😂 LOVE THE VIDEO. Well done 👍. Yes your questions and thoughts on the topic are dead on. It’s an age old argument in philately and it’s entirely up to the collector, AND as you said you can absolutely learn from them 😊
Hi Graham - So excited to see you here commenting on my channel! Thanks for stopping by and all the encouragement - also I'm also relieved that you didn't mind that I 'sampled' your video clip in this one - 😂 😃 Thanks for the inspiration!
We philatelists have argued on this topic for almost a hundred years. And I have found a solution for myself, I have divided my collection into 3 categories of albums, each category contains thousands of stamps. One category is dedicated only for Mint, another of Postally used and the last one contains only CTOs, case closed 😀. I still collect, swap, buy CTOs along with the other 2 categories and I enjoy it. Enjoying the stuff should be the mantra.
Thanks! That's what I'm basically doing for now ... Still discovering what exactly it is I like. Maybe someday I'll be able to narrow it down but for now anything goes!
I have many CTOs as I think just about everyone does, they are impossible to avoid! They look colorful and pretty, and while I don't want to collect them, I don't throw them away either (Someone else may want it!). What I think is really gross are the CTOs that have the cancel PRINTED with the image! Come on, that's crazy. That is the thing about stamps, literally something for everyone! Great video!
Thanks for posting this. I had the same crisis when I learned about CTOs. But ultimately, I decided that if I'm putting stamps in my album with mounts, I could always swap them out with "better" stamps later
Hello StampCat! i just found your channel today because of Graham (Exploring Stamps). And it's serendipitous because just earlier today I was having a conversation on CTO in an online forum i often read. Love the channel and hope you keep it up!!
I used to place my collection in black pages albums and store CTOs as well as duplicates in envelopes to avoid saturating and damaging the albums with such a mass of stamps. After 20 years I changed strategy to fill white pages stockbooks with everything, both CTOs and also duplicates in albums.
I am still trying to figure out how to store my stamps! As soon as I put everything away, I get too many more stamps and they don't fit in the album anymore haha. Thanks for your comment!
I don't mind them. I am from Australia and some of our very earliest stamps were cto as well and these are often worth far more than postally used ones. I tend to have my mint stamps first then the ctos then used for each series. I find having them all in one place very convenient. P.S. I really like watching Exploring Stamps videos as well. :)
I like this strategy of separating them into different categories. Exploring stamps videos have taught me probably 90% of anything I know about stamp collecting 😂. Thanks for your comment!
Youre right, CTO's are real stamps, for a real stamp collection - I collect USSR, a lot of CTO's, but I still love my stamp collection :) (I also sell stamps now, superfun) Thanx for your video, fun and good to learn from. Regards from Denmark, Claus
Hi StampCat - great and interesting video, good luck with your channel. As to CTOs - I decided that if they could have at least in theory been used to send mail, then they are the same as unused stamps, and if they are related to the country of issue, then I collect them (so, no, Ally McBeal stamps from Caribbean countries do not qualify). If countries would restrict their stamps to relevant local themes, then the CTO problem would mostly disappear, because like your Rwandan hairstyle stamps, they are still great for learning about exotic lands. One of my favorite stamps is an attempted CTO from Republic of Guinea where the machine they used for cancellation apparently ran out of ink and only an impression was left on the stamp, no cancellation, and thus it was unused (mint), and not a CTO! It always pays to look more closely. As I got older, however, I did get more interested in covers where there is no question that it traveled through the mail. Holding a historical cover (from Argentina with an Eva Peron stamp when she was in power or a cover sent to Germany in 1943 with a sticker on the back noting that the Gestapo opened this letter) in my own hands can still send chills down my spine! Again, welcome to stamp collecting and keep making videos!
Thanks so much for your welcoming words! Wow that's an incredible cover to have! So much history all on one 'paper,' and with big historical time periods from both countries... That's amazing. And I can't believe an Ally McBeal stamp exists 🤣 in a way, it's hilarious for me to see what subjects they think people are really interested in.
CTOs usually cost about 25% of the denomination of the mint ones. Great educational value for younger people in collecting stamps that way. Collect what makes you happy! Also, create your own maxicards, and some cacheted covers!
A great idea, I'm thinking of getting into making my own cachet covers but haven't yet! Seems like a great way to commemorate fun life events or even just celebrate themes and topics. Thanks for watching!
I was looking for such kind of estimation. I do buy a lot of stamps and many are CTOs, but I definitely don't want to buy things with higher prices than what they actually cost. Can I use this 25% as a rule of thumb? I always consider reselling some of my less interesting collection and would like to have a compass here.
