You finally summed up how I feel about this movie. I couldn't quite put my finger on why I like to rewatch this movie so often, yet it is not as satisfying at the Dark Knight. Also explains why I fear rewatching the Dark Knight too often (seeing the imperfections of the gold), yet don't have the same reserve to rewatching The Dark Knight Rises
It's more like competing in a triathlon in which you swim like aquaman, bike like Lance Armstrong, and then get hit by a bus when running the marathon. It sucks.
I think Nolan and Ledger would've topped themselves. They're both legends, and they were only getting started with each other. It was a symbiotic relationship with so much potential.
It's not all about The Joker, and no going by certain Batman comics I know there are several stories that could've made better movies than The Dark Knight; it's all about execution.
I actually like DKR. The Dark Knight was better, yes, but I respect Nolan’s ambition and I like that he didn’t try to create a villain to out-Joker the Joker. Nolan just stuck to his guns and made a stand alone film, although with parallels to the first two. I liked it.
Rewatched the Trilogy this past weekend and if you watch the films back to back, you appreciate Rises more, infact after seeing all 3 movies 7 years after it concluded, i can't help but feel like this is a damn near perfect trilogy of films. The only thing keeping it from being "perfect" is because The Joker isn't seen or wasn't even mentioned in Rises which cannot be helped due to the death of Heath Ledger. With all that in mind, The Dark Knight Rises is still an amazing film. And what Chris Nolan and co. accomplished in the end is quite a feat. They really dont make super hero films like this anymore.
It has it strong points and a great movie in TDK. But perfect? Light years away from it. Specially rises. It has more nonsense and holes that you can overlook. I still love the trilogy though
That was my first thought when I heard it. Batman did die, because he was always a symbol to begin with. Bruce killed Batman. It wasn't really a lie in that sense, and it's ambiguous what JGL will do with it.
Yes, but it had to bear with the legacy of The Dark Knight. It fell short on that, not that it was a bad film but because its story and plot, though amazing if you read them, were not executed that masterfully. If you ask me ''does it worth our time then?'' ill fucking say '' YES! ''. Its just that sence of pity of the grandieur that could have been; an Epic movie held as pinacle of art like The Return of the King.
stryder HD It was average. It got increasingly stupid like the stupid battle at the end, Catwoman's cringy lines and Bane had the most anticlimactic death of all time Average film in an average trilogy BB-7/10 TDK-8.9/10 TDKR-7.8/10
I agree, people poo on Anne Hathaway. I like her as an actress, don't know her personally. She was amazing in the wonderful film Colossal, which I highly recommend.
, brother... When u look at this film as a product of reference to literary masterpieces like a tale of two cities or any other underlying theme that nolan has built upon, it might seem like a great work of art... Now looking at it from a narrative standpoint, its 2 hours of total bullshitting... Myself being a hard core nolan fanboy, its still hard for me to digest this film despite its lunatic plot holes, vague character motivations, pathetic 3rd act villain reveal, below average action choreography, and totally ruining batman as a character... In dark knight we witnessed a batman who beat all odds and overcame his emotional hardships to truly stand up and become a noble person as a whole and you could genuinely relate to him as a character but this film honestly dumps all that character development into a paper shredder...
I understand the people who say that "Batman cannot sacrifice himself if Bruce Wayne is alive because they're the same person" but I believe those people miss the point or simply they don't want to see it. The point is that Bruce finally managed to live without Batman, without his fear, without his traumas, without his pain and anger... he finally "Rises from the darkness" and he did it by escaping the pit (which is my favourite scene in the trilogy) in that scene not only Batman rises to fight for Gotham against Bane and save the city, but more importantly BRUCE escapes from his pain finding the will to finally live his life and in a way he frees himself from Batman who was consuming him. Until that moment Bruce couldn't live without Batman because he needed him. Throughout all the movie there's this dualism and theme of "You need to find another way, you're not Batman anymore" or "you don't own these people anymore...you've given them everything" but he didn't give everything, not yet... Bruce knew that a legend is more powerful in death. After Escaping the pit Batman has to do the definitive sacrifice...he dies to give people hope and to give them an ideal. Doing this Batman finally completes his path and Bruce Wayne can start his own. So I believe this "Batman's sacrifice" needs to be seen more metaphorically because Bruce really lets die a part of him that has always been there since he fell in the pit when he was young. You couldn't still accept this and you may prefer an end where Bruce literally dies, but you can't say "Batman's sacrifice is a lie", it's not that superficial. I personally think the dualism of Batman/Bruce Wayne is very fascinating and I love the way Nolan ended this amazing trilogy, to me this is the end this character truly deserves. It's a story of a man who has to find the will to live again after a life spent fighting for justice and for people torturing himself physically and mentally with all his resources. This end symbolizes that out of tragedy and darkness comes greatness. It's up to us. Sorry if I made any mistakes, english is not my first language
