The Roman Gladius (Short Sword) in its correct Historical Context
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- Some mythbusting and historical context behind the famous Roman short sword, known as the gladius. Previous video on Roman plate armour: • What was Roman Army PL...
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Interesting that the Roman tactic seems to have been to move right into shanking range, I can imagine that having a real psychological impact, very aggressive. With a spear formation you can maintain some distance, but Romans with gladius and scutum, they have to get right up in your face. Kind of terrifying, actually.
Definitely the right thing to do against pike blocks and spear formations of their enemies.
@@scholagladiatoria Interesting though, how history always reverted back to the spear formation. Even the Romans.
@@seanbeckett4019during the period of the Republic and early to middle empire Roman troops had substantially better equipment than their enemies. So with much heavier armor the Roman legionary can more safely get in close and is significantly advantaged in grappling range. So having a weapon set that prioritizes getting in close is just playing to their strengths.
But by the time of the late empire, the disparity in the equipment closes dramatically with chainmail becoming much more common and padded cloth armor being ubiquitous. So legionaries can no longer rely on having a huge advantage in close quarters due to heavier armor. Thus the need to revert to spears and long swords. Though even then the Romans continue to prefer shorter spears.
@@seanbeckett4019 I suspect as the level of professionalism in the roman army dropped, spears became a safer and more effective option.
*Casually approach Gaul*
Good timing! I literaly just received my Albion Augustus yesterday.
I think the metallurgy of the time would also favor short stubby blades. As smiths improved steel making and forging techniques, The blades became longer and thinner. As the swords changed the fighting style changed.
13:56 training & teamwork/more individual etc changed? Rome was going through a lot changes just then.
Trivia nonsense: About 25 years ago CBC in Canada used to produce excellent historic infommercials. There was one in historical reference to the unknown disappearance of Viking settlements in Canadas furthest northern tip of Newfoundland.
It believed (guessed) that somehow they csme into violent conflict with local Innuit natives.
There was superb fantasy scene of three helmeted Vikings fighting back to back with thier wonderfully long Saxon swords. A battle with hidden enemies in the clouds.
Its believed they were eventually vanquished by the Innuit.
Whom promptly gave them warrior respect in verbally past down song.
Thanks to Gavin, I felt like I was there, in person, thinking to myself ‘How do I hold my sword for Matt’s benefit without looking awkward?’ P.S. Gavin did great. I hope.
I was concerned at certain points Matt was going accidentally back himself onto the pointy bit! 😱🤣
If you fighting from the horseback then gladius (as a whole family short swords) it's not ideal weapons. Spatha was introduced as a sword first to the roman cavalry probably from frankish or gallic auxiliary troops (cavalry). In later empire / early Byzanthium period armies were a lot more saturated by horse riders then it was in late republic / early empire so even infantry need a weapon with longer reach. This is ofcourse of many reasons why roman legionaires change theirs equipment. PS. Gavin really looks like cool guy and glad to see him again in your video :)
Spears were still the ultimate weapon and thats what their Auxiliar used as main weapons. Swords are mainly backup weapons.
I think that's part of the answer. Ultimately, I think as Matt said, the gladius was part of a system that involved great armor, shields, training, intimidation (see another post), AND a short stabbing sword that was unbeatable so long as you had all of those together. Lose any of them, with perhaps training being #1, and you are better off reverting to a more generic fighting style. Against cavalry the shield and pilum would be better than a longer sword. But only if you had a really professional, well-trained, and high morale army which the Romans started to lack as time went on.
Problem is people think too much in drawers. Even before the Spatha the Romans had cavalry swords and in fact what we think of Gladius had length variations that completely overlap with the Spatha so you do not have them fit in neat categories. You have swords seeming too short for a Spatha but otherwise seemingly that pattern and others too long for Gladius but otherwise that pattern and everything across a spectrum.
Agreed. The switchover to "longer" bladed weapons was, probably more than anything else, due to the shift in doctrine from blocks of heavy infantry to highly mobile cavalry.
@@kleinerprinz99ййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййййй 18:37
Matt Easton is the Scott Manley of arms and armor. Both are bald men from the UK who are experts in particular nerdy fields and are widely respected among their community
Fight safe!?
Scott saved me from so much frustration when learning to play Kerbal Space Program.
@@Carrot421911 Combined they become Kerballish Quart.
Or he's the Ian McCollum of swords. He's sword-jesus.
Wait, you mean they are not the same person?!
Thank you so much for helping dispel the myth that Gladii were a thrust-only sword! If you go back and read the texts, there's on from a soldier describing limbs being removed when enemies would overreach in combat. That in itself proves it had a versatility in the cut, but so many people only know what video games and movies tell them.
I read a very stupid comment under Forge In Fire: Gladius. I can't remember exactly but it's something like this: Gladius is a thrushting weapon, Roman commander will be very pissed if a soldier slash than thrust.
That was a so WTF comment. If it's thrusting only weapon why were the edges sharpern?
Famously when Caesar tried to stop routing legionaires, one of the soldiers in panic raised his arm against Caesar, it was cut off by his bodyguard, saving Caesar's life.
Livy's account of the Macedonian wars comes to mind. According to Livy, some of Phillip's men who were used to fighting the Greeks and Illyrians and as a result familiar only wounds caused by javelins and arrows and rarely lances were appalled by the wounds caused by the Spanish sword such as heads cut off from the trunk, arms lopped, necks and shoulders entirely cut through, disembowelments and various other wounds so terrible that were perceived with horror.
Should be obvious that anything with an edge at least had a secondary usage as a cutter/chopper. I don't get why people are so fast to develop these weird ideas about history. Or maybe I do, I could see historians trying to make a name for themselves coming up with "theories" like that to further their name/career.
@@Juel92 Usually, I think these kind of “theories” don’t come from historians (not least because that’s not the kind of thing you make an academic career out of in that field), but from game and/or weapons bros.
Finally some ｃｏｎｔｅｘｔ! Hopefully this video will have great ｐｅｎｅｔｒａｔｉｏｎ in the community and help dispel the gladius myths.
hehehe
I remember a TH-cam poll asking what the best close range sword was and the gladius won by a long shot despite no mention of it being accompanied by a shield. That surprised me as it was going against the cutlas and the wakizashi.
No hand protection is likely the biggest negative to most Roman-type swords and knives, gladius, pugio, and such weapons. Matt did a video about the evolution of hand protection on swords, and for some reason, more ancient blades just didn't have them, but after they caught on, more and more sword-makers adopted them. Crossguards, basket hilts, etc.
Fencing unarmored with a gladius against a cutlass sounds far from ideal, though all three are close enough that skill & conditioning would be what really matter.
@@dashcammer4322Swords in the ancient world were nearly always used with a shield in the off-hand. You're not defending with the sword at all, so hand protection simply isn't necessary.
@@Tobascodagama A lot of these swords were also, relatively speaking, mass produced. With the simpler technology the romans and other people had on hand, even if they had thought of using hand protection, the expense in time, money, and resources, in producing a large swathe of swords for citizen-soldiers would have been incredibly difficult.
@@dashcammer4322 Interesting fact, the gladius was actually in use around 1355, but it was hidden in plain sight. Swordsmiths at the time cleverly disguised it by giving it a crossguard and a pommel.
One of the things that I have always loved as a Roman Historian and find very interesting is how Rome would run across something, the gladius hispaniensis, certain ship designs, different armors,. ect and if it seemed effective against what the Romans had or seemed like they could work it into their current methods they would almost absorb it into their system. They might change it up, modify its design a bit, and then just straight use it. That is how Rome got a navy, they partially copied the ship designs from the Carthaginians, modified it to have a Corvus (docking bridge) to turn ship combat back into land combat, and off they went with a semi-effective navy.
My thoughts on the semispatha is that some were older gladii still in circulation and that others were broken down spathae. Either instance seems to mean it was likely the cheaper option. On a related note, I'd like to learn more about late Roman knives; they seem to blur between sica and seax.
I have a soft spot for the Pompeii Gladius with its parallel edges and triangular point, probably because it reminds me of 8bit sword sprites from old games, or my childhood drawings of what i thought a sword looked like
And Asterix comics' Romans ...
I also think it is Important to consider Roman military equipment not only in the context of fighting Barbarians or other Mediterranean states, but also against other Romans. Internecine conflict features rather heavily in Roman History, and almost all of the famous Roman civil wars occurred after the implementation of the Gladius. Additionally, most, if not all, of a Roman Soldier’s training partners would be other similarly equipped and trained legionaries. I think that last fact is important when you consider soldiers use their weapons in training much more than they do in battle. So for all the external pressures that influenced the adoption of the gladius paired with the Scutum, it’s longevity as a weapon system, And it’s eventual replacement by spatha and oval shields, must also be analyzed alongside internal pressures and the experience of Romans fighting other Romans. All that is to say, it seems likely to me that Roman soldiers (or atleast the ones with power to commission equipment) found the gladius/scutum/pilum combination suitable against both Romans and non-Romans alike, because we do not see dramatic innovation away from this system during times of war with either internal or external foes.
As far I know, the Spartans also had very short swords. Others laughed that you could practice swallowing them (such a spectacular trick). A little boy in Sparta complained to his mother: "My sword is shorter than my opponent's." The mother replied, "Then come closer." Speaking of the Romans, a few days ago I read interesting information about what kind of field fortifications the Romans made. I was very surprised. Apparently they connected three short poles to form a kind of "anti-personnel hedgehog". Is it true?
Yes I touch on Greek swords in the video :-)
@@scholagladiatoria Yes, I saw it, but were the Spartan ones actually shorter than the typical "Greek" ones?
in answer to the inquiry, ‘Why do you use short swords ? ’ said, ‘So that we may get close to the enemy.’ - plutarch's sayings of spartans
@@Zbigniew_Nowakprobably not. People tend to take any classical hellenic story and attribute it to the spartans.
@@Arkeo36 So there is this version of this anecdote. But it makes practical sense of course. Supposedly, the Romans were able to achieve a 2:1 tactical advantage thanks to this, because two men with short swords could operate in a narrow section of the fight where there was one opponent with a long sword.
It's good to finally see an Albion again! You've been featuring a lot of other sword makers, but we haven't seen an Albion in quite a while. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, it seems like you've possibly sold many of your good old Albions, like your Ringeck and your Poitier...
Funnily enough I filmed a video with the Ringeck today. I still have them all, except the Poitiers, which I did sell... to Gavin rather coincidentally!
@@scholagladiatoria, Ha!! Well, I'm glad that the Poitiers has at least stayed in good hands!😃😂 And I can't wait to see your upcoming video with the Ringeck! It's such a brutally beautiful, pointy, stabby longsword!
Why are they so expensive compared to other makers? Is it literally just a status symbol thing or what?
@@Kinetic.44Not an expert by any means, but my initial guess would be better tolerances
@@Kinetic.44 , I would second evster7flick's statement about tolerances, and you could probably say the same about their overall fit and finish. I would also say that it has to do with the fact that Albion's "Next Generation" line, the line most people get, are designed by the amazing swordsmith Peter Johnsson. Peter's abilities, even just as a designer, are not to be underestimated! There's just a certain historical aesthetic to them that sets them apart... or at least HAD set them apart. You see, we find ourselves in an interesting time in terms of the world of production swords. With swords such as those Windlass has produced in collaboration with Matt (and the Royal Armouries?), we're finally starting to see pieces that can compete with Albion, especially for the money.
The reason for the move away from gladius and scutum shield in the later roman period, is because that fighting system was designed for a specific time in history of large, rigorously trained and organized armies of elite soldiers fighting other large armies. Its all about context as always. After the romans had conquered all the local armies around them, the times changed. They became more about control of the land they owned. They became complacent and wealthy. Life of the wealthy, powerful and capable of upwards mobility, became about that personal rise more so than the goals of the state. And as hard times make hard people, then hard people make soft time...soft times make soft people - and soft people make hard times. Society began to decline and new challengers gnawed at the bits of the empire, struggle and strife became harder to deal with and adaptation had to be made. Armies of hundreds of thousands of trained massive shields and formations became less common and combat devolved more into unorganized skirmishing and for that purpose the gladius and scutum were no longer the best option. There is nothing on earth that is a simple 1 word answer. But also, nothing is all that complicated. it is just human nature. It is just the logical outcome of peoples desires and the times they find themselves in. People always just do the best they can for themselves in the context they exist within. Times changed, so weaponry and tactics and realities of battle all changed. Its just that we try to distill 400 years of history into 1 word or 1 phrase, which keeps us from understandng the truth of the matter.
When did the military of the Republic move from using low-carbon iron swords to high carbon steel swords?
I think one reason for the longer sword (and slightly small and lighter shields) might be the fact that the late roman army tended to put more emphasis on small scale raiding, that they tended to concentrate fewer soldiers to each battle and (perhaps) that the physical battlefields tended to get larger (fighting in the east vs. the parthians and along the Rein, rather then in fairly narrow valleys in Italy, Greece and so on) So battlefields would see a smaller density of soldiers, meaning that soldiers and units would have to cover a greater area than before, while also having the space to use a longer cutting sword. No longer fighting the type of heavy infantry that they had done before, would also make a longer cutting sword more useful.
i completely agree, I just wrote a similar comment
Late Rome was in a strategically defensive posture, this is evident in the archeological record with forts. Forces were less trained and on a smaller scale to respond to border incursions.
Interestingly, the Romans started off liking fairly large swords in their infancy.
Extant Italian xiphoi finds are larger in comparison to Greek finds, with blade lengths in the region of ~60-70 cm (Campovilano has a blade length of 63cm). La Tene B swords were also quite Widespread in Republican Rome, with blade lengths being similar or a bit larger than the Italic Xiphos. Early Gladius Hispaniensis finds also tend to have blade lengths of around ~65cm.
10:54 From what Ive seen from simulations using tactics writen in documents they would try to cut your arm too while you make that slashing movement....when your arm is extended they could cut it (Maybe not chop the arm off but hurt it pretty bad) and then stab you.
BTW: Great video man! keep up the good work!
It's really trippy that I just was looking up what manuals or "hema" styles would be applicable to a xiphos like 3 days ago. And now a video pops up for my exact sword of choice (or at least it's mentioned). Mind you the one I have is the 19in blade from zombie tools. My rationale for it wasnt as a paired item with a shield but moreso being used in confined spaces; hallways/ buildings/ ect. Where a longer weapon would be inconvenient and possibly get caught on enviromental hazards. (Theres a goblin slayer referance in here somewhere). Obv at that point the historical/ traditional training for combat goes out the window but I'm still curious if there's a general shortsword manuscript that could serve as a baseline to referance.
I've done kali/ escrima before and worked with knives, batons, tonfa, staffs, the horrendous abomination that are nunchucks, butterfly swords, and a very, veryyyy small bit of kendo. So it's far less "how do I swing da cutty thingy" and more "what made this effective historically so I can supplament/ enhance my current technique or notice flaws I hadn't realized existed before.
Man that turned into a ramble. Idk if anyone will read this or have any suggestions but if ya do major thanks!
Veni, vidi, vici!
Great video! Can you address how and why the gladius changed from the Roman Republic to the Roman Empire? I've always been intrigued/confused by gladius measurements that suggests the mid-Republican era gladius was a good bit longer than the imperial era gladius.
Good question!
It may have to do with the transition from the manipular formation to cohorts. The manipular formations were looser as they were developed when fighting the Sabines in the mountains of Italy, and worked well in Spain too. Cohorts were developed after much fighting in Africa with more open terrain and moving back to a tighter formation became more useful as would transitioning to a shorter sword.
I wish I could read the answer to this question but on most of my TH-cam channels I cannot read comments to people's comments
@@robo5013 According to Vegetius, the imperial era cohorts of the 1st-2nd centuries had 3 feet of space between each man (so ~6 feet total per person). That is pretty spacious formation. In comparison, most spear formations are much tighter.
Great video. That sword/shield combo was obviously effective for 100's of years; especially when deployed in large formations.
The sword and shield combination is a distinction without difference - literally EVERYONE had swords and shields. What identifies the Romans is rather that they used javelins instead of spears or pikes. It really should go without saying, in such a context, that the javelin was their primary weapon, just as the spear was that of the 5th century hoplite, or the pike that of the Macedonian phalangite.
I mean, think of it this way: if the Roman was a dedicated fighter at close range, employing to good effect his shield and sword for the duration of a battle, then exactly why did he not also carry a spear, spears being also exemplary close-combat weapons and synergizing very well with swords in their differing specialties?
I could anticipate your counterarguments to the above with the considerable evidence of battle duration, casualty statistics, contemporary writing, human physical limitations, and other such matters, but since these could also be gained from a brief, free, and entertaining online perusal of recent short-form scholarship on the matter and some rummaging through the contents of Caesar and Polybius, I would encourage you to spare me the effort.
@@melanoc3tusii205 Yes and no, depending on how you define “primary”.
The pilum was definitely a key factor in the combination, but arguably because it allowed for a more effective deployment of the sword and shield by disrupting opponent formations and was effective against enemy shields.
This would allow the legionaries to then do their bloody sword fights more effectively. (And of course the pilum could also be used as a stabbing spear in a pinch)
If we define the pilum as the “primary weapon”, in the sense of the weapon mainly used to kill or incapacitate opponents, you’d expect legionnaires to stand off and pepper their opponents with them, like other types of javelin men from antiquity, and not rely much on their swords.
But if the legionaries were mainly javelin units, then it would also not make much sense to weigh them down with a lot of heavy armour, something else that set them aside from the dedicated javelin units of antiquity.
By contrast, a Greek hoplite or a Macedonian phalangite would have their thrusting spear as their primary weapon for killing and maiming opponents with their sword as more of a backup.
interesting video
I think the Gladius is designed and "modernized" to fight with heavy armor and in close formation and close combat
you say yourself that there were several variants of the Gladius depending on the zone where they were made and the variation of fighting style
Long swords were first adopted by the Roman cavalry, Gladius on horseback is "funny"
Later, in the late Empire, the fighting style of the Roman army changed
the long sword has advantages in one-on-one combat, while it is a hindrance in close formation
As there were fewer and fewer Romans and opponents who learned how to break the formation / force the Romans to fight one-on-one, weapons and armor changed as well.
The Romans were known to be "practical", if you had a better weapon than them, they would capture it, adopted it and use their own engineering to improve it to beat you even better
I saw a video where a historian took today's police (riot police) in armor and with shields and clubs to try Roman tactics
(the test opponents were the local Rugby team) against the crowd
although the rugby players were more numerous and even physically stronger, the police "caught" them without any problems
The conclusion was that the formations and methods of today's Police are very similar to Roman tactics
the main difference was that the police train and work as a unit with three soldiers in a line (group); while the Romans have 10 or more soldiers in a line
a smaller group is more mobile, while a larger group is stronger and more stable
and then in that situation put the Gladius, the perfect practical little sword, to stab and cut the opponent's legs under the shield
Forgive me if this is a dumb question,I’m still a relative novice to sword history and styles.(I’m more of a firearms guy😂). But what is the difference between a Spatha Sword and a Gladius?
i have this VR game,gladius...
and there best used like this: stab,shield,stab,shield repeat.
you hide behind your shield,and just stab away.........its a nice fighting style,its effective.
just putting a point in someones face,is very effective.
there not made to swing,and parry,there made to stab.
a swing would also not puncture armor.
they also have a solid grip,this is also better for stabbing.
like you have this shield wall,with people stabbing beyond that wall...
its kinda like a phalanx,with spears...just with swords.
a rapier...is like a modern Gladius,fencing,stabbing people,instead of swinging.
its purely focused on discipline....
shield and stab,shield and stab.....that is what you learn your muscles.
like i said...its effective,that why they got so big,the Romans.
i still envy the Greek phalanx though.
but a spear is useless close range.
phalanx is bronze age and Romans are early iron age.
rapier is far more modern....made more for duels.
now gladius is a game not a simulation...
but vr simulations can teach us much.....
you can simulate weapons,era,and stuff like that.
you could simulate a true roman fight.
from a history perspective,it could teach people much.
Obviously, the germanic and saxton weapons were effective enough against the roman army. It caused them to build two massive walls to try to keep them away from roman territory.
It's exactly right that the secret to the success of the gladius was that it was used as part of a weapon _system_ (in conjunction with the scutum), and in conjunction with the close formations and high level of discipline of the Roman army. I have an original French Model 1831 artillery short sword, which was deliberately copied from the Roman gladius (one's depicted in surviving Roman art, rather than archaeological finds, I feel quite certain), and the French artillerymen to whom it was issued did not find it a useful weapon at all. They did find it useful as a machete-like camp tool, and called it the _coupe-chou_ (cabbage chopper). But as a weapon, they didn't think it worth much, and it's not hard to see why; a soldier trying to use one against an enemy armed with a saber or a musket with bayonet attached, would be at a _severe_ reach disadvantage, and would have neither the shield, nor the close formation that were the keys to making this type of sword a world-beating weapon when the Romans used it in the late Republican and early Imperial periods.
The french weapon you talk about had another group of issues leading to a not so stellar weapon Performance. Reach was definitely an issue, but the artillery short sword was far heavier and 'overbuilt' compared to the various types of gladius. It was unwieldy. I think there's a video on the scholagladiatoria channel
@@heavybolter6396 Yeah, the solid brass hilt definitely makes it heavier than ideal for a sword, though that did probably improve its durability for the machete role it more typically played.
The Roman army during the most relevant portion of its military exploits with javelin, shield, and sword did not fight in close order and was not particularly disciplined - those are fallacious retrojections from the late Roman Empire, when they favored thrusting spears.
I thoroughly enjoyed this rather pointed study on Roman weaponry. Thank you! Subscribed.
Could you talk of La Tené Swords?
As it happens, I've been learning more about them recently.
@@scholagladiatoria that would be nice. They are quite special.
Wait Gavin doesn't wear his Roman Legionnaires outfit all the time?! I know I would. 😂
The context is also an issue …. The Roman unit sort of functioned like a machine…. The front guy fought for x minutes then the next guy moved up to take his place. Afterall arms get tired.
I think Romans or anyone with a short sword really would have been trained not only to attack the head and neck but also the hands and arms, like in most forms of knife fighting.
"Offend that which offends you most" the full or empty hand.
Its also been noted that the increasing use of Auxillla troops with their weapon sets had influence on the Regulars
Edit:
You mentioned it right at the end 👍
Yeah, I meant to mention it much earlier, but got there in the end 😉
@@scholagladiatoria it's a lot to squeeze in short videos. 500 years of history in 10 minutes or less and still get the major points that everybody is going to get you for! 😆👍
One inrnb office kdichrb i wasnt to die dhdbf lmn okay i am waiting good and yes i am waiting uere now i am standing on it no yes okqy weell i see
The most critical pieces of Roman military equipment were arguably the shovel and pick---the constant entrenchment and protected camp building was a more distinct tactic for them than what they did on the battlefield itself.
In reality, it's the level of professionalization and discipline---they could order an army into the field, marching, digging in, and staying there indefinitely before fighting as a disciplined unit, something neighboring states couldn't count on their forces doing reliably.
You forgot a key factor; the closeness of combat after contact was akin to being near the front of the crowd at a concert. Wearing the gladius on the right, allows it to be drawn and wielded well even when packed in like sardines.
you mean palestine 🇵🇸 so called israel didn’t exist back then
I have to wonder whether smaller units covering larger areas drove some of the changes in equipment. I don't think they had the economy to have enough full legions to cover their territory as densely as they had early on. I remember reading how much of a struggle to finance the legions that they often ran into. If they were forced to cover more area with smaller detatchments then equipment that favored large unit actions would be less effective while equipment that favored small units, individuals and cavalry would be more useful(like longer swords, bigger spears and smaller sheilds that require lesser supply chains or allow more impact from a single soldier) over time that wouls have driven a lot od equipment changes.
My thoughts as well. The Roman economy simply couldnt maintain the 30 odd legions plus auxiliaries in the 4th century. Troops that werent paid had a disturbing tendency to rebel and proclaim their own Emperor...
One of the Roman authors I've read (I think Tacitus, but maybe Pliny the Elder) talks about Roman soldiers charging their enemies and the front rank knocking them down with their scutums and the ranks behind stabbing them while they were on the ground. I wish I could remember the quote. Not sure whether it would really be a practical tactic or how widespread it was if so, but it reinforces the ideas that a) the gladius was intended to be just one part of a larger weapons system incorporating the scutum and pila, and b) the strength of the Roman armies during the period of their peak success lay in their discipline, coordination and teamwork.
My guess as to why the gladius fell out of fashion was probably mainly cultural- as time went on fewer Italians wanted to serve in the army and the Empire made greater use of auxiliaries and mercenaries, including the Germans mentioned by Matt. These people would have had their own cultural preferences for particular weapons that might have influenced the military culture as a whole.
Seems like a valid tactic. Heard it before also.
You move around a lot when you do these videos, and with the way Gavin was holding his gladius I admit I got concerned a couple times in the video. =)
part of the kit, hurling, spear and knife, for each type and phase of fighting. Also, horsemen need longer swords to reach down, forward and to the side. practical riding horses start at 12.0 hands (4 inches to a hand) and increase thru the ages.
My lay person instinct is to say. The large shield and short sword were an extreme advantage against people less armored. And then, as the same armor went everywhere. The romans had to adapt and start using different tactics/weapons. Also, maybe something to do with a more individualized Soldier is opposed to fighting as a unit over rough terrain?
"The large shield and short sword were an extreme advantage against people less armored."
This begs two questions - why do you think the people they fought against were less armoured, and why do you think that those people, being less armoured, didn't themselves fight with sword and large shield?
"And then, as the same armor went everywhere."
The same armour *started off* elsewhere, and in fact most of elsewhere had serviceable armour of one variety or another.
"Also, maybe something to do with a more individualized Soldier is opposed to fighting as a unit over rough terrain?"
As opposed to the Greeks, who developed first dense forces armed with dedicated thrusting spears and then even denser forces armed with massive pikes, and obviously lived on a massive expanse of grassy plains flatter than the average pancake?
Gavin is looking like when you come back from the pub and your mate just took a line of speed and won’t shut up explaining how the Gladius works, yeah man I get it can but we just chill out and watch Eurotrash now.
Can you call the gladius the sword of the empire when for the vast majority of its existence it preferred the spatha or its descendants? Even if you discount anything past 480, it must still at least compete with the gladius for duration of preference after the rise of Augustus.
Good point
The Roman army strengths were the same as American army strengths: solid chain of command, disciplined soldiers, economy of scale
You don’t need the best fighters to have the best army
the armour only gets more intricate when you take into account what is depicted on Trajan's Collum with elements found in the gladiatorial arena being adopted widespread by military forces to better defend legs and lower arms from weapons like the Falx.
combining these with existing armour like the Lorica Segmentata to create a proto suit of armour.
Did you see the discovery of original gladii in Israel? Hidden alongside documents in a cave. Sheaths as well.
I have a video about it 😉 Please take a look
I had read long time ago that gladius was good for cutting too. When I handled it felt almost like butcher's cleaver with nasty point for thrusting.
That's a very interesting observation.
Thanks for these in depth info on the gladius big shield towards long sword and more rounded shields.
I wonder if this could stem from a more offensive Rome with larger formations towards a more defensive smaller lighter forces quickly raiding from cover of say Hadrians wall forts.
In a smaller nimbler force you need to fight more individually. Doing quick punitive raids to keep tribes outside (and inside) the Hadrian wall and Rhine line policed.
And, I guess at lower cost. 18:37
You briefly mentioned the possibility of a "transitional sword" between gladius and spatha, and the possibility that certain types of soldiers were given those;
From practicality alone (it takes a lot of effort, time and money to make new swords for the whole roman army....) I guess, that once the romans wanted to shift to a new sword type, they started out handing the new swords to the troops, where the new swords were thought to make the best use/results. Thus for a short period you would see certain types of soldier carrying the spathas before others.
Back in the day, when I served in the Danish army, I was in a transport compagny - bringing supplies to the fighting men. At that time, the army was getting a new rifle system, lighter and with smaller caliber cartridges. We were the last ones to get the new rifles, because we were not supposed to do a lot of fighting....
Again context is key to understanding.
👍💪👍.
I'd like to see a comparison of gladius vs Ka-bar and what advantages and disadvantages it has. Also which one would you want to use in trench warfare or close quarters combat?
I'd definitely be bringing a gladius to a modern close quarters engagement as a compliment to a battle rifle/carbine with or without bayonet, and hand grenades.
When someone lunges out of a door or window to grab your rifle, the sling attatched to the webbing will retain it long enough to draw a gladius from a horizontal sheath behind your back and stab with it as they pull you towards themselves by the rifle sling...
@@SonsOfLorgar sarcasm?
K-Bar is smaller, of course. Lighter and can be carried on more locations of one's body comfortably or conveniently.
Shorter reach, though. So one would use knife fighting techniques instead of sword or machete techniques.
Both are part of a system or kit of equipment.
Gladius might do better than the K-Bar as a digging/entrenching tool. K-Bar is a better substitute for a steak-knife or meal-preparation knife.
Compare with the Guhkri and a machete, as well, to make the experiment interesting. :-)
@@libraeotequever3pointoh95 I had been under the assumption that if you train with something like the gladius it would be just as easy if not easier to use in such cases. However, you'd probably have to start out training with it from a younger age type deal.
How prevalent do you think the other type of short sword(kopis/falcata) was around the mediterranean compared to the straight swords?
How much did improvements in metallurgy impact the transformation of the Roman side-arm from the gladius to longer blades? Was the mass-production of blades during the early Empire a factor in shape, and did the move to artisan forging encourage longer blades? Just wondering, beyond the battlefield, how much material sciences played a part.
The evolution from gladius to spatha was more a function of the transition of the major strike arm of the Roman army. The cavalry replaced the infantry as the most important component of the army. The longer spatha was necessary to extended the reach of the infantry when engaged against horsemen. The Romans had been issuing longer swords to their cavalry for centuries and had the technology to produce them.
You're wrong. The "roman gladius(short sword)" as you call it, is/was actually,The Gladius Hispaniensis and it was one of various Lusitanian Weapons with which many romans found death when fighting our Ancestors of Lusitânia (Present Portugal). They saw its effectivness in their own bodies and adopted it . But that doesn't surprise me , as all anglo-saxons are arrogant and ignorant about SACRED HISPANIA(which I prefer to call The Sacred Hibéria) ANCESTRAL HISTORY.
I really only had a passing interest of old weapons until I came across your channel. Really like it. Thank you,
In my eyes, the form of the Gladius and similar swords like the Xiphos give some things away: They have a bulk of material at the tip and thus are somehow a hybrid between an axe and a sword, which does make sense when you consider that soldiers in those times did not only fight with their weapons. They had to march miles and miles through hostile territory, somehow get some food, firewood, buld a camp every day in the evening AND they had to carry all their stuff with them.
So, when I would have to walk all the way from, let's say Cunaxa to Greece and carry all my belongings with me, I wouldn't want to carry a seperate axe, a cooking knife, a machete and in case I get into a battle a long sword with me, but instead a tool that I can use to cut down small trees and bushes into firewood, to cut some vegetables or bread or meat and to hack through thick bushes, while I still could use that tool in battle as a not too bad alternative to a long sword - especially since my main weapon would be some kind of spear, which I already have to carry with me - but probably could use as a tent pole at night. So, dual usability would be an important thing to me, as it would be for people who hike or do outdoorsy stuff today is.
And since the Romans were the first to realy organize their military and its logistics, at some point in time they might just have been at a point, where it WAS more sustainable, more cheaper and more sensible to use longer swords and instead have some more specialized units in their organization that cook, organize firewood or do all that stuff. A legionary under Caesar would probably while on campaign have to march through gallic or germanic forrests, hunt for food, cut his own fire wood and build his own camp while fending against some Raiders occasionally - while 200 years later his descendant would instead live in a brick or stone built castellum, where food is provided to him by his units cooks, he would buy firewood or meat from the locals who live nearby and the only reason for him having a Gladius would in fact be to fight off barbaric intruders.
The gladius was a terrifying weapon, macedonian sources remarked on the savage injuries and wounds it inflicted. Not just thrusting but chopping and hacking
The key is the Systematics. A single Legion guy tooling around is eh… the total weapon and fighting SYSTEM has to always be considered.
A Hema 1v1 is nothing like how a lot of the equipment was designed to be used.
Hell an “AR-15” pattern gun is middling. Put that gun in a group or platoon of the USMC with a full kit, and it’s suddenly a very significant part of the overall system.
@8:30 A point that often gets lost is that Vegetius is not describing the Roman Army in perpetuity. He's giving relative snap shots of the Imperial Army. By contrast if you dig into modern and ancient literature dealing with the Legions of the Mid and Early Republic you get a very different image: Each Roman Legionary occupied a "tactical box" that's nearly 2m from end to end. Yes, you need more space to cut with a gladius than you do to thrust BUT the Republican Legionary had that space.
I think there's an interesting discussion to be had about using the massive shield as an offensive tool. How much of Roman tactics would have been about shoving like a rugby scrum?
When Suetonius fought Boudicca`s army at the battle of Watling street his pre battle speech makes a point of telling his men to bash the enemy with their shields first before using their swords
Sort of off the specific topic. A friend of mine was reading about medieval murders in York. Among the many baselards, he ran across a reference to a bladed weapon called a "twyfel". I've looked in the OED, but can only find a 1460 reference to "twyfyl" as meaning "doubtful". Have you heard of a sword or knife called a "twyfel"?
The Gladius of the Iberian Peninsula, that of Hispania, is the most beautiful. The Gladius Hispaniensis, longer and with a more pronounced tip, suitable for carrying on horseback as well as on foot. An evolution of the classical Roman Gladius
I think it was used as a "pommel" primarily. Blades of all time even today are incredibly valuable so "using" one in an actual Battle would be because of something desperate. Think of all the literal blood and guts everywhere, bugs, birds, sweat, stench...easy to lose your both literal and psychological "grip" on the situation. Probably would wrap the grip in leather though actually. Plus the sheath was really important and a sight to behold. Romans were definitely "King of the Kit" back in the Day. Modern times "King of the Load Out" as well i imagine but i don't think Romans had actual boots but certainly had ankle support. I would think there was a crisis of having flat feet back in these times as well. Either way a literal "slippery slope" if suddenly taken by a need to start hacking away at everything. Ancient Romans didn't have formal rock throwing units as well interesringly and unlike the Greeks who were really good at "pelting"(with stones.)
why did Roman soldiers of the 300s look like Germans? Because they were Germans very often and outnumbered origin roman from Italy or southern Europe. Even their military leaders were Germans or Gaul-Romans. So it is quite obvious that tactics and equipment changed and auxiliary troops of the past became regular legion then.
Early swords: Blade handle.
Later swords: Blade crossguard handle.
Later than that: Blade crosspart now goes over knuckles too and sometimes full basket hilt.
Later than that: Blade handle for people with child sized hands.
Modern: Blade knuckle guard handle.
So.
They carried on the right side and drew from the right side
so they didn't drop shield.
Fascinating.
Something else I speculate about the Gladius: it's an incredibly intuitive weapon to use. If the Romans needed to quickly raise up a legion, and didn't have a lot of time to train the men, they could focus on drilling formations over teaching their men how to use their weapons, because they are extremely intuitive to use when you hold them with a large shield. Yes, the men would train with the weapons as well as formations, but in a pinch, learning the formation is arguably more important than learning the weapons, and having a sword that some uneducated farmer could pick up, immediately hold correctly, and intuitively be able to use in a pinch would be incredibly helpful.
Any weapon that requires you to learn how to swing it is going to be *much* harder to teach, because you have to think about edge alignment and technique, especially around defense. But with a weapon designed so well for thrusting you need no such training. You *can* cut with it, especially once you're trained up, but the intuitive, obvious thing to do with it is thrust. It IS a sword in the end, and very effective as a cutting weapon, but if I'm a new legionary and am not quite comfortable with it, I'm going to be chilling behind my shield and poking anyone who gets too close.
Nice video, just want to point out that since it's a Greek word (and I'm Greek :P) it's pronounced ksifos, no z or y sounds in there. "Ks" is self explanatory, and "i" as in how you pronounce the letter "e". Cheers
The long blade Celtic Spathe needed to be wielded so requires open order fighting! So 2 Legionaries per Celt leader or bodyguard! The Spathe was used by Roman cavalry to close distance created by riding! & typically against a fleeing enemy!!! The late Roman era came after the empire was walled off & heavy armour stopped them getting to breaches! Leading to chain-mail being dropped!!! Also used with a very large flat curved shield with it's plumbata rack fitted!!!
The Romans copied or adapted items from everywhere for almost everything, their classical helmets were called "Galea" - something they had adopted from the Celtic tribes in the north of the Italian peninsula (even before they invaded Gaul) - which you add to the "gladius Hispaniensis" from the Iberian peninsula, "braccae" which are influenced by Gaulish trousers, and Greek "pteruges" ("feathers" or stips of armour attached to garment worn under a cuirass to protect the shoulders and groin), etc.
Following Marius, the Imperial Roman army were composed of highly trained, professional soldiers. That was a huge advantage. The local allied units took on the training of the Romans so they got better too. Barb vs Legionnaire? Barbs die.
Great vid. I can imagine the Romans moving to longer swords as cavalry become more prominent on late Roman battlefields. Fighting with the shield and gladius was doubtless effective against opponents on foot, but I suspect they were not so effective if most of your opponents were mounted.
Three additional factors I would add to the gladius being its original size then getting longer over time:
1) It was proportional to the original grain/fruit-fed mediterranean tribes who used it, who were generally smaller and more ectomorphic than the bigger, heavy-protein-raised, long-limbed endomorphic northerners they eventually encountered. The northrons used longer, heavier swords to some extent because they could.
2) The "frontier barbarians" were also more prone to using axes, which changes the whole dynamic. A heavy square ground-hugging shield isn't so good at stopping an axe head's momentum swinging downward from above, so you have to switch to a smaller, more maneuverable shield that is easier to raise up over your head in a hurry. Goodbye scutum, and so the gladius loses some of its context when it loses its partner shield.
Obviously, once the romans could hire frisian, norse, or northern keltic mercenaries, that changed the standards on their side as well, as you mentioned. Still, about the only thing anyone could do about the cliff people / suebi was to stay the hell out of their territory, and hope they stayed in it. Sometimes, the best strategy is knowing where to limit your boundaries, as John Cleese put it in "Silverado": "Today, my jurisdiction ends here..."
2) The northern center-grip large round shield, which can be used edge-on from a side stance to maintain space, especially combined with a longer axe, gave considerable range advantage in melee. The shorter gladius is great if you can get within a couple feet of your opponent; but if they have a setup that can hold you off and strike from over a meter away, it just doesn't have the reach, especially if the opponent is already 6 inches taller and longer in the arm.
Thus, this late-roman/early-migration arms race/evolution involved both the equipment sets involved, as well as the physical properties of the soldiers themselves.
Not sure if it's just my device but the video framing keeps jumping and it's extremely annoying.
When comparing legionaries against say, Gauls, I'd not doubt that Gaul warriors would be well versed in their way of warfare. Caesar describes them as fighting in phalanx. But a key advantage the Romans would have is everything is more standardised, the discipline, the fitness and the equipment. You might have great Gaul warriors, and guys who can afford mail, but you also have guys who might not be as motivated or might not have a mail shirt.
Imagine in the future people making movies about the US and you have soldiers in full modern body armor carrying M16 rifles around on D-Day.
All weapons systems have a philosophy of use. So, if you compare swords outside of their intended philosophy of use, especially when the swords are part of a defined weapons system, they won't fare very well. Don't compare a gladius to something like, say a broadsword or a katana, etc.
Mr Stabby can get in multiple hits during the time a weilding swing is made!!! & If you get a Celtic chief in chain mail then slashing will likely blunt the tip! Stabbing between the rings & ramming it in can open up a 2.5-3" slit in Celtic chain-mail! As battlefield finds have shown!!!
Hi Matt, could you pls make a vid about keeping your weapons in shape (maintenance, rust-removal, oils, etc). thx!
I wonder how much of the transition from the Late Republican-style Gladius and Scutum to the Spatha and oval Scutum was a matter of changing doctrine and how much it was a matter of the changing cultural makeup of the Roman Army.
Like, was the change a top-down decision by Roman Generals, or did the gradual shift from Italian citizen soldiers to Germanic mercenaries mean that the overall army saw a switch to what they were already making and using where they lived?
The Roman Army was more effective when they used the gladius. The short gladius required soldiers to move forward, to stab and slash at the enemy, while the longer swords of the fourth century encouraged soldiers to move backward, to get enough room to swing and thrust their long swords. Hmm. Which would be more effective-- an army that moves forward, or an army that moves backward?
Context is everything. From what little I know the substitution of the gladius with a longer sword coincided with the division of the Roman Army into the limitanei and the comitatenses. The size of the legions was also reduced from a theoretical 6000 + auxiliaries to a "legion" of 1000 or so with a higher ratio of light troops, many of whom were missile armed.
As an aside I think I remember reading somewhere that in the 3rd century and early 4th century, where Rome was fighting border wars and dealing with internal problems, that the practice had developed of taking roughly 2 cohorts from an established legion's home base and using them , together with similar detachments from other legions, as "firemen" to send to where the latest trouble spot was, these detachments then become the basis of the new legio.
The legio in a the comitatenses/field army was thus not so much the main strike force but more intended to act as an "anchor" for the light troops and much improved cavalry to do the main work, plus the size of actual armies was a lot smaller than in the age of Republican and Imperial expansion - never mind that the population had declined and the traditional recruiting grounds of Spain and Illyria were simply not producing the number of quality recruits needed.
Where this is going is that while an early imperial legion of 6000 men could be trained to fight shield to shield and occupy a given space, and therefore fill a gap between(for example) 2 woods, a much smaller legion simply couldnt occupy the same space shield to shield with the density of an early Imperial legion, never mind the points made above.
Hence the dense formations were simply were not possible, and so the style of fighting had to change, hence the demise of the gladius.
I have to strongly disagree with you. Roman gladius was inspired in the Spanish indigenous swords, they copied it's design mostly from the free celtic guerrillas throughout the entire peninsula. But not satisfied with that, they realized that because it was manufacture in Italy, they still were of inferior quality than the swords produced in the iberian peninsula. Is the reason why they later replaced the gladius from Italy directly with the swords produced in zones of Spain or Portugal. Surely same applied with shields and other military equipment
What about gladiatorial combat? Where the Gladius and a small buckler / style shield was used against the trident and a net, etc. A skilled gladiator armed w/ a Gladius / buckler would have been pretty formidable. My point is, how did Spartacus and Co. inflict so much damage on trained Roman Legions outside of their one on one training gladiatorial training?
But what about the triarii spears? I've read that on the Early Imperial Era the Roman army adopted the coohrte as a battle tatic, where the first line of the blocks was composed by soldiers armed with spears.
the romans in the line used like a chaimshaw white a short blades eat down the attacking enemy's.
The romans secret was organisation, training, using units more flexibel als the others, like greek. Ther was many important parts, like combat enginering (including digging). And the economy to hold a huge professional army for centurys.
Sloghtly oddball but I’ve wondered if there is a similarity in fighting effiectiveness between the Roman units armed with gladius/scutum and Shaka’s Zulu regiments armed with assegais and large shields. A similar solution to similar tactical need?
I think we all pretty much agree if properly maintained armour lasts forever. Is it possible one reason Rome 'fell' (or at least lost it's military edge) was over time (decades, centuries?) barbarians accumulated sufficient armour to reach parity?
The change in composition of the soldiers being used by the empire, the middle and late empire, would also have an input on why they change their weaponry and tactics. In the Republic and early empire periods, you're talking mainly Latin or latinized groups. In the middle and late empire you're talking about a large number being horse riders or barbarians of one type or another. Even the ones who were romanized, were not latinized, and therefore had different cultural backgrounds from which they drew from both and are fighting style, and the weaponry available to them
Indeed they were supposed to be very affective at cutting, which is not referenced as much. Roman Historians reference many instances of legions “ cutting the enemy soldiers, horses, farm animals , women, and children to pieces “. With the Gladius Hispaniensis.
OMG 😂 gladius and scutum worked together? WOW!!!!
thanks bud
Could somebody explain to me , why everyone says that the roman spatha , was the ancestor of viking age swords , when Celts used long bladed swords , before the Romans and even before AD ???
Passing thought but could the ‘transitional’ Spartha from the Gladius not be an institutional economy measure using old Gladius reworked to a longer, if thinner, form?
Kinda wonder how the High Imperial army would have with late imperial roman equipment with that times population, wealth, and logistics. Seeing video's of todd's channel it is apparent a plumbata can be thrown alot of further than a pilum, a single legionare can carry more plumbata than a pilum, spears are obviously a spear anti calvary weapon than a sword and spatha would longer cutting and thrusting range than a glaudis. It just seems like the Late imperial soldiers are more verstalite fighters than a earlier which is just heavy armored shocked heavy infranty at close range and nothing else. It reminds me that the steam engine was invented around this period, but one bothered to do anything with cus the ancient Greek and Roman world was awash in slaves. People will ignore things, even something would argue is improvement, if they don't see a need for it.
one correction "Hispanic sword" (gladius Hispanus) means hispania or iberia sword not spanish sword, the gladius Hispanus were used by the celtiberian that came from north and center of modern Portugal and Spain. So called spanish sword is a big error.
I think the Gladius was designed to penitrate mail and cloth/leather and deal a decisive deadly wound being so wide. It's my favorite sword so much it's my online alias.
I do want to note that overall the gauls would NOT be as well armored as the romans. The romans did indeed adopt mail armor from the gauls, but only a scant handful of gaulish warriors would be equipped, the most socially important ones. Most gauls had no chest armor. And even helmets are kind of rare in archaeological finds compared to spears.
It's kinda sad that Vegetius is one of the better sources we have on Principate military protocols, because he's writing almost two centuries after the Roman army stopped fighting this way, lol
Any info on the steel/iron quality of the gladius? Having the pilum being a relative thin piece of steel being strong enough to withstand bending when stabbed or thrown at an object. That same could have been applied when the gladius waqs only a stabbing sword.
Being a wide sharp blade, balanced for good cutting by being leave shaped thus top heavier then a narrow straight sword is a give away that it was used a lot for cutting. And being short and wide also a excellent tool sword when building camps or having to walk through dence forrest, bushes, tall grass areas, having a sword that is a weed cutter and wood carver is making it a multitool really.