Let’s explore the example of Kong in greater depth. In many ways he is similar to Jaws. In fact the 1976 studio reboot of Kong came about as a conscious decision following the success of Jaws the year before. The characters are very similar ie not malicious, not vindictive but represent antagonism and conflict because of a latent threat they pose / fear of them etc. [definition of antagonist]. This intensifies when they are placed in a normal world i.e. a city for Kong or a tourist coast line during summer with Jaws. The nature of Kong and Jaws is very complex but also beautifully primeval and simple. By definition ‘an antagonist is a person who actively opposes or is hostile to someone or something; an adversary’ as wikipedia puts it ‘An antagonist is a character, group of characters, institution or concept that stands in or represents opposition against which the protagonist(s) must contend. In other words, an antagonist is a person or a group of people who oppose a protagonist.’ Kong is an antagonist by definition, however, what makes Kong complex - in many screen versions at least - is that the audience feels sympathy with his plight and filmmakers have portrayed him as an anti-hero.
Steven Irizarry I know fleshing out your antagonist is important, I never said it wasn't. But I feel like how to make the villain "terrifying" is more based on their behavior, how they say things, and what they do. Their backstory and why they do what they do should certainly be thought out from the beginning, but it shouldn't surface too early or too late in the story if you want the audience to see them as intimidating.
One of the best parts of my writing is actually my villains. In fact some of my best work is where even the heros are kind of villains. There are a few things you can do to make him terrifying however it requires you to give him a character arc. The first way to make you fear the villain is to make you absolutely fucking hate him. I like to point to superman in the first 2 injustice comics. You absolutely fucking hate him however you know how fucked batman is without kryptonite (and they never let kryptonite become a factor). The other way is to actually let the villain win. The injustice comic does this well but the pendragon books do it alot better. Not only do you like the story enough to fallow along the first 5 books on the 7th book however you realize how absolutely useless the hero is at stopping the villain. the 4th book also does this well but is the start to making the villain more terrifying.
I like how Killgrave in Jessica Jones is terrifying. It's the danger, ability and willingness of the villain to do something terrible to your favourite character. What Killgrave does is that he controls people's will. He orders you to do something, or even suggests it and your whole life will revolve around fulfilling that order. For example (spoiler) making you sleep with him, cut your own throat, kill your own family, two people peel skin of each other's faces and so on and so forth. In other words with him, you are always one word away from hell.
Another important tip for antagonists: They don't have to be people or even living things. Antagonist does not equal villain. An antagonist is simply an element that the protagonist is seeking to overcome. As such, your antagonist could be an ailment, an environment, or even a concept. A perfect example would be the film The Martian. There is no villain in the story consciously working against the hero, but there is an antagonist in the form of the planet Mars. It's surface doesn't support life and the protagonist has to survive the unsurvivable until he can escape. Keep this in mind when writing your stories so you can focus on what the true antagonist of your story is. Avoid adding villains to stories where the true antagonist is something less tangible.
Thanks, that's a great point. I went into this in another video... or it could have been a viewer question... using Gravity as an example but yes, The Martian works just as well. Thanks for posting.
I can’t believe you actually had me googling that. Put it down to the fact that sometimes I get my B’s & M’s mixed up. You can imagine the uproar over my video featuring a pair of Molluscs.
I disagree regarding the most compelling antagonists being those who see themselves as a hero. It's not the same as being honest with themselves or a true believer in their own cause, the more compelling ones generally are self-reflective, self-aware and rarely shallow, sophisticated. It's not about what is right, it's about what they believe they need to do... an antagonist could very well know that all he does is terrible but had to be done. They can overlap but are not the same thing. Those that think themselves the hero might as well be the dime a dozen holier-than-thou religious preacher who all think they are special and chosen... tend to be the most annoying & just narcissistic.
This video is riddled with bad points. Believe it or not doing bad things that you think are right are the points that a good HERO should have. Lets look at batman in the dark knight. He absolutely hates killing however he does it because he knows the joker will never stop killing people. The key to a good hero is actually not the hero himself its the asshole. Every good superhero needs an asshole. For example superman has batman. Xaolin showdown has raimundo be the asshole. There is no heros in marvel.
It doesn't matter what "type" of villain your villain is- how compelling they are is solely based on your skills as a writer. And also, in some cases, the character-who-believes-they're-a-hero can be very well done and interesting because it makes the reader wonder what said character went through to have such a strong, irreversible perception of what "justice" is. Dime a dozen mustachio twirling villains can go either way (honest with themselves or self proclaimed hero) and be equally terribly written, usually bc the author neglects them a proper story, or doesn't take the time to develop their motives. To sum up, any sort of villain can be compelling as long as the author takes the time to examine them rather than settling into overused tropes and cliches.
The protagonists in the thing I'm working on aren't really good people themselves. I mean, they're less "MUAHAHAHAHA!!! I WILL DESTROY THE WORLD!!" and more "Hey, gotta make a living." An antagonist in this is actually a cop, so there's that.
One thing I like to do is take virtues and twist them to the extreme. One semi-villain I'm writing of is devoted to freedom and liberty for all, at any cost. Seriously, any. He thinks slavery should be punished by death, but he also thinks long term prisons sentences might as well be slavery, meaning he wants to bring down the ruling government and "liberate" the people, whether they like it or not.
Are you familiar with the Knight Templar trope? It's a lot like what you're describing. Someone who thinks they're doing right but in trying to do right, does wrong. Anyways, I like your idea.
There's also a large group that's created a mostly-utopian society, and decided that everyone in the galaxy should have their quality of life. Greatest good for the greatest number of people. But rather than focus on diplomacy and trade, they decided it would be faster to just declare war on anyone who resisted their ideals, and forcibly spread their way of life. It's the best course in the long run, who cares about the billions of people we slaughter achieving it? They're the ones that tried to stop us from taking over anyway, so its their fault! (They're perhaps more literal knight templars, because they do act kind of like they are knights sometimes. Except space knights with guns.)
I'd say they're less evil than the "freedom and liberty" guy, because at least they are actually instating a good society and infrastructure, whereas the other guy just thinks that anarchy, frontier justice, vigilantes, and pirate gangs are the way to go, and anyone who opposes them is a tyrant.
The large group sounds like "Utopia Justifies the Means". If you ever do finish this, I'd like to read it. I've dabbled in writing before, albeit I'm more fond of the fantasy genre than sci-fi.
What about Zuko from Avatar the Last Airbender? He was the antagonist, but he changed a lot towards the end. Unless you mean like, the main MAIN antagonist, which would be his dad, right? IDK
It’s typical for the antagonist to have a ‘henchman’. This not only creates a physical obstacle for the hero but it also give them an additional obstacle to overcome before the actual antagonist can be defeated. Think Bond films, the Matrix, Jurassic park etc etc. Thanks for posting.
Click Imagination that's something that makes the star wars trilogy interesting. most people probably think of vader when picking out a villain in the movies but in the end vader is just a pawn that does the dirty work of the real villain.
And what is whit the emeror? Is he a good Antagonist? I think not, because he had no realy Backstory in the 3 first Movies and was just evil, because too be Evil. Just for the records, I dont think someone is interested in it. I think Villians like Anti Spira, Zone, Kyubey, L and the Major are great Antagonists. Kyubey and Anti Spiral just want to protect the Universe, like Zone what will destroy a Town too change the Future, and L will hatch a Massmurder, the Protagonist. And the Major. He is a Nazi. And he is the Most Evil Charakter ever. All of them are Animevillians, but all of them are very interessting Charakters.
"A villain doesn't have a character arc?" I don't particularly agree with this they are still people (or at least sentient creatures) and time changes people. not to say they will resort to giving up or realize the wrong doing but this could take form in a greater ambition of drive (almost frantic) towards winning. I think making your antagonist not have a character arc at all is almost lazy and could quite possibly result in a stale character. now I do think that quite regularly the character arc which they is indeed smaller, smaller but not nothing at all. every single character you create has motivations and desires or else are they either necessity or a properly fleshed out being? With this being said I did like and agree with the majority of which you said. Keep up the good work and the amazing quality of your videos!!
Baylee Siedr If you give the antagonist a character arc, that would mean their normalcy would change, they would have a change of heart or something. And that would contradict what he just said in the second point don’t you think? EDIT: What you must be describing is an anti-hero as stated in the top pinned comment
I think a lot of people avoid giving their villains character arcs because doing so makes the audience sympathize with them more, which depending on how you want your villain to be portrayed, can be a bad thing. If you look at villains such as the Joker, Emperor Palpatine and Fire Lord Ozai, their backstories are mostly unknowns. This is to not only give them a sense of mystery, but also to dehumanize them and make them seem more evil, and thus harder to sympathize with.
