You will be even more excited to know that Qualcomm right now actively working together with the Linux kernel developers and the larger Linux community for an absolute FULL support for their new Snapdragon X Elite chip series and also for older SoCs. It's coming together this year and beginning next. So, Windows won't be the only options on the new, shiny beasty laptops that came out already with X and will come later on.
That is very nice. Let's be real, ARM or other RISC architectures are the future for laptops. So, being able to buy one in the near future (my laptop is not very good) is a pretty nice thing. If they support external GPUs that would make it the best laptop. Imagine using the internal super efficient APU when unplugged and using the normal external GPU when plugged. That will be crazy good
@@vidal9747 The news just surprised me this week, especially so close after the current ARM Windows laptop announcements. Qualcomm is already working for support with 6.8 and 6.9 kernels and will be fully done towards later kernels.
I get that you’re bored but the truth is that boring is exactly what people want out of an operating system. We are currently in a situation where we need to take the needs of average users seriously now due to all the AI madness that’s happening across the tech sector. Many refugees coming to Linux. I hope that Cosmic helps that and doesn’t add to their confusion.
Exactly. But this is the motto of the community. Always changing everything. Now, a new desktop, more options. This is why Linux Desktop never will be a big hit. More than 30 years and still fighting for uniformity in the appearance of desktop applications.
Please, let's discuss this further. We need to provide a better, stable, working and accessible option for the majority of OS's users. Microsoft is punishing windows 10 users, and maybe it's for a good reason: it is no longer profitable for them to have them using it. So this is a great change to establish a mature option for users needing a working computer.
the beauty of this community is there is something for everyone, while we need stability, ease of use, and popularity, we also would like something new, these two categories should be just split in two
@@pubdigitalix no not at all, Linux is about Choices not about Uniformity. There are plenty of Distros that offer Uniformity and plenty that do not. All about choices, you choose what you like.
Scroll speed! Are we really just going to skip over the fact they have this in the settings?????? Finally Linux with mouse/trackpad scroll speed built in!
I mostly use Windows but I installed Fedora on an old laptop for my brother after his Macbook died. I am amazed at how good it feels! So snappy and clean. If it wasn't for some of the proprietary software I need, I'd probably use it full time. But one thing I was perplexed by was the lack of scroll speed control. Why is that not an option? Surely it's not that hard to have a slider to adjust a factor in the scrolling speed.
I will fix some of the issues in the video. There is functioning icon theme support, but changing the theme mode will clear cached icon theme data at the moment. Some changes on that page are needed to not overwrite the page data on theme mode changes.
If you can ensure that libcosmic provides pixel perfect theming, that'd be amazing. So far, the theme looks a bit rough, but it's pre alpha, so I understand it's not your main concern yet. At 10:34 by example, for the right click menu: there should be consistent space around the highlight, it should not be reaching the side unless it's filling the line entirely. shortcuts tips could be a tad darker than function name to not read both the same way like there were the same thing. The menu separator should not reach the edges, it's cleaner when it starts/ends at a few pixels from the edge. The first line "Open" is way closer to the edge than" Move to trash" etc
GNOME visual are not bad, but some choices are questionable. COSMIC it's an opportunity to take the best of GNOME, like CSD, headerbars, and mix with the best of KDE, like proper customization, a functional system tray, support for the DE draws windows decorations if needed and more powerfull programs.
@@sheevys I love it. With the headerbars, the programs look amazing, and the new camera app is one of the design peaks I never thought GNOME could reach. However, I do disagree that GNOME makes CSD the only way to operate a window. COSMIC encourages CSDs, but it's not mandatory, and programs that don't have one will be designed by COSMIC itself.
@@donkey7921 I hope, too! And I hope COSMIC get an HIG, to avoid inconsistencies like KDE programs, but draws a future for COSMICs apps, towards accessibility, eye-candy (why not) and beyond.
Pretty excited about a new DE, hope they can polish it the coming months. I'm pretty fond of GNOME so if it's a bit like GNOME but more performant with better customization/defaults (like dash-to-dock that almost everyone uses) then I'm already a fan!
I have to say that originally I found the gnome system of minimal features that require extensions bizarre. That's because for some reason when I was first using a gnome DE the firefox plugin needed to install gnome extensions didn't work for me. I remember thinking, why the heck do I need a firefox plugin to get basic features of my DE? And then of course I had the experience many have had of an extension I'd used for years suddenly breaking or no longer being available and one broken extension disabling all the others. So frankly I just like this idea of applets that are built to integrate seamlessly with Cosmic, that run as separate processes, that won't break, that probably use less resources, and that can be turned on and off in a settings panel. The gnome system seems perverse. So I don't care if it looks just like gnome. The important thing is it doesn't work like it. Plus I prefer the UI features of the current Pop and the built-in tiling WM. People forget, but splitting up the gnome activities overview into several targeted launchers like rofi made sense as a way to streamline workflow. And it was built in so you didn't have to do a rofi configuration. And they forget how great it was to have the equivalent of i3 wm accessible right inside a full-featured desktop.
I love that the terminal has a traditional "file edit view etc" menu bar. I get really annoyed when desktop apps do hamburger menus that have more than a few options (and especially when they have submenus), because they're really difficult to use with a screen magnifier.
The fact that the COSMIC DE allows you to adjust the scroll speed of the mouse easily could indicate that the COSMIC developers actually want to develop a desktop environment for the average user, the long-time Windows/macOS user.
I tried the latest build and was very impressed. I loved how easy it was to theme. Really a comfy middle ground between GNOME and Plasma. You can not only easily change the accent color, but also the main windows colors. Not several dozen colors to mess with like KDE but just enough to totally change the look in minutes without downloading themes. I really like the balance of customization, powerful features and ease of access. I really am excited and think it will be pretty popular.
As fedora keeps getting new "tiling-window manager" variants this is the only fedora variant I'm looking forward to. Finally something that's workspace-oriented but also supports modern features such as (gasp) floating windows, an actual settings page and themes I don't have to download as text files from some random GitHub repo
Can't wait to try this out. I love pop_os because of their automatic tiling set up. I want to use tiling but I also don't want to use tiling (because of all these setups you have to do 😂)
you can def already see the performance improvements over the pop shop when he pulled it up. I was wondering what the big selling point here was, and a from the ground up rust DE is very appealing
@@st.altair4936 GNOME is not a modular applet-based desktop environment. On that front alone, COSMIC is closer to Xfce than GNOME. The ability to simulate GNOME is a testament to how flexible COSMIC's layout and applet architecture is.
