@@johnmck1147 Hi john i agree you are the guru ... I have a problem with my 2kw seems to smoke a lot so over fueling i guess would you happen to know. The factory settings or best setting for 2kw heater ive tried two black controller and they both seem to be doing same hope you can shed some light on matter many thanks Nick
Nick Pritch , Hi Nick, I really need more info to be of some help. Did it smoke from new, or did it start smoking later? Is the smoke black or or is it white? Does it smoke just on start up, or all the time? If it smoked from new, you most likely have an install issue. Eg too long a combustion air inlet, too many bends in inlet hose, or restrictions in exhaust. Issues here cause lack of combustion air for a complete burn. If it started smoking later, it is most likely caused by carbon buildup in the glow plug atomising screen or the burner chamber. If only on start up suspect glow plug screen, if always probably carbon in both glow screen and main burner screen. Smoking can also happen with a dirty fuel filter. I hope this is of some help. JMcK
If you don't have a spare controller to shutdown the unit with, you can cut fuel by disconnecting the fuel pump. This will trigger a low temp error and start a safe shutdown. But like he showed, don't let it lose power. When the fan stops, it won't cool itself anymore. If the controller fails and things keep running, cut the fuel and let it cool itself down. Great video, thanks for the info!
I've just bought one of these heaters and a 30 amp power supply but as you "could" get a mains drop out I'm also going to invest in a UPS for A$40+A$23 delivery on EBAY.......belt and braces is my middle name.
Today I got my heater running thanks to you. Yes I cleaned and cooked the tubular thing that goes around the glow plug, and I also found dirt in the air hole. B\ut I also found another problem you might want to look at. The controller (the fancy blue one) had a short circuit in the wires. Pull off the adhesive front cover, remove 4 screws and inside you will see that they stripped the wire 10mm. Over time this exposed wire crossed and would intermittently short out. I cut some heat shrink and used it. Thanks for your help, much appreciated. And now I am warm and dry.
Hey John, Followed you from your beginning. You have become the default source for accurate, detailed information about these heaters! Thanks for your work.
That was very important information about how the heater can overheat and how it won't turn off if the controller fails. I will buy a spare controller and ecu!🙏🤠
I just completed wiring my heater in. It works, thanks for the good advice about the run down time when turning off to prevent the circuit board from melting. There is no mention of this in the "instruction" booklet. You saved me some heartache and lost dollars.
Curious observation with my analogue controller today… Absolutely excellent videos John, best I’ve seen so many thanks. I had a curious observation today with my 5kw which has an analogue controller; last couple of weeks it’s been starting and stopping fine but will not regulate the temperature lower than anything other than flat-out. I’ve had to use it like this out of necessity but it’s not ideal as you can imagine. Today I was armed with some tools to troubleshoot but before I started, I selected a low temp setting and started it up as usual and even after 15 mins the temperature was not going down, the pump ticking like mad as I’ve had lately… so I decided to press and hold the ‘On’ button on the analogue controller. After a few seconds the pump slowed down and all was fine! It starts and runs as normal now, I’ve had it over a year and it’s definitely back to its old self with full control over the temperature. Maybe I have inadvertently done some sort of reset? I’ve powered it up 5 times since with no problems and I’m very happy with it again. I haven’t seen anything on the internet/youtube about heaters that fail to turn the heat down (with no error codes) and neither have I seen anything about holding the ‘On’ button down while it’s running so I hope this helps you and others who may experience this curious fault.
Very helpful video. I'm installing one of these in my VW Kombi Camper. Unfortunately, it didn't come with any instructions. I love the magpies singing to accompany your lesson.
Hi Jay, thanks for the feedback. I have not done detailed videos on controllers as there are already a number on TH-cam. A lot of people comment about the birds in the background. I live in a nice rural area. JMcK
John, I have now encountered two different plug types with two different controllers. The new Black painted all in one (link to it in your All In One heater video) has a round connector with 3 wires. Its around 3/8" in diameter with a screwing locking collar on it. Wished I could post a picture of it. Ok the Second on is on a Red All In One heater that has a controler that has a single knob. To turn on, press in on the knob and turn to the right. After unit is up and running the heat setting is set by turnning the knob to the right for + heat, turn knob to left for - heating. No temp scale in Celsius just pulse rate. To shut down, press and hold and turn knob to the left till 000 is read. Let off knob and it runs the shut down phase. Now on this heater the controller has a Flat 3 wire connector. Now on visual inspection of both of these heater control units (motherboards) with the same and it looks the same in the pictures you have on your videos and pictures that I found on eBay. And John you are The Guru of the Chinese diesel air heaters. God I would have loved to have you as a shop instructor in high school or middle school. Have a G-day from the USA.
Great videos i really enjoy them you do a good job of intelligently testing things many of us would like to know. I will be purchacing one of thease heaters for my 4x4 camping vehicle. Question the espar heaters have an option for high altitude kit is there any such thing or adjustment for thease units to run well at high altitude? Also what parts would you reccamend carrying as spares for thease units atomizer screne, glow plug, gaskets of any kind for dissassembly and reassembly? I saw in one of your other videos an intake air screne you were showing does that come with the units or do i buy that seporate? Curious if installed and used properly how often do they get carboned or need repair? Also a video on how we should be controling the unit what pulse rate how to set a thermostat controled temp. Also a video on how to use the diag function on the controlers Thanks for the great vids and info mike
Hi Michael, at this stage I have not seen a high altitude kit for these Chinese diesel heaters. With no adjustment the heaters run rich at high altitude and hence cause more soot build up than normal. You can lessen this soot formation at altitude by using a kerro/ diesel mix. Somewhere between 80:20 to 50:50 mix seems good. As for spares, I would suggest some glow plug screens as spares, and perhaps a spare glow plug, and removal tool, as the glow plugs are easily broken on removal, unless done careful. If installed correctly and with an end of season kerro/diesel short cleaning run these heaters can go for many years without a pulldown for carbon and soot removal. Sadly most heater kits come with a so called intake silencer. These are not an air filter, and are useless as a silencer. You will need to purchase an intake filter separately. I hope this helps a little. JMcK
Thank you for such a well thought out explanation of the controllers for these heaters. You did a excellent job the explanation of the different ones available. I have at so many different videos of people trying to do what you did I about gave up trying find anyone with any knowledge until I accidentally clicked on yours. I'm so glad I did. Thank you, what a job
Hey John, love the detailed vids, very helpful. Just wondering if you can do a factory reset on the digital display control unit? I keep getting error code E-05, overheating issue. My air intake and exhaust pipes are all clear and with minimal bends, heat duct is fine and cool air in the cabin has adequate air flow. The fan works and blows air out fine, not sure what the issue could be?
The LCD controller users 0.114 ma (+/-) an hour in standby mode. Over 24 hrs that equates to 2.736 amps. This would drain a 100 ah battery down to 50% in just over 18 days in standby mode based on the fact there is no other parasitic draw from the battery. This is a very good point you raised, thank you John.
Yes Enigma. You would be surprised at the number of people who store their caravan or motorhome under a tarp or carport (solar won't work) and do not realise the constant heater current drain will flatten their battery in pretty short order. If left this way all winter the battery is generally a write off. JMcK
Thank you John, had to work a lot of that out myself before I came across your channel. Your presentation and detail is marvelous and now much enjoy watching all your episodes, well done !
Hey Mate. Thanks for the vid. I am just in the process of fitting a 2kw heater and have fitted an isolating switch on the main 12v feed so it was good to hear about the impromptu shut down overheating. I am also running the diesel fuel line inside some clear plastic tubing for both protections and to insulate it from the van and suppress the noise as I had heard that it was a problem. This was then mounted with rubber coated P clips to further enhance the suppression. It is great to share our experience and knowledge to help others. So many tricks and traps in the install and the instructions, which are in varying degrees of chinglish, are at best downright confusing and at worst, not existent. Perhaps non existent would be better as people would be forced to look around for the proper way to install them. lf I was an absolute beginner I wouldn't have had a clue what to do based on the install instructions or lack thereof.
I reached out to you last January. I use my heater to heat up my shop and it worked great, which I had mentioned back then to you, if you can recall. Well I have turned it up a notch. I'm using this heater as one of the heat source to heat up a 205L drum full of coolant, that then goes in my floor radiating heat system. I used a 4 inch grinder and made a groove going in a circle around the casing, to be able to insert a 3/8 copper tube tightly wound inside the said groove. Right now, it is running with no pump pushing the coolant inside the 3/8 tube. Instead, I use the science of heat that likes to escape any entrapment and at the same time, it sucks in the cold coolant. It goes in the pipe at around 16c right now but exits at around 48-49c on average. So on top of heating up the ambient air, it also supplies heat for my drum. I also have an used oil burner/wood stove combo, 600watts of solar panels running a 600watt heating element, and also a solar hot water heater on the go. I am assembling everything right now. Your videos were really helpful in how to disassemble these heaters and so on. Thanks for the knowledge you share with us.
Hi Danny, thanks for the feedback. Is it possible for you to send me some photos. I have often been asked to do a video on other applications. If I do so I will give the contributors the credit. My email is - johnmck47@outlook.com Thanks ..JmcK
@@johnmck1147 I promise I will once I'm done and running. It will be winter here as it will be summer for you so I have time against me right now. I saw something else last night that gave me an idea. I have an old defective Cooler Master liquid cooling CPU pump and radiator that I kept in case I'd need it one day. It is almost the same dimensions as the air heater end of it. I will make some king of tin or thin sheet metal and make a shroud for it and circulate the coolant through it. Yet another way of taking heat and sending it in my radiant floor.
I didn't know about the shutdown. I just got the all in one heater to warm my garage. I was going to use an ATX computer power supply to power the unit and shut it off when not in use. I'll now use a battery with a charger and turn off the battery after the heater turns off. Thanks for the information, you saved an ecu!
@@johnmck1147 I watched all the videos and learned a lot about this heater. I fired it up today and it blew out smoke for the first 5 minutes then all is OK. Thanks for the videos, very helpfull when setting these up for the first time. 😊
Hi Pat, yes I talked about that method in the description with this video, however in a lot of cases like Caravans and Motorhomes and Trucks, with the fuel lines underneath the vehicles it is not so easy in the mud rain and snow of winter, when these heaters are most used, to get underneath the vehicles and disconnect the fuel. In the rare event this occurred, and there was much mud and rain, I think I would chose the master switch and fan method. Also with this method you do not have to get underneath the vehicle all over again to reconnect the fuel line and do the prime again as well. Anyway, thanks for the positive feedback Pat. JMcK
Cut the power to the pump then? Add a cutoff switch to the wire that runs to the pump? Would that trigger the unit to go thru its shut down routine and cool itself down albeit without fuel input?
Excellent video. I just installed one with the basic LED controller and was having some trouble figuring out the functionality. I can’t thank you enough.
John thanks for making these videos. You give a lot of well presented material. I was looking to see well much the silencers work.and your video on the silencers gave me more information than I was looking for which was great. You pointed out some things I did not know. Again thanks for these awesome videos
A point of information about the first controller that you showed. If you turn the unit on and the knob seems to not work and it seems to change settings on its own... Press and hold ON while the unit is on and the fan blades in the knob will change colors... When they are red it seems that the unit basically runs on high and adjusts a bit here and there as needed on its own... I turned it all the way down and things just kept on trucking. However, if you press and hold ON while the unit is on the fan will change from red to blue. When the fan blades are blue it follows the input that you have asked of it. I've not been able to find any of this mentioned in any of the manuals.
Hi john I have had these heaters for about 6 years( Airtronic and a Chinese one ). I get about 700 hours before they require service . your videos are great help to get the Chinese one going. I have a red controller and remote and they work fine. I get all my parts from Butlertechnic in England for the Airtronic, but not have a supplier for the Chinese one yet.
Thank You John. It was not obvious they had a room temperature thermostat. I was afraid maybe the temp set could be the device temp, not the room temp. You gave us the information . Thank you so much !
Well, I fact yesterday a guy that actually owns one said : in fact it actually have a problem. Because apparently the thing can go on low heating, according to the room temperature, but it will not regulate using total shut down power on the fire. That means, for a 1000W to 8000W model, if 1000W is too much for the insulated volume you have, you’ll overheat without regulation ! That’s a terrible problem for me. Need to keep one door partly open then ? Do you confirm that ? He has 5kW model with the full electronic controller.