The mayor is an antagonistic force but just not the main villain in story terms ie unstoppable force meets immovable object . I like the thinking though as technically there wouldn't be a story if he wasn't insistent on keeping the beach open ie Jaws isn't a threat on land. So for that reason he sets the stakes and the ticking clocking. Without the mayor you woukld still have the shark but no pressure to sort the problem out. Thanks for that. A good point.
Hi. It’s usually the case so don’t worry. If you’ve not seen them already check out the free screenwriting tutorials. We start with developing the antagonist. th-cam.com/video/btNxe4fnZi4/w-d-xo.html Thanks for posting.
Using antagonists like Jaws as an example is pretty one dimensional in terms of examples for a complex antagonist. In a sense, the shark, being only a shark that is not humanised in ways where we can't connect with them on an emotional level or relate to the humanity of it, is more of a safety hazard than a complex antagonist. And that can work too, as it is, indeed a shark. Characters are best portrayed by showing or at least implying that there is humanity in there, if you want to create a character to create a connection with the audience. This makes a character realistic, as all humans have emotion behind them, if they hide it or not. This is of course optional if you don't wanna have a deeper story and want to make it more lighthearted. If you want more advice on characters, cause I'm assuming you came here as a writer, I have a few suggestions that are extremely helpful, _Brookes Eggleston- Character design forge:_ he gives really good advice on how to create characters and stories. He addresses the visual design component and the storytelling part while being really entertaining. He's on youtube and has helped my writing and drawing out a lot _Trope Talks:_ also on youtube. They give explanations for tropes and dissect writing clichés while making the viewers understand these components of stories. This is really helpful and they're also really funny.
Motivations and backstory are essential. Every evildoer has a whole life behind them. You can discern and deduce what their motivations are even if their backstory isn't completely spelled out. The Outlanders in Horizon:Zero Dawn that attack the Sacred Land and killed Rost's family, for example. They sadistically slaughter and torture others and mock the other's refusal to leave the Sacred Lands as a method of alleviating the frustration derived from their misfortunes in life or the abuse suffered from other humans, as well as a means to make themselves feel as though they have a sense of power and self-worth.
Nitpick. You say it's hard to see Kong as an antagonist, conflating antagonist with villain. King isn't evil(not a villain), but he's definitely in conflict with the protagonists, and that makes him the antagonist.
I think King Pin as done in the Netflix Daredevil is a good example of a villian done right. Honestly, while Heath's Joker was really well done, Jack's one I liked because I could see people working for him for reasons other than terror. He did not constantly kill his own guys, which bothers me in a bad guy.
Hi, I totally agree. There has to be reason and motive behind the actions else the audience sense it's a device to make them more 'villainous.' Thanks for posting
THIS IS COMPLETELY UNRELATED BUT THE INTRO MUSIC DISTRACTED ME SO MUCH BECAUSE DAN HOWELL USES IT FOR HIS INTERNET SUPPORT GROUP AND I JUST CAN'T AND I ALSO APOLOGIZE BECAUSE THE PHANDOM IS EVERYWHERE
for an example of a villain that undergoes a character arc, look no further than Meruem from Hunter x Hunter, a character who's introduction made me sigh with boredom, but whose death made me cry
Hi. I’m not familiar with the series but will google it. It’s not that villains can’t have character arcs, it’s really a generalisation. Softening of the audience’s perception of an antagonist at the end of a movie can - if a writer isn’t careful - undermine the heroes objective. Which is to say that if the hero defeats evil - but that evil turns out to be not that evil really (in fact we quite like them actually) - then it can impact on how the audience feels when the leave the cinema. However - as I keep saying… it’s not really about rules / can’s / can’t etc. writers are famous for pulling off all sorts of cleverness.
yeah i get what you mean. following the hero's journey only to have the rug pulled out from under both of us is pretty disappointing! it's done tastefully in the Chimera Ant arc, don't worry
depends of the story hunter x hunter is a very long running series so an arc for the villain makes sense, it most fiction villains dont have the time for a full arc
He's got Killer queen Gunpowder gelatin It is not as it seems He will blow your ass to shreeeeeeeeds *Cough cough* You forgot Kira, not edgy impostor kira but Yoshikage, a serial killer who just wants to live a quiet life when the main cast crashes into his life, ruining everything he built for himself as a seemingly mundane buisnessman living in the suburbs. He's such a great villain you almost feel sorry for him instead of hating him.
It is quite helpful video but i feel the need to point something out At first i do not think villain has to think he is a hero, in my opinion he just has to think he is right or his actions, no matter how evil or crazy they are, are justified And other thing is that it is much harder to write about villain's character arc, but if you want to, you can, you can drive them into madness, you can crush all their world (for example give them someone who they would die for and then kill this person mercilessly, it can change anyone) There are no rules, it is about creativity and ability to use it with some common sense sorry for long post and possible mistakes, English isn't my native language :v
When are you doing the protagonist video? I have created a very complex antagonist and I now need ideas on how to create the perfect protagonist to match.
Just started the mentor video but I’ll do the protagonist after. The animation takes a little while though so in the meantime - to create the protagonist… make them a polar opposite of the antagonist. i.e. if your antagonist has no rules - make sure your protagonist does (Batman v Joker) if your antagonist is a womaniser make your hero shy. If your hero is afraid of heights have your antagonist live in penthouse. By seeing this dynamic both in terms of character and story structure you will be able to see how your hero will need to change to overcome them. Check out the video on structure. th-cam.com/video/kJwCl1IoMDA/w-d-xo.html it explains how to mirror the hero and villain's story arcs.
Is it a screenplay? If so then backstory should really be avoided where possible. Writers tend to see back story as crucial but audiences don’t. It can just slow down a movie. If back story is necessary then play with the structure to suit. Don’t just bolt it on. Ie use a non linear narrative to tell both stories. One tip with back story - don’t tell it all at once - create a subplot with it and weave information as and when necessary into the main story. Avoid the back story opening cliche followed by the ’10 years later’. I know - I know you see it everywhere but it's a really a quick fix or device to create a dramatic, pre-credit opening. If the back story is setting up the character then ‘show’ / dramatise the character in the present day in Act 1 with how they live with the resulting weakness or flaw. Every story is different of course and every writer approaches things differently so go with your gut. Oh, the reason I asked if it was a screenplay is that it’s an easier fix in a novel. There's some character stuff on the website if you want some general tips. Hope this helps.
+Click Imagination thanks a lot! I am planning for a book I am going to write and the villain's backstory is very important otherwise the reader won't understand why they are a villain etc. After the mentor and then the hero videos could you do a sidekick for the villain/hero?
Jaws is NOT a villain - he is an animal plain and simple - doing what animals like his species does - at least in the story - (Real great whites seldom attack humans and actually studies have shown them not even liking the taste of humans.) Yes, he is very frightening, dangerous and a predator, but a villain - that just silly. That's like calling an earthquake a villain. or a fire or a lightning strike a villain. Watch out, that avalanche is so evil! ...silliness to even suggest it.
Some villains, like say, Adachi from Persona 4, are so goddamn fun not because they're trying to do the right thing, but because they're sick of the system that maybe the protagonist is endorsing. Adachi was fun because he was a ruthless cynic fed up with everyday life, like a lot of players might feel. Even if he did wrong, it was a release from the "Good boy" image of the protagonist. Sometimes it's an unseen antagonist, for example, the military in Catch-22. Sure, there are some faces to be put to that, Colonel Korn for example, but the bigger villain Heller was pointing out was the beuacracy behind him, pushing him and those around him to send men to their death. Sometimes a story doesn't even need a villian or a hero, instead revolving around two morally grey characters, and sometimes the villian is best left in the protagonist's spot.
Hi, I'm having some trouble coming up with a good villain for my story and this has been a big help. But I'm still a bit lost on what his unshakeable motivations should be. The general premise is that he attacks the North Pole with the intention of killing everyone in there. His ultimate goal at the moment is to kill Santa and draw out his brother, Krampus. Who in modern day society would want to do that?
Hi. Thanks for posting. Glad it's been a big help. I get the idea of killing Santa and thus spoiling Christmas for all the boys and girls. You could see how a kid who grew up with disappointment and jealousy could make that leap but why kill Santa to draw out his brother. Check our online series. We start with the antagonist - might help. th-cam.com/video/btNxe4fnZi4/w-d-xo.html
Really, it's not a must for an antagonist to think they are the hero, some antagonists also have a character arc so this is is just a video on how to make something cliche and old.
A villain that doesn't change by the end is a badly written villain unless they're purposefully insane or psychopath. Villains don't need to do a whole 180 but redemption arcs are great because It reflects how anyone can turn evil if put through enough tragedy, abuse or brainwashing.