@@joshuaconsiglio6136 One of the selling points of pop shop is the performance. Thank god we don't have to deal with the slow mess of gnome software and the discover anymore!
Appreciate you taking the time to spin this up and poke around - looking good so far. Hope we can get our grubby little hands on it for real later this year.
I'm really excited for COSMIC. I think it will be a nice addition to the forward thinking distros, and it might be the only one to get me to move from a window manager.
@@KoopstaKlicca well it just looks like gnome in my eyes. also DO NOT USE POP_OS!! it’s a horrible experience, use something like debian or arch. if your a newbie, use nobara.
This is not going to be fair if you do 30 days daily drive challenge with pre alpha Cosmic Desktop. BTW, I am testing it about 6 months now, it is very stable (feel more stable than KDE). 😁
@@adammontgomery7980 its not Gnome. Gnome, even though probably one of the best DE's available on Linux, is still trash. I think Cosmic realizes that it can't just be another Gnome. The Cosmic store looks more like a windows or apple app store than the traditional joke of previous linux "stores". i think Cosmic has true promise to be the first GREAT Linux DE that normies would feel comfortable using.
Honestly the only thing I dig about the Cosmic Desktop is the fluid and responsive tiling feature. If KDE/Gnome had that it would be epic. The rest of the features (desktop customization/shop/terminal/editor/greeter/settings/etc) are fine but nothing special that would make me want to switch other than to try something new.
i think it will be very interesting for the future. cosmic can be used by other developers to make it their own. plugins should work better than under gnome
The cosmic-store is actually our killer app right now that we recommend trying out on KDE and GNOME. Try comparing the performance and memory consumption with GNOME Software and KDE Discover.
Iirc KDE plasma seems to have something similar now. Not full fledged auto tiling like i3 or hyprland unfortunately. That said, they do seem to be working on it which is great.
"not much exciting" -- what exactly would be "exciting" for you: - Include AI into the desktop - life checks for copyright infringements in the file sysstem - Add Ads into the configuration dialogs - Have a global account that you must have to install the system on your own computer? What I want to say: I had my share of excitement on Windogs and on Linux computers already. That was one reason, I ditched KDE for Gnome -- because at one point the KDE team management to break my work routine so much and even break fine running apps that did stop working and I even lost valuable data. I am using Linux for working with it -- I don't need excitement new stuff. What I need is a system that works and that gives me at least the feeling, that this is MY computer, that works for me -- and not the other way around as I get with the Windogs "offering", where I am the product now.
Seeing the tiling system really gave me some new thoughts about the desktop experience. Floating windows and desktop icons are a tragedy that most of us are cursed with. Floating windows as a whole concept make no sense because I've never once thought that the perfect place for an application isn't in a maximized or snapped position. It just looks messy. And desktop icons are equally terrible because why would you want your icons being covered by the very apps you're trying to use? The taskbar is a great and minimal idea to store away icons for apps in a familiar and consistent way, yet desktop icons are unruly and difficult to access. I think Cosmic will be the future of the Linux desktop considering that it's pre-alpha state already looks like this.
Can we just maybe get a desktop experience that actually works? There are already plenty of distributions that look fancy and dont work. At this point we are lucky if we get proper drivers from Nvidia, which I dont know if anyone noticed is currently taking over the world.
we have XFCE for AGES now.. why not just use what's already perfect?! gtk themes are there for it which makes it look however you want and everything else can be customised too while it's feature complete and rock solid.
I understand this is an alpha, so I do not mean to be too harsh or blunt, but at a higher level what is the actual vision or purpose behind this? Why are they making a whole new desktop environment? I'm in the camp of boring is good, boring means stability. I am very happy with Gnome on PopOS 22.04 and I don't see the benefit of leaving Gnome for a new desktop environment that's probably going to be missing features that already exist and will most likely be buggy on launch...
Novel and Cutting Edge are cool, but a stable desktop (system, really) on which to develop, or get anything done in general, is really, really exciting, too. Interesting vid, thx.
I WAS PLANNING TO MOVE TO HYPRLAND, BUT WATCHING THIS, A TILING DE, WRITTEN IN RUST FOR MY 4GB RAM POTATO MACHINE, AND READY TO USE, I'M SOLD ! I'LL WAIT FOR IT TO GET OVER THE ARCH OFFICIAL REPOS, ALONGSIDE GIMP 3.0 !
I'm starting to think about contributing to Cosmic. I'm not a huge fan of ICED as a UI toolkit and that's what has kept me away so far but the progress on the desktop is exciting. Does anyone happen to know if GTK4 (without libadwaita) can be used with COSMIC to produce native-feeling windows? I assume all the built-in widgets are coupled to ICED, right?
COSMIC's native toolkit is libcosmic. Therefore, if you want to build applications which look native to COSMIC, you have to build them with libcosmic. To be a truly native COSMIC design, you need to have an application which uses the nav bar and context drawers from our interface guidelines, which come baked into the application trait in libcosmic. If you build applications with iced, they won't fit in with COSMIC either, since Iced doesn't use COSMIC's desktop theming.
