I just bought birdsfoot trefoil seeds to plant in an old, abandoned garden. I plan to grow it to give to my grassfed ewes during breeding season. I'm really excited to try it out! It is really hard to find here so I'm glad I managed to find my own to grow.
Birdsfoot trefoil seed has been increasingly extremely difficult and expensive to find. Now you can just get non-named cultivar variety mixtures you used to be able to get genetically improved varieties. Mainly that were produced out of New York in Canada but you can’t find any other good new improve varieties anymore. It’s kind of going extinct, I hope you like it the sheep should do greater where are you located?
@michiganhay7844 I'm up in northern BC, Canada. I've noticed everyone just does alfalfa and don't get me wrong, I don't dislike alfalfa, but it does make me a bit nervous to be so reliant on one crop. Wanted to try a bit of variety. I'm planning to grow and harvest the hay myself with no equipment and I should have enough to get us through flushing and breeding next year.
Nice video, I grow a lot of birdsfoot trefoil in a mix. I find on the heaviest ground it out yields any other forage legume and seems to be the hardest to kill through winter grazing or ploughing, just slightly tougher than white clover. Seed is very easy to get hold of here in the uk with 'leo' and 'agri' being varieties that i have been supplied with. BFT always confused me as sometimes it grows through the winter but sometimes it dissappears completely as if its dead in early winter then comes back very strong in June. I have also seen it creep out like white clover but then sometimes grow upright like alfalfa even in different parts of the same field. It also seems to have massive nodules on it compared to red clover or alfalfa so could be fixing more nitrogen on my clay.
Hello. When do you seed the BFT in Uk? I live in Belgium. I tried 2 times to interseed in pasture , 1× in may after first cut and 1× in september . Both times with no succes.
It's funny how so many people think that flail conditioners are bad for legumes.. we used to back the conditioner shield off for clover and alfalfa, then forgot to do it once.. it dried a day faster and didn't notice anything more leaf loss than with rolls..
Thankfully there’s a few pieces that haven’t got replaced by apartments but I have a Lotta ground that has grown houses in apartments in the last 20 years
@@michiganhay7844 I wonder if you also find the tick trefoil which is a whole different plant that cows here liked to eat. It has D shaped stickers that attach to your clothes. The birdsfoot trefoil you have is not supposed to be in Florida but i distinctly remember it growing in cow pastures and around horse barns. Evidently its seeds can survive the digestive system and you would find it growing out of manure piles. A similar plant that was used in pastures is called hairy indigo. It provides nitrogen to grasses and is very common along roads and in power line right of ways here.
@@chargermopar well there’s something that we called tick clover but I think that’s actually sweet clover so I’m not sure if the tick trefoils an actual Trefoil I’ll look it up and then there is hairy vetch I wonder if that is similar to the plant you referred to and yes I’ve heard of Trefoil growing down into maybe Northern Georgia but that’s amazing it will handle the heat there are some people that will put trefoil seed in their mineral and the cows will lick it up and that’s a way of seeding the pastures so yes it’s a very hard seed that slow growing with low seedling vigor but it does go through the digestive tracts of animals and that is a common way that people add it to their pastors
Where at in Michigan? I'd love to pick your brain on this stuff. I'm newer to cattle and want top shelf pasture and hay(fertilizer, herbicide, pesticide free). We're in Willis, looking forward to spring to begin!
Good morning Ray.. the 27th was yesterday.. lots of longer lasting forages take a while to get established. My question, do the gophers like it?? BTW, seed harvest is the same for clovers and alfalfa. Orchard grass matures too fast here, have to get a cutting in mid May, then another in July/August.. but for most of us, it's too wet until end of June, by then orchard grass is like wire, cows won't even eat it unless they're starving.. The old alfafas used to make it 7 to 10 years..
Thanks for the info it sounds like you have the exact same experience with orchard grass as what I do yeah the old Vernal varieties lasted a long time what’s your main grass now?