Just to pick up on the point... 'A villain that doesn't change by the end is a badly written villain'. I understand the point you're making but I would issue a caution. Yes, if done well, the reversal of the antagonist's character arc can produce exceptional cinema, however, the majority of scripts I read where the writer tries this, it fails - it serves to undermines the hero at the end. The audience needs someone to cheer and someone to boo. This is the basis of story telling for thousands of years. No need to change that - it simply works. The hero succeeds at the end - the audience feels satisfied. The success is deserved if the villain is a worthy opponent. The more villainous the antagonist, the more heroic the hero needs to be to stop them. If the antagonist softens... be careful not to make it at the expense of the hero as a direct result of the antagonist changing - changing AFTER the hero has defeated them is the way to go. It helps if you think of heroism and antagonism as a force [not just peple] affecting every aspect of the story. Pushing and pulling creates tension. If both sides feel to be going in the same direction - there is no tension.
Is this a good villain for the book I’m writing? A man who was once good, he killed a dictator who oppressed and killed the villains family, but to insure that the proficiency, (that his children will rebuild his regime) won’t come true. He sets out to kill the dictator’s children. A girl escapes him. When his spy’s find her 13 years later , they try to kill her, se escapes. He hires bounty hunters to kill her, but he wants her death to be quick, as he does have symphony for her, and truly believes that there is no other way. Spoiler alert In the end, he falls off a cliff, the main charter grabs his hand, he looks up at him, and says “ I will never ask for lifestyle the hands of that family agin” he than lets go of the main character’s hand and falls to his death. So he is more of a hero turned anit hero then a villain. His main goal is to prevent people from suffering in the way that he suffered. If there is anything wrong with him, than what do I need to change?
Hi. Thanks for posting. So your question ‘is this a good villain for the book I’m writing’… hummm. I really can’t make such a black and white response based on that paragraph alone as so much would appear to depend on the prophecy and the world’s belief in it. These things are also about how much conviction you have as a writer to make them good. I can see there would be conflict but I would make sure the logic is sound. Secondly, think about how will the hero and villain will work together to deliver the story and create a satisfying ending? Hope this helps.
What if your villain sees himself as a villain in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way? I have a "protagonist" who is antagonistic, who says his acquaintances' level of villainy is rather blase. "I've bought shares in Sifto Salt." "You do realize, you're giving off vibes that you're up to something." "Well... it could well be that I am." "I hope you realize that someone might get in your face about it." "Fucker better have a cape!" "Should I... maybe umm... let that slip to the media?" "... ... ... snirk... do it."
Hi, thanks for posting. It’s really good question. Because I don’t have much to go on in relation to the story - keep it to yourself by the way, don’t post publicly - I think it comes down to audience, tone and genre. In your mind, what’s examples of similar projects - and have they worked with an audience and commercially (not always the same things). I’d say try anything. Writers are always pushing boundaries and making original stuff work… but… be savvy to what’s gone before you and is there a market. Best luck with the project. Let me know how you get on.
I'm not really sure how you can say that Skynet is a compelling villain, that's the real villain of the Terminator movies, not just the individual killing machines.
Sorry - Kong is far from a villain - in fact I wouldn't even consider him an antagonist - after all he is the key character and it's the environment and world around him that came calling. His adversaries; the dinosaurs, the humans, and even the fem fatal who are the villains. Kong is what he is and is good as what he is. He is "normal" in his world. It is the characters out to seek Kong or fight Kong who represent opposition against HIM. They are the antagonists. Just because they are humans doesn't mean they are automatically the protagonists.
If you want to immerse the reader into the heros perspective and hate the villain have them do something horrendous. Thanos killing everyone Umbridge scarring Harry Bad guys killings John Wicks dog In order for us to hate a character they have to do something first
I have a question about a possible video you could make because I'm really struggling with it. Why The villain would want to kill/hurt the protagonist ?
Hi, thanks for posting. Attached is a link to a tutorial in how to outline a story with the hero and villain plotted together. In order to bind the hero and villain you need a common objective to create tension ie the villain has wired a bus to blow up once it drops below 50mph, the hero has to stop that from happening. Both are equally determined which makes the stakes and tension ever higher. Does that answer your question? th-cam.com/video/5U4IgCn78BI/w-d-xo.html
Give me tips on this antagonist I'm writing. He's the leader of the country, and he manufactured pills that are falsely advertised, he is aware that the pills do not do what they are told to do, but the pills do something else that does do something good. He has a sociopathic personality, but is not willing to risk a lot of things to stop the protagonist.
Hi. So what is it that he wants? Start with that. What’s he trying to achieve. You also said ‘he manufactured’ as apposed to manufacturing - so what’s he doing at the time the story starts. I get that he’s passing pills off as something they’re not but you’re saying they’re actually have some benefits. Do you mean health benefits or as party drugs - because if the former then surely he would just stop selling them for the original reason (which they’re no good for anyway), rebrand and sell them for the actual good they do. I’m ignoring the FDA’s view on all this of course. Thanks for posting.
Click Imagination I think I should be a little more specific. The story I'm writing is dystopian, the pills were meant to prevent people from turning into creatures, but that isnt the case. The reason the creatures exist is because a war broke out prior to the events of the story, the war was caused by mentally unstable people and cause lots of problems, the antagonists mother was greatly affected by this, his drive is that he doesn't want this war to happen. He knows that mental disorders don't scare the citizens as much as the creatures do, so to spread the pills around, he sold them off as prevention from turning into some kind of monster. Through this he climbed the ranks and eventually became a leader.
OK Paper Jam. Seems that he has a personal, genuine reason. I’m not clear on the logic of antagonist v protagonist though. So does the hero want the war and why is this good.
If I can ask, would it be believable or possible to make a well-written antagonist who questions whether or not what he's doing is really right throughout the story, but he's already done so much that it's about impossible to go back?
Hi, thanks for posting. Firstly, nothing is impossible or unworkable but I’d say you need to be careful you don’t weaken the hero’s journey by the antagonist seeking redemption. Inner conflict… conflict in any form… is the stuff of great stories but the audience needs someone to root for and someone to boo. Write out the ending and see what that would look like. If you can still make it satisfying then you’re doing something right.
Thank you for the feedback! I wanted to show the reader he wasn't completely heartless and make them have some understanding of his motives and perhaps sympathy, but still in the end know that he still deserves to lose/pay for what he's done,, if that makes any sense. Would that be a good idea at all?
Hi. The main issue is to just make sure that the defeat is justified and you’re not rooting for them over the hero. Complex and layered is good but the reader needs to know they still have to be defeated.
Lotad Worshipper if you want an example of someone who wrestles with this point look up the character Griffith from the Berserk manga. The manga itself is also good for seeing a character change over time and how events can change a person. If you don't want to read the entire thing, the example I gave is on chapter 93.
I don't see why someone just has to be forced to follow the old protagonist vs antagonist trope at all. We've been there, done that, countless times. There's much more to explore beyond that. "A song of Ice and Fire"/"Game of Thrones" series got renown while somewhat distancing itself from it. Not to mention it keeps perpetuating the "Us vs Them" mentality that already does enough damage in the real world, not just internationally but interpersonallly as well. People are just people, I find it off-putting to think that readers simply must have an antagonist to dehumanise and destroy. Why can't they be redeemed? Or God Forbid! Actually be right! Why can't a concensus be reached? Why must it end with "Vanquishing Evil". Hey, here's an idea! How about showing the goblin's perspective upon seeing the shining knight heroically slaughtering whole settlements in their righteous quest.
Thanks for reaching out. There’s no rules in relation to character introduction but here are some pointers. 1) introduce the main characters early. 2) dramatise their ‘character’ rather than necessarily introducing them with plot. 3) don’t explain everything about them to quickly. 4) set up the antagonist in such a way that when the hero is introduced (or vice versa) the audience go ‘ahhh - I see why this might fit together’ 5) make the introductions memorable These might help th-cam.com/video/btNxe4fnZi4/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/SRyJZ8EPazg/w-d-xo.html Best of luck
Then i would question the tension in the first and third act if the hero has no antagonist to face and overcome. Hard to comment without details of course.
@@ЖудаМ Hidden influence sounds like classic misdirection with a reveal of the truth in the 3rd act TADA - the twist. But you don't have an antagonist in the 3rd act either - so I'm not sure what you mean. There should be an objective goal, subjective obstacles and ever building threat and jeopardy - to mention but a few ingredients. Check out the blog posts on the website - loads of stuff there to help and explain www.clickimagination.com
Hey what if the villain is one primordial evil that possess's those who have darkness in their hearts and depending on how evil the person originally is the force of evil takes over or just becomes a power for the villain, can that be done well?