@@mmstick Ah, I thought libcosmic was built on top of ICED. From the examples in the libcosmic repo it appears they share the same design philosophies (very functional, react+redux like). I'm not saying this programming architecture is wrong, just not to my taste. I'd have liked it if libcosmic was a lower level API that frameworks could build on top of. Then again, I guess being prescriptive is what Apple does with SwiftUI so it's hard to argue with results 🤣
@@DavidAlsh Best not say in public that TEA (The Elm Architecture) and its MVU (Model-View-Update) design pattern is like React+Redux. An Elm philosopher might have a brain aneurysm reading that. Quite the opposite. React+Redux is essentially what Leptos is doing, whereas this is more like Sauron. We were actually explicitly looking to build a toolkit that uses the MVU design pattern from the very beginning. Largely in part because it's a perfect match for Rust's borrow checker; and I happened to come to the same conclusions after years of modeling all of the GTK applications in Rust for PopOS-which eventually led to a joint effort to take Relm4 to the next level. The iced runtime is a very lean event loop which has ownership of your application's struct-aka the Model. In each iteration of the loop, the runtime calls the view method of the Model to create a View. The View is a state machine whose purpose is both to describe the layout of the interface and how to draw it; and to be a streamlined pipeline for processing UI events and yielding any Messages from widgets in the View that they triggered.The View can efficiently borrow data directly from the Model because the View has the same lifetime as the borrowed Model. Once the View has been drawn, the runtime will wait for UI events-such as mouse and keyboard events-and process them directly through the View. Those events will be pass through various widgets which may emit any number of Messages in response. After the View has processed the UI event, the View is dropped and any received Messages will be passed through the Model's update method, which mutably borrows the Model. The update method uses pattern matching to find the appropriate branch to execute (which is much faster than dynamic dispatch), and the programmer can then update the model while running any application logic necessary. Once the update method has completed, the next iteration of the loop begins. So the main thread does not require an async executor as it only needs to manage one event loop, and its one application model. In practice, optimizing an iced/libcosmic application requires minimal effort because there is only one model, with one view method, and one update method. There are quick and easy ways to cache and reuse allocations in these hot paths. So it is not unrealistic to expect complex views to be generated within the microsecond range. The GPU will be the main bottleneck, so it is the current focus of optimization work.
Love the cosmic updates.System76 has been doing a tremendous job making linux useable for the masses. On an unrelated note, the future of desktop linux has to be better app installation process and apps in general. The only thing stopping masses to use linux is app support and the usability of the OS in general. One should not have to touch the terminal to install anything whatsoever in a desktop environment. We need app support from Adobe, Microsoft, Nvidia to name a few. There are thousands who have dual boot only because of games running on Windows and not on Linux. I dont know how this bridge will ever be resolved because once you are used to actually "owning" the software on your machine, it will be difficult to switch to other closed OS.
I'm so excited for COSMIC. It's gonna have tiling but a full DE. They did a great job on Pop Shell. Finally, a usable DE unlike KDE and (vanilla) GNOME
It was removed so as to not have non-functional toggles, since implementing it isn't a priority for the first alpha. It will be added back later, possibly for the beta.
I haven't been able to check up on any Linux news for almost a year and damn I'm so excited about how far Cosmic has come in that time. This is looking really good ESPECIALLY for not even an alpha build yet.
I'm really excited to try daily driving this when it fets fully released. Here's hoping they can finally get HDR working properly, we already got VRR and 10-Bit Color, all we need is HDR.
Love the changes, but will never understand why they want a dock at the bottom and an action bar at the top. for the love of god pick one or the other. applications should be on the dock, same for workspaces being an option in the dock or settings. they dont need to hang out at the top of my screen. All of the other options on the top middle/right can live in a nice bubble on the bottom right of the screen.
I've been using Debian based distros and GNOME since around 1999 or 2000. I am an "average" Linux desktop user. Everything I have learned to do with computers like building my own, basic networking and OS skills, is because I am an old school pc gamer that took a few computer classes in high school and I also hate Microsoft. Mostly I've used Ubuntu since it's inception in the early 2000s but in the last decade Canonical has gotten worse and worse and I've been seeking a new OS. I tried PopOS a few years ago and loved it, but ended up going back to Ubuntu and Debian 12 when that came out. Anyway my Ubuntu system (gaming pc) has gotten so bloated and stuttery that I finally decided to go back to Pop and see how it feels and so far I love it. Cosmic feels like a better version of GNOME, maybe that's a hot take but it's my first impression. I am skeptical because Pop is based on Ubuntu but I think they are doing their own thing and I find Cosmic to be very inoffensive and intuitive so far as a GNOME user and a 60%-of-the-time GUI user.
I think most of the people don't need loads of new exciting features every now and then. I was and still am a Linux fan boy but what matters the most now is getting the job done. I don't even bother installing any themes or icon packs on Gnome. Tried Pop_OS at the very early stages back in 2018/19 , used Elementary for almost 2 years, never went to KDE, but I think Linux should just strive for what Windows 7 was known for, stability, doesn't fight the users. Microsoft tried the tiles on Windows 8 and Windows Mobile platform, and they horribly failed. It is better not to surprise users with something that they might not need at all. Like all the new AI features that are coming to Windows 11, many people will not like that approach to shoving down the throat. Linux better capitalizes on it.
With the Cosmic app store, and Linux app stores in general, I'm curious why flathub is used by default. Not that it's not good but doing it natively is good too. I do hope there's a setting making the default native.
I wasn't that interested in this, but seeing the demonstration got me a lot more excited. Loved the tiling functionality. Good enough to move away from my beloved XFCE? We'll see.
gdm = gnome desktop manager, basically the gnome version of the "cosmic-greeter," or the kde version "kdm" ... basically the DE launcher .. they are a lightweight graphical starting point.
@@mrnulll oops. Brain whoops on the M. You are correct and I knew that, just a disconnect between brain and keyboard last night. I'll leave it. As for sddm ... Well I don't use kde and haven't back since the days back to when I was still flirting with Linux so today I learned.
IS IT just me or does that look like what the desktop of 90% of everyone who uses Gnome with extensions installed such as DashToDock already looks like?
A lot of people do configure Gnome that way, yes. It's also a re-implementation of their current Gnome based Cosmic desktop with some tweaks. I wouldn't doubt they'll add more options in the future but recreating their current experience is a good starting point.
Zorin kind of has that, a few pre-made layouts that you can freely switch between. Would be nice if other distros included that so you have a few built-in flavors to work with.
I'm getting so bored of waiting for HDR to work like this isn't magic it's just going from 8 to 10 bits every pixel just make it work damnit it's been years and years and years since 10 bit and HDR screens have been around and NOTHING in linux works with it yet ffs
For me, the cosmic greeter worked before, but one of recent updates broke it. One thing thatalready makes COSMIC standout to me (asside from tiling) is that every monitor gets it's own workspaces, dock, and panel! This is huge to me, and it's extremely frustrating how limiting both KDE and gnome are in that regard.
