I find it crazy how at the start of D, we had a cheap set of start decks that were good bases to build off of. We then got the new start decks which were 3 times the price and full of blank cards not intended to be used in games, Bushiroad had a solid idea and didn't do that again. For D we definitely need more decksets like the Orfist one, give a boss unit a full deck for a player to catch up with to be able to play with their friends who may have a more rounded deck. I liked the premium decksets as an entry point and using subclans was an amazing idea to show some love for old decks, more of that would be great for players looking to start premium.
I still recall my soured experience trying got get into D format with the first wave of OD Start Deck fell through and scrambled with getting stuff second-hand and be left with one or two incomplete decks and feeling like I have to spend $200+ on base rarity cards. >:c
Format with no overtrigger, actual online version that’s up to date, stopping the release of overpowered promos, making the game actually international, adverts
Well, OT alone now is not gonna help. Stride decks in standard are drawing like crazy till they decked out. And that's for ALL Stride decks. They can rush you early because they draw 3 rather then 2 now and that will force you to ride on g3 to replenish hand or you won't survive further. But that's not all there are still tons of problems in standard. The game will never be they same as the era of LB. The game started to get ruined little by little by the time they decided to create Legion. There is no return after that.
@@kodokutamashi1569 idk about you, but the release of LJ was a mistake in my opinion. Pre-LJ was, in my eyes, the peak it got to. LJ forced you to play the clan or lose because locks were busted and unless you were a gold paladin user, it was always annoying to see your entire board getting locked and you yourself can't do anything other than vg attack. LJ was like prison now with very many and easy ways to lock with no detrimental cost. You just know how bad it got when pretty much almost every release after LJ were supports to counteract it. Prior to that however were some of the most fun I had
I think we all agree on the entry level product. I have my own store and getting new players was really hard precisely because all we had was the starter decks from D era and they needed to be updated in order to get the players to stand a chance with the community that start to come to the store. One of the other games we have is Weiss Schwarz and tbh just 2 trial decks are more than enought to have a decent deck that can be updated latter, which is the pont that you suggest. Hopefully they announce something good for next year.
Definitely agree with this! When my friend was trying to get me into vanguard in may, the cheapest deck we could get was 80 dollars, and that was already 40 dollars under its market value. I really enjoy the game now, but it’s a shame that there was such a high entry fee to get into a game that I didn’t know if I would enjoy
Since the Cross Cray Epic story just ended, it'd be a great idea to release Glitter starter decks for each nation since many players love the characters
True Cause it just a good opportunity for new players But my only issue with these starter decks is they are very under supported unless you buy booster sets cards to make them really competitive for tournaments Such a wasted opportunity for bushiroad if you ask me
I don’t play Vanguard because there’s nobody to play with in my small town, but as a game designer I find it very challenging to get into with the Emergy Generator being only in starter products and not in boosters (and also they kinda suck). I think it’s an okay mechanic, but the limitations put by Bushi kind of don’t make sense, you’re either forced to use the energy cards or the gauge card, but can’t use dice to it. That would make VG have 17 card zones with the G zone, order zone and the crest zone for the energy generator. I miss the old days when you would need only 50 cards to play with, and even the G Zone. The removal of the clans was defo a W move, even though there are still ghosts of the clans in the current game but the fact that the factions got reduced from over 20 to six.
When I started playing one of the things I thought was really cool about vanguard was that a lot of the bosses or major cards appearing in the anime came from trial decks. With the anime being so positively received, it would be great to bring back those start products with cards you actually keep using and actually have value rather than every boss unit you actually use like jheva or youthberk coming from a booster set. Better printing of promos and better processes for reprints (whether of promos or key cards) would really boost the player experience. I’d like it if promos were like early release or alt arts a month before the major set reprints it but we hardly get promo reprints Think either outright banning the overtrigger or setting its power boost to 10k would make the game feel more consistent too
One thing that's also really important is year round availability. I know stores don't want stock sitting on shelves, but it's crazy to have to say "yeah you can get into the game in January if you pre order a stride deckset now. This years sold out ages ago." Meanwhile I can pick up a pokemon or lorcana starter deck from over a year ago at the same shop.
I think vanguard should do what pokemon used to and release like tournament decks at a slightly higher price point as a competitive entry point, between trial decks and stride decksets
@@ZoruaHunter Stride decksets are basically all new cards released as a single product. The idea of selling tournament decks would mean reprints of popularly used cards as an entry point for players with a competitive deck, and allow current players to either pick up the deck easily, or obtain reprints of cards that are most likely needed for the game.
- Make it so Overtriggers aren’t used in tournaments. People do not take Vanguard that seriously as a competitive game in the west thanks to the ultimate sack that is overtrigger. They will never ban it at this point so they should at least make it so that tournaments you don’t use them or their power ups become 20k instead of 100 mil so it’s not as big of a sack. - make more products like generation dragenesis. One of the biggest problems with Vanguard right now is so many decks waiting FOREVER to get new support. So they should have more boosters like this where they’re made just to support old ridelines. I imagine them, after a season of the anime ends, has like 2-3 sets of these where they provide every rideline in standard up to that point at least 2 new cards. This of course also means Lyrical. - Lyrical should be more constant in the main sets. The fact that we started D series and it took til like year 3 or 4 for lyrical to be in the main sets is crazy. The current way lyrical is going is not good. Their own products sell awfully in English and they’re always behind the times on power level, I mean hell they didn’t even give them the new generic front. They need to just cave and fully put in the lyrical side sets into the main sets even if it means like increasing the amount of cards you’re getting per pack so people will stop complaining every other second about lyrical. - Better starter decks. The quick starter decks were trash. We need actual good ones. More akin to what we got with the jeweled, Lianorn, and Youth decks but with out the extra product so it can be lower cost. - More advertising. I cannot believe how this game is still going on internationally with no advertising but it’s still felt that the English side is crippling. - A good F2P online simulator. Them cancelling Vanguard online was this games biggest failure. Me and my few friends straight stopped playing for years, til D series started, because of that cancellation. - just erase dear days or at least lower the price. It’s a good product but still not worth its cost. - Make promos just alt arts or special editions of existing cards, not brand new possibly meta or at least deck warping cards.
Since it's a part of the game, people should really get over the overtrigger crap. They won't stop; they'll keep creating more. Having said that, it's a smart idea to use existing cards for alt arts. Alternate art promo foiling for pack buying and regular common card for participating tourneys
@ no, people should not just stop complaining about the overtrigger. If the player base just stopped complaining about the game then Bushi could just do whatever they want without any consideration of the consumer ie the people who are buying their product and giving them money.
in my opinion, this is the direction these new starter decks could be like: - a playset of the boss unit - 2x of that boss unit's most important supports (at least 1 type of the most used support) - 2x each of effect crits and/or draws and booster set PGs - nation OT - either guaranteed sanctitude, or a "buy 2 starter decks get a sanctitude PR" campaign (since you get 2 of the boss' support) - maybe include a simple deck box (like the ones from the Youth, Drajeweled, and Lianorn decks) - and to keep the price reasonable, it could be like the first ever D starter decks, just 1 foil boss unit for example Drajeweled could get: - 4x booster set Drajeweled - 2x Rockargours - 2x Falcate Performers - 2x each of effect crits and/or draws and booster set PGs - Gallmageheld Youth gets: - 4x Skyfall Youth - 2x Sequana - 2x each of Zest, Gust, and Tempest - 2x each of effect crits and/or draws and booster set PGs - Amartinoa edit: also i think the boss units that're most likely to get starter decks are Bavsargra (if she gets no new form in a DZBT), Drajeweled, Seraph, Youth or Bastion, Magnolia or Lianorn, and Kairi or Loronerol
@@CosmicNebula444it's best if bushiroad don't do that Cause it's just a waste of money and not everyone gets a fair share of getting these decks If you ask me, they should reprint the good generic card cards such as effect triggers like in at a lower ratity versions then the booster sets to keep prices down low for all players and keep the higher rarity cards in booster sets instead To give a incentive for new or returning player something to buy for this TCG Makes it's more accessible for all players of any skill level to play the game And if they want to be a competitive player They can start getting the better support cards from booster sets to be really good at official tournaments bushiroad wants to happen Such a wasted opportunity to get new players to get into the game
I've actually been thinking about this myself. Personally, I was thinking it'd be a really good idea to reprint MLB/Blaster Blade stuff soon, and a Starter Deck of those cards would be perfect, considering that they're tied to Aichi. For English, it'd also be a good way to finally give us Blaster Blade The Vanguard, too lmao
I agree Considering that MLB is most well known card in the community It's such a well known card due to nostalgia and how fun the deck is in standard But it's not accessable to new players or returning or current players of the standard format as one of the support cards is a comic exclusive card that so far has not been reprinted yet Would have been nice for such a deck to exist Especially for me as it's one of my favourite units of the game
@@gwarguraqueentrickstarcoat9110 yeah I kinda play some online games and without the vanguard on my actual irl deck the deck feels like I lose a huge power budget.
