Is BA's Club Europe Worth It? Economy and Business class compared...
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 มิ.ย. 2024
- I recently flew to Malaga with BA in business class (and reviewed that trip here: • Flight Review With A T... ). I came back in Economy, and instead of making another dull economy class trip report, I decided to make a video comparing the two experiences. Is BA's club Europe product worth the premium?
To make the comparison as good as possible, I picked flights which left at similar times of day on the same aircraft type.
So what did I find? Well I'm not going to tell you here - you'll have to watch the video (and the ads!) to find out!
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⏰ Timestamps:
0:00 - Intro
2:03 - Pricing
3:36 - On the Ground
5:47 - On the Plane
8:27 - Intangibles
9:37 - So is it worth it?
12:22 - But on the other hand...
Its a balancing act - very well explained
Thanks - this one took a while to make!
Just wanted to say thank you. Your review has literally just saved me nearly £800. I had an offer to fly business return from Heathrow to Cyprus for my wife and I. But before booking I did a quick TH-cam search to see the seating arrangement. Boy I’m glad I did. That’s not business. 😂😂😂. It’s daylight robbery. Great video. Ty. Hope you save other people 💸💸💸💸💸💰💵💶💷💴
Thanks for watching.... You do get some refreshment and it is quite a long flight, but if you're after the seat then its not worth it... Try to get an economy seat close to the front as the legroom can narrow a bit right up the back on some planes
I always fly Club Europe on BA holidays. I just always find a really good deal. I do appreciate the extra service such as fast track security, lounge, on board meal, priority boarding, dedicated crew and check-in areas and it’s nice to have more space with the middle seat being blocked out.
It’s also crucial if you want to move up to bronze, silver or gold as you earn significantly more tier point. My silver status comes in super handy when I’m doing long haul economy.
Also felt sorry for the people that were in rows beyond 12. My last 4 flights were Neo aircrafts which had the slimline seats.
Thanks Ameer - status does help and flying club helps you get there!
Very comprehensive review! As a non-status holder I actually think Club Europe offers better value than long haul, since you're getting the same in-airport experience as long-haul for a fraction of the cost. For a short flight the leg room doesn't bother me and, as I usually fly with my wife, the empty middle seat is nice as we effectively "own" the row. Went LHR to Lanzarote earlier this year, Iberia via Madrid out and BA non-stop back. Having access to the lounges in all three airports (including the outdoor terrace in Lanzarote) was great, especially as we had a few hours' layover in Madrid. Service was great on both airlines, including the BA crew addressing me by name unprompted.
Thanks Mark. Really good to hear a positive review of BA - plenty of BA journeys go well but people are rarely motivated to report that - you see far more unhappy customer who are clearly inspired to complain!
I ALWAYS fly club europe for short haul. If you think about it : 2 checked suitcases + fast track + lounge (best for 7am flights so you can leave home later and shower in the lounge) + front of plane sits meaning almost no queues at the customs 99% of the time + meal service and free drinks - all of this for £150 per flight (almost always £90 on upgrades) it’s SO WORTH the extra cost to get that extra comfort and ease of mind to just show up at the terminal and relax
Hi Matt, great video as always.
There was one thing you failed to mention, when flying in club there is always space for your carry on in the lockers above your seat unlike ‘down the back’ where space can get tight if you are towards the end when getting onboard.
Keep up the good work, your videos have inspired me to gain status and I would love to do a tier point run as some stage.
Thanks for the kind words Neil - as they say, that means there's one less of them and one more of us! Valid point on the overhead bins - my experience is that the crew will always magic them away if the immediately adjacent bin is full, although where they end up can complicate things...
We have Bronze Status, and as a result sneak on Priority Boarding as a result....rushing to board near the front as a result because of the locker space as you mentioned.
The empty middle seat is well worth having. Economy is usually rammed. Even if it's only fairly full, it's pot luck whether an empty seat is in your row. The other onboard convenience not mentioned are the toilet arrangements. Business class gets exclusive use of the forward toilet, the much larger economy cabin is relatively less well served so queues are likely on longer European routes. Much less of an issue on short flights of course.
Good points about the toilet, although in my recent experience that benefit is rarely enforced by the crew...
Great video, Matt. Something worth noting, particularly for those chasing status, is that longer Club Europe routes such as to Bucharest, Malta, the Canaries or anywhere in Greece attract 80 Tier Points per sector, making that even better value if you can get a nicely priced flight. Also worth adding, for those of us living in the "regions" is that a through flight from Manchester, Glasgow etc is often not much more than starting from Heathrow. Manchester to Athens in Club Europe return would net a nice lump of 240 TPs - double that if the double Tier Points BA Holidays offer is still going at the time of typing. Plus... BA has reduced TP thresholds by 25% for most of 2022 (the exact cut-off depending on your Executive Club renewal point). So that MAN -ATH trip, or similar, could get someone straight to Silver!