@@DrDolan2000 Exactly. I think we all agree The Dark Knight is the best out of the three movies objectively (and one of the greatest of all), but for me when it comes to choose between one of them I don't know what to say really. I simply love the trilogy in its entirety, the way Nolan and all the staff crafted it, the amazing music, the evolution of it. The theme developed through each one of the three : fear, fall, rise. These movies are so important to me, so inspiring, this character has helped and still help me during my darkest times. I remember myself as a child watching Batman Begins in DVD and I remember how fascinated I was with this character that I could not fully understand yet. The third one is so epic to me, so inspiring, so hopeful, so effective, it focuses on the relationship between Bruce and Batman, it explores what the legacy of Batman could be, which are themes that I love. Unlike other Batman stories, this movie really explores the toxic effects that Batman has on Bruce in long terms, it taught me that maybe we can rise from our strongest fears and traumas, our darkest sides, from our deepest failures. And this creates a beautiful contrast in Batman, who of course is a symbol of hope and justice, something absolutely positive and necessary, a symbol of the best that we can be, but it's so toxic to the man behind it, it's so toxic to the man behind the physical personification of it (at least in long terms), so Bruce could only rise from it or die for it. The climbing scene is one of my favorite scenes of all time, the powerful Hans Zimmer's music, the symbolism, the meaning, it really gets me. For these reasons It pains me when people complain so much about it. Everyone can have a personal opinion and I'm not saying you're wrong if you don't like it, but I believe that despite its flaws, it's still so great. I love stories and I love movies, and the Dark Knight trilogy has made me love Batman so much, it has made me (and all of us) explore the meaning and the greatness of the idea of Batman, a character that I will always remember. Anyway thank you for your attention guys, I really appreciate :)
Batman sacrificed himself, for the greater good. His sacrifice was not based on a lie. That is why this "lie" of self-sacrifice has more chances of working than the flawed "Dent" lie. I do agree with the other points, I wish they had gone deeper into the evil's of the Dent's act under a corrupt government and shown some actual cases of Rich stealing from the Poor.. Though-provoking analysis! Enjoyed the video immensely!
The conversation between Alfred and Bruce showed why Bruce faked his death "when Rome's protector didn't leave they called him Caesar." Bruce didn't want to end up the City's judge, jury, and excutioner.
Honestly I think they could have done something better than just ripping off some crappy old book. The Riddler would have been a way better choice as a kind of Zodiac-like serial killer manipulating Batman personally, leaving clues at crime scenes. They still could have included Catwoman, maybe even Poison Ivy as well as a serial killer who uses botanical poisons, Deadshot too as a hitman using stolen Waynetech to increase his accuracy (seeing as how there are no superpowers in the Nolan-Verse) and hell maybe they could all be connected somehow to the Court of Owls...idk...The Dark Knight Rises was the weakest part of the trilogy.
@@John-X The Riddler part of your comment seems to be what Matt Reeves is doing with The Riddler in The Batman. But for the rest of your post, it kinda seems messy.
I think the dark knight rises did an extremely good job at following up to the best comic book movie of all time. It was a very emotional, powerful and satisfying end to the trilogy
Also it's funny the way you say 'Blackgate is an obvious analogy to Bastille' and a few sentences later you conclude there are no similarities between the two except excessive amount of prisoners.
Favourite Douchebag I'd argue that beyond the symbolism, it was a lie as Batman obviously wasn't actually dead and it was just a cover up from Bruce not wanting to be Batman anymore. Also, he said that the prisons were intended to be similar but lacked anything beyond the excessive level of prisoners to demonstrate how poor the writing of TDK was.
I believe they mean that Blackgate was supposed to be the Bastille to continue the "A Tale of Two Cities" connections, but beyond the prisoners and the storming, has too little in common to serve the same purpose: showing the brutality of the authority and their excessive overreaching powers.
Huzzamossi : Batman is Bruce's mission. Even though we usually think one equals another, Alfred is emphasising within the movie that Batman is just a part of Bruce and not vice versa. Bruce decided his mission is complete, thus Batman actually did die. It's not just symbolism unless you consider Batman to be symbolic in his entirety. I don't know why he concluded that the prisons were intended to be similar to that degree, to me the idea that a more aggressive government control would produce fuller prisons and bigger inequality is pretty elementary, and the idea that it is SUPPOSED to be a depiction of medieval France is definitely not something I would judge the movie by.