Been a pop OS user for a while. Have a System 76 Oryx Pro I work off of professionally. TBH I don't like the idea of this being pushed out so soon after Alpha to 24.04 as the main DE. Do I want to trust my work on an interface that quite frankly looks like its being rushed? I am just hoping if its not fully baked at release that getting another DE on Pop is painless because I have yet to find another distro that works all the way completely on the Oryx Pro w/o component or driver module issues, especially with the GPU switch feature.
What makes you think we will rush a release? We will release an Alpha when we are nearly finished with COSMIC V1. The Beta will release when all V1 features are finished.
@@synen Do you think if you constantly says this people will eventually believe you? Why are you lying and trying to get people to doubt them you freak
Honestly I liked Pop the moment they tried to make Gnome usable and be able to change stuff. But reading all the comments bashing on KDE not being stable and stuff like that are complete BS. Cosmic seems to be a mid point between Gnome and KDE which is already an incredibly good proposition for a DE (Like Cinnamon). I am already using OpenSuse KDE and Pop_OS on my main machine, but I won't even try the Alpha, I will wait for a full release on a Pop_OS ISO to install, without leftovers of Gnome and fully optimized for Rust Cosmic. Best of luck to the Dev team and special thanks for trying to achieve something so coold that Gnome users could only dream with a thrillion extensions and not even achieving all the stuff.
It doesn't look vastly different from the current Gnome based Pop!_OS, but they're getting close to getting free from Gnome and all their BS. I hope Pop succeeds.
I like that you can choose between rounded, slightly rounded and square. Other desktops don't have that option. I hate rounded corners. I there is an option for a panel only, instead of dock and panel. I prefer the traditional panel with everything I use pinned on it. Other than that Cosmic looks great.
Everyone can do most tasks on Smart devices and gaming console if computers want to be unreliable it's time to make a new way of living I will be honest I mainly want Linux for Steam but even if you pay for the games the creator can decide to take it away from you which is why I am not thrilled about all digital gaming political propaganda.
Absolute drama queen lol recall isnt even able to be used on current pc's and wont be for a few years. But sure, you linux folk will have your golden year one day soon! only been saying it for the last 15 years.
@@tristen_grant I'm aware. I'm just making a slight joke to it, nothing bad against the PopOS devs, they're working hard on COSMIC and I like what I see so far.
Cosmic seems to be good from scratch DE. Not mature yet, not the features I am used to in KDE Plasma yet. Will check it out every six months and see when it gets to sort of parity with Plasma before I will try to use it for daily driver.
You will be even more excited to know that Qualcomm right now actively working together with the Linux kernel developers and the larger Linux community for an absolute FULL support for their new Snapdragon X Elite chip series and also for older SoCs. It's coming together this year and beginning next. So, Windows won't be the only options on the new, shiny beasty laptops that came out already with X and will come later on.
That is very nice. Let's be real, ARM or other RISC architectures are the future for laptops. So, being able to buy one in the near future (my laptop is not very good) is a pretty nice thing. If they support external GPUs that would make it the best laptop. Imagine using the internal super efficient APU when unplugged and using the normal external GPU when plugged. That will be crazy good
@@vidal9747 The news just surprised me this week, especially so close after the current ARM Windows laptop announcements. Qualcomm is already working for support with 6.8 and 6.9 kernels and will be fully done towards later kernels.
year of the linux desktop /s
@@vidal9747They support discrete and external gpus. And upgradability is miles ahead.
You will be even more excited that COSMIC is already running on ARM systems right now.
I get that you’re bored but the truth is that boring is exactly what people want out of an operating system. We are currently in a situation where we need to take the needs of average users seriously now due to all the AI madness that’s happening across the tech sector. Many refugees coming to Linux. I hope that Cosmic helps that and doesn’t add to their confusion.
Exactly. But this is the motto of the community. Always changing everything. Now, a new desktop, more options. This is why Linux Desktop never will be a big hit. More than 30 years and still fighting for uniformity in the appearance of desktop applications.
Please, let's discuss this further. We need to provide a better, stable, working and accessible option for the majority of OS's users. Microsoft is punishing windows 10 users, and maybe it's for a good reason: it is no longer profitable for them to have them using it. So this is a great change to establish a mature option for users needing a working computer.
the beauty of this community is there is something for everyone, while we need stability, ease of use, and popularity, we also would like something new, these two categories should be just split in two
@@pubdigitalix no not at all, Linux is about Choices not about Uniformity. There are plenty of Distros that offer Uniformity and plenty that do not. All about choices, you choose what you like.
I don't think there are as many "refugees" coming to linux, as people think. They're mistaking Android and mobile phone adoption, as new linux users.
Scroll speed! Are we really just going to skip over the fact they have this in the settings?????? Finally Linux with mouse/trackpad scroll speed built in!
in theory you can set it on gnome too. But you need to add a library as as a work around.
The fact that we even have to rejoice about scroll speed is quite sad.
I mostly use Windows but I installed Fedora on an old laptop for my brother after his Macbook died. I am amazed at how good it feels! So snappy and clean. If it wasn't for some of the proprietary software I need, I'd probably use it full time. But one thing I was perplexed by was the lack of scroll speed control. Why is that not an option? Surely it's not that hard to have a slider to adjust a factor in the scrolling speed.
KDE already has this on Wayland, FWIW.
Hilarious how such a basic feature is considered amazing in Linux
I will fix some of the issues in the video. There is functioning icon theme support, but changing the theme mode will clear cached icon theme data at the moment. Some changes on that page are needed to not overwrite the page data on theme mode changes.
I am so excited about Cosmic! You guys rock.
Take your time. Don't burn your selves out. Thank you for everything.
If you can ensure that libcosmic provides pixel perfect theming, that'd be amazing.
So far, the theme looks a bit rough, but it's pre alpha, so I understand it's not your main concern yet.
At 10:34 by example, for the right click menu:
there should be consistent space around the highlight, it should not be reaching the side unless it's filling the line entirely.
shortcuts tips could be a tad darker than function name to not read both the same way like there were the same thing.
The menu separator should not reach the edges, it's cleaner when it starts/ends at a few pixels from the edge.
The first line "Open" is way closer to the edge than" Move to trash"
etc
@@rocksquared It would be better to create issues on GitHub. I'll forget this otherwise.
@@rocksquared Yet he says it will be ready for production in 2 months.
