Buy them every time you see them and use them basically every turn, I had the same issue until I literally just started buying out every vendor on sight
@@jamesbailey5350 The "L" in trying to correct someone's pronunciation with your specific regional pronunciation in a reply to an unrelated comment is the other kind of L
While robbing every merchant blind of all their possessions, I always snag their arrows too, because those are good to hoard in my box in case I ever need them one day
I put them in the box I keep right next to my bucket of fish full of the inhabitants of the goblin camp from act 1. I'd bring them with me, but I need inventory space to hold all the cultists of Moonrise Tower and stuff them into this barrel. But of course, nothing compares to the Heavy Chest full of Ornate and Gilded chests full of miscellaneous, unsorted weapons, armor, and junk I pull out then slam down on some merchant's counter before extorting them for every single gold coin, healing potion, camp supply, and moderately intriguing magic item they have. By the way. For whatever reason, merchants seem to put containers of items into their personal inventory instead of wherever shop inventory goes. If you know in advance which merchants you're going to ice later (or just male some good predictions), you can sell that crate of goblin weapons like 4 or 5 times. Just. Picking the half ton crate off the corpse is sometimes difficult...
Roaring thunder is extremely underrated, it shouldn't be anywhere bellow S or A tier. Even with such low DC, it can push back targets that cannot be targeted, throw off the cliff multiple targets at the same time and gives the ability to everyone in your group to push back targets from bigger distances than gust of wind and without wasting spell slots. They also have better control over the position everyone will be thrown (in the video it states that you are supposed to hit the target which is NOT how these are meant to be used). A fighter can throw 3 of these arrows per turn, meaning that even strong targets will fail the SAVE and die. These can make the slayer, balthazar and so many other fights so much easier.
It's possible I should have been more clear in what I was saying - it's not that you're supposed to shoot them at enemies, it's that if you do, you can't usually use the knockback, and if you don't, you're losing out on damage. In your example of a high level fighter, you're probably giving up on 100-200 damage for a small chance to knock enemies back - why not just attack them? It will just kill them faster. The sanctuaried bhaalists *are* a real use case, but by that point in the game you'll have way better tools to deal with them (including either smokepowder or many targets arrows if you want an arrow-based solution)
@@Cephalopocalypse Hmm. I mean, you can certainly use the knockback effect if you are shooting a creature. Not sure about console, but on PC you can fine tune the direction the enemy will fly based on where the arrow is placed on the enemy's body (and get minor adjustments on nearby enemies too). Between move speed and arrow placement, you're getting at least a 60-90 degree aiming arc to send the enemy flying. If there's a ledge nearby an enemy, it's just a ~50% chance to just kill the enemy on hit (so you can redirect the rest of your attacks elsewhere). Can blast them into other walls/hazards as well. Definitely think this one is being slept on too, especially considering arrows that are good for 1 or 2 fights are ranked much higher. It's normal damage, but with a chance to instantly kill the enemy if there's a chasm nearby (and there are lots of chasms in the game).
Definitely not D tier, IMO. They're good for knocking mid level horde type enemies off edges for instant kills. Ones that usually have no good loot but can cause a lot of offensive damage and tie up your party with their attacks and positioning.
@@radiantflux1432 Gaseous Form is IMO the best option for that part of the game. I'm pretty sure you can remain in the gas form and interact with all the chests, so you just walk from vault to vault.
One of my favorite things to do with the elemental arrows is to shoot with frost, fire, then lightning. That way, the enemy gets possibly proned, wet, and then takes double damage from lightning.
Lightning arrows following a Rain Spell (everyone wet and vulnerable to lightning) are instant Damage Multipliers. My 2c.... S Tier. Especially Act 1 & 2. IMO.... They are also the "rarest" of the Elemental Arrows.... which I feel certain is intentional in the design of the game.
I love using Roaring Thunder in the Moonrise assault to get the archers out of the rafters and make them fall all the way down to the floor and take a ton of damage. That's about it.
I think I would add my voice to the comments calling for Roaring Thunder to be higher than D tier. Basically, on PC, moving the mouse, you can choose to hit "different" parts of the same enemy, still getting the damage but getting a different angle to potentially move that enemy. This had made arrow of roaring thunder a regular default of mine for certain high stakes fights (e.g. underdark boat fight, Nere/Duergar fight, can use while clearing out moonrise towers main floor on archers in the rafters, etc.). That said, I think intelligent use of them for the normal amount of damage plus the chance to reposition is just strictly better than, say, arrow of lightning. Certainly not competing for A or S tier though.
Agreed. Having an arrow that can do several character-turns worth of clearing whatever chaff is shooting at you from rafters, higher cliffs, another boat, or whatever is worth the price of admission. They also usually don’t have loot you need so there’s only a small price to pay for seeing a bunch of enemies fall to their certain death is just. So. Satisfying.
Probably the best Moment I had in this Game was when I fought Karniss in my Honour Mode run. He was the only Enemy left and had just cast sanctuary, so I couldn’t think of anything better than shooting a rolling Thunder Arrow next to him. It completely yeeted him off the Roof he was standing on, killing him although having around 80 health left. Had me completely shook for a Moment.
@@meekrab9027 Consistency is a real strength when it comes to high-risk situations. It's really more a thing early game where a single missed attack can monumentally mess up your turn/output, but even late game certain...fights have some brutal time limitations.
I’ve been able to reliably reproduce this, but if you have surprise and the auto-crit from assassin, EVERY SINGLE DAMAGE INSTANCE of arrow of many targets is a critical hit. So you crit on the initial hit, all the riders, crit on the second target plus all the riders, crit on the third target plus all the riders, and the fourth target as well. With Titanstring and Giant Elixir, strange conduit, the gloves that give sneak attack force damage, the sword that gives +D6 Necrotic damage on enemies that haven’t acted yet, elemental weapon from the drake throat Glaive, and sharpshooter I’m doing absolutely NUTS damage. 70+ damage per target, and with action surge or war priest charges I’m doing that 2-3 times on the first turn of combat. NOTHING can stand up to that kinda damage.
The arrow of transposition has one very specific usecase that you didn't mention, that i find comes up almost every single encounter: The ability to teleport your Barbarian who wants to use their first bonus action of combat to rage right into the face of the enemies. Since barbarians also get extra attack, this often lets you get out a much higher-value melee attack on the first turn of combat, and is especially valuable for tiger barbarians who can just immediately bleed 3 enemies, giving them disadvantage on con saves as well as activating all the other effects that apply when attacking bleeding characters, such as BOOOAL's benediction or some aspects of the beast etc.
@@henriquealves5740 Yes, extra attack works on melee, ranged and throws. So even if you throw a potion to heal an ally you still get an extra attack from it.
I understand the reasoning for the roaring thunder arrow being D, but I find so much utility out of these personally. Even if it forgoes damage, I often do the ground target to push enemies off of cliffs. Even with the low save DC, getting 2 or 3 attempts per character (past level 5) makes it pretty likely that at least one of them knocks an enemy off a cliff, killing them instantly. While Thunderwave, Gust of Wind, or shove can do this with better action economy, the ability to do this from range gives a lot of utility to the roaring thunder arrow and makes it B tier for me personally. Not that I'm saying your reasoning is incorrect! Just that I personally go to use these a lot.
Acid arrows are especially useful if your melee characters are running GWM. That -2 to enemy AC really helps with landing those big hits more consistently
When using the Titanstring bow, the illmater arrow also reapply your strength modifier an additional time to the damage. Assuming you are using a strength elixir this mean 1d4 +5 they can also safely be used against opponent even if you have melee teammate in there without the risk of friendly fire. One of my most used arrow for act 1 & 2.
Love these consumable lists, I always learn so much valuable information! The elixir video actually changed the way I play the game, thinking of how my characters will use their “elixir slot” is much more efficient than trying to remember which one to use for when I’m in a tight spot
About transposition and bonus actions. Any character can have a hand crossbow, and thus make ranged attacks as a bonus action. Thus, many of the utility arrows are essentially "free" as some classes like wizard don't consistently spend their bonus actions. So for the characters that want it, the transposition arrow is a bonus action teleport.