I enjoyed 😊. Not all CTO’s are issued by postal authorities though. A lot of them are, however there are some companies printing stamps with cancel (cto) which never even get to the country but flood the collectors market. The revenue of these sales will be (partly) for the government of these countries though. These stamps will have maybe a footnote in Scott’s catalogue but will not be listed. This you find them in some of the Arabian states for example. Other stamps that have a CTO however are regularly issued stamps, that can be found mint, used and as CTO. These are Scott listed. Most of them are remainders cancelled and sold to stamp dealers. Collecting CTO’s is fine, and can be a lot of fun. However when you want to exhibit your collection, CTO’s are prohibited from the collection. The reason for this is these stamps get printed and cancelled to sell as used stamps to the collector. In an exhibit you show the development and the postal use of a stamp and a CTO does not fit in there. FDC’s are also made for collecting, and not to to carry the mail, although some have been in the mail. For that reason FDC’s in general are not that expensive, exceptions are some of the hand painted FDC’s First flight covers is another example, and there are many more. All totally collectable, however you might encounter people trying to convince you otherwise. I do not collect them myself, I collect postally used stamps on and off cover, however I do appreciate that people collect the material. Main point is, to enjoy the hobby. Everyone collects differently.
Thanks so much for commenting all of this information! I'm thinking of making a future episode discussing those stamps 'printed by those companies but are never actually sent for use in the country' (such as Stamperija, for example); thanks for sharing the note about how it would be listed in Scott catalogue, as I didn't know that. Your information has been very helpful, thanks for visiting the channel!
You grabbed me when you were talking about the designs, and how some are irrelevant to the country, and yet others are relevant. I struggle with which stamps to include in my collection and am not including those irrelevant topical designs. But I don't mind CTO's. You can buy them direct from several postal authorities if you like (I notice Sweden does that.) Bonus question: Is a stamp soaked of an unmailed FDC from the post office a CTO? Is it used if the letter was never mailed? What is the sound of one hand clapping? 🤣 I have a lot of 'used' stamps that have a nice FDC cancel in the corner.
I too prefer some CTO's more than others! Although if a truly postally used option is available I'd rather have that - but I've also found some CTO's tell a political or historical story just as well as a 'real' stamp. An example is Vietnam (especially North Vietnam) during the Vietnam War. Their stamps (CTOs) were mainly issued as propaganda or to make money for their cause...the designs make it very clear the opinions of their government at the time, and events that were taking place. I wondered that as well about soaked off FDCs! I have at least one of those. To complicate matters more, I was told at a stamp exhibition (selling cachets for the event) that I could technically mail the cachets to people, even though they were marked with the events special post mark- as long as it was on the date of the event .... So these stamps were post marked before mailing but still able carry mail? Isn't that almost like a CTO with mailing power? I'm not sure if I understood correctly at that cachet booth 😅 but it added confusion for me. Thanks for watching, cheers!
Some time ago, when I learned what CTOs really are, I removed all of them from my collection. Obviously anyone can choose to collect them if they want but the issue I have with these 'stamps' is that they were basically created by post offices to fool novice collectors. They are often sold as used, which is, in fact, a scam. CTOs are the reason I stopped collecting used stamps.
In fact, they are cancelled specifically to stop them from being used for any legitimate purpose. That makes them effectively no different than cinderellas. I don't really care about them in my topical collections, but in my primary collections, I only collect mint.
CTO are basically Cancelled To Order. Legitimate stamps stamped so they have no postal value and usually a bit cheaper. They are avoided by most collectors but there are collectors out there who obtain them to complete their collection of used, CTO, and mint. :)
That old intro scene made me 😂😂😂😂. So I was introduced to philately as a kid and after a break for a few decades I got back into it.. I came across these CTOs mainly as sheets and just understood they existed but not the whole idea of CTOs..just figured for some reason a sheet has been cancelled. And I kid you not - I actually found out the whole deal about them, from our man Graham..!😂😂😂😂.. Exact same way as you.. Lol.. Anyways I think there's 2 ways to look at them (well imo at least) : 1. Philately as a financial investment venture - no not really worth much ( unless there's a special story attached to a specific issue).. And tbh one person's rubbish could be another's treasure - and..also what's worthless today could be a good mine tomorrow. 2. Philately out of interest - anything goes really.I mean forgeries can be collected in that case. The rule here is "There are NO rules" . If something appeals to you and people are happy to part with it for little $$( other means of barter do exist)- that's a win win in my book. I don't really collect CTOs but I saw a sheet of them and just thought it looked grand.. So I took it. Every stamp - Cinderella, forgery, cto or whatever it may be, tells a story. 🙂👍🏽
I fully agree about collecting for interests sake! In general I'm not super keen on CTO's just because of this 'negative aura' many collectors have of them..... but then, I'll find out about the back story behind a stamp, or just fall in love with the image, and suddenly I have to have it, CTO or not! I do find them interesting as well in a propaganda sense- for example North Vietnam during the war Issued many stamps that were not ever intended for postal use, and primarily to raise money on the collector market (as CTO) but the images they show really tell a story of that time period in their history, and they certainly make their opinions very clear on the stamp imagery!