Keep up the great videos. I'm late to this particularly party, but I'm catching up. :)
Cheers Rob - all good points! I do find though that every video would be 60 minutes long if I followed every chain of advice in every video! The BA Holidays thing is a juicy incentive though...
Superb video. Great analytical comparison, which, for an accountant, takes into account the emotional side of it too. One of the best air flyer channels out here.
Thanks Colin! Accounting for the win...
Brilliant analysis - really enjoyed it. Looking forward to watching the rest of your videos!
Thanks,
Rob
Cheers Rob - thanks for watching!
Fantastic video. Such eloquent elaboration.
Thank you very much!
Great video and loved the analogy to the emotional component
Thanks - enjoyed making that video. Something a little different!
Thank you! I have no checked bags and I won’t eat anything so definitely economy for me I think. Only a two hour flight 🤷
I think a lot of people will agree with that approach...
Great video as always Matt. Your LHR to JFK economy class inspired me to start taking economy again for that leg again. I still prefer a lie flat bed anything longer than 7hrs. Doing Jfk to IST in 1st BA next week....keep em coming
Thanks - over the Atlantic on a day flight - hard to justify business when all you're getting is food and drink and not sleep....
Great video! Was about to book a Club Europe flight from KEF to MAD and then saw this video! Made me remember my unremarkable LH business class flight from OSL-IST and they look quite the same!
Thanks for this review!
Thanks Alvin - club can work but make sure you are getting value for the extra cost!
I'm travelling to malaga tomorrow, great to know this 😊
Have a good trip!
Watched this a second time, having just purchased return, Club Europe, reward flights between Gatwick and Verona, for 27000 Avios and £50. I think that Blue-(non)status me should be able to get his money's worth while getting all emotional. And, surprisingly, it looks like my DIY bookings will come in cheaper than an equivalent package from a well-known travel company - and that's rare.
Great video, with a very clever opening and some spreadsheety fun.
Thanks - sounds like decent value. Have a great trip!
Sounds like decent value! Have a great trip
Great video! Thanks!
Thanks Sergey! Glad you enjoyed it
Hi Matt, BA lounges at LHR/LGW are pretty good and pay for lounges are not nearly as good and most only give you a certain amount of time. Think you could add atleast £10-£15 on top of paid for lounge entry. I think you can stay in a BA lounge all day? Fast track could be valued at £5.00, thinks that the going rate or used to be. Agree that eating and drinking in an airport terminal is costly so bang on with your estimation. The meals on board and free drinks also stack up on board so IMO not a great deal of difference between ET/CE prices.
Thanks - I made this video with Heathrow in mind but you are right about the differences from LGW with the fast track access... And as the food has improved in Club in recent months the arguments for Club are probably even stronger! Thanks for the comment, and thanks for digging this older video out!
Great video Matt. I’m flying BA Club Europe to Milan tomorrow. I’m only going business class for the Qantas status credits.
"The psychology of loyalty programmes" would be an interesting video to me, but probably not many others!
We do this trip at least six times a year so really enjoyed your take on it, and had never thought of listing the monetary value.....Only do CE if over 2K for the Tier Points, and then try to wrap them in a BA Holiday....But now will look at the cost per Tier Point more closely. Thanks for another good video Matt.
You're very welcome Tim
Thanks again Matt for a thoughtful and really well presented video. The Covid issue adds some value I think on the extra space between you and a fellow passenger, and for the sake of 50 quid, I'd do it. Such intangible value is difficult to quantify though.
Thanks Ken - interesting point... Right now there's value in that approach, although planes are sometimes so empty there's even more social distancing possible in economy!
Liked the intro to this video Matt, must say any flight over 4 hours we tend to fly business class although this one was a companion voucher one, going by our recent trip to Cyprus we were very happy with the service plus the meals we very good on all 4 flights GLA-LHR-LCA.
When we got back to Heathrow the e-gates were not opened so had to queue for immigration lucky we were in seat 3DF so were of quickly and got in before it got to busy by the time we reached immigration the queue was long.
Cheers Peter - trying to mix it up a bit with the intro! 4 hours is probably a reasonable duration to flip over to mid-haul (from short-haul) and a different set of considerations apply... Glad you had good service and glad you enjoyed Cyprus.
Greetings from the Scottish highlands - you know the movie Highlander?, I’m 5 minutes drive North in Balmacara Estate. I’ve been binge watching your videos today as it’s been very stormy and I’m stuck indoors. Thank you so much for all the work you put into your videos, they’re brilliant 👍🏻❤️🏴
Much appreciate you watching the videos. I usually recommend them for people having trouble sleeping, but I guess passing a rainy afternoon is another good use for them!
Excellent video - the financials are interesting and you are absolutely right about the emotional aspects.
Having done BA Club Europe a few times and also very recently here's my take:
Plus points: dedicated check-in to beat queues, lounge access (often nicer at destination city as T5 Galleries N&S are like zoos), priority boarding and luggage space, meal provided (quality has significantly improved over the last few years) with [alcoholic] drinks, elbow room, priority disembarking (useful to get to immigration queues first), bonus Tier points (if you're scrambling to retain or reach a status).