He say this is for battery energy savings. Because the power on/power off would consume too much, hard to recharge later on a camper. Myself I purchased a 1 to 8 kW model, but my caravan would need only 500 W or less... gonna have a problem apparently. I think about using On/Off function with a thermostat to shut it off. And to avoid the important battery consumption, i think about making the starting resistor plug out if service when powering off. I think this could be achieved using a klixon thermostat on the aluminum fins, not allowing the starting plug to be supplied when the body is already hot. Normally this is a carbon clogging issue, but I gonna use my caravan maybe 3 cold nights a year....
rené solaire Hi Rene, I suspect your heater is the common 5 kw model. I do not think you will have an issue with this heater. On a low setting the heater runs very slow, puts out low heat and uses very little power. If it does get too hot, jut turn it off for a while. JMcK
Thanks again for another very informative video. I have a suggestion/question. For those of us with Webasto heaters, we sure could use another series on them. Granted, the here will be a lot of overlap, but maintenance and controllers will be very informative. Thanks you.
Hi John, not sure if its been mentioned but you could also disconnect power to the dosing pump for an effective emergency shutdown if needed in the event of a controller failure. Once unit has cooled, one could then disconnect the primary power. Really enjoy your videos!
Hi John, Thank you for all your info and work that goes into making these video's. I was getting a low voltage warning E-01 and the heater would then shut down. It wasn't the batteries for they were at 13.2v . Come to find out it was the fuse and after changing it the unit worked just fine.
Hi John - Thanks for your quick response. I’ll keep my fingers crossed and hope one of your subscribers will come up with some answers. In the meantime I’ll try to locate a Celsius to Fahrenheit conversion table. Hope you’re enjoying the sail.
Hi Reg, Yes you are right, 94 beats a minute works out at 1.56 Hz or pulses a second. 1.6 Hz is the default minimum on these heaters. You get flame out when you go lower. It is not realistic to try and slow the pump rate further. A real 2 KW heater is about 330 mm long, the outlet is about 60 mm in diameter, and the weight about 2.8 kg A 5 KW heater is about 390 mm long, the outlet is about 75 mm diameter, and the weight about 4.2 kg. I hope this helps. JMcK
Another way to force shutdown would be to disconnect the pump if you can. Good tip about needing the right shutdown, fuses/breakers too need to be happy drawing 20A on the 12V model.
Just received my Chinese heater here in Canada, too about three weeks to get delivered. But my controller is different from all the ones you show here. It is like the lcd display model but it doesn’t have the battery or wifi displays on it and no clock, if I hold down the top two buttons it gives me a new display of blue mountains in the corner where you have a battery display. Have you seen these I can’t find anybody explaining these controllers
Solution to the PCB melting might be to add a mount that insulates it better from the heat of the frame it is attached to. While you are the de facto leader in describing these heaters, you cover more than anyone else and you correct what others have wrong, etc... you regularly mess up the values you express... as the length of time the more advanced controller 1 1/2 to 2 weeks, less than a minute later 2 to 3 weeks... you do that a lot in all your videos and why I bring it up.
Hi Mr D, Thanks for the feedback. Can you give me more info re the time you talk about so I can go back and see what I said. Generally if I talk about time, say the time you should give the heater a high speed run to clean out carbon, it is such a variable, and depends on your heater install, how you operate the heater, the quality of diesel you use etc. I just give rough guidelines. If you use the heater constantly on low power and you have a long bendy exhaust perhaps a high power run every couple of weeks is a good preventive maintenance issue. Every heater and install is different, so is the time for a hot carbon burn. On our boat in the Med, I just give it a high power run once a year (season), but the motorhome about once a month. Re the circuit board, I think you would find effective isolation difficult in the space available. Better to use effort to prevent a sudden shutdown in the first place. Cheers JMcK
Watched all your heater videos now John. Its clear you have passion and experience in teaching, and you do it extremely well. I'll gleefully use all your tips when i install my system. Any tips on multiple air outlets would be handy ! Cheers Si
Thank you so much for this mate, I have the controller with the blue circle and it had be stuffed how it worked. Thank you so much I will credit you in my video. I have also subscribed, good to see a fellow Aussie.
Thanks for the video. A thought, If your controller fails, Disconnect the lead to the pump. This should cause the heater to generate a E-08 or E-04 error but should still allow the heater to power down without overheating. (in theory, not tested)
Thanks for the feedback Pierre. Yes that is more preferable than turning off the fuel and having the pump run dry. I mentioned in reply to another comment here a suggestion to consider a switch in the pump power line. But it is all about accessibility. A controller failure is very rare and if accessibility to the fuel pump wiring was difficult, like under the van in the mud and rain, I would use the power off method and a portable fan. Also as I have done this before, I am familiar with what happens. Thanks again. JMcK
Your welcome Daryl. Re the second sentence, the male magpie has been a resident here for over 6 years now, and even if I am away 3 months, he flies down to greet me the day I arrive home. In six breeding cycles, neither he nor his mate has ever attacked me, no matter how close I come to the nest.
John McK 47 similar story here re magpies. My breeding pair sit on my knee each morning and have their daily briefing. I’m in Paradise Beach Victoria. On the diesel heater, I am working my way through your videos. I really appreciate your efforts and the great information provided.
Hi there You can go into the menu in the ECB and make changes. There are a number of people online who will give you the password. I no longer do that because I have seen too many users get themselves in a whole lot of problems. There is no reset button back to factory settings. If your set up is correct, and your issues are with a new heater, I suggest you ask for a replacement as you could have controller or ECB issues. JMcK
Hey john, fun video! But you forgot to talk about the advanced control on the controller with the lcd screen. Going to the settings, the fourth dash, the password is 1688, and then you can adjust the ratio of the rate of pulse and the speed of the fan to improve the quality of the combustible mixture.
More really good information John ,did wonder myself what would happen if controller broke down as it needs fan to blow air through the unit to cool down , good to know that those controllers only work on those heaters with the same control board ,👍 ❤️
Very good videos John, thank you very much for your effort. I would love to se a video regarding the advanced setting and tweaking the rpm/Hz for optimal performance.
Hi Dessmo, Thanks for your comments and video request, unfortunately I will leave your particular topic request for others to do. My goal with these videos was to try and help the DIY person who would buy a cheap Chinese copy heater on line and install it themselves, without the help or input from a brand name supplier. In fact some brand name suppliers insist on a professional install. I believe the Chinese have done a good job matching fan/rpm settings, and when amateurs start messing here with the password protected control settings they often mess things up. This is an area I will leave for a tinkering enthusiast to play with, and publish a video, should they choose. Sorry. JMcK
Hi good videos, On this video you say that if you have a different connector on the control unit and you wish to change it for a red/blue controller etc, you need to swap the ECU to match them up . you can't as the round or triangular plug on the control unit connects to the wiring loom, not directly into the ECU. the wiring loom needs to be changed.
John. Thanks for this series of great videos at79 sure help question if controller goes seems like it will keep running. If u disconnect pump will unit keep running to act like cool down then could pull fuse. Than you
Recently purchased the cheapest 5 kw heater I could find, $84USD. It came with the simple controller you note as decent. I like the simple knob controller, ordered one, tested it and got the 7 error code. I suspected the incompatibility issue so I ordered another motherboard and knob controller. The new motherboard looks substantially different but has the same connections. I tried the original controller and only got 4 red LEDs dashes. Both new knob controllers show the 1 error code, low voltage with 12.6 volts on brand new battery I keep on battery tender. The packaging indicates the replacement motherboard is usable with 12 or 24 volts, though I specifically ordered a 12 V unit. However, very clearly marked on the board where the big red wire is soldered, it says “+24V. (The original board that came with the heater has no marking at the same wire, though the cover is marked 12V.). I think I have a 24 V replacement board, thus low voltage error code. It is going back and I will try to order, yet again, a 12V mboard. Is it really this complicated? Am I on the right track or do I just start over with another complete unit that costs a little more. I am already collecting spare controllers. Thank you, John. I have watched all your vids and find them extremely helpful. I am spreading your fame at our US Albin Owners Group.
Hi Richard, Thanks for the post. When I made these videos, some years ago now, to try and help the DIY installer, the Chinese manufactures all followed the same protocol and it was so easy to mix an match controllers and motherboards, but lately some manufactures have been going proprietary and using their own protocol. This is making it difficult for the average heater owner to make changes. I think you may be on the right path, but first check the voltage at the motherboard. Are you bench testing, or installed testing. It is not uncommon for heater owners to have voltage issues after install, particularly if they do not connect heater direct to the battery, have a cheap fuse, and don't increase wire size. If voltage issue is on a bench test I suggest you ask supplier for replacement controller and motherboard. There is also another issue to consider. Most of the Chinese Copy heaters were exact copies (mechanical parts, not electronics) of the German Eberspacher D2 and D4 heaters. But now there are some Chinese heaters that are copies of the German Webasto heater. These two heaters are very different inside even though they may look similar to the untrained eye. Parts for Eberspacher copy are not compatible with Webasto copy. Because of these issues, I now recommend the normal purchaser buy a heater that comes with the controller they want. Please let me know how you go. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 One of the things that drew me to you besides the sheer volume of info you put out is that you respond to almost all inquiries! You do realize how unconventional you are? And how grateful your public is! I am bench testing since you strongly recommend it and I am glad I am I did. When you say check voltage at the motherboard are you suspecting voltage drop from too small wiring in the boat? (I am a licensed electrician...well I let it lapse a few years back since I retired...) One would need to check voltage drop while it is running which could be tricky without tapping the wires close to the unit. Certainly doable... I did purchase the heater with the controller I thought would allow me to add the knob style. The controller is not the one that you got with the aluminum case heater. Funny thing, the manual that came with my heater has a section that covers the knob style controller. I have sent back the controller that indicates +24V on the motherboard. I have ordered another controller that says 12V in all the advertising info. I have tried contacting these sellers to no avail. Wish me luck! I also have contacted the original supplier requesting whether or not they can provide another controller and motherboard or will allow me to return and upgrade to a more expensive unit. I am still within the 30 day return window. The unit works like a champ with its supplied controller and motherboard. There is no guarantee that a more expensive unit will be any different than the one I have since they all advertise and look identical except for color of plastic. I have also considered what else could be happening here, many posters say simply swap a couple wires around and voila. These are really basic units: a controller with three wires, a pump with two wires, and a two wire power supply. Internally, there is the heat sensor and the two wire connector to the fan. Whether or not the motherboard is made of Swiss cheese or unobtainium, it still has the harness which contains the connectors to pump, batt, and controller and its internal connections to the fan and sensor. And the replacement motherboard should nest into unit without any mods. Now if each factory chooses to use interchangeable harnesses and non-interchangeable components we are all left blowing in the wind. Curious stuff. No need to respond, John. I will update if I have any success or gain any wisdom. The unit I have works fine as supplied. I was simply trying to have parts on hand for field repair, mainly to avoid burning up the motherboard by a hard shutdown. When this unit craps, maybe I'll be old enough to sell the boat. Thank you, good sir!
After two new ECUs and two knob style controllers I could not achieve any interchangeability. I put it all back together using only the parts supplied originally. Works fine, but I have no backup plan short of simply installing another entire unit. If and when I do, I'll spend more than $84 and hope for the best. The second ECU was exactly the same as the first with +24V marked at the big red wire. The supplier assured me it would work on 12V.
The problems you had with the white metal cased heater where the wires were mixed up, what you can do is just unsolder the two or three wires and then resolder them in the correct order. That way you can keep the old ECU. Simply reorder the wire
@@johnmck1147 I bought my first of these a week ago and have not even test run it yet or done the install at this point i am going to watch all your videos before i decide where i am going to install this one in our trailer. so all the info you present is greatly appreciated
john galt Hi John, A smart idea to always bench test every heater before an install. I hope the install goes well, and the little heater gives you lots of warmth on those cold winter days. JMcK
Thanks. Should you control panel fail and it keeps running, best fix is unplug the fuel pump which will stop fuel flow and heater will go out. After about 5 minutes it should be cool enough to pull the fuse.
Does the control unit need to be on the heater? Maybe it can be taken out and setup next to the controller far away from the heater to make it impossible to overheat it.
