Hi, I graduated from NYU School of Physical Therapy BS degree in 1981. I just retired. I made good money as a PT contractor my last 20 years ($100,000.00+). I really loved working with and helping people. I went into the service (US Air Force) before going to college and the GI educational Bill paid for all of my college. I used to sing to my patients and was known as the Singing Therapist !! 😊😊
Good for you. I hate being a PT now bc I get shit on everyday with copious amounts of paperwork and shitty reimbursement.....and now ridiculous healthcare premiums for horrible coverage......I should have gone to med school, but instead I am the red headed step child of healthcare
SO true about being easily replaced. I remember my PT mill noticing that I was unhappy as a new grad drowning in documentation literally telling me "this is your potential replacement" right before they showed applying PTs the workplace.
There was a period of time where I considered leaving the profession. Practicing since 2015. Doing residency and fellowship and it still felt like a total waste of time. Once I left traditional healthcare and became self employed, I found my fire again. Great video as always mate.
DPT here: this advice is misleading 1. The ROI is poor. $110k would be a bargain. Today, you're looking at something closer to $150-200k. Things to consider are: Tuition, books, rent/ cost of living, inability to work while in school (true for most students, but rare exceptions are found), cost of clinical education (if your placement is out of your immediate area, you fund all living and travel expenses). Scholarships are very uncommon. Most schools don't need financial assistance to incentivize students to apply. If financial aid is available, it is often in the form of a TA, offered to one or two 2nd year students. Students aren't typically paying off loans in 5 years, and that's not due to lack of hustle. That typically requires taking a job you dont like, in a setting you dont like and struggling financially, while pumping most of your income into loans. These people most likely benefit from living in a dual income situation and have financial assistance from a partner. Anyone paying off their loans in this amount of time is the minority, and made extreme sacrifices to do so. 2. The job is more frustrating than fulfilling. You have the patient's best interests in mind, but you're often the only one. You'll spend the bulk of your time begging patients to participate in their own care, whether that's literally trying to get them out of bed in a SNF or acute setting, tricking them into doing exercises or otherwise bargaining with them to participate. You'll be doing the jobs of support staff, such as changing patients soiled briefs, or getting them something to drink. These same support staff may not even get your patient out of bed all weekend. If you work outpatient, you'll likely work in a mill ... because they're everywhere, and decent alternatives are difficult to find, especially as new grads. Often times, you wont know you've been hired by a mill, until its too late. You'll get harassed about productivity standards, take your documentation home (unpaid), while insurance continues to cut reimbursement rates. Keep in mind that profits rule everything else, and if you get in the way of that, your company will let you know. You'll see a hand full of patients you're excited to work with through out the week, and the rest will drain your soul. Bottom line is: its a job. Find something you can tolerate that allows you to otherwise enjoy life. Loving your work is not a requirement, but not absolutely hating your job is. Its a means to an end. Pick something that you'll be good at and doesn't take up all of your time and resources. For most, PT isnt the right path. In fact, many are leaving the field in search of a better quality of life. Studies regarding burnout rates of PTs: Spoiler Alert, they're high. aptaeducation.org/abstract-archive/view.cfm?id=22771 www.apta.org/contentassets/3f6e82c0f4ab4b8baff58921b682174e/kristilinkresearchpaper.pdf blog.getluna.com/pt-burnout-is-at-an-all-time-high-according-to-a-new-study
Thank you for sharing such a detailed comment. The topic of burnout for sure needs to be addressed in the PT profession since it is a big deal and quite common. One of the biggest hurdles for PT students are the large amount of loans, which for sure can be paid of within 5-10 years. Im not a financial planner nor is that my expertise, but I’ve seen it happen and I’m also on track to pay off $140K loans in that timeline too. However, I understand that every situation is different. Thank you for your insight B Na!