Negative points: Poor leg room (same as economy), cost (are all the plus points above really worth an extra £100-200 for at most 2-3 hours flying...this really boils down to what price one puts on comfort, less stress plus perks)
Regardless of Economy/Club Europe, the BA FAs are always top notch - friendly, helpful, good humoured.
Edit: if you want extra leg-room, book an Economy exit row seat.
Good summary!
Thanks for your videos. Just got my silver membership, have 4 more business class trips booked before the end of December which will give me gold status for a year. IMO flying business give me the chance to enjoy the entire journey from the minute i get to the airport.
Absolutely. And quite right too as you are the boss!!!
Excellent breakdown
Thanks!
Really great video again Matt. Nice way to put a twist on a fairly generic trip! I thought I would add a few things having just done some business trips (long may this relative normalcy continue). Lots of valid points in your video but some are a bit different if you are actually flying for work imo.
1) For short notice flights, shorthaul, the premium on business class often becomes very narrow if you need checked baggage. This is truer at the moment than ever because flight prices across the board are out of whack. Flying to Amsterdam last week it was only £15 more to fly BA business, rather than BA economy and pay for 2 large checked bags. Throw in the discount on a conference center hotel booked with the flight, and it was even 10 quid cheaper then flying easyjet. That last point is definitely a result of current weirdness rather than a regular pattern though.
2) Easier and quicker check in really helps. Business trips are busy enough without having to carve our hours in a day to queue and quibble at check in. Also, I have always found BA has a forgiving attitude to baggage dimensions for business class. Helpful when transporting banners etc for trade shows.
3) Tier points. Being able to expense business trips to the company is nice, but honestly club Europe is a tool for minting tier points for me. The 160 tp routes (especially now with the double tier point offer) are just such a great mix of time and cost efficiency. Now if I could only get some regular consulting gigs in Istanbul or Marrakesh...
All excellent points My Lord, thanks for taking the time to share them! I think the thought process is inherently different if someone else is paying! Probably unusual to be travelling on business with such a volume of baggage but that does present you with a real sweet spot! Nice that you can book your own travel too - lots of larger companies think they can do it better by taking all bookings in house but sledgehammer travel policies can ignore nuanced stuff like booking through BA Hols... Cheers!
Great insightful
Thanks for watching!
As a BA gold , most of the benefits are available for me even in the cheapest economy class. So the the break of difference is usually 50 pounds for a single journey. Pre-covid, I got some good upgrade deals for only 39 or 69 pounds in a single journal, mainly to Berlin or DUS.
Thanks Ryan. The equation shifts a little if I'm harvesting tier points but £50 is a good number to have in mind
Excellent analysis - it helped me make my decision for an upcoming trip. As someone who has never flown on BA and has no status on BA or One World Alliance, I really analyzed this decision. We will be flying two short hops - LHR to GLA and then EDI back to LHR - the long haul will be with Delta One from SLC to LHR to SLC. The differentiator for me was checked baggage (coming for several weeks) and club access. Having two checked bags each made up the price difference - the rest is just icing. Looking forward to the trip. The only unacceptable charge for me was to pay to select a seat in Club Europe - that is discount airline BS (a US acronym for "unacceptable"). As such, because the flights are short - we opted to play seat roulette - its not like we are really sitting together anyway with the middle seat blocked out.
Thanks Okee! The seat selection fee... Very contentious but BA holds that ability back for its premium travellers and its a very highly valued benefit - extremely frustrating for those that don't! On short haul within Europe (and the new Club Suites which all have aisle access) its not a particularly big deal deal. Short flight up to Scotland too - have a great trip!
Fab video as always Matt, if the price difference is not too much, it can be upgraded with Avios or there is a chance of proactive upgrade I tend to upgrade to club Europe. Doing so helped me to retain my silver status thus far and this year to try for gold with reduced requirement. Not only for the added teir and Avios points you get and the free flowing drinks . thank you for the review comparing both found it insightful
Cheers Jack. I was offered a POUG for £99 coming back, which was more than the differential when I booked, which was an interesting data point! But I stuck with economy for the video... Had a minute about POUGs in the first draft of this video but cut it out as it was distracting (and I can make a dedicated video about POUGs another day!!!!)
I am using AVIOS to travel to Madrid towards the end of October. My Avios are collected mainly through my BA AVIOS card, exchanging Nectar points from shopping at Sainsbury's and using the BA e Store for non discretionary spend items such as insurance, utilities, electricals etc. The cost is around 25,000 AVIOS + £50 return going economy with Iberia on the way out and Business Class with BA coming back. I think that is pretty good value given the way I collect my AVIOS. I would never pay cash for a Club Europe ticket no matter what the price is.
Have a wonderful trip! And allow plenty of time for some lounge time on the way back - its actually one of my favourites.... It's not trying to be spectacular, but what it does, it does really well....