Hi Dan, Possible but difficult. On the ECU is a fan rotation sensor, that would need to be removed from the circuit board and some sort of fine tolerance bracket made. But why bother. With a good install an overheat is extremely remote. Also, in the unlikely event of an issue, an new ECB is only about $20. Cheers. JMcK
To prevent your battery from being drained you could install a battery cutoff, and that would cut off accessories once the battery reaches a certain voltage
Hi Eksine, yes you could do that but you would remove the heaters ability to do a proper cool down cycle before turning off. Much better to have a seperate vehicle start battery and a domestic house battery. Also the heater ECU will initiate a shutdown cycle when it sees around 10.5 volts at the heater, and prevent permanent battery damage. JMcK
Hey John, u do a great job helping with navigation of these diesel heaters. On my second heater, runs great, just curious, have a led controller and when you hit the ok button to see time, hertz, and voltage and scroll to next the alpine symbol comes up with a number from 150 to maybe 300 with a m to the side. Any suggestions what this means. South Carolina here. Love the heater for my RV. Thanks
Hello John, Thanks for the quick feedback. I have an EXTERNAL temperature device which has functioned on my Webasto heater. An internal switch , wakes up the heater at a set minimum temperature and cut it out at the desired temperature. Could I use this in conection with the simple controller with the rotating knob... ? Maybe am asking too much ? Thank you anyway for your first answer which helped me sorting out the problem.
Hi John can i put a switch on the red power wire at the led controller like cut the power wire next to controller and fit a switch to it on my diesel heater, thanks mate you are doing a great job as well , o and can you change the display from herts to temp mate?? or you think it best just to use the herts display
I've had the heater 15 months using it during the winter months in my semi truck now we've had a super mild March and I've gotten away without using it using a warm blankett but some nights that's a bit cool
Thank you! this topic is very frustrating to me, it seems like the simplest dial controller is the best because it can act as a basic thermostat with no hassle. I have the type with the LEDs and blue circle on the front and it's annoying and won't work as a thermostat for me. Plus I had to bash it open and solder the 7 segment displays to get it to work in the first place! I wish the dial type could read error codes to you...
Hi Chris, Thanks for the feedback. The simple dial controller DOES SHOW ERROR CODES. The little LED's that indicate the temp setting flash an error code. Eg, three lights flashing means error 03. Cheers. JMcK
Very helpful info. I am thinking of powering the heater from the 240v mains supply using an appropriate adapter. Power cuts in my area are quite common, though they last less than 10 seconds at a time in most cases. What should you do if the power is shut off unexpectedly? I was thinking of using a 12v relay and a small motorcycle battery I have sitting around as a fail safe. The idea being that when the mains is on, the adapter powers the relay sending power from the adapter to the heater. If the power is cut, then the relay will switch to the battery, giving me time to power it off properly. I would have to make sure to top up the battery every few weeks or after a power cut. My question is will the heater notice the short 20ms interruption in power as the relay switches over? I would assume it would briefly flash up a low power warning as the power switches over and then continue running? Maybe it would simply shutoff and overheat? It must be able to deal with short power drops as battery voltage can sag as other high power devices turn on. I would love to hear your thoughts and would like to say thank you for posting such helpful info on these heaters. I have been pouring though your videos and they have answered many questions.
Hi SF, I do not like to give definite comment on something I have not personally tested, and I have not tested a 20 ms power cut. But I can give you an opinion. If the ECU detects a voltage drop it will go into a shut down cycle to protect the heater, and I suspect it will do the same if it senses a power supply interruption. Whether it can sense a 20ms interruption I do not know, but you can bench test it yourself. Next time I am doing a bench test I will do this for my own knowledge. However, as you are going to use a motorbike battery, have you considered using that to power the heater, and connect the battery to a small multistage smart charger, rather than use a mains power supply and a relay. A 10 second power outage on a very hot heater will likely cause damage to the ECU If you do bench test the relay, I would be most interested to hear the outcome. I am on my sail boat in Greece at the moment and can't do bench tests. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thank you for the reply! I understand your position on the subject and will have to do some tests. Do you know if the fan motor is a 12v DC motor? If so maybe I could wire the relay to the motor directly so if the power goes out the battery will kick in to keep the fan running. I hope its not some fancy AC 3 phase setup that I will have no hope in powering with ease. I assume the only issue with a power cut is the ECU board getting too hot? Also maybe residual fuel in the chamber? The only reason I came up with the relay and small battery idea was because I already have the items to hand. I normally keep the battery connected to a tiny solar panel that trickle charges it and thought it could easily keep the heater running for a few minutes if the power was interrupted. I don't think it has the grunt to run the heater for long periods. I could maybe try and relocate the ECU board outside of the housing as a last ditch attempt at protecting the heater from unforeseen events. Anyway I will keep you posted on the situation. Enjoy your holiday! all the best.
From logic only, I do not think a 20 ms power cut would cause issues. Worst case heater would go into shut down mode safely as power would be available after switch to run glow plug and fan. But this needs to be tested. It is not practical to move ICU out of heater. Too many issues. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Just a little update. I spent a while tinkering and I got it to work. Though I did have to change my plan a little. When powering the relay from the same 12 volt power supply that the heater is connected to I noticed that the power supply would take a short while to die when the power was removed. The heater would switch off just before the relay switched over to the battery. The relay didn't need much power to stay energized and would switch over to the battery just a little too late. This would cause the display to blink. (tested while the heater wasn't running) I needed to find a way for the relay to switch earlier so I rummaged through my collection of old 12v wall warts and tested them to see which one would make the relay deactivate the quickest when power was removed. I found one that was instantaneous and used that to power the relay separately. So now when power is removed the relay switches instantly before the heaters power supply has even started to die and the heater continues like nothing happened. When power is reinstated again, there is also no issue as the heater power supply thankfully comes on instantly. I plucked up the courage to finally run the heater and test it. Sure enough it didn't flinch. The fact that the heaters power supply would take a second to die and finding a small power supply for the relay that dies instantly made the switch over to the battery happen so quickly that the heater didn't notice a thing. So while my initial theory didn't quite work, I was able to find a simple solution using old junk I had floating about. In conclusion you can make it work but I can't say there is a definitive circuit that will work in all situations. I was lucky that the heaters power supply would stay on for a brief period when the power was disconnected and that I found a power supply for the relay that would deactivate really quickly. I'm pleased I didn't have to spend money on a leisure battery and smart charger to power the heater. My hoard of junk parts and a little experimentation saved a few notes. Hopefully now if we have a power cut the heater won't have a meltdown.
I'm thinking of installing a switch on the red (+) wire of the controller, and at the end of heater season/travel, it will cut power to the controller and display. While a digital controller will still need reprogramming, cutting it off will not damage the heater, even if accidentally turned off.
Could the same result be achieved by disconnecting the connecter blocks from the loom to the display controller? I've read a switch is a no no so I thought when not in use of unplugging the controller?
@@naomiobrien3543 if I understand, yes you could just disconnect your controller. Perhaps there is confusion because yes, a switch to disconnect power to the burner might be a big problem if switched off when it’s running. But a switch to the controller is no problem.
Hi John, thanks for your great videos, the detail you provide is really amazing. I've noticed the leads on the controllers do not seem to be very long. I am thinking that this will limit your options on the placement of the controller and the heater. cheers
Will the knob style keep a close temp , like will it turn on and shut down at certain temps? Or does the knob simply adjust the rate of fuel being pumped and the fan speed? I ask because there will be a bunch of other stuff to do before installing the heater , and it's still too hot hear in the states to test it out. Also which one of the LCD screens do you suggest for simplicity that can be set for a certain temperature? The heater that we just ordered has the knob.
Hi Phil, If your dial controller looks like mine in the video, well it comes with an inbuilt thermistor and as such does offer control over the temperature. Any of the common LED controllers will give you temperature control. But having said that, some heaters are now coming on the market with "non standard" wiring and connecting plugs so it is more difficult to swap out controllers. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thank You for the quick reply Sir. I had a question , or an idea come to mind after watching your videos. I'm putting this in a full sized bus. What if I was to cut a hole in the exhaust pipe in the bus , make a good flange and connect the heater exhaust directly into the 3 inch diesel engine exhaust pipe running out the back of the bus??? It will be 8-12 FT long depending on where the heater gets mounted. I'm assuming that long of a pipe would muffle the turbine sounds down quite a bit. Also assuming if it was to run thru the bus muffler that might be too much back pressure on it , what is your thoughts on that? Or do you think running the heater exhaust into the big 3 inch pipe would be too restrictive ? I may be even bigger exhaust pipe , I haven't got the bus home yet , but did look under it and did notice that it has new exhaust under it. Once again I truly Thank You for your in-depth videos on these heaters.
Phil Lowman Hi Phil, One thing you must consider with these heaters is back pressure, as the combustion fan is very little and very basic. Running the heater exhaust into the bus exhaust could work with the bus engine off, but how would you prevent engine exhaust creating significant back pressure when the engine is running, and how would prevent the engine exhaust coming back out through the heater? It might be simpler to just run the heater exhaust just straight down through the floor. Cheers.. JMcK
Love this series, thank you! Would love if you tried some mods, like moving the electronics out of the heater so they can't get too hot if power is removed. Or if there would be a way to mod a controller to be able to turn LEDs on and off with external switch. Oh, separate question, what are your thoughts on the heaters that have a metal housing instead of plastic? I like the idea as far as durability, but concerned the housing would get to hot.
Hi Hoss An uncontrolled shutdown is not a common occurrence, so it would hardly be worth the effort of removing the electronics. It could be done though. I have already done tests on the metal case heaters, (the white heater you see here is aluminum), and like you I initially thought there would be an issue with the metal case getting very hot, as aluminum is a great conductor of heat. But my tests showed this not to be the case. Aluminum heat transfer works both ways, so the incoming air kept the aluminum case cool. My tests showed virtually no difference in actual case temperatures at varying settings. It is really just a personal preference thing what type of case you buy. I was planning a video test, but I am going away sailing shortly for three months. Perhaps I may do one later in the year. JMcK
HI John, So enjoying your videos, my background comes from Power Generation but still unclear how an Electro Magnet works on DC ? Thinking some form of oscillator in the ECU Looking fwd to your next subject. Cheers
Hi Neville, It is just simple power switching. DC power on the magnet coils energise, and piston flies up. Power off - no magnetic field and spring pushes piston back down. I have made a lead with a simple micro switch which I turn on and off for when I want to send fuel down a long delivery line in initial start up. If I remember right you can see it in motorhome video. (Made Six years ago now). JMcK
Hi John good video Just to let you know the v2 heater you have comes with the new blue controller and red remote in uk with the better sellers the red remote is by far better it will tell you the the heat of the unit battery volts up and down and a lot more from sitting in your front room so if you buy a new heater look for the red remote just got one it's the best iv'e come across give the birds some nuts oh by the way that controller I was trying to pair was a faulty one have a good day. Jeff
Morning John, Have you found a more durable/ better alternative to the plastic vent that delivers the hot air into the room. The hose clip holding the hose to the plastic vent loses tension during heating. (ie plastic softens due to heat) consequently the hose dislodged and melted the plastic vent. Thank you Dave
Hi Dave, I have had no issues with mine, but I am aware of some, new to market, heater sellers providing garbage accessories with their heaters. Not just hose, but fuel line, hose clamps, and substandard electrical wire. Some marine and hardware stores sell an insulated aluminum vent hose that may be suitable for you. I am currently away sailing for 3 months, and your question has prompted me to do some research on this when I return home. JMcK
G'day John. I note you say the blue controller on your ipad at 3.15 is the same as the older unit but a different configuration. I have the blue controller but nowhere is there a hole for a thermister to read temp. Do you know how this one is reading temp? Seems strange to me.
I've just bought one of these heaters and it is powered by a 12 volt 30 amp power supply......when it switches off the LED readout turns off too.........I also finally turn the power supply off when the heater goes to it's off cycle.
Hi John. In your opinion are there any benefits in the units with aluminum housing? Safety? Durability? Longevity? I plan on mounting mine in the trunk of a car, routing the intake and supply air into the passenger area. Is this space too confined? Do these units need more air space around them for cooling? Thanks.