@@michiganhay7844 here at home it's a mix of everything... Mostly meadow Foxtail and fescue. Most has been in for 60++++ years. Other fields are pretty much whatever has taken over.. some good, some not so good
Very insightful and informative video. Apologies if this was covered already, but if you were planting a new field like this what percentage birdsfoot trefoil would be in your seed mix? (Assuming you had access to a variety of your liking).
@@michiganhay7844 Very interesting. What grass/grass mix would you go in with the following year if you were trying to maintain a late/flexible cutting window? Just timothy and some brome? Appreciate the insight.
@@spencerray3633 some broom because it stays green Timothy possibly it doesn’t seem to come in every year but I’m starting to like endophyte novel tall fescue holds its color till way late in the year like Braum but yields a lot more
Awesome video, treefoil must be a eastern thing? I've never seen it in person I don't think. Around here atleat half the horse hay buyers will only take straight grass. And I agree 100% straight grass won't do anything without feeding it nitrogen. I kind of disagree about the balage comments tho. If you hire the wrapping done it will cost $5 to $7 a bale. It definitely is more economical to feed balage then dry hay stored outside. The feed value is higher and there is no waste. In today's weather patterns cutting one day and baling that afternoon or next morning means more hay made in short weather windows. Also high quality alfalfa is cheaper to produce then buying protein supplements.
They grow Trefoil in northern Minnesota quite a bit of it up by Duluth superior Wisconsin cause I’ve seen it up there you’re just in a heavy Rowcrop area where it’s considered a weed it’s probably been largely eradicated in your area. You’re right about being able to have somebody to come in and custom wrap some areas have access to that some don’t I was pretty much referring to if you bought the equipment as far as feed quality and value that’s kind of really not true properly bail dry hey is just as good quality as baleage except you can make the argument there are more digestible carbohydrates in baleage because there was less time for the plant to Respirer however it’s kind of a silly justification for beef cows since a brood cowherd certainly does not require dairy quality level hey and the extra carbohydrates actually can be detrimental to the overall beef cowherd in that situation being that they really are designed as a forager scavenger and to utilize that ruminant to the best economic potential as well however I think this is a good topic for another video that I think I will do to explain more in depth my justification about the industry push to over utilize baleage and a beef cow herd I just think economically it makes very little sense to me However I would really like to see a bigger perspective from your view on this I think this would be a really good video for you as well always appreciate your input and the comments thank you
@@michiganhay7844 As always I'm not here to start arguments. I should of explained a bit, with balage you have less of a chance with weather affecting feed quality. You get it up faster and preserve it better. While yes brood cows don't need high quality feed all the time, when milking for the calf you will have better calf gains feeding cows higher protein feed. But my main point for high protein/feed value is backgrounding your own calves. If you want to capture the most dollars per head you can't sell them off the cow anymore. Protein and energy are what puts pounds on calve in my opinion. That's where I was going with the alfalfa. It's more cost effective for me to raise 22% plus protein alfalfa then to buy protein pellets and mix with $7 corn.
@@e.a.bfarms I agree 100% that’s why I stopped buying corn back in 2008 when the ethanol boom took off I can definitely make a lot more money with Alfalfa and I do actually grow a decent amount of alfalfa as well
It’s funny you ask that if I mow a grass field after it’s fully been pollinated and the seed is ripen the seeds fall right on top of the hood of my Discbine and I’ll scoop that seed up by the bucket loads and I have used that it’s an easy way to harvest it especially the orchard grass seed
Awesome video great to see some hay on the ground
I just bought birdsfoot trefoil seeds to plant in an old, abandoned garden. I plan to grow it to give to my grassfed ewes during breeding season. I'm really excited to try it out! It is really hard to find here so I'm glad I managed to find my own to grow.