I was a PT back in the 1990s. I decided to leave the profession within 4 years for a myriad of reasons. Ultimately I thought “did I invest all those years in school for this?” Oh Noooooo! I went back to Medical School and it was the best decision of my life. Four other classmates in my PT class went back to PA programs. I think PT likely pays less than any other doctorate program. I would much rather be an NP or Pharmacist. But to each their own.
I go back and forth!!! I’m a LMT in Arizona and my private practice breaks 120,000 yearly. I have about 80-100ish patients a month but I do 25 to 35 a week. The catch is, I’m a medical massage therapist, scheduler and my own aide. It’s very draining and physically demanding. I love to learn, adapt and always evolving. I’m afraid of getting burned out in PT.
Monotony?wow sounds that they have never work in a business/mkt area in a super big company😂 I've been there,all my family works there too, no matter how fancy is the brand: crazy amounts of stress, crazy pace(like everything is burning), you work 10-14 hours and even you have 2-5 accounts, every freaking day seems the same with a "tolerable" work environment to SUPER toxic environment , crazy amounts of hours sitting in front of your PC even in home office, no work-life balance, the same insane meetings of 3 hours at 7pm and crazy bosses. Trust me,I quit and I'm never going to look back, I'm actually starting my PT school. I earned huge amounts of money and I hated every single day without meaning and feeling like anyone and anything had value for the company,nor the bosses and watched how the life of my coworkers went to he'll for health,stress and monotony issues.
Went to cal state northridge instead of usc. Best decision I’ve ever made. I don’t care that I have a masters instead of a dpt ; I probably make more than most dpts anyways working in snfs
Hey bro, question I'm struggling to choose picking major PT or clinical dietician I feel I should pick DC but then ppl telling me thy don't make good $🤔
Here's the real scoop. PT is a train wreck today. I contract and only pick places where I work 1 on 1. Always have. And I'm 80% retired from that. But the majority of PTs aren't PTs--they are glorified athletic trainers seeing multiple patients at a time. Trust me I can tell when I get a patient from one of those mills and those mills are the majority of clinics. Two: the chronic pain patient can't be solved usually because of his lifestyle. And PTs don't have the brains or lack the guts to tell the MDs that they will not give continuous therapy on and off throughout the year to patients who have chronic pain because they are obese and anxiety ridden with piss poor lifestyles. And chronic pain is the new cash cow with some of these genius clinics pushing for maintenance PT for these patients. I also don't engage in that. I work in remote alaska where people are active and would never work in regular america where the fact is, the majority of your patients will be there because of their poor lifestyles. Third: you keep introducing yourselves as "Dr." You are not an MD. You are not a specialty doctor who went to medical school. "Dr" as part of your channel name is a misrepresentation to the public. You are not even a legitimate academic Dr. Your "thesis" is not on the realm of a real doctorate. It takes several months to even get a topic accepted for thesis---after an extensive lit review which is usually presented a few times to your advisor. And this is all done after all coursework is completed. Your pre "write-ups" are not even in the same universe as a doctorate degree. It also takes a few months to get a committee for your paper usually. And something like 50% of thesis presentations don't make it through the first time. How many in your class didn't graduate from this? Exactly. It's not the same, it's not remotely the same--period. You don't do orals, you don't teach lower level classes and your degree is entry level. So basically you do nothing a real post graduate student does. You went to PT school. That's it, on top of an unrelated degree. The idea of spending 150-200 K now for this is nonsense. Don't do it future students. If you are going to do that then go be a real doctor and graduate chiropractic school.
