From my understanding, Dakotaraptor was a raptor that shattered a long-held stereotype belief about Dromaeosaurs. For the longest time, it appeared to be believed that the Raptors/Dromaeosaurs started out big, but then kept getting progressively smaller, sacrificing body size for brain size. Then Dakotaraptor is discovered, and that belief is pretty much instantly thrown out the window. Because here you have a Dromaeosaur that is nearly as big as Utahraptor, but it's living alongside T-Rex.
Its likely Dakota Raptor did exist, as it fit well with the Utahraptor and Juvi T-Rex's and there was overlap as the Rex's likely competed with the Dromaeosaurs in what ever niche they filled. Even today in North America several predators overlap each other. The Bears, Wolves, Mountain Lions, Coyotes, Fox etc. A number of them will tend to prey on the same animal or feed on alternate food sources. Bears, Wolves and Coyotes for example are not strictly carnivores and can and do eat other sources if they find them. Its likely this was the case for the dinosaurs. The Utah and Dakota likely filled the role of a medium sized predator, and the T-Rex young filled the role temporarily as one as well until it reached a large enough size that the raptors couldn't challenge.
Let's examine some modern species interactions that may shed some light on predator competition. In Yellowstone, we can see that wolves and brown bears overlapp and often interact with each other. In British Columbia, brown bears and cougars are both large predators that have population that overlapp. These animals niche partition. Cougars are ambush hunting specialists, who use the dense undergrowth of the (dwindling) Canadian forest to obscure themselves. They also hide on steep rock faces. Bears often hunt by ambush, but not to this degree. Bears often forage and diversify their diet. I wonder if a similar kind of interchange wasn't taking place here. Perhaps this raptor was scaling the mountainous west coast, or scrambling up large trees to pounce on prey below. Juvenile Tyrannosaurus were thin, built for speed. Perhaps dense woodland was more suited to the raptors, watching intently for something moving on the forest floor. Open spaces or scrubland more suited to the lithe young tyrannosaurs
@@lukekurlandski7653 But bears WILL TRY to 'roll' another predator's kill if the bear is big enough (hell, 'Grizz' will even tangle with wolf packs--conversely wolf pack will also try to swarm a Grizz if it's a big kill).
My guess is the medium sized predators were both large dromaeosaurs and juvenile tyrannosaurs. I’m guessing the dromaeosaurs ran in larger groups so they could stand off the rexes without risking a fight. I’m guessing juvenile rexes also ran together in small groups until they were big enough individually to intimidate more than one raptor.
There's no real evidence of gregarious behavior in droneosaurs except for some fossil footprints of a group walking in the same direction that was found in Asia, and that site with the Deinonychus surrounding the dead ornithopod.
I think of Dakotaraptor the same way I think about Nanotyrannus. Its not only possible but likely a large bodied dromaeosaur/ small bodied tyrannosaur coexisted with T. Rex. Of course I, not an expert, am basing my hypothesis off of similar formations from other continents. Tarbosaurus and Alioramus come to mind as the biggest inspiration for my viewpoint but I could be very wrong.
@@CringasaurusIt’s validity is debated matter of fact a paper is coming out sometime soon in favor of its validity. I personally don’t think there’s enough evidence one way or the other so I’m neutral on the debate myself.
@Cringasaurus invalid as it may be and as much as i don't hold much weight for the current understanding of nanotyrannus, it's entirely probable that a small bodied tyrannosaurid coexisted with T. Rex as this seemed to be a condition of almost every other ecosystem from the triassic to the cretaceous. As I pointed out with Tarbosaurus and Alioramus, it's almost certain, with some room for error, that juvenile rexes weren't the only small to medium sized carnivores
@@wyattrippy5939 Honestly not to sound condescending but people in the paleo community seem to have a very narrow minded view on ecology and how it actually works as a general rule.
@bennettfender9927 To be fair it's completely understandable. The prehistoric world shares similarities with the modern world but has enough differences to be foreign. I don't think what you said was condescending as much as it was true
So the question is really was Dakotaraptor its own species or just the adult form of Archeaoraptor? People take it too far when they say it never existed. The animal we're thinking of existed, it's just what we call it that's in question.
