Thanks Richard… good video… you did well to emphasise the first two of the 4 principles of survival (protection and location). The other two, water and food are irrelevant as you won’t survive long enough for those to be an issue. On the subject of location; I paddle (west coast) with a waterproof VHF with a DSC emergency button (registering for an MMSI number is cheap and easy)… gives you a backup emergency button, gps tracking, and comms with every other vessel in Table Bay, including hopefully, the one coming to your rescue
@@ForbesRichard they form part of the GMDSS, which the EPIRB you use forms part of. I'll probably botch an attempt at a brief explanation. There are some good explanations on youtube if you search VHF DSC emergency button and VHF MMSI. I considered an EPIRB, but felt the VHF with emergency VHF ability, was a better option for shorter range, close shore emergencies (especially with the ability for two way communication). My unit (IC-M93D) is a bit bigger than those mini EPIRBs, but I carry it in the hydration pouch of my PFD and have done so for a few years now. In my experience as a Helicopter rescue swimmer/ sea survival instructor and having worked at sea for 16 years... the "LOCATION" element of survival is the one given least thought (because we all naturally feel cold, hungry or thirsty), but the old adage; "No one is a survivor, until they have been rescued" is as apt as it gets. Hope that helps, I'm always interested to learn better or newer alternatives.
@@ForbesRichard Maritime Mobile Service Identity (MMSI) is a unique 9 digit number that is assigned to a (Digital Selective Calling) DSC radio. If you can push the button your radio will transmit your GPS location digitally to Cape Town radio.
Richard, that was a very good vid ! Reminds me of the shock movies they made for people working on nuclear plans in the 70’s (that’s how old I am). Btw, Paradoxical Undressing also a thing with high altitude mountaineering. A few thoughts: • I have some experience in a few serious sports - rock climbing, white-water kayaking, mountain biking and recently a bit of downwind paddling. What strike me is the huge objective (as opposed to subjective) dangers in downwind paddling. • Climbing , you have a mate at the end of the rope looking after you, scuba divers buddy up, in white water you shoot a rapid the re-group in the next pool. In mountain biking you go one at a time then stop to agree how scary the last section was. (And so how good you must be.) • Not on Millers ! (Or not my experience.) You don’t know where the others are. Or even who they are. Or how many there are. No point, you can’t really see much. • Really bad management to rely on the NSRI to save us. I think we are all quite good at mitigating risk. We are not good at identifying it ! That is what this vid does, and does well. So what should we do ? Perhaps …. • Wear more technical life jackets. • Buddy up. Always. • Wear what cold water kayakers wear. • Use RescueMe. • Do nothing. It is after all, part of the sport.
Thanks Charles. Thought provoking response. Re relying on the NSRI. I have spoken to them about this and their view is that provided we are thoughtful, well prepared and know our limits, they are only too happy to help us when the &*^$ hits the fan. And, even if we are idiots (like I have been) they will also apply the same degree of effort to saving us ! There are however quite a few of the very experienced elite paddlers who will go to the nth degree to self rescue. But very few of us have what it takes (skill and mindset) to do that.
And so much that the cold kills, last March 8th, in Tarragona, Spain, I fell into the water and could not get on the surfski because of the brutal storm, although the water was 14 degrees, when they rescued me and took me to the hospital, my body temperature was 27 degrees and I could not move, fortunately I just started to train after the trauma.
I've had to go into water that was close to freezing temp (ice forming on surface), without protective clothing. Stripped down to underwear. Each time, I had less than 2 minutes before my large muscles started to lock up. As soon as feeling any of this, I climbed out. Once climbed out, *I felt WARM as my muscles seized*. I won't lie, the muscles seizing up felt great. It was like I'd donned a suit of muscle armour. Standing out of the water, steam rising from my body, veins and muscles popping like I was some bodybuilder burnt down for a competition. It was a complete seizing up, I literally couldn't move. Not even to walk. In contrast, I've swum several hundred metres in similar conditions, but wearing clothes (wool underlayers, sweater, goretex waterproof on top) and was fine. My neck froze and seized, where it was exposed to the water. However, my torso base layer remained dry, so the cold water was not reaching arms or torso. There's no such thing as bad weather, just bad clothing.
Oh, and I really don't rate wetsuits for paddling. We aren't in the water and as you say, wetsuits are useless when wet and exposed to the wind. Much much prefer garments like reed chillcheater or Rooster aquatherm. If I get too hot when paddling in these, I scoop up some water and dump it down my neck.