I think that's literally the only fight I've ever used them in, and it's against enemies who have Sanctuary so you can't directly damage them anyway. Super niche case in a single fight, and generally underwhelming everywhere else. D-tier seems fair, especially since Gust of Wind will knock those helpers off without the DC-12 save.
Yeah! I think that's pretty much their only real use-case in the game (some people have mentioned the Nere fight, but I think that's mostly trauma from being knocked into lava themselves :P). By that point you should have much better tools to deal with those enemies though (including smokepowder arrows and many targets arrows if you want an arrow-based solution)
@@Cephalopocalypse I've used them exactly once, because I got surprised by mimics in the Underdark and the DC was 5% higher than a shove on one of them near a cliff, rolled the 35% twice and got it on the second time... I can't really think of any situations where Thorn Whip or any of the other forced movement options aren't entirely preferable. The effect is good, but it's the worst example of the effect.
Orin fight, Nere fight, Gnoll fight, the Duergar boat fight, the phase spider matriarch fight, the massive moonlight towers fight, Saving Smythn inspiration fight, etc. The roaring thunder arrows also synergize incredibly well with the Hunger of Hadar spell. Warlocks can Eldritch blast a foe back into the black mist, Barbarians can throw them back in directly but most everyone else can use these Roaring thunder arrows to push enemies back into the damage.
Just finished up a solo gloomstalker/assassin playthrough with heavy arrow usage and it was so much fun. Sneak in with an arrow of many targets, invis, repeat. Packs just fall over. I think i did the whole goblin camp with them only getting a total of 4 attacksin before i was able to sneak/invis away. Highly recommend, so fun.
And yet, the ENEMY with Roaring Thunder arrows somehow always manage to kill half the party, including inexplicably the character with the HIGHEST strength. I swear, the computer cheats with that freaking arrow every time.
The Death Shepards can't be silenced and apparently can bring back ghouls an infinite number of times even though you burnt the corpse. Which if a corpse is burnt you can't use speak to dead on a corpse. "Too damaged".
A couple of things: the arrow of arcane interference does eork, but only if you’re before the targeted enemy in initiative, which will cause them to be silenced on their turn. Secondly, arrow of many targets can hit enemies in sanctuary if they’re near the original target as it works like an aoe. (It even hit invisible creatures, tho idk if that’s intended). Cheers mate.
Roaring thunder arrow will always be S tier in my book because of the slayer fight in act 3. I had run out of aoe and thats the only thing that kept me in my honour run. deals very well with targets that have sanctuary on them.
The arrow of many targets can be powerful for Crowd Control as well. I ran Astarion with the gloves of power, and bow of the banshee. Using things like drow poison, an attack could have a chance to bane, knock out, and frighten 4 enemies.
I have never used the Salving Arrow, thus placing it D tier for me, and have used many a Roaring Thunder to end or shorten fights near ledges, pushing that one up to B tier.
Dragon Slaying arrows are mostly useless. You will face only TWO dragons in the entire game, assuming you take on Ansur, unless you also piss off Qudenos, for some reason. And the dragon at the top of the netherbrain, you don't even need to fight at all.
Disagree about the thunder arrow. It's easily saved by the important enemies but it's incredibly useful in dispatching the minions in a huge bunch. Normally they are week and you could shoot them one by one by one thunder arrow takes care of most of them since so many fights are on cliffs and stuff.
I got so annoyed with it after a while, and gave up on using them.recently I was trying to use them to push Dame away from the bone chill effect, and ofc she saved like 4 of those
Yeah, arrow of many targets on a character that has a bow with cold damage (via drakethroat glave) and the snowburst ring is too good. Not just awesome damage but great control too. So many proned enemies.
roaring thunder, bard flourish push, battlemaster prone/push is how i discovered the much fun sport of using bhaalists for bhaal ball. monstrosity good for one boss fight. many targets sooo broken
i think you are doing a disservice to the ilmater arrow, because some fights have healing numbers that are extremely high. myrkul for example heals for about 50~, that is from my experience much more than a typical undead slaying arrow and denying that amount of healing can single handedly carry fights that do it. and i dont think its really comparable to the bone chill cantrip because not only is it a attack action instead of a cast action, but also it just happens along with the normal attack while a caster would need to interrupt their plans for that turn to cast it, the level of ease that archers can do it with essentially means if you have a archer in your party no enemies can heal for the entire game.
My main issue with all the arrows that create hazard surfaces is that the moment battle is done all my companions will go out of their way to walk through those surfaces 😡
The number of times roaring thunder saved me. It's not the strongest, but the most memorable watching the big boss fly off cliffs. Like the construct at the top of the mages tower was just unbelievable saving my run. Love the teir list
I personally think roaring thunder to be at least C tier, I would place it in B tier. The reason for this, is that it's D tier in some encounters and S tier in other encounters, so when it's good it's really good so definitely they are worth carrying around. They are good against group of targets that can be thrown off-cliff, as some of them will fail the strength check, they are good against targets that are hard to hit, which plenty of honor mode enemies have like legendary resistances and damage reductions, they are good to clean some conditions on a party member while also attempting to get an enemy off him, like sleep, and, probably the reason so many comments write about it being S tier, they are so freaking fun to use and it feels awesome when they do work, in hand-sight it's a game and it should be enjoyed. Also, even though they don't work all the time on high-threat targets, sometimes you have no real options other then running from an encounter, so gambling on throwing some high-str character with roaring thunder before running from the encounter can definetly make them useful.
Roaring thunder is criminally underrated here. The missed damage opportunities argument assumes the melee attacker is able to get in melee range (not counting opportunity attacks in order to do so). It's a guaranteed check for knockback even if you miss the shot (which you shouldnt be using for damage in the first place) and usually your martials arent going to be dealing big damage with other arrows either. It's a great way to zone enemies pushing them back to difficult terrain like spike growth or back down to lower ground after they spent the turn dashing up. Roaring thunder means your martials are able to support your ranged squishies without having to take melee damage. An example is fighting steel watchers - you'd rather stay far away letting your fighters soak their ranged attacks instead of going melee and likely getting maimed. Throughout that fight, you could continually attempt to boop them into a chasm for a free kill, or in general for a martial character to get a quick free kill while waiting for enemies to approach your party.
The good thing abiut fire arrows is that I oftentimes use them when I for some reason forgot a few explosives next to an enemy and they need some ignition. Makes me technically kill Ansur with 1 Fire Arrow.
The slaying arrows are really straining your (reasonable) policy to not mention spoilers. Putting Dragon Arrows in A tier when there are 2 fights against Dragons (one of which you can also use the cheaper Undead slaying ones) is a bit of a stretch to me.
First playthrough I eagerly gathered every kind of arrow and ended up with huge stockpiles because I never used them. Now I don't go out of my way to get them, but sometimes use them.
Roaring thunder was my favorite arrow. I loved using those to shoot enemies off high ground by shooting behind a target. Now they took fall damage and are probe and vulnerable for my melee allies to maul them. Some pets, barbarians and druid transformations are very grateful to receive a prone target delivered to them on a silver platter. I also used it to help an ally disengage. Sometimes when you get ambushed the one attack to disengage instead of all attacks to disengage is a better slternative to creating distance. Or when a melee enemy was far enough away I could push them back further out to force them to dash me instead of attacking me. You can also use it to set up a future attack, grouping enemies and pushing back NPC allies so your magic user can cast a fireball and not risk any friendly fire. Roaring thunder is an arrow that rewards you for map awareness and positioning. I made a lot of use out of it, but its not as useful as the elemental arrows but more relevant than those slaying arrows. Roaring Thunder is atleast C tier for me.
I use darkness arrows to steal from vendors since the area of effect is much smaller than darkness spell. You’re obscured while attempting to steal and you’re able to steal a few times while in turn based mode.