GNOME visual are not bad, but some choices are questionable. COSMIC it's an opportunity to take the best of GNOME, like CSD, headerbars, and mix with the best of KDE, like proper customization, a functional system tray, support for the DE draws windows decorations if needed and more powerfull programs.
CSD is one of the worst features of Gnome
@@sheevys I love it. With the headerbars, the programs look amazing, and the new camera app is one of the design peaks I never thought GNOME could reach. However, I do disagree that GNOME makes CSD the only way to operate a window. COSMIC encourages CSDs, but it's not mandatory, and programs that don't have one will be designed by COSMIC itself.
@@henriquepicanco97 Server-side decorations are just better for non GTK/Libadwaita apps
I hope COSMIC never ends being at all like plasma.
@@donkey7921 I hope, too! And I hope COSMIC get an HIG, to avoid inconsistencies like KDE programs, but draws a future for COSMICs apps, towards accessibility, eye-candy (why not) and beyond.
agree, completely lost interest in linux news, got very stale since like a last year or so. Cosmic could be a nice change.
DE's might not have much going on but linux gaming has been huge this year and M$ is pushing users towards it :)
They should add 110% scaling for laptops
would love that. For now I just increase the size of the text to 1.10% in gnome tweaks and 125% zoom in Firefox/Discord etc
Pretty excited about a new DE, hope they can polish it the coming months.
I'm pretty fond of GNOME so if it's a bit like GNOME but more performant with better customization/defaults (like dash-to-dock that almost everyone uses) then I'm already a fan!
it looks like Gnome, but supposedly performs like Mac.
im very excited.
I have to say that originally I found the gnome system of minimal features that require extensions bizarre. That's because for some reason when I was first using a gnome DE the firefox plugin needed to install gnome extensions didn't work for me. I remember thinking, why the heck do I need a firefox plugin to get basic features of my DE? And then of course I had the experience many have had of an extension I'd used for years suddenly breaking or no longer being available and one broken extension disabling all the others. So frankly I just like this idea of applets that are built to integrate seamlessly with Cosmic, that run as separate processes, that won't break, that probably use less resources, and that can be turned on and off in a settings panel. The gnome system seems perverse. So I don't care if it looks just like gnome. The important thing is it doesn't work like it.
Plus I prefer the UI features of the current Pop and the built-in tiling WM. People forget, but splitting up the gnome activities overview into several targeted launchers like rofi made sense as a way to streamline workflow. And it was built in so you didn't have to do a rofi configuration. And they forget how great it was to have the equivalent of i3 wm accessible right inside a full-featured desktop.
I love that the terminal has a traditional "file edit view etc" menu bar. I get really annoyed when desktop apps do hamburger menus that have more than a few options (and especially when they have submenus), because they're really difficult to use with a screen magnifier.
The fact that the COSMIC DE allows you to adjust the scroll speed of the mouse easily could indicate that the COSMIC developers actually want to develop a desktop environment for the average user, the long-time Windows/macOS user.
still not going to Linux because of the driver and software support
oooooooh that tiling looks good....
I tried the latest build and was very impressed. I loved how easy it was to theme. Really a comfy middle ground between GNOME and Plasma. You can not only easily change the accent color, but also the main windows colors. Not several dozen colors to mess with like KDE but just enough to totally change the look in minutes without downloading themes.
I really like the balance of customization, powerful features and ease of access. I really am excited and think it will be pretty popular.
As fedora keeps getting new "tiling-window manager" variants this is the only fedora variant I'm looking forward to. Finally something that's workspace-oriented but also supports modern features such as (gasp) floating windows, an actual settings page and themes I don't have to download as text files from some random GitHub repo
Can't wait to try this out. I love pop_os because of their automatic tiling set up. I want to use tiling but I also don't want to use tiling (because of all these setups you have to do 😂)
The main reason why I am excited is that this is basically pure Rust, so a huge amount of hardening will come with it just because of that.
you can def already see the performance improvements over the pop shop when he pulled it up. I was wondering what the big selling point here was, and a from the ground up rust DE is very appealing
They rewrote Gnome in Rust 😭😭
@@st.altair4936 GNOME is not a modular applet-based desktop environment. On that front alone, COSMIC is closer to Xfce than GNOME. The ability to simulate GNOME is a testament to how flexible COSMIC's layout and applet architecture is.
Rust fanboys are so delusional
@@joshuaconsiglio6136 One of the selling points of pop shop is the performance. Thank god we don't have to deal with the slow mess of gnome software and the discover anymore!
2024 is the Linux year
😂😂
'25, once Windows 10 is officially no longer supported
I really like how the settings UI for trays. While KDE is good it often feels clunky.
Appreciate you taking the time to spin this up and poke around - looking good so far. Hope we can get our grubby little hands on it for real later this year.
I'm really excited for COSMIC. I think it will be a nice addition to the forward thinking distros, and it might be the only one to get me to move from a window manager.
that’s a really odd way to say GNOME
@@StillMasoroni no i hate gnome
@@KoopstaKlicca well it just looks like gnome in my eyes. also DO NOT USE POP_OS!! it’s a horrible experience, use something like debian or arch. if your a newbie, use nobara.
@@StillMasoroni what is the point of this? You see dock and panel and thinks that's gnome?
@@donkey7921 it looks identical.
This is not going to be fair if you do 30 days daily drive challenge with pre alpha Cosmic Desktop.
BTW, I am testing it about 6 months now, it is very stable (feel more stable than KDE).
😁
It looks like it could be a good OS, once the devs get it polished to Linux community standards.
mean DE
@@flamestoyershadowkill6400 that's why I never got videos like this. It's gnome with some theming.
@@adammontgomery7980 its not Gnome. Gnome, even though probably one of the best DE's available on Linux, is still trash. I think Cosmic realizes that it can't just be another Gnome. The Cosmic store looks more like a windows or apple app store than the traditional joke of previous linux "stores". i think Cosmic has true promise to be the first GREAT Linux DE that normies would feel comfortable using.