@@MattsPlanet Yeah I am going to see Arsenal play in Seville, after todays result proper excited with the trip and the game coming. Also travelling first class on Renfe trains, puts UK trains to shame.
Great video this, enjoyed it. If I go from T5 then I'll go Euro Traveller. If I go from T3 then I'll go Club Europe so I can sit in the Cathay lounge. 👌 Not keen on the BA lounges so T3 is brilliant when flying Club with BA.
Cheers Adam. T3 does indeed have a lot to commend it!
Hallelujah, a TH-cam blogger that actually describes the real Y experience. Other bloggers tend to travel in Y and describe checking in at the F area, using fast track security at LHR and then enjoying the Galleries First then getting the best seat in Y - not the typical experience!
Matt, I follow a lot of you tubetravel bloggers, your videos are rocketing up my ratings - your comments seem grounded in the reality of a lot of travellers (like me at least) - trying to get the best bang for our buck if we splurge - most of us are not trying to put on our mortgages on our Amex Cards in order to maintain some form of status
Thanks Paul - kind of you to take the time to comment. It's difficult to make a video about a short haul economy flight, as nothing much interesting happens but I will continue to do so as that is the most common travel experience for most viewers, including me!
The difference if you have status isn't usually worth it. The longer EU legs Tier points are sometimes worth it if you need it. I don't usually bother for solo travel but if 2 of us are travelling then that can be a better option.
Thanks Vince - for short flights that's probably right. If you travel a lot, minimising the impact of the experience is probably the goal but if travel is a novelty, maximising the experience is probably people's goal!
What an excellent review.
Thanks! One from fairly deep in the archives, but I think it's still valid!
@@MattsPlanet I’ve just subscribed so will have a look at some of your more recent videos.
I am of a similar age to you (probably older) and have been flying BA within Europe since before Business Class even existed and they still offered First and Economy as the class choices aboard their Tridents! I have travelled extensively and there were periods when I was averaging 100+ flights a year.
You ask 'Is it worth it?'. That is a very difficult question and depends on how much importance an individual places on various elements. If you are flying on business and your employer/client is paying then of course it doesn't matter (to you). If you are paying from your own pocket, then you do have to consider value for money. I recall once on this very route, Malaga - Gatwick one-way, BA asking exactly Euro1000 (one thousand Euro) one-way more for Club Europe over Economy. I simply couldn't justify that! The same applies to the example in the video where they are asking over £600 extra. That price difference is quite unjustifiable in any real sense.
On the ground, it depends on if you want or need lounge access and if you have other means of gaining access to the lounge. If you have, say, an Amex card which gets you into a lounge, or a Priority Pass or an airline status, then you don't need to pay again in your fare. This assumes that you actually place any value on such access in the first place.
Fast track security (when departing) and fast track immigration (where applicable and depending on nationality) on arrival can be very useful.
I feel that BA Club Europe is a particularly poor product in the air especially since the latest refurbishment where the seat pitch has been reduced to 31 inches throughout the aircraft, the extra legroom in the forward rows having been removed.
I'm afraid that I don't share your opinion of the meal. Sausage and mash, a small salad and a small bowl of I'm not sure what (for desert?) is not my opinion of a business class meal. 20 years ago BA would have served that (sausage and mash) on their holiday charter flights on that route, not even in Economy on the scheduled services let alone in the Club Europe cabin. My personal opinion of this meal is so poor that I could happily go without it and spend the money saved on a much better meal in a nice restaurant in Malaga! The complimentary alcohol and champagne is fine but personally, as I usually have to drive at the end of the flight, not something I particularly want.
Concerning the 'snacks' in economy. I have to laugh at how the definition of the word 'snack' has changed in recent years. In the late 1970's the BA definition of a 'snack' (Y class 'flight snack' catering symbol as opposed to 'meal 'catering symbol)) was a full cold meal complete with starter, cold main course, desert and cheese and crackers! I thought we had hit rock bottom about 15 years ago when on routes such as Malaga - London they replaced the nice hot meal service in Economy with that pizza slice and deli-box. Now that would perhaps fit my definition of a 'snack'. It is of course a great shame that BA joined the low cost airlines in some sort of race to the bottom ....
Personally I would choose to travel in the business class cabin on shorter flights so long as the price difference was reasonable; not dirt cheap but reasonable in the sense of the actual cost of the extras that I will receive. To take the example of the flight where Economy was £81 and Club £705, this could not be justified. Personally I am prepared to pay for QUALITY but this is not something that I feel BA Club Europe currently offers. Having said that though, it is obviously better than Economy.
One thing on which it is difficult to place a value is the importance to a particular individual of being in the (hopefully!) quieter, more refined environment of the forward cabin, away from the 'bucket and spade' brigade. This is actually a much more important consideration than other factors such as the meal.
Many people in the comments section here have said things about points/avios, only paying extra/travelling business class to get more points, only making a journey to get status credits etc ... hmmmm
Thanks Ben - appreciate you taking the time to share these thoughts. They led me to spend some time trying to dredge up memories of BA from the 90's - I wasn't flying extensively back then, certainly not up the front, but whilst the details are sketchy, the memories are broadly good... I guess the key is to compare BA to its current competition, rather than to its historic offerings and I think BA doesn't compare that well on that basis...