During my early years of stamp collecting, I too have questioned the validity of CTO's. But ultimately accepted CTO's as collectable stamps with the following criteria. It is based on "my" definition of a "used" stamp, meaning "any form of applied cancellation making a valid stamp for usage the inability for any type of future usage". Those CTO's stamps which the cancellation are printed as part of the stamp would NOT be added to my collection, because the cancellation was never applied. Heck, I would go further to define those printed CTO's stamps as "cinderella"s.
I like your definition! Same here- I like the CTO's better that have had a cancel applied. I think the ones with printed-on cancel ugly. And yet I still put them away in my book haha.
@@StampCatStampsThey are all printed on when the stamps were manufactured except possibly some of the earliest ones that may have been hand stamped on
am surprised, worried & upset upon learning the true meaning of CTO😮. anyways, i know & still remember where my stamps came from😊 I have few big, gummed, unbelievable themed stamps from some countries 😮 blah blah which i separated. 😅
I'm not a snob, it's a cancelled stamp, if there is no gum you cant prove it's a cto, cancelling a corner of a stamp is no prof, i know since i collect envelopes, the stamp could be cancelled in a million ways. I wish they could just drop the term, it's just a stamp with a bad cancel, opposite to a luxury cancel with full place and date with only 10% tilted max, fully centered upright position. Don't worry just collect what you like with no limits.
Any thoughts on soaking CTO stamps to remove the gum? Then, they appear no different than a soaked used stamp (of course, you would know the truth that it was never actually used). To me, it seems a bit dishonest to do that, but I'm sure some collectors do it.
Removing the gum would definitely make it harder to differentiate from a real postally used stamp for sure! (I had even thought about mailing myself a CTO on the cover - along with the appropriate postage of course - then 'soaking it off' to make it follow the journey of a used stamp 😂) but I think what annoys most collectors about them are when stamps are printed mostly in CTO form and never really issued for use to mail at all. It's like they 'never had a chance' 🤷🏻♀️
CTO are okay, they are officially printed by Postal Service, just like Used and MNH, so they are official stamps, so they can be and are fit for adding to your collection! I also have these Rwanda/Rwandaise African wild people, they are good stamps!
@@StampCatStamps CTO okay, like Magyar Posta/Hungary they are after all government printed and are STAMPS! Okay to keep in Album! Same goes for Mongolia!
Not long ago I considered collecting Space stamps. I ordered an assortment for $10. They turned out to be 100% CTOs. So basically I way overpaid. Some were nice but the all of them were just made for profit. Not able to use for postage. So essentially they are glorified stickers. In my opinion, if they don't have catalog numbers, they're not postage stamps.
There definitely seem to be a lot of CTO space stamps! I'm curious, do you prefer stamps to be listed only in Scott catalog or any of the others as well? Sometimes it seems like everything has a Michel number of nothing else. I'm not too experienced with using catalogs, so I don't know the intricacies! Thanks for your comment
@@StampCatStamps I guess I would say, if you like them, collect them. I'd hate to throw them away but then they don't belong in any normal postage stamp album. If a person loves aardvarks, they should collect everything pertaining to aardvarks and not worry about value or catalog inclusion. Anyway, you know what they say about opinions.
A key phrase here is 'can be used for postage' as being different from 'has been used for postage'. If you go to the post office and buy some stamps but never get round to using them, does that mean that they are not real stamps. Of course not. There's nothing that magically happens when you stick a stamp to an envelope that suddenly turns it from just a piece of paper into a stamp. By the same token, there are a lot of stamps these days that manage to travel through the postal system without being cancelled, how would you categorise them? In the end it depends on whether you would like nice, neat cancels on stamps or be happy with cancels that are not so neat and possibly block out most of the image on the stamp. Really, it's up to the collector to decide for her or himself what they want in their collection. Stanley Gibbons catalogues state that they do not list stamps issued in excess of postal needs, but in a world where postage paid labels are becoming increasingly common, it could be argued that ALL stamps are issued in Excess of postal NEEDS. It seems that all postal authorities are issuing more and more stamps with higher and higher values and these often do find their way into catalogues. As for subjects on stamps, Australia, where I live, almost never issues any stamps that don't relate directly to Australian culture and society, which I understand, but there are some events and people that are of global significance and I wish that countries like Australia would sometimes recognise these events and people.