Honestly the only thing I dig about the Cosmic Desktop is the fluid and responsive tiling feature. If KDE/Gnome had that it would be epic. The rest of the features (desktop customization/shop/terminal/editor/greeter/settings/etc) are fine but nothing special that would make me want to switch other than to try something new.
i think it will be very interesting for the future. cosmic can be used by other developers to make it their own. plugins should work better than under gnome
The cosmic-store is actually our killer app right now that we recommend trying out on KDE and GNOME. Try comparing the performance and memory consumption with GNOME Software and KDE Discover.
Iirc KDE plasma seems to have something similar now. Not full fledged auto tiling like i3 or hyprland unfortunately.
That said, they do seem to be working on it which is great.
I just really hope it's going to be a healthy middle ground between gnome and KDE in terms of user freedom.
"not much exciting" -- what exactly would be "exciting" for you:
- Include AI into the desktop
- life checks for copyright infringements in the file sysstem
- Add Ads into the configuration dialogs
- Have a global account that you must have to install the system on your own computer?
What I want to say: I had my share of excitement on Windogs and on Linux computers already. That was one reason, I ditched KDE for Gnome -- because at one point the KDE team management to break my work routine so much and even break fine running apps that did stop working and I even lost valuable data.
I am using Linux for working with it -- I don't need excitement new stuff. What I need is a system that works and that gives me at least the feeling, that this is MY computer, that works for me -- and not the other way around as I get with the Windogs "offering", where I am the product now.
This is amazing considering that it's still a fairly fresh project as compared to decades of GNOME or KDE development.
Seeing the tiling system really gave me some new thoughts about the desktop experience. Floating windows and desktop icons are a tragedy that most of us are cursed with. Floating windows as a whole concept make no sense because I've never once thought that the perfect place for an application isn't in a maximized or snapped position. It just looks messy. And desktop icons are equally terrible because why would you want your icons being covered by the very apps you're trying to use? The taskbar is a great and minimal idea to store away icons for apps in a familiar and consistent way, yet desktop icons are unruly and difficult to access. I think Cosmic will be the future of the Linux desktop considering that it's pre-alpha state already looks like this.
Can we just maybe get a desktop experience that actually works? There are already plenty of distributions that look fancy and dont work. At this point we are lucky if we get proper drivers from Nvidia, which I dont know if anyone noticed is currently taking over the world.
If you want a desktop experience that actually works, you have to build it from scratch. That's what COSMIC is doing.
I've been using desktop linux for 20+ years, what doesn't work? I guess I'm just lucky because it worked for me
NVIDIA is finally releasing open source drivers btw. Just announced.
Put your money where your mouth is and Donate, its not free, you want more and better you have to put money on it. You guys are really something LOL
we have XFCE for AGES now.. why not just use what's already perfect?!
gtk themes are there for it which makes it look however you want and everything else can be customised too while it's feature complete and rock solid.
I understand this is an alpha, so I do not mean to be too harsh or blunt, but at a higher level what is the actual vision or purpose behind this? Why are they making a whole new desktop environment? I'm in the camp of boring is good, boring means stability. I am very happy with Gnome on PopOS 22.04 and I don't see the benefit of leaving Gnome for a new desktop environment that's probably going to be missing features that already exist and will most likely be buggy on launch...
Watch the LinuxFest Northwest COSMIC DE demo, and the Tech Over Tea interviews on COSMIC.
Nah, i’ll stick with Plasma or i3. Just use your computer and get shit done.
Novel and Cutting Edge are cool, but a stable desktop (system, really) on which to develop, or get anything done in general, is really, really exciting, too. Interesting vid, thx.
Desktop Linux… and RedoxOS. Non-Linux microkernel that is UNIX-like… brought to you by the COSMIC desktop devs!
I WAS PLANNING TO MOVE TO HYPRLAND, BUT WATCHING THIS, A TILING DE, WRITTEN IN RUST FOR MY 4GB RAM POTATO MACHINE, AND READY TO USE, I'M SOLD !
I'LL WAIT FOR IT TO GET OVER THE ARCH OFFICIAL REPOS, ALONGSIDE GIMP 3.0 !
Tiling?
stop screaming
CAPSLOCK IS CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL
I'm starting to think about contributing to Cosmic. I'm not a huge fan of ICED as a UI toolkit and that's what has kept me away so far but the progress on the desktop is exciting. Does anyone happen to know if GTK4 (without libadwaita) can be used with COSMIC to produce native-feeling windows?
I assume all the built-in widgets are coupled to ICED, right?
COSMIC's native toolkit is libcosmic. Therefore, if you want to build applications which look native to COSMIC, you have to build them with libcosmic. To be a truly native COSMIC design, you need to have an application which uses the nav bar and context drawers from our interface guidelines, which come baked into the application trait in libcosmic. If you build applications with iced, they won't fit in with COSMIC either, since Iced doesn't use COSMIC's desktop theming.
@@mmstick Ah, I thought libcosmic was built on top of ICED. From the examples in the libcosmic repo it appears they share the same design philosophies (very functional, react+redux like).
I'm not saying this programming architecture is wrong, just not to my taste.
I'd have liked it if libcosmic was a lower level API that frameworks could build on top of. Then again, I guess being prescriptive is what Apple does with SwiftUI so it's hard to argue with results 🤣
@@DavidAlsh Best not say in public that TEA (The Elm Architecture) and its MVU (Model-View-Update) design pattern is like React+Redux. An Elm philosopher might have a brain aneurysm reading that. Quite the opposite. React+Redux is essentially what Leptos is doing, whereas this is more like Sauron.
We were actually explicitly looking to build a toolkit that uses the MVU design pattern from the very beginning. Largely in part because it's a perfect match for Rust's borrow checker; and I happened to come to the same conclusions after years of modeling all of the GTK applications in Rust for PopOS-which eventually led to a joint effort to take Relm4 to the next level.
The iced runtime is a very lean event loop which has ownership of your application's struct-aka the Model. In each iteration of the loop, the runtime calls the view method of the Model to create a View. The View is a state machine whose purpose is both to describe the layout of the interface and how to draw it; and to be a streamlined pipeline for processing UI events and yielding any Messages from widgets in the View that they triggered.The View can efficiently borrow data directly from the Model because the View has the same lifetime as the borrowed Model.
Once the View has been drawn, the runtime will wait for UI events-such as mouse and keyboard events-and process them directly through the View. Those events will be pass through various widgets which may emit any number of Messages in response. After the View has processed the UI event, the View is dropped and any received Messages will be passed through the Model's update method, which mutably borrows the Model.