Hi Matt! Good comparison. With the "euro business" model, it means that in theory, they can sell the entire cabin as business class. Although that will be an extremely rare scenario. But another theoretical scenario, albeit also rare, is when there are fewer economy seats sold than business class seats. Those would make the "special" boarding lane benefit a bit moot and negligible.
I would put value though on the blocked middle seat: half of £62 (£31). The total value would be £81, still short but time saving would be valuable. Then there is printing one could do at the lounge. Also wifi access which I think is time limited if using LHR's main wifi network.
I'm not sure if I caught this in the video but on a few occasions when I booked a BA flight for myself, it was the no-checked baggage option in 2016. I don't know about now but doing so also forecloses your ability to choose a seat at any point and you will leave everything to chance. And I think it is £30-60 if you change your mind later and wish to check a bag. Business class allows you to check TWO bags so I would value that at over £30, and I emphasise over because the economy option gives you one 23 kg but business is 2 32 kg bags, so almost 3x the weight allowance. Checking bags in is a god-send for cutting time at security.
And on European flights, other benefits, if the business class load is relatively light, is you are seated in front. I value that a lot for a couple of reasons: first to disembark, access to an additional toilet, a better chance of saying hello to the pilot(s).
I am not sure if this is done post-pandemic but on select European flights, you might be lucky to get a medium-haul A321 with a flat-bed. But that is admittedly a lottery.
Unfortunately BA's Club Europe does not seem to offer complementary WiFi. Carriers like SAS do that for their upper classes.
Thanks - that's more detailed than the video you're commenting on!!!
As an American flying BA for the first time this summer, I was shocked to learn this! This makes First Class on a American Airlines CRJ seem opulent haha.
You are quite right - doesn't make that us product "first class" though ..
Very good video explaining the Pro's & Con's of flying Club Europe. As highlighted in the video, disappointed with the "normal" seat and may look at the extra cost of purchasing the 3rd seat or extra legroom seats (which I normally require) in economy when travelling with other half. Currently in Turkey and didn't use Heathrow Lounge on way out (7am) but later flight back so should make full use of it then. Have another trip, this time to Egypt in January, so will see if its a different aircraft/configuration. That said, I'm a mature traveller and have had enough of being squeezed in like a battery hen with screaming kids and/or oafs fore & aft on 3hr+ flights...lol
Thanks Kevin - "oafs fore & aft" is brilliant! Cairo these days is an A321 from LHR so the same tight business class legroom - quite painful (literally) on a 5+ hour flight. BA decided it could make more money from using widebodies on other routes so CAI and AMM lost the comfy planes a few years back...
The London to Sofia route in business great tier point run as well as Bucharest 160 points Sofia 140 quid each way bargin
Indeed - jusy 9 and a half round trips to get to gold... Nearly £3k? Probably helpful to get those last few TPs rather than going the whole way via SOF!
Excellent video Matt. I personally find club world (or business class in general) only stand out on long-haul flights. Darn expensive yes, but the difference is much more substantial don’t you think?
Long haul - economy versus business is a completely different proposition! Premium economy versus business is a completely different proposition! Thanks for the support!
Good video. From my own experience flying Club Europe, the seats seemed to have more cushioning than the economy seats, and the middle seat had a table in its place, which seemed to have been missing in your flight. In my case, I think the seats would have a bit of a higher value, but I think it all depends on the particular aircraft.
I showed it in a video but the "good" seats go back to perhaps row 13 - so the business cabin will have good seats regardless of how back the curtain goes...
Fair comparison, Matt. I often do LON-JER, and occasionally, I have done the £79 upgrade, I think that's too expensive for such a short flight. With that said, I have paid it. I think something like £59 is a fair price for the short flight.
I think CE becomes worth it on the longer flights.
Sometimes, if you're flying W, J or F, internationally, the price difference between CE and ET is minimal, and BA just shoves you in CE.
I'd be more inclined to pay the £79 at the end of the day after a hard week as a bit of a treat!
I upgraded to Sicily in October purely to get the tier points and double the tier points as booked a car too-as its Catania it’s also worth 80 points rather than 40-being a Jersey man i often have to compete with business men for club Europe to LHR seats however I need them for my tier point run to get silver-from then on I’ll do economy with lounge access! Use companion vouchers to book business next time too thus getting more value.
I get the feeling that the JER service hasn't really recovered to pre-pandemic levels yet? Competing with the business traffic must irritate. Started a TP run to Portland from JER a few years back and it was a very pleasant experience. Thanks!
You cost breakdown was very interesting. There is some unquantifiable value though to the benefits that come with booking Europe Business class. I just booked a business class flight from LHR to BER. I chose business because I have a seven hour layover in Heathrow and need a comfortable place to chill (i.e. lounge access). That’s really the main reason, maybe the only reason I booked business for this flight. And the price wasn’t horrible. However, I’m booking Economy for all my other flights while I’m in Europe.