Birdsfoot trefoil seed has been increasingly extremely difficult and expensive to find. Now you can just get non-named cultivar variety mixtures you used to be able to get genetically improved varieties. Mainly that were produced out of New York in Canada but you can’t find any other good new improve varieties anymore. It’s kind of going extinct, I hope you like it the sheep should do greater where are you located?
@michiganhay7844 I'm up in northern BC, Canada. I've noticed everyone just does alfalfa and don't get me wrong, I don't dislike alfalfa, but it does make me a bit nervous to be so reliant on one crop. Wanted to try a bit of variety. I'm planning to grow and harvest the hay myself with no equipment and I should have enough to get us through flushing and breeding next year.
@@ShepherdsCreek I gotta look up your videos on how you harvest. Hey, that would be very interesting to watch.
@@michiganhay7844 I'll definitely make some videos on it this summer whether I'm successful or not haha
Nice video, I grow a lot of birdsfoot trefoil in a mix. I find on the heaviest ground it out yields any other forage legume and seems to be the hardest to kill through winter grazing or ploughing, just slightly tougher than white clover. Seed is very easy to get hold of here in the uk with 'leo' and 'agri' being varieties that i have been supplied with. BFT always confused me as sometimes it grows through the winter but sometimes it dissappears completely as if its dead in early winter then comes back very strong in June. I have also seen it creep out like white clover but then sometimes grow upright like alfalfa even in different parts of the same field. It also seems to have massive nodules on it compared to red clover or alfalfa so could be fixing more nitrogen on my clay.
Hello. When do you seed the BFT in Uk? I live in Belgium. I tried 2 times to interseed in pasture , 1× in may after first cut and 1× in september . Both times with no succes.
It's funny how so many people think that flail conditioners are bad for legumes.. we used to back the conditioner shield off for clover and alfalfa, then forgot to do it once.. it dried a day faster and didn't notice anything more leaf loss than with rolls..
With my old John Deere Mocho I had a lot of hard times trying to get legumes dry
@@michiganhay7844 interesting... We found the flail stripped the wax off and drying was faster than being crimped
It must me great to have pasture 20 years later instead of being replaced by apartments.
Thankfully there’s a few pieces that haven’t got replaced by apartments but I have a Lotta ground that has grown houses in apartments in the last 20 years
@@michiganhay7844 I wonder if you also find the tick trefoil which is a whole different plant that cows here liked to eat. It has D shaped stickers that attach to your clothes. The birdsfoot trefoil you have is not supposed to be in Florida but i distinctly remember it growing in cow pastures and around horse barns. Evidently its seeds can survive the digestive system and you would find it growing out of manure piles. A similar plant that was used in pastures is called hairy indigo. It provides nitrogen to grasses and is very common along roads and in power line right of ways here.
@@chargermopar well there’s something that we called tick clover but I think that’s actually sweet clover so I’m not sure if the tick trefoils an actual Trefoil I’ll look it up and then there is hairy vetch I wonder if that is similar to the plant you referred to and yes I’ve heard of Trefoil growing down into maybe Northern Georgia but that’s amazing it will handle the heat there are some people that will put trefoil seed in their mineral and the cows will lick it up and that’s a way of seeding the pastures so yes it’s a very hard seed that slow growing with low seedling vigor but it does go through the digestive tracts of animals and that is a common way that people add it to their pastors
Where at in Michigan? I'd love to pick your brain on this stuff. I'm newer to cattle and want top shelf pasture and hay(fertilizer, herbicide, pesticide free). We're in Willis, looking forward to spring to begin!
I’m in the Brighton in Hartland area. Feel free to call me. Glad to talk to you.
Good morning Ray.. the 27th was yesterday.. lots of longer lasting forages take a while to get established.
My question, do the gophers like it??
BTW, seed harvest is the same for clovers and alfalfa.
Orchard grass matures too fast here, have to get a cutting in mid May, then another in July/August.. but for most of us, it's too wet until end of June, by then orchard grass is like wire, cows won't even eat it unless they're starving..
The old alfafas used to make it 7 to 10 years..