So I’ve heard that insurance is no longer covering a PTAs salary, meaning now physical therapists have to pay out of pocket to have an assistant. The job market is killing PTAs. Definitely something to look into. (Heard this from my colleges advisor for health sciences)
If you are coming out of high school then going PTA wouldn't be a bad idea but it will prolong your path to becoming a PT. As a PTA you need to earn an associates degree which is 2 years and often requires an additional year of pre requisites = 3 years. If you then choose the PT route there are only a few bridge programs that exist allowing some of your PTA credits towards your DPT degree. I do believe most of these bridge programs still require a bachelors degree and additional prerequisites resulting in a few more years of study before applying to them 3-4years (depending on whether a school will take PTA credits towards your bachelors). The bridge programs are also about the same cost and length as traditional PT schools about 3 years but have more flexibility to work as a PTA and offset the cost. So if you do PTA first it would take 2-3 years + 3-4 years for your bachelors + 3 years for PT school (traditional or bridge). Many end up staying as a PTA because of this and because the increase in pay to become a PT isn't worth the time and effort for some. PTAs make around 50-60k a year and PTs around 80k (can vary for both) but PTs are coming out with over 100k in student loans. They both do similar work but PTs have more autonomy and upward mobility. Jobs are still available for PTAs and always will be. There has just been a recent reimbursement cut targeting PTAs but they are still profitable for companies. Before commiting shadow or work as a PT aide. I have been a PTA 3 years and going back to school but choosing the PA route.
This is a real question asking because I’m considering this path and I’m a freshman in college will physical therapist be passed out by ai , I mean I know this depends on policy and stuff just asking from those in the profession
That is a great question! I personally don't think that AI will take over physical therapy. The profession requires you to have Physical contact by a therapist. Of course AI can offer exercises and stretches to help, but nothing will replace the physical touch
Hi! I really want to study PT but I suffer from hypermobility. I'm afraid my body will hurt and I can't do the job... Do you (or someone with experience about this subject) have some advise for me? Thank you so much.
Hey bro I have elhers danlos syndrome. I had to make the conscious choice of switching over to Inpatient bc I could feel providing joint mobs on a daily basis was starting to hurt me. There’s still a lot of precautions I take but for the most part I’m cool. Now that I’m a professional and no longer a student I also focus a lot of strengthening for myself. There are other specialties within the field that require less physical effort on your part too, such as cardio. I always loved inpatient so the transition was easier than expexted( granted I was bummed a bit that I felt like I couldn’t keep at it at ortho) but nonetheless I’m happy now.
Manual therapy is phasing out imo. Not reimbursed in the OP setting very well. As well as therapist just not doing it as often as it used to be used. Some are heavy on it. Some don’t do it at all. You could make it in the OP setting.
The main reason a student should avoid PT as a career is the poor pay for number of years spent in school. Many bachelor degree majors pay more in salary than a doctorate of PT.
I didnt know that a therapist was a doctor? In this day and age with chat gpt and A.i it certainly is not worth it. Remember PT was done way before A.i really took off. Which leads to students with no PT experience or qualifications having more knowledge just by A.i.
Hi, I graduated from NYU School of Physical Therapy BS degree in 1981. I just retired. I made good money as a PT contractor my last 20 years ($100,000.00+). I really loved working with and helping people. I went into the service (US Air Force) before going to college and the GI educational Bill paid for all of my college. I used to sing to my patients and was known as the Singing Therapist !! 😊😊
Good for you. I hate being a PT now bc I get shit on everyday with copious amounts of paperwork and shitty reimbursement.....and now ridiculous healthcare premiums for horrible coverage......I should have gone to med school, but instead I am the red headed step child of healthcare
I'm only a tech and working at a PT mill is making rethink my career path. Best of luck to all who are sticking with it!
What is a pt mill?? I wa highly concidering getting my dpt
Don't do it
@@vincentkingsdale8334 I didn't. I went to Costco and make way better pay and benefits than I did being a PT tech, but still miss the PT environment.
I LIKE YOUR STYLE. Im really motivated to be a physical therapist and keep preaching!
SO true about being easily replaced. I remember my PT mill noticing that I was unhappy as a new grad drowning in documentation literally telling me "this is your potential replacement" right before they showed applying PTs the workplace.
Screw that company for saying that
There was a period of time where I considered leaving the profession. Practicing since 2015. Doing residency and fellowship and it still felt like a total waste of time. Once I left traditional healthcare and became self employed, I found my fire again. Great video as always mate.