There are many encounters where Rolling thunder arrows are supreme. The very First usage I got out of one was blowing the bugbear goblin Boss of Act 1 from the rafters he climbed on in order to get to my Party that I had positioned there to rain down death on all of the enemies. At that point of the game, dealing over 80 damage in one action with a level 4 or 5 Party (which I had been then) is very difficult - it was brilliant there. There are enough encounters where positioning is critical imo, thereby I think that that arrow is really good, though only in selective instances. The worst downside is that you lose loot if you knock an enemy Down a chasm, but over the course of the game, it nearly never matters
I will say transposition arrows are much better for barbarians since 1) at the start of combat, you can’t misty step into the front line and rage in the same turn unless you have 2 BA’s 2) if you already are raging you can’t cast Misty step anyway so this still provides some mobility without the movement cost of jumping
Gotta disagree with the acid arrow, I've never seen one deal extra damage, and enemies just move out of the acid the first chance they get. The only saving grace is that the AC penalty is nice. D-tier imo. Fire arrows are the better version of acid arrows. Arrow of darkness area is too low to be actually useful. If it was even half of what the spell does, they might be worth using casually. With the right party, they might be great, but that also just goes to show how inflexible they are normally. Arrows of salving are available way too late into the game. Once you're able to buy them, your party is already strong enough to 1) end combat before getting inflicted with the ailments, 2) just don't get inflicted by the ailments because their saves are so good, and finally 3) there's a good chance your characters are just immune to the effects.
I find transposition arrow is very good on non-archer high AC tank builds, especially combined with Sentinel and any "damage on miss" equipment. you can use your movement & the bow to position your tank character in tight concentrations of enemies. it just lets you get up close and personal quickly.
You and literally never disagree so I'm obliged to remark that you have yet to truly recognize the mayhem and joy of roaring thunder arrows. Alongside darkness and transposition they are the only arrows I keep (I only play honor mode) and the havoc they can cause at, say, the bhaalist ambush - it's off the hook. Regardless, good stuff props
Arrows of Darkness are **incredibly** strong on builds that run hexblade/fighter crossclasses - everyone had devilsight and 3 ranged attacks, and you can put out darkness without spell slots or concentration! Getting everyone on eldritch night gives you even more darkness casts :D
the arrows of roaring thunder should be higher cause the first time one of my characters died was when Gale got thundered into a lava pit. >:( Also lost an honour run cause the whole party was trying to sneak past an archer I didn't know had an arrow of roaring thunder and we were standing next to a precarious ledge.
Yes those duergar archers in the Nere fight completely ruined my day with these on my first honor mode run. They seem to work better for the AI than for players
Yeah, roaring thunder should be at least B: Situational one hit kill & AoE preparation for non-casters is sooo good. I used them on my shadow monk, who almost always went first, a lot of times: Teleport into a good position, knock 2 more enemies into a pile, on higher levels shoot another arrow - then the caster comes in with Fireball, blizzard, whatever.
They're much better against the party since PCs will tend to have minmaxed stats, so Gale will often have a very low str save and can fail a DC 12. Enemies tend to have pretty good str saves and even ones with a +0 pass the save 45% of the time - for me, that kind of failure rate just isn't worth it!
Most of the slaying arrows are basically S+ in fights where you have a 400+hp target. I didn't realize that damage riders are added to both halves of the arrow damage (which includes str for titanstring). I just did a run where my archer could wipe out any of the big HP bosses in a single round using the appropriate arrow. I really couldn't ask for more from an arrow.
I remember when I made the Ethal fight so much easier when I fired an ice arrow at the one I thought was her out of her clones. She slipped and Karlach got to wail on her with a speed potion and dropped her down enough for her to surrender.
The best way to use a roaring thunder arrow is to reposition yourself. Use it on a cleric to reposition an open hand monk or something. It can save your damage character wasting action economy to disengage. It’s best used in the same turn as your free disengage. It’s way better than healing your monk or casting a protective spell because it’s free economy and then you can use your movement to reposition after.
Worth mentioning that the arrow of transposition CANNOT be used as your extra attack! I am not sure if you get an extra attack if you use it first, but if you have attacked once and are on your extra attack it won’t let you fire this. At least, it hasn’t for me in the past.
Many targets is just incredible and being able spread on hit effects like bane and radiant orbs is so satisfying. Gloomstalker Astarion is currently carrying my honour no rest run and putting EK thrower and open hand monk to shame.
oh wow, arrow of roaring thunder is my personal favorite to use, at least in the early game. I just love things that give knock back and its really useful to conserve spell slots and such. D tier i feel like is a bit harsh for the many cases knock back can be used. Its also just an additional bonus as opposed to a regular arrow, which is nice for battles where you dont really want to put a surface on the ground. I've had cases where I was able to hit it on the wall and push enemies closer. Granted, the smokepowder arrow is better at it in a lot of cases, but in the early game i had a lot of mileage out of it. And for end game, was very useful fighting bhaal cultists and the lorroakan fight. On the flipside of it, Darkness is my least favorite one to use. Maybe since I did not take the niche advantage of making it works but it usually means my ranger/spell caster can't hit the target anymore, which sucks for my gloomstalker/thief ranger which usually has a lot of actions to just kill it. I'm sure theres equipment or things to work around that, but it would probably require a lot of investment and a dedicated build to work.
Dude, the Ilmater arrow is so clutch. I was fighting the lava elemental and i couldnt do any damage because of its healing that let it heal up to 120 hp per turn. Shot it once with the arrow and the rest was a piece of cake.
Fire and acid arrows are great for destroying spider webs. A heavy spider, say a matriarch, can take significant falling damage if the web beneath her were to vanish.
One of my many campaigns is with an "elemental archer" character where I set it up so I have basically unlimited supply of all the arrows from Withers. I still have to buy them, but they aren't limited. So I use the special arrows as the "elemental" part though maybe I should call it a Green Arrow/Hawkeye character haha. Granted it is probably OP but it is also so much fun.
I guess I shouldn't have used a Roaring Thunder arrow against Ethel while my friend was in the cut scene with her and knocking her into that bottomless chasm in her huts basement bypassing that boss fight entirely.
Your list is very similar to what I love to use in my games. I do like Ilmaters arrows a lot in act 1, but after that, they are not that good any more. And arrow of many targets is so powerful and nice.
Roaring thunder is way higher than D tier in my book. In all of my runs, they have been monumental in winning fights, either pushing enemies off ledges or into hazards, pushing my allies away from them to prevent opportunity attacks while saving an action to dash, knocking around targets like the chanting bhallists or anyone else sanctuaried or just making any minor adjustment to possitioning.
I know this has already been commented a few times but out of all your tier lists the Arrow of Roaring Thunder being in D tier is by far the item I disagree with the most. Any enemy at high elevation or next to a chasm having to pass a DC 12 saving throw or be instantly killed or be knocked down from high elevation in any direction you want and being able to hit multiple enemies with this at once is an extremely useful effect. This comes into play in an insanely high number of encounters, with many of them being some of the most difficult encounters in the game. Now in comparison to the Smokepowder Arrow which has essentially the same effect with a better save DC while also dealing damage in a large explosion radius, it's not as reliable so I'd rank it somewhere in S tier. However, it's available from the beginning of the game unlike the Smokepowder Arrow which is only available in Act 2 if you've gone through all the steps to save Barcus Wroot or if not then not until Act 3 which makes it by far one of the best arrows for Acts 1 and 2. It's also much easier to direct which direction the enemies will be sent flying with the Roaring Thunder in comparison to the Smokepowder Arrow which makes it a better option in some scenarios. It's also useable to knock an enemy away from one of your party members without triggering a reaction and without damaging your party member. Ultimately, it's just an extremely useful item that's viable in nearly half of all encounters in the game, I think you're extremely limited in your analysis of the versatility and usefulness of this arrow.
Tactical spoiler for the end of Act II: . . . . . I tried using Arrows of Ilmater on the Avatar of Myrkul at the end of the second act, because I knew he would devour those Necromites and I didn't want him to heal from that. Unfortunately, it turns out that the healing technically happens on the sacrificial Necromite's turn, and since the Bone Chill effect stopped at the end of his OWN turn, the Avatar of Myrkul was totally able to benefit from that healing. At first I thought the arrow was glitched out or something, but when I reviewed it afterwards I saw the order of operations. So, I guess the short version is: Don't bother with Arrows of Ilmater during the Avatar of Myrkul fight in particular, they will not prevent his healing because of the way the healing happens (through no fault of the arrows' own). [EDIT] Unless you can apply it *after* Avatar of Myrkul's initiative (but before the Necormites)
Acid arrows will also explode things that go boom. Learnt that the hard way. I don’t think they explode liquids like wine, but they def will explode those glass fire bottles.