I am glad that Kris is bringing this topic up. As a new vanguard player who is almost finished with building their deck I find it incredibly difficult to figure out where to start! I know CFV is slowly cleaning up but I think they really need a definitive "START HERE" point that most people can agree on.
The biggest problem with starter product is that it gets scalped in the west. Stardust blaze is current 2x the MSRP because cool blitz order is in it. Like not only does it have to be printed with good cards in mind, but printed into the ground. Its cool that SB had stuff in it to make it appealing to newer players and established players, but in order to get it at MSRP is to either work at the store, or know someone.
I think it may be fine to ban the overtrigger now. I remember a few years ago that there was a concern about Vanguard not having go-to staples that shops can hold to always sell to players. The last couple of years remedied this with the various nation cycle generics that most decks want.
For veterans of the game, starter product with full effect triggers and sanctitude would be an auto buy regardless of ride line etc because if i want to build say kothiblaze, id need effect triggers and effect pgs etc and it would make it so much easier!
Oh and also, one of the main point of contention as well, is the price point. Like, YGO's Try Deck is like 1000ish yen, and it's all you need. Most TCGs (that has healthy starter product) does this, where to start with you'd need like 1000-2000 yen. Pokemon, you buy two packs of the Greninja deck and have a decent deck. One Piece, as mentioned in the video has loads of decently structured cheap deck. Doesn't even have to be competitive, just have to be decent to play with. Meanwhile in Vanguard you got 800 yen trial deck that's filled with vanilla cards, and whose main vanguard probably won't get used.
New player here coming from OCG Yugioh and you had great point at the end regarding them treating us like we're 5 year olds with the newer starter decks 😭. It's been kinda hard to get into the game with how hard it is to get singles (building both Eva and Lianorn rn and a starter for Lianorn would be GREAT). Been mostly playing by using proxies for now but I can't enter competitive with them so it's kind of a shame :
I honestly feel like Rotovisor, Flamme-G, Dolls, Liscaria, and Ghryandra were suppose to be the starter product. Cuz if you look at them, with the exception of Rotovisor till they showed that promo, they have all been getting relativly decent main set support and they're all decent decks. They are pretty much the decks I used to get some of my friends into the game. They're all pretty cheap. The only problem is explaining you need to buy an Energy Generator, PGs, and Triggers. Other wise my Friends all picked up each deck for like 20-30 dollars US in singles.
As someone who has played in tournaments during the G-Era and has played Dear Days, I find it very challenging to get into Standard Format. I find it difficult because the all the Quick Start Decks suck and the better decks that have Divine Skills can only be obtained by purchasing booster packs. On top of that, getting Damage and Power counters for the cards is hard and is pretty expensive. It would be much appreciated if Bushiroad created Competitive Tournament Level Starter Decks for every Nation with incredible skills. It would also be nice if those Starter Decks included Sleeves, Energy Generators, Power & Damage Counters, Over Triggers, Order Cards, Effect Perfect Guards, and a Double Deck Box.
I fully agree on your take about starter decks. My opinion is that they need to make more starter decks like G with a lot of variety. All of try 3 got a TD. Luard and Shiranui got one Harri and Nightrose had one. Even cards like Chouchou that didn't appear in the anime had one. They should go back to selling regular priced TDs (1000 yen to 1500 yen) ones and have it so you buy one and have 4 copies of your important cards. This I feel is the best way to get newcomers into the game. It's easy and cheap and you have the bare minimum on you. No need to inflate the price with sleeves etc. Those products are nice and I like them, but I feel like they should not get more priority over regular TDs. The Cray epic ride lines should have had TDs, we should have had new Baro, Eugene, Hexaorb as TDs for example. I've had several instances of my Yugioh friends asking me if the deck I lent them to play with me had a TD only for them to be disappointed when I said no, when if there was one, they might have gotten into the game by buying it. In fact when the Overdress 300 yen sds came out and the WillDress tds came out, I actually did manage to get some of my friends to start playing the game by reccomending them a starter deck. People prefer getting into a tcg via a TD rather than having to buy packs or singles to build a deck or even buying a deck someone else made and is selling on merukari or something. The severe lack of regular TDs is sad and I hope they change that from now on!
I agree with this since a friend of mine started playing and I could only advise Stardust Blade, because the others were expensive or the recent ones were literally just blank cards when he wanted keter. Now he is doing slowly Youthberk deck but I thought of what you said and what if it was 3 from will dress theme and 3 from fated, like for example: DE - Varga BG - Welstra Lyrical - Krysrain DS - Drajewel KS - Youth Stoicheia - Lianorn or DE - Jheva Keter - Youth DS - Drajeweled BG - Fated Welstra Stoicheia - Fated Zorga Lyrical - Krysrain And I say Varga due to it's popularity, it doesn't need to have dual nations or energy cyclers and even doesn't need the set 5 stuff, would sell amazingly well and people would go after the most recent sets made.
The most painful feeling when you buy a starter deck is realizing that none of the cards are gonna be in your final max tuned version. I had this when i started with V in highschool and bought the narukami starter deck, saved up money for that shi... atleast when i bought salamangreat for yugioh they gave me actual gazelles, spinnys so i can do the actual combos. on another note.....Bushi, make a graiandra starter deck and my soul is yours again
I was literarily typing Starter Deck Yuyu/Raika while playing the video. I like your position. It's not like entering Vanguard is expensive. You can grab a playset of the newest collab set when a new set drops and that's usually quite cheap. But we really need a solid boxed product that represent the standard format of Vanguard. We can't point at Love and Berry and say "this is Vanguard." Plus collab decks don't have ongoing support, so once someone brought in by collab decides to stay, they still struggle to find a deck they can keep building and playing.
Completely agree with everything you mentioned. It feels like Bushiroad was attempting to make Vanguard appear "easy to learn/beginner friendly" by stripping the start decks down to being vanilla but I feel this has a pretty negative effect on the reception of the game. It doesn't allow for beginners to witness what makes Vanguard fun and interesting for veterans and at the same time gives this impression that new players are incapable of comprehending basic mechanics. Gatekeeping effects triggers despite being almost 4 year into standard is also incredibly odd since G starter decks had no issue including 2 copies in the past. They are killing it with their "higher tier" product in Stride decksets but they seem out of touch for their more budget friendly option. I had an easier time getting players into the game in 2018-2021 with V starter decks than the situation we are currently in.
- Revert time rules - Stop making crucial cards promos - Ban the overtrigger - Add energy to Premium - Premium-specific set - Ban D deckset crests from premium
I could totally related to this, i just started playing Pokemon recently, and im surprised how useful their recent starter decks are, more than 50% of the deck are actually staple to the deck, i bought the Gardevoir one, and it already has Iono, Arven, Professor Research, Earthen Vessel, Ultra Balls, Nest Balls, and the full 443 evolution lines, which are staple for this deck (and lot of decks too), in Vanguard term, its like giving full different colored Youthberks alongside effect triggers and PGs to the started deck. This is really surprising, because i used to think that TCG are normally this expensive as a hobby, but turns out another TCG could actually lowers the new player gate. So yeah, i think it's time for Bushiroad to look past instant money by milking current players and step up their game to invite new players instead by making the game more accessible. Cuz i really love Vanguard and i dont want it to become Buddyfight 2.0😢
Issues with vg right now: 1) Insane offensive power crept for the player going 1st (Razael & Levidras killing people on their 1st g3 turn while people are at g2 + can turbo filter + low cost for skills) 2) Lack of any good defensive mechanics (Like V's G3 heal guardians) for the player going 2nd to at least survive in a playable game state going into their 1st g3 turn 3) Really bad starter products + insanely op (& expensive) generics to make the decks playable 4) OT is still in the game (at least nerf the +100mil to a guardable number of +30k or something ffs so people can actually account for OT number and the attacking players kill turn doesn't just end with the 1st attack, the effects themselves are usually game changing already)
To further your point on the lack of good starter product for vanguard: I'm a returning player, I quit playing during the middle of V Era, and tried to come back after seeing Ominagruzio. My problem during that time was: I don't know what works and don't, I tried to check the vanguard wiki for all cards that might be relevant for Omina, make a list of necessary cards, buy them from 7 different sellers, some I need to order from Japan because no one is selling them here. After all that, I end up needing to replace 24 cards because it doesn't work as well as I expected. Now, everytime I buy a new deck, I will only buy it if its already prebuilt. While they are much more expensive, its still cheaper than sourcing all the cards from so many sellers and paying for those transport cost. A good starting deck will definitely help alliviate that problem
100% agree with the points brought up here It genuinely feels so odd that stride decksets are the best product if you wanna learn vg and stand a chance at a locals, despite the fact that they are just not representative of how most other decks plays They don't teach you about the importance of the early game (cuz most cards are gb-locked), there's no mention of energy, divine skills or even how persona ride works it leaves you in a very weird spot where you don't understand the format you're playing, but you know what a stride is we should have product that allows you to build more transferable skills lol
The Try decks were ENG OCG only :v but you are right. I managed to rope a new player and they were interested in Stride decks and a friend got Stardust Blade TD, but new players need really good entry points, and more than one. And old TDs, due to the Energy Crest, were made invalid
@differentfight what needs to be done to get players into the game, is 1) have these “glitter” decks as the Starter decks. 2) start making the g1 back to 10k shield. Like you said the older generation knows how to play and it would be a lot better for new player to understand how the game works; plus keeps power creep somewhat under control.