As a primarily a sea kayaker (who only dabbles in surfskis occasionally) I can say that these facts are pounded into our brains early as a part of formalized coaching offered by organizations like Paddle Canada, ACA, BCA and such. All the hazards are the same and in case of surfskis and possibly amplified since you guys tend to go further out off-shore and more often solo. We tend to be heavier on gear but we do account for more hazards such as loss or breakage of a paddle, layered drysuits for colder water and so on. About every committed sea kayaker seems to be onboard with that without any particular debate, but the surfski community doesn't seem do borrow much from this culture.
It is a different culture and we quite often take flak from the Sea Kayaking crowd for being "reckless". I think it's something akin to camper vans v sports cars (without being derogatory). Why would you load down your sports car with hydraulic jacks and tool kits and camping gear? Downwind paddling is all about sleek, clean, light craft surfing waves. Hanging all kinds of gear like spare paddles on a surfski just doesn't fit the mould. Having said that, I carry VHF, phone, emergency steering kit, flares, etc, and most of us do have some or all of that we're not entirely cavalier. We normally do shorter, quicker paddlers than Sea Kayakers who seem to do longer, adventure type paddling. Respect to each. Different strokes, for different folks, etc.
The "all kinds" of gear you are referring to are really the result of the same though process you went through. Instead of learning by costly mistakes one can take a look at the adjacent sport and pick what is appropriate without resorting to us vs them type of debate. Specifically we are talking about sufficient immersion wear and maybe a spare paddle. The latter shouldn't make you much less slick. Introduce an extra bungee attachment point further out at the stern and that's it.
l wonder when l watch the millers run video's, how does the paddle go when they break their paddle. How do they continue or do they call emergency help. Always enjoy your video's , l'm from the Land Down Under.
hi Keith. I depends on both the conditions and the experience/capability of the paddler. So if you are on a regular SE run in 25kts then many of us could self rescue with just one blade. However if you are on a reverse NW run in 30kts plus (being blown slightly offshore) then it is an entirely different story and most of us would call for help. However, even under such circumstances there are instances of where elite paddlers have made it to shore either by using just one blade with a leg or two out, or by lying on their skis and paddling with arms like a surfboard.
Grate video Rich. Thanks for going to the trouble of making it. One correction I would like to make is that you refer to Safetrx not being to locate a paddler due to there only being a single cell tower and therefor the position could not be triangulated. Safetrx uses the GPS chip in the phone to determine position and not tower triangulation. Cell connection is only needed to transmit that GPS position to NSRI, and that is usually possible with a just a single tower and low grade connection, but a cell coverage is required nonetheless. The message I got from your video is have layers of safety as no single method is fool proof. Because one over heats when paddling hard, cold water protection is almost neglected. Being able to extend how long you can wait for rescue is critical.
Thanks very much Rob. I will give you a shout about the cell phone/Safetrax issue (and PLB AIS signals etc) as I think there is room (and appetite) to ensure we know the actual science and practical functioning. Got my sights on a follow up clarification video. 🙏
Panic should be your worst fear. It gets worse when you realize that you have not prepared enough for the situation you find yourself in. No excuse for not using a PLB and personal floatation. As well weather forecasts are really accurate these days and there is no excuse for not being apprised before you get on the water. I wonder why I am alive for the risks that I took in my training for PE2EL Challenges back in the early 80s. Mostly in California into our winter months. Self reliance can only get you so far but keeps you in the game.
I tend to carry both PLB and VHF. Probably guilty of not wearing enough on the water, my uniform year round on the water is rugby shorts and black singlet.
@@ForbesRichard Good thing is I've never been to a Rugby game in my life. An expat South African we had working with us could not comprehend such a thing from a kiwi.
@@ForbesRichard Yeah, I always preferred to be doing things myself. Running, rowing, kayaking, swimming, cycling, tramping, ... nicking the rugby teams ball. 😇
Thanks Richard… good video… you did well to emphasise the first two of the 4 principles of survival (protection and location). The other two, water and food are irrelevant as you won’t survive long enough for those to be an issue.
On the subject of location; I paddle (west coast) with a waterproof VHF with a DSC emergency button (registering for an MMSI number is cheap and easy)… gives you a backup emergency button, gps tracking, and comms with every other vessel in Table Bay, including hopefully, the one coming to your rescue
Mark, thank you. What are DSC and MMSI ?