Thanks for your comment, you raise some good points! Now-a-days especially I get many stamps in my mail that they don't seem to bother to post mark anymore. Great if you want a clear image of the stamp, but not so interesting if you like to know about the journey of the letter. I agree it comes down to each person can decide what they want to collect. Again thanks for watching and sharing your thoughts!
If it appears in the Scott catalog, I accept it in my collection. The stamp may or may not be a CTO, it makes no difference to me. I have a member my club who collects only iron curtain countries and most the stamps you get from them are CTO.
That's true! One of my Dad's worldwide albums has a nearly full Bulgaria section... Huge majority CTO but really they look quite nice all together and still depict a lot of folk culture and important events for their nation. I like them!
I wanted to share a comment from a viewer that I think youtube removed because it has links- but I found them to be useful resources! I'll try pasting it here. Thank you John for the comment! John Berry-- I am new to your channel (am I saying that right?) but have been a collector since (well not active for a while) I "inherited - read absconded" my older brother's Harris collection once he moved out way, way, way back in the day. I enjoy your videos and they have rejuvenated my interest in collecting. Your enthusiasm is contagious. I just watched this one, and your reaction to CTOs was priceless. Don't know if you have looked into the UPU or their WEB site for searching for stamps from UPU member countries - I recommend it (both links below): UPU -> www.upu.int/en/Home Search site ->www.wnsstamps.post/en/Stamps-Search
I do collect CTO-s and my thoughts on this, to put it simple, are: of course they don't have any place in a postal history or traditional philately exhibit; there, postal circulation is everything. However, for a thematic collector, who wishes to tell a story through stamps and other philatelic material, I don't see why they should be rejected. I know that there will be purists out there that would probably have me stoned to death for saying this, but...
Thanks for your thoughts! ... In some ways I 'like' the CTO's or don't mind them if they put a lot of effort into making it look beautiful. You're right that they are great for topical collections...And don't worry, there will be no stoning here on my channel 🙃.
For me it's cheating and waste of stamps. I simply don't get the concept of CTO. I buy CTOs only if I had no other option in forseeable future. They usualy "warm the spot" for the proper one. CTO are neither mint nor from circulation.
Haha I like that phrase: "warm the spot." I agree they are their own entity, not mint, not 'used', not fake, not 'real'? Certainly beautiful as placeholders though, for sure.
WRONG: Some CTO stamps has real value. For example Australia Specialiazed Catalogues Kangaroo and KGV stamps have gone up in value - on some of the high values in the hundreds opf dollars so all on here is not accurrate or from other stamp comment below this one. Do you research CTO's have value in some countries and Australia is one of them as are other commomwealth countries
Thanks for your comment, I'm always happy to learn more about the world of stamps! Except ... I watched the video again and again and I can't find where I said that CTO stamps don't have any value? If anything I felt I was trying to advocate -for- collecting CTO's. Well, thanks for watching!
😂 LOVE THE VIDEO. Well done 👍. Yes your questions and thoughts on the topic are dead on. It’s an age old argument in philately and it’s entirely up to the collector, AND as you said you can absolutely learn from them 😊
Hi Graham - So excited to see you here commenting on my channel! Thanks for stopping by and all the encouragement - also I'm also relieved that you didn't mind that I 'sampled' your video clip in this one - 😂 😃 Thanks for the inspiration!
We philatelists have argued on this topic for almost a hundred years. And I have found a solution for myself, I have divided my collection into 3 categories of albums, each category contains thousands of stamps. One category is dedicated only for Mint, another of Postally used and the last one contains only CTOs, case closed 😀. I still collect, swap, buy CTOs along with the other 2 categories and I enjoy it.
Enjoying the stuff should be the mantra.
That's a brilliant idea! I agree that the purpose of collecting is really all the enjoyment!
@@StampCatStamps true that ☺️
Your collection - your rules! Collect whatever makes you happy
Thanks! That's what I'm basically doing for now ... Still discovering what exactly it is I like. Maybe someday I'll be able to narrow it down but for now anything goes!
I've been collecting for 70yrs and I keep my CTOs, my collection, my rules
I have many CTOs as I think just about everyone does, they are impossible to avoid! They look colorful and pretty, and while I don't want to collect them, I don't throw them away either (Someone else may want it!). What I think is really gross are the CTOs that have the cancel PRINTED with the image! Come on, that's crazy.