What vanguard needs: - Fire people responsible for 3 card reprint sets. The purpose of reprint set is bring down prices of staples and this kind of product do not do it at all. Just do normal reprint sets from time to time like Duel Devastator from yugioh or megatins. - Fire the person responsible for decision to put in a quick starter deck 90% of vanila cards. This was horrible product and in the west we got sleeves added to drive up pricepoint to 20$. Its a joke of product in 2024 while at the same time you are forced to buy it if you want to play competetive because energy generator (which should be a F-ing boxtopper). - Stop with deckfixing promos. Put that in main sets to entice people to buy product! If you keep loosing because your deck is not consistent or do not do stuff you want it to do, because its gatekept by promo then you have less enticement to come to shop. Not only that, but some shops open these promos and sell them for singles without handling packs to players. - Start with giving good premium product like 3 times a year. This format is great for competetive, its skill intensive, its nice to watch (standard is RNG format which diceroll and trigger checks is like 70% of your win). - PUT ON A FREE TO PLAY SIMULATOR. JUST GO MASTER DUEL WAY. NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WILL PAY AAA PRICE TAG FOR CARD GAME SIM. - Remove OT from premium and make it full skill reliant format. Vanguard is not even in top 10 selling card games in japan. Literaly getting beaten by lorcana is humiliating, because bushi missmanages cardgame. They do not learn from mistakes. 2 reboots though them NOTHING.
I agree with what you guys are saying. I was also thinking today that they should bring out like a 5 pack of just the energy generator to put with other decks instead of having to always swap them around with the deck you want to use for that day or tournament.
I think an official online client that isn't dear days would be very good for the game, especially here in the West, since the game isn't as popular in comparison to Japan. I would like to see more frequent banlists for all formats of the game and for there to be more than just two cards that get hit on the banlist.
The main issue atm is ratios are bad which cause prices to become toxic asf which yes is bushiroads fault. Sets don't need 21 RRR imho they need to down shift alot of the rarities keeping the RRR for boss units only then have RR and R and C support said boss unit and or the generic staples, like in OG vanguard. They also need 8 copies minimum of each RRR per case, prices only started to go crazy in D around set 5 and onwards when they increased the RRR and RR count but cut the pull rates back. Set structure should imo be something like: 12 RRR (2 each nation) 24 RR (4 each nation) 24 R ( 4 each nations) 48 C (6 each nation) Promo issue is a simple fix, actually print the card in the set it supports something in THEN print a holo or a stamped version for shops to hand out as tournament promo in a pack with some older format staple cards too. That way promo chasers get to bling their decks while new players aren't left out because staple cards are in there also.
Something I would personally love to see is possibly re printing some of the G1 or what ever from stride decksets that made them so expensive, the fact that a luard msrp is 50$ but even on release you where lucky to find them for under 80 for the basic or 200+ for premium versions all because the g1 and crest is crazy now base set is 150$ on tcg 3 times more then what it should be makes it hard for old players who are coming back that enjoy it to pick up something basic
It’s sucks more because of how good the dress starter products were. The decks gave you access to the boss unit used in the anime, and gave you a sort of structure to build off or with the cards in the main sets. I remember seeing an old video of yours recently at the start of D where the video was just buy the starter deck, and then here’s the card from set 1 you can put in to improve the deck. Tbh my main problem With the quick start decks was the fact that all the cards in the decks were given effect versions in DBZ01, and their effects were so painfully mid that they easily could’ve been cards in the start deck and the products would’ve improved so much, and then all this mid cards wouldn’t take up more set space. I get they were made to introduce the mechanics in the game in a basic way, but the mechanics of vanguard aren’t that complicated in all honesty, not the hardest thing to pick up
I think they should take a different approach to reprints and make them more frequent and accessable not special alt art shenanigans rarity that's harder to get then the initial print but just literally RR Lower rarity of staple cards for budget deck building for example my gripe with the Xoverdress was how every single Vairina aside Vils was a RRR instead of making lower rarity version with the only drawback of having higher cost for skill.
OTher then starter product, reprint sets should be fixed as well. Like, do an actual reprint set WITHOUT any new cards, and DO NOT make them a 3 card per pack. THEN we can talk about fixes to the game.
Mobile or pc game would be my pick. I live in a small rural area and nobody around me plays. Having a way to interact with the game outside the anime would be great!
Closest I’ve ever come to playing the actual game is dear days, before that was vangaurd zero. If they can actually make something like master duel then that’s free money for them and an easy way to get new player who will then come over to the real game or just give them more money on the online game.
Bushiroad needs to start considering their non-Japanese customers more. Some of us want to support the game, but their practices of these promos for their shops as an example just doesn’t work outside Japan. They really need to build goodwill with shops outside Japan, since folks are still plenty upset this game rebooted twice and turned many folks away from that alone.
Format with no OT or ban the OT, have more accessible products for new & returning players, keep the pricing for staple to be lowered so playerbase can grow, PR not being staple cards for decks but are alternative artworks of cards, no double loss for the competitve tournaments, a official online client of CFV for PC & the current gen consoles,
The OT is game changing. Changing the power buff should be something to look into. For starter decks, they should re imagine the OG 5 start decks to have Divine Skills but make it like Buddyfight ones where their Divine Skills(Overturn) aren't as strong so they would still buy the RRR version on booster packs and have them have the same name so they would just run 4 copies.
This very thing actually happened with me and Youthberk. I wanted to play it so badly but when I got the start deck and realized the Youthberk in the start deck wasn't the same one as the one in the set then saw that the actual one played was $60+ USD per copy and that wasn't including the rest of the stuff I needed. I dropped the idea so fast and never got to play the deck I was most excited to play in a while. I'm not saying put all the best stuff in the deck asap, but that deck was 100% unplayable out of the box...I got a kinda cool deck box though....
I think the elephant in the room is that their primary customer is not the players but the stores. the entry product that they want sell is players buying singles from stores, the promo situation will never end so long as they keep on the path to incentivise peoe to come into stores for tournements and whatever mobile game they could come out with has to be strictly worst than the paper experience or it cuts into money people could be spending on cards. I hate to sound defeatist on this subject but with the years of criticism the player base has given bushi their really is no other reason i can think of.
I 100% agree with this and to add to this Shadowverse Evolve has the same problem. We aren't even getting the combined starter decks of dragoncraft and runecraft which is such a shame.
Kinda agree on most of the idea here. I like to play most of the vanguard decks but my local shop and online shop keep increasing the key cards price for no reason....and when the current value of the cards drop,they refused to reduce the price?
1. Stop rebooting 2. Find a way so older card can have a play again 3. Make MD instead of overpriced Switch game 4. No OT 5. Add more trigger variation, maybe like rearguard switch effect.
I started playing when Season 2 Overdress aired; I played D format first and had fun, then i tried V format and very hooked up by the playstyle It looks like V has utilized every vanguard playstyle ever created Playing with damage zone, deal damage to yourself, Refiarade style (Vg dont attack but lot of drive-cheking), JK style (placing onto other unit), Starhulk (reversing trigger effect) also playing with opp drive check
I actually think the best starter decks they could make that would be really cool are maybe starter decks for the promo bosses . We have at least 1 in every nation and they just showed us in youthquake with spinomarquis they are finally willing to give them ride lines and support. Other option is the glitter bosses
What do you mean when you say start decks? Like I understand being brand new to the game, but would you exclude the stride deck sets because of both the price and their competitive viability?
One thing that I’ve noticed with trying to start out new players especially that come from previous TCG’s, is the stipulation’s behind Vanguard. Things like Bermuda’s Bikini rares and Thegrea(My favorite D deck atm.) is just really hard to show to players without feeling ashamed. I understand it’s a cultural thing and it may even be where I live that might be an issue (right smack in the middle of the Bible Belt) but it’s just extremely difficult to get people to look past a lot of negatives with the Vanguard community
From Limit Break, to Legion, to stride just to so many mechanics so fast no one could keep up with constantly changing mechanics and the meta game or anyone playing at all at least here in New Jersey was non existent. It just feels like they’re always trying to catch up to other card games by rushing but that cost myself and the few people who played to all just slowly not keep up.
