To me it's like Demise used groose as a base for his incarnations of hatred. Which is incredibly messed up because Groose ends up becoming friends with Zelda and Link.
They probably did this with the intent of humanizing Ganondorf more. In Wind Waker it was hinted at that he actually cared about the Gerudos, because he talked about the hellish conditions of the Gerudo Desert and that he envied Hyrule's prosperity and better living conditions. If he envied those conditions, why wouldn't he have just moved to Hyrule and abandon his people? Unless he cared about his people and wanted to expand their territory to have better living conditions. In Ocarina of Time, it was shown that after taking over Hyrule the Gerudos were still living in the desert, which is why many people refuted Ganondorf's humane side, but you have to factor in the Gerudos did not exactly like Ganondorf. They thought he was a power mad psycho, so they probably turned against him and stood against him after he conquered Hyrule. They were essentially rebels to their own leader, so why would they be living on the new lands acquired for their people, rather than just trying to keep the original land and stay out of Ganondorf's path/try to stop him? So, they probably wanted to humanize him further by showing that even though his original ancestor was kind of a jerk at first, he wasn't evil. In Twilight Princess, they also humanized him a bit more because Din just gave him the Triforce of Power. He was chosen by a goddess to wield a piece of the triforce. Why would Din want to give that to Ganondorf if she thought he was nothing but pure evil? So, it is kind of neat how they have been throwing in hints here and there that he isn't just some embodiment of pure evil.
Ever since I played Skyward I sensed that Groose was an ancestor of Ganondorf, because it's so obvious to put these 3 characters and make the reference so clear, red hair, yellow eyes come on, it's the trinity of the past.
a meticulous fan would notice it, I hope that in tears of the kingdom they explain the origin of the gerudos or Ganondorf, for some reason skyward only came out before having TOTK, I played it again and noticed many things that could be important for what's to come.
The thing is, it's not only link and Zelda's relationship that makes groose jealous. You seem to leave out the fact that groose is upset that he has to put so much work into being a knight, and link is really lazy AF and everything just comes naturally to him. Everything groose had and did, he had to train, work hard for and earn, Link slept in everyday and was just naturally talented. Demise I think saw this, and because of that, was able to latch on, and that's why the curse continues through groose's bloodline, and ganondorf is absolutely the reincarnation of groose infected with demise's malice.
I like this! This fills the gap I felt for grooses character. I hated that you get such a strong "rival" for a game that's supposed to take place 1st in the overall time line, and he gets left out of the entire series from then on out. Now it feels like grooses actions actually had an effect on the time line as well and is still very much somehow still apart of it! Cool theory dude!
Before I ever played Skyward sword I only knew it was a prequel and some tidbits here and there. I assumed Groose was the origin of Ganon. Its obvious to me they were intentionally hinting at this. The 3 characters of Link, Zelda and Ganon have always appeared as tied to the three parts of the Triforce and these three in Skyloft have the same sort of connection to each other. Then you add in the physical similarities to Ganon you mention here. Demise realizing he can reincarnate himself later and having specific interactions with Groose. I like the irony as well of Groose growing as a person but his progeny taking on his darker side again. I dont think its a hot take or stretch to say this was intended to be hinted at.
I never noticed the music thing! That's so cool! And i mean... of course is just a theory and just to play around with what if, I know that Groose is just very similar to Ganondorf because the Zelda team wanted to include Ganondorf at least as a reference somewhere in the game to always have the trio even if sentimentally and by tradition, and probably nothing else. Even if it's just that, i'm glad they do this kind of things then because we also like this characters, and at least i miss them if they are not there. We can keep making stories about them and speculate because they are part of what forms the legend. And i like that even subtly they play around with the what if's too, like with Groose as a What if Ganondorf was more like a school bully, or a friend.
I had the thought that groose started the Herudo line, but it didn't click with me that Groose himself might be vessal Demise reincarnates as until today. I hate it 😭
@@CommerceAudio Groose slowed is similar to Ganondorfs theme. I don't remember the exact speed you need but try to aim for the tempo used for the organs in ocarina of time.
I think this is less deep than a theory even makes it out to be. Looking at it from a character design and writing perspective, it's just clear the developers were, at the very least, trying to draw some parallels between groose and ganondorf. The developers focused heavily on the "first in the timeline" part of the game, so to me, it seems like they 100% intended any subtext with groose.
Ganondorf acts completely different from Groose. He doesnt even Love Zelda (which would be Pedophile to be honest Because she is mostly a kid or a teen and he is physically a 30-40 year old dude in most cases), and then Ganondorf isnt a bully, he is a powerhungry maniac, he only kidnaps Zelda for uptaining the Power she posesses or to prevent her being a threat to his plans. Ganondorf isnt a Bowser-Knock-Off as everyone claims, he is pure evil in Flesh
i see it like this. ganondorf is not actually a reincarnation of groose. the ganondorfs are grooses descendants, and demise inserts his spirit into the males of grooses bloodline. due to it being customary that gerudo males are named ganondorf, we have a series of very similar gerudo men in the same bloodline inhabited by the same spirit, but they are not actual reincarnations of one person. this is why the other ganondorfs dont particularly care about zelda, only her triforce.
To me it's like Demise used groose as a base for his incarnations of hatred. Which is incredibly messed up because Groose ends up becoming friends with Zelda and Link.