The update method uses pattern matching to find the appropriate branch to execute (which is much faster than dynamic dispatch), and the programmer can then update the model while running any application logic necessary. Once the update method has completed, the next iteration of the loop begins.
So the main thread does not require an async executor as it only needs to manage one event loop, and its one application model.
In practice, optimizing an iced/libcosmic application requires minimal effort because there is only one model, with one view method, and one update method. There are quick and easy ways to cache and reuse allocations in these hot paths. So it is not unrealistic to expect complex views to be generated within the microsecond range. The GPU will be the main bottleneck, so it is the current focus of optimization work.
TechHut: There's nothing exciting going on
Bazzite
CachyOS
...
Are we a joke to you?
Love the cosmic updates.System76 has been doing a tremendous job making linux useable for the masses. On an unrelated note,
the future of desktop linux has to be better app installation process and apps in general. The only thing stopping masses to use linux is app support and the usability of the OS in general. One should not have to touch the terminal to install anything whatsoever in a desktop environment. We need app support from Adobe, Microsoft, Nvidia to name a few. There are thousands who have dual boot only because of games running on Windows and not on Linux. I dont know how this bridge will ever be resolved because once you are used to actually "owning" the software on your machine, it will be difficult to switch to other closed OS.
You don't have to use a terminal. COSMIC already comes with the COSMIC App Store, which you can install and use on any desktop environment.
I look forward to when this is configurable in other distros like Arch, Nix, Guix, Gentoo, etc.
COSMIC is looking awesome! Will give it a try when it's released.
As long you have to use command line to install, it is not for the masses.
You don't have to. There is the COSMIC App Store.
The basic commands on terminal are very easy, more than search apps with viruses and so on windows, but anyway there are appstores
its looking good, really buggy, but its not even an alpha release as of yet, so that is expected.
For me, Cosmic is becoming a simplified and polished KDE. Which is good, I love it
I'm so excited for COSMIC. It's gonna have tiling but a full DE. They did a great job on Pop Shell. Finally, a usable DE unlike KDE and (vanilla) GNOME
I'm a Windows user and I like Windows,but this Cosmic desktop looks really nice. There is some serious job putted there.
I can’t wait to try the beta
I didn't see the frosted glass effect in the settings here that I've seen previously. I hope they didn't remove it
It was removed so as to not have non-functional toggles, since implementing it isn't a priority for the first alpha. It will be added back later, possibly for the beta.
I haven't been able to check up on any Linux news for almost a year and damn I'm so excited about how far Cosmic has come in that time. This is looking really good ESPECIALLY for not even an alpha build yet.
A hashtag is made of two things. The hash (#) and the tag (the bit after the hash). The symbol by itself is a HASH.
What I see is a polished GNOME
And this is already a victory.
Already a win, plus not depending on the stubborn gnome devs (appindicators being the most notorious and simple thing they just refuse to use)
I would never use that desktop background, especially with dark mode.
I'm really excited to try daily driving this when it fets fully released. Here's hoping they can finally get HDR working properly, we already got VRR and 10-Bit Color, all we need is HDR.
Looks really nice. I like Pop!_OS and so when this comes out in a more finished condition I'll definitely be giving it a try.
Let's see if we can try for 250 Linux distros.
Some of us want a boring desktop because it's what we use to get real work done. Fedora 40 KDE has been fantastic.
It has a lot of potential for sure.
Cosmic team should add a bouncing effect in the dock and also add the driver manager like linux mint.
What, so much happened in the last few months
How's the responsiveness, memory consumption and battery life compared to other major desktops like gnome or kde
Love the changes, but will never understand why they want a dock at the bottom and an action bar at the top. for the love of god pick one or the other. applications should be on the dock, same for workspaces being an option in the dock or settings. they dont need to hang out at the top of my screen.
All of the other options on the top middle/right can live in a nice bubble on the bottom right of the screen.
I've been using Debian based distros and GNOME since around 1999 or 2000. I am an "average" Linux desktop user. Everything I have learned to do with computers like building my own, basic networking and OS skills, is because I am an old school pc gamer that took a few computer classes in high school and I also hate Microsoft. Mostly I've used Ubuntu since it's inception in the early 2000s but in the last decade Canonical has gotten worse and worse and I've been seeking a new OS. I tried PopOS a few years ago and loved it, but ended up going back to Ubuntu and Debian 12 when that came out. Anyway my Ubuntu system (gaming pc) has gotten so bloated and stuttery that I finally decided to go back to Pop and see how it feels and so far I love it. Cosmic feels like a better version of GNOME, maybe that's a hot take but it's my first impression. I am skeptical because Pop is based on Ubuntu but I think they are doing their own thing and I find Cosmic to be very inoffensive and intuitive so far as a GNOME user and a 60%-of-the-time GUI user.
I think most of the people don't need loads of new exciting features every now and then. I was and still am a Linux fan boy but what matters the most now is getting the job done. I don't even bother installing any themes or icon packs on Gnome. Tried Pop_OS at the very early stages back in 2018/19 , used Elementary for almost 2 years, never went to KDE, but I think Linux should just strive for what Windows 7 was known for, stability, doesn't fight the users. Microsoft tried the tiles on Windows 8 and Windows Mobile platform, and they horribly failed. It is better not to surprise users with something that they might not need at all. Like all the new AI features that are coming to Windows 11, many people will not like that approach to shoving down the throat. Linux better capitalizes on it.
With the Cosmic app store, and Linux app stores in general, I'm curious why flathub is used by default. Not that it's not good but doing it natively is good too. I do hope there's a setting making the default native.
This is the Pop!_OS default. If your distribution doesn't add it, you won't see it.
I wasn't that interested in this, but seeing the demonstration got me a lot more excited. Loved the tiling functionality. Good enough to move away from my beloved XFCE? We'll see.
Is this stable enough to use as a daily driver / work laptop? What do you guys think?
gdm = gnome desktop manager, basically the gnome version of the "cosmic-greeter," or the kde version "kdm" ... basically the DE launcher .. they are a lightweight graphical starting point.
In this case DM = display manager. And KDE changed to SDDM.