Hi D, the aluminum housing is a personal preference thing. I could find no real differences in operation testing between the aluminum and plastic heaters. Before testing I thought there may be excessive cabin heat lost through the housing rather than going into the ducting, but this was not so. The aluminum is more robust, but could perhaps suffer from corrosion in very wet climates (but I have NO knowledge of this happening) Both types of heaters need an air space around them for safety. The trunk of your car should be fine, but you would need some form of barrier so luggage could not fall against the heater. If they are about the same price, I would choose aluminum, but is just my personal preference. Regards. JMcK
Thanks John. You provided the instructions that were needed to get a good install. I have mine installed in my RV but the display will not turn on. It is the one that has all the LEDs and draws the most current. I have search for a way to diagnose the problem be it the wiring or the display but I can't find this information no can I get the display to turn on. Have you heard of this? Could the controller be DOA?
Hi Charles, First check your install and make sure your connection are tight and your battery voltage polarity is correct. If this is good and your heater is a new one ask for a replacement. If the heater is not new, suggest you buy a new controller on eBay. Look for one with same plug as your current plug. Occasionally you can get a dud controller, but double check your wiring first. Easy for me to diagnose, I have a number of spares and can just plug in a spare controller. JMcK
Thanks John. I have checked everything and it appears to be fine. I have ordered another controller. I don't hold out much hope on them honoring the 3 year warranty but if they do I will have a spare. Charlie
Thanks for the reply fitted one in mates caravan last week it primes ok but then nothing on pressing start so suspect faulty controller it’s the basic type with dial where as mine is the one that shows functions ,fan spinning ,glow plug pump kicking in ect so have no idea what’s wrong ?
Hi, Very much appreciate all your heater videos. I bought one of the “8kw” units, you know, orange with carbon fibre (!). Works well, been testing it in workshop before vehicle install. When I say works well, the heater works as advertised. But the lcd controller seems crippled. I can change from hertz to temp, and temp increases and decreases according to setting. But the clock doesn’t hold time , and no display icon for glow plug nor fuel pump. And no way found ( believe me I’ve tried many button combos ) to access admin settings. I’m planning on adding afterburner control when they become available again, so the lcd controller issue isn’t a deal breaker. Just a bit annoying right now. Cheers Alistair
Hi Alistair, it is not uncommon to get a broken LCD controller. Suggest you ask your supplier for a replacement. Most eBay heater suppliers won't be able to give you a replacement as very few sell spare parts, but most will give you enough cash back for you to buy a replacement on eBay. Cheers. JMcK
Hi john, Yes, I’ll see about getting some satisfaction from the vendor. Another funny thing, I had a look at the motherboard in the heater. The board connection for the case temp sensor was connected one pin off. I mean laterally moved one pin. Took the chance and reset connection “properly “ , but got an error code on power up. It’s almost as if the wires to the connector were inserted in the wrong place and the entire connector has to be shifted one pin over to make it work. I’ll look at it again, and take a pic. Oh, and I did a quick and dirty measure of pump hz , indicated vs. apparent. I counted pump clicks for time period and got pretty well 2x the indicated. Ie 2hz when 1hz indicated. Perhaps more evidence of a flakey controller. Cheers Alistair
Wondering LCD controller has to be mounted inside the room being heated? Planning on mounting to heater outside the room under a cover and just plumb the heating pipe inside. Trying to reduce noise plus carbon monoxide risk. Should I wire the LCD controller into the room so the the thermister can control the heat inside the room? Thanks
Awesome video John, do you know the control PIN OUT for the harness? I wanted to integrate this in to a controller I built for automation. Or does it use I2C/SPI/etc and communicate with the main board?
John: Quite a few asking about the different style plugs on different controllers. You mentioned it yourself in this video. Any thoughts to if you could just cut the wire (plug type) off whatever old controller you have & solder it onto the new controller? (Of course you would need to cut the wires on the new controller as well). There (seems) to be a pretty standard 3 wires to these controllers & a standard 3 color code of Red, Blue & Black. As I was watching you approach that section/problem in this video of the wires/colors being in different positions on a replacement controller I thought you were going to say to do just that. Cut the wires.Solder into correct position & problem solved. Instead you went into the customer service with the supplier. I guess that worked out pretty good with the $50 rebate. Just wondering if you figure a cut & splice job could also be done? I have the issue of a heater (LCD controller) that came with a square shaped plug for the controller. ALL the replacement controllers (falsely advertised as "universal" controllers) seem to have that Triangle shaped plug. Si if my controller goes bad I guess I have to buy both a new controller & Mother board for the heater (which I assume comes with a new main wire harness?). Otherwise the only other option I see is what I ask about....Cutting & splicing old shape plug to new controller wires. Does THAT seem like a thing that could work???????? Others are wanting to know this too!!!!
Hi Rusty, I have to be a little careful here. When I made these videos some years ago now, the Chinese manufactures followed a standard protocol, but lately some manufactures are doing their own thing, and nothing matches up. The old standard for controllers was 3 wires. Black (12V-). Red (12V+) and Blue (sense) If the plugs were different or the colours didn’t line up you could cut the wired and solder them back to suit a new controller, or different plug. In your case you could do this yourself but you must accept the responsibility of things going wrong. In the majority of cases this would work, but if you have a manufacturer using totally different protocol it would not work. Make sure your power wire from battery is fused. (15 amp fuse) If protocol is wrong in most cases nothing would happen. Worst case you could damage ECB or controller. If you were unlucky and did damage those parts you can buy a spare ECB and controller quite reasonable price on line, but suggest you buy both from same supplier to up your chances they are completely compatible. If not you can return them. Cheers. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thanks for the reply John & the added info of the (old protocol) for the volts/color code. I get your telling me to use caution & the need to accept the responsibility... I do. It's tough to decide between buying spare parts (controllers) & just buying a whole new heater. I'm just trying to be prepared as I have already had a situation where the wires into the controller were pulling off the soldered terminal & possibly cross shorting to the neighboring terminal in the controller. As you probably have noticed as much as you have studied these things, There is no wire stress relief so fatigue takes a toll with movement. I have been posting/advising folks to pump some hot glue or RTV Gasket seal in & all around the wire where it enters the controller. That seemed to solve my issue. The terminals are way to close to attempt to re-solder if they break off. Anyway, I thank you again for all the information you have given & taken the time to educate us all on these heaters & operations & repairs... I most certainly learned a bunch of things watching your series of videos. All those Chinese Manufactures should be required to send you a commission on each unit they sell for all the help you have given! Hope you are well & all is good in your world. Rusty
Hi John, excellent information in this video. Are you familiar with Jayco caravans? I’m wondering whether I could just pick up the 12V power from the fuse box? Reason I say that is because Jayco’s already have a 12V isolate switch in the “roller door” area. Provided I go through the heater shut down sequence, I figure I could then just isolate the 12V and not have to worry about installing another switch, to power down the controller (when van is not in use).
Hi Greg, these heaters draw around 10 to 12 amps on start and shut down, and you require a 15 amp fuse. One critical install requirement is to upgrade the wire size if the heater is more than about 500mm from the battery, if you don't do this you will have starting issues as voltage drop in the wire loom does not heat up the glow plug enough to get a good burn start. You can use the fuse box if it has adequate wire size from battery to fuse box. I always prefer to run the heater wire direct to the battery with its own fuse and master switch. Often in caravans the wire size to the fuse box is marginal, and people run lights, TV, phone charging etc, and to turn on the heater as well causes significant voltage drop in the system. Cheers, JMcK
John, I have a couple of general questions. 1. I see that these Diesel Air Heaters come in several sizes, 2.5 kw, 3.0 kw, 5.0 kw and 8.0 kw. I'm concerned as to what size chinese diesel heater I should purchase for my USA 2018 Ford Transit, Tall Roof and extended length Campervan. 2. I would also like to mount the fuel tank on the exterior of the vehicle on the drivers side underneath and fillable from the exterior of van. I don't want the tank in the living area of the van. Do you have any recommendations. The van engine runs on gasoline and not diesel.
Hi Michael, First up, I have only ever seen these Chinese diesel air heaters come in two actual sizes. 2.5 kw and 5 kw. For marketing reasons some less than honest suppliers advertise these heaters as different sizes, but actually sell you a standard 5 kw heater. All the 8kw heaters I have seen are actually 5 kw heaters sold at a higher price. Now my suggestion. You do not tell me about how well insulated the van is, or the area and outside air temperatures you expect to experience, but I suggest you go for a standard 5 kw heater. Some people have another opinion, but I have the view that it is better to have a heater of greater capacity than needed running at a lower setting where there is less noise and less stress on the heater, rather than a smaller heater running flat out all the time. If space is an issue for you and the van is well insulated and you are not in constant negative temperatures, you could get buy with a 2.5 kw heater, but an actual 2.5 kw is hard to find. From my experience, there are yet no 8kw diesel air heater. They are all stock standard 5 kw heaters branded and sold as 8 kw heaters at a higher price. You can mount the diesel fuel tank where conviennent for you provided you use acceptable install practices. You are aware these are Chinese copy diesel heaters, not petrol heaters, although with the genuine Eberspacher heater you can purchase a special petrol version. Regards, JMcK
I appear to have the advanced black controller but on a basic motherboard. When I press the settings button, nothing happens except a beep from the controller itself. The pulse rate increases in 0.5hz increments only and cannot be adjusted until the heater is on. The issue now is it reporting E01 and my only conclusion is it is somehow stuck on 24v. Without the settings menu, I have no idea how to change it back to 12v. Any ideas?
Good video, I am not sure about the pulse control, would this be used to increase and lower the heat? in other words what is the function and the optimal setting.
How would I interface a home made controller to the heaters? On the Espar, there's a yellow wire to turn on the heat by applying 12VDC to it. Is the wiring that simple, or is there a complex communication ie CANBUS, etc?
I don't know if you realise it, but you are now the official cheap Chinese heater guru! Thank you
I hope I can live up to that statement Martin. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Hi john i agree you are the guru ... I have a problem with my 2kw seems to smoke a lot so over fueling i guess would you happen to know. The factory settings or best setting for 2kw heater ive tried two black controller and they both seem to be doing same hope you can shed some light on matter many thanks Nick
Nick Pritch ,
Hi Nick, I really need more info to be of some help.
Did it smoke from new, or did it start smoking later? Is the smoke black or or is it white? Does it smoke just on start up, or all the time?
If it smoked from new, you most likely have an install issue. Eg too long a combustion air inlet, too many bends in inlet hose, or restrictions in exhaust. Issues here cause lack of combustion air for a complete burn.
If it started smoking later, it is most likely caused by carbon buildup in the glow plug atomising screen or the burner chamber. If only on start up suspect glow plug screen, if always probably carbon in both glow screen and main burner screen.
Smoking can also happen with a dirty fuel filter.
I hope this is of some help. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 you already have done.
Those creatures in the background?
If you don't have a spare controller to shutdown the unit with, you can cut fuel by disconnecting the fuel pump. This will trigger a low temp error and start a safe shutdown. But like he showed, don't let it lose power. When the fan stops, it won't cool itself anymore. If the controller fails and things keep running, cut the fuel and let it cool itself down. Great video, thanks for the info!
I've just bought one of these heaters and a 30 amp power supply but as you "could" get a mains drop out I'm also going to invest in a UPS for A$40+A$23 delivery on EBAY.......belt and braces is my middle name.
Today I got my heater running thanks to you. Yes I cleaned and cooked the tubular thing that goes around the glow plug, and I also found dirt in the air hole. B\ut I also found another problem you might want to look at. The controller (the fancy blue one) had a short circuit in the wires. Pull off the adhesive front cover, remove 4 screws and inside you will see that they stripped the wire 10mm. Over time this exposed wire crossed and would intermittently short out. I cut some heat shrink and used it. Thanks for your help, much appreciated. And now I am warm and dry.
Hi John,
Thanks for that information. JMcK
Hi John,
Thanks for that information. JMcK
Who needs instructions, we have John!!! A true blessing to the Chinese diesel world.
Hey John, Followed you from your beginning. You have become the default source for accurate, detailed information about these heaters! Thanks for your work.
Thanks for the positive feedback Robert.
He thank us for watching ... The community should be thanking you for such thorough explainstions. Respect.
That was very important information about how the heater can overheat and how it won't turn off if the controller fails. I will buy a spare controller and ecu!🙏🤠
I just completed wiring my heater in. It works, thanks for the good advice about the run down time when turning off to prevent the circuit board from melting. There is no mention of this in the "instruction" booklet. You saved me some heartache and lost dollars.
