Finally, the very needed video about all the menu options on a VNA. And it is based on the model that I have, which is another plus. Best wishes and greetings from Bosnia.
Ralph, you really are the Elmer's Elmer. This was so well done. Thank you! PS. I'd like to see the VNA used to check a plate choke for non-resonance in a tubed amplifier. We are truly blessed to have these powerful measuring tools that are inexpensive today and were completely out of reach just a few decades ago. 73 OM
Thank you so much! Hmmm... a plate choke ... that would be an R.F. Choke, an inductor specifically wound to prevent self resonance. I've used these before. I *might* even have one kicking around the "junk box." I will have to do some looking. I would think that this would be a similar measurement as we might make on any inductor with an eye toward self resonance. Hmmm ... I've added it to the video queue. I'm with you, these are way awesome instruments! 73's! 🙂
Thanks for these informative videos. I just got a older version of a nano VNA for test to see if I can use it as I want. $40 was what I could afford. There is so much food in this video so I have to look at it several times to understand. Big thanks.
Yes, there is a LOT to learn there, for sure! Be sure to work at understanding the meaning behind it all, too. That is why I point folks back to my other videos where I explain things in a lot more detail so they understand exactly what Reflection Coefficient is, for instance. 🙂
Definitely a worthwhile and useful video! I have been using mine for some time but still picked up useful/further descriptive information from you. Thanks Ralph & 73...
Ralph, you speak very clearly and in a way easily understood. I have been building a presentation and have used the explanations in your video to put my notes in plain English. I have a question please. My H4 has the addition of a "Measure" button on the home menu. Unfortunately, I have found no information on it. What are these tests and when would these tests used. Thank you!
Hmmmmmmmmmmm .... I really do not know. I took a look about and didn't find anything either. I guess you will have to experiment with it or ask the manufacturer. 🙂
I really appreciate your work. I've watched several of your videos and I think they are awesome. You make things easy enough so I can finally understand :) but they are also well detailed. I wish I had found your channel sooner.. THANKS, THANKS, THANKS! Btw, is there any video in which you cover smith chart usage for *through* measurements in details ?
Thank you and you are very very very welcome! 🙂 I have a whole series (and play list) on Smith Charts. I don't know if this meets what you are looking for. th-cam.com/play/PL27hd2cDvPRuIAUWTncVgjD5dEEmw6CPE.html 🙂
To my knowledge (at this moment), Smith Charts are only all about impedance, return loss, phase variance, reflection coefficient, VSWR and the like ... impedance related things things. They are used for impedance matching, VSWR reduction and such (see my series on them for more details). As I currently understand it, the Smith Chart cannot be used to predict signal levels and the like (through measurements). 🙂
Thanks for your answers :) Well, I have saw several of your smith chart videos in past weeks, and I found them enlighting. I Learned a lot about how to interpret them about reflective measurements, so thank you once again :) I also have read on internet that smith chart are not used for through (I mean S21 or S12) measurements indeed, but apparently NanoVNA allow for setting that kind of "trace" on CH1 and in this video, at about 17:00, you mention "transmission line impedence modifications", so I was asking for details about that thing.. But I might just have misunderstood that part :/
@@andreamerello6393 Yes. The Smith Chart is all about a "lossless transmission line." With a lossless transmission line, the SWR will remain absolutely the same regardless of frequency and where you sample it along the line (not entirely true with real life transmission lines, but still remains a reasonable assumption at lower frequencies e.g. HF). What DOES change is the composition of the impedance which gives rise to that VSWR. See the video on Transmission Line Realities (th-cam.com/video/Uok4gBD1B60/w-d-xo.html). So, there is an impedance transformation that occurs which the Smith Chart will help you predict. Using this fact, you can choose an impedance you like and use that fact to create a stub match to yield a 1:1 SWR (e.g. like in this video: th-cam.com/video/FvhvdGTrdX8/w-d-xo.html). Hope this helps! 🙂
you have this kindly concerned raised-eyebrow look on your face, letting me know it's indeed tricky material and my bafflement is valid lol, thankya my goodman!
I'd go as far as to say "it can't NOT be confusing (at first)." I'm attempting to characterize a Tesla coil using my new DG8SAQ VNWA 3, and its like "how many resonant frequencies does this have!?", turns out it has a series mode and 2 parallel mode resonant peaks. Persistent uncertainties (apparently i like a good challenge - eek), thus i arrived here. Thanks for lending me your perspective!