I finished residency last year and we had a gap year for fellowship due to covid. Feeling this really strongly right now in OP ortho.
@@Tori_Rex I hope you find peace and reconnect with the mission and passion that inspired you to join the profession
DPT here: this advice is misleading 1. The ROI is poor. $110k would be a bargain. Today, you're looking at something closer to $150-200k. Things to consider are: Tuition, books, rent/ cost of living, inability to work while in school (true for most students, but rare exceptions are found), cost of clinical education (if your placement is out of your immediate area, you fund all living and travel expenses). Scholarships are very uncommon. Most schools don't need financial assistance to incentivize students to apply. If financial aid is available, it is often in the form of a TA, offered to one or two 2nd year students.
Students aren't typically paying off loans in 5 years, and that's not due to lack of hustle. That typically requires taking a job you dont like, in a setting you dont like and struggling financially, while pumping most of your income into loans. These people most likely benefit from living in a dual income situation and have financial assistance from a partner. Anyone paying off their loans in this amount of time is the minority, and made extreme sacrifices to do so.
2. The job is more frustrating than fulfilling. You have the patient's best interests in mind, but you're often the only one. You'll spend the bulk of your time begging patients to participate in their own care, whether that's literally trying to get them out of bed in a SNF or acute setting, tricking them into doing exercises or otherwise bargaining with them to participate. You'll be doing the jobs of support staff, such as changing patients soiled briefs, or getting them something to drink. These same support staff may not even get your patient out of bed all weekend. If you work outpatient, you'll likely work in a mill ... because they're everywhere, and decent alternatives are difficult to find, especially as new grads. Often times, you wont know you've been hired by a mill, until its too late. You'll get harassed about productivity standards, take your documentation home (unpaid), while insurance continues to cut reimbursement rates. Keep in mind that profits rule everything else, and if you get in the way of that, your company will let you know. You'll see a hand full of patients you're excited to work with through out the week, and the rest will drain your soul.
Bottom line is: its a job. Find something you can tolerate that allows you to otherwise enjoy life. Loving your work is not a requirement, but not absolutely hating your job is. Its a means to an end. Pick something that you'll be good at and doesn't take up all of your time and resources. For most, PT isnt the right path. In fact, many are leaving the field in search of a better quality of life.
Studies regarding burnout rates of PTs: Spoiler Alert, they're high.
aptaeducation.org/abstract-archive/view.cfm?id=22771
www.apta.org/contentassets/3f6e82c0f4ab4b8baff58921b682174e/kristilinkresearchpaper.pdf
blog.getluna.com/pt-burnout-is-at-an-all-time-high-according-to-a-new-study
Thank you for sharing such a detailed comment. The topic of burnout for sure needs to be addressed in the PT profession since it is a big deal and quite common. One of the biggest hurdles for PT students are the large amount of loans, which for sure can be paid of within 5-10 years. Im not a financial planner nor is that my expertise, but I’ve seen it happen and I’m also on track to pay off $140K loans in that timeline too. However, I understand that every situation is different.
Thank you for your insight B Na!
4 years of undergrad also adds like 100k
@@williamfenton7957 it can. Yes.
ROI is rich
what would you do instead of physical therapy if you had to redo it all over again?
I was a PT back in the 1990s. I decided to leave the profession within 4 years for a myriad of reasons. Ultimately I thought “did I invest all those years in school for this?” Oh Noooooo! I went back to Medical School and it was the best decision of my life. Four other classmates in my PT class went back to PA programs. I think PT likely pays less than any other doctorate program. I would much rather be an NP or Pharmacist. But to each their own.
Remember sir m soooo slow and mr mater the car guy is design self so ugly
What did you go back to Medical School for?
I go back and forth!!! I’m a LMT in Arizona and my private practice breaks 120,000 yearly. I have about 80-100ish patients a month but I do 25 to 35 a week. The catch is, I’m a medical massage therapist, scheduler and my own aide. It’s very draining and physically demanding. I love to learn, adapt and always evolving. I’m afraid of getting burned out in PT.