I must have gotten lucky in my runs because I'd rate the thunder arrow way closer to the top. It is my most used arrow because it's so prevalent and easy to knock a few enemies off into oblivion. Typically open with that and then let the melee guys deal with who's left. Obviously the bomb is better, but way harder to obtain. Thunder does work in all the acts. Darkness is spot on at the top though.
You may not have mentioned that poisons, damage riders and enhancements, and conditions are all transferred through the different arrows and onto any damage surface left behind.
Immater arrows are usually the ones I sell unless I’m desperate. Most characters don’t heal, unless your fighting a group that has a labeled cleric, like the flaming fist guides, your waiting to see if they heal before you use the arrow. I normally just have 1 for each character and I’ve never brought any.
In addition to all what you said, Arrow of Many targets bounces can hit enemies in Sanctuary, which in one certain encounter where the main enemy is surrounded with those who buff her while staying in sanctuary make that encounter just a joke. Totally imbalanced consumable. And you can stack infinite amount of them in creche (I don't know, maybe even earlier, but cheche trader is the first one I can think of).
Another great tier list for BG3 in the bag! Curious though: several times you’ve said “having [blank] arrow on each character…” yet the magical pockets mechanic allows any character to use an item from another other character’s inventory. Ergo wouldn’t dividing the stack among the party be unnecessary?
One thing you didn't mention of arrow of many targets, if you have the shortbow of the banshee, the frightened condition can apply to all of them. I'm using it on my sword bard to stack up my arcane acuity and I always seem to frightened at least 1 out of 5 per arrow hit
I too do like Darkness but I was surprised at least 2 times in honour mode by enemies being able to throw bombs or stones into it: Yurgir's Merregons and Goblins. Merregons have Devil's Sight, so no hiding in Darkness from them. But Goblins only have Darkvision. I created a bug report and they are looking into it.
Yeah, there's some weird issues with darkness still - the game's lighting engine is incredibly buggy. My (completely unsubstantiated) theory is that the darkness effect sometimes intersects either environmental lighting or hidden level geometry and leaves little tiny holes in the protection effect, then the enemy targets your exposed elbow or something like that. The downsides of an analog rather than grid-based combat system!
I don't know the exact mechanics of Silence in BG3, but in D&D 5e, Silence only prevents you from casting spells that have a Verbal component. This should prevent Shield and Hellish Rebuke, but not Counterspell, as Counterspell only has a Somatic component, so it only needs a free hand to cast it. BG3 doesn't care about Somatic components though, all characters can cast spells while they have stuff equipped in both hands without problems, so this means in BG3, as long as you have a reaction available, you could always cast Counterspell.
They simulate verbal components by some spells (like Hypnotic Pattern) specifically having "you can cast this while silenced," and ignore somatic entirely (or rather, all spells have verbal only).
@@Cephalopocalypse I see well that makes it pretty confusing then, because in game Counterspell has an incantation so that would imply a verbal component in BG3, and if some spells like Hypnotic Pattern have it worded like that, while Silence's tooltip has a similar wording in BG3 as in 5e, it just seems like a bit of a mess.
[Spoiler alert] Arrow of Roaring Thunder can push the cultists in Orin's encounter off the cliff. You can attack those cultists from the furthest distant without triggering Orin. If you attack Orin without those cultists chanting, she will have ZERO Unstoppable charge.
One sidenote about the arrow of ilmater: I often use this as a tiny bit of extra damage, especially at the start of the game on my rogue character in combo with invisible Shovel, therefore keeping Shovel out of battle, but still dishing out a tiny bit of extra damage with the arrow AND getting the guaranteed sneak attack. This is not really possible with the other basic arrows as they do an area of effect, damaging shovel and thus pulling him into combat.
![ILLSLICK - KILLSHOT REMIX [FULL VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RIK8RrqIAzE/mqdefault.jpg)
Great, now I just need to stop saving the arrows for the "next" fight where I'll really need it.
saving it for bg4
I feel seen.
Use then when you can’t sneak attack and you need more damage
The most relatable comment on TH-cam
Buy them every time you see them and use them basically every turn,
I had the same issue until I literally just started buying out every vendor on sight
Don't forget that these slaying arrows are also very nice to sell in the late game after you've forgotten to use them every friggin time
Extremely accurate
What is this 'selling' you mentioned? Just go shopping as Astarion - he gets the best prices 🤑
Don't be that guy. Don't be the mentor sending off your party without op gear. Save it for future generations of adventurers.
15 persuasion bard would like your entire stock.
You will give it at a wonderful discount
Arrow of Many Targets: It bypasses Sanctuary, if you hit a target next to the one using Sanctuary. Incredibly helpful!
Does anyone know what dangerous elements he is talking about in act 1?
Yes! I meant to mention that but forgot - they can also hit invisible enemies!
@@nothisispatrick6528 SPOILER
Maybe the Mud Mephits and Wood Woads in the swamp?
@@jamesbailey5350 The "L" in trying to correct someone's pronunciation with your specific regional pronunciation in a reply to an unrelated comment is the other kind of L
@@Cephalopocalypse trust, and the L in salving isn't silent. another L 🤣🤣
While robbing every merchant blind of all their possessions, I always snag their arrows too, because those are good to hoard in my box in case I ever need them one day
I prefer to shove the merchants' possessions in a backpack and then juggle the backpack until the items are in my backpack. >:]
One day...
I put them in the box I keep right next to my bucket of fish full of the inhabitants of the goblin camp from act 1.
I'd bring them with me, but I need inventory space to hold all the cultists of Moonrise Tower and stuff them into this barrel.
But of course, nothing compares to the Heavy Chest full of Ornate and Gilded chests full of miscellaneous, unsorted weapons, armor, and junk I pull out then slam down on some merchant's counter before extorting them for every single gold coin, healing potion, camp supply, and moderately intriguing magic item they have.
By the way. For whatever reason, merchants seem to put containers of items into their personal inventory instead of wherever shop inventory goes.
If you know in advance which merchants you're going to ice later (or just male some good predictions), you can sell that crate of goblin weapons like 4 or 5 times.
Just. Picking the half ton crate off the corpse is sometimes difficult...
"one day"
Me with the magic scrolls
Im a rougue cosplaying mage
Roaring thunder is extremely underrated, it shouldn't be anywhere bellow S or A tier.
Even with such low DC, it can push back targets that cannot be targeted, throw off the cliff multiple targets at the same time and gives the ability to everyone in your group to push back targets from bigger distances than gust of wind and without wasting spell slots. They also have better control over the position everyone will be thrown (in the video it states that you are supposed to hit the target which is NOT how these are meant to be used).
A fighter can throw 3 of these arrows per turn, meaning that even strong targets will fail the SAVE and die.
These can make the slayer, balthazar and so many other fights so much easier.
It's possible I should have been more clear in what I was saying - it's not that you're supposed to shoot them at enemies, it's that if you do, you can't usually use the knockback, and if you don't, you're losing out on damage. In your example of a high level fighter, you're probably giving up on 100-200 damage for a small chance to knock enemies back - why not just attack them? It will just kill them faster.
The sanctuaried bhaalists *are* a real use case, but by that point in the game you'll have way better tools to deal with them (including either smokepowder or many targets arrows if you want an arrow-based solution)
@@Cephalopocalypse Hmm. I mean, you can certainly use the knockback effect if you are shooting a creature. Not sure about console, but on PC you can fine tune the direction the enemy will fly based on where the arrow is placed on the enemy's body (and get minor adjustments on nearby enemies too). Between move speed and arrow placement, you're getting at least a 60-90 degree aiming arc to send the enemy flying. If there's a ledge nearby an enemy, it's just a ~50% chance to just kill the enemy on hit (so you can redirect the rest of your attacks elsewhere). Can blast them into other walls/hazards as well.