In response to both points. For me it's how that logic and motivation is dramatised. The key is getting the reader or audience to believe they have reason and conviction. So its not so much as having darkness in their heart - its about there objective and how that darkness makes them dangerous and unstoppable.
it starts out just with an insatiable hunger that its simple mind at first translates into a need to consume all but as it gets smarter it figures out that it is only one part of a whole and is incomplete, also once it is smart enough to figure out it is getting smarter it finds people who are smart and uses them to gain more intelligence, also at first it is just drawn towards the darkness in peoples hearts since it thinks on a subconscious level that their darkness can complete it.
OK, that makes sense. It's not feeling the 'darkness can complete it' though. It would be good to say that - once complete - there is an objective that they're working to obtain. This objective will be what the hero is working to stop. So the antagonist is 'complete'? What next? What jeopardy does that create to the world? That's why must the be stopped at all costs.
Hi. The plan was to work on more animations depending on how well they went down with viewers. Happy to start the next one. Which would be useful? The hero, the central character or the mentor? Thanks for watching.
This video is simply "How to make a specific kind of villain" A story with a villain is also a specific kind of story too, and this video doesn't even touch their _need_ and _why_ in the story. " A villain does not have a Character arc" Am I in Terrible Writing Advice? Was that sarcasm? I hope it was. Amateurish and overly specific advice, and it lacks argumentative foundation for itself.
Click Imagination This is awesome the person who posted the video actually responded! I seriously can’t tell you how awesome that is man! Okay okay calm down. I would suspect that give climatic changes and the gradual increase of the luminosity of the sun that their might be some changes. But overall if the basic anatomy of the Shark works from an evolutionary perspective then there would be no need for changes.
Well hey umm this is just basic tolkienish villains and heroes, the best thing to do is to have no story arc for your villain? What? Any good writer who writes about real people eg grr martin would know that this is so unrealistic, the point of a story is to immerse someone into the actual story, a great way to do that is to make the characters AT LEAST SEMI HUMAN!! Like come on a great villain needs a story arc to grow as a character so by the end of the story there can be redemption or it could leave the villain worse than when he/she started take Darth Vader, arguably one of the greatest antagonists in history has a story arc for crying out loud, this is basic shit if you are planning on making a book that is not specifically for dumb people and children
Except… Darth isn’t the ultimate antagonist of Star Wars it’s the Emperor or arguably ‘the dark side of the force’. Vader is the antagonist’s henchman, the physical personification of the antagonistic threat. The Emperor has no story arc and the dark side of the force remains unchanged at the end of the film. Vader is defeated, of course, cleverly by his own partial redemption but it doesn’t undermine the ultimate threat. His redemption - and even the Emperors death - doesn’t diminish the dark side of the force - it cleverly remains dormant - until the next chapter. Think of Vader’s character being like a Bond villain’s henchman. They are a plot device to provide a movable threat to the hero and also to hide the ultimate antagonist whose reveal might be kept for the twist of the 3rd act. The reason I say as 'general rule of thumb for the antagonist not to have a character arc' is that you don’t want to undermine the hero’s journey and them ‘saving the day’ - which is to defeat the ultimate threat. If the ultimate antagonist ends up saving themselves then the hero could have probably just stayed home. At a basic level, stories are good v evil… where evil is ultimately defeated by the hero being pushed to the limits. Unstoppable force (hero) meets immovable object (villain). Redemption would, to me at least, indicate the villain is movable after all. With all that said, in my experience, writers who understand the basics of story telling decide how best to play with the rules to serve their story. That’s the fun of learning the craft.
Click Imagination now I understand what you are trying to say but he was the bad guy up until basically the final film where we actually just heard of the emperor in empire but we just saw him in in Jedi so he was the bad guy for basically all of the story
Click Imagination I do really respect you for responding to your viewers for which I am very greatful, just wanted to mention that I agree with all of your points except for the one I was mad about
No problem - it's not about right or wrong - for me it's what a writer can get to work for them. This video offers some basic tools in a very short, 5 minute tutorial.. The subject matter is complex. What I always say in workshops - 'take away what works for you - leave what doesn't'. Best of luck with your projects.
Good stuff, how do you feel about creating characters from the viewpoint of various passions and interests, also creating ambiguity within said interests, possibly conflicting to further add depth. Im amazed damn yt advert actually advertised something of use! Cheers!
Hi Alex. Thanks for watching. In answer to your questions, my initial thought would be it would depend on the chosen canvas. Anything is possible. You could structure a novel to make that type of narrative compelling and would have enough time to establish and explore the interests and depth. Less likely for a 120-minute screenplay but without more detail I couldn’t make a judgement. In context, I’m thinking Game of Thrones ‘the 120-minute movie’ vs a TV series of 5,6 or 7 seasons. It also depends on what the story is that you’re telling. You can effectively have an ‘ensemble peace’ with multiple characters and multiple story arcs but if you’ve not attempted something so complex before I would start small.
It's for a games design, I'm trying to create a somewhat emergent series of events in which would affect the lives of characters driving the narrative forward, vaguely similar to that of a "goosebumps" book an example would be multiple "goosebumps" stories that can be dropped and/or switched between in order to create a progressive story in which the player is the "writer" to some extent. Thank'sya kindly!
Ah, games design. Well, there you open up a can of mystical worms that’s been the debate amongst screenwriters and games designers since time in memorial. Amongst the issue of dialogue and act structure, you have the added challenge of story native (formal structure) v open world interactions of the game player. Best advice is to keep it simple and use the Mr Men approach to characters i.e. give each character a quickly recognisable trait and try not to overlap personalities like TV in order to simply fuel drama. With a clear objective for each character and a clear character trait, you will be able to jump around and the players will pick up easily where they left off. Best of luck.
Let’s explore the example of Kong in greater depth.
In many ways he is similar to Jaws. In fact the 1976 studio reboot of Kong came about as a conscious decision following the success of Jaws the year before. The characters are very similar ie not malicious, not vindictive but represent antagonism and conflict because of a latent threat they pose / fear of them etc. [definition of antagonist]. This intensifies when they are placed in a normal world i.e. a city for Kong or a tourist coast line during summer with Jaws.
The nature of Kong and Jaws is very complex but also beautifully primeval and simple.
By definition ‘an antagonist is a person who actively opposes or is hostile to someone or something; an adversary’ as wikipedia puts it ‘An antagonist is a character, group of characters, institution or concept that stands in or represents opposition against which the protagonist(s) must contend. In other words, an antagonist is a person or a group of people who oppose a protagonist.’
Kong is an antagonist by definition, however, what makes Kong complex - in many screen versions at least - is that the audience feels sympathy with his plight and filmmakers have portrayed him as an anti-hero.
Title was a bit misleading. That was just how to develop the antagonist, not how to make them 'terrifying.'
PirateUnicorn character can make antagonists better than a throwaway cartoon villian...darth vader and joker
Steven Irizarry I know fleshing out your antagonist is important, I never said it wasn't. But I feel like how to make the villain "terrifying" is more based on their behavior, how they say things, and what they do. Their backstory and why they do what they do should certainly be thought out from the beginning, but it shouldn't surface too early or too late in the story if you want the audience to see them as intimidating.
One of the best parts of my writing is actually my villains. In fact some of my best work is where even the heros are kind of villains. There are a few things you can do to make him terrifying however it requires you to give him a character arc.
The first way to make you fear the villain is to make you absolutely fucking hate him. I like to point to superman in the first 2 injustice comics. You absolutely fucking hate him however you know how fucked batman is without kryptonite (and they never let kryptonite become a factor).
The other way is to actually let the villain win. The injustice comic does this well but the pendragon books do it alot better. Not only do you like the story enough to fallow along the first 5 books on the 7th book however you realize how absolutely useless the hero is at stopping the villain. the 4th book also does this well but is the start to making the villain more terrifying.
I like how Killgrave in Jessica Jones is terrifying. It's the danger, ability and willingness of the villain to do something terrible to your favourite character. What Killgrave does is that he controls people's will. He orders you to do something, or even suggests it and your whole life will revolve around fulfilling that order. For example (spoiler) making you sleep with him, cut your own throat, kill your own family, two people peel skin of each other's faces and so on and so forth.
In other words with him, you are always one word away from hell.
I like the anime goblin slayer, so, does goblins count as a force of nature, and do monsters count as in that category?
Look just above they eyes on the hockey mask.
Tiny happy face.
Top marks for spotting it.
Casual Mercy Main :)
Another important tip for antagonists: They don't have to be people or even living things. Antagonist does not equal villain. An antagonist is simply an element that the protagonist is seeking to overcome. As such, your antagonist could be an ailment, an environment, or even a concept. A perfect example would be the film The Martian. There is no villain in the story consciously working against the hero, but there is an antagonist in the form of the planet Mars. It's surface doesn't support life and the protagonist has to survive the unsurvivable until he can escape. Keep this in mind when writing your stories so you can focus on what the true antagonist of your story is. Avoid adding villains to stories where the true antagonist is something less tangible.
