than a combative one).
Justice and honesty every time
That is the asd way
You can talk about more than the weather or sports 🙂but that's a great place to start when you first meet a person. It's like warming up an oven before you put the food in, we call it " breaking the ice". I appreciate your insights. I *think* I'm allist (but an ADHDer) so I definitely relate to many of the things you are describing. I have an Autistic sibling, an autistic Uncle and two ADHDer children, so I'm 90% sure my grandchildren will be some combination of Autistic/ADHD/AuDHD. I think talking to each other is the best way to bridge the gap.
Please what other topics are ok 😅
@@WoodshedTheory Strangers at a party will frequently search for shared interests or people to discuss, saying things like "Seen any good movies recently?" or "So how do you know (shared contact)?"
Thank you for this video ❤️ from a neurotypical queer of colour with asd friends that I love
happy to have you
We’re not rude, we’re straight fwd. no bs. The dream would be, Let’s just talk straight instead of what society enjoys as dancing around a bush. So many humans are such thin skin and can’t think for themselves.
I love how you said we interact w normals in a way “they’re not used to” yup. They’re used to their sugar coats.
We are way smarter in general. And that offends normals. We see through things others miss. Our brains work on a higher wave length.
Point blank:
We see their shadows
Unfortunately everyone does not want to disclose that they are on the spectrum
and though they are able to perform their jobs well they end up losing jobs because people find them rude and awkward.
I think coming out with your diagnosis whether it be autism dyslexia ADD and explaining it to everyone would help in a social and work environment and make life easier for everyone. I always let everyone know that I am dyslexic and have ADD and that I absorb information differentlyand I find that people are more patient and willing to help me because they know that I struggle.
Hi Robert this is great advice. I know not everyone wants to disclose, heck there are times were i wouldnt for sure
My experience telling co-workers I have ADHD and Dyslexia has been them responding. Yeah I get distracted sometimes too, and I flipped the letters in a word once.
I genuinely wish ADHD was only getting distracted a little occasionally, and Dyslexia was just flipping a letter or two occasionally.
My favorite is when someone will say they have a Migraine headache right now.
I immediately remember my most recent migraine (which was probably within a week or two) where I was woken up with a spike in my head, knowing I will be uncontrollably throwing up for the next few hours, simply to be rewarded by my co-workers being upset with me because I wasn't at work again.
I think it should be considered rude to trivialize someone else's struggles when they in fact, don't have any idea what these struggles are like.
You are making perfect sense
Thanks Rebecca
6:20 I actually have the opposite experience of this. All my professor at the graduate level have been more than open for students to call out mistakes (in a nice way, of course), and have never been mad about such mistakes.
Hi you are totally right, esp at the graduate level.
The fact I get told I’m rude, too blunt or too direct most of the times is the reason I prefer to stay quite most of the times cuz I know I’m gonna some how offend someone with my words without even trying cuz we live In a society where direct communication can be seen as a bad thing since this society mentally getting weaker and weaker by the day
Yeah I get it, i think I got scared to say anything
I’m sure automatically assuming it’s them will paint you in a better light.
I hold the view that a rude person is a rude person. Autism or not.
I have autism and know other people with autism, and we are just as different as everyone else.
There are people that are rude because they dont respect other people.
But I get where you are coming from on the issue of autism and social competence.
Im trying to learn social cues and always look to what I can do better.
thanks for sharing
Always being told I'm rude by the same person and I always ask what did I say. Guess what the words weren't bad but my tone and directness was. Ok, mind boggled. My answer: Don't say anything. Then I'm told my face looks angry or they can't read me so easily. Boggled again. What to do other than to dig a a big hole and throw myself in. This person is a highly sensitive person and i tend to take their criticisms with a grain of salt. I've seen them take offense to the most mundane things. Judge where the information is coming from.
Hi I understand the confusion as I have also been through this - I think sometimes people don't know how express what they find rude about a situation - or they just wont tell me either
I think when NT said they were hurt. We should apologize. Yes, they need to be understanding it’s sometimes not on purpose. We can’t say they must understand us. But, we can’t understand them. We have feelings too. We need to meet each other half way.