The Divine Skill units should've been trial deck cards 🤷♂& Make the booster sets for upgrades or new boss units for minor decks (like Heroes). That's my take lol
Keep the OT No more double loss for time rules. Keep the OT as it is. Don't add the ride deck nor the energy generator to P Ban the D encounter stride crests and cards from P
I remember back in the day when they introduce Narukami and Gold Paladin Starter Deck that's when I play Vanguard for the first time and that's how they get me to play their game although I stop playing Vanguard because they're so expensive during Stride era
Iirc earlier this year Duel Master also release 2 starter/structured deck for 2 Nation, which their retail price is 500 JPY, and it really strong as well
They should in general release more structure/starter decks, I agree... They even had that going on well in the first season when releasing the more competitive starter decks providing some very viable aces...
Honestly if vanguard take lessons on making starter decks on wixoss level it would do so much for the game. Wixoss start decks have mostly being pretty decent even in tournament settings and the best part about their start decks is that whenever they release a new one, it usually has 2-4 copies of a reprinted meta card. That's why new players have a smoother transition into the game and older players can get these older meta cards without breaking their wallet.
I agree with many of these. Especially a better starter deck similar to other card games. Personal problem I have is that in my country we are like 3 years behind kekw.
Different types of game-play is my opinion, now every thing is multi attack (more than 3 attacks). We do not have other play styles, before there was more variety, something a kin to control( Megacolony and Link joker/Star-Vader) or defensive ( Angel Feather- Gavrail) or discard(Nubatama).
100%. Im tryna get into vanguard after zero and build an actual playable deck but the cost is too high and the cards are hard to get. It is very demotivating! I might as well not even start lol
Needing more starter product is a good point to bring up for sure. But my issue beyond that is that even if the Starter product is there. Would the west even get it? Or would the product specific cards just get jammed into another product later on as short printed box toppers? So I'd say even more than Starter product in order of importance would be increased investment in western markets
The stand up decks were the best! I could give a person to try out the game with the favrneel deck while i played orfist and everyone would figure out how to play and really enjoy the game
I really want something that gives me a playset of effect triggers and the nation overtrigger. Despite all the reprints of triggers if I were to buy a playset I would end up spending more on just the triggers than the start deck. My most recent physical purchase is Stardust Blade and the only reason I bought it was because I liked the artwork and that G3 Vyrgilla Says that The Vanguard you love won't end here. As others have said about new formats/rules, I really don't like OverTrigger as the opponents could lose because they didn't have two sentinels in hand or worse the attacking player knows they would have lost next turn if it weren't for OverTrigger check. Both players know the win isn't as valuable. I guess it makes for great moment between friends, but I swear this game could wind up like Buddyfight did with this +100 million crap. The time investment to not only know how my decks but also my opponents. I don't want to memorize 80 - 100 cards each set. My LGS isn't that beginner friendly and Dear Days is a mid tier video game at best. Not a bad card game sim but it fell short of the mark and yet asked for way more $$ than it should have.
they need to make it so that decks need more than 1 boss/vanguards to play so they can still sell other bosses for that deck in the set while also put good boss in the trial deck. Like Breakride / G Era TDs. Makes it easier to sell cards whike also spices up the gameplay too
Important archetype cards being promos and drops on festival and triple drive sets suck cause they expensive as hell and have to wait forever for a reprint. A lack of pre built decks and more dynamic things in the game like a archetype that has multiple vanguards or order units or more defensive combos
The lack of starter products is the worst, like me and my brother want to get into the game, but getting the cards is hard because of where we live, it would literally solve all our problems if bushi just released a couple of decks every year
Tbh as someone who wants to get into the game but can't is that theres no good way to play the game digitally because I live far from a store without transportation so I cant play it physically. Then Dear days is asking for $70 as an entry fee which I thought my friend was joking with me when they first said it then they said plus dlc for newer cards. Knowing tcg there is probably a fanmade version of it but knowing fanmade tcg its probably freeroam like you playing irl for example yugioh it would be duelingbook and I still need guidence of what am I doing and why and practice not against people yet like a story mode, it just feels Im stuck in a paradox. So in the mean time I just be on the slidelines watching
I think they should ease up on the personal effects that a lot of decks get, like the autoMod gauge. That or give other decks access to these outside of deck mechanics but they work differently from the original. There's a lot of times where I watch two different decks match up but due to the differing mechanics it doesn't even feel like they're playing the same game.
They should make products by level... beginner/intermediate/ advance...at the end of advance product you got complete deck with with old staple unit and effect trigger...and booster box can be cheap and got new unit that support that the deck you finish
I miss generic ride lines so that I can make choices in what I run in my decks. (The problem to me is deckbuilding feel forced in standard. I had a few friends not get into the game because of it)
They should have a new entry level decks like Gramgrace, orfist etc Maybe like featuring units like Youthberk, Drajewel, Basavargra, but in a advanced level product type of decks. (Lianorn/Magnolia is also fine too!!!) Otherwise it will be hard to intro new players starting game when complaints such as cards are expensive, prices are unforgiving etc. Especially having my friend to start playing this year has been too difficult bcuz of those feedbacks about the market.
Speaking of reprints, Bushi never reprinted their Triple Drive booster set. I feel like instead of asking for reprints, Bushi needs to come up with new cards that has two skills. One skill would specifically support a new ride line while the second skill would be a more generic skill that other ridelines can use. One example would be Francette. One skill can only be used by Krysrain while the other can be used by other Lyrical cards. Makes a good alternative for Yuika. Why go with this direction? Reprints can help new players. But the thing is... What about the old players who already have the old cards? If a new booster pack comes out, and if these old players are loyal to their current ride line, what would they look forward to? So I say, make a new ride line with good support, that way new players don't have to prioritise looking for a reprints meanwhile older players get new cards they could or won't use. On business side, more players looking forward to the new releases would be good for business.
Bruh that is a terrible idea. Loving Pink Francette is a $18 to $20 dollar card minimum because it's second skill is so generic. Keep in mind Francette price has only gone down recently. It used to be $30 dollars minimum, not even a month ago.
@Nineball757 It is high priced because it is the one of the rare cards that has skills to support both generics and Krysrain. As for older cards that need reprints, their prices are also high. So would you rather pay for old cards at high prices or new cards that could be high or low price? if you make more cards like Francette, then it would mean less need for her and cards like her. Lower demand mean lower prices.
@SinRealm @SinRealm Diantha is a poor example. Diantha is cheap not because we got more Stocheia revive units. It's because: 1 - She got a reprint. 2 - More importantly, She got power crept by Alvina, who is basically Diantha 2.0, but better. What's Alvina price on the secondary market? $18 to $20. Basically the exact same price Diantha was before she got a reprint and before this card came out. Despite the numerous Stocheia revive units we have gotten.
I find it crazy how at the start of D, we had a cheap set of start decks that were good bases to build off of.
We then got the new start decks which were 3 times the price and full of blank cards not intended to be used in games, Bushiroad had a solid idea and didn't do that again.
For D we definitely need more decksets like the Orfist one, give a boss unit a full deck for a player to catch up with to be able to play with their friends who may have a more rounded deck.
I liked the premium decksets as an entry point and using subclans was an amazing idea to show some love for old decks, more of that would be great for players looking to start premium.
I still recall my soured experience trying got get into D format with the first wave of OD Start Deck fell through and scrambled with getting stuff second-hand and be left with one or two incomplete decks and feeling like I have to spend $200+ on base rarity cards. >:c
i agree
the second set of start decks digusted me
Format with no overtrigger, actual online version that’s up to date, stopping the release of overpowered promos, making the game actually international, adverts
Local play in more places
fully agree with this one, personally dislike Overtrigger
Ban OT for sure, worst part of the game by far.
Well, OT alone now is not gonna help. Stride decks in standard are drawing like crazy till they decked out. And that's for ALL Stride decks. They can rush you early because they draw 3 rather then 2 now and that will force you to ride on g3 to replenish hand or you won't survive further. But that's not all there are still tons of problems in standard. The game will never be they same as the era of LB. The game started to get ruined little by little by the time they decided to create Legion. There is no return after that.
@@kodokutamashi1569 idk about you, but the release of LJ was a mistake in my opinion. Pre-LJ was, in my eyes, the peak it got to. LJ forced you to play the clan or lose because locks were busted and unless you were a gold paladin user, it was always annoying to see your entire board getting locked and you yourself can't do anything other than vg attack. LJ was like prison now with very many and easy ways to lock with no detrimental cost. You just know how bad it got when pretty much almost every release after LJ were supports to counteract it. Prior to that however were some of the most fun I had
I think we all agree on the entry level product. I have my own store and getting new players was really hard precisely because all we had was the starter decks from D era and they needed to be updated in order to get the players to stand a chance with the community that start to come to the store. One of the other games we have is Weiss Schwarz and tbh just 2 trial decks are more than enought to have a decent deck that can be updated latter, which is the pont that you suggest. Hopefully they announce something good for next year.