Thanks, that's a great point. I went into this in another video... or it could have been a viewer question... using Gravity as an example but yes, The Martian works just as well. Thanks for posting.
That isn't true tho
Antagonist is a CHARACTER that opposes the protagonist (Another character). Literally just that.
yes but baddies are more fun. Imagine Treasure Island without Long John SIlver
King Kong i not a villain. He is a victim of the actual villain.
internet drone A piece of land is not a villain unless it's an earthquake.
Nah, but that one guy who wanted to put him on display is.
death to america
"A few billion years"
This is a huge nitpick, but sharks evolved in the last 500 million years or so.
I can’t believe you actually had me googling that. Put it down to the fact that sometimes I get my B’s & M’s mixed up. You can imagine the uproar over my video featuring a pair of Molluscs.
Aren't Billions and Millions swapped in Britain? Or was that Billions and Trillions?
You have to be careful not to mistake billions for mullions when ordering windows - I learned that the expensive way.
SamuraiSarcasm In some countries billion is milliard and trillion is billion
Thanks, Johan... I can honestly say I didn't know that.
I disagree regarding the most compelling antagonists being those who see themselves as a hero. It's not the same as being honest with themselves or a true believer in their own cause, the more compelling ones generally are self-reflective, self-aware and rarely shallow, sophisticated. It's not about what is right, it's about what they believe they need to do... an antagonist could very well know that all he does is terrible but had to be done. They can overlap but are not the same thing. Those that think themselves the hero might as well be the dime a dozen holier-than-thou religious preacher who all think they are special and chosen... tend to be the most annoying & just narcissistic.
BioCapsule
Exactly what I was thinking. Also, the Joker is a terrible example of a villain that sees themselves as a hero.
couldn't have said it any better myself
I agree 100% with what you said
This video is riddled with bad points. Believe it or not doing bad things that you think are right are the points that a good HERO should have. Lets look at batman in the dark knight. He absolutely hates killing however he does it because he knows the joker will never stop killing people.
The key to a good hero is actually not the hero himself its the asshole. Every good superhero needs an asshole. For example superman has batman. Xaolin showdown has raimundo be the asshole. There is no heros in marvel.
It doesn't matter what "type" of villain your villain is- how compelling they are is solely based on your skills as a writer. And also, in some cases, the character-who-believes-they're-a-hero can be very well done and interesting because it makes the reader wonder what said character went through to have such a strong, irreversible perception of what "justice" is. Dime a dozen mustachio twirling villains can go either way (honest with themselves or self proclaimed hero) and be equally terribly written, usually bc the author neglects them a proper story, or doesn't take the time to develop their motives. To sum up, any sort of villain can be compelling as long as the author takes the time to examine them rather than settling into overused tropes and cliches.
"First and foremost, you have to love your antagonist"
Check✔
Thanks for posting.
The protagonists in the thing I'm working on aren't really good people themselves. I mean, they're less "MUAHAHAHAHA!!! I WILL DESTROY THE WORLD!!" and more "Hey, gotta make a living."
An antagonist in this is actually a cop, so there's that.
cool. have fun.
All the best for the project Joe, thanks for posting.
Ah, the most boring kind of villain.
Petite Cossette I guess you haven't watched Death Note?
.... but Sharks don't actually LIKE human meat. We taste rather unpleasant to them. They much prefer turtles, fish, or seals.
Thanks, i've learned something today.
One thing I like to do is take virtues and twist them to the extreme. One semi-villain I'm writing of is devoted to freedom and liberty for all, at any cost. Seriously, any. He thinks slavery should be punished by death, but he also thinks long term prisons sentences might as well be slavery, meaning he wants to bring down the ruling government and "liberate" the people, whether they like it or not.
Are you familiar with the Knight Templar trope? It's a lot like what you're describing. Someone who thinks they're doing right but in trying to do right, does wrong. Anyways, I like your idea.
Uncle Sam I am indeed familiar, and that's kind of what I'm trying to do.
There's also a large group that's created a mostly-utopian society, and decided that everyone in the galaxy should have their quality of life. Greatest good for the greatest number of people. But rather than focus on diplomacy and trade, they decided it would be faster to just declare war on anyone who resisted their ideals, and forcibly spread their way of life. It's the best course in the long run, who cares about the billions of people we slaughter achieving it? They're the ones that tried to stop us from taking over anyway, so its their fault! (They're perhaps more literal knight templars, because they do act kind of like they are knights sometimes. Except space knights with guns.)
I'd say they're less evil than the "freedom and liberty" guy, because at least they are actually instating a good society and infrastructure, whereas the other guy just thinks that anarchy, frontier justice, vigilantes, and pirate gangs are the way to go, and anyone who opposes them is a tyrant.
The large group sounds like "Utopia Justifies the Means". If you ever do finish this, I'd like to read it. I've dabbled in writing before, albeit I'm more fond of the fantasy genre than sci-fi.
What about Zuko from Avatar the Last Airbender? He was the antagonist, but he changed a lot towards the end. Unless you mean like, the main MAIN antagonist, which would be his dad, right? IDK
It’s typical for the antagonist to have a ‘henchman’. This not only creates a physical obstacle for the hero but it also give them an additional obstacle to overcome before the actual antagonist can be defeated. Think Bond films, the Matrix, Jurassic park etc etc. Thanks for posting.
Click Imagination that's something that makes the star wars trilogy interesting. most people probably think of vader when picking out a villain in the movies but in the end vader is just a pawn that does the dirty work of the real villain.
Vader is a brilliant example.
Thankyou! I see how it works now.
And what is whit the emeror? Is he a good Antagonist? I think not, because he had no realy Backstory in the 3 first Movies and was just evil, because too be Evil.
Just for the records, I dont think someone is interested in it.
I think Villians like Anti Spira, Zone, Kyubey, L and the Major are great Antagonists. Kyubey and Anti Spiral just want to protect the Universe, like Zone what will destroy a Town too change the Future, and L will hatch a Massmurder, the Protagonist. And the Major. He is a Nazi. And he is the Most Evil Charakter ever. All of them are Animevillians, but all of them are very interessting Charakters.
I forgot what the book was called, but it was amazing. It was from the Villains perspective, and it was as if the character wasn’t even the villain
I make up an image and come up with a character through that and add other things, while in the process adding or subtracting from the image
I do the exact same thing. I also test different kinds of voices to see what fits.
Also it helps if you have a pencil
BEFORE you start writing
Thanks for the waste of time guys
"A villain doesn't have a character arc?" I don't particularly agree with this they are still people (or at least sentient creatures) and time changes people. not to say they will resort to giving up or realize the wrong doing but this could take form in a greater ambition of drive (almost frantic) towards winning. I think making your antagonist not have a character arc at all is almost lazy and could quite possibly result in a stale character. now I do think that quite regularly the character arc which they is indeed smaller, smaller but not nothing at all. every single character you create has motivations and desires or else are they either necessity or a properly fleshed out being? With this being said I did like and agree with the majority of which you said. Keep up the good work and the amazing quality of your videos!!
Baylee Siedr
If you give the antagonist a character arc, that would mean their normalcy would change, they would have a change of heart or something. And that would contradict what he just said in the second point don’t you think?
EDIT: What you must be describing is an anti-hero as stated in the top pinned comment
it can also change to more evil, maybe realizing he needs to take more extreme measures to achive a goal or something.
Compelling antagonists can definitely have a character arc, I don't know what that part was about.
@@kayelao2005 Antagonist and Anti-Hero aren't mutually exclusive.
I think a lot of people avoid giving their villains character arcs because doing so makes the audience sympathize with them more, which depending on how you want your villain to be portrayed, can be a bad thing. If you look at villains such as the Joker, Emperor Palpatine and Fire Lord Ozai, their backstories are mostly unknowns. This is to not only give them a sense of mystery, but also to dehumanize them and make them seem more evil, and thus harder to sympathize with.
I always thought the mayor was the villain in Jaws
The mayor is an antagonistic force but just not the main villain in story terms ie unstoppable force meets immovable object . I like the thinking though as technically there wouldn't be a story if he wasn't insistent on keeping the beach open ie Jaws isn't a threat on land. So for that reason he sets the stakes and the ticking clocking. Without the mayor you woukld still have the shark but no pressure to sort the problem out. Thanks for that. A good point.
Excellent. Terse, and with good pace. I can concentrate this long.
Thanks, we aim to please
Thank you so much for this video… I have a story idea and a perfect protagonist but I'm seriously lacking when it comes to antagonists.
Hi. It’s usually the case so don’t worry. If you’ve not seen them already check out the free screenwriting tutorials. We start with developing the antagonist. th-cam.com/video/btNxe4fnZi4/w-d-xo.html Thanks for posting.