To me conforming to NTstandards just because they outnumber us feels like masking. I’m done masking, I’m just going to stop walking on eggshells and be myself and if it drives people away that’s perfectly fine. I’d rather have fewer and better friends.
Yes. I too am really working on leaving the mask behind
I have had plenty of experience with this. It really hasn’t gotten better with age and experience either.
Hi Todd, I hope things get better if that’s what you want
Nothing wrong with being "too honest", the issue is WHEN this is required and appropriate and when it is not. That doesn't mean NOT being honest, it means not every situation requires specificity/precision/exactness.
Arguing with your lecturer about a minor detail that has been generalised for brevity but for which you missed the nuance that that exactness is not required for is going to get them irked at you. I understand why you might feel all the specifics are important, but there is a communication/interpretation malfunction there.
thank you for sharing
I’m friends with an autistic person and someone else the autistic one keeps getting to aggressive making the other one upset
thanks for sharing, are you able to discuss this with the person and talk about boundaries?
@@WoodshedTheory no. I have low confidence and the other one refuses completely.
sorry to hear that i hope you can come to a solution @@BazzasAviation
I understand what you mean. Many things my son does would be taken as rude if I didn't explain it to them when he acts this way. He really just wants to help. He doesn't understand that everything is not his business. Not his problem. He just sees the world connected as a whole.
Yes I think it takes a long time to learn NT expectations
Oh I feel this a lot for myself!
Do you find yourself second-guessing and ruminating past conversations with people because you fear you have been too blunt in your conversation with them? If so, what do you do? How do you overcome that rumination?
I learned to bullshit my way through decades ago. I'm too tired to care, now lol What do you mean you're not supposed to correct a professor giving wrong info 🤔 oops 😬 lol the way I see he's making 6 figures annually and we're paying for it haha 😂 Love your content haven't been around because I took a solo camping trip in my van for two weeks. Had no service at all in a lot of places. At this point I'm just enjoying being by myself and thinking about taking off again lol ✌️❤️⚔️🔥🐴
A camping trip with no service sounds amazing
Much worse than being rude is sometimes I've tried to ask for advice for myself but it came off totally wrong. Like I asked somebody how they don't just kill themself. But it wasn't about them, I didn't mean to imply they should or something I just meant like what keeps you going? Idk. I felt so bad afterward when I realized how bad that sounded
I’m sorry that happened
@@WoodshedTheory do u understand what I'm saying? It just didn't even occur to me how they were going to take it. Afterward it seemed obvious
Too Honest!?!? Nah, no such thing lol. Honesty is the best policy.
Sometimes lol
How did you learn how to communicate better with NT people? People are so sensitive and offended. I am always super honest, I can't lie or withhold info to make people feel better. Are there any resources or ways to get better at this?
I'm not sure about resources unfortunately (doesn't mean there aren't any i'm sure). but for me it was getting my ocd under control via meds and therapy and learning more mindfulness - it helped me slow down to listen more and remember that i don't know what people are going to say so i should hear them out. i hope this helps
Thank you for this video
Thanks for your support
Hey Claire, another amazing video, yes i have been called rude many times. The struggle i have is people never explain what i have done or said. I totally relate with you. Great explaining as always.
Hi Gemma hope you are well we should chat soon!
@@WoodshedTheory absolutely would love to have a chat i have hangouts or, i could invite you on a panel
That sounds awesome :)
Having a friend who has aspergers is very tough for me. After five years of friendship, I asked if we could just meet up maybe once or twice a month because honestly sometimes it drives me insane and I'm sorry I don't mean to offend or be rude, but the main issue I see in people with aspergers is they don't want to understand or that they don't care enough to understand certain things are rude. It gives off a certain "I only care about how I feel and you're going to deal with my misbehavior" energy and I'm not here for it.
You can't just go on your entire life not even wondering "was this the best way to communicate?" and expect not to be left alone. Nobody likes a person who exhibits narcissistic traits.