That is the thing about stamps, literally something for everyone! Great video!
Thanks for posting this. I had the same crisis when I learned about CTOs. But ultimately, I decided that if I'm putting stamps in my album with mounts, I could always swap them out with "better" stamps later
Very sound reasoning and I agree! They certainly look nice in an album regardless of being CTOs.
Hello StampCat! i just found your channel today because of Graham (Exploring Stamps). And it's serendipitous because just earlier today I was having a conversation on CTO in an online forum i often read. Love the channel and hope you keep it up!!
Welcome! Glad that you're here and enjoying the content so far. Graham is clearly my inspiration for this channel haha.
Bonito video maravillosos sello Felicidades amiga GRACIAS por compartir buenas noches un abrazo 👏👏👏👍👍👌
¡Gracias por mirar y dejar un comentario!
awesome channel, love your reasoning, I have to dust off the colleciton.. Keep it up!
Thanks! Will do!
Nice and interesting information
My friend.
Blessings
Thank you so much!
BTW, I subscribed to the channel, after it was featured in Graham's latest video :)
Thanks so much - Graham's the best! Welcome!
I used to place my collection in black pages albums and store CTOs as well as duplicates in envelopes to avoid saturating and damaging the albums with such a mass of stamps. After 20 years I changed strategy to fill white pages stockbooks with everything, both CTOs and also duplicates in albums.
I am still trying to figure out how to store my stamps! As soon as I put everything away, I get too many more stamps and they don't fit in the album anymore haha. Thanks for your comment!
I agree with Graham that it is an age old argument. Personally I try to collect CTOs together with mint and postally used examples of stamps.
Nice video !
Thanks -Glad you enjoyed it
Thank you for sharing.
My pleasure! 🙂
I don't mind them. I am from Australia and some of our very earliest stamps were cto as well and these are often worth far more than postally used ones. I tend to have my mint stamps first then the ctos then used for each series. I find having them all in one place very convenient. P.S. I really like watching Exploring Stamps videos as well. :)
I like this strategy of separating them into different categories. Exploring stamps videos have taught me probably 90% of anything I know about stamp collecting 😂. Thanks for your comment!
Youre right, CTO's are real stamps, for a real stamp collection - I collect USSR, a lot of CTO's, but I still love my stamp collection :) (I also sell stamps now, superfun) Thanx for your video, fun and good to learn from. Regards from Denmark, Claus
Thank you and hello from Canada!
Welcome!
This is very fun philatelic content.
@@TLabsLLC-AI-Development aw thanks so much! Well... Philately is fun!
Hi StampCat - great and interesting video, good luck with your channel. As to CTOs - I decided that if they could have at least in theory been used to send mail, then they are the same as unused stamps, and if they are related to the country of issue, then I collect them (so, no, Ally McBeal stamps from Caribbean countries do not qualify). If countries would restrict their stamps to relevant local themes, then the CTO problem would mostly disappear, because like your Rwandan hairstyle stamps, they are still great for learning about exotic lands. One of my favorite stamps is an attempted CTO from Republic of Guinea where the machine they used for cancellation apparently ran out of ink and only an impression was left on the stamp, no cancellation, and thus it was unused (mint), and not a CTO! It always pays to look more closely. As I got older, however, I did get more interested in covers where there is no question that it traveled through the mail. Holding a historical cover (from Argentina with an Eva Peron stamp when she was in power or a cover sent to Germany in 1943 with a sticker on the back noting that the Gestapo opened this letter) in my own hands can still send chills down my spine! Again, welcome to stamp collecting and keep making videos!
Thanks so much for your welcoming words! Wow that's an incredible cover to have! So much history all on one 'paper,' and with big historical time periods from both countries... That's amazing. And I can't believe an Ally McBeal stamp exists 🤣 in a way, it's hilarious for me to see what subjects they think people are really interested in.
CTOs usually cost about 25% of the denomination of the mint ones. Great educational value for younger people in collecting stamps that way. Collect what makes you happy! Also, create your own maxicards, and some cacheted covers!
A great idea, I'm thinking of getting into making my own cachet covers but haven't yet! Seems like a great way to commemorate fun life events or even just celebrate themes and topics. Thanks for watching!
I was looking for such kind of estimation. I do buy a lot of stamps and many are CTOs, but I definitely don't want to buy things with higher prices than what they actually cost. Can I use this 25% as a rule of thumb? I always consider reselling some of my less interesting collection and would like to have a compass here.
I enjoyed 😊.
Not all CTO’s are issued by postal authorities though. A lot of them are, however there are some companies printing stamps with cancel (cto) which never even get to the country but flood the collectors market. The revenue of these sales will be (partly) for the government of these countries though.