Curious observation with my analogue controller today…
Absolutely excellent videos John, best I’ve seen so many thanks.
I had a curious observation today with my 5kw which has an analogue controller; last couple of weeks it’s been starting and stopping fine but will not regulate the temperature lower than anything other than flat-out. I’ve had to use it like this out of necessity but it’s not ideal as you can imagine.
Today I was armed with some tools to troubleshoot but before I started, I selected a low temp setting and started it up as usual and even after 15 mins the temperature was not going down, the pump ticking like mad as I’ve had lately… so I decided to press and hold the ‘On’ button on the analogue controller. After a few seconds the pump slowed down and all was fine! It starts and runs as normal now, I’ve had it over a year and it’s definitely back to its old self with full control over the temperature.
Maybe I have inadvertently done some sort of reset? I’ve powered it up 5 times since with no problems and I’m very happy with it again. I haven’t seen anything on the internet/youtube about heaters that fail to turn the heat down (with no error codes) and neither have I seen anything about holding the ‘On’ button down while it’s running so I hope this helps you and others who may experience this curious fault.
Thanks for that feedback Mags. Much appreciated. JMcK
Very helpful video. I'm installing one of these in my VW Kombi Camper. Unfortunately, it didn't come with any instructions. I love the magpies singing to accompany your lesson.
Hi Jay, thanks for the feedback. I have not done detailed videos on controllers as there are already a number on TH-cam. A lot of people comment about the birds in the background. I live in a nice rural area. JMcK
John, I have now encountered two different plug types with two different controllers. The new Black painted all in one (link to it in your All In One heater video) has a round connector with 3 wires. Its around 3/8" in diameter with a screwing locking collar on it. Wished I could post a picture of it. Ok the Second on is on a Red All In One heater that has a controler that has a single knob. To turn on, press in on the knob and turn to the right. After unit is up and running the heat setting is set by turnning the knob to the right for + heat, turn knob to left for - heating. No temp scale in Celsius just pulse rate. To shut down, press and hold and turn knob to the left till 000 is read. Let off knob and it runs the shut down phase. Now on this heater the controller has a Flat 3 wire connector. Now on visual inspection of both of these heater control units (motherboards) with the same and it looks the same in the pictures you have on your videos and pictures that I found on eBay. And John you are The Guru of the Chinese diesel air heaters. God I would have loved to have you as a shop instructor in high school or middle school. Have a G-day from the USA.
Hi KLH, thanks for the kind words and detailed feedback. JMcK
We enjoy your bird serenading us. My mate of 18 years is a small macaw named Sam.
Hi Frederick, just letting you know all the birds you hear are wild birds. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 i know, I'm envious!!!!
Great videos i really enjoy them you do a good job of intelligently testing things many of us would like to know. I will be purchacing one of thease heaters for my 4x4 camping vehicle. Question the espar heaters have an option for high altitude kit is there any such thing or adjustment for thease units to run well at high altitude?
Also what parts would you reccamend carrying as spares for thease units atomizer screne, glow plug, gaskets of any kind for dissassembly and reassembly?
I saw in one of your other videos an intake air screne you were showing does that come with the units or do i buy that seporate? Curious if installed and used properly how often do they get carboned or need repair? Also a video on how we should be controling the unit what pulse rate how to set a thermostat controled temp. Also a video on how to use the diag function on the controlers Thanks for the great vids and info mike
Hi Michael, at this stage I have not seen a high altitude kit for these Chinese diesel heaters. With no adjustment the heaters run rich at high altitude and hence cause more soot build up than normal. You can lessen this soot formation at altitude by using a kerro/ diesel mix. Somewhere between 80:20 to 50:50 mix seems good.
As for spares, I would suggest some glow plug screens as spares, and perhaps a spare glow plug, and removal tool, as the glow plugs are easily broken on removal, unless done careful.
If installed correctly and with an end of season kerro/diesel short cleaning run these heaters can go for many years without a pulldown for carbon and soot removal.
Sadly most heater kits come with a so called intake silencer. These are not an air filter, and are useless as a silencer. You will need to purchase an intake filter separately.
I hope this helps a little. JMcK
Thank you for such a well thought out explanation of the controllers for these heaters. You did a excellent job the explanation of the different ones available. I have at so many different videos of people trying to do what you did I about gave up trying find anyone with any knowledge until I accidentally clicked on yours. I'm so glad I did. Thank you, what a job
Hey John, love the detailed vids, very helpful. Just wondering if you can do a factory reset on the digital display control unit? I keep getting error code E-05, overheating issue. My air intake and exhaust pipes are all clear and with minimal bends, heat duct is fine and cool air in the cabin has adequate air flow. The fan works and blows air out fine, not sure what the issue could be?
carbon build up from not running the heater on high for a good 30-60mins periodically to burn it off.
The LCD controller users 0.114 ma (+/-) an hour in standby mode. Over 24 hrs that equates to 2.736 amps. This would drain a 100 ah battery down to 50% in just over 18 days in standby mode based on the fact there is no other parasitic draw from the battery. This is a very good point you raised, thank you John.
Yes Enigma. You would be surprised at the number of people who store their caravan or motorhome under a tarp or carport (solar won't work) and do not realise the constant heater current drain will flatten their battery in pretty short order. If left this way all winter the battery is generally a write off. JMcK
I have a controller I can’t find instructions for. Can you recommend a forum for Diesel heater questions?
Thank you John, had to work a lot of that out myself before I came across your channel. Your presentation and detail is marvelous and now much enjoy watching all your episodes, well done !
Hi Neville, pleased you found the videos helpful. JMcK
I feel like I have earned college credit watching these videos! Great information.
Well thank you SK55, for your positive comments. JMcK
Hey Mate. Thanks for the vid. I am just in the process of fitting a 2kw heater and have fitted an isolating switch on the main 12v feed so it was good to hear about the impromptu shut down overheating. I am also running the diesel fuel line inside some clear plastic tubing for both protections and to insulate it from the van and suppress the noise as I had heard that it was a problem. This was then mounted with rubber coated P clips to further enhance the suppression. It is great to share our experience and knowledge to help others. So many tricks and traps in the install and the instructions, which are in varying degrees of chinglish, are at best downright confusing and at worst, not existent. Perhaps non existent would be better as people would be forced to look around for the proper way to install them. lf I was an absolute beginner I wouldn't have had a clue what to do based on the install instructions or lack thereof.
I reached out to you last January. I use my heater to heat up my shop and it worked great, which I had mentioned back then to you, if you can recall.
Well I have turned it up a notch. I'm using this heater as one of the heat source to heat up a 205L drum full of coolant, that then goes in my floor radiating heat system. I used a 4 inch grinder and made a groove going in a circle around the casing, to be able to insert a 3/8 copper tube tightly wound inside the said groove.
Right now, it is running with no pump pushing the coolant inside the 3/8 tube. Instead, I use the science of heat that likes to escape any entrapment and at the same time, it sucks in the cold coolant. It goes in the pipe at around 16c right now but exits at around 48-49c on average. So on top of heating up the ambient air, it also supplies heat for my drum. I also have an used oil burner/wood stove combo, 600watts of solar panels running a 600watt heating element, and also a solar hot water heater on the go. I am assembling everything right now.
Your videos were really helpful in how to disassemble these heaters and so on. Thanks for the knowledge you share with us.
Hi Danny, thanks for the feedback.
Is it possible for you to send me some photos. I have often been asked to do a video on other applications. If I do so I will give the contributors the credit.
My email is - johnmck47@outlook.com
Thanks ..JmcK
@@johnmck1147 I promise I will once I'm done and running. It will be winter here as it will be summer for you so I have time against me right now. I saw something else last night that gave me an idea.
I have an old defective Cooler Master liquid cooling CPU pump and radiator that I kept in case I'd need it one day. It is almost the same dimensions as the air heater end of it. I will make some king of tin or thin sheet metal and make a shroud for it and circulate the coolant through it. Yet another way of taking heat and sending it in my radiant floor.
Dany F
👍
I didn't know about the shutdown. I just got the all in one heater to warm my garage. I was going to use an ATX computer power supply to power the unit and shut it off when not in use. I'll now use a battery with a charger and turn off the battery after the heater turns off.
Thanks for the information, you saved an ecu!
Hi CW, pleased the videos were of some benefit. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 I watched all the videos and learned a lot about this heater.
I fired it up today and it blew out smoke for the first 5 minutes then all is OK.
Thanks for the videos, very helpfull when setting these up for the first time. 😊
Wonderful explanation of pros and cons of these controllers!
I am so thankful for the work you put in on these videos.!
Thanks for the prompt reply confirming my thought. Now I just have to find a suitable tap to fit the system.
Motorbike shop, hardware store selling air tools. Those air stopcocks work well and are what I mostly use. JMcK
You never mention voltage issues or error codes, I’m always having issues lol. Thanks for your videos!!!!
If the controller fails just shut the fuel off I enjoy this series of videos on these heaters you are doing keep up the great work!!!
Hi Pat, yes I talked about that method in the description with this video, however in a lot of cases like Caravans and Motorhomes and Trucks, with the fuel lines underneath the vehicles it is not so easy in the mud rain and snow of winter, when these heaters are most used, to get underneath the vehicles and disconnect the fuel.
In the rare event this occurred, and there was much mud and rain, I think I would chose the master switch and fan method. Also with this method you do not have to get underneath the vehicle all over again to reconnect the fuel line and do the prime again as well.
Anyway, thanks for the positive feedback Pat. JMcK
Cut the power to the pump then? Add a cutoff switch to the wire that runs to the pump? Would that trigger the unit to go thru its shut down routine and cool itself down albeit without fuel input?
Excellent video. I just installed one with the basic LED controller and was having some trouble figuring out the functionality. I can’t thank you enough.
John thanks for making these videos. You give a lot of well presented material. I was looking to see well much the silencers work.and your video on the silencers gave me more information than I was looking for which was great. You pointed out some things I did not know.
Again thanks for these awesome videos
Thanks for the feedback Michael. JMcK
A point of information about the first controller that you showed. If you turn the unit on and the knob seems to not work and it seems to change settings on its own... Press and hold ON while the unit is on and the fan blades in the knob will change colors... When they are red it seems that the unit basically runs on high and adjusts a bit here and there as needed on its own... I turned it all the way down and things just kept on trucking. However, if you press and hold ON while the unit is on the fan will change from red to blue. When the fan blades are blue it follows the input that you have asked of it. I've not been able to find any of this mentioned in any of the manuals.
Thanks for that feedback Brett. JMcK
Hi john I have had these heaters for about 6 years( Airtronic and a Chinese one ). I get about 700 hours before they require service . your videos are great help to get the Chinese one going. I have a red controller and remote and they work fine. I get all my parts from Butlertechnic in England for the Airtronic, but not have a supplier for the Chinese one yet.
Hi Peter, thank you for the info and feedback. I get parts for the Chinese heaters mainly from eBay. Cheers. JMcK
Thank You John. It was not obvious they had a room temperature thermostat. I was afraid maybe the temp set could be the device temp, not the room temp. You gave us the information . Thank you so much !
👍
Well, I fact yesterday a guy that actually owns one said : in fact it actually have a problem. Because apparently the thing can go on low heating, according to the room temperature, but it will not regulate using total shut down power on the fire. That means, for a 1000W to 8000W model, if 1000W is too much for the insulated volume you have, you’ll overheat without regulation ! That’s a terrible problem for me. Need to keep one door partly open then ? Do you confirm that ? He has 5kW model with the full electronic controller.
He say this is for battery energy savings. Because the power on/power off would consume too much, hard to recharge later on a camper. Myself I purchased a 1 to 8 kW model, but my caravan would need only 500 W or less... gonna have a problem apparently. I think about using On/Off function with a thermostat to shut it off. And to avoid the important battery consumption, i think about making the starting resistor plug out if service when powering off. I think this could be achieved using a klixon thermostat on the aluminum fins, not allowing the starting plug to be supplied when the body is already hot. Normally this is a carbon clogging issue, but I gonna use my caravan maybe 3 cold nights a year....
rené solaire
Hi Rene, I suspect your heater is the common 5 kw model. I do not think you will have an issue with this heater.
On a low setting the heater runs very slow, puts out low heat and uses very little power. If it does get too hot, jut turn it off for a while. JMcK
Pleased you found the videos helpful. JMcK
Thanks again for another very informative video.