The main question is if Dakotaraptor is a separate genus or the remains are just part of Acheroraptor. So there shouldn't be doubt there was a big dromeosaur in Hell Creek, then. . .
There's no reason why medium-sized predator can't coexist with large predator. Best example of this is in the Morrison formation, from the largest Saurophaganax to Allosaurus and to medium size theropods like Ceratosaurus and Marshosaurus. All of them exist at the same place and live just fine
Morrison is a Jurassic formation while Hell Creek is a Late Cretaceous. This is a big deal as there is a noticeable tendency towards decreasing numbers of small to mid-sized dinosaurs in the ecosystems as young of large dinosaurs were taking their place.
I found your video fascinating. Raptors have always intrigued me. I raised many types of Poultry in high school if one ever watched Turkeys, Chickens etc They truly will hunt and eat almost anything Thank you for your great video on the Raptors. 💪🏻🙏🏻✨
If we have so little evidence of this animal's existence...maybe we just leave feathers out of the discussion for now? I have nothing against feathers other than they are becoming a "given"....and shouldn't, especially for an animal so large.
Maybe we are getting a little ahead of ourselves if it’s existence is questionable, I just feel (and this is my opinion) that feather coverings for dromaeosaurs are as much of a given as fur is for any cat. Maybe smilodon was bald, but it seems doubtful, I just take the same approach with dromaeosaurs given their close relation to birds. Even it is a conclusively valid taxon, we probably won’t find direct evidence for feathers 🤷🏻♂️
I question whether an entire niche can simply be filled with the juveniles of a single species that then fills another niche when it grows up. Was this hypothesis based on anything beyond the lack of opposing evidence and public obsession with the T-rex?
In my limited understanding, it is exactly that, the absence of evidence of another medium-sized species. However, just the absence of evidence should not be confused with evidence of absence, After 150 years exploring a formation, the absence of medium-sized predators and the presence of juvenile T-Rex with physical characteristics quite different from those of adults seems to me to be sufficient basis for this hypothesis to be established
Thank you for inviting comment. Lions are co-extant with leopards, cheetahs, and hyenas. From this truth I feel confident to postulate the following: Speed, maneuverability, and intelligence. Three factors that can lead to a smaller carnivore co-existing with a larger one. If the smaller raptor possessed superiority in two or all three of these factors when compared to T Rex of similar size, then it's possible the smaller species could act with relative impunity around its far larger distant cousin. With that said, every dinosaur was vulnerable to crocodile attack as it came to water to drink or search for prey-or mates. My point is that a variety of predators might be supported by an endemic population of prey species. Every dinosaur had to come to water holes or rivers eventually. When and wherever that might be (in tropic or semitropical areas, at least) it's likely there'd be crocodiles. Since most predators in regions inhabited by crocodiles are able to persist (as species if not as individuals), I believe it possible that smaller raptors could do so, despite the presence of either crocodile, or large terrestrial rival/competitor/existential threat.
First of May, I say well done on your video. I really enjoyed it. Thank you for taking the time to make it. My thoughts on Dakotaraptor is that this dinosaur was very real but filled a different role within the environment that it lived in. In turn of food wise I would say that it prayed on young Edmontosaurus and other ormithopods
I like triceratops more than tyrannosaurus. It isn't even that I dislike rexes it is just that I get tired of them being the end all be all, so at least partially out of defiance of popular and over saturated opinions getting tiresome. Same reason I get sick of Jurassic Park being interchangeable with dinosaurs. To the topic I also like deinonychus. Where dakota and utah are like the tigers and bears of the dromaeosaur world it is the wolf, and that sort of stuck with me, plus it was the one that completely upended our understanding of dinosaurs in the 60s and 70s.
Personally i think that Dakotaraptor was more commonly found in dense forests, too dense to accomodate both the juvenile and adult trexs. And the lack of remains up till this point would reflect an animal less commonly seen in the depicted environment. And maybe the animal found had been brought to the area by either flooding or a river.
Referring Dromaeosaurs as these giant groundhawks is so unoriginal. I'd describe them as more like a Bird-Wolf if anything. Of more concern is the classification analysis, the teeth of Acheroraptor are incomparable with Dakotaraptor remains which leaves only the post cranial elements which Acheroraptor apparently lacks. So, how could Paleontologists have suggested the notion both genus are synonymous with each other despite very poor evidence and going out on a limb? That's not smart thinking.