@@cold3lectric That is a very interesting project! My cousin created one of those MANY years ago. I never did anything like that. In some ways, that Tesla coil is like the RF choke they put in linear amplifiers. It is wound specifically to create several self-resonant frequencies. That's cool, too! 🙂
Great video, I'd be interested in your take on how and when you make the three types of impedance/component value measurements. The S11, and the two S21 (shunt,series) through measurements with the NanoVNA.. Thanks
Thanks! I'm noodling on the whole"through" measurement of components thing. They would form the input impedance to a frequency dependent voltage divider with the input impedance of port 2 (ch 1) being the output side of things. It'll be a very interesting study and experiment on the bench. Know that if I come up with something cool, there will be a video on it.🙂
@@eie_for_you Yes from what I've read, whether the impedance is much greater or less than the 50 ohm center impedance determines which S21 method is used, for the most accuracy. Copper Mountain has some good info... Cheers...
Thanks! You are right, it is a very powerful and affordable (now) tool! In the coming weeks I plan on demonstrating various measurements using it. This should be a lot of fun and *far* less complicated than the walk through.🙂
@@eie_for_you Well I'll be dipped my RigExpert AA-200 just went belly up it will no longer measure anything. Was in the process of measuring a delay line for a 40 phased array when it decided to quit working....Bummer! I hear the RigExperts are real sensitive to static electric charges so I may have somehow zapped it. Question now is do I finally go the VNA route?
@@U812-k7j Well ... a couple of things ... first, antennas build up static, so ALWAYS short and ground the antenna to dissipate the static before connecting it to any analyzer or nanoVNA....But you know that and, if you are like me, occasionally forget and (most of the time) get away with it. On the whole nanoVNA front. Their are a LOT of real cheap copy-cats out there ($49!). I paid a bit more for my nanoVNA V2 +4 version from nanorfe.com/nanovna-v2.html Then I got a small pelican case for it. If you are new to VNAs, I strongly recommend at least taking in my video on VNA terminology found here: th-cam.com/video/rRkrGE-55YA/w-d-xo.html There is a LOT to learn, (The entire VNA Playlist is here: th-cam.com/play/PL27hd2cDvPRubW4VEujzoEFwo2m9PpoFZ.html) Once you get your nanoVNA, then the nanoVNA menu walk through will help a lot (th-cam.com/video/_96N3oGFatE/w-d-xo.html). Take the time to learn your nanoVNA, it will become a valuable tool for you. If I can help anywhere along the way, let me know! 🙂
@@eie_for_you Hi Ralph, Well I decided to go with the Rigexpert AA-230BLE this time just seems to fit my needs right now. More than likely I will purchase a Nano VNA in the near future both devices have a place in the shack. The weird thing about my AA-200 failing is I wasn't even measuring directly to an antenna I was measuring a delay line that was on the bench disconnected from anything that may have had static build up. I was standing on a carpet floor maybe my body itself had a static charge from standing on the carpet who knows. Sometimes its best to not ask questions and just move on.
Another great video to recommend to my students. I already have the NanoVNA that stops at 900 MHz and I managed to avoid a cheap clone. Can I ask where you bought yours which I assume is "genuine"?
I bought mine directly from the "Official Store" link from the "Official Site" which brought me to here: www.tindie.com/stores/hcxqsgroup/? Good call ... avoiding the cheap clones. 🙂
It depends on what you are trying to do. If you are looking to monitor the swr of your antenna while applying real transmitter power, then you are set. Be aware that, depending on the frequency and the make/model you may be introducing it's own SWR and loss into the transmission line. (see my video on the subject: th-cam.com/video/1fpoViuxn3c/w-d-xo.html) If you are doing antenna creation and characterization, then the nanoVNA is most definitely they way to go. Plus it will do a **LOT** of other jobs for you,too. 🙂
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Finally, the very needed video about all the menu options on a VNA.
And it is based on the model that I have, which is another plus.
Best wishes and greetings from Bosnia.
I'm so very glad that you were blessed by this video! Yeah, without a guide some of this stuff is pretty mysterious. Hvala 🙂
What a great video. Very informative. Thank you! And thank you for not rushing!
Thank you ... and you are very welcome! 🙂
Ralph, you really are the Elmer's Elmer. This was so well done. Thank you! PS. I'd like to see the VNA used to check a plate choke for non-resonance in a tubed amplifier. We are truly blessed to have these powerful measuring tools that are inexpensive today and were completely out of reach just a few decades ago. 73 OM
Thank you so much! Hmmm... a plate choke ... that would be an R.F. Choke, an inductor specifically wound to prevent self resonance. I've used these before. I *might* even have one kicking around the "junk box." I will have to do some looking.