"the antagonist doesn't have a character arc"
Prince Zuko, everbody.
to be fair zuko wasn't the main villain of the whole series, it was the fire lord
That's true, didn't think about that
2:20 Yep, Jaws is a cute shark :3
There are villains, monsters and beasts; make sure to understand the distinctive differences.
Awesome channel. I am writing my first published comic book. This is helpful
Lovely to hear. Thanks for letting me know and best of luck with the comic. Hope all the content helps.
Using antagonists like Jaws as an example is pretty one dimensional in terms of examples for a complex antagonist. In a sense, the shark, being only a shark that is not humanised in ways where we can't connect with them on an emotional level or relate to the humanity of it, is more of a safety hazard than a complex antagonist. And that can work too, as it is, indeed a shark. Characters are best portrayed by showing or at least implying that there is humanity in there, if you want to create a character to create a connection with the audience. This makes a character realistic, as all humans have emotion behind them, if they hide it or not. This is of course optional if you don't wanna have a deeper story and want to make it more lighthearted.
If you want more advice on characters, cause I'm assuming you came here as a writer, I have a few suggestions that are extremely helpful,
_Brookes Eggleston- Character design forge:_ he gives really good advice on how to create characters and stories. He addresses the visual design component and the storytelling part while being really entertaining. He's on youtube and has helped my writing and drawing out a lot
_Trope Talks:_ also on youtube. They give explanations for tropes and dissect writing clichés while making the viewers understand these components of stories. This is really helpful and they're also really funny.
Motivations and backstory are essential. Every evildoer has a whole life behind them. You can discern and deduce what their motivations are even if their backstory isn't completely spelled out.
The Outlanders in Horizon:Zero Dawn that attack the Sacred Land and killed Rost's family, for example. They sadistically slaughter and torture others and mock the other's refusal to leave the Sacred Lands as a method of alleviating the frustration derived from their misfortunes in life or the abuse suffered from other humans, as well as a means to make themselves feel as though they have a sense of power and self-worth.
Nitpick. You say it's hard to see Kong as an antagonist, conflating antagonist with villain. King isn't evil(not a villain), but he's definitely in conflict with the protagonists, and that makes him the antagonist.
I think King Pin as done in the Netflix Daredevil is a good example of a villian done right. Honestly, while Heath's Joker was really well done, Jack's one I liked because I could see people working for him for reasons other than terror. He did not constantly kill his own guys, which bothers me in a bad guy.
Hi, I totally agree. There has to be reason and motive behind the actions else the audience sense it's a device to make them more 'villainous.' Thanks for posting
THIS IS COMPLETELY UNRELATED BUT THE INTRO MUSIC DISTRACTED ME SO MUCH BECAUSE DAN HOWELL USES IT FOR HIS INTERNET SUPPORT GROUP AND I JUST CAN'T AND I ALSO APOLOGIZE BECAUSE THE PHANDOM IS EVERYWHERE
Random Fandom Trash the phandom is truly everywhere
I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHERE I HEARD IT
for an example of a villain that undergoes a character arc, look no further than Meruem from Hunter x Hunter, a character who's introduction made me sigh with boredom, but whose death made me cry
Hi. I’m not familiar with the series but will google it. It’s not that villains can’t have character arcs, it’s really a generalisation. Softening of the audience’s perception of an antagonist at the end of a movie can - if a writer isn’t careful - undermine the heroes objective. Which is to say that if the hero defeats evil - but that evil turns out to be not that evil really (in fact we quite like them actually) - then it can impact on how the audience feels when the leave the cinema. However - as I keep saying… it’s not really about rules / can’s / can’t etc. writers are famous for pulling off all sorts of cleverness.
yeah i get what you mean. following the hero's journey only to have the rug pulled out from under both of us is pretty disappointing! it's done tastefully in the Chimera Ant arc, don't worry
depends of the story hunter x hunter is a very long running series so an arc for the villain makes sense, it most fiction villains dont have the time for a full arc
He's got Killer queen
Gunpowder gelatin
It is not as it seems
He will blow your ass to shreeeeeeeeds
*Cough cough*
You forgot Kira, not edgy impostor kira but Yoshikage, a serial killer who just wants to live a quiet life when the main cast crashes into his life, ruining everything he built for himself as a seemingly mundane buisnessman living in the suburbs. He's such a great villain you almost feel sorry for him instead of hating him.
It is quite helpful video but i feel the need to point something out
At first i do not think villain has to think he is a hero, in my opinion he just has to think he is right or his actions, no matter how evil or crazy they are, are justified
And other thing is that it is much harder to write about villain's character arc, but if you want to, you can, you can drive them into madness, you can crush all their world (for example give them someone who they would die for and then kill this person mercilessly, it can change anyone)
There are no rules, it is about creativity and ability to use it with some common sense
sorry for long post and possible mistakes, English isn't my native language :v
Thank you! Great video!
Our pleasure. Glad you enjoyed it.
thank you so much
Pleasure, Loren
"How to create a cliche antagonist"
When are you doing the protagonist video? I have created a very complex antagonist and I now need ideas on how to create the perfect protagonist to match.
Could you also do a video on how to do backstories for the characters? Thanks
Just started the mentor video but I’ll do the protagonist after. The animation takes a little while though so in the meantime - to create the protagonist… make them a polar opposite of the antagonist. i.e. if your antagonist has no rules - make sure your protagonist does (Batman v Joker) if your antagonist is a womaniser make your hero shy. If your hero is afraid of heights have your antagonist live in penthouse. By seeing this dynamic both in terms of character and story structure you will be able to see how your hero will need to change to overcome them. Check out the video on structure. th-cam.com/video/kJwCl1IoMDA/w-d-xo.html it explains how to mirror the hero and villain's story arcs.
Is it a screenplay? If so then backstory should really be avoided where possible. Writers tend to see back story as crucial but audiences don’t. It can just slow down a movie. If back story is necessary then play with the structure to suit. Don’t just bolt it on. Ie use a non linear narrative to tell both stories. One tip with back story - don’t tell it all at once - create a subplot with it and weave information as and when necessary into the main story. Avoid the back story opening cliche followed by the ’10 years later’. I know - I know you see it everywhere but it's a really a quick fix or device to create a dramatic, pre-credit opening. If the back story is setting up the character then ‘show’ / dramatise the character in the present day in Act 1 with how they live with the resulting weakness or flaw. Every story is different of course and every writer approaches things differently so go with your gut. Oh, the reason I asked if it was a screenplay is that it’s an easier fix in a novel. There's some character stuff on the website if you want some general tips. Hope this helps.
+Click Imagination thanks a lot! I am planning for a book I am going to write and the villain's backstory is very important otherwise the reader won't understand why they are a villain etc. After the mentor and then the hero videos could you do a sidekick for the villain/hero?
Will do. Good luck with the novel.
Jaws is NOT a villain - he is an animal plain and simple - doing what animals like his species does - at least in the story - (Real great whites seldom attack humans and actually studies have shown them not even liking the taste of humans.) Yes, he is very frightening, dangerous and a predator, but a villain - that just silly. That's like calling an earthquake a villain. or a fire or a lightning strike a villain. Watch out, that avalanche is so evil! ...silliness to even suggest it.
Some villains, like say, Adachi from Persona 4, are so goddamn fun not because they're trying to do the right thing, but because they're sick of the system that maybe the protagonist is endorsing. Adachi was fun because he was a ruthless cynic fed up with everyday life, like a lot of players might feel. Even if he did wrong, it was a release from the "Good boy" image of the protagonist.
Sometimes it's an unseen antagonist, for example, the military in Catch-22. Sure, there are some faces to be put to that, Colonel Korn for example, but the bigger villain Heller was pointing out was the beuacracy behind him, pushing him and those around him to send men to their death. Sometimes a story doesn't even need a villian or a hero, instead revolving around two morally grey characters, and sometimes the villian is best left in the protagonist's spot.
Thanks for posting.
Hi, I'm having some trouble coming up with a good villain for my story and this has been a big help. But I'm still a bit lost on what his unshakeable motivations should be. The general premise is that he attacks the North Pole with the intention of killing everyone in there. His ultimate goal at the moment is to kill Santa and draw out his brother, Krampus. Who in modern day society would want to do that?
Hi. Thanks for posting. Glad it's been a big help. I get the idea of killing Santa and thus spoiling Christmas for all the boys and girls. You could see how a kid who grew up with disappointment and jealousy could make that leap but why kill Santa to draw out his brother.