Definitely think this one is being slept on too, especially considering arrows that are good for 1 or 2 fights are ranked much higher. It's normal damage, but with a chance to instantly kill the enemy if there's a chasm nearby (and there are lots of chasms in the game).
I mean i usually use them to knock enemies off of high ground or into hazards 😅 maybe its not optimal but its hilarious so i always stock up
Definitely not D tier, IMO. They're good for knocking mid level horde type enemies off edges for instant kills. Ones that usually have no good loot but can cause a lot of offensive damage and tie up your party with their attacks and positioning.
Knocking allies off platform in mirkul fight is a need in honour mode to get heals
The arrow of transposition was a life saver in Act 3 when I had to rush around under a strict time limit.
I've never thought once to use those arrows in that encounter! ty lol
Yep exactly, the main use is to teleport really long distances in a single turn!
And for looting many of the vaults in the Counting House 💰
@@ChadCollins I am so stupid. I used misty step when I could have just used some of my arrows.
@@radiantflux1432 Gaseous Form is IMO the best option for that part of the game. I'm pretty sure you can remain in the gas form and interact with all the chests, so you just walk from vault to vault.
One of my favorite things to do with the elemental arrows is to shoot with frost, fire, then lightning. That way, the enemy gets possibly proned, wet, and then takes double damage from lightning.
good idea!
Yes! I actually talk about this exact combo in the video, it's awesome
Lightning arrows following a Rain Spell (everyone wet and vulnerable to lightning) are instant Damage Multipliers.
My 2c.... S Tier. Especially Act 1 & 2.
IMO.... They are also the "rarest" of the Elemental Arrows.... which I feel certain is intentional in the design of the game.
I love using Roaring Thunder in the Moonrise assault to get the archers out of the rafters and make them fall all the way down to the floor and take a ton of damage. That's about it.
I think I would add my voice to the comments calling for Roaring Thunder to be higher than D tier. Basically, on PC, moving the mouse, you can choose to hit "different" parts of the same enemy, still getting the damage but getting a different angle to potentially move that enemy. This had made arrow of roaring thunder a regular default of mine for certain high stakes fights (e.g. underdark boat fight, Nere/Duergar fight, can use while clearing out moonrise towers main floor on archers in the rafters, etc.). That said, I think intelligent use of them for the normal amount of damage plus the chance to reposition is just strictly better than, say, arrow of lightning. Certainly not competing for A or S tier though.
Agreed. Having an arrow that can do several character-turns worth of clearing whatever chaff is shooting at you from rafters, higher cliffs, another boat, or whatever is worth the price of admission.
They also usually don’t have loot you need so there’s only a small price to pay for seeing a bunch of enemies fall to their certain death is just. So. Satisfying.
Probably the best Moment I had in this Game was when I fought Karniss in my Honour Mode run. He was the only Enemy left and had just cast sanctuary, so I couldn’t think of anything better than shooting a rolling Thunder Arrow next to him. It completely yeeted him off the Roof he was standing on, killing him although having around 80 health left.
Had me completely shook for a Moment.
@@seosoos so you Katniss’ed Kaniss? I’m not even sure I’ve got references right.
I never considered acid arrows being worth using with any regularity. Really feel like you've uncovered a hidden gem; thanks!
Most builds won't have any trouble hitting enemies except for the very early game, where they're quite useful.
@@meekrab9027 Consistency is a real strength when it comes to high-risk situations. It's really more a thing early game where a single missed attack can monumentally mess up your turn/output, but even late game certain...fights have some brutal time limitations.
Disappointed to see no Arrow of Sparrow Slaying.
Looking forward to watching this one.
Mao Zedong approved
He must have missed this OP arrow 😢
@@Playingwithproxies I buy it for flavor, love that kiddos rip-off items.
Probably for the reason mentioned at 2:56.
@@justforplaylists good point, surely its omission is strictly because it's unique. If we couls stockpile those, the game would be way too easy
I’ve been able to reliably reproduce this, but if you have surprise and the auto-crit from assassin, EVERY SINGLE DAMAGE INSTANCE of arrow of many targets is a critical hit. So you crit on the initial hit, all the riders, crit on the second target plus all the riders, crit on the third target plus all the riders, and the fourth target as well. With Titanstring and Giant Elixir, strange conduit, the gloves that give sneak attack force damage, the sword that gives +D6 Necrotic damage on enemies that haven’t acted yet, elemental weapon from the drake throat Glaive, and sharpshooter I’m doing absolutely NUTS damage. 70+ damage per target, and with action surge or war priest charges I’m doing that 2-3 times on the first turn of combat. NOTHING can stand up to that kinda damage.
yep, the critical bug with many targets is just completely busted (on top of the arrow's intended effect *already* being completely busted)
Roaring Thunder is S tier bro. Crazy good for knowing enemies off or where you want them to be for AoE
Arrow of Ilmater also has no saving throw and therefore always does an extra 1d4 damage on a hit in addition to blocking healing.
One advantage of arrow of Ilmater is that is NOT an area effect, and can be fired into melee with no problem.
This is very true!
The arrow of transposition has one very specific usecase that you didn't mention, that i find comes up almost every single encounter: The ability to teleport your Barbarian who wants to use their first bonus action of combat to rage right into the face of the enemies. Since barbarians also get extra attack, this often lets you get out a much higher-value melee attack on the first turn of combat, and is especially valuable for tiger barbarians who can just immediately bleed 3 enemies, giving them disadvantage on con saves as well as activating all the other effects that apply when attacking bleeding characters, such as BOOOAL's benediction or some aspects of the beast etc.
arrow of transposition much more useful on a monk character who has more use for bonus actions rather than attack actions
Very true. One character where half of an action is definitely less cost than a full bonus action.
For sure! Very important point
And if you fire an arrow you can make the extra attack still.. Or am i wrong?
@@henriquealves5740yes, you can
@@henriquealves5740 Yes, extra attack works on melee, ranged and throws. So even if you throw a potion to heal an ally you still get an extra attack from it.
So, basic arrows:
Acid: High AC enemies
Fire: Lots of small enemies
Ice: Melee enemies
Lightning: Clustered enemies
Your breakdowns continue to be super helpful in understanding all the details that are built into this wonderful game! Thanks for all your great work!
Thanks very much! I appreciate the kind words :D
I understand the reasoning for the roaring thunder arrow being D, but I find so much utility out of these personally. Even if it forgoes damage, I often do the ground target to push enemies off of cliffs. Even with the low save DC, getting 2 or 3 attempts per character (past level 5) makes it pretty likely that at least one of them knocks an enemy off a cliff, killing them instantly. While Thunderwave, Gust of Wind, or shove can do this with better action economy, the ability to do this from range gives a lot of utility to the roaring thunder arrow and makes it B tier for me personally. Not that I'm saying your reasoning is incorrect! Just that I personally go to use these a lot.
Acid arrows are especially useful if your melee characters are running GWM. That -2 to enemy AC really helps with landing those big hits more consistently
When using the Titanstring bow, the illmater arrow also reapply your strength modifier an additional time to the damage. Assuming you are using a strength elixir this mean 1d4 +5 they can also safely be used against opponent even if you have melee teammate in there without the risk of friendly fire. One of my most used arrow for act 1 & 2.
Interesting! Does that work on honour? Most of the DRS bugs like that got nerfed on honour mode, so if they missed that one that's good to know!
@@Cephalopocalypse Yes it worked on honor mode as of May 2024 when i got my dices.
I'm pretty sure the Titanstring bow applies +strength to any additional damage arrow. Maybe not the Smokepowder but the elemental ones for sure.
Love these consumable lists, I always learn so much valuable information! The elixir video actually changed the way I play the game, thinking of how my characters will use their “elixir slot” is much more efficient than trying to remember which one to use for when I’m in a tight spot
I love using the arrows of Ilmater against baddies who aren't hostile yet, talking my way out of that assault then immediately shooting them again
That's a cool idea! That prevents the autoheal out of combat I assume? That's kind of awesome
About transposition and bonus actions. Any character can have a hand crossbow, and thus make ranged attacks as a bonus action. Thus, many of the utility arrows are essentially "free" as some classes like wizard don't consistently spend their bonus actions.