In the U.S. you don’t get lounge access just for buying a domestic business/first class ticket. And, you generally can’t purchase single-entry access to U.S. lounges. Normally, the only way to get lounge access in the U.S. is to either have status or an international business class ticket…or some airlines let you purchase a yearly lounge membership (which isn’t cheap). So, Europe business has a lot of value that isn’t available for most domestic travelers here in the U.S.
Oh, and also, even in first class, meals generally are not served for flights under 2-2.5 hours (depending on airline and route). So, through the eyes of an American traveler, Europe Business may have more value than for someone who frequently uses air travel inside Europe.
The only thing, really, which domestic (non-status) business/first class passengers in the U.S. get is a larger seat, free booze, and possibly an IFE screen…and meals on longer flights. Delta has IFE screens on many of their jets (A220, A319, A320, A321, 737-800, 737-900, 757-200, 757-300, and all their wide-bodys)…even in economy. Only their CRJs, 717s, and Embraer jets don’t have seat back IFE screens. But Delta is an exception. Many American carriers have ditched the IFEs on their domestic aircraft.
Cheers Steve - and for the follow up comment too. The US aviation world does operate a little differently to the European or Asian ones... Lounge access comes with status, so if you can get into the lounge even when travelling economy, that's another reason to skip the business fare...
Excellent comparison Matt. Agree with you wholeheartedly about the "emotional" aspect of flying Club. Keep up the good work!
Emotions are powerful forces!
It would be nicer if BA did make the seat pitch and width a little better than ET. I know why they don't do it, as it's simpler not to, but they could just increase the pitch, and still market it as the same pitch as ET.
I don't think people will feel cheated if it's _pitched_ in the marketing as the same as ET, but you get a better seat. It's like when BA has different generations of its J and F seats in service, if you get an older seat and you complain, BA just says, we gave you a business class seat, we didn't guarantee a specific type of seat... So sit down and pipe down! 🤦🏼♂️😂
I did note that Aegean does widen the pitch a little up front and narrows them as you move back... Still with the flexible curtain depending on demand... Which may be a way of giving something a little extra to those paying a lot extra!
Hi Matt. Flying business class and using the lounges means that you are separated from the hens and stags on an early flight. Also less chance of loads of screaming kids. Peace and quiet is worth it! Charles
Thanks Charles - you did run the risk that some City idiot insists on sharing his conference call at high volume in the lounge, but on balance its probably still a net win!!
Cashed out some Avios for Club Europe, FRA-LHR. Needed some lounge access and baggage allowances. $50 fee vs ?? if I went economy.
Part of that is higher taxes levied on premium cabins... But part of it isn't!!
Great thanks!!! How can I travel like this so much - is this for your job
Hi Darren - this is my job now... I did though spend 25 years wearing a suit and tie doing a "proper" job before , so I have some resources squirrelled away from those years to fund what I am doing now... Thanks for watching!
Not to mention they fact that they charge Club passengers to reserve seats! In fact they cost more to reserve than the Euro Traveller seas.
Interesting point - BA stands out by clinging to their seat booking policy for non-status holders... Those with status love the benefit, those without (quite rightly) hate it!
When the fare is reasonable then I would upgrade, however my best recent flights have been in row 1 on easyjet with speedy boarding .... my seat has never been 'bumped' -(changed by the airline for some spurious reason). Flights have been on time and service excellent.....with plenty of space reserved for carry ons (speedy boarding passengers)...
That's not a bad idea for a video actually - "Is EasyJet still a Low-Cost Carrier?" Thanks Richard!
@@MattsPlanet 1 f on the A319 / A320 2f on the A321 (easyjet) is the way to go!!
Good video but can I make a couple of points? Firstly the seats are not the same throughout the plane, as can actually be seen on your video. The bulk of the economy seats (depending where the divider curtain is) are the ultra thin basic seats. The Club Europe seats have more padding plus an adjustable headrest and are actually more comfortable seats. My second point is regarding value and is that Club Europe works if you are travelling with your full quota of luggage. You get 64 kilos of checked in luggage included which equates to three suitcases in economy. When you factor that cost in, Club Europe can usually pay for itself before you factor in lounges etc. As an aside I fly quite frequently from Cyprus to LHR invariably with Lufthansa as their business class is usually around half the cost of BA and, in my experience, is often cheaper than Easyjet. It means changing planes in Germany (or Austria or Switzerland) but as I enjoy the whole experience of flying that doesn't bother me, particularly as you get lounge access at the transit airport plus meals on both flights!
Thanks! The seat point is a good one although I'm not too worried about baggage - can' barely remember the last time I checked a suitcase let alone 3! I reviewed Lufthansa business from Athens back to London and I thought it was very good - the stop just gives you a chance to explore another lounge, which is fine by me!!!!!!!