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Definitely agree with this! When my friend was trying to get me into vanguard in may, the cheapest deck we could get was 80 dollars, and that was already 40 dollars under its market value. I really enjoy the game now, but it’s a shame that there was such a high entry fee to get into a game that I didn’t know if I would enjoy
@@pb7393 to be fair though the 70$ stride ddcksets were tier 1 straight out the box
Since the Cross Cray Epic story just ended, it'd be a great idea to release Glitter starter decks for each nation since many players love the characters
True
Cause it just a good opportunity for new players
But my only issue with these starter decks is they are very under supported unless you buy booster sets cards to make them really competitive for tournaments
Such a wasted opportunity for bushiroad if you ask me
I don’t play Vanguard because there’s nobody to play with in my small town, but as a game designer I find it very challenging to get into with the Emergy Generator being only in starter products and not in boosters (and also they kinda suck). I think it’s an okay mechanic, but the limitations put by Bushi kind of don’t make sense, you’re either forced to use the energy cards or the gauge card, but can’t use dice to it. That would make VG have 17 card zones with the G zone, order zone and the crest zone for the energy generator. I miss the old days when you would need only 50 cards to play with, and even the G Zone. The removal of the clans was defo a W move, even though there are still ghosts of the clans in the current game but the fact that the factions got reduced from over 20 to six.
- is really good. Ran out of characters sorryyy 😂
When I started playing one of the things I thought was really cool about vanguard was that a lot of the bosses or major cards appearing in the anime came from trial decks. With the anime being so positively received, it would be great to bring back those start products with cards you actually keep using and actually have value rather than every boss unit you actually use like jheva or youthberk coming from a booster set.
Better printing of promos and better processes for reprints (whether of promos or key cards) would really boost the player experience. I’d like it if promos were like early release or alt arts a month before the major set reprints it but we hardly get promo reprints
Think either outright banning the overtrigger or setting its power boost to 10k would make the game feel more consistent too
For more Decks like Stardust Blade!! But also Cards are so expensive right now its sad...
One thing that's also really important is year round availability. I know stores don't want stock sitting on shelves, but it's crazy to have to say "yeah you can get into the game in January if you pre order a stride deckset now. This years sold out ages ago." Meanwhile I can pick up a pokemon or lorcana starter deck from over a year ago at the same shop.
This is actually huge, especially big reprint sets like Festival Booster I feel like should really be produced in more than just 1 wave too
I think vanguard should do what pokemon used to and release like tournament decks at a slightly higher price point as a competitive entry point, between trial decks and stride decksets
Is that not what the stride decks are?
@@ZoruaHunter Stride decksets are basically all new cards released as a single product. The idea of selling tournament decks would mean reprints of popularly used cards as an entry point for players with a competitive deck, and allow current players to either pick up the deck easily, or obtain reprints of cards that are most likely needed for the game.
Thats consumer friendly, so no. Absolutely not.
@@IzuBear ah, duh. Cards that have been used a lot and proven successful instead of new ones
- Make it so Overtriggers aren’t used in tournaments. People do not take Vanguard that seriously as a competitive game in the west thanks to the ultimate sack that is overtrigger. They will never ban it at this point so they should at least make it so that tournaments you don’t use them or their power ups become 20k instead of 100 mil so it’s not as big of a sack.
- make more products like generation dragenesis. One of the biggest problems with Vanguard right now is so many decks waiting FOREVER to get new support. So they should have more boosters like this where they’re made just to support old ridelines. I imagine them, after a season of the anime ends, has like 2-3 sets of these where they provide every rideline in standard up to that point at least 2 new cards. This of course also means Lyrical.
- Lyrical should be more constant in the main sets. The fact that we started D series and it took til like year 3 or 4 for lyrical to be in the main sets is crazy. The current way lyrical is going is not good. Their own products sell awfully in English and they’re always behind the times on power level, I mean hell they didn’t even give them the new generic front. They need to just cave and fully put in the lyrical side sets into the main sets even if it means like increasing the amount of cards you’re getting per pack so people will stop complaining every other second about lyrical.
- Better starter decks. The quick starter decks were trash. We need actual good ones. More akin to what we got with the jeweled, Lianorn, and Youth decks but with out the extra product so it can be lower cost.
- More advertising. I cannot believe how this game is still going on internationally with no advertising but it’s still felt that the English side is crippling.
- A good F2P online simulator. Them cancelling Vanguard online was this games biggest failure. Me and my few friends straight stopped playing for years, til D series started, because of that cancellation.
- just erase dear days or at least lower the price. It’s a good product but still not worth its cost.
- Make promos just alt arts or special editions of existing cards, not brand new possibly meta or at least deck warping cards.
even overtriggers at 50k power woukd be fine. still extrwmely strong but can guard it with 3 15k triggers
Vanguard online was the developer fault
@@IVSAGTN doesn’t really change the fact that bushi still cancelled it and still hasn’t done anything to replace it
Since it's a part of the game, people should really get over the overtrigger crap. They won't stop; they'll keep creating more.
Having said that, it's a smart idea to use existing cards for alt arts.
Alternate art promo foiling for pack buying
and regular common card for participating tourneys
@ no, people should not just stop complaining about the overtrigger. If the player base just stopped complaining about the game then Bushi could just do whatever they want without any consideration of the consumer ie the people who are buying their product and giving them money.
in my opinion, this is the direction these new starter decks could be like:
- a playset of the boss unit
- 2x of that boss unit's most important supports (at least 1 type of the most used support)
- 2x each of effect crits and/or draws and booster set PGs
- nation OT
- either guaranteed sanctitude, or a "buy 2 starter decks get a sanctitude PR" campaign (since you get 2 of the boss' support)
- maybe include a simple deck box (like the ones from the Youth, Drajeweled, and Lianorn decks)
- and to keep the price reasonable, it could be like the first ever D starter decks, just 1 foil boss unit
for example Drajeweled could get:
- 4x booster set Drajeweled
- 2x Rockargours
- 2x Falcate Performers
- 2x each of effect crits and/or draws and booster set PGs
- Gallmageheld
Youth gets:
- 4x Skyfall Youth
- 2x Sequana
- 2x each of Zest, Gust, and Tempest
- 2x each of effect crits and/or draws and booster set PGs
- Amartinoa
edit: also i think the boss units that're most likely to get starter decks are Bavsargra (if she gets no new form in a DZBT), Drajeweled, Seraph, Youth or Bastion, Magnolia or Lianorn, and Kairi or Loronerol
Let's not return to the "you don't have a complete deck unless you buy multiple of the same trial deck" era please
@@CosmicNebula444it's best if bushiroad don't do that
Cause it's just a waste of money and not everyone gets a fair share of getting these decks
If you ask me, they should reprint the good generic card cards such as effect triggers like in at a lower ratity versions then the booster sets to keep prices down low for all players and keep the higher rarity cards in booster sets instead
To give a incentive for new or returning player something to buy for this TCG
Makes it's more accessible for all players of any skill level to play the game
And if they want to be a competitive player
They can start getting the better support cards from booster sets to be really good at official tournaments bushiroad wants to happen
Such a wasted opportunity to get new players to get into the game
I've actually been thinking about this myself. Personally, I was thinking it'd be a really good idea to reprint MLB/Blaster Blade stuff soon, and a Starter Deck of those cards would be perfect, considering that they're tied to Aichi. For English, it'd also be a good way to finally give us Blaster Blade The Vanguard, too lmao
YES
Yes!!!!! As a blaster main I need this and especially the vanguard
I agree
Considering that MLB is most well known card in the community
It's such a well known card due to nostalgia and how fun the deck is in standard
But it's not accessable to new players or returning or current players of the standard format as one of the support cards is a comic exclusive card that so far has not been reprinted yet
Would have been nice for such a deck to exist
Especially for me as it's one of my favourite units of the game
@@gwarguraqueentrickstarcoat9110 yeah I kinda play some online games and without the vanguard on my actual irl deck the deck feels like I lose a huge power budget.
@@gwarguraqueentrickstarcoat9110 I think the most well known card in community is like overlord
I am glad that Kris is bringing this topic up. As a new vanguard player who is almost finished with building their deck I find it incredibly difficult to figure out where to start! I know CFV is slowly cleaning up but I think they really need a definitive "START HERE" point that most people can agree on.
the Pr problem is very annoying
The twin tail girl is Hamari Kanoashi the boss of the deck is kyouka
The biggest problem with starter product is that it gets scalped in the west. Stardust blaze is current 2x the MSRP because cool blitz order is in it. Like not only does it have to be printed with good cards in mind, but printed into the ground. Its cool that SB had stuff in it to make it appealing to newer players and established players, but in order to get it at MSRP is to either work at the store, or know someone.