I have a suggestion/question. For those of us with Webasto heaters, we sure could use another series on them. Granted, the here will be a lot of overlap, but maintenance and controllers will be very informative.
Thanks you.
Hi John, not sure if its been mentioned but you could also disconnect power to the dosing pump for an effective emergency shutdown if needed in the event of a controller failure. Once unit has cooled, one could then disconnect the primary power. Really enjoy your videos!
Yes, in theory it should work, but I have not actually done this.
However next time I am bench testing a heater I will test it out.
Thanks. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 If that works by disconnecting the power to the pump as an emergency shut down probably a kill switch in the pump line will work better.
👍
You are a treasure good sir. Thank you for the master class on diesel heaters!!
Hi John, Thank you for all your info and work that goes into making these video's. I was getting a low voltage warning E-01 and the heater would then shut down. It wasn't the batteries for they were at 13.2v . Come to find out it was the fuse and after changing it the unit worked just fine.
👍
Hi John - Thanks for your quick response. I’ll keep my fingers crossed and hope one of your subscribers will come up with some answers. In the meantime I’ll try to locate a Celsius to Fahrenheit conversion table. Hope you’re enjoying the sail.
Hi Michael, 22°C to 25°C is a comfortable temperature. 30°C is warm.
I'm from Alaska, and I believe 17°c to 20°c is comfortable!
Hi Reg,
Yes you are right, 94 beats a minute works out at 1.56 Hz or pulses a second.
1.6 Hz is the default minimum on these heaters. You get flame out when you go lower.
It is not realistic to try and slow the pump rate further.
A real 2 KW heater is about 330 mm long, the outlet is about 60 mm in diameter, and the weight about 2.8 kg
A 5 KW heater is about 390 mm long, the outlet is about 75 mm diameter, and the weight about 4.2 kg.
I hope this helps. JMcK
Love the bird sounds in the back ground!
One of the positives of living on acreage. The downside is there is a lot of mowing. JMcK
Another way to force shutdown would be to disconnect the pump if you can.
Good tip about needing the right shutdown, fuses/breakers too need to be happy drawing 20A on the 12V model.
Just received my Chinese heater here in Canada, too about three weeks to get delivered. But my controller is different from all the ones you show here. It is like the lcd display model but it doesn’t have the battery or wifi displays on it and no clock, if I hold down the top two buttons it gives me a new display of blue mountains in the corner where you have a battery display. Have you seen these I can’t find anybody explaining these controllers
@@wannabsailor not seen those, maybe a new type, the older LCD controller is cheap if you need to change.
Solution to the PCB melting might be to add a mount that insulates it better from the heat of the frame it is attached to.
While you are the de facto leader in describing these heaters, you cover more than anyone else and you correct what others have wrong, etc... you regularly mess up the values you express... as the length of time the more advanced controller 1 1/2 to 2 weeks, less than a minute later 2 to 3 weeks... you do that a lot in all your videos and why I bring it up.
Hi Mr D,
Thanks for the feedback. Can you give me more info re the time you talk about so I can go back and see what I said.
Generally if I talk about time, say the time you should give the heater a high speed run to clean out carbon, it is such a variable, and depends on your heater install, how you operate the heater, the quality of diesel you use etc. I just give rough guidelines. If you use the heater constantly on low power and you have a long bendy exhaust perhaps a high power run every couple of weeks is a good preventive maintenance issue. Every heater and install is different, so is the time for a hot carbon burn. On our boat in the Med, I just give it a high power run once a year (season), but the motorhome about once a month.
Re the circuit board, I think you would find effective isolation difficult in the space available. Better to use effort to prevent a sudden shutdown in the first place.
Cheers JMcK
Watched all your heater videos now John. Its clear you have passion and experience in teaching, and you do it extremely well. I'll gleefully use all your tips when i install my system. Any tips on multiple air outlets would be handy !
Cheers Si
Thank you so much for this mate, I have the controller with the blue circle and it had be stuffed how it worked. Thank you so much I will credit you in my video. I have also subscribed, good to see a fellow Aussie.
Thanks for the feedback Pokey. JMcK
The control unit needs a battery backup, like a PC...that way, it should remem ber the time and settings. 👍
By the way, your video was great!
Thanks for the video. A thought, If your controller fails, Disconnect the lead to the pump. This should cause the heater to generate a E-08 or E-04 error but should still allow the heater to power down without overheating. (in theory, not tested)
Thanks for the feedback Pierre. Yes that is more preferable than turning off the fuel and having the pump run dry. I mentioned in reply to another comment here a suggestion to consider a switch in the pump power line. But it is all about accessibility. A controller failure is very rare and if accessibility to the fuel pump wiring was difficult, like under the van in the mud and rain, I would use the power off method and a portable fan. Also as I have done this before, I am familiar with what happens. Thanks again. JMcK
THANKS for the great info. As a magpie lover I really liked hearing your lot in the background.
Your welcome Daryl.
Re the second sentence, the male magpie has been a resident here for over 6 years now, and even if I am away 3 months, he flies down to greet me the day I arrive home. In six breeding cycles, neither he nor his mate has ever attacked me, no matter how close I come to the nest.
John McK 47 similar story here re magpies. My breeding pair sit on my knee each morning and have their daily briefing. I’m in Paradise Beach Victoria. On the diesel heater, I am working my way through your videos. I really appreciate your efforts and the great information provided.
Daryl Hooke
Thanks Daryl. JMcK
Hi there
You can go into the menu in the ECB and make changes. There are a number of people online who will give you the password.
I no longer do that because I have seen too many users get themselves in a whole lot of problems. There is no reset button back to factory settings.
If your set up is correct, and your issues are with a new heater, I suggest you ask for a replacement as you could have controller or ECB issues. JMcK
Hey john, fun video!
But you forgot to talk about the advanced control on the controller with the lcd screen.
Going to the settings, the fourth dash, the password is 1688, and then you can adjust the ratio of the rate of pulse and the speed of the fan to improve the quality of the combustible mixture.
I tried my heater for the first time today and it works great !!
👍
More really good information John ,did wonder myself what would happen if controller broke down as it needs fan to blow air through the unit to cool down , good to know that those controllers only work on those heaters with the same control board ,👍 ❤️
Hi John, I am pleased the information is helpful to some people. JMcK
Very good videos John, thank you very much for your effort. I would love to se a video regarding the advanced setting and tweaking the rpm/Hz for optimal performance.
Hi Dessmo,
Thanks for your comments and video request, unfortunately I will leave your particular topic request for others to do. My goal with these videos was to try and help the DIY person who would buy a cheap Chinese copy heater on line and install it themselves, without the help or input from a brand name supplier. In fact some brand name suppliers insist on a professional install.
I believe the Chinese have done a good job matching fan/rpm settings, and when amateurs start messing here with the password protected control settings they often mess things up.
This is an area I will leave for a tinkering enthusiast to play with, and publish a video, should they choose. Sorry. JMcK
Hi good videos,
On this video you say that if you have a different connector on the control unit and you wish to change it for a red/blue controller etc, you need to swap the ECU to match them up . you can't as the round or triangular plug on the control unit connects to the wiring loom, not directly into the ECU. the wiring loom needs to be changed.
John. Thanks for this series of great videos at79 sure help question if controller goes seems like it will keep running. If u disconnect pump will unit keep running to act like cool down then could pull fuse. Than you
Hi Richard,
If you turn off the fuel or disconnect power to the fuel pump the heater will go into safe shutdown mode. JMcK
Thank you John
Recently purchased the cheapest 5 kw heater I could find, $84USD. It came with the simple controller you note as decent. I like the simple knob controller, ordered one, tested it and got the 7 error code. I suspected the incompatibility issue so I ordered another motherboard and knob controller.
The new motherboard looks substantially different but has the same connections. I tried the original controller and only got 4 red LEDs dashes. Both new knob controllers show the 1 error code, low voltage with 12.6 volts on brand new battery I keep on battery tender.
The packaging indicates the replacement motherboard is usable with 12 or 24 volts, though I specifically ordered a 12 V unit. However, very clearly marked on the board where the big red wire is soldered, it says “+24V. (The original board that came with the heater has no marking at the same wire, though the cover is marked 12V.). I think I have a 24 V replacement board, thus low voltage error code. It is going back and I will try to order, yet again, a 12V mboard. Is it really this complicated? Am I on the right track or do I just start over with another complete unit that costs a little more. I am already collecting spare controllers.
Thank you, John. I have watched all your vids and find them extremely helpful. I am spreading your fame at our US Albin Owners Group.
Hi Richard,
Thanks for the post.
When I made these videos, some years ago now, to try and help the DIY installer, the Chinese manufactures all followed the same protocol and it was so easy to mix an match controllers and motherboards, but lately some manufactures have been going proprietary and using their own protocol. This is making it difficult for the average heater owner to make changes.
I think you may be on the right path, but first check the voltage at the motherboard.
Are you bench testing, or installed testing. It is not uncommon for heater owners to have voltage issues after install, particularly if they do not connect heater direct to the battery, have a cheap fuse, and don't increase wire size.
If voltage issue is on a bench test I suggest you ask supplier for replacement controller and motherboard.
There is also another issue to consider. Most of the Chinese Copy heaters were exact copies (mechanical parts, not electronics) of the German Eberspacher D2 and D4 heaters. But now there are some Chinese heaters that are copies of the German Webasto heater. These two heaters are very different inside even though they may look similar to the untrained eye. Parts for Eberspacher copy are not compatible with Webasto copy.
Because of these issues, I now recommend the normal purchaser buy a heater that comes with the controller they want.
Please let me know how you go. JMcK
@@johnmck1147
One of the things that drew me to you besides the sheer volume of info you put out is that you respond to almost all inquiries! You do realize how unconventional you are?
And how grateful your public is!
I am bench testing since you strongly recommend it and I am glad I am I did. When you say check voltage at the motherboard are you suspecting voltage drop from too small wiring in the boat? (I am a licensed electrician...well I let it lapse a few years back since I retired...) One would need to check voltage drop while it is running which could be tricky without tapping the wires close to the unit. Certainly doable...
I did purchase the heater with the controller I thought would allow me to add the knob style. The controller is not the one that you got with the aluminum case heater. Funny thing, the manual that came with my heater has a section that covers the knob style controller.
I have sent back the controller that indicates +24V on the motherboard. I have ordered another controller that says 12V in all the advertising info. I have tried contacting these sellers to no avail. Wish me luck! I also have contacted the original supplier requesting whether or not they can provide another controller and motherboard or will allow me to return and upgrade to a more expensive unit. I am still within the 30 day return window. The unit works like a champ with its supplied controller and motherboard. There is no guarantee that a more expensive unit will be any different than the one I have since they all advertise and look identical except for color of plastic.
I have also considered what else could be happening here, many posters say simply swap a couple wires around and voila. These are really basic units: a controller with three wires, a pump with two wires, and a two wire power supply. Internally, there is the heat sensor and the two wire connector to the fan. Whether or not the motherboard is made of Swiss cheese or unobtainium, it still has the harness which contains the connectors to pump, batt, and controller and its internal connections to the fan and sensor. And the replacement motherboard should nest into unit without any mods. Now if each factory chooses to use interchangeable harnesses and non-interchangeable components we are all left blowing in the wind.
Curious stuff.
No need to respond, John. I will update if I have any success or gain any wisdom. The unit I have works fine as supplied. I was simply trying to have parts on hand for field repair, mainly to avoid burning up the motherboard by a hard shutdown. When this unit craps, maybe I'll be old enough to sell the boat.
Thank you, good sir!
(I neglected to mention the glow plug. Yes, I did connect it. Oops!)
After two new ECUs and two knob style controllers I could not achieve any interchangeability. I put it all back together using only the parts supplied originally. Works fine, but I have no backup plan short of simply installing another entire unit. If and when I do, I'll spend more than $84 and hope for the best. The second ECU was exactly the same as the first with +24V marked at the big red wire. The supplier assured me it would work on 12V.
The problems you had with the white metal cased heater where the wires were mixed up, what you can do is just unsolder the two or three wires and then resolder them in the correct order. That way you can keep the old ECU. Simply reorder the wire
best most informative videos on these heaters thanks for the work and the great presentation
Your welcome John. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 I bought my first of these a week ago and have not even test run it yet or done the install at this point i am going to watch all your videos before i decide where i am going to install this one in our trailer.
so all the info you present is greatly appreciated
john galt
Hi John, A smart idea to always bench test every heater before an install.