These stamps will have maybe a footnote in Scott’s catalogue but will not be listed. This you find them in some of the Arabian states for example.
Other stamps that have a CTO however are regularly issued stamps, that can be found mint, used and as CTO.
These are Scott listed. Most of them are remainders cancelled and sold to stamp dealers.
Collecting CTO’s is fine, and can be a lot of fun. However when you want to exhibit your collection, CTO’s are prohibited from the collection.
The reason for this is these stamps get printed and cancelled to sell as used stamps to the collector.
In an exhibit you show the development and the postal use of a stamp and a CTO does not fit in there.
FDC’s are also made for collecting, and not to to carry the mail, although some have been in the mail.
For that reason FDC’s in general are not that expensive, exceptions are some of the hand painted FDC’s
First flight covers is another example, and there are many more.
All totally collectable, however you might encounter people trying to convince you otherwise.
I do not collect them myself, I collect postally used stamps on and off cover, however I do appreciate that people collect the material.
Main point is, to enjoy the hobby. Everyone collects differently.
Thanks so much for commenting all of this information! I'm thinking of making a future episode discussing those stamps 'printed by those companies but are never actually sent for use in the country' (such as Stamperija, for example); thanks for sharing the note about how it would be listed in Scott catalogue, as I didn't know that. Your information has been very helpful, thanks for visiting the channel!
You grabbed me when you were talking about the designs, and how some are irrelevant to the country, and yet others are relevant. I struggle with which stamps to include in my collection and am not including those irrelevant topical designs. But I don't mind CTO's. You can buy them direct from several postal authorities if you like (I notice Sweden does that.)
Bonus question: Is a stamp soaked of an unmailed FDC from the post office a CTO? Is it used if the letter was never mailed? What is the sound of one hand clapping? 🤣 I have a lot of 'used' stamps that have a nice FDC cancel in the corner.
I too prefer some CTO's more than others! Although if a truly postally used option is available I'd rather have that - but I've also found some CTO's tell a political or historical story just as well as a 'real' stamp. An example is Vietnam (especially North Vietnam) during the Vietnam War. Their stamps (CTOs) were mainly issued as propaganda or to make money for their cause...the designs make it very clear the opinions of their government at the time, and events that were taking place.
I wondered that as well about soaked off FDCs! I have at least one of those. To complicate matters more, I was told at a stamp exhibition (selling cachets for the event) that I could technically mail the cachets to people, even though they were marked with the events special post mark- as long as it was on the date of the event .... So these stamps were post marked before mailing but still able carry mail? Isn't that almost like a CTO with mailing power? I'm not sure if I understood correctly at that cachet booth 😅 but it added confusion for me.
Thanks for watching, cheers!
Some time ago, when I learned what CTOs really are, I removed all of them from my collection. Obviously anyone can choose to collect them if they want but the issue I have with these 'stamps' is that they were basically created by post offices to fool novice collectors. They are often sold as used, which is, in fact, a scam. CTOs are the reason I stopped collecting used stamps.
I hate CTO's but it won't stop me from collecting stamps. Was just wondering, is there any country that still produce some?
@@sylvaindore3190 The most recent ones I have are from Germany, issued in 2010-2011
In fact, they are cancelled specifically to stop them from being used for any legitimate purpose. That makes them effectively no different than cinderellas. I don't really care about them in my topical collections, but in my primary collections, I only collect mint.
liked and subscribed ❤
Thank you so much!
CTO are basically Cancelled To Order. Legitimate stamps stamped so they have no postal value and usually a bit cheaper. They are avoided by most collectors but there are collectors out there who obtain them to complete their collection of used, CTO, and mint. :)
That old intro scene made me 😂😂😂😂. So I was introduced to philately as a kid and after a break for a few decades I got back into it.. I came across these CTOs mainly as sheets and just understood they existed but not the whole idea of CTOs..just figured for some reason a sheet has been cancelled. And I kid you not - I actually found out the whole deal about them, from our man Graham..!😂😂😂😂.. Exact same way as you.. Lol..
Anyways I think there's 2 ways to look at them (well imo at least) :
1. Philately as a financial investment venture - no not really worth much ( unless there's a special story attached to a specific issue).. And tbh one person's rubbish could be another's treasure - and..also what's worthless today could be a good mine tomorrow.