I think it may be fine to ban the overtrigger now. I remember a few years ago that there was a concern about Vanguard not having go-to staples that shops can hold to always sell to players. The last couple of years remedied this with the various nation cycle generics that most decks want.
For veterans of the game, starter product with full effect triggers and sanctitude would be an auto buy regardless of ride line etc because if i want to build say kothiblaze, id need effect triggers and effect pgs etc and it would make it so much easier!
I agree. Like Chris said bushiroad wont do it,they would go bankrupt😂😂
Oh and also, one of the main point of contention as well, is the price point. Like, YGO's Try Deck is like 1000ish yen, and it's all you need. Most TCGs (that has healthy starter product) does this, where to start with you'd need like 1000-2000 yen. Pokemon, you buy two packs of the Greninja deck and have a decent deck. One Piece, as mentioned in the video has loads of decently structured cheap deck. Doesn't even have to be competitive, just have to be decent to play with.
Meanwhile in Vanguard you got 800 yen trial deck that's filled with vanilla cards, and whose main vanguard probably won't get used.
New player here coming from OCG Yugioh and you had great point at the end regarding them treating us like we're 5 year olds with the newer starter decks 😭. It's been kinda hard to get into the game with how hard it is to get singles (building both Eva and Lianorn rn and a starter for Lianorn would be GREAT). Been mostly playing by using proxies for now but I can't enter competitive with them so it's kind of a shame :
I honestly feel like Rotovisor, Flamme-G, Dolls, Liscaria, and Ghryandra were suppose to be the starter product. Cuz if you look at them, with the exception of Rotovisor till they showed that promo, they have all been getting relativly decent main set support and they're all decent decks. They are pretty much the decks I used to get some of my friends into the game. They're all pretty cheap. The only problem is explaining you need to buy an Energy Generator, PGs, and Triggers. Other wise my Friends all picked up each deck for like 20-30 dollars US in singles.
As someone who has played in tournaments during the G-Era and has played Dear Days, I find it very challenging to get into Standard Format. I find it difficult because the all the Quick Start Decks suck and the better decks that have Divine Skills can only be obtained by purchasing booster packs. On top of that, getting Damage and Power counters for the cards is hard and is pretty expensive. It would be much appreciated if Bushiroad created Competitive Tournament Level Starter Decks for every Nation with incredible skills. It would also be nice if those Starter Decks included Sleeves, Energy Generators, Power & Damage Counters, Over Triggers, Order Cards, Effect Perfect Guards, and a Double Deck Box.
I fully agree on your take about starter decks. My opinion is that they need to make more starter decks like G with a lot of variety. All of try 3 got a TD. Luard and Shiranui got one Harri and Nightrose had one. Even cards like Chouchou that didn't appear in the anime had one. They should go back to selling regular priced TDs (1000 yen to 1500 yen) ones and have it so you buy one and have 4 copies of your important cards. This I feel is the best way to get newcomers into the game. It's easy and cheap and you have the bare minimum on you. No need to inflate the price with sleeves etc. Those products are nice and I like them, but I feel like they should not get more priority over regular TDs. The Cray epic ride lines should have had TDs, we should have had new Baro, Eugene, Hexaorb as TDs for example. I've had several instances of my Yugioh friends asking me if the deck I lent them to play with me had a TD only for them to be disappointed when I said no, when if there was one, they might have gotten into the game by buying it. In fact when the Overdress 300 yen sds came out and the WillDress tds came out, I actually did manage to get some of my friends to start playing the game by reccomending them a starter deck. People prefer getting into a tcg via a TD rather than having to buy packs or singles to build a deck or even buying a deck someone else made and is selling on merukari or something. The severe lack of regular TDs is sad and I hope they change that from now on!
I agree with this since a friend of mine started playing and I could only advise Stardust Blade, because the others were expensive or the recent ones were literally just blank cards when he wanted keter. Now he is doing slowly Youthberk deck but I thought of what you said and what if it was 3 from will dress theme and 3 from fated, like for example:
DE - Varga
BG - Welstra
Lyrical - Krysrain
DS - Drajewel
KS - Youth
Stoicheia - Lianorn
or
DE - Jheva
Keter - Youth
DS - Drajeweled
BG - Fated Welstra
Stoicheia - Fated Zorga
Lyrical - Krysrain
And I say Varga due to it's popularity, it doesn't need to have dual nations or energy cyclers and even doesn't need the set 5 stuff, would sell amazingly well and people would go after the most recent sets made.
The most painful feeling when you buy a starter deck is realizing that none of the cards are gonna be in your final max tuned version. I had this when i started with V in highschool and bought the narukami starter deck, saved up money for that shi...
atleast when i bought salamangreat for yugioh they gave me actual gazelles, spinnys so i can do the actual combos.
on another note.....Bushi, make a graiandra starter deck and my soul is yours again
Thank you!! This does not get talked about enough it is too damn hard to get new players into this game!! In comparison to other competing TCGs
I was literarily typing Starter Deck Yuyu/Raika while playing the video.
I like your position. It's not like entering Vanguard is expensive. You can grab a playset of the newest collab set when a new set drops and that's usually quite cheap.
But we really need a solid boxed product that represent the standard format of Vanguard. We can't point at Love and Berry and say "this is Vanguard."
Plus collab decks don't have ongoing support, so once someone brought in by collab decides to stay, they still struggle to find a deck they can keep building and playing.
Completely agree with everything you mentioned. It feels like Bushiroad was attempting to make Vanguard appear "easy to learn/beginner friendly" by stripping the start decks down to being vanilla but I feel this has a pretty negative effect on the reception of the game. It doesn't allow for beginners to witness what makes Vanguard fun and interesting for veterans and at the same time gives this impression that new players are incapable of comprehending basic mechanics.
Gatekeeping effects triggers despite being almost 4 year into standard is also incredibly odd since G starter decks had no issue including 2 copies in the past. They are killing it with their "higher tier" product in Stride decksets but they seem out of touch for their more budget friendly option.
I had an easier time getting players into the game in 2018-2021 with V starter decks than the situation we are currently in.
- Revert time rules
- Stop making crucial cards promos
- Ban the overtrigger
- Add energy to Premium
- Premium-specific set
- Ban D deckset crests from premium
I could totally related to this, i just started playing Pokemon recently, and im surprised how useful their recent starter decks are, more than 50% of the deck are actually staple to the deck, i bought the Gardevoir one, and it already has Iono, Arven, Professor Research, Earthen Vessel, Ultra Balls, Nest Balls, and the full 443 evolution lines, which are staple for this deck (and lot of decks too), in Vanguard term, its like giving full different colored Youthberks alongside effect triggers and PGs to the started deck.
This is really surprising, because i used to think that TCG are normally this expensive as a hobby, but turns out another TCG could actually lowers the new player gate. So yeah, i think it's time for Bushiroad to look past instant money by milking current players and step up their game to invite new players instead by making the game more accessible. Cuz i really love Vanguard and i dont want it to become Buddyfight 2.0😢
The G Legend decks were so good as starting points for new and returning players at the time... we need stuff like that again.
Legend Deck Aichi has got to be one of the greatest products in Vanguard's history
Issues with vg right now:
1) Insane offensive power crept for the player going 1st (Razael & Levidras killing people on their 1st g3 turn while people are at g2 + can turbo filter + low cost for skills)
2) Lack of any good defensive mechanics (Like V's G3 heal guardians) for the player going 2nd to at least survive in a playable game state going into their 1st g3 turn
3) Really bad starter products + insanely op (& expensive) generics to make the decks playable
4) OT is still in the game (at least nerf the +100mil to a guardable number of +30k or something ffs so people can actually account for OT number and the attacking players kill turn doesn't just end with the 1st attack, the effects themselves are usually game changing already)
To further your point on the lack of good starter product for vanguard: I'm a returning player, I quit playing during the middle of V Era, and tried to come back after seeing Ominagruzio. My problem during that time was: I don't know what works and don't, I tried to check the vanguard wiki for all cards that might be relevant for Omina, make a list of necessary cards, buy them from 7 different sellers, some I need to order from Japan because no one is selling them here. After all that, I end up needing to replace 24 cards because it doesn't work as well as I expected.
Now, everytime I buy a new deck, I will only buy it if its already prebuilt. While they are much more expensive, its still cheaper than sourcing all the cards from so many sellers and paying for those transport cost.
