Genuinely in awe of your layout! It’s exactly how I would have mine if I had the space for one! The beauty of TH-cam if folk like you who share your layout with others to enjoy!
They chose a good time for a sale, as someone who has been loving driving the 87 on the TSW Preston->Carlisle route that has just come out the thought of picking up a model had crossed my mind.
I loved the Class 87s. When i worked at Rugby Borough Council i was based in the Works Unit, which was by the WCML. Class 8X loco hauled trains going North, generally with a Class 82 DVT on the London end. Incidentally, TEMU markets a Class 81 priced at £23.49! Looks like a static model on a plinth. It too has the grey roof and a plastic pantograph. As a kid, I had a Class 81 AL1 and a Class 77 EM2 on my layout. They both had metal working pantographs, and a switch to select the method of current collection (wheels or pantograph). On the 78, the switch was disguised as a rib on the roof.
I saw this pantograph collection switch on one of my uncles locos recently. I've never seen live overhead wires on a model though. Did Triang/Hornby make this?
Yeah, does make you wonder. On one hand they're saying, costs have gone up and this is how much it is to make these days. On the other hand they can afford to do almost half price discounts. I can't imagine they're making a lot off these models though, probably just want them gone and to get the cash back in.
I bought a sound fitted blue version from Olivia’s Trains and I must say it’s excellent, the sound especially. Pulls prototypical 9-10 coach rakes although the only downside is I can only get a scale top speed of 80 mph and need 100 so may need to fiddle with CV’s at some point.
I loved the Class 87s. When i worked at Rugby Borough Council i was based in the Works Unit, which was by the WCML. Class 8X loco hauled trains going North, generally with a Class 82 DVT on the London end. Incodentally, TEMU markets a Class 81 priced at £23.49!
A few months back I picked up this loco for 45£ in a lot with a Hornby N2. Brand New, barely run. I am not too interested in electric locos, so I mostly bought the lot for the N2, but after close inspection (mine is in the Virgin Rail livery named Sir Winston Churchill) I gotta say it's a very nice model. Especially the lighting with cab lights. I love it, but it's rather lacking for over 230£ it's bonkers. DCC sound, maybe, but analogue absolutely not. Yours looks much nicer than mine I think, but owning a electric locomotive is quite for me. Greetings from Switzerland 🇨🇭
I fully agree on the price. I picked up this model for about €150, which seemed more than fair, but full price is too high. One thing I wonder about is the shade of yellow. It seems a little too orangey to me - or at least it looks it compared to my other UK models with yellow ends.
I did wonder about the paint colours, but I'm not really in a position to judge being colour deficient and not knowing enough about the era. I agree the yellow ends look very orangey and the executive livery doesn't match my Hornby coaches, but I expect there were variations.
The only problem I have with the metal pantographs is with you over time they tend to fail with fatigue cracks forming in all the essential pivoting components of the pantograph itself
I love that model shop! Every time I go in It’s like stepping back in time. The only downside to the shop is I get a bad case of the willy wants and then I have to pull myself back into line and remember I don’t have any space for a layout 😢 Still a great shop to lose an hour in just looking around!
@ Hi 🙋♂️ Thanks! Definitely love a good look around in there, so many nooks and crannies you literally have to look everywhere because you always see something that you haven’t seen before! It’s interesting just seeing what other people are looking at and buying also! The only thing I tend to buy is the Hornby Christmas wagon when it comes out every year, I have managed to collect them all starting way back with the first one in the Christmas Special train set to the first stand alone wagon in 2005 right through to the present year!
I got the one in grey large logo R30030 a while ago. It looks absolutely fantastic, in my opinion. Unfortunately though it has some quite serious flaws which led me to expressing some quite uncharitable thoughts about Hornby's design department in the privacy of my living room. I was never able to get it running to my satisfaction and so it lives in it's box under my layout.
I tried it with a Gaugemaster ruby and a zen - I couldn't achieve a smooth start from standstill. In addition the decoder position, as mentioned, is far from ideal. All they had to do was make the slot a tiny bit wider and it would not have been so much of a problem but as it is, the act of tightening the pcb mounting screws was twisting the decoder off it's pins. Solved that by packing behind the decoder using a sleeper and some kapton tape but come on - a little bit of thought could have avoided the problem. Which is a shame because as I said, the livery is probably my favourite in my collection.