2. Philately out of interest - anything goes really.I mean forgeries can be collected in that case. The rule here is "There are NO rules" . If something appeals to you and people are happy to part with it for little $$( other means of barter do exist)- that's a win win in my book. I don't really collect CTOs but I saw a sheet of them and just thought it looked grand.. So I took it. Every stamp - Cinderella, forgery, cto or whatever it may be, tells a story. 🙂👍🏽
I fully agree about collecting for interests sake! In general I'm not super keen on CTO's just because of this 'negative aura' many collectors have of them..... but then, I'll find out about the back story behind a stamp, or just fall in love with the image, and suddenly I have to have it, CTO or not! I do find them interesting as well in a propaganda sense- for example North Vietnam during the war Issued many stamps that were not ever intended for postal use, and primarily to raise money on the collector market (as CTO) but the images they show really tell a story of that time period in their history, and they certainly make their opinions very clear on the stamp imagery!
During my early years of stamp collecting, I too have questioned the validity of CTO's. But ultimately accepted CTO's as collectable stamps with the following criteria. It is based on "my" definition of a "used" stamp, meaning "any form of applied cancellation making a valid stamp for usage the inability for any type of future usage". Those CTO's stamps which the cancellation are printed as part of the stamp would NOT be added to my collection, because the cancellation was never applied. Heck, I would go further to define those printed CTO's stamps as "cinderella"s.
I like your definition! Same here- I like the CTO's better that have had a cancel applied. I think the ones with printed-on cancel ugly. And yet I still put them away in my book haha.
@@StampCatStampsThey are all printed on when the stamps were manufactured except possibly some of the earliest ones that may have been hand stamped on
am surprised, worried & upset upon learning the true meaning of CTO😮.
anyways, i know & still remember where my stamps came from😊
I have few big, gummed, unbelievable themed stamps from some countries 😮 blah blah which i separated. 😅
Nothing wrong with CTO's as long as they are appropriately priced and identified as such. I also collect topically so they fit right in with me.
They're great for a topical collection... it's nice having a good quality image on the stamp- some of them really are quite beautiful !
I'm not a snob, it's a cancelled stamp, if there is no gum you cant prove it's a cto, cancelling a corner of a stamp is no prof, i know since i collect envelopes, the stamp could be cancelled in a million ways. I wish they could just drop the term, it's just a stamp with a bad cancel, opposite to a luxury cancel with full place and date with only 10% tilted max, fully centered upright position. Don't worry just collect what you like with no limits.
Just curious- what do you end up doing with the ones you get from bulk purchases?
@@alanpower2857 you are right of course!
Graham has an excellent video about tongs 👍🏽
@@mookatgirl7680 I saw that one! Maybe I should get the golden tongs...
One can almost always differentiate a cto without gum from a postally used corner cancelled one by the evenness of the cancellation ink
Прикольное видео, спасибо!
Any thoughts on soaking CTO stamps to remove the gum? Then, they appear no different than a soaked used stamp (of course, you would know the truth that it was never actually used). To me, it seems a bit dishonest to do that, but I'm sure some collectors do it.
Removing the gum would definitely make it harder to differentiate from a real postally used stamp for sure! (I had even thought about mailing myself a CTO on the cover - along with the appropriate postage of course - then 'soaking it off' to make it follow the journey of a used stamp 😂) but I think what annoys most collectors about them are when stamps are printed mostly in CTO form and never really issued for use to mail at all. It's like they 'never had a chance' 🤷🏻♀️
@@StampCatStamps That would certainly be a creative way to make it a technically used stamp!
@@popperfrozyNope. They are cancelled to order not gummed to order.
Removal of gum doesn't change that
This is why I collect MNH. lol.
CTO are okay, they are officially printed by Postal Service, just like Used and MNH, so they are official stamps, so they can be and are fit for adding to your collection! I also have these Rwanda/Rwandaise African wild people, they are good stamps!
Thanks for watching! I guess for me, if I like the design or topic I'd the stamp I'll collect it even if it's a CTO!
@@StampCatStamps CTO okay, like Magyar Posta/Hungary they are after all government printed and are STAMPS! Okay to keep in Album! Same goes for Mongolia!
@@StampCatStamps Thanx, are you Chinese?
I'm mixed! Half Filipino and half Canadian
Not long ago I considered collecting Space stamps. I ordered an assortment for $10. They turned out to be 100% CTOs. So basically I way overpaid. Some were nice but the all of them were just made for profit. Not able to use for postage. So essentially they are glorified stickers. In my opinion, if they don't have catalog numbers, they're not postage stamps.