I hope the install goes well, and the little heater gives you lots of warmth on those cold winter days. JMcK
Thanks. Should you control panel fail and it keeps running, best fix is unplug the fuel pump which will stop fuel flow and heater will go out. After about 5 minutes it should be cool enough to pull the fuse.
Does the control unit need to be on the heater? Maybe it can be taken out and setup next to the controller far away from the heater to make it impossible to overheat it.
Hi Dan,
Possible but difficult. On the ECU is a fan rotation sensor, that would need to be removed from the circuit board and some sort of fine tolerance bracket made.
But why bother. With a good install an overheat is extremely remote. Also, in the unlikely event of an issue, an new ECB is only about $20.
Cheers. JMcK
You are my Chinese diesel heater guru
Pleased you found the videos helpful. JMcK
To prevent your battery from being drained you could install a battery cutoff, and that would cut off accessories once the battery reaches a certain voltage
Hi Eksine, yes you could do that but you would remove the heaters ability to do a proper cool down cycle before turning off. Much better to have a seperate vehicle start battery and a domestic house battery. Also the heater ECU will initiate a shutdown cycle when it sees around 10.5 volts at the heater, and prevent permanent battery damage. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 ok I see thank you for explaining that
emergency disconnect switch on the fuel pump would work great, could be on a thermostat as well.
👍. Correct. JMcK
Hey John, u do a great job helping with navigation of these diesel heaters. On my second heater, runs great, just curious, have a led controller and when you hit the ok button to see time, hertz, and voltage and scroll to next the alpine symbol comes up with a number from 150 to maybe 300 with a m to the side. Any suggestions what this means. South Carolina here. Love the heater for my RV.
Thanks
Hello John, Thanks for the quick feedback. I have an EXTERNAL temperature device which has functioned on my Webasto heater. An internal switch , wakes up the heater at a set minimum temperature and cut it out at the desired temperature. Could I use this in conection with the simple controller with the rotating knob... ? Maybe am asking too much ? Thank you anyway for your first answer which helped me sorting out the problem.
MIND BLOWN AWAY YOU SIR ARE ONE SMART DUDE !!!
Wow Raymond, thank you for those nice comments. JMcK
Thank you so much for the info and tips on these heaters sir :)
Hi John can i put a switch on the red power wire at the led controller like cut the power wire next to controller and fit a switch to it on my diesel heater, thanks mate you are doing a great job as well , o and can you change the display from herts to temp mate?? or you think it best just to use the herts display
I've had the heater 15 months using it during the winter months in my semi truck now we've had a super mild March and I've gotten away without using it using a warm blankett but some nights that's a bit cool
👍
Multiple air outlets are ok as you are restricting the airflow. We have three outlets on our boat. JMcK
Thank you for your great presentation! Learning a lot about these! God bless!
Your welcome Allen. JMcK
Hi ?? everyone has said, great video and well presented. I'm assuming all controllers are interchangeable except for the dodgy wired one
That is correct. JMcK
Thank you! this topic is very frustrating to me, it seems like the simplest dial controller is the best because it can act as a basic thermostat with no hassle. I have the type with the LEDs and blue circle on the front and it's annoying and won't work as a thermostat for me. Plus I had to bash it open and solder the 7 segment displays to get it to work in the first place! I wish the dial type could read error codes to you...
Hi Chris,
Thanks for the feedback.
The simple dial controller DOES SHOW ERROR CODES. The little LED's that indicate the temp setting flash an error code. Eg, three lights flashing means error 03.
Cheers. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 wow thanks John, I'll have to pick one up. I appreciate this series very much, thank you for making it!
Very helpful info. I am thinking of powering the heater from the 240v mains supply using an appropriate adapter. Power cuts in my area are quite common, though they last less than 10 seconds at a time in most cases. What should you do if the power is shut off unexpectedly?
I was thinking of using a 12v relay and a small motorcycle battery I have sitting around as a fail safe.
The idea being that when the mains is on, the adapter powers the relay sending power from the adapter to the heater. If the power is cut, then the relay will switch to the battery, giving me time to power it off properly. I would have to make sure to top up the battery every few weeks or after a power cut.
My question is will the heater notice the short 20ms interruption in power as the relay switches over? I would assume it would briefly flash up a low power warning as the power switches over and then continue running? Maybe it would simply shutoff and overheat? It must be able to deal with short power drops as battery voltage can sag as other high power devices turn on.
I would love to hear your thoughts and would like to say thank you for posting such helpful info on these heaters. I have been pouring though your videos and they have answered many questions.
Hi SF,
I do not like to give definite comment on something I have not personally tested, and I have not tested a 20 ms power cut. But I can give you an opinion.
If the ECU detects a voltage drop it will go into a shut down cycle to protect the heater, and I suspect it will do the same if it senses a power supply interruption. Whether it can sense a 20ms interruption I do not know, but you can bench test it yourself. Next time I am doing a bench test I will do this for my own knowledge.
However, as you are going to use a motorbike battery, have you considered using that to power the heater, and connect the battery to a small multistage smart charger, rather than use a mains power supply and a relay.
A 10 second power outage on a very hot heater will likely cause damage to the ECU
If you do bench test the relay, I would be most interested to hear the outcome. I am on my sail boat in Greece at the moment and can't do bench tests. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thank you for the reply! I understand your position on the subject and will have to do some tests.
Do you know if the fan motor is a 12v DC motor? If so maybe I could wire the relay to the motor directly so if the power goes out the battery will kick in to keep the fan running. I hope its not some fancy AC 3 phase setup that I will have no hope in powering with ease.
I assume the only issue with a power cut is the ECU board getting too hot? Also maybe residual fuel in the chamber?
The only reason I came up with the relay and small battery idea was because I already have the items to hand. I normally keep the battery connected to a tiny solar panel that trickle charges it and thought it could easily keep the heater running for a few minutes if the power was interrupted. I don't think it has the grunt to run the heater for long periods.
I could maybe try and relocate the ECU board outside of the housing as a last ditch attempt at protecting the heater from unforeseen events.
Anyway I will keep you posted on the situation.
Enjoy your holiday! all the best.
From logic only, I do not think a 20 ms power cut would cause issues.
Worst case heater would go into shut down mode safely as power would be available after switch to run glow plug and fan. But this needs to be tested.
It is not practical to move ICU out of heater. Too many issues. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Just a little update. I spent a while tinkering and I got it to work. Though I did have to change my plan a little.
When powering the relay from the same 12 volt power supply that the heater is connected to I noticed that the power supply would take a short while to die when the power was removed. The heater would switch off just before the relay switched over to the battery. The relay didn't need much power to stay energized and would switch over to the battery just a little too late. This would cause the display to blink. (tested while the heater wasn't running)
I needed to find a way for the relay to switch earlier so I rummaged through my collection of old 12v wall warts and tested them to see which one would make the relay deactivate the quickest when power was removed. I found one that was instantaneous and used that to power the relay separately.
So now when power is removed the relay switches instantly before the heaters power supply has even started to die and the heater continues like nothing happened. When power is reinstated again, there is also no issue as the heater power supply thankfully comes on instantly.
I plucked up the courage to finally run the heater and test it. Sure enough it didn't flinch. The fact that the heaters power supply would take a second to die and finding a small power supply for the relay that dies instantly made the switch over to the battery happen so quickly that the heater didn't notice a thing.
So while my initial theory didn't quite work, I was able to find a simple solution using old junk I had floating about.
In conclusion you can make it work but I can't say there is a definitive circuit that will work in all situations. I was lucky that the heaters power supply would stay on for a brief period when the power was disconnected and that I found a power supply for the relay that would deactivate really quickly.
I'm pleased I didn't have to spend money on a leisure battery and smart charger to power the heater. My hoard of junk parts and a little experimentation saved a few notes. Hopefully now if we have a power cut the heater won't have a meltdown.
Hi SF, thanks for that info and feedback. I hope all goes well for you. JMcK
Thank you John for your video
I'm thinking of installing a switch on the red (+) wire of the controller, and at the end of heater season/travel, it will cut power to the controller and display. While a digital controller will still need reprogramming, cutting it off will not damage the heater, even if accidentally turned off.
Could the same result be achieved by disconnecting the connecter blocks from the loom to the display controller? I've read a switch is a no no so I thought when not in use of unplugging the controller?
@@naomiobrien3543 if I understand, yes you could just disconnect your controller. Perhaps there is confusion because yes, a switch to disconnect power to the burner might be a big problem if switched off when it’s running. But a switch to the controller is no problem.
Hi John, thanks for your great videos, the detail you provide is really amazing.
I've noticed the leads on the controllers do not seem to be very long. I am thinking that this will limit your options on the placement of the controller and the heater.
cheers
Will the knob style keep a close temp , like will it turn on and shut down at certain temps? Or does the knob simply adjust the rate of fuel being pumped and the fan speed? I ask because there will be a bunch of other stuff to do before installing the heater , and it's still too hot hear in the states to test it out.
Also which one of the LCD screens do you suggest for simplicity that can be set for a certain temperature?
The heater that we just ordered has the knob.
Hi Phil,
If your dial controller looks like mine in the video, well it comes with an inbuilt thermistor and as such does offer control over the temperature.
Any of the common LED controllers will give you temperature control. But having said that, some heaters are now coming on the market with "non standard" wiring and connecting plugs so it is more difficult to swap out controllers. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thank You for the quick reply Sir. I had a question , or an idea come to mind after watching your videos. I'm putting this in a full sized bus. What if I was to cut a hole in the exhaust pipe in the bus , make a good flange and connect the heater exhaust directly into the 3 inch diesel engine exhaust pipe running out the back of the bus??? It will be 8-12 FT long depending on where the heater gets mounted. I'm assuming that long of a pipe would muffle the turbine sounds down quite a bit. Also assuming if it was to run thru the bus muffler that might be too much back pressure on it , what is your thoughts on that? Or do you think running the heater exhaust into the big 3 inch pipe would be too restrictive ? I may be even bigger exhaust pipe , I haven't got the bus home yet , but did look under it and did notice that it has new exhaust under it.
Once again I truly Thank You for your in-depth videos on these heaters.
Phil Lowman
Hi Phil,
One thing you must consider with these heaters is back pressure, as the combustion fan is very little and very basic. Running the heater exhaust into the bus exhaust could work with the bus engine off, but how would you prevent engine exhaust creating significant back pressure when the engine is running, and how would prevent the engine exhaust coming back out through the heater?
It might be simpler to just run the heater exhaust just straight down through the floor.
Cheers.. JMcK
so much info ...you're the best ..thank you for all your hard work
Thanks for the positive comments Kelly. JMcK
Love this series, thank you! Would love if you tried some mods, like moving the electronics out of the heater so they can't get too hot if power is removed. Or if there would be a way to mod a controller to be able to turn LEDs on and off with external switch. Oh, separate question, what are your thoughts on the heaters that have a metal housing instead of plastic? I like the idea as far as durability, but concerned the housing would get to hot.
Hi Hoss
An uncontrolled shutdown is not a common occurrence, so it would hardly be worth the effort of removing the electronics. It could be done though.
I have already done tests on the metal case heaters, (the white heater you see here is aluminum), and like you I initially thought there would be an issue with the metal case getting very hot, as aluminum is a great conductor of heat. But my tests showed this not to be the case. Aluminum heat transfer works both ways, so the incoming air kept the aluminum case cool. My tests showed virtually no difference in actual case temperatures at varying settings. It is really just a personal preference thing what type of case you buy.
I was planning a video test, but I am going away sailing shortly for three months. Perhaps I may do one later in the year. JMcK
HI John,
So enjoying your videos, my background comes from Power Generation but still unclear how an Electro Magnet works on DC ?
Thinking some form of oscillator in the ECU
Looking fwd to your next subject.
Cheers
Hi Neville,
It is just simple power switching. DC power on the magnet coils energise, and piston flies up. Power off - no magnetic field and spring pushes piston back down.