Hi Rob- I just do not know what Hornby are thinking on their price point as it is £50-£60 more than a brand new tooled Accurascale or Cavalex loco with much more detail and features . it is the same with their Class 60 and their RRP should be around £125 where the retailers are having them otherwise why pay more for less. Cheers Kev
Hi James. The affiliate link is for Rails of Sheffield, but the model was reduced by 45% at multiple retailers and on Hornby's website. Also, just to be clear, this isn't an advert for rails and is not a paid promotion.
In my (admittedly relatively limited experience) big price cuts like these are less because of a problem with the model, just the fact that they are vastly overpriced for what they are. Like, heljan models are ALWAYS on sale. (Not all of them, but they are usually on the deals page). And now Hornby have raised their prices so much, they are often on a sizeable discount. For instance, I managed to get a sound fitted turbomotive for around 150 quid. Great model, it’s good. But it’s full price, not worth it for me. Nothing wrong with the model itself, just overpriced. The price I got it for, very happy indeed!
The original class 87 release was equipped for 8 pin, which really restricted the DCC options. Unfortunately, when Hornby "upgraded" this model to 21 pin they kept the 8 pin mapping for functions. That keeps the same restrictive functionality, and on top of that moving the decoder to the underside of the PCB brought with it problems of fitting decoders. Too thick, and they interfere with the flywheels, too long or wide and the PCB doesn't go back down because the decoder doesn't clear the chassis moulding. Its a really poorly laid out model. The livery error is just the icing on the cake...look at the red/white lining on the cab doors, its a different shade to the rest of the bodyside. I returned mine when this batch was first released, absolutely unacceptable model for the price; but that has become par for the course when buying Hornby products. That is most likely why they are so heavily discounted - poor specification, cheaply made and daft mistakes for a market leading price.
I hadn't noticed the door issues. I get the impression this was an old design that took so long to get to market that the tech had moved on and the model was already a bit "out of date".
@@LittleWicketRailway The original release of class 87 was extremely out of date when it was first released in 2018. It wasn't that its an old design, or that it took a long time to develop. On paper, it is a relatively recent release. For some reason Hornby persisted with 8 pin DCC for a decade longer than everyone else. Its only very recently that they have moved to using other interfaces. Their diesel models which were released as 8 pin (such as the class 31, 50, 56, 60 and 87) and have been 'upgraded' to 21 pin have pretty much only had a new 21 pin interface supplied but retain their 8 pin functionality...these being models which carry an RRP of well over £200, but look at the prices and spec of Accurascale and their directly competing models. Or the specification of the cheaper Cavalex class 56. Even Bachmanns class 31 is cheaper for a much higher specification. I think this is ultimately the answer as to why a large selection of Hornby models are so heavily discounted. They had the opportunity to improve and upgrade to meet the challenge from competing models, but for whatever reason they didn't; and now have set their prices insanely higher...Hornbys class 60 R30373 for £249.99 versus exactly the same livery class 60 from Cavalex with a higher spec for £194.95, or the class 60 from Accurascale for £169.99. I really cannot see the sense in Hornby expecting as much as £80 more for an inferior model. For £20 more than Hornby expect for their DC class 60, you can get a DCC sound fitted model from Accurascale!
Another one here that returned mine and got a refund. Such a shame somebody at Hornby doesnt take ownership of this flagship electric loco and sort it out..... i wouldnt even buy one of this particular version at £130. The different shades of red stripe the poor lighting suite functionality, no corridor lights and a flimsy pan. Its 85% of the way there just needs another well thought out refresh.
Genuinely in awe of your layout! It’s exactly how I would have mine if I had the space for one! The beauty of TH-cam if folk like you who share your layout with others to enjoy!
Thanks for that lovely comment. Much appreciated.
They chose a good time for a sale, as someone who has been loving driving the 87 on the TSW Preston->Carlisle route that has just come out the thought of picking up a model had crossed my mind.
I loved the Class 87s. When i worked at Rugby Borough Council i was based in the Works Unit, which was by the WCML. Class 8X loco hauled trains going North, generally with a Class 82 DVT on the London end.
Incidentally, TEMU markets a Class 81 priced at £23.49! Looks like a static model on a plinth. It too has the grey roof and a plastic pantograph.
As a kid, I had a Class 81 AL1 and a Class 77 EM2 on my layout. They both had metal working pantographs, and a switch to select the method of current collection (wheels or pantograph). On the 78, the switch was disguised as a rib on the roof.