Check our online series. We start with the antagonist - might help. th-cam.com/video/btNxe4fnZi4/w-d-xo.html
Really, it's not a must for an antagonist to think they are the hero, some antagonists also have a character arc so this is is just a video on how to make something cliche and old.
thanos? 3:25?, i feel like the whole of infinity war was thanos development arc
Was that the same background music as Danisnotonfire's Internet Support Group at the end
A villain that doesn't change by the end is a badly written villain unless they're purposefully insane or psychopath. Villains don't need to do a whole 180 but redemption arcs are great because It reflects how anyone can turn evil if put through enough tragedy, abuse or brainwashing.
Just to pick up on the point... 'A villain that doesn't change by the end is a badly written villain'. I understand the point you're making but I would issue a caution. Yes, if done well, the reversal of the antagonist's character arc can produce exceptional cinema, however, the majority of scripts I read where the writer tries this, it fails - it serves to undermines the hero at the end. The audience needs someone to cheer and someone to boo. This is the basis of story telling for thousands of years. No need to change that - it simply works. The hero succeeds at the end - the audience feels satisfied. The success is deserved if the villain is a worthy opponent. The more villainous the antagonist, the more heroic the hero needs to be to stop them. If the antagonist softens... be careful not to make it at the expense of the hero as a direct result of the antagonist changing - changing AFTER the hero has defeated them is the way to go.
It helps if you think of heroism and antagonism as a force [not just peple] affecting every aspect of the story. Pushing and pulling creates tension. If both sides feel to be going in the same direction - there is no tension.
How come you didn't use The Terminator as the main example? There are literal lines ('cant be bargained with', and 'absolutely will never stop...')
Hi Brian, yes The Terminator is a brilliant example. Thanks for posting.
jaws and kong? that's it?! I got nothing out of this video.
Is this a good villain for the book I’m writing?
A man who was once good, he killed a dictator who oppressed and killed the villains family, but to insure that the proficiency, (that his children will rebuild his regime) won’t come true. He sets out to kill the dictator’s children. A girl escapes him. When his spy’s find her 13 years later , they try to kill her, se escapes. He hires bounty hunters to kill her, but he wants her death to be quick, as he does have symphony for her, and truly believes that there is no other way.
Spoiler alert
In the end, he falls off a cliff, the main charter grabs his hand, he looks up at him, and says “ I will never ask for lifestyle the hands of that family agin” he than lets go of the main character’s hand and falls to his death. So he is more of a hero turned anit hero then a villain. His main goal is to prevent people from suffering in the way that he suffered.
If there is anything wrong with him, than what do I need to change?
Hi. Thanks for posting. So your question ‘is this a good villain for the book I’m writing’… hummm. I really can’t make such a black and white response based on that paragraph alone as so much would appear to depend on the prophecy and the world’s belief in it. These things are also about how much conviction you have as a writer to make them good. I can see there would be conflict but I would make sure the logic is sound. Secondly, think about how will the hero and villain will work together to deliver the story and create a satisfying ending? Hope this helps.
What if your villain sees himself as a villain in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way? I have a "protagonist" who is antagonistic, who says his acquaintances' level of villainy is rather blase.
"I've bought shares in Sifto Salt."
"You do realize, you're giving off vibes that you're up to something."
"Well... it could well be that I am."
"I hope you realize that someone might get in your face about it."
"Fucker better have a cape!"
"Should I... maybe umm... let that slip to the media?"
"... ... ... snirk... do it."
Hi, thanks for posting.
It’s really good question. Because I don’t have much to go on in relation to the story - keep it to yourself by the way, don’t post publicly - I think it comes down to audience, tone and genre. In your mind, what’s examples of similar projects - and have they worked with an audience and commercially (not always the same things). I’d say try anything. Writers are always pushing boundaries and making original stuff work… but… be savvy to what’s gone before you and is there a market. Best luck with the project. Let me know how you get on.
I'm not really sure how you can say that Skynet is a compelling villain, that's the real villain of the Terminator movies, not just the individual killing machines.
Skynet is more of an abstract background with no character or attributes other than "Must kill all humans/John Connor"
Sorry - Kong is far from a villain - in fact I wouldn't even consider him an antagonist - after all he is the key character and it's the environment and world around him that came calling. His adversaries; the dinosaurs, the humans, and even the fem fatal who are the villains. Kong is what he is and is good as what he is. He is "normal" in his world. It is the characters out to seek Kong or fight Kong who represent opposition against HIM. They are the antagonists. Just because they are humans doesn't mean they are automatically the protagonists.
If you want to immerse the reader into the heros perspective and hate the villain have them do something horrendous.
Thanos killing everyone
Umbridge scarring Harry
Bad guys killings John Wicks dog
In order for us to hate a character they have to do something first
I have a question about a possible video you could make because I'm really struggling with it. Why The villain would want to kill/hurt the protagonist ?
Hi, thanks for posting. Attached is a link to a tutorial in how to outline a story with the hero and villain plotted together. In order to bind the hero and villain you need a common objective to create tension ie the villain has wired a bus to blow up once it drops below 50mph, the hero has to stop that from happening. Both are equally determined which makes the stakes and tension ever higher. Does that answer your question? th-cam.com/video/5U4IgCn78BI/w-d-xo.html
The joker doesn't care if he's right or normal.
Exactly. Thanks, Matthew. That's what makes him such an antagonist.
Click Imagination Joker is supposed to be chaos incarnate, the randomness of crime. You could say he is a "force of nature" type villain as well.
I'm also trying to make him a character that the reader will HATE
It's not an easy thing to achieve so best of luck. Thanks for posting and please let me know how you get on. Regards
Give me tips on this antagonist I'm writing.
He's the leader of the country, and he manufactured pills that are falsely advertised, he is aware that the pills do not do what they are told to do, but the pills do something else that does do something good. He has a sociopathic personality, but is not willing to risk a lot of things to stop the protagonist.
Hi. So what is it that he wants? Start with that. What’s he trying to achieve. You also said ‘he manufactured’ as apposed to manufacturing - so what’s he doing at the time the story starts. I get that he’s passing pills off as something they’re not but you’re saying they’re actually have some benefits. Do you mean health benefits or as party drugs - because if the former then surely he would just stop selling them for the original reason (which they’re no good for anyway), rebrand and sell them for the actual good they do. I’m ignoring the FDA’s view on all this of course. Thanks for posting.
Click Imagination
I think I should be a little more specific. The story I'm writing is dystopian, the pills were meant to prevent people from turning into creatures, but that isnt the case. The reason the creatures exist is because a war broke out prior to the events of the story, the war was caused by mentally unstable people and cause lots of problems, the antagonists mother was greatly affected by this, his drive is that he doesn't want this war to happen. He knows that mental disorders don't scare the citizens as much as the creatures do, so to spread the pills around, he sold them off as prevention from turning into some kind of monster. Through this he climbed the ranks and eventually became a leader.
OK Paper Jam. Seems that he has a personal, genuine reason. I’m not clear on the logic of antagonist v protagonist though. So does the hero want the war and why is this good.
If I can ask, would it be believable or possible to make a well-written antagonist who questions whether or not what he's doing is really right throughout the story, but he's already done so much that it's about impossible to go back?
Hi, thanks for posting. Firstly, nothing is impossible or unworkable but I’d say you need to be careful you don’t weaken the hero’s journey by the antagonist seeking redemption. Inner conflict… conflict in any form… is the stuff of great stories but the audience needs someone to root for and someone to boo. Write out the ending and see what that would look like. If you can still make it satisfying then you’re doing something right.
Thank you for the feedback!
I wanted to show the reader he wasn't completely heartless and make them have some understanding of his motives and perhaps sympathy, but still in the end know that he still deserves to lose/pay for what he's done,, if that makes any sense.
Would that be a good idea at all?
Hi. The main issue is to just make sure that the defeat is justified and you’re not rooting for them over the hero. Complex and layered is good but the reader needs to know they still have to be defeated.
Lotad Worshipper if you want an example of someone who wrestles with this point look up the character Griffith from the Berserk manga. The manga itself is also good for seeing a character change over time and how events can change a person. If you don't want to read the entire thing, the example I gave is on chapter 93.
I don't see why someone just has to be forced to follow the old protagonist vs antagonist trope at all. We've been there, done that, countless times. There's much more to explore beyond that.
"A song of Ice and Fire"/"Game of Thrones" series got renown while somewhat distancing itself from it.
Not to mention it keeps perpetuating the "Us vs Them" mentality that already does enough damage in the real world, not just internationally but interpersonallly as well.
People are just people, I find it off-putting to think that readers simply must have an antagonist to dehumanise and destroy. Why can't they be redeemed? Or God Forbid! Actually be right!
Why can't a concensus be reached? Why must it end with "Vanquishing Evil".
Hey, here's an idea! How about showing the goblin's perspective upon seeing the shining knight heroically slaughtering whole settlements in their righteous quest.