I’m a lmt as well. Trying to get to your level. That’s goals
I’m on this page trying to figure this out as a LMT myself. I’ll shadow a local PT soon to be sure.
Thanks…I’ve been a PT since 1991 and I still love my job!
Do what you love, but prepare for the future. You will need a side hustle with any career you have if you want to be rich. PTs will always be employed
Thank you so much Dr Lee for the encouragement and the tips you share
i love these videos so much, they get me excited for the future
wow very well said!! just finished my first year baby letss goo on to neuro this summer!!
How hard is it? Is it possible to work and go to school
Monotony?wow sounds that they have never work in a business/mkt area in a super big company😂 I've been there,all my family works there too, no matter how fancy is the brand: crazy amounts of stress, crazy pace(like everything is burning), you work 10-14 hours and even you have 2-5 accounts, every freaking day seems the same with a "tolerable" work environment to SUPER toxic environment , crazy amounts of hours sitting in front of your PC even in home office, no work-life balance, the same insane meetings of 3 hours at 7pm and crazy bosses.
Trust me,I quit and I'm never going to look back, I'm actually starting my PT school. I earned huge amounts of money and I hated every single day without meaning and feeling like anyone and anything had value for the company,nor the bosses and watched how the life of my coworkers went to he'll for health,stress and monotony issues.
Went to cal state northridge instead of usc. Best decision I’ve ever made. I don’t care that I have a masters instead of a dpt ; I probably make more than most dpts anyways working in snfs
I thought you have to have a dpt instead of masters
so you give an hour per patient... and what is your rough salary? Can you make a USD $80,000+ by having an hour session with each patinet?
Hey bro, question I'm struggling to choose picking major PT or clinical dietician I feel I should pick DC but then ppl telling me thy don't make good $🤔
Here's the real scoop. PT is a train wreck today. I contract and only pick places where I work 1 on 1. Always have. And I'm 80% retired from that. But the majority of PTs aren't PTs--they are glorified athletic trainers seeing multiple patients at a time. Trust me I can tell when I get a patient from one of those mills and those mills are the majority of clinics. Two: the chronic pain patient can't be solved usually because of his lifestyle. And PTs don't have the brains or lack the guts to tell the MDs that they will not give continuous therapy on and off throughout the year to patients who have chronic pain because they are obese and anxiety ridden with piss poor lifestyles. And chronic pain is the new cash cow with some of these genius clinics pushing for maintenance PT for these patients. I also don't engage in that. I work in remote alaska where people are active and would never work in regular america where the fact is, the majority of your patients will be there because of their poor lifestyles. Third: you keep introducing yourselves as "Dr." You are not an MD. You are not a specialty doctor who went to medical school. "Dr" as part of your channel name is a misrepresentation to the public. You are not even a legitimate academic Dr. Your "thesis" is not on the realm of a real doctorate. It takes several months to even get a topic accepted for thesis---after an extensive lit review which is usually presented a few times to your advisor. And this is all done after all coursework is completed. Your pre "write-ups" are not even in the same universe as a doctorate degree. It also takes a few months to get a committee for your paper usually. And something like 50% of thesis presentations don't make it through the first time. How many in your class didn't graduate from this? Exactly. It's not the same, it's not remotely the same--period. You don't do orals, you don't teach lower level classes and your degree is entry level. So basically you do nothing a real post graduate student does. You went to PT school. That's it, on top of an unrelated degree. The idea of spending 150-200 K now for this is nonsense. Don't do it future students. If you are going to do that then go be a real doctor and graduate chiropractic school.
I’m a PT student, not going back
Not going back to????
😂😂 in Brazil the graduation is for free
LUCKY
Currently deciding whether I should test the waters with PTA first or to go into another medicine field such as PM&R. Any advice?