A good starting deck will definitely help alliviate that problem
100% agree with the points brought up here
It genuinely feels so odd that stride decksets are the best product if you wanna learn vg and stand a chance at a locals, despite the fact that they are just not representative of how most other decks plays
They don't teach you about the importance of the early game (cuz most cards are gb-locked), there's no mention of energy, divine skills or even how persona ride works
it leaves you in a very weird spot where you don't understand the format you're playing, but you know what a stride is
we should have product that allows you to build more transferable skills lol
The Try decks were ENG OCG only :v but you are right. I managed to rope a new player and they were interested in Stride decks and a friend got Stardust Blade TD, but new players need really good entry points, and more than one. And old TDs, due to the Energy Crest, were made invalid
@differentfight what needs to be done to get players into the game, is 1) have these “glitter” decks as the Starter decks. 2) start making the g1 back to 10k shield. Like you said the older generation knows how to play and it would be a lot better for new player to understand how the game works; plus keeps power creep somewhat under control.
What vanguard needs:
- Fire people responsible for 3 card reprint sets. The purpose of reprint set is bring down prices of staples and this kind of product do not do it at all. Just do normal reprint sets from time to time like Duel Devastator from yugioh or megatins.
- Fire the person responsible for decision to put in a quick starter deck 90% of vanila cards. This was horrible product and in the west we got sleeves added to drive up pricepoint to 20$. Its a joke of product in 2024 while at the same time you are forced to buy it if you want to play competetive because energy generator (which should be a F-ing boxtopper).
- Stop with deckfixing promos. Put that in main sets to entice people to buy product! If you keep loosing because your deck is not consistent or do not do stuff you want it to do, because its gatekept by promo then you have less enticement to come to shop. Not only that, but some shops open these promos and sell them for singles without handling packs to players.
- Start with giving good premium product like 3 times a year. This format is great for competetive, its skill intensive, its nice to watch (standard is RNG format which diceroll and trigger checks is like 70% of your win).
- PUT ON A FREE TO PLAY SIMULATOR. JUST GO MASTER DUEL WAY. NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WILL PAY AAA PRICE TAG FOR CARD GAME SIM.
- Remove OT from premium and make it full skill reliant format.
Vanguard is not even in top 10 selling card games in japan. Literaly getting beaten by lorcana is humiliating, because bushi missmanages cardgame. They do not learn from mistakes. 2 reboots though them NOTHING.
I agree with what you guys are saying. I was also thinking today that they should bring out like a 5 pack of just the energy generator to put with other decks instead of having to always swap them around with the deck you want to use for that day or tournament.
I think an official online client that isn't dear days would be very good for the game, especially here in the West, since the game isn't as popular in comparison to Japan. I would like to see more frequent banlists for all formats of the game and for there to be more than just two cards that get hit on the banlist.
The main issue atm is ratios are bad which cause prices to become toxic asf which yes is bushiroads fault. Sets don't need 21 RRR imho they need to down shift alot of the rarities keeping the RRR for boss units only then have RR and R and C support said boss unit and or the generic staples, like in OG vanguard. They also need 8 copies minimum of each RRR per case, prices only started to go crazy in D around set 5 and onwards when they increased the RRR and RR count but cut the pull rates back.
Set structure should imo be something like: 12 RRR (2 each nation) 24 RR (4 each nation) 24 R ( 4 each nations) 48 C (6 each nation)
Promo issue is a simple fix, actually print the card in the set it supports something in THEN print a holo or a stamped version for shops to hand out as tournament promo in a pack with some older format staple cards too. That way promo chasers get to bling their decks while new players aren't left out because staple cards are in there also.
its really funny seeing the comment section and everyone just goes "ban the ot!"
and the world goes round and round
Something I would personally love to see is possibly re printing some of the G1 or what ever from stride decksets that made them so expensive, the fact that a luard msrp is 50$ but even on release you where lucky to find them for under 80 for the basic or 200+ for premium versions all because the g1 and crest is crazy now base set is 150$ on tcg 3 times more then what it should be makes it hard for old players who are coming back that enjoy it to pick up something basic
It’s sucks more because of how good the dress starter products were. The decks gave you access to the boss unit used in the anime, and gave you a sort of structure to build off or with the cards in the main sets. I remember seeing an old video of yours recently at the start of D where the video was just buy the starter deck, and then here’s the card from set 1 you can put in to improve the deck. Tbh my main problem With the quick start decks was the fact that all the cards in the decks were given effect versions in DBZ01, and their effects were so painfully mid that they easily could’ve been cards in the start deck and the products would’ve improved so much, and then all this mid cards wouldn’t take up more set space. I get they were made to introduce the mechanics in the game in a basic way, but the mechanics of vanguard aren’t that complicated in all honesty, not the hardest thing to pick up
I think they should take a different approach to reprints and make them more frequent and accessable not special alt art shenanigans rarity that's harder to get then the initial print but just literally RR
Lower rarity of staple cards for budget deck building for example my gripe with the Xoverdress was how every single Vairina aside Vils was a RRR instead of making lower rarity version with the only drawback of having higher cost for skill.
OTher then starter product, reprint sets should be fixed as well. Like, do an actual reprint set WITHOUT any new cards, and DO NOT make them a 3 card per pack. THEN we can talk about fixes to the game.
My young cousins just got curious about vanguard and i felt proud. So i went online to buy start decks. I had to buy overdress decks to teach them
I don't think new player wanna cards that do nothing, even if they don't understand it at first
Mobile or pc game would be my pick. I live in a small rural area and nobody around me plays. Having a way to interact with the game outside the anime would be great!
Closest I’ve ever come to playing the actual game is dear days, before that was vangaurd zero. If they can actually make something like master duel then that’s free money for them and an easy way to get new player who will then come over to the real game or just give them more money on the online game.
You know at the beginning part. There is something missing in vanguard: Stand Triggers.
Bushiroad always screws up. They start with all the good vibes and then they just do the things bad.
Bushiroad needs to start considering their non-Japanese customers more. Some of us want to support the game, but their practices of these promos for their shops as an example just doesn’t work outside Japan. They really need to build goodwill with shops outside Japan, since folks are still plenty upset this game rebooted twice and turned many folks away from that alone.
Format with no OT or ban the OT, have more accessible products for new & returning players, keep the pricing for staple to be lowered so playerbase can grow, PR not being staple cards for decks but are alternative artworks of cards, no double loss for the competitve tournaments, a official online client of CFV for PC & the current gen consoles,
The OT is game changing. Changing the power buff should be something to look into.
For starter decks, they should re imagine the OG 5 start decks to have Divine Skills but make it like Buddyfight ones where their Divine Skills(Overturn) aren't as strong so they would still buy the RRR version on booster packs and have them have the same name so they would just run 4 copies.
This very thing actually happened with me and Youthberk. I wanted to play it so badly but when I got the start deck and realized the Youthberk in the start deck wasn't the same one as the one in the set then saw that the actual one played was $60+ USD per copy and that wasn't including the rest of the stuff I needed. I dropped the idea so fast and never got to play the deck I was most excited to play in a while. I'm not saying put all the best stuff in the deck asap, but that deck was 100% unplayable out of the box...I got a kinda cool deck box though....
I think the elephant in the room is that their primary customer is not the players but the stores. the entry product that they want sell is players buying singles from stores, the promo situation will never end so long as they keep on the path to incentivise peoe to come into stores for tournements and whatever mobile game they could come out with has to be strictly worst than the paper experience or it cuts into money people could be spending on cards. I hate to sound defeatist on this subject but with the years of criticism the player base has given bushi their really is no other reason i can think of.
I 100% agree with this and to add to this Shadowverse Evolve has the same problem. We aren't even getting the combined starter decks of dragoncraft and runecraft which is such a shame.
Kinda agree on most of the idea here.
I like to play most of the vanguard decks but my local shop and online shop keep increasing the key cards price for no reason....and when the current value of the cards drop,they refused to reduce the price?
spitting facts. also love the lighting in this vid
1. Stop rebooting
2. Find a way so older card can have a play again
3. Make MD instead of overpriced Switch game
4. No OT
5. Add more trigger variation, maybe like rearguard switch effect.
I started playing when Season 2 Overdress aired; I played D format first and had fun, then i tried V format and very hooked up by the playstyle
It looks like V has utilized every vanguard playstyle ever created
Playing with damage zone, deal damage to yourself, Refiarade style (Vg dont attack but lot of drive-cheking), JK style (placing onto other unit), Starhulk (reversing trigger effect) also playing with opp drive check
OG Vanguard has so many starter product that it's wild that modern Vanguard right now is struggling with it
16:04 5K jumpscare W O W meme. Make my day thanks
I actually think the best starter decks they could make that would be really cool are maybe starter decks for the promo bosses . We have at least 1 in every nation and they just showed us in youthquake with spinomarquis they are finally willing to give them ride lines and support. Other option is the glitter bosses
What do you mean when you say start decks? Like I understand being brand new to the game, but would you exclude the stride deck sets because of both the price and their competitive viability?