@@mrnulll oops. Brain whoops on the M. You are correct and I knew that, just a disconnect between brain and keyboard last night. I'll leave it. As for sddm ... Well I don't use kde and haven't back since the days back to when I was still flirting with Linux so today I learned.
Dayum.. That looked like windows 11 Linux format. I have a KDE version that looks like this cosmic setup.
it's ugly, also if you didn't mention cosmic, I would have thought it was a badly themed GNOME
IS IT just me or does that look like what the desktop of 90% of everyone who uses Gnome with extensions installed such as DashToDock already looks like?
Well they're moving over from their current GNOME implementation. Probably don't want to make to many dramatic cosmetic changes yet.
A lot of people do configure Gnome that way, yes. It's also a re-implementation of their current Gnome based Cosmic desktop with some tweaks. I wouldn't doubt they'll add more options in the future but recreating their current experience is a good starting point.
Which means those people can use COSMIC without needing to muck around with extensions that constantly break or cause performance issues and bugs.
That's a lot of work for a pretty lame gui.
I love the simplicity of i3. It may be old with no flashy stuff but i dont care. Simple and reliable.
COSMIC started because the Pop!_OS developers were using i3 instead of GNOME.
Scrollbar width ??
I really wish devs make one click to change from cosmic pop os to any one bar window thing or like cinnamon anything but not their desktop.
Zorin kind of has that, a few pre-made layouts that you can freely switch between. Would be nice if other distros included that so you have a few built-in flavors to work with.
I'm getting so bored of waiting for HDR to work like this isn't magic it's just going from 8 to 10 bits every pixel just make it work damnit it's been years and years and years since 10 bit and HDR screens have been around and NOTHING in linux works with it yet ffs
Too early to say it is the "future", but certainly excited to see what it can do over the next few years.
I'm already very excited about the Cosmic Desktop.
For me, the cosmic greeter worked before, but one of recent updates broke it. One thing thatalready makes COSMIC standout to me (asside from tiling) is that every monitor gets it's own workspaces, dock, and panel! This is huge to me, and it's extremely frustrating how limiting both KDE and gnome are in that regard.
Been a pop OS user for a while. Have a System 76 Oryx Pro I work off of professionally. TBH I don't like the idea of this being pushed out so soon after Alpha to 24.04 as the main DE. Do I want to trust my work on an interface that quite frankly looks like its being rushed? I am just hoping if its not fully baked at release that getting another DE on Pop is painless because I have yet to find another distro that works all the way completely on the Oryx Pro w/o component or driver module issues, especially with the GPU switch feature.
What makes you think we will rush a release? We will release an Alpha when we are nearly finished with COSMIC V1. The Beta will release when all V1 features are finished.
O have an acer nitro 5, I have tried many diferent distros and configs. Only pop works properly with multiple gpus
@@mmstick Didnt you claim ready for production in 2 months ? I see contradictions.
@@synen No, you made your own strawman claiming that I said that. You see contradictions because you're seeing delusions.
@@synen Do you think if you constantly says this people will eventually believe you? Why are you lying and trying to get people to doubt them you freak
u kinda look like caseoh
BRUH I'm at least 742lb lighter
I’m not returning to Linux until cosmic de is available on arch
Can you set up a workspace grid (2×2 or 3×3)?
I excited
Honestly I liked Pop the moment they tried to make Gnome usable and be able to change stuff. But reading all the comments bashing on KDE not being stable and stuff like that are complete BS. Cosmic seems to be a mid point between Gnome and KDE which is already an incredibly good proposition for a DE (Like Cinnamon). I am already using OpenSuse KDE and Pop_OS on my main machine, but I won't even try the Alpha, I will wait for a full release on a Pop_OS ISO to install, without leftovers of Gnome and fully optimized for Rust Cosmic.
Best of luck to the Dev team and special thanks for trying to achieve something so coold that Gnome users could only dream with a thrillion extensions and not even achieving all the stuff.
Plasma 6 was great.
It's beautiful but you can see that it doesn't have integration with the system theme in flatpaks 😥
Flatpak applications do use COSMIC's system theme if they are GTK3 or GTK4 based, and you have enabled external theme support.
It doesn't look vastly different from the current Gnome based Pop!_OS, but they're getting close to getting free from Gnome and all their BS. I hope Pop succeeds.
I like that you can choose between rounded, slightly rounded and square. Other desktops don't have that option. I hate rounded corners. I there is an option for a panel only, instead of dock and panel. I prefer the traditional panel with everything I use pinned on it. Other than that Cosmic looks great.
Everyone can do most tasks on Smart devices and gaming console if computers want to be unreliable it's time to make a new way of living I will be honest I mainly want Linux for Steam but even if you pay for the games the creator can decide to take it away from you which is why I am not thrilled about all digital gaming political propaganda.
I like GNOME, but it feels bloated and unstable with minor tweaks. COSMIC could fix all that without ruining the aesthetics.
Windows Recall will be the best thing that's ever happened to Linux.
😂 yeah it's gonna bring that hilarious 4% to 4.1 in about 5 years or so..
Absolute drama queen lol recall isnt even able to be used on current pc's and wont be for a few years. But sure, you linux folk will have your golden year one day soon! only been saying it for the last 15 years.
is the pop shop really secure?
Like any other shop, it is just a user interface to select what to download and install from the repos and/or flathub
yeah it just pulls packages from flathub and their own repositories so you're good
how did you get the numbers in the panel
Coming along
Number sign. ☑
Why not hide under a table or inside a fridge?
I'm just waiting for Cosmic to be released in stable and I will instantly hop into Pop_OS!
"That's it? That's the COSMIC Desktop?? THAT WAS JUST GNOME WITH DESKTOP EXTENSIONS!"
You are aware of what PopOS was/is right?
@@tristen_grant I'm aware. I'm just making a slight joke to it, nothing bad against the PopOS devs, they're working hard on COSMIC and I like what I see so far.
I really hope they add the ability to download flatpak extensions from the appstore similarly to how the gnome shop lets you. It would be quite nice.
Cosmic just seems like Gnome but sane?
Cosmic seems to be good from scratch DE. Not mature yet, not the features I am used to in KDE Plasma yet.
Will check it out every six months and see when it gets to sort of parity with Plasma before I will try to use it for daily driver.
Can i use the cosmic in portuguese?