@@ForbesRichard they form part of the GMDSS, which the EPIRB you use forms part of. I'll probably botch an attempt at a brief explanation. There are some good explanations on youtube if you search VHF DSC emergency button and VHF MMSI. I considered an EPIRB, but felt the VHF with emergency VHF ability, was a better option for shorter range, close shore emergencies (especially with the ability for two way communication). My unit (IC-M93D) is a bit bigger than those mini EPIRBs, but I carry it in the hydration pouch of my PFD and have done so for a few years now. In my experience as a Helicopter rescue swimmer/ sea survival instructor and having worked at sea for 16 years... the "LOCATION" element of survival is the one given least thought (because we all naturally feel cold, hungry or thirsty), but the old adage; "No one is a survivor, until they have been rescued" is as apt as it gets. Hope that helps, I'm always interested to learn better or newer alternatives.
Thanks, will check out the YT videos. Bit like buying property...."location, location, locatio"
@@ForbesRichard Maritime Mobile Service Identity (MMSI) is a unique 9 digit number that is assigned to a (Digital Selective Calling) DSC radio. If you can push the button your radio will transmit your GPS location digitally to Cape Town radio.
@@andrewcarr3650 Thanks Andrew. Even though I recently did the radio course, I am still foggy about some of the terminology.
Your best video yet Richard! Well presented and researched mate.
Thank you Graham 🙏.
sorry Graeme !
Richard, that was a very good vid !
Reminds me of the shock movies they made for people working on nuclear plans in the 70’s (that’s how old I am). Btw, Paradoxical Undressing also a thing with high altitude mountaineering.
A few thoughts:
• I have some experience in a few serious sports - rock climbing, white-water kayaking, mountain biking and recently a bit of downwind paddling. What strike me is the huge objective (as opposed to subjective) dangers in downwind paddling.
• Climbing , you have a mate at the end of the rope looking after you, scuba divers buddy up, in white water you shoot a rapid the re-group in the next pool. In mountain biking you go one at a time then stop to agree how scary the last section was. (And so how good you must be.)
• Not on Millers ! (Or not my experience.) You don’t know where the others are. Or even who they are. Or how many there are. No point, you can’t really see much.
• Really bad management to rely on the NSRI to save us.
I think we are all quite good at mitigating risk. We are not good at identifying it !
That is what this vid does, and does well.
So what should we do ?
Perhaps ….
• Wear more technical life jackets.
• Buddy up. Always.
• Wear what cold water kayakers wear.
• Use RescueMe.
• Do nothing. It is after all, part of the sport.
Thanks Charles. Thought provoking response. Re relying on the NSRI. I have spoken to them about this and their view is that provided we are thoughtful, well prepared and know our limits, they are only too happy to help us when the &*^$ hits the fan. And, even if we are idiots (like I have been) they will also apply the same degree of effort to saving us ! There are however quite a few of the very experienced elite paddlers who will go to the nth degree to self rescue. But very few of us have what it takes (skill and mindset) to do that.
And so much that the cold kills, last March 8th, in Tarragona, Spain, I fell into the water and could not get on the surfski because of the brutal storm, although the water was 14 degrees, when they rescued me and took me to the hospital, my body temperature was 27 degrees and I could not move, fortunately I just started to train after the trauma.
Heavens Jose, that was a close call. Glad that you made it and are now finally back on your ski.
Thank you for this video ! That's all i am talking about to all paddlers i teach in France with Surfski & Co.
Thank you Eric.
Approaching darkness is also a factor to be considered.
For sure, thanks Johann.
top vid thx Richard
Much appreciated again, thanks Nick.
I've had to go into water that was close to freezing temp (ice forming on surface), without protective clothing. Stripped down to underwear.
Each time, I had less than 2 minutes before my large muscles started to lock up. As soon as feeling any of this, I climbed out. Once climbed out, *I felt WARM as my muscles seized*.
I won't lie, the muscles seizing up felt great. It was like I'd donned a suit of muscle armour. Standing out of the water, steam rising from my body, veins and muscles popping like I was some bodybuilder burnt down for a competition.
It was a complete seizing up, I literally couldn't move. Not even to walk.
In contrast, I've swum several hundred metres in similar conditions, but wearing clothes (wool underlayers, sweater, goretex waterproof on top) and was fine. My neck froze and seized, where it was exposed to the water. However, my torso base layer remained dry, so the cold water was not reaching arms or torso.
There's no such thing as bad weather, just bad clothing.
Oh, and I really don't rate wetsuits for paddling. We aren't in the water and as you say, wetsuits are useless when wet and exposed to the wind.
Much much prefer garments like reed chillcheater or Rooster aquatherm.
If I get too hot when paddling in these, I scoop up some water and dump it down my neck.
Thanks for your feedback Alastair. Will you pls copy links for those two garments that you refer to ?
Tried to post links, but youtube doesn't like it.