There definitely seem to be a lot of CTO space stamps! I'm curious, do you prefer stamps to be listed only in Scott catalog or any of the others as well? Sometimes it seems like everything has a Michel number of nothing else. I'm not too experienced with using catalogs, so I don't know the intricacies! Thanks for your comment
@@StampCatStamps I guess I would say, if you like them, collect them. I'd hate to throw them away but then they don't belong in any normal postage stamp album. If a person loves aardvarks, they should collect everything pertaining to aardvarks and not worry about value or catalog inclusion. Anyway, you know what they say about opinions.
A key phrase here is 'can be used for postage' as being different from 'has been used for postage'. If you go to the post office and buy some stamps but never get round to using them, does that mean that they are not real stamps. Of course not. There's nothing that magically happens when you stick a stamp to an envelope that suddenly turns it from just a piece of paper into a stamp. By the same token, there are a lot of stamps these days that manage to travel through the postal system without being cancelled, how would you categorise them? In the end it depends on whether you would like nice, neat cancels on stamps or be happy with cancels that are not so neat and possibly block out most of the image on the stamp. Really, it's up to the collector to decide for her or himself what they want in their collection. Stanley Gibbons catalogues state that they do not list stamps issued in excess of postal needs, but in a world where postage paid labels are becoming increasingly common, it could be argued that ALL stamps are issued in Excess of postal NEEDS. It seems that all postal authorities are issuing more and more stamps with higher and higher values and these often do find their way into catalogues. As for subjects on stamps, Australia, where I live, almost never issues any stamps that don't relate directly to Australian culture and society, which I understand, but there are some events and people that are of global significance and I wish that countries like Australia would sometimes recognise these events and people.
Thanks for your comment, you raise some good points! Now-a-days especially I get many stamps in my mail that they don't seem to bother to post mark anymore. Great if you want a clear image of the stamp, but not so interesting if you like to know about the journey of the letter. I agree it comes down to each person can decide what they want to collect. Again thanks for watching and sharing your thoughts!
If it appears in the Scott catalog, I accept it in my collection. The stamp may or may not be a CTO, it makes no difference to me. I have a member my club who collects only iron curtain countries and most the stamps you get from them are CTO.
That's true! One of my Dad's worldwide albums has a nearly full Bulgaria section... Huge majority CTO but really they look quite nice all together and still depict a lot of folk culture and important events for their nation. I like them!
I wanted to share a comment from a viewer that I think youtube removed because it has links- but I found them to be useful resources! I'll try pasting it here. Thank you John for the comment!
John Berry-- I am new to your channel (am I saying that right?) but have been a collector since (well not active for a while) I "inherited - read absconded" my older brother's Harris collection once he moved out way, way, way back in the day. I enjoy your videos and they have rejuvenated my interest in collecting. Your enthusiasm is contagious. I just watched this one, and your reaction to CTOs was priceless. Don't know if you have looked into the UPU or their WEB site for searching for stamps from UPU member countries - I recommend it (both links below): UPU -> www.upu.int/en/Home Search site ->www.wnsstamps.post/en/Stamps-Search
I do collect CTO-s and my thoughts on this, to put it simple, are: of course they don't have any place in a postal history or traditional philately exhibit; there, postal circulation is everything. However, for a thematic collector, who wishes to tell a story through stamps and other philatelic material, I don't see why they should be rejected. I know that there will be purists out there that would probably have me stoned to death for saying this, but...
Thanks for your thoughts! ... In some ways I 'like' the CTO's or don't mind them if they put a lot of effort into making it look beautiful. You're right that they are great for topical collections...And don't worry, there will be no stoning here on my channel 🙃.
CTOs are not stamps because they have never represented a postal credit. Stamps represent postal credit.
Hmmm but what's your take on crypto / NFT stamps, or stamps that are automatically canceled on first day covers?
For me it's cheating and waste of stamps. I simply don't get the concept of CTO. I buy CTOs only if I had no other option in forseeable future. They usualy "warm the spot" for the proper one. CTO are neither mint nor from circulation.
Haha I like that phrase: "warm the spot." I agree they are their own entity, not mint, not 'used', not fake, not 'real'? Certainly beautiful as placeholders though, for sure.
CTOs? Meh. I guess if you are collecting world wide then CTOs are "meh" but they'll fill a spot. It's an old stamp collecting argument.
WRONG: Some CTO stamps has real value. For example Australia Specialiazed Catalogues Kangaroo and KGV stamps have gone up in value - on some of the high values in the hundreds opf dollars so all on here is not accurrate or from other stamp comment below this one. Do you research CTO's have value in some countries and Australia is one of them as are other commomwealth countries
Thanks for your comment, I'm always happy to learn more about the world of stamps! Except ... I watched the video again and again and I can't find where I said that CTO stamps don't have any value? If anything I felt I was trying to advocate -for- collecting CTO's. Well, thanks for watching!