@@MattsPlanet My record (pre Brexit) was flying by myself with 6 suitcases, so it is one of the first things that I check, but I know that I am in the minority!! PS other good thing with Lufthansa is punctuality. Only ever missed one connection at Frankfurt and, as I was business class, they put me up in the Sheraton which was right outside the terminal. Had I been economy it would have been a bus ride to a cheap hotel in the city. Worth bearing in mind that you do seem to get looked after better if you are in the premium seats if you have any problems.
Good review, if you require 64kg of baggage (2 x pieces) then your cost comparison is far better in CE.
That's a lot of luggage for a long weekend but you're absolutely right!
@@MattsPlanet u r correct too. We only take cabin baggage. Saves time at both ends and no one stops you in CE
Yes, business class is worth the extra money.
That would be a short video if I said that!
Great video Matt, thank you!
I'm possibly cursing the fare-finders code here by sharing this, but; British Airways is scheduling her A380's again on short haul routes to regain service by first flying them on short routes! Buying/upgrading business on these planes (althoug it be 1:30-ish flights) seems like a chance of a lifetime for people who only fly short haul, like myself. I honestly would LOVE you to cover one of these 're-entry of service' flights, after the you know what grounding. Where to look; End of November, LHR-FRA and/or LHR-MAD on BA A380. I found a back-to-back itinerary for £321 both ways in the BA A380 on ITA Matrix, business class from LHR-FRA. Maybe fiddle around with the itinerary and get an even better deal. Get out, fly the mighty A380 in business and gain tier points along the way for the price of a Club Europe (A320 middle seat blocked economy) seat! Up to you (and your viewers) what you do with this information, although this would be an ultimate video for your channel for me! Cheers, all the best!!
Cheers Peter. I had spotted that news. There used to be a LAN (I think?) flight from Madrid to Frankfurt in a widebody - that would have made an outstanding triangular outing! I am scheduled on an A380 in club back from the States in early December so will cover the product for the channel, but I will keep an eye on the short-haul hops too - I've done a few like that in the past before I videoed everything and it is a grand day out, although I live a bit further away from LHR these days...
Went back and watched this video again.
Is it worth flying business on Avios points though? (With a companion voucher).And do you get the avios points for flying the miles even when you use the points to pay for the flight? I'm guessing you do.
Within Europe, the general view is that business isn't worth it and its a bit of a waste of a two-fer. "Proper" long haul on BA is where a two-fer gets best value... But then again if you have a pile of avios, then business within Europe isn't that much more expensive and can be worth it the avios, but still probably wouldn't be worth the twofer... Unless the twofer is about to expire and you can only spend it within Europe... You don't get avios or TPs in a redemption flight. You do on Virgin, very unusually, but not on BA.
@@MattsPlanet I'm flying to Dalaman, that's not in Europe.
I still have two companion vouchers with Virgin and 60,000 points which I'll use for long haul probably to Hong-Kong.
That's why I used the BA ones for this trip
Great video. If there isn’t a massive difference in price and it’s an afternoon or evening flight then I find Club Europe is worth it for the lounge alone, being a Scotsman who gets my ticket value in drink.
That's the spirit! I'm guessing literally??? Thanks for the comment!
Doesn't seem like it's normally worth it in Europe, though sometimes it might be worth flying it once or twice to get to the next frequent flyer level from the status credits with Qantas after having flown a return flight to Australia.
Indeed - every little helps when it comes to status!
Great explanation as always Matt. I wouldn't consider business class at all within Europe, the value is so poor in my opinion.
Hopefully that's the conclusion the video presented - not worth it in cash terms, but might be if its a special occasion... Even worse if you spend the money (as I did for this video) and the experience was a little meh!
Since we only travel Trans Atlantic, short haul really have no experience, premium economy is a nice alternative, however First or business is our choice on British Airways ❤🇬🇧❤️
First or business is the way to go on most airlines if you can swing it! And if you start your itinerary somewhere like Dublin, you get a short haul and a long haul experience for much less!
This grandpa is very wise but I think flying business class could worth it in the peak seasons when the aircraft are pretty full......
Absolutely!
IMO the american approach to Business/First class is vastly superior to the euro-business approach. And if any airline execs are watching it absolutely is the difference between me getting my credit card out or not.
All that said, when the price differential is slim enough, the emotional thing does kick in and I do give it a whirl.
The fixed number of seats is the problem but I agree the experience is far superior... Sadly the customer experience comes second to flexibility (and therefore profitability) in Europe
I can't afford / justify long haul BA business; as such the occasional 80/160 tier point return routes are often the best way for me to secure and retain status.
Cheers - GG. I can't think I'd ever pay what BA is asking for long haul business from London... Ex-EU though? Different story...
@@MattsPlanet There’s something to be said for flying BA on the return to the UK though; the prices often vary from £100-£300 based on various customer service charges, taxes (specifically Heathrow fee / UK APD) and so on! :)
i probably get through 70 quids worth of alcohol alone, and food wise im a gannet. definitely worth it for me. thats just in the lounge -let alone the plane
Good work! Great commitment!