An unrelentless villain who thinks what they’re doing is right is terrifying indeed
Thanks for posting
Hi, I'm having trouble introducing my antagonist in the first act.
Thanks for reaching out. There’s no rules in relation to character introduction but here are some pointers. 1) introduce the main characters early. 2) dramatise their ‘character’ rather than necessarily introducing them with plot. 3) don’t explain everything about them to quickly. 4) set up the antagonist in such a way that when the hero is introduced (or vice versa) the audience go ‘ahhh - I see why this might fit together’ 5) make the introductions memorable
These might help
th-cam.com/video/btNxe4fnZi4/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/SRyJZ8EPazg/w-d-xo.html
Best of luck
Click Imagination Thank you very much and great video
What if the story isn't about a hero and just features a villain?
I can't picture where the drama, tension, jeopardy will come from. What's the context?
What if the antagonist appears only indeed in the ACT II?
Then i would question the tension in the first and third act if the hero has no antagonist to face and overcome. Hard to comment without details of course.
@@ClickImagination Maybe some kind of hidden influence to create tension?
@@ЖудаМ Hidden influence sounds like classic misdirection with a reveal of the truth in the 3rd act TADA - the twist. But you don't have an antagonist in the 3rd act either - so I'm not sure what you mean. There should be an objective goal, subjective obstacles and ever building threat and jeopardy - to mention but a few ingredients. Check out the blog posts on the website - loads of stuff there to help and explain www.clickimagination.com
@@ClickImagination right :)
There's a place where we can talk? I need to discuss this subject :)
@@ЖудаМ Contact via the website. Otherwise i just get spam. Thanks
Boy this is harder than school
Can anyone rate an antagonist I've wrote about? Just comment yes and I'll explain
Feel free to post. Happy to comment.
Jaws was driven by memes not by hunger as we all know.
although some say memes are more fulfilling then food.
Hey what if the villain is one primordial evil that possess's those who have darkness in their hearts and depending on how evil the person originally is the force of evil takes over or just becomes a power for the villain, can that be done well?
also the force starts out as mindless but each time it possesses someone it uses their intellect to become smarter
In response to both points. For me it's how that logic and motivation is dramatised. The key is getting the reader or audience to believe they have reason and conviction. So its not so much as having darkness in their heart - its about there objective and how that darkness makes them dangerous and unstoppable.
It's a great trick, i like the mechanics but... What's their motivation to possess all these people? What is the end game for them?
it starts out just with an insatiable hunger that its simple mind at first translates into a need to consume all but as it gets smarter it figures out that it is only one part of a whole and is incomplete, also once it is smart enough to figure out it is getting smarter it finds people who are smart and uses them to gain more intelligence, also at first it is just drawn towards the darkness in peoples hearts since it thinks on a subconscious level that their darkness can complete it.
OK, that makes sense. It's not feeling the 'darkness can complete it' though. It would be good to say that - once complete - there is an objective that they're working to obtain. This objective will be what the hero is working to stop. So the antagonist is 'complete'? What next? What jeopardy does that create to the world? That's why must the be stopped at all costs.
I can't find the other vids in this series
Hi. The plan was to work on more animations depending on how well they went down with viewers. Happy to start the next one. Which would be useful? The hero, the central character or the mentor? Thanks for watching.
+Click Imagination I'd love to see the next video if you could do that. I really love the animations. They play well with your talking
Thanks, really glad you liked it. Which character should I do next - hero, mentor or central character?
+Click Imagination id like to see the mentor :)
Sure thing. Just finishing off a corporate video project then i'll get right onto it. Thanks for getting in touch.
There are plenty of better videos explaining this video better and offers examples of different kinds of antagonism
This video is simply "How to make a specific kind of villain"
A story with a villain is also a specific kind of story too, and this video doesn't even touch their _need_ and _why_ in the story.
" A villain does not have a Character arc"
Am I in Terrible Writing Advice? Was that sarcasm? I hope it was.
Amateurish and overly specific advice, and it lacks argumentative foundation for itself.
cool cool, chill chill
This video was very generic and actually gave some bad advice, animations were aight tho
Y
Real life "villians" arn't complex. They would be very boring to read about.
Million, not billion good sir.
It's a fair cop but i do wonder if sharks would actually be any different after a billion years. Thanks for posting.
Click Imagination This is awesome the person who posted the video actually responded! I seriously can’t tell you how awesome that is man! Okay okay calm down. I would suspect that give climatic changes and the gradual increase of the luminosity of the sun that their might be some changes. But overall if the basic anatomy of the Shark works from an evolutionary perspective then there would be no need for changes.
King Kong wasn't the villain
Well hey umm this is just basic tolkienish villains and heroes, the best thing to do is to have no story arc for your villain? What? Any good writer who writes about real people eg grr martin would know that this is so unrealistic, the point of a story is to immerse someone into the actual story, a great way to do that is to make the characters AT LEAST SEMI HUMAN!! Like come on a great villain needs a story arc to grow as a character so by the end of the story there can be redemption or it could leave the villain worse than when he/she started take Darth Vader, arguably one of the greatest antagonists in history has a story arc for crying out loud, this is basic shit if you are planning on making a book that is not specifically for dumb people and children
Except… Darth isn’t the ultimate antagonist of Star Wars it’s the Emperor or arguably ‘the dark side of the force’. Vader is the antagonist’s henchman, the physical personification of the antagonistic threat. The Emperor has no story arc and the dark side of the force remains unchanged at the end of the film. Vader is defeated, of course, cleverly by his own partial redemption but it doesn’t undermine the ultimate threat. His redemption - and even the Emperors death - doesn’t diminish the dark side of the force - it cleverly remains dormant - until the next chapter.
Think of Vader’s character being like a Bond villain’s henchman. They are a plot device to provide a movable threat to the hero and also to hide the ultimate antagonist whose reveal might be kept for the twist of the 3rd act.
The reason I say as 'general rule of thumb for the antagonist not to have a character arc' is that you don’t want to undermine the hero’s journey and them ‘saving the day’ - which is to defeat the ultimate threat. If the ultimate antagonist ends up saving themselves then the hero could have probably just stayed home.
At a basic level, stories are good v evil… where evil is ultimately defeated by the hero being pushed to the limits. Unstoppable force (hero) meets immovable object (villain). Redemption would, to me at least, indicate the villain is movable after all.
With all that said, in my experience, writers who understand the basics of story telling decide how best to play with the rules to serve their story. That’s the fun of learning the craft.
Click Imagination now I understand what you are trying to say but he was the bad guy up until basically the final film where we actually just heard of the emperor in empire but we just saw him in in Jedi so he was the bad guy for basically all of the story
Click Imagination I do really respect you for responding to your viewers for which I am very greatful, just wanted to mention that I agree with all of your points except for the one I was mad about
No problem - it's not about right or wrong - for me it's what a writer can get to work for them. This video offers some basic tools in a very short, 5 minute tutorial.. The subject matter is complex. What I always say in workshops - 'take away what works for you - leave what doesn't'. Best of luck with your projects.
This is a good way to make formulaic bull crap
Give them a top hat and lots of money. INSTANTLY EVIL.
Funnily enough, I just played Monopoly.
And the moustache! You can't forget the moustache!
Good stuff, how do you feel about creating characters from the viewpoint of various passions and interests, also creating ambiguity within said interests, possibly conflicting to further add depth. Im amazed damn yt advert actually advertised something of use! Cheers!
Hi Alex. Thanks for watching. In answer to your questions, my initial thought would be it would depend on the chosen canvas. Anything is possible. You could structure a novel to make that type of narrative compelling and would have enough time to establish and explore the interests and depth. Less likely for a 120-minute screenplay but without more detail I couldn’t make a judgement. In context, I’m thinking Game of Thrones ‘the 120-minute movie’ vs a TV series of 5,6 or 7 seasons. It also depends on what the story is that you’re telling. You can effectively have an ‘ensemble peace’ with multiple characters and multiple story arcs but if you’ve not attempted something so complex before I would start small.
It's for a games design, I'm trying to create a somewhat emergent series of events in which would affect the lives of characters driving the narrative forward, vaguely similar to that of a "goosebumps" book an example would be multiple "goosebumps" stories that can be dropped and/or switched between in order to create a progressive story in which the player is the "writer" to some extent. Thank'sya kindly!
Ah, games design. Well, there you open up a can of mystical worms that’s been the debate amongst screenwriters and games designers since time in memorial. Amongst the issue of dialogue and act structure, you have the added challenge of story native (formal structure) v open world interactions of the game player. Best advice is to keep it simple and use the Mr Men approach to characters i.e. give each character a quickly recognisable trait and try not to overlap personalities like TV in order to simply fuel drama. With a clear objective for each character and a clear character trait, you will be able to jump around and the players will pick up easily where they left off. Best of luck.