I have made a lead with a simple micro switch which I turn on and off for when I want to send fuel down a long delivery line in initial start up. If I remember right you can see it in motorhome video. (Made Six years ago now). JMcK
Hi John good video Just to let you know the v2 heater you have comes with the new blue controller and red remote in uk with the better sellers the red remote is by far better it will tell you the the heat of the unit battery volts up and down and a lot more from sitting in your front room so if you buy a new heater look for the red remote just got one it's the best iv'e come across give the birds some nuts oh by the way that controller I was trying to pair was a faulty one have a good day. Jeff
Thanks for the feedback Jeff. Yes, I will do that with my next heater.
Great videos John, what size of solar panel would you suggest for a 5kw heater?
Morning John, Have you found a more durable/ better alternative to the plastic vent that delivers the hot air into the room.
The hose clip holding the hose to the plastic vent loses tension during heating. (ie plastic softens due to heat) consequently the hose dislodged and melted the plastic vent. Thank you Dave
Hi Dave,
I have had no issues with mine, but I am aware of some, new to market, heater sellers providing garbage accessories with their heaters. Not just hose, but fuel line, hose clamps, and substandard electrical wire.
Some marine and hardware stores sell an insulated aluminum vent hose that may be suitable for you.
I am currently away sailing for 3 months, and your question has prompted me to do some research on this when I return home. JMcK
G'day John. I note you say the blue controller on your ipad at 3.15 is the same as the older unit but a different configuration. I have the blue controller but nowhere is there a hole for a thermister to read temp. Do you know how this one is reading temp? Seems strange to me.
I've just bought one of these heaters and it is powered by a 12 volt 30 amp power supply......when it switches off the LED readout turns off too.........I also finally turn the power supply off when the heater goes to it's off cycle.
With a dual purpose battery it's not problem to have small power draws. Normal car batteries will drain fast....
Hi John. In your opinion are there any benefits in the units with aluminum housing? Safety? Durability? Longevity? I plan on mounting mine in the trunk of a car, routing the intake and supply air into the passenger area. Is this space too confined? Do these units need more air space around them for cooling? Thanks.
Hi D, the aluminum housing is a personal preference thing. I could find no real differences in operation testing between the aluminum and plastic heaters. Before testing I thought there may be excessive cabin heat lost through the housing rather than going into the ducting, but this was not so. The aluminum is more robust, but could perhaps suffer from corrosion in very wet climates (but I have NO knowledge of this happening)
Both types of heaters need an air space around them for safety. The trunk of your car should be fine, but you would need some form of barrier so luggage could not fall against the heater.
If they are about the same price, I would choose aluminum, but is just my personal preference.
Regards. JMcK
Thanks John. You provided the instructions that were needed to get a good install. I have mine installed in my RV but the display will not turn on. It is the one that has all the LEDs and draws the most current. I have search for a way to diagnose the problem be it the wiring or the display but I can't find this information no can I get the display to turn on. Have you heard of this? Could the controller be DOA?
Hi Charles,
First check your install and make sure your connection are tight and your battery voltage polarity is correct. If this is good and your heater is a new one ask for a replacement.
If the heater is not new, suggest you buy a new controller on eBay. Look for one with same plug as your current plug.
Occasionally you can get a dud controller, but double check your wiring first. Easy for me to diagnose, I have a number of spares and can just plug in a spare controller. JMcK
Thanks John. I have checked everything and it appears to be fine. I have ordered another controller. I don't hold out much hope on them honoring the 3 year warranty but if they do I will have a spare.
Charlie
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Thanks for the reply fitted one in mates caravan last week it primes ok but then nothing on pressing start so suspect faulty controller it’s the basic type with dial where as mine is the one that shows functions ,fan spinning ,glow plug pump kicking in ect so have no idea what’s wrong ?
Hi,
Very much appreciate all your heater videos. I bought one of the “8kw” units, you know, orange with carbon fibre (!). Works well, been testing it in workshop before vehicle install.
When I say works well, the heater works as advertised. But the lcd controller seems crippled. I can change from hertz to temp, and temp increases and decreases according to setting. But the clock doesn’t hold time , and no display icon for glow plug nor fuel pump. And no way found ( believe me I’ve tried many button combos ) to access admin settings.
I’m planning on adding afterburner control when they become available again, so the lcd controller issue isn’t a deal breaker. Just a bit annoying right now.
Cheers
Alistair
Hi Alistair, it is not uncommon to get a broken LCD controller. Suggest you ask your supplier for a replacement. Most eBay heater suppliers won't be able to give you a replacement as very few sell spare parts, but most will give you enough cash back for you to buy a replacement on eBay. Cheers. JMcK
Hi john,
Yes, I’ll see about getting some satisfaction from the vendor. Another funny thing, I had a look at the motherboard in the heater. The board connection for the case temp sensor was connected one pin off. I mean laterally moved one pin. Took the chance and reset connection “properly “ , but got an error code on power up. It’s almost as if the wires to the connector were inserted in the wrong place and the entire connector has to be shifted one pin over to make it work.
I’ll look at it again, and take a pic.
Oh, and I did a quick and dirty measure of pump hz , indicated vs. apparent. I counted pump clicks for time period and got pretty well 2x the indicated. Ie 2hz when 1hz indicated. Perhaps more evidence of a flakey controller.
Cheers
Alistair
ragnar hairybreeks
Thanks for that feedback Alastair. I would be interested to know how you go with a new controller. JMcK
Wondering LCD controller has to be mounted inside the room being heated?
Planning on mounting to heater outside the room under a cover and just plumb the heating pipe inside. Trying to reduce noise plus carbon monoxide risk.
Should I wire the LCD controller into the room so the the thermister can control the heat inside the room? Thanks
Awesome video John, do you know the control PIN OUT for the harness? I wanted to integrate this in to a controller I built for automation. Or does it use I2C/SPI/etc and communicate with the main board?
Hi FJS,
In the controllers I have, the blue wire is the communication wire, the other two are power wires. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thanks for that John! Would be curious to see if we can integrate in with a serial i/o - enjoy your videos
👍
I want to sit on that green recliner and drink a beer with you and visit.
👍
John: Quite a few asking about the different style plugs on different controllers. You mentioned it yourself in this video. Any thoughts to if you could just cut the wire (plug type) off whatever old controller you have & solder it onto the new controller? (Of course you would need to cut the wires on the new controller as well). There (seems) to be a pretty standard 3 wires to these controllers & a standard 3 color code of Red, Blue & Black. As I was watching you approach that section/problem in this video of the wires/colors being in different positions on a replacement controller I thought you were going to say to do just that. Cut the wires.Solder into correct position & problem solved. Instead you went into the customer service with the supplier. I guess that worked out pretty good with the $50 rebate. Just wondering if you figure a cut & splice job could also be done? I have the issue of a heater (LCD controller) that came with a square shaped plug for the controller. ALL the replacement controllers (falsely advertised as "universal" controllers) seem to have that Triangle shaped plug. Si if my controller goes bad I guess I have to buy both a new controller & Mother board for the heater (which I assume comes with a new main wire harness?). Otherwise the only other option I see is what I ask about....Cutting & splicing old shape plug to new controller wires. Does THAT seem like a thing that could work???????? Others are wanting to know this too!!!!
Hi Rusty,
I have to be a little careful here. When I made these videos some years ago now, the Chinese manufactures followed a standard protocol, but lately some manufactures are doing their own thing, and nothing matches up.
The old standard for controllers was 3 wires. Black (12V-). Red (12V+) and Blue (sense) If the plugs were different or the colours didn’t line up you could cut the wired and solder them back to suit a new controller, or different plug.
In your case you could do this yourself but you must accept the responsibility of things going wrong. In the majority of cases this would work, but if you have a manufacturer using totally different protocol it would not work. Make sure your power wire from battery is fused. (15 amp fuse)
If protocol is wrong in most cases nothing would happen. Worst case you could damage ECB or controller. If you were unlucky and did damage those parts you can buy a spare ECB and controller quite reasonable price on line, but suggest you buy both from same supplier to up your chances they are completely compatible. If not you can return them.
Cheers. JMcK
@@johnmck1147 Thanks for the reply John & the added info of the (old protocol) for the volts/color code. I get your telling me to use caution & the need to accept the responsibility... I do. It's tough to decide between buying spare parts (controllers) & just buying a whole new heater. I'm just trying to be prepared as I have already had a situation where the wires into the controller were pulling off the soldered terminal & possibly cross shorting to the neighboring terminal in the controller. As you probably have noticed as much as you have studied these things, There is no wire stress relief so fatigue takes a toll with movement. I have been posting/advising folks to pump some hot glue or RTV Gasket seal in & all around the wire where it enters the controller. That seemed to solve my issue. The terminals are way to close to attempt to re-solder if they break off. Anyway, I thank you again for all the information you have given & taken the time to educate us all on these heaters & operations & repairs... I most certainly learned a bunch of things watching your series of videos. All those Chinese Manufactures should be required to send you a commission on each unit they sell for all the help you have given! Hope you are well & all is good in your world. Rusty
👍. JMcK
Hi John, excellent information in this video. Are you familiar with Jayco caravans? I’m wondering whether I could just pick up the 12V power from the fuse box? Reason I say that is because Jayco’s already have a 12V isolate switch in the “roller door” area. Provided I go through the heater shut down sequence, I figure I could then just isolate the 12V and not have to worry about installing another switch, to power down the controller (when van is not in use).
Hi Greg, these heaters draw around 10 to 12 amps on start and shut down, and you require a 15 amp fuse. One critical install requirement is to upgrade the wire size if the heater is more than about 500mm from the battery, if you don't do this you will have starting issues as voltage drop in the wire loom does not heat up the glow plug enough to get a good burn start.
You can use the fuse box if it has adequate wire size from battery to fuse box.
I always prefer to run the heater wire direct to the battery with its own fuse and master switch. Often in caravans the wire size to the fuse box is marginal, and people run lights, TV, phone charging etc, and to turn on the heater as well causes significant voltage drop in the system.
Cheers, JMcK
John, I have a couple of general questions.
1. I see that these Diesel Air Heaters come in several sizes, 2.5 kw, 3.0 kw, 5.0 kw and 8.0 kw. I'm concerned as to what size chinese diesel heater I should purchase for my USA 2018 Ford Transit, Tall Roof and extended length Campervan.
2. I would also like to mount the fuel tank on the exterior of the vehicle on the drivers side underneath and fillable from the exterior of van. I don't want the tank in the living area of the van. Do you have any recommendations. The van engine runs on gasoline and not diesel.
Hi Michael,
First up, I have only ever seen these Chinese diesel air heaters come in two actual sizes. 2.5 kw and 5 kw. For marketing reasons some less than honest suppliers advertise these heaters as different sizes, but actually sell you a standard 5 kw heater. All the 8kw heaters I have seen are actually 5 kw heaters sold at a higher price.
Now my suggestion.
You do not tell me about how well insulated the van is, or the area and outside air temperatures you expect to experience, but I suggest you go for a standard 5 kw heater. Some people have another opinion, but I have the view that it is better to have a heater of greater capacity than needed running at a lower setting where there is less noise and less stress on the heater, rather than a smaller heater running flat out all the time.
If space is an issue for you and the van is well insulated and you are not in constant negative temperatures, you could get buy with a 2.5 kw heater, but an actual 2.5 kw is hard to find.
From my experience, there are yet no 8kw diesel air heater. They are all stock standard 5 kw heaters branded and sold as 8 kw heaters at a higher price.
You can mount the diesel fuel tank where conviennent for you provided you use acceptable install practices. You are aware these are Chinese copy diesel heaters, not petrol heaters, although with the genuine Eberspacher heater you can purchase a special petrol version.
Regards, JMcK
I appear to have the advanced black controller but on a basic motherboard. When I press the settings button, nothing happens except a beep from the controller itself. The pulse rate increases in 0.5hz increments only and cannot be adjusted until the heater is on. The issue now is it reporting E01 and my only conclusion is it is somehow stuck on 24v. Without the settings menu, I have no idea how to change it back to 12v. Any ideas?
Good video, I am not sure about the pulse control, would this be used to increase and lower the heat? in other words what is the function and the optimal setting.
Increase the Hz, or pump pulses and you increase rate of fuel to heater and hence increase temperature output. JMcK
How would I interface a home made controller to the heaters? On the Espar, there's a yellow wire to turn on the heat by applying 12VDC to it. Is the wiring that simple, or is there a complex communication ie CANBUS, etc?
Beautifull explanation.