😂 my missus does the same with the sparkling wine in the lounge & onboard even comes away with a few bottles on occasions 🤪
If you only ingest £30 worth of food and booze at the lounge then you're not doing it right.
Very good point!!!!
Sorry Matt if my finger caught the dislike by mistake, I did hit the like as well 🙈🤷
You're forgiven!
Drinking a lot of gin at breakfast and being drunk so early.... tempting... After all, it has to be worthwhile. 😇
It's 5 o'clock somewhere....
@@MattsPlanet haha that’s true 🥴😃
Club Europe has slipped to an all time low. Seat is now the same, with same legroom, and the food is not exceptional. I remember the days of a cooked breakfast in economy on a 35 minute flight to Jersey. I don't think it's worth it now. Also you have to pay £20+ to choose your seat when it used to be free !
Thanks D.O.F. - that seat reservation fee is deeply controversial - if you're in the Exec Club with Status than you love it that you get the choice of the best seats. If you're not, then BA is really unusual in not including seat selection in the fare and it really annoys people... Otherwise I completely agree!
Absolutely not worth it for me, not even thinking about it. It's Premium Economy and should be sold as such. But with so many sheep happy to part from cash as if it's water, they're always going to fill those seats for premium costs.
Strong opinions! Not that I disagree with many of them!
Ryanair have better leg room than BA and nobody can recline into your face. Wouldn't waste money on BA even in economy
Plenty of people would agree!
Great video, although one question worth considering is whether BA Club Europe makes sense from an Avios perspective. IIRC the point differential was relatively small on the ZRH > LCY flight I booked back on Easter 2019 (9000 points for J vs 6000 for Y). In addition for rewards bookings sometimes the only availability is business, in which case it's your only way to get any value out of a reward booking as had happened to me on that particular flight. Overall, I had a good experience there both in terms of the lounge and onboard meal. Another key consideration is what the upgrade offers are after you've booked your BA flight. Case in point, back in August 2019 I had a late afternoon BA flight from DUB to MAN which I booked in the cheapest Y fare (it was on part with the RyanAir flight that took me to DUB). On the day of travel I was notified that the flight I was on was cancelled and I was rebooked onto a late night flight back (arriving into MAN nearly at midnight). At that point the prospect of me sitting in the airport for hours on end waiting to board whilst all the restaurants at the airport close early (IIRC the last thing to stay open was Burger King but even then it closed around 2200) being hungry and cranky wasn't something I was looking forward too (at this time I didn't have OneWorld status and the free lounge visits on my AmEx Gold card were already used up on previous travels). In that case the upgrade for £60 to Club Europe seemed reasonable. I got a lounge I could use and work from for the afternoon and once onboard the plane I was served a lovely salmon entree with champagne. Excellent service considering the chalk time of that flight was around 40 minutes. Sure I really didn't make use of the extra baggage allowance, priority security nor other benefits, but it really took the edge of that trip for me. And to top it off, there was unscheduled rail works when I got back to Manchester, meaning I had to take the scenic route (replacement bus) back to York an ordeal that had me arriving back at around 6 AM. Not fun!
fresheningback in economy. At the same time, I already had lounge access thanks to my Premier Gold status and all the lounges I would've had access to would've been the same if I was travelling business or economy in that direction. I also didn't need extra status credit as I already had all my flights booked out for the year and would make UA Gold status for 2020. Then I had to Osaka, travelling the most direct, cost efficient route from where I was (Berlin) which of course would be Tegel to Osaka via Dusseldorf, Las Vegas, San Francisco (this ended up being constructed as a one-way on EuroWings from Tegel to Las Vegas for £175 in Basic Economy, followed by a £30 a night stay at the Comfort Inn Las Vegas, followed by a £500 multicity on United from Las Vegas to Osaka then Osaka back to Toronto). In that case it was all economy to Osaka, I got to enjoy the LH Senator lounges in Germany, and the mediocre United Clubs at Vegas and SF. Fortunately, my United Gold gave me access to those excellent exit row seats on the 777 I was flying. On the way back my friend (who is a Global Services member) used her upgrade credits to sponsor my upgrade to Polaris which was a nice treat on the way back. Short story long: there's no hard or fast rule on when to fly business or not. It really depends on the context of the travel and what may make sense in one circumstance won't make sense in a slightly different circumstance.
P.S. - Absolutely love the Private Eye magazine you got stowed away on that flight to Corfu. Good to see someone is paying attention to the real news in the UK :p
Thanks for that - I find a Private Eye is about perfect for a flight of 2 hours or less! I had one with me but was fighting my way through Knife by Jo Nesbo on this trip...
You're right - when redeeming avios the logic is somewhat reversed in that business is often decent value. I did record a chunk about the pro-active upgrade I was offered coming back - £99 which was quite a lot more than the premium they offered when I first booked. But I cut it out as the video was getting long and it wasn't core - thought I could make a separate video about it one day! Thanks for the support!