So for the characters that want it, the transposition arrow is a bonus action teleport.
Omfg, didnt think of it as handcrossbow option 😮
For me is the Roaring Thunder very helpful to eliminate the helpers of Orin.
So I think the D-tier is chosen very low.
I think that's literally the only fight I've ever used them in, and it's against enemies who have Sanctuary so you can't directly damage them anyway. Super niche case in a single fight, and generally underwhelming everywhere else. D-tier seems fair, especially since Gust of Wind will knock those helpers off without the DC-12 save.
@@the_snobot Hmmm... Apparently I missed that Gust of Wind -option. Thanks for this advice. :)
Yeah! I think that's pretty much their only real use-case in the game (some people have mentioned the Nere fight, but I think that's mostly trauma from being knocked into lava themselves :P). By that point you should have much better tools to deal with those enemies though (including smokepowder arrows and many targets arrows if you want an arrow-based solution)
@@Cephalopocalypse I've used them exactly once, because I got surprised by mimics in the Underdark and the DC was 5% higher than a shove on one of them near a cliff, rolled the 35% twice and got it on the second time...
I can't really think of any situations where Thorn Whip or any of the other forced movement options aren't entirely preferable. The effect is good, but it's the worst example of the effect.
Orin fight, Nere fight, Gnoll fight, the Duergar boat fight, the phase spider matriarch fight, the massive moonlight towers fight, Saving Smythn inspiration fight, etc.
The roaring thunder arrows also synergize incredibly well with the Hunger of Hadar spell. Warlocks can Eldritch blast a foe back into the black mist, Barbarians can throw them back in directly but most everyone else can use these Roaring thunder arrows to push enemies back into the damage.
I used the many targets arrow for the first time today and it did multi crit. I was blown away!
Hell yeah that's satisfying.
Just finished up a solo gloomstalker/assassin playthrough with heavy arrow usage and it was so much fun. Sneak in with an arrow of many targets, invis, repeat. Packs just fall over. I think i did the whole goblin camp with them only getting a total of 4 attacksin before i was able to sneak/invis away. Highly recommend, so fun.
And yet, the ENEMY with Roaring Thunder arrows somehow always manage to kill half the party, including inexplicably the character with the HIGHEST strength. I swear, the computer cheats with that freaking arrow every time.
The Death Shepards can't be silenced and apparently can bring back ghouls an infinite number of times even though you burnt the corpse. Which if a corpse is burnt you can't use speak to dead on a corpse. "Too damaged".
@@02091992able The way around this is you pick up their bodies😂
A couple of things: the arrow of arcane interference does eork, but only if you’re before the targeted enemy in initiative, which will cause them to be silenced on their turn.
Secondly, arrow of many targets can hit enemies in sanctuary if they’re near the original target as it works like an aoe. (It even hit invisible creatures, tho idk if that’s intended). Cheers mate.
Roaring thunder arrow will always be S tier in my book because of the slayer fight in act 3. I had run out of aoe and thats the only thing that kept me in my honour run. deals very well with targets that have sanctuary on them.
The arrow of many targets can be powerful for Crowd Control as well. I ran Astarion with the gloves of power, and bow of the banshee. Using things like drow poison, an attack could have a chance to bane, knock out, and frighten 4 enemies.
Yep exactly - the on-hit effects being multiplies is just so ridiculous
I have never used the Salving Arrow, thus placing it D tier for me, and have used many a Roaring Thunder to end or shorten fights near ledges, pushing that one up to B tier.
Only encounter I've used it with was to save Isobel at Last Light
Dragon Slaying arrows are mostly useless. You will face only TWO dragons in the entire game, assuming you take on Ansur, unless you also piss off Qudenos, for some reason.
And the dragon at the top of the netherbrain, you don't even need to fight at all.
I don’t think you can actually fight Qudenos. Even if you attack him in the under city
Disagree about the thunder arrow. It's easily saved by the important enemies but it's incredibly useful in dispatching the minions in a huge bunch. Normally they are week and you could shoot them one by one by one thunder arrow takes care of most of them since so many fights are on cliffs and stuff.
I got so annoyed with it after a while, and gave up on using them.recently I was trying to use them to push Dame away from the bone chill effect, and ofc she saved like 4 of those
I haven’t watched yet but Many Targets is SSSSS, it carried my HM run so goddamn hard
Yeah, arrow of many targets on a character that has a bow with cold damage (via drakethroat glave) and the snowburst ring is too good. Not just awesome damage but great control too. So many proned enemies.
@@wasienka Amazing combo, been using this on my current run and it's so funny and powerful lmao.
Using it with paralytic coatings...
This video made me use the special arrows in Act 2 after I spent hours robbing each one I could find in Act 1. Definetely made combat more fun.
Hey, you missed an arrow of sparrow slaying sold from the teethling kid in last light
Arrow of transposition could probably be bumped up a tier due to its use outside of combat for exploration, it’s reaaaally nice there
it's good for the bank vault
arcane interference is so good to break concentration on balthazar's cloudkills. thats where i mainly use those, its really useful for that
roaring thunder, bard flourish push, battlemaster prone/push is how i discovered the much fun sport of using bhaalists for bhaal ball. monstrosity good for one boss fight. many targets sooo broken
I can't believe you didn't mention the arrow of sparrow slaying. Always a priority buy for me at last light inn
The most important of all!
i think you are doing a disservice to the ilmater arrow, because some fights have healing numbers that are extremely high.
myrkul for example heals for about 50~, that is from my experience much more than a typical undead slaying arrow and denying that amount of healing can single handedly carry fights that do it.
and i dont think its really comparable to the bone chill cantrip because not only is it a attack action instead of a cast action, but also it just happens along with the normal attack while a caster would need to interrupt their plans for that turn to cast it, the level of ease that archers can do it with essentially means if you have a archer in your party no enemies can heal for the entire game.
My main issue with all the arrows that create hazard surfaces is that the moment battle is done all my companions will go out of their way to walk through those surfaces 😡
Elemental arrows can also reveal invisible enemies if they take damage
Maybe not the most resourceful but makes some fights a lot easier
Roaring Thunder is situationally useful. Very Handy in pushing enemies off the high edges and it comes by quite easily too.
the way i mostly used roaring thunder and ilmater\lightning ones....literally saved the day every damn time....this list is....something
You'll be really impressed if you try the good ones then!
Literally a perfect tier list video cos u time stamped it
Ceph I need you to rank the different camp supplies next
Salami S rank because it's the only one you can use to bludgeon people with for 1d4 damage.
Playing with 4x camp supply cost? Do you hate yourself?
@@AverageJohansonIf you pickpocket a lot that wouldn't even be much of an issue.
@@Al0neStillAlive Camp supplies have never been an issue for me even without pickpocketing. I also only use the camp supply bundles too.
Poutine > Banana > Roast Dwarf Torso > Cheap Wine > Everything Else
The number of times roaring thunder saved me. It's not the strongest, but the most memorable watching the big boss fly off cliffs. Like the construct at the top of the mages tower was just unbelievable saving my run.
Love the teir list
I personally think roaring thunder to be at least C tier, I would place it in B tier. The reason for this, is that it's D tier in some encounters and S tier in other encounters, so when it's good it's really good so definitely they are worth carrying around. They are good against group of targets that can be thrown off-cliff, as some of them will fail the strength check, they are good against targets that are hard to hit, which plenty of honor mode enemies have like legendary resistances and damage reductions, they are good to clean some conditions on a party member while also attempting to get an enemy off him, like sleep, and, probably the reason so many comments write about it being S tier, they are so freaking fun to use and it feels awesome when they do work, in hand-sight it's a game and it should be enjoyed. Also, even though they don't work all the time on high-threat targets, sometimes you have no real options other then running from an encounter, so gambling on throwing some high-str character with roaring thunder before running from the encounter can definetly make them useful.