I would think that this would be a similar measurement as we might make on any inductor with an eye toward self resonance. Hmmm ...
I've added it to the video queue.
I'm with you, these are way awesome instruments! 73's! 🙂
@@eie_for_you I think this would be an excellent video for sure!
@@SpinStar1956 I'm looking forward to making it. 🙂
Thanks for these informative videos. I just got a older version of a nano VNA for test to see if I can use it as I want. $40 was what I could afford. There is so much food in this video so I have to look at it several times to understand. Big thanks.
Yes, there is a LOT to learn there, for sure! Be sure to work at understanding the meaning behind it all, too. That is why I point folks back to my other videos where I explain things in a lot more detail so they understand exactly what Reflection Coefficient is, for instance. 🙂
Definitely a worthwhile and useful video!
I have been using mine for some time but still picked up useful/further descriptive information from you.
Thanks Ralph & 73...
Thanks so much! I'm really glad there was something there for you! That's my goal. 🙂
A very educational video! Thank you! This is going to take a few more replays to get everything absorbed in to my brain! 73
You are very welcome! Yeah, there is a lot to take in. You will get it! 🙂
Ralph, you speak very clearly and in a way easily understood. I have been building a presentation and have used the explanations in your video to put my notes in plain English. I have a question please. My H4 has the addition of a "Measure" button on the home menu. Unfortunately, I have found no information on it. What are these tests and when would these tests used. Thank you!
Hmmmmmmmmmmm .... I really do not know. I took a look about and didn't find anything either. I guess you will have to experiment with it or ask the manufacturer. 🙂
I really appreciate your work. I've watched several of your videos and I think they are awesome. You make things easy enough so I can finally understand :) but they are also well detailed. I wish I had found your channel sooner.. THANKS, THANKS, THANKS!
Btw, is there any video in which you cover smith chart usage for *through* measurements in details ?
Thank you and you are very very very welcome! 🙂
I have a whole series (and play list) on Smith Charts. I don't know if this meets what you are looking for.
th-cam.com/play/PL27hd2cDvPRuIAUWTncVgjD5dEEmw6CPE.html
🙂
To my knowledge (at this moment), Smith Charts are only all about impedance, return loss, phase variance, reflection coefficient, VSWR and the like ... impedance related things things. They are used for impedance matching, VSWR reduction and such (see my series on them for more details).
As I currently understand it, the Smith Chart cannot be used to predict signal levels and the like (through measurements). 🙂
Thanks for your answers :) Well, I have saw several of your smith chart videos in past weeks, and I found them enlighting. I Learned a lot about how to interpret them about reflective measurements, so thank you once again :) I also have read on internet that smith chart are not used for through (I mean S21 or S12) measurements indeed, but apparently NanoVNA allow for setting that kind of "trace" on CH1 and in this video, at about 17:00, you mention "transmission line impedence modifications", so I was asking for details about that thing.. But I might just have misunderstood that part :/
@@andreamerello6393 Yes. The Smith Chart is all about a "lossless transmission line." With a lossless transmission line, the SWR will remain absolutely the same regardless of frequency and where you sample it along the line (not entirely true with real life transmission lines, but still remains a reasonable assumption at lower frequencies e.g. HF). What DOES change is the composition of the impedance which gives rise to that VSWR. See the video on Transmission Line Realities (th-cam.com/video/Uok4gBD1B60/w-d-xo.html). So, there is an impedance transformation that occurs which the Smith Chart will help you predict. Using this fact, you can choose an impedance you like and use that fact to create a stub match to yield a 1:1 SWR (e.g. like in this video: th-cam.com/video/FvhvdGTrdX8/w-d-xo.html).
Hope this helps! 🙂
you have this kindly concerned raised-eyebrow look on your face, letting me know it's indeed tricky material and my bafflement is valid lol, thankya my goodman!
You are very welcome! Yeah, there is a LOT there and it *can* be confusing. 🙂
I'd go as far as to say "it can't NOT be confusing (at first)."
I'm attempting to characterize a Tesla coil using my new DG8SAQ VNWA 3, and its like "how many resonant frequencies does this have!?", turns out it has a series mode and 2 parallel mode resonant peaks. Persistent uncertainties (apparently i like a good challenge - eek), thus i arrived here. Thanks for lending me your perspective!
@@cold3lectric That is a very interesting project! My cousin created one of those MANY years ago. I never did anything like that.