We need a nice middle of the road between stride decks and starter decks similar to the stand up deck sets, but without the extra add ons.
One thing that I’ve noticed with trying to start out new players especially that come from previous TCG’s, is the stipulation’s behind Vanguard. Things like Bermuda’s Bikini rares and Thegrea(My favorite D deck atm.) is just really hard to show to players without feeling ashamed. I understand it’s a cultural thing and it may even be where I live that might be an issue (right smack in the middle of the Bible Belt) but it’s just extremely difficult to get people to look past a lot of negatives with the Vanguard community
Drinking Game: Take a shot every time Jason said "Yep/Ya" in the background.
From Limit Break, to Legion, to stride just to so many mechanics so fast no one could keep up with constantly changing mechanics and the meta game or anyone playing at all at least here in New Jersey was non existent. It just feels like they’re always trying to catch up to other card games by rushing but that cost myself and the few people who played to all just slowly not keep up.
The Divine Skill units should've been trial deck cards 🤷♂& Make the booster sets for upgrades or new boss units for minor decks (like Heroes). That's my take lol
Keep the OT
No more double loss for time rules.
Keep the OT as it is.
Don't add the ride deck nor the energy generator to P
Ban the D encounter stride crests and cards from P
I remember back in the day when they introduce Narukami and Gold Paladin Starter Deck that's when I play Vanguard for the first time and that's how they get me to play their game although I stop playing Vanguard because they're so expensive during Stride era
Iirc earlier this year Duel Master also release 2 starter/structured deck for 2 Nation, which their retail price is 500 JPY, and it really strong as well
They should in general release more structure/starter decks, I agree... They even had that going on well in the first season when releasing the more competitive starter decks providing some very viable aces...
Honestly if vanguard take lessons on making starter decks on wixoss level it would do so much for the game. Wixoss start decks have mostly being pretty decent even in tournament settings and the best part about their start decks is that whenever they release a new one, it usually has 2-4 copies of a reprinted meta card. That's why new players have a smoother transition into the game and older players can get these older meta cards without breaking their wallet.
Also, Kris you look so good in this, is this a new lighting set up ?
I agree with many of these. Especially a better starter deck similar to other card games.
Personal problem I have is that in my country we are like 3 years behind kekw.
Different types of game-play is my opinion, now every thing is multi attack (more than 3 attacks). We do not have other play styles, before there was more variety, something a kin to control( Megacolony and Link joker/Star-Vader) or defensive ( Angel Feather- Gavrail) or discard(Nubatama).
100%. Im tryna get into vanguard after zero and build an actual playable deck but the cost is too high and the cards are hard to get. It is very demotivating! I might as well not even start lol
Splits really help too. Getting Liael soon. ❤
Needing more starter product is a good point to bring up for sure. But my issue beyond that is that even if the Starter product is there. Would the west even get it? Or would the product specific cards just get jammed into another product later on as short printed box toppers? So I'd say even more than Starter product in order of importance would be increased investment in western markets
The stand up decks were the best! I could give a person to try out the game with the favrneel deck while i played orfist and everyone would figure out how to play and really enjoy the game
I really want something that gives me a playset of effect triggers and the nation overtrigger. Despite all the reprints of triggers if I were to buy a playset I would end up spending more on just the triggers than the start deck. My most recent physical purchase is Stardust Blade and the only reason I bought it was because I liked the artwork and that G3 Vyrgilla Says that The Vanguard you love won't end here.
As others have said about new formats/rules, I really don't like OverTrigger as the opponents could lose because they didn't have two sentinels in hand or worse the attacking player knows they would have lost next turn if it weren't for OverTrigger check. Both players know the win isn't as valuable. I guess it makes for great moment between friends, but I swear this game could wind up like Buddyfight did with this +100 million crap.
The time investment to not only know how my decks but also my opponents. I don't want to memorize 80 - 100 cards each set. My LGS isn't that beginner friendly and Dear Days is a mid tier video game at best. Not a bad card game sim but it fell short of the mark and yet asked for way more $$ than it should have.
they need to make it so that decks need more than 1 boss/vanguards to play so they can still sell other bosses for that deck in the set while also put good boss in the trial deck. Like Breakride / G Era TDs. Makes it easier to sell cards whike also spices up the gameplay too
There's at least 20 starter decks
Lyrical deck in deluxe was Kyouka, never saw her play it though.
Important archetype cards being promos and drops on festival and triple drive sets suck cause they expensive as hell and have to wait forever for a reprint. A lack of pre built decks and more dynamic things in the game like a archetype that has multiple vanguards or order units or more defensive combos
As a loyal Youthberk, a Youth Starter product will be a huge godsend to us :>
The lack of starter products is the worst, like me and my brother want to get into the game, but getting the cards is hard because of where we live, it would literally solve all our problems if bushi just released a couple of decks every year
Vanguard mobile game would be nice
God I miss Vanguard ZERO 😭
Vanguard digital client for PC, mobile and consoles would be better
This
Tbh as someone who wants to get into the game but can't is that theres no good way to play the game digitally because I live far from a store without transportation so I cant play it physically. Then Dear days is asking for $70 as an entry fee which I thought my friend was joking with me when they first said it then they said plus dlc for newer cards. Knowing tcg there is probably a fanmade version of it but knowing fanmade tcg its probably freeroam like you playing irl for example yugioh it would be duelingbook and I still need guidence of what am I doing and why and practice not against people yet like a story mode, it just feels Im stuck in a paradox. So in the mean time I just be on the slidelines watching
I think they should ease up on the personal effects that a lot of decks get, like the autoMod gauge. That or give other decks access to these outside of deck mechanics but they work differently from the original.
There's a lot of times where I watch two different decks match up but due to the differing mechanics it doesn't even feel like they're playing the same game.
They should make products by level... beginner/intermediate/ advance...at the end of advance product you got complete deck with with old staple unit and effect trigger...and booster box can be cheap and got new unit that support that the deck you finish
7:52 Kris: this is how you get new people into the game
Bushi: by going bankrupt ? 🤨
I miss generic ride lines so that I can make choices in what I run in my decks.
(The problem to me is deckbuilding feel forced in standard. I had a few friends not get into the game because of it)
@DifferentFight First they need to come out with the EFF Heal for lyrical that's uses its effect when the opponent's grade is higher you.
what they really need is make a good online client, or to really try to push into shops. CFV is really only California here in the US
They should have a new entry level decks like Gramgrace, orfist etc
Maybe like featuring units like Youthberk, Drajewel, Basavargra, but in a advanced level product type of decks. (Lianorn/Magnolia is also fine too!!!)
Otherwise it will be hard to intro new players starting game when complaints such as cards are expensive, prices are unforgiving etc. Especially having my friend to start playing this year has been too difficult bcuz of those feedbacks about the market.
Speaking of reprints, Bushi never reprinted their Triple Drive booster set.
I feel like instead of asking for reprints, Bushi needs to come up with new cards that has two skills. One skill would specifically support a new ride line while the second skill would be a more generic skill that other ridelines can use.
One example would be Francette. One skill can only be used by Krysrain while the other can be used by other Lyrical cards. Makes a good alternative for Yuika.
Why go with this direction? Reprints can help new players. But the thing is... What about the old players who already have the old cards? If a new booster pack comes out, and if these old players are loyal to their current ride line, what would they look forward to?
So I say, make a new ride line with good support, that way new players don't have to prioritise looking for a reprints meanwhile older players get new cards they could or won't use.
On business side, more players looking forward to the new releases would be good for business.
This is going to make every cards very expensive in the secondary markets. More RRR generics will make decks more expensive
Bruh that is a terrible idea. Loving Pink Francette is a $18 to $20 dollar card minimum because it's second skill is so generic. Keep in mind Francette price has only gone down recently. It used to be $30 dollars minimum, not even a month ago.
@Nineball757 It is high priced because it is the one of the rare cards that has skills to support both generics and Krysrain. As for older cards that need reprints, their prices are also high. So would you rather pay for old cards at high prices or new cards that could be high or low price? if you make more cards like Francette, then it would mean less need for her and cards like her. Lower demand mean lower prices.
@@iqhmalRedux not really, take Diantha for example. We got more Stoicheia revivers now so demand for her is lower.
@SinRealm @SinRealm Diantha is a poor example. Diantha is cheap not because we got more Stocheia revive units. It's because:
1 - She got a reprint.
2 - More importantly, She got power crept by Alvina, who is basically Diantha 2.0, but better.
What's Alvina price on the secondary market? $18 to $20. Basically the exact same price Diantha was before she got a reprint and before this card came out. Despite the numerous Stocheia revive units we have gotten.
I think normal Blitz Orders should have their own deck or zone with the exception being Regalis Pieces.