Roaring thunder is criminally underrated here. The missed damage opportunities argument assumes the melee attacker is able to get in melee range (not counting opportunity attacks in order to do so). It's a guaranteed check for knockback even if you miss the shot (which you shouldnt be using for damage in the first place) and usually your martials arent going to be dealing big damage with other arrows either. It's a great way to zone enemies pushing them back to difficult terrain like spike growth or back down to lower ground after they spent the turn dashing up.
Roaring thunder means your martials are able to support your ranged squishies without having to take melee damage. An example is fighting steel watchers - you'd rather stay far away letting your fighters soak their ranged attacks instead of going melee and likely getting maimed. Throughout that fight, you could continually attempt to boop them into a chasm for a free kill, or in general for a martial character to get a quick free kill while waiting for enemies to approach your party.
The good thing abiut fire arrows is that I oftentimes use them when I for some reason forgot a few explosives next to an enemy and they need some ignition.
Makes me technically kill Ansur with 1 Fire Arrow.
The slaying arrows are really straining your (reasonable) policy to not mention spoilers. Putting Dragon Arrows in A tier when there are 2 fights against Dragons (one of which you can also use the cheaper Undead slaying ones) is a bit of a stretch to me.
First playthrough I eagerly gathered every kind of arrow and ended up with huge stockpiles because I never used them. Now I don't go out of my way to get them, but sometimes use them.
Roaring thunder was my favorite arrow. I loved using those to shoot enemies off high ground by shooting behind a target. Now they took fall damage and are probe and vulnerable for my melee allies to maul them. Some pets, barbarians and druid transformations are very grateful to receive a prone target delivered to them on a silver platter.
I also used it to help an ally disengage. Sometimes when you get ambushed the one attack to disengage instead of all attacks to disengage is a better slternative to creating distance.
Or when a melee enemy was far enough away I could push them back further out to force them to dash me instead of attacking me.
You can also use it to set up a future attack, grouping enemies and pushing back NPC allies so your magic user can cast a fireball and not risk any friendly fire.
Roaring thunder is an arrow that rewards you for map awareness and positioning. I made a lot of use out of it, but its not as useful as the elemental arrows but more relevant than those slaying arrows. Roaring Thunder is atleast C tier for me.
I use darkness arrows to steal from vendors since the area of effect is much smaller than darkness spell. You’re obscured while attempting to steal and you’re able to steal a few times while in turn based mode.
There are many encounters where Rolling thunder arrows are supreme. The very First usage I got out of one was blowing the bugbear goblin Boss of Act 1 from the rafters he climbed on in order to get to my Party that I had positioned there to rain down death on all of the enemies. At that point of the game, dealing over 80 damage in one action with a level 4 or 5 Party (which I had been then) is very difficult - it was brilliant there. There are enough encounters where positioning is critical imo, thereby I think that that arrow is really good, though only in selective instances. The worst downside is that you lose loot if you knock an enemy Down a chasm, but over the course of the game, it nearly never matters
I will say transposition arrows are much better for barbarians since 1) at the start of combat, you can’t misty step into the front line and rage in the same turn unless you have 2 BA’s
2) if you already are raging you can’t cast Misty step anyway so this still provides some mobility without the movement cost of jumping
Gotta disagree with the acid arrow, I've never seen one deal extra damage, and enemies just move out of the acid the first chance they get. The only saving grace is that the AC penalty is nice. D-tier imo. Fire arrows are the better version of acid arrows.
Arrow of darkness area is too low to be actually useful. If it was even half of what the spell does, they might be worth using casually. With the right party, they might be great, but that also just goes to show how inflexible they are normally.
Arrows of salving are available way too late into the game. Once you're able to buy them, your party is already strong enough to 1) end combat before getting inflicted with the ailments, 2) just don't get inflicted by the ailments because their saves are so good, and finally 3) there's a good chance your characters are just immune to the effects.
Now, make a tier list of dipable surfaces :^]
I find transposition arrow is very good on non-archer high AC tank builds, especially combined with Sentinel and any "damage on miss" equipment.
you can use your movement & the bow to position your tank character in tight concentrations of enemies.
it just lets you get up close and personal quickly.
You and literally never disagree so I'm obliged to remark that you have yet to truly recognize the mayhem and joy of roaring thunder arrows. Alongside darkness and transposition they are the only arrows I keep (I only play honor mode) and the havoc they can cause at, say, the bhaalist ambush - it's off the hook. Regardless, good stuff props
Arrows of Darkness are **incredibly** strong on builds that run hexblade/fighter crossclasses - everyone had devilsight and 3 ranged attacks, and you can put out darkness without spell slots or concentration!
Getting everyone on eldritch night gives you even more darkness casts :D
Really love all the content! Your videos have been so helpful and fun to watch!
the arrows of roaring thunder should be higher cause the first time one of my characters died was when Gale got thundered into a lava pit. >:(
Also lost an honour run cause the whole party was trying to sneak past an archer I didn't know had an arrow of roaring thunder and we were standing next to a precarious ledge.
Yes those duergar archers in the Nere fight completely ruined my day with these on my first honor mode run. They seem to work better for the AI than for players
Yeah, roaring thunder should be at least B: Situational one hit kill & AoE preparation for non-casters is sooo good.
I used them on my shadow monk, who almost always went first, a lot of times: Teleport into a good position, knock 2 more enemies into a pile, on higher levels shoot another arrow - then the caster comes in with Fireball, blizzard, whatever.
Yeah, they effect my positioning in the Nere fight so much.
They're much better against the party since PCs will tend to have minmaxed stats, so Gale will often have a very low str save and can fail a DC 12. Enemies tend to have pretty good str saves and even ones with a +0 pass the save 45% of the time - for me, that kind of failure rate just isn't worth it!
Arrows of Darkness are also crazy good for making pick-pocketing attempts easier, if what I've seen in videos.
There is one more rare special arrow: Barbed Arrow, there is only 6 in entire game
Most of the slaying arrows are basically S+ in fights where you have a 400+hp target. I didn't realize that damage riders are added to both halves of the arrow damage (which includes str for titanstring). I just did a run where my archer could wipe out any of the big HP bosses in a single round using the appropriate arrow. I really couldn't ask for more from an arrow.
Love your videos!! Just wanted to point out that Hat of fire aquity and scorching ray is the fastest way to build arcane aquity stacks!
Thanks! Yep, that's one of the ways to get to max stacks instantly
silence isn't inconsistent in stopping reaction spells at all, it is completely consistent with what spells it prevents, those with a verbal component
I remember when I made the Ethal fight so much easier when I fired an ice arrow at the one I thought was her out of her clones. She slipped and Karlach got to wail on her with a speed potion and dropped her down enough for her to surrender.
Yep - it's just so powerful when it works that even with the low DC it's still busted
The best way to use a roaring thunder arrow is to reposition yourself. Use it on a cleric to reposition an open hand monk or something. It can save your damage character wasting action economy to disengage. It’s best used in the same turn as your free disengage. It’s way better than healing your monk or casting a protective spell because it’s free economy and then you can use your movement to reposition after.
Worth mentioning that the arrow of transposition CANNOT be used as your extra attack! I am not sure if you get an extra attack if you use it first, but if you have attacked once and are on your extra attack it won’t let you fire this.
At least, it hasn’t for me in the past.
Many targets is just incredible and being able spread on hit effects like bane and radiant orbs is so satisfying. Gloomstalker Astarion is currently carrying my honour no rest run and putting EK thrower and open hand monk to shame.
Learned so much from this video, thank you!
Thanks so much for the support! Glad you enjoyed the video!
oh wow, arrow of roaring thunder is my personal favorite to use, at least in the early game. I just love things that give knock back and its really useful to conserve spell slots and such. D tier i feel like is a bit harsh for the many cases knock back can be used. Its also just an additional bonus as opposed to a regular arrow, which is nice for battles where you dont really want to put a surface on the ground. I've had cases where I was able to hit it on the wall and push enemies closer. Granted, the smokepowder arrow is better at it in a lot of cases, but in the early game i had a lot of mileage out of it. And for end game, was very useful fighting bhaal cultists and the lorroakan fight.
On the flipside of it, Darkness is my least favorite one to use. Maybe since I did not take the niche advantage of making it works but it usually means my ranger/spell caster can't hit the target anymore, which sucks for my gloomstalker/thief ranger which usually has a lot of actions to just kill it. I'm sure theres equipment or things to work around that, but it would probably require a lot of investment and a dedicated build to work.
Dude, the Ilmater arrow is so clutch. I was fighting the lava elemental and i couldnt do any damage because of its healing that let it heal up to 120 hp per turn. Shot it once with the arrow and the rest was a piece of cake.
Fire and acid arrows are great for destroying spider webs. A heavy spider, say a matriarch, can take significant falling damage if the web beneath her were to vanish.
One of my many campaigns is with an "elemental archer" character where I set it up so I have basically unlimited supply of all the arrows from Withers. I still have to buy them, but they aren't limited. So I use the special arrows as the "elemental" part though maybe I should call it a Green Arrow/Hawkeye character haha. Granted it is probably OP but it is also so much fun.
I guess I shouldn't have used a Roaring Thunder arrow against Ethel while my friend was in the cut scene with her and knocking her into that bottomless chasm in her huts basement bypassing that boss fight entirely.
Your list is very similar to what I love to use in my games. I do like Ilmaters arrows a lot in act 1, but after that, they are not that good any more. And arrow of many targets is so powerful and nice.
Roaring thunder is way higher than D tier in my book. In all of my runs, they have been monumental in winning fights, either pushing enemies off ledges or into hazards, pushing my allies away from them to prevent opportunity attacks while saving an action to dash, knocking around targets like the chanting bhallists or anyone else sanctuaried or just making any minor adjustment to possitioning.
I know this has already been commented a few times but out of all your tier lists the Arrow of Roaring Thunder being in D tier is by far the item I disagree with the most. Any enemy at high elevation or next to a chasm having to pass a DC 12 saving throw or be instantly killed or be knocked down from high elevation in any direction you want and being able to hit multiple enemies with this at once is an extremely useful effect. This comes into play in an insanely high number of encounters, with many of them being some of the most difficult encounters in the game. Now in comparison to the Smokepowder Arrow which has essentially the same effect with a better save DC while also dealing damage in a large explosion radius, it's not as reliable so I'd rank it somewhere in S tier. However, it's available from the beginning of the game unlike the Smokepowder Arrow which is only available in Act 2 if you've gone through all the steps to save Barcus Wroot or if not then not until Act 3 which makes it by far one of the best arrows for Acts 1 and 2. It's also much easier to direct which direction the enemies will be sent flying with the Roaring Thunder in comparison to the Smokepowder Arrow which makes it a better option in some scenarios. It's also useable to knock an enemy away from one of your party members without triggering a reaction and without damaging your party member. Ultimately, it's just an extremely useful item that's viable in nearly half of all encounters in the game, I think you're extremely limited in your analysis of the versatility and usefulness of this arrow.
Tactical spoiler for the end of Act II:
.
.
.
.
.
I tried using Arrows of Ilmater on the Avatar of Myrkul at the end of the second act, because I knew he would devour those Necromites and I didn't want him to heal from that. Unfortunately, it turns out that the healing technically happens on the sacrificial Necromite's turn, and since the Bone Chill effect stopped at the end of his OWN turn, the Avatar of Myrkul was totally able to benefit from that healing. At first I thought the arrow was glitched out or something, but when I reviewed it afterwards I saw the order of operations. So, I guess the short version is:
Don't bother with Arrows of Ilmater during the Avatar of Myrkul fight in particular, they will not prevent his healing because of the way the healing happens (through no fault of the arrows' own). [EDIT] Unless you can apply it *after* Avatar of Myrkul's initiative (but before the Necormites)
Acid arrows will also explode things that go boom. Learnt that the hard way. I don’t think they explode liquids like wine, but they def will explode those glass fire bottles.
I must have gotten lucky in my runs because I'd rate the thunder arrow way closer to the top. It is my most used arrow because it's so prevalent and easy to knock a few enemies off into oblivion. Typically open with that and then let the melee guys deal with who's left. Obviously the bomb is better, but way harder to obtain. Thunder does work in all the acts. Darkness is spot on at the top though.
You may not have mentioned that poisons, damage riders and enhancements, and conditions are all transferred through the different arrows and onto any damage surface left behind.
Immater arrows are usually the ones I sell unless I’m desperate. Most characters don’t heal, unless your fighting a group that has a labeled cleric, like the flaming fist guides, your waiting to see if they heal before you use the arrow. I normally just have 1 for each character and I’ve never brought any.
In addition to all what you said, Arrow of Many targets bounces can hit enemies in Sanctuary, which in one certain encounter where the main enemy is surrounded with those who buff her while staying in sanctuary make that encounter just a joke. Totally imbalanced consumable.
And you can stack infinite amount of them in creche (I don't know, maybe even earlier, but cheche trader is the first one I can think of).
Yes! I meant to mention that but forgot - they can also hit invisible enemies!
We always overrated the lightning arrow because of its bonus to Steel Watchers, but looking back there are so many better ways of dealing with them
Another great tier list for BG3 in the bag! Curious though: several times you’ve said “having [blank] arrow on each character…” yet the magical pockets mechanic allows any character to use an item from another other character’s inventory. Ergo wouldn’t dividing the stack among the party be unnecessary?
One thing you didn't mention of arrow of many targets, if you have the shortbow of the banshee, the frightened condition can apply to all of them. I'm using it on my sword bard to stack up my arcane acuity and I always seem to frightened at least 1 out of 5 per arrow hit
Thanks good subject matter that I haven’t seen anyone else address.
I too do like Darkness but I was surprised at least 2 times in honour mode by enemies being able to throw bombs or stones into it: Yurgir's Merregons and Goblins. Merregons have Devil's Sight, so no hiding in Darkness from them. But Goblins only have Darkvision. I created a bug report and they are looking into it.
Yeah, there's some weird issues with darkness still - the game's lighting engine is incredibly buggy. My (completely unsubstantiated) theory is that the darkness effect sometimes intersects either environmental lighting or hidden level geometry and leaves little tiny holes in the protection effect, then the enemy targets your exposed elbow or something like that. The downsides of an analog rather than grid-based combat system!
I don't know the exact mechanics of Silence in BG3, but in D&D 5e, Silence only prevents you from casting spells that have a Verbal component. This should prevent Shield and Hellish Rebuke, but not Counterspell, as Counterspell only has a Somatic component, so it only needs a free hand to cast it. BG3 doesn't care about Somatic components though, all characters can cast spells while they have stuff equipped in both hands without problems, so this means in BG3, as long as you have a reaction available, you could always cast Counterspell.
They simulate verbal components by some spells (like Hypnotic Pattern) specifically having "you can cast this while silenced," and ignore somatic entirely (or rather, all spells have verbal only).
@@Cephalopocalypse I see well that makes it pretty confusing then, because in game Counterspell has an incantation so that would imply a verbal component in BG3, and if some spells like Hypnotic Pattern have it worded like that, while Silence's tooltip has a similar wording in BG3 as in 5e, it just seems like a bit of a mess.
[Spoiler alert] Arrow of Roaring Thunder can push the cultists in Orin's encounter off the cliff. You can attack those cultists from the furthest distant without triggering Orin. If you attack Orin without those cultists chanting, she will have ZERO Unstoppable charge.
One sidenote about the arrow of ilmater: I often use this as a tiny bit of extra damage, especially at the start of the game on my rogue character in combo with invisible Shovel, therefore keeping Shovel out of battle, but still dishing out a tiny bit of extra damage with the arrow AND getting the guaranteed sneak attack. This is not really possible with the other basic arrows as they do an area of effect, damaging shovel and thus pulling him into combat.
Top tier content to eat sth with. Do all the items tier lists like armor tier list ring tier list... too ;D
Arrow of Many Targets + Luck of the Far Realms crits all targets, that may be what you've seen