Thanks for the info it sounds like you have the exact same experience with orchard grass as what I do yeah the old Vernal varieties lasted a long time what’s your main grass now?
@@michiganhay7844 here at home it's a mix of everything... Mostly meadow Foxtail and fescue.
Most has been in for 60++++ years.
Other fields are pretty much whatever has taken over.. some good, some not so good
Very insightful and informative video. Apologies if this was covered already, but if you were planting a new field like this what percentage birdsfoot trefoil would be in your seed mix? (Assuming you had access to a variety of your liking).
I actually probably put in 100% birdsfoot it first to help eliminate competition see how it comes up and then go back in with a grass the next year
@@michiganhay7844 Very interesting. What grass/grass mix would you go in with the following year if you were trying to maintain a late/flexible cutting window? Just timothy and some brome? Appreciate the insight.
@@spencerray3633 some broom because it stays green Timothy possibly it doesn’t seem to come in every year but I’m starting to like endophyte novel tall fescue holds its color till way late in the year like Braum but yields a lot more
So much truth here.
Thank you appreciate it
Hello sir how are you, sir I want seed this grass,I live in Manchester England, please tell me, you from
Awesome video, treefoil must be a eastern thing? I've never seen it in person I don't think. Around here atleat half the horse hay buyers will only take straight grass. And I agree 100% straight grass won't do anything without feeding it nitrogen. I kind of disagree about the balage comments tho. If you hire the wrapping done it will cost $5 to $7 a bale. It definitely is more economical to feed balage then dry hay stored outside. The feed value is higher and there is no waste. In today's weather patterns cutting one day and baling that afternoon or next morning means more hay made in short weather windows. Also high quality alfalfa is cheaper to produce then buying protein supplements.
They grow Trefoil in northern Minnesota quite a bit of it up by Duluth superior Wisconsin cause I’ve seen it up there you’re just in a heavy Rowcrop area where it’s considered a weed it’s probably been largely eradicated in your area. You’re right about being able to have somebody to come in and custom wrap some areas have access to that some don’t I was pretty much referring to if you bought the equipment as far as feed quality and value that’s kind of really not true properly bail dry hey is just as good quality as baleage except you can make the argument there are more digestible carbohydrates in baleage because there was less time for the plant to Respirer however it’s kind of a silly justification for beef cows since a brood cowherd certainly does not require dairy quality level hey and the extra carbohydrates actually can be detrimental to the overall beef cowherd in that situation being that they really are designed as a forager scavenger and to utilize that ruminant to the best economic potential as well however I think this is a good topic for another video that I think I will do to explain more in depth my justification about the industry push to over utilize baleage and a beef cow herd I just think economically it makes very little sense to me However I would really like to see a bigger perspective from your view on this I think this would be a really good video for you as well always appreciate your input and the comments thank you
@@michiganhay7844 As always I'm not here to start arguments. I should of explained a bit, with balage you have less of a chance with weather affecting feed quality. You get it up faster and preserve it better. While yes brood cows don't need high quality feed all the time, when milking for the calf you will have better calf gains feeding cows higher protein feed. But my main point for high protein/feed value is backgrounding your own calves. If you want to capture the most dollars per head you can't sell them off the cow anymore. Protein and energy are what puts pounds on calve in my opinion. That's where I was going with the alfalfa. It's more cost effective for me to raise 22% plus protein alfalfa then to buy protein pellets and mix with $7 corn.
@@e.a.bfarms I agree 100% that’s why I stopped buying corn back in 2008 when the ethanol boom took off I can definitely make a lot more money with Alfalfa and I do actually grow a decent amount of alfalfa as well
Ray have you ever thought of getting some seed from your own grasses.
It’s funny you ask that if I mow a grass field after it’s fully been pollinated and the seed is ripen the seeds fall right on top of the hood of my Discbine and I’ll scoop that seed up by the bucket loads and I have used that it’s an easy way to harvest it especially the orchard grass seed