@@Alastair510 Yep, thanks Alastair. I think that "no such thing" comment originates from the motorcycling community in the UK !
@@ForbesRichard I don't know the origin, but the comedian Billy Connelly used it in his act.
Good 👍🏻
Thank you Van Zyl.
As a primarily a sea kayaker (who only dabbles in surfskis occasionally) I can say that these facts are pounded into our brains early as a part of formalized coaching offered by organizations like Paddle Canada, ACA, BCA and such. All the hazards are the same and in case of surfskis and possibly amplified since you guys tend to go further out off-shore and more often solo.
We tend to be heavier on gear but we do account for more hazards such as loss or breakage of a paddle, layered drysuits for colder water and so on. About every committed sea kayaker seems to be onboard with that without any particular debate, but the surfski community doesn't seem do borrow much from this culture.
Yep, thanks. I think we have a lot to learn from your fraternity that ventures out in typically more extreme cold weather and water.
It is a different culture and we quite often take flak from the Sea Kayaking crowd for being "reckless". I think it's something akin to camper vans v sports cars (without being derogatory). Why would you load down your sports car with hydraulic jacks and tool kits and camping gear? Downwind paddling is all about sleek, clean, light craft surfing waves. Hanging all kinds of gear like spare paddles on a surfski just doesn't fit the mould. Having said that, I carry VHF, phone, emergency steering kit, flares, etc, and most of us do have some or all of that we're not entirely cavalier. We normally do shorter, quicker paddlers than Sea Kayakers who seem to do longer, adventure type paddling. Respect to each. Different strokes, for different folks, etc.
The "all kinds" of gear you are referring to are really the result of the same though process you went through. Instead of learning by costly mistakes one can take a look at the adjacent sport and pick what is appropriate without resorting to us vs them type of debate.
Specifically we are talking about sufficient immersion wear and maybe a spare paddle. The latter shouldn't make you much less slick. Introduce an extra bungee attachment point further out at the stern and that's it.
Neat contrasting and distinguishing analogy, thanks Rob.
l wonder when l watch the millers run video's, how does the paddle go when they break their paddle. How do they continue or do they call emergency help. Always enjoy your video's , l'm from the Land Down Under.
hi Keith. I depends on both the conditions and the experience/capability of the paddler. So if you are on a regular SE run in 25kts then many of us could self rescue with just one blade. However if you are on a reverse NW run in 30kts plus (being blown slightly offshore) then it is an entirely different story and most of us would call for help. However, even under such circumstances there are instances of where elite paddlers have made it to shore either by using just one blade with a leg or two out, or by lying on their skis and paddling with arms like a surfboard.
Grate video Rich. Thanks for going to the trouble of making it. One correction I would like to make is that you refer to Safetrx not being to locate a paddler due to there only being a single cell tower and therefor the position could not be triangulated. Safetrx uses the GPS chip in the phone to determine position and not tower triangulation. Cell connection is only needed to transmit that GPS position to NSRI, and that is usually possible with a just a single tower and low grade connection, but a cell coverage is required nonetheless. The message I got from your video is have layers of safety as no single method is fool proof. Because one over heats when paddling hard, cold water protection is almost neglected. Being able to extend how long you can wait for rescue is critical.
Thanks very much Rob. I will give you a shout about the cell phone/Safetrax issue (and PLB AIS signals etc) as I think there is room (and appetite) to ensure we know the actual science and practical functioning. Got my sights on a follow up clarification video. 🙏
Panic should be your worst fear. It gets worse when you realize that you have not prepared enough for the situation you find yourself in. No excuse for not using a PLB and personal floatation. As well weather forecasts are really accurate these days and there is no excuse for not being apprised before you get on the water. I wonder why I am alive for the risks that I took in my training for PE2EL Challenges back in the early 80s. Mostly in California into our winter months. Self reliance can only get you so far but keeps you in the game.
Yep, I too am very lucky to have survived my earlier stupidity/ignorance !
I tend to carry both PLB and VHF. Probably guilty of not wearing enough on the water, my uniform year round on the water is rugby shorts and black singlet.
Careful of those black rugby short lest Etzebeth gets hold of you ! 😉
@@ForbesRichard Good thing is I've never been to a Rugby game in my life. An expat South African we had working with us could not comprehend such a thing from a kiwi.
What !!!!! never been....you gotta be kidding me. Our (SA) perspective is that it is an (obligatory) religion down there !
@@ForbesRichard Yeah, I always preferred to be doing things myself. Running, rowing, kayaking, swimming, cycling, tramping, ... nicking the rugby teams ball. 😇
👊