Stalin's Record Player: The DP-27 Light Machine Gun
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- / forgottenweapons
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Despite having early experience with the Madsen LMG prior to World War One, the Soviet military opted to follow the German path of machine gun development after the war. Valuing the sustained firepower of belt-fed guns like the MG08-15 and MG08-18 over the portability of guns like the BAR or Lewis, the Soviet Union formally adopted the Maxim-Tokarev in 1925. However, Degtyarev developed his own simple, light, bis-fed design anyway, with support of one M.V. Frunze in the military establishment.
The Army ultimately came around to the benefits of a more portable light machine gun, and the Degtyarev was adopted in 1927, with production beginning in 1928 (hence the references to both DP-27 and DP-28 as its name). It would continue to undergo iterative development for several years, eventually becoming a very durable and reliable weapon for the Red Army. Service in World War Two showed a few shortcomings however, resulting in an upgrade program to the DPM, adopted in 1944. This involved moving the recoil spring to the back of the gun, adding a pistol grip, and improving the bipod. In 1946 it was adapted to belt feed, and eventually only pushed out of service by the introduction of the PK in the early 1960s.
Degtyarev's gas-operated, flapper-locked system proved to be very successful, and he used the same basic system in the DShK, DS-39, and RPD machine guns as well.
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Fun fact: The magazine also doubles as a film reel containing the original cut of “Battleship Potemkin”
Or a frisbee
I'd pay to see that... (seriously, it's one of the classics of cinema).
HEAVENLY POTEMKIN BUSTERRR
Finall, after all this time, a 'fun fact' that is both fun and factually 👍
@@SonsOfLorgar Also true
Ah yes, the "DinnerPlate-27".
Not like they're using them for much else
ah, yes, Tachankas light machine gun!
(joke)
@@jakubas6396 it is tho
😂😂
Always found the "Dinner plate-twenty eight" to rhyme a lot better.
Auto caption: "Taking a look at the standard Russian light machine gun of WWII. This is the dead giraffe."
I laughed, thanks
Material shortages really took a toll on em.
Somebody did a nice job repairing the receiver after it had been cut in half!! I am surprised you didn't point it out Ian you do most of the time.
I've never heard of the Shooter's Outpost Museum before but I can't wait to see what fantastic arms are in store next.
It's my LGS. Owner has an insane collection of machine guns, enough to have his own museum.
My LGS also. Great place.
Same here I got down there about every weekend haha
@@kyleward1654 Damn yall got half the town out here
I got to meet him there. Fantastic store and the guy who owns the museum has some one of a kind firearms that don't exist anywhere else. Apparently there's a .22LR M1 carbine that there was only 1 prototype of in there. Don't know if he'll do a video on that but I know he said he did quite the handful of firearms reviews here.
Some say you can hear "MOUNTED AND LOADED" in the background if you're careful
3:57 Russian doesn't use Latin script so when transliteration is used there are usually no silent letters, which is to say all letters in Frunze are pronounced.
I don't know about the DP-27 or DP-28 controversy but TH-cam auto subtitles calls this Degtyarev a "dead giraffe"...
Русские с этим "мертвым жерафом" выиграли войну и взяли Берлин.
I'm actually impressed by the simplicity in this wow
00 7: IIRC DP-27 has the least amount of moving parts of any rifle calibre full auto weapon. Record may still hold, atleast in LMG category.
Seeing the trigger and the receiver will always remind me of the RPD.
The fun game of: what will the auto-generated captions caption the name Degtyrev as?
My favourite was 'Dead giraffe'.
Thats my new name for it
This was the service weapon of the ex President of Finland, Mr Mauno Koivisto who passed away few years ago. He served in WW 2 special forces under Captain Lauri Törni, or Larry Thorn as he was known in U.S. Green Berets later. They conducted aggressive reconnaissance missions behind enemy lines. Mr. Koivisto still remembered the serial number of his service weapon in an interview. That very gun is now in a collection of Finnish war museum.
3:52 "attracted the attention of M.V. Frunz". - His last name is Frunzé. The last E is not silent. The correct pronunciation is closer to "Frunz-eh"
The surname Frunze is derived from the Romanian word frunză, which translates as “plant leaf”. his father was Moldovan
No surprise this design was as effective and long-lived as it was - the internal design is amazingly elegant and free of complex machining. I'd imagine it was fairly cheap and easy to build and maintain.
Apparently it cost about the same as SVT rifle
Yeah, Russian soldiers used to joke that the "Dinner Plate 28" (TH-cam commenter nickname for weapon) worked better when buried under sand.
@@milesipka ah yes, russian soldiers joked with english puns, totally believe that
My god, the mechanical simplicity and yet the inguinity on display, this gun is truly a marvel of soviet gun design.
I never cease to be amazed by Ian's knowledge and depth of historical info. Great upload!
LMG MOUNTED AND LOADED!
Yes indeed
Oh man, I didn't know Shooters' museum was finally open. I'll have to go visit when I get a day off. Thanks, Ian!
Hearing you call a Maxim MG08/15 a light machine gun was weird, but then I looked it up and found out the /15 actually IS a LMG variant. I learn something every time I watch one of these videos.
Somehow i heard it
"DP-28 mounted and ready!"
Or
"LMG, mounted and loaded!"
Came to the comments for this
Yup, that is the *dinner-plate!*
The manufacturing started in 1927 actually. Friend of mine has one made in 1927. Huge difference in manufacturing and finishing in comparison to WW2 manufactured DPs.
Finnish nomenclature for these is DP m/27. Finnish soldiers referred to it with name "Emma".
Russia: *brings a whole bunch of guns and such to Finland in the late 1930s*
Finland: "Ah yes, from each according to his abilities to each according to their needs. Thanks for the guns, we needed those."
literally a mile away from me, hope you enjoyed your time in NH! That gun room in shooters is very nice.
Gun Jesus has finally made a video about the Lord's weapon.
“LMG mounted”
@@extraneoussolution3372 "and loaded."
RIP Mounted LMG
Yessir
The Lord be walking and may his glory set those pesky Ash's ablaze
"LMG MOUNTED AND LOADED"
Some russian man in a game.
I was looking for this thanks
Pray to the lord
Its so sad that this is gone now
Got my first elite yesterday at level 148. Maining the LORD since Feb 2019
@@quandale_dingle6353 it lives in our dreams. And our hands since it's a primary. RIP turret in wheels
Had a chance to fire one of these on a military range a few years back. Very easy to use - especially changing the mag. Easier to get a wide spread of fire than I thought it would be. The grip safety has to be pulled in really tight though.
I've been following Ian for so many years. I've watched this video probably 4-5 times over the years, and now YT is demanding I see it again. For the last week it keeps popping up as a auto play, in the recommended video side panel and in the top of my home page. Ok, ok, YT I'll watch it again.
I never realized how much the humpbacked rear of the receiver resembles the the Browning Auto-5
What stood out the most about the maxim, was its insane accuracy. in full auto you can put down crazy accurate fire.
The Weapon of Choice for the "Lord"
LMG MOUNTED AND LOADED
the magazine is actually a smart idea in concept, it would allow sustained fire while laying prone while not having a mag sticking up out of the top
One of the main reasons to go for a "plate" mag was lack of springs suitable for box magazine. But Soviet union had a working factory that made gramophones that was able to produce springs for DP mags
the front sight seems really nice
"Tachanka's Gun" or "Big Mommy Ara Ara MG"
Take your pick.
I choose yes
Doesn’t matter; the Fascists will _die _*_even faster!_*
Put a warp nacelle under each bipod leg and it's a plausible starship variant.
LMG MOUNTED ! AND LOADED
I've been waiting for Chanky boy's LMG to show up.
Emma, a popular recording by Ture Ara gave a nickname for the DP-27 in Finnish use.
Finns called this "Emma" after a popular wartime record.
The excellent and informative intro seems to prove the old age adage; no matter what you have, the grass is always greener!
Once you remove the magazine, the DP27 is very slim design. Had it been made belt fed, that would have made it significantly better, while the pans are ok, belts are better, even if the belt was only a 50rd segment.
There is actually a belt fed variant called the RP46, which saw use all the way up into the 1960s.
cloth machine gun belt was causing too many malfunctions. And the widespread production of a metal machine-gun belt began only in the middle of the war.
This gun was called "Emma" In Finland according to a popular song at the time because the magazine resembled a gramophone disc. I handled one back In the early 90:s when I was In the Finnish army but didn't get to shoot it. I believe they were well liked by the Finns during the war as they were simple and fairly reliable unlike the Finnish Lahti-Saloranta Light machine gun which was overly complicated.
I've always thought this gun looked really cool but the magazine design always boggled my brain. Thanks for showing how it worked. 😊
Testament of quality is than in 1944 there was more DPs in Finnish army than our official Lahti-Saloranta LMGs. All catched from Soviets, one at the time. Finns used every opportunity to save them. When after some wilderness battle all other captured guns were thrown to swamp before yomp, DPs were carried home. Finns had to start domestic magazine production.
"LMG, no longer mounted, but loaded"
Im honestly dissapointed that Ian didn't say "LMG mounted and loaded"
Shot one in Warsaw a few months ago... (and a ZB-26/MG-42 /PPSh 41 and PPS 43 and an MP-34... ) Real bucket list stuff. Great fun! The way the magazine on the DP clicks around as it feeds is quite distracting! LOL
Ah yes, we Zakus are very familiar with this gun. Thank you for the video of this wonderful LMG!
Very, very interesting ... that guy could build a solid, long-lasting, dependable gun!
Fun fact, Mikhail Frunze was from Bishkek, Kyrgyzstan. During the Soviet days it was called Frunze.
im pretty sure the bolt can be forward when removing the barrel
I had to work the day Ian came to Hooksett. Usually I don't get up there due to the distance. I did just purchase a fine product from their Amherst store.
We will have disco party tonight. Comrad Vasili will rotate few discs on his DP-27.
On the Netflix show, The Defeated, the DinnerPlate has a pretty good cameo.
I am really enjoying your videos, thank you!
Again, so COOL keeping in mind when this was developed.
Would it be possible to just turn the bipod around to be able to lean into it? Seems like an easy thing to do even if it means that the folded bipod legs would stick out in front of the gun...
How does Ian know my vanguard loadout I'm fucking about with...? Please stop it Ian!
Ah yes, the gun with the manhole cover for a magazine
Dang, learned way more about this thing than expected. Really cool.
I wish Ian had gone over "How" the magazine was reloaded.
I mean, it's pretty obvious, innit? You just pull the tab at the top and drop rounds through feed lips
Looks like the Starship Enterprise 🚀
LMG MOUNTED AND LOADED
One of Finland's president used DP on his personal weapon in WWII
I been wanting to see a video with this fine firearm
In regards to guys in Ukraine using the DP with a reverse flash-hider: the guns were likely in a some forgotten military storeroom for the past 70 years and it is quite possible that those hiders are now permanently fused like that. At the beginning of the Ukrainian-Russian war, there was a massive shortage of everything, so the army had to use whatever weapons were available in the army reserves.
That's a good point.
@@ForgottenWeapons our war has spawned quite a lot of interesting weapon curiosities, such as a single shot DSHK anti-material rifle.
R/combatfootage currently has a video of a FSA fighter shooting the DP27 in Syria. Amazing how these weapons are still used in modern combat.
Not sure how hard it was to manufacture, but the design seems pretty slick
Imagine being able to say "light" and "Lewis gun" in the same sentence
It's looks great to me for it's time, over all how easy it's to field strip and the low number of parts.
I was wondering what you were filming at shooters
Don’t say it…..Don’t say it….Don’t say….
*LMG!! MOUNTED AND LOADED!!!!*
10 part field strip is nice
Hey Ian, your videos are great, can I ask, I see the obvious point in a muzzle break device but what does that cone do?
i have waited 84 years for this videos
Anyway, the Russians' liking for the MG08-15 didn't prevent them from purchasing substantial batches of Lewis guns during WWI. These were used massively in the Russian Civil War, and even early in WWII, when the remaining couple hundreds were taken from storage to make up for the shortage of weapons.
I have a feeling the Lewis guns were there because the Tsar needed a shitton of guns yesterday.
Russians liked MG-08-15 pattern because they had only Maxims to begin making LMGs. Fedorov being the top dog of early soviet firearms development was pushing for the light and box-fed one. Russians at some moment were looking to MG-13, which was in the early development and managed to get a very early prototype from Veimar Republic for testing and it perfomed waaay better than MT-25 but was complex and DP was already developed.
You’re in hooksett NH! That’s 30 minutes from derry where I live they send their highschoolers to our highschool!
What is the purpose of the dovetail at the end of the barrel? I can't see any reference specifically to it, but I do see a picture of the flexible aircraft mount guns with sight in a similar place but can't see the right side of the barrel.
The last iteration of this weapon was to add an FN FAL underneath it and ship it to Africa for use by Dolph Lungren aka Red Scorpion.
Brother of my grandfather was a squad leader of Lithuanian anti Communist partisans Forest Brothers. He carried DP-27, I still have this old picture of him with this machine gun (picture was being hid in the basement for many many years as it would have been used as a one way ticket to Siberia if found by the NKVD and collaborators).
He and his squad got surrounded in a forest in Ukmerge district in early 1947, that's all the details we know.
Hope he survived brave man
I almost got my hands on one of these dinner plate guns. That would have been incredible.
I’d be flippin that bipod right around
Greetings from NH! Shooter's has a bunch of cool stuff
Have you ever come across a mannlicher m1895? Also do you know if they are reasonably common or not? I'd like to add one to my collection
Is this where Mauser got the delayed roller action from? Change the flaps for rollers?
1:06 That's plainly incorrect. The whole story with the DISA building a machinegun plant in Kovrov to produce Madsen MGs was taking place during WW1. In the meantime Fedorov rifles were seen as LMGs. Besides, Russia was getting Lewis guns, and on the Western front CSRG Mle 1915s. So no, neither the Russian nor the Red army wasn't ignorant of the benefits af an LMG, especially given the mobile warfare they've experienced.
1:38 That's also incorrect. The only reason why Maxim-Tokarev came about is that it was expedient to produce, since the availability of any sort of LMGs was still low and manufacturing capacity for other designs was nowhere to be seen at that point.
still waiting for the ps90 mag design to be exploited as a replacement for pan magazines...
10:00 couldn't you just reverse fit the bipod?
love the channel and content just one thing. You don't pronounce the d in Madsen
very nice explanation of a cool gun
Ian says the sten was pretty crap. However I think it is underated. And I think this gun is too. It did heat up because of the wires around the barrel. However I still think its a slow but very capable lmg. With a capacity of 65000 round life span per barrel.
One person ONE PERSON guaranteed used the magazine as a food plate
Finnish call name " Emma " rapid fire rifle. The Finnish army received 175 of as spoils of war.
dude no way! i live in Hooksett, shooters outpost is awesome!
A wise man once said, ‘’ LMG MOUNTED AND LOADED’’
First gun I picked up in my first game of PUBG, years ago.
Hope you had fun in my state it’s real nice
Is it common to have windage adjustment on the front sight post?
why did the rp system not come into the states but a bunch of dp kits have. You'd think they would have sold the rp conversion devices also.
iirc, The Russians did field a small number of Federov Avtomat mag fed LMGs during WW1.
Aghhh I didn't realize there's a museum right by me
Ian forgot to mention about Fedorov Avtomat, the first Russian LMG. It started it's development pretty much after the Russo-Japanese War and it could perhaps be considered as the first more easily portable LMG, meanwhile the rest of the Europe were designing machine guns for aircrafts before WW1.
The Federov was intended as an automatic rifle, along the lines of the BAR and Chauchat, not so much as an LMG.
Well, sort of a battle rifle then. Supposedly forced into a role of an LMG at times.
@@ForgottenWeapons The line between those was really blurry, especially given that it was classified the same way as Madsen: ружьё-пулемёт, literally 'gun-machinegun', as calque from the French _fusil mitrailleur._
In any case, even if we exclude Chauchat as well, there were LMGs in Russian service at the time, the aforementioned Madsen for one, and Lewis gun was also used. And it was well understood what an LMG in its modern sense is, it's just that Maxim-Tokarev was the only thing that could be made at the time.