I saw this pantograph collection switch on one of my uncles locos recently. I've never seen live overhead wires on a model though. Did Triang/Hornby make this?
@LittleWicketRailway I think they did back in the 80s, although the supports did not look like the WCML, or the later GWML structures iirc.
@@LittleWicketRailway Back in the 1960s Triang sold a class 81 which could pick up power from overhead wires.
A@@LittleWicketRailwayit was the same with the hornby 86 , they had a switch on the roof by the pantograph. I purchased my 2 86s back in 2003 😊
With the discounts they are still making a profit....(although a smaller one) for Mfg & dealers so it shows over inflated retail prices are !
Yeah, does make you wonder. On one hand they're saying, costs have gone up and this is how much it is to make these days. On the other hand they can afford to do almost half price discounts. I can't imagine they're making a lot off these models though, probably just want them gone and to get the cash back in.
I bought a sound fitted blue version from Olivia’s Trains and I must say it’s excellent, the sound especially. Pulls prototypical 9-10 coach rakes although the only downside is I can only get a scale top speed of 80 mph and need 100 so may need to fiddle with CV’s at some point.
Love the picture of the ultimate electric and diesel locos together. 87/60.
I loved the Class 87s. When i worked at Rugby Borough Council i was based in the Works Unit, which was by the WCML. Class 8X loco hauled trains going North, generally with a Class 82 DVT on the London end.
Incodentally, TEMU markets a Class 81 priced at £23.49!
Thanks for the update and happy Christmas to you
A few months back I picked up this loco for 45£ in a lot with a Hornby N2. Brand New, barely run. I am not too interested in electric locos, so I mostly bought the lot for the N2, but after close inspection (mine is in the Virgin Rail livery named Sir Winston Churchill) I gotta say it's a very nice model. Especially the lighting with cab lights. I love it, but it's rather lacking for over 230£ it's bonkers. DCC sound, maybe, but analogue absolutely not. Yours looks much nicer than mine I think, but owning a electric locomotive is quite for me. Greetings from Switzerland 🇨🇭
Nice review and video, Jersey Bill
Thanks Jersey Bill
I fully agree on the price. I picked up this model for about €150, which seemed more than fair, but full price is too high. One thing I wonder about is the shade of yellow. It seems a little too orangey to me - or at least it looks it compared to my other UK models with yellow ends.
I did wonder about the paint colours, but I'm not really in a position to judge being colour deficient and not knowing enough about the era. I agree the yellow ends look very orangey and the executive livery doesn't match my Hornby coaches, but I expect there were variations.
The only problem I have with the metal pantographs is with you over time they tend to fail with fatigue cracks forming in all the essential pivoting components of the pantograph itself
Hi. Rob. I visited Cheltenham Model Centre and noticed a Hornby R30030 £174.50
1970’s models had metal pans because Hornby had a working catenary system the trains could use without using the truck to pick up electricity.
I love that model shop! Every time I go in It’s like stepping back in time. The only downside to the shop is I get a bad case of the willy wants and then I have to pull myself back into line and remember I don’t have any space for a layout 😢 Still a great shop to lose an hour in just looking around!
@SamM-oh2cx Hi. I agree. There is no need to buy. Just look around can be half the fun.
@ Hi 🙋♂️ Thanks! Definitely love a good look around in there, so many nooks and crannies you literally have to look everywhere because you always see something that you haven’t seen before! It’s interesting just seeing what other people are looking at and buying also! The only thing I tend to buy is the Hornby Christmas wagon when it comes out every year, I have managed to collect them all starting way back with the first one in the Christmas Special train set to the first stand alone wagon in 2005 right through to the present year!
Thanks for a useful review
Thanks :-)
A great price for a very decent model.
I got the one in grey large logo R30030 a while ago. It looks absolutely fantastic, in my opinion. Unfortunately though it has some quite serious flaws which led me to expressing some quite uncharitable thoughts about Hornby's design department in the privacy of my living room. I was never able to get it running to my satisfaction and so it lives in it's box under my layout.
What was wrong with yours? Mine runs quite well, but I generally don't rate the design.
Is it possible it's the decoder used?
I tried it with a Gaugemaster ruby and a zen - I couldn't achieve a smooth start from standstill. In addition the decoder position, as mentioned, is far from ideal. All they had to do was make the slot a tiny bit wider and it would not have been so much of a problem but as it is, the act of tightening the pcb mounting screws was twisting the decoder off it's pins. Solved that by packing behind the decoder using a sleeper and some kapton tape but come on - a little bit of thought could have avoided the problem. Which is a shame because as I said, the livery is probably my favourite in my collection.