In some ways, that Tesla coil is like the RF choke they put in linear amplifiers. It is wound specifically to create several self-resonant frequencies. That's cool, too! 🙂
Outstanding video Ralph; however, the yellow pencil annunciator frequency may have been set a little too high....LOL!!!
Many thanks!
73' de K4WRF
Thanks man!
The "yellow pencil annunciator frequency"... yup, a bit out of range of the antenna, I think! ...LOL! 🙂
Great video, I'd be interested in your take on how and when you make the three types of impedance/component value measurements. The S11, and the two S21 (shunt,series) through measurements with the NanoVNA.. Thanks
Thanks! I'm noodling on the whole"through" measurement of components thing. They would form the input impedance to a frequency dependent voltage divider with the input impedance of port 2 (ch 1) being the output side of things. It'll be a very interesting study and experiment on the bench.
Know that if I come up with something cool, there will be a video on it.🙂
@@eie_for_you Yes from what I've read, whether the impedance is much greater or less than the 50 ohm center impedance determines which S21 method is used, for the most accuracy. Copper Mountain has some good info... Cheers...
@@wb7ond Hmmmm...I'll have to check that out when I get to investigating this. Thanks! 🙂
Nice video Ralph personally I don't own a VNA just a antenna analyzer maybe someday I'll pick one of these up looks to be a powerful tool.
Thanks! You are right, it is a very powerful and affordable (now) tool!
In the coming weeks I plan on demonstrating various measurements using it. This should be a lot of fun and *far* less complicated than the walk through.🙂
@@eie_for_you Well I'll be dipped my RigExpert AA-200 just went belly up it will no longer measure anything. Was in the process of measuring a delay line for a 40 phased array when it decided to quit working....Bummer! I hear the RigExperts are real sensitive to static electric charges so I may have somehow zapped it.
Question now is do I finally go the VNA route?
@@U812-k7j Well ... a couple of things ... first, antennas build up static, so ALWAYS short and ground the antenna to dissipate the static before connecting it to any analyzer or nanoVNA....But you know that and, if you are like me, occasionally forget and (most of the time) get away with it.
On the whole nanoVNA front. Their are a LOT of real cheap copy-cats out there ($49!). I paid a bit more for my nanoVNA V2 +4 version from
nanorfe.com/nanovna-v2.html
Then I got a small pelican case for it.
If you are new to VNAs, I strongly recommend at least taking in my video on VNA terminology found here:
th-cam.com/video/rRkrGE-55YA/w-d-xo.html
There is a LOT to learn,
(The entire VNA Playlist is here: th-cam.com/play/PL27hd2cDvPRubW4VEujzoEFwo2m9PpoFZ.html)
Once you get your nanoVNA, then the nanoVNA menu walk through will help a lot (th-cam.com/video/_96N3oGFatE/w-d-xo.html). Take the time to learn your nanoVNA, it will become a valuable tool for you.
If I can help anywhere along the way, let me know! 🙂
@@eie_for_you Hi Ralph,
Well I decided to go with the Rigexpert AA-230BLE this time just seems to fit my needs right now. More than likely I will purchase a Nano VNA in the near future both devices have a place in the shack. The weird thing about my AA-200 failing is I wasn't even measuring directly to an antenna I was measuring a delay line that was on the bench disconnected from anything that may have had static build up. I was standing on a carpet floor maybe my body itself had a static charge from standing on the carpet who knows. Sometimes its best to not ask questions and just move on.
@@U812-k7j Enjoy your Rig Expert. Let me know how it works for you. 🙂
Another great video to recommend to my students. I already have the NanoVNA that stops at 900 MHz and I managed to avoid a cheap clone.
Can I ask where you bought yours which I assume is "genuine"?
I bought mine directly from the "Official Store" link from the "Official Site" which brought me to here: www.tindie.com/stores/hcxqsgroup/?
Good call ... avoiding the cheap clones. 🙂
@@eie_for_you TNX!
@@IK8XOO--Paolo You are welcome! 🙂
👍Thank you sir.
You are very welcome, my friend! 🙂
Thanks!
You are very welcome! 🙂
I just ordered an SWR meter to use on my 2-meter stuff. Did I waste my money?
It depends on what you are trying to do. If you are looking to monitor the swr of your antenna while applying real transmitter power, then you are set. Be aware that, depending on the frequency and the make/model you may be introducing it's own SWR and loss into the transmission line. (see my video on the subject: th-cam.com/video/1fpoViuxn3c/w-d-xo.html)
If you are doing antenna creation and characterization, then the nanoVNA is most definitely they way to go. Plus it will do a **LOT** of other jobs for you,too. 🙂