They probably did this with the intent of humanizing Ganondorf more. In Wind Waker it was hinted at that he actually cared about the Gerudos, because he talked about the hellish conditions of the Gerudo Desert and that he envied Hyrule's prosperity and better living conditions. If he envied those conditions, why wouldn't he have just moved to Hyrule and abandon his people? Unless he cared about his people and wanted to expand their territory to have better living conditions. In Ocarina of Time, it was shown that after taking over Hyrule the Gerudos were still living in the desert, which is why many people refuted Ganondorf's humane side, but you have to factor in the Gerudos did not exactly like Ganondorf. They thought he was a power mad psycho, so they probably turned against him and stood against him after he conquered Hyrule. They were essentially rebels to their own leader, so why would they be living on the new lands acquired for their people, rather than just trying to keep the original land and stay out of Ganondorf's path/try to stop him? So, they probably wanted to humanize him further by showing that even though his original ancestor was kind of a jerk at first, he wasn't evil. In Twilight Princess, they also humanized him a bit more because Din just gave him the Triforce of Power. He was chosen by a goddess to wield a piece of the triforce. Why would Din want to give that to Ganondorf if she thought he was nothing but pure evil? So, it is kind of neat how they have been throwing in hints here and there that he isn't just some embodiment of pure evil.
Ever since I played Skyward I sensed that Groose was an ancestor of Ganondorf, because it's so obvious to put these 3 characters and make the reference so clear, red hair, yellow eyes come on, it's the trinity of the past.
a meticulous fan would notice it, I hope that in tears of the kingdom they explain the origin of the gerudos or Ganondorf, for some reason skyward only came out before having TOTK, I played it again and noticed many things that could be important for what's to come.
The thing is, it's not only link and Zelda's relationship that makes groose jealous. You seem to leave out the fact that groose is upset that he has to put so much work into being a knight, and link is really lazy AF and everything just comes naturally to him.
Everything groose had and did, he had to train, work hard for and earn, Link slept in everyday and was just naturally talented.
Demise I think saw this, and because of that, was able to latch on, and that's why the curse continues through groose's bloodline, and ganondorf is absolutely the reincarnation of groose infected with demise's malice.
No, simply because Groose would never have hair that bad.
I like this! This fills the gap I felt for grooses character. I hated that you get such a strong "rival" for a game that's supposed to take place 1st in the overall time line, and he gets left out of the entire series from then on out. Now it feels like grooses actions actually had an effect on the time line as well and is still very much somehow still apart of it! Cool theory dude!
Before I ever played Skyward sword I only knew it was a prequel and some tidbits here and there. I assumed Groose was the origin of Ganon. Its obvious to me they were intentionally hinting at this. The 3 characters of Link, Zelda and Ganon have always appeared as tied to the three parts of the Triforce and these three in Skyloft have the same sort of connection to each other. Then you add in the physical similarities to Ganon you mention here. Demise realizing he can reincarnate himself later and having specific interactions with Groose. I like the irony as well of Groose growing as a person but his progeny taking on his darker side again. I dont think its a hot take or stretch to say this was intended to be hinted at.
I never noticed the music thing! That's so cool!
And i mean... of course is just a theory and just to play around with what if, I know that Groose is just very similar to Ganondorf because the Zelda team wanted to include Ganondorf at least as a reference somewhere in the game to always have the trio even if sentimentally and by tradition, and probably nothing else. Even if it's just that, i'm glad they do this kind of things then because we also like this characters, and at least i miss them if they are not there. We can keep making stories about them and speculate because they are part of what forms the legend. And i like that even subtly they play around with the what if's too, like with Groose as a What if Ganondorf was more like a school bully, or a friend.
I had the thought that groose started the Herudo line, but it didn't click with me that Groose himself might be vessal Demise reincarnates as until today. I hate it 😭
Hot tip, slow Groose theme down.
What does it give you? I can’t figure it out.
@@CommerceAudio Groose slowed is similar to Ganondorfs theme. I don't remember the exact speed you need but try to aim for the tempo used for the organs in ocarina of time.
What a good point, now I'm even more excited to see the story of Tears of the Kingdom
Everyday i hope they bring Groose back to help us fight ganondorf/demise and then we have the power of all three! It would be phenomenal :>
I think this is less deep than a theory even makes it out to be. Looking at it from a character design and writing perspective, it's just clear the developers were, at the very least, trying to draw some parallels between groose and ganondorf. The developers focused heavily on the "first in the timeline" part of the game, so to me, it seems like they 100% intended any subtext with groose.
Ganondorf acts completely different from Groose.
He doesnt even Love Zelda (which would be Pedophile to be honest Because she is mostly a kid or a teen and he is physically a 30-40 year old dude in most cases), and then Ganondorf isnt a bully, he is a powerhungry maniac, he only kidnaps Zelda for uptaining the Power she posesses or to prevent her being a threat to his plans.
Ganondorf isnt a Bowser-Knock-Off as everyone claims, he is pure evil in Flesh
Why can't Ganondorf be a pedophile? He is evil personified isn't he?
@@Mr.Smiley_Ji mean ganondorf never once says he loves zelda. he just wants to take the triforce of wisdom
i see it like this. ganondorf is not actually a reincarnation of groose. the ganondorfs are grooses descendants, and demise inserts his spirit into the males of grooses bloodline. due to it being customary that gerudo males are named ganondorf, we have a series of very similar gerudo men in the same bloodline inhabited by the same spirit, but they are not actual reincarnations of one person. this is why the other ganondorfs dont particularly care about zelda, only her triforce.
didn't he say this is Groose land when he got to the surface too?