Favourite Douchebag Except that through the entire franchise we're led to believe that like in the comics Bruce is Batman's mask and not vice versa, Batman cannot die without Bruce dying so it's just strange to end it that way. Also Bruce also "died" hence his funeral so that's a lie... then there's the fact that the bat signal was fixed and that Blake was basically given the batcave implying that Batman isn't dead so it's just kind of a mess
That's not true at all. But I don't get why people don't like Dark Knight Rises. I can understand if you don't like Batman Begins. I can understand if you don't like Dark Knight. But Rises? Seriously how can anyone dislike this movie. I was at the edge of my seat and some of the scenes I can't even forget. I saw Dark Knight four times and forgot most of the scenes. I saw Rises twice and remember most of it and people don't understand depth. It was artistic and way better than DCEu crap
Achyuth Thouta I like rises . Imo it’s the weakest of the three. But that’s just my opinion , my favorite of the series is begins and I know I’m in the minority on that one , but it can’t be denied Nolan has got some of the most annoying fanboys around , the guy is going to get heavily criticized simply for stating his opinion
Achyuth Thouta the truth of the matter is that the movie could’ve been made way better nowadays and in all honesty with a better Batman and bane and cat women in the trilogy. Ben Affleck’s batman is a much more realistic Batman that could’ve been easily used to set a theme and philosophy set by Nolan
Batman didn't sacrifice himself at the end of The Dark Knight Rises. This wasn't his intention. The "death" of Batman wasn't meant to be a selfless act of self-sacrifice, it was a "selfish" act of unburdening himself of a weight too heavy to bear for him. Bruce Wayne actually came full circle at that point. He originally created Batman as a symbol that could've been anyone, yet in the course of the movies, he was so consumed by this symbol that he lost track of his own idinity in it. By the beginning of the Dark Knight Rises he felt like he only had two choices: To be Batman, or to be nothing. He lost sight over the fact that Batman was a symbol, he obsessively internalized the identity. The very same identity that he felt lead to the death of his loved ones. Being Bruce Wayne killed his parents. Being Batman killed Rachael. But when Gotham started going bad again, he felt like he had to Batman again to save it. Not realizing, as Alfred put it, that he had to help the Gotham police force as Bruce Wayne -- his actual identity --- to help himself too. Rachel said that Bruce Wayne was the mask and that Batman was his true self. But nah. Bruce was his true self around Rachel, Lucius and Alfred. When he encapsulated both sides of his psyche. A man, but a righteous one. And it was at the end of the the Dark Knight that he regained sight over what it means to be himself. And that Batman was a symbol that exists outside himself, that could be adopted by anyone. In this case, John Blake.
I wish the movies made this overarching theme more clear rather than trying to cram in random references to real life events and other peoples' works. Batman's story should be about the man under the mask, not the shitty ass city he lives in.
Dark knight would have been much better movie if it simply ended with Joker's victory. Gotham was doing great in the beginning, crime was disappearing, everyone was doing great, than Joker came and f-ed it all up. That should have been the story. That would provide a nice contrast and a great set-up for the next movie. Instead, "dark Knight" continued with two villains running around on the screen, people being all noble and not blowing each other up, Joker just arbitrarily loosing, and worst of all: "I am sacrificing myself for you" Bullsh.
15:44 this actually reinforces Jokers’ philosophy “When the chips are down these civilised people, they’ll eat each other”. As he said, people’s values and morals are a bad joke, and dropped at the first sign of trouble. And he was absolutely right The people are not fighting for a socialist revolution. It’s just chaos now and the citizens of Gotham have been reduced to primitive barbaric but ultimately true form of the human state and condition.
The dent act feeds into therevokution created by bane. The dent act took out the organized crume bht it didnt solve any of the underlying causes of the problem. And bane swooped in and took advantage of the vulnerabilities in the system.
This was a great video and helped me understand why I felt that this film had something missing as opposed to the other two in terms of its thematic structure
that doesn't mean much considering that the Batman had only just returned and that in his sacrifice he was no longer needed. It's like throwing away your back brace in exchange for healthy back, there's no sacrifice.
Look, through the series we're shown that Batman would risk his life for Gotham. He'd not only risk his own life, he'd compromise the fundamental right to privacy (when he hacks everyone's phones) and the lives of the people closes to him (when he chooses Harvey over Rachel). He's obsessed with saving Gotham but Alfred points out to him that it's this obsession with doing things as this solo vigilante that's actually leading to WORSE and more EXTREME problems as personified in the Joker. By killing Batman he actually sacrifices the portion of himself that pushed him to the point where he could perform as Batman. He basically killed his own self identity, the thing that he dedicated his life to. When he gives it up the first time he's broken, he's directionless and basically he's living without living. He's dead while alive, he's given it up but he's just regretting the sacrifice of Dent, as soon as it's plausible to be Batman again when it's shown that trying to preserve the Dent lie backfired he immediately retakes the cowl again. At the end of the trilogy he's found away to definitively kill/let go that part of himself that gave him the drive/obsession to be the Dark Knight while acknowledging that it's Gotham that needs to choose it's destiny without his interference. He sacrificed himself for