Hi Rob- I just do not know what Hornby are thinking on their price point as it is £50-£60 more than a brand new tooled Accurascale or Cavalex loco with much more detail and features . it is the same with their Class 60 and their RRP should be around £125 where the retailers are having them otherwise why pay more for less.
Cheers Kev
Hornby is asking £239.99 at time of this post.
I think this is a advert for Rails of Sheffield.
Screen shot is of Hornby, Black Friday sale. I agree rails of Sheffield have the City of Glasgow discounted, couldn’t see this one…
Hi James. The affiliate link is for Rails of Sheffield, but the model was reduced by 45% at multiple retailers and on Hornby's website. Also, just to be clear, this isn't an advert for rails and is not a paid promotion.
@@LittleWicketRailway Hornby site is back up to £239, no stock at Rails and TMC sold out all sinnce your video.
In my (admittedly relatively limited experience) big price cuts like these are less because of a problem with the model, just the fact that they are vastly overpriced for what they are.
Like, heljan models are ALWAYS on sale. (Not all of them, but they are usually on the deals page). And now Hornby have raised their prices so much, they are often on a sizeable discount.
For instance, I managed to get a sound fitted turbomotive for around 150 quid. Great model, it’s good. But it’s full price, not worth it for me. Nothing wrong with the model itself, just overpriced. The price I got it for, very happy indeed!
The original class 87 release was equipped for 8 pin, which really restricted the DCC options. Unfortunately, when Hornby "upgraded" this model to 21 pin they kept the 8 pin mapping for functions. That keeps the same restrictive functionality, and on top of that moving the decoder to the underside of the PCB brought with it problems of fitting decoders. Too thick, and they interfere with the flywheels, too long or wide and the PCB doesn't go back down because the decoder doesn't clear the chassis moulding. Its a really poorly laid out model. The livery error is just the icing on the cake...look at the red/white lining on the cab doors, its a different shade to the rest of the bodyside. I returned mine when this batch was first released, absolutely unacceptable model for the price; but that has become par for the course when buying Hornby products. That is most likely why they are so heavily discounted - poor specification, cheaply made and daft mistakes for a market leading price.
I hadn't noticed the door issues. I get the impression this was an old design that took so long to get to market that the tech had moved on and the model was already a bit "out of date".
@@LittleWicketRailway The original release of class 87 was extremely out of date when it was first released in 2018. It wasn't that its an old design, or that it took a long time to develop. On paper, it is a relatively recent release. For some reason Hornby persisted with 8 pin DCC for a decade longer than everyone else. Its only very recently that they have moved to using other interfaces. Their diesel models which were released as 8 pin (such as the class 31, 50, 56, 60 and 87) and have been 'upgraded' to 21 pin have pretty much only had a new 21 pin interface supplied but retain their 8 pin functionality...these being models which carry an RRP of well over £200, but look at the prices and spec of Accurascale and their directly competing models. Or the specification of the cheaper Cavalex class 56. Even Bachmanns class 31 is cheaper for a much higher specification. I think this is ultimately the answer as to why a large selection of Hornby models are so heavily discounted.
They had the opportunity to improve and upgrade to meet the challenge from competing models, but for whatever reason they didn't; and now have set their prices insanely higher...Hornbys class 60 R30373 for £249.99 versus exactly the same livery class 60 from Cavalex with a higher spec for £194.95, or the class 60 from Accurascale for £169.99. I really cannot see the sense in Hornby expecting as much as £80 more for an inferior model. For £20 more than Hornby expect for their DC class 60, you can get a DCC sound fitted model from Accurascale!
Another one here that returned mine and got a refund. Such a shame somebody at Hornby doesnt take ownership of this flagship electric loco and sort it out..... i wouldnt even buy one of this particular version at £130. The different shades of red stripe the poor lighting suite functionality, no corridor lights and a flimsy pan. Its 85% of the way there just needs another well thought out refresh.
Oh Rob, I didn't know you no longer lived in Brum.
Yeah, my city days are done. I still go in occasionally.
Really poor design by Hornby that a speaker cannot be plugged into the HM7000 decoder then the body put back on!
well you can always refund if you dont like it, simple
The pantograph is utter rubbish, still waiting for some replacements
I can tell you what is wrong with it without watching the video - it is made by Hornby and is grossly overpriced.