PTAs aren’t as sought out for these days I’ve heard
So I’ve heard that insurance is no longer covering a PTAs salary, meaning now physical therapists have to pay out of pocket to have an assistant. The job market is killing PTAs. Definitely something to look into. (Heard this from my colleges advisor for health sciences)
If you are coming out of high school then going PTA wouldn't be a bad idea but it will prolong your path to becoming a PT. As a PTA you need to earn an associates degree which is 2 years and often requires an additional year of pre requisites = 3 years. If you then choose the PT route there are only a few bridge programs that exist allowing some of your PTA credits towards your DPT degree. I do believe most of these bridge programs still require a bachelors degree and additional prerequisites resulting in a few more years of study before applying to them 3-4years (depending on whether a school will take PTA credits towards your bachelors). The bridge programs are also about the same cost and length as traditional PT schools about 3 years but have more flexibility to work as a PTA and offset the cost. So if you do PTA first it would take 2-3 years + 3-4 years for your bachelors + 3 years for PT school (traditional or bridge). Many end up staying as a PTA because of this and because the increase in pay to become a PT isn't worth the time and effort for some. PTAs make around 50-60k a year and PTs around 80k (can vary for both) but PTs are coming out with over 100k in student loans. They both do similar work but PTs have more autonomy and upward mobility. Jobs are still available for PTAs and always will be. There has just been a recent reimbursement cut targeting PTAs but they are still profitable for companies. Before commiting shadow or work as a PT aide. I have been a PTA 3 years and going back to school but choosing the PA route.
This is a real question asking because I’m considering this path and I’m a freshman in college will physical therapist be passed out by ai , I mean I know this depends on policy and stuff just asking from those in the profession
That is a great question! I personally don't think that AI will take over physical therapy. The profession requires you to have Physical contact by a therapist. Of course AI can offer exercises and stretches to help, but nothing will replace the physical touch
Same for occupational therapy. Anyone thinking of ot don’t do it
What do you mean don't do it are you saying that occupation itself is a waste
@@brianbcj meaning don’t bother going to school for it and pursuing it as a career it has a poor return on investment among other things
@@nsanenthembrane say that til u need one. I'M in the navy school is already paid for my brother
@@brianbcj that’s awesome! If your tuition is getting paid for then it’s a good field
@@nsanenthembrane you're quite wrong
Hey man, do you think Fresno State is a good school for DPT if I'm a Fresno state Ex. Sc. Graduate?
here in Colombia a PT has an income of 6.000 USD per year... what a difference.
6k a year???
Yes 6k dls in a year, also here in Mexico
Hi!
I really want to study PT but I suffer from hypermobility. I'm afraid my body will hurt and I can't do the job... Do you (or someone with experience about this subject) have some advise for me?
Thank you so much.
Hey bro I have elhers danlos syndrome. I had to make the conscious choice of switching over to Inpatient bc I could feel providing joint mobs on a daily basis was starting to hurt me. There’s still a lot of precautions I take but for the most part I’m cool. Now that I’m a professional and no longer a student I also focus a lot of strengthening for myself. There are other specialties within the field that require less physical effort on your part too, such as cardio. I always loved inpatient so the transition was easier than expexted( granted I was bummed a bit that I felt like I couldn’t keep at it at ortho) but nonetheless I’m happy now.
Manual therapy is phasing out imo. Not reimbursed in the OP setting very well. As well as therapist just not doing it as often as it used to be used. Some are heavy on it. Some don’t do it at all. You could make it in the OP setting.
The main reason a student should avoid PT as a career is the poor pay for number of years spent in school. Many bachelor degree majors pay more in salary than a doctorate of PT.
Thank God I didnt study PT in the states.
LOL it’s a long journey for sure
Hay quá
Your so cool 😂🔥🔥
I didnt know that a therapist was a doctor? In this day and age with chat gpt and A.i it certainly is not worth it. Remember PT was done way before A.i really took off.
Which leads to students with no PT experience or qualifications having more knowledge just by A.i.
Hay quá
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