Again, this isn't meant to offend, but it's my brutal honest truth as someone who is trying to figure out how to not be annoyed by my friend in every conversation.
I am sure that I’m not the way you describe and I have autism.
Also look up the double empathy theory autistic people are usually better at communicating with other autistic people and vice versa.
oh my God this is a game changer because I have struggled with my mom‘s rudeness for years and years and years years and finally me at age 40 it dawned on me a cpl days ago like hmmm ya know? I think something might be wrong with her neurologically and you described her to the tee!! thank you I needed to hear this to have a little more patience and compassion. ty ty ty.
I’m so glad this was helpful
Having autism does not mean something is wrong with them mentally, it’s just a different neurotype
@@DanniBby true
You choosing to try and understand her and having more compassion is sweet. Kudos to you for that!❤
What even is the definition of 'rude'. Each generation has their own opinion on this. ESPECIALLY if you were raised in a religious household where children had a rigid structure of behaviors!
I was raised very religious so the moral code was HIGH
I much prefer the autistic person’s mindset of prioritising truth and equality over ego and hierarchy. It’s about values and which values are prioritised. From an autistic perspective (mine) being truthful is being kind.
thanks for sharing
I'm not rude, I just don't have the energy to wait around for your BS to be done.
Lol I get it!
Okay, Claire - I'm terrible! And I can tell from your giggle that you are occasionally terrible too. You know what I'm talking about (hopefully!)... those moments where someone is offended and finds us rude and we think it's the most hilarious thing we've ever experienced. The old, "Charlie was very offended by that," met by "BWAHAHAHAHA! Really? So what?" Unfortunately, with the exception of maybe four people I care deeply about - who know what I'm like in the first place and for the most part don't get offended themselves by me in any case, most situations where I offend someone genuinely amuses me. I'm confused, but I think I stoped actually caring and letting it haunt me decades ago. But then again I'm a computer engineer so in daily life, I'm not called upon to really interact in a way that would be problematic. My comptuers like me being blunt.
Indeed!
When I was at the University of Wisconsin in the late 60's, the physiology professor was describing to a hall of 200+ students how the nervous system worked.
The penis, he told us, was innervated by sacral nerve 2.
Then I asked, outloud without 'permission',
"What innervates the clitoris?" GASP! People did not even Say the word clitoris then. Well.
The natural feminist in me would not let the opportunity go by. I was saying "What about Woman?"
How dare the patriarchy perpetuate
this thinking by concealing information about women? University professors needed schooling in basic human rights.
See, now I am ranting a bit.
Anyway, I have always felt compelled to speak the truth or ask What is the truth.
No, not so good at "holding my tongue".
Rude? Many times I was told I was rude.
I still am. But I call it being direct, real, straightforward.
how will i know emotions are involved?
I find the best way is to ask people to clarify their emotions. But that is hard to because you you say "you're upset?" they get more upset because to them it's obvious.
At 59 I hit a point where I'm just afraid to socialize. I can't accidentally offend anyone if I'm at home alone. I'm just so tired. Mentally and emotionally exhausted. I never have to apologize to my animals.
"I am not being rude, I'm just telling you the truth." Wrong! Or, "I can't control what I say to you, by thinking before I speak." Wrong again. But, if the person is not ready to accept this, I try to respond with grace just as God has given me. Especially, if the person was raised in an abusive family. Admitting fault and saying sorry, maybe too much to handle.
it is a tough subject
Hello Claire I am Brenton I am new at this I was diagnosed with autism since the age of 5 years old didn't make eye contact and I am a loner I'm 27 years old I am autism I like your videos are awesome about autism stuff and everything trying to get everybody to understand all the autism community give them advice and everything I like it it might help me someday
Hi Brenton so happy to have you commenting. I know that being autistic can be difficult and I commend you for putting yourself out there.
@@WoodshedTheory I guess you're right
I act annoyed if I’m annoyed hurt if I’m hurt. This is the ultimate honesty.
If you can’t act it say it. U will help the people who can’t handle you know not to waist time.
Honestly in our emotional experience is 100% most important.
Don’t expect people to “just know” (this is just shitty behavior no matter your status regarding ANYTHING else)
If we model fairiness and understanding then hopefully enough people will get it. If you are gonna assume you might as well assume they are doing their best (feeling pretty clever about the previous sentence/and furious)
I beat myself up for so long when really it was other people (ALL) neurodivergent and allistic that needed to be checked.I’m annoyed that soooo few ppl are more compassionate or generous. Everyone seems totally consumed with whether others are affirming their thoughts that they never do the work that atypical people must do to just exist.
Sorry probably just exhausted, thanks for you time😂
The Truth is never rude.
I've had many lightbulb moments way after I've been "rude" but I never intend it that way! I think people get intimidated by honesty & feel called out by it, when all we're doing is correcting a mistake. The worst times have been at work when colleagues misunderstood my intention to be helpful. I stopped making suggestions at that job in the end 🙄
Yes I have learned that people don't want to hear how they can do their job better if it is not from a boss
I think my boss and his girlfriend both have autism and the work place vibe I have observed is very unsettling and awkward . They can't read emotions or cue feeling from other people and they seem to have no filters for others in the kitchen . I like them both as a person,but as boss and his assistant. They both make it very difficult. I noticed the trend to blame everyone in the kitchen for everything that happens. I also noticed they are very distracted by each other and makes them take longer on projects and ends up with his girlfriend working longer hours..there is so much I want to say here , because I deeply wanna understand and know how to approach them.
I told my boss my friend died and he was totally numb to it and gave me no response other than I'm sorry for your loss...but didn't acknowledge that being at work might not be the best place to be during a mourning period...and I feel he didn't pick up on because he has autism. And it concerns me and I'm now starting to question whether I can handle working with someone who can't read cue, behavior, body language and or other emotion.self accountability or holding himself and his girlfriend in a standard that doesn't allow their homelife disagreementss to affect the work place when they shut down.
Because I notice he can trigger her to be very quiet and shut down, she starts acting upset by being silent and incommunicable ..and needs her space. And it affects the work place vibe...I know it's also just their autism.
They are nice people outside of work, I just don't know how to handle their behavior or their lack of ability to acknowledge others and how they make people feel.
Thanks for sharing. I don’t know the people in question so I really can’t comment on the situation
One of my friends as Asperger’s and literally has not many friends, and every time I’ve been on the phone recently he’s really blunt as soon as I’ve talked about something that’s bothering me, I would listen to his problems really often and he was kind of relying on me for that for a long time. As soon as I’ve talked about mine he says he needs to go. It’s so annoying man it really pisses me off . If this kind of lack of empathy or emotional reciprocity is a symptom I can seriously see how some struggle to maintain friendships. I literally don’t know how to deal with it
Get a better friend
This IS rude, not autism 😅
I have ASD and people bullied me called stupid and rude not buying it
From my experiences I have called a rude or mean a few times in my life. All I was trying to do was be honest and forthcoming to the person I was talking to. Also from my perspective I don't think autistic people are rude, we are just not very trusting of neuro-typical people since they don't know what it is like to live in our shoes so to speak.
Hi James thank you for your comment
Maybe it is masking. But, I do not like to talk about personal things (finance, medical, etc.). Some NT people share way to much about themselves with strangers. When I encounter this, I'm think to myself "I don't really care" and make every effort to get out of that conversation. On the other hand, in professional life - I am fact and truth based. If "you can't handle the truth" - don't ask me the question. I will not filter or try to make it sound positive. I can't stand when people don't just come out and say what the issue is.
Actually I also tend to share everything or nothing so mostly I try to share nothing
Whenever I am challenged or called rude I respond by being silent. Now, is that being rude?
I guess it would depend on the situation I’m not sure
Yes
Thanks for sharing
Wow. So you can imagine that this makes relationships really, uhm, zesty.
I guess so
I made a terrible joke about my friend the other day and she confronted me about it, and when I said sorry I was over explaining myself and that is also considered rude. And I have noticed that neurotypicals often make jokes on other peoples behalf so I was honestly just mimicking, and she is adhd, and she said she wasn't angry but I feel like she is and now I am overanalyzing the situation, even though we talked about it and she said it was okay. I do understand that it was a bad joke and she was hurt, but I also am struggling with a lot of anxiety about it right now.
I’m sorry this happened - I have been through it as well. Even last
Night I was talking about how I struggle to let things go and start apologizing even if there isn’t anything to apologize for. I think I just want to make things right (to the point where I am feeling back at peace)
Yes, sometimes, but not on purpose
Indeed
Maybe there are better ways to communicate with people than to call people rude. My two cents
My experience with this is that people around me say "oh, it's not what you said but the tone that you said it, that implies this this and that..." I ended up being called rude and people gaslight me, treating me as if I'm angry or mad.... I can't understand... I didn't implied anything..., and apparently the tone also means something? This is so difficult to understand... And sometimes I do get angry when people tell me that I sound angry even when I'm not... It's like a self fulfilling prophecy where people don't hear actual words but only sounds...
Good point, People do find the tone important. it's a whole other part of communication.
Very caring until you get targeted.
Hi Dustin sorry I’m not sure what aspect you are referring to
Hi i was getting along with this person in a work setting. I really thought they are super smart nice and interesting8. They were very approving of me my wprking style. One day They just decided they dont want to work witg me and they want to work with someone else. I guess i was blindsided by their bluntness. And i feel like i was being picked out of a room for being newly employed. I am trying to learn because i haven't had this happen in my job. I felt shamed.
In my opinion, the burden of communication should not rely on the person disabled by the system.
That is a good thought thanks for sharing
yes, they have moments in which they are rude bc they don't understand social norms.
If I get called rude... I usually ask "when?" I find it funny to observe the visible face of confusion (one of the very few faces I do understand) I do my best not to laugh in the moment and get to laugh about it later.😂😂😂 I think the confusion comes from "how does he not know" rolling around the back of their brain...😊
Interesting. So you do know what you where rude about and pretend not to know? Thank you for clarifying. I was saying in the video that asd people mostly don’t know that they have been rude.
@@WoodshedTheory I'm sorry if this is a little long... I didn't realize it would be this long... Oops... My bad...
well I meant that "when?" was a genuine question but confusion is one of the few faces I can pick out even though I still don't know what I did... There aren't very many faces I can pick out like... Insert example here: jealousy or disgust or other also subtle faces that aren't as obvious as confusion or anger a person's face is hard to read but I often find the fact that they don't know why I don't know funny... I've had practice connecting the dots connected to the facial expression of confusion because I noticed that when I asked "when" instead of "why" it was usually followed by the other person's question of "what do mean "when?"" And after I noticed it I started finding it funny yet I knew that laughing at someone's face is wrong because I went through that too with my flat affect face... So I would purposely not process the thing I found funny until sometime later... You see I don't find rudeness funny, but the really weird expression of confusion that is often absent on my face. In this connection of the dots experiment I did I learned through trial and error what basic face tend to be different another basic face... What I mean by basic face is the more obvious differences between each face. It's more details mostly unrelated to the face like I know a smile represents "happy"... A change in body temp and redness in the face along with clenched fists tends to represent "anger"... Tears represent "sad"... And "shock" or "surprise" tends to be accompanied by a jolt or jump... Everything else is more subtle and I don't understand it... I only know confusion because a question usually follows it... It took me years to realize that...
I know I'm weird. But I embrace it with what I can only hope is pride...
I can be rude on purpose though if I feel offended by something someone said I didn't like(especially if It was ableist)
And again, I'm sorry for the in depth info dump that you didn't ask for. (By the way I'm on the spectrum, in case you didn't guess by what I just did unexpectedly(and I don't remember why I felt it was so important anymore)) omg if anyone actually reads this I'll be shocked