I'm not an expert IRL but can play one on the internet, and I think a lot of problems in paleo-archeology with dinos can be solved if you assume they were cold blooded. This is because unless you assume they grew really fast, there's just not enough meat to satisfy so many of these creatures unless they were like modern cold-blooded reptiles, which can go for a year sometimes between meals. Dinos back then probably enjoyed basking in the sun and regulating their body temperature more than running around slashing things with that big toe and constantly eating. That's my hypothesis and I'm sticking to it. You read it here first!
If dinosaurs were warm blooded then the carnivorous ones still wouldn’t starve to death since, don’t forget that their prey (for the ones that are bigger than bears like trex , giganotosaurus,etc) are usually multi-ton animals that could probably provide enough food for a large warm-blooded theropod for a few days at the very least, maybe a week and a bit at the most.
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From my understanding, Dakotaraptor was a raptor that shattered a long-held stereotype belief about Dromaeosaurs. For the longest time, it appeared to be believed that the Raptors/Dromaeosaurs started out big, but then kept getting progressively smaller, sacrificing body size for brain size. Then Dakotaraptor is discovered, and that belief is pretty much instantly thrown out the window. Because here you have a Dromaeosaur that is nearly as big as Utahraptor, but it's living alongside T-Rex.
It didn't exist 😭
@@stxticnathan6627 Just because a few turtle remains were found with it doesn't mean it didn't exist
@@stxticnathan6627 the raptor existed, It just can’t be called Dakotaraptor.
@@stxticnathan6627it does exist there was still a giant dromeasaur although rare in hell creek
Its likely Dakota Raptor did exist, as it fit well with the Utahraptor and Juvi T-Rex's and there was overlap as the Rex's likely competed with the Dromaeosaurs in what ever niche they filled. Even today in North America several predators overlap each other.
The Bears, Wolves, Mountain Lions, Coyotes, Fox etc. A number of them will tend to prey on the same animal or feed on alternate food sources. Bears, Wolves and Coyotes for example are not strictly carnivores and can and do eat other sources if they find them.
Its likely this was the case for the dinosaurs. The Utah and Dakota likely filled the role of a medium sized predator, and the T-Rex young filled the role temporarily as one as well until it reached a large enough size that the raptors couldn't challenge.
Let's examine some modern species interactions that may shed some light on predator competition.
In Yellowstone, we can see that wolves and brown bears overlapp and often interact with each other.
In British Columbia, brown bears and cougars are both large predators that have population that overlapp.
These animals niche partition. Cougars are ambush hunting specialists, who use the dense undergrowth of the (dwindling) Canadian forest to obscure themselves. They also hide on steep rock faces. Bears often hunt by ambush, but not to this degree. Bears often forage and diversify their diet.
I wonder if a similar kind of interchange wasn't taking place here. Perhaps this raptor was scaling the mountainous west coast, or scrambling up large trees to pounce on prey below. Juvenile Tyrannosaurus were thin, built for speed. Perhaps dense woodland was more suited to the raptors, watching intently for something moving on the forest floor. Open spaces or scrubland more suited to the lithe young tyrannosaurs
Bears (aside from polar bears) aren’t predatory in the same way that cougars/theropods were. The majority of a continental bear’s diet is not meat.
@@lukekurlandski7653 But bears WILL TRY to 'roll' another predator's kill if the bear is big enough (hell, 'Grizz' will even tangle with wolf packs--conversely wolf pack will also try to swarm a Grizz if it's a big kill).
My guess is the medium sized predators were both large dromaeosaurs and juvenile tyrannosaurs. I’m guessing the dromaeosaurs ran in larger groups so they could stand off the rexes without risking a fight. I’m guessing juvenile rexes also ran together in small groups until they were big enough individually to intimidate more than one raptor.
There's no real evidence of gregarious behavior in droneosaurs except for some fossil footprints of a group walking in the same direction that was found in Asia, and that site with the Deinonychus surrounding the dead ornithopod.
Isn’t there fossils of a group of juvenile T Rexs hunting a Triceratops together
I think of Dakotaraptor the same way I think about Nanotyrannus. Its not only possible but likely a large bodied dromaeosaur/ small bodied tyrannosaur coexisted with T. Rex. Of course I, not an expert, am basing my hypothesis off of similar formations from other continents. Tarbosaurus and Alioramus come to mind as the biggest inspiration for my viewpoint but I could be very wrong.
but isn't nanotyrannus invalid?
@@CringasaurusIt’s validity is debated matter of fact a paper is coming out sometime soon in favor of its validity. I personally don’t think there’s enough evidence one way or the other so I’m neutral on the debate myself.
@Cringasaurus invalid as it may be and as much as i don't hold much weight for the current understanding of nanotyrannus, it's entirely probable that a small bodied tyrannosaurid coexisted with T. Rex as this seemed to be a condition of almost every other ecosystem from the triassic to the cretaceous. As I pointed out with Tarbosaurus and Alioramus, it's almost certain, with some room for error, that juvenile rexes weren't the only small to medium sized carnivores
@@wyattrippy5939 Honestly not to sound condescending but people in the paleo community seem to have a very narrow minded view on ecology and how it actually works as a general rule.
@bennettfender9927 To be fair it's completely understandable. The prehistoric world shares similarities with the modern world but has enough differences to be foreign. I don't think what you said was condescending as much as it was true
So the question is really was Dakotaraptor its own species or just the adult form of Archeaoraptor? People take it too far when they say it never existed. The animal we're thinking of existed, it's just what we call it that's in question.
The main question is if Dakotaraptor is a separate genus or the remains are just part of Acheroraptor. So there shouldn't be doubt there was a big dromeosaur in Hell Creek, then. . .
Maybe this was a fully grown acheroraptor.
There's no reason why medium-sized predator can't coexist with large predator. Best example of this is in the Morrison formation, from the largest Saurophaganax to Allosaurus and to medium size theropods like Ceratosaurus and Marshosaurus. All of them exist at the same place and live just fine
Morrison is a Jurassic formation while Hell Creek is a Late Cretaceous. This is a big deal as there is a noticeable tendency towards decreasing numbers of small to mid-sized dinosaurs in the ecosystems as young of large dinosaurs were taking their place.
@@goj1_lag00n what about Tarbosaurus and Alioramus?
I found your video fascinating. Raptors have always intrigued me. I raised many types of Poultry in high school if one ever watched Turkeys, Chickens etc They truly will hunt and eat almost anything Thank you for your great video on the Raptors. 💪🏻🙏🏻✨
Thank you very much for creating & sharing this thought provoking nice video about Dakotaraptor.
It's my pleasure 🙂
If we have so little evidence of this animal's existence...maybe we just leave feathers out of the discussion for now? I have nothing against feathers other than they are becoming a "given"....and shouldn't, especially for an animal so large.
Maybe we are getting a little ahead of ourselves if it’s existence is questionable, I just feel (and this is my opinion) that feather coverings for dromaeosaurs are as much of a given as fur is for any cat. Maybe smilodon was bald, but it seems doubtful, I just take the same approach with dromaeosaurs given their close relation to birds. Even it is a conclusively valid taxon, we probably won’t find direct evidence for feathers 🤷🏻♂️
The “Dakotaraptor” arm bones had quill knobs, like modern birds
now i'm convinced that dakotaraptor is a chimaera of non-dromaeosaurid dinosaurs
Imagine a Dakotaraptor arguing with a Young T.rex over food
I'm still hoping that the pack-hunting tyrannosaur hypothesis still bares out with different aged individuals having different roles in the hunt.
I question whether an entire niche can simply be filled with the juveniles of a single species that then fills another niche when it grows up. Was this hypothesis based on anything beyond the lack of opposing evidence and public obsession with the T-rex?
In my limited understanding, it is exactly that, the absence of evidence of another medium-sized species.
However, just the absence of evidence should not be confused with evidence of absence, After 150 years exploring a formation, the absence of medium-sized predators and the presence of juvenile T-Rex with physical characteristics quite different from those of adults seems to me to be sufficient basis for this hypothesis to be established
My thoughts exactly!
Are you getting cast for the next live action Mario movie?Interesting moustache and great vid as always!
😂
I'm afraid I can't do a Chris Pratt impression as well as Mario
Distractingly handsome ⁉️‼️
I’m starting to feel bad for how much I seem to be distracting you 😂
Thank you for inviting comment.
Lions are co-extant with leopards, cheetahs, and hyenas. From this truth I feel confident to postulate the following:
Speed, maneuverability, and intelligence. Three factors that can lead to a smaller carnivore co-existing with a larger one. If the smaller raptor possessed superiority in two or all three of these factors when compared to T Rex of similar size, then it's possible the smaller species could act with relative impunity around its far larger distant cousin.
With that said, every dinosaur was vulnerable to crocodile attack as it came to water to drink or search for prey-or mates. My point is that a variety of predators might be supported by an endemic population of prey species. Every dinosaur had to come to water holes or rivers eventually. When and wherever that might be (in tropic or semitropical areas, at least) it's likely there'd be crocodiles. Since most predators in regions inhabited by crocodiles are able to persist (as species if not as individuals), I believe it possible that smaller raptors could do so, despite the presence of either crocodile, or large terrestrial rival/competitor/existential threat.
First of May, I say well done on your video. I really enjoyed it. Thank you for taking the time to make it. My thoughts on Dakotaraptor is that this dinosaur was very real but filled a different role within the environment that it lived in. In turn of food wise I would say that it prayed on young Edmontosaurus and other ormithopods
I like triceratops more than tyrannosaurus. It isn't even that I dislike rexes it is just that I get tired of them being the end all be all, so at least partially out of defiance of popular and over saturated opinions getting tiresome. Same reason I get sick of Jurassic Park being interchangeable with dinosaurs.
To the topic I also like deinonychus. Where dakota and utah are like the tigers and bears of the dromaeosaur world it is the wolf, and that sort of stuck with me, plus it was the one that completely upended our understanding of dinosaurs in the 60s and 70s.
Yeah I kinda get the T.rex fatigue. It was an awesome animal, but there are so many more too!
It’s called “The Ghost of Hell Creek” because Dakotaraptor literally didn’t exist.
Source: Pre-teen youtuber who thinks he's smart.
Personally i think that Dakotaraptor was more commonly found in dense forests, too dense to accomodate both the juvenile and adult trexs. And the lack of remains up till this point would reflect an animal less commonly seen in the depicted environment. And maybe the animal found had been brought to the area by either flooding or a river.
Referring Dromaeosaurs as these giant groundhawks is so unoriginal. I'd describe them as more like a Bird-Wolf if anything. Of more concern is the classification analysis, the teeth of Acheroraptor are incomparable with Dakotaraptor remains which leaves only the post cranial elements which Acheroraptor apparently lacks. So, how could Paleontologists have suggested the notion both genus are synonymous with each other despite very poor evidence and going out on a limb? That's not smart thinking.
I live in South Dakota so I have to root for the home team… Dakotaraptor team! Lol
omg a GHOST ORB 0:13
ngl u look like henry cavil no hard feelings XD
How on earth can there be no hard feelings when you’re saying I look like such a famously hideous man?! 😂
4:09 What about Anzu?
i want dakotaraptor to be real
SOUTH Dakota
I feel like I’m being flirted with and I do take that personally 🤭
Well I’m a personal kinda guy 😂
Did you actually copy Dino Corner's video of the same name?
I'm not an expert IRL but can play one on the internet, and I think a lot of problems in paleo-archeology with dinos can be solved if you assume they were cold blooded. This is because unless you assume they grew really fast, there's just not enough meat to satisfy so many of these creatures unless they were like modern cold-blooded reptiles, which can go for a year sometimes between meals. Dinos back then probably enjoyed basking in the sun and regulating their body temperature more than running around slashing things with that big toe and constantly eating. That's my hypothesis and I'm sticking to it. You read it here first!
A paleontologist is what I meant. And keep in mind giant squids are cold blooded and do just fine in the deep sea.
If dinosaurs were warm blooded then the carnivorous ones still wouldn’t starve to death since, don’t forget that their prey (for the ones that are bigger than bears like trex , giganotosaurus,etc) are usually multi-ton animals that could probably provide enough food for a large warm-blooded theropod for a few days at the very least, maybe a week and a bit at the most.
You always look unimpressed by everything
And rather flirtatious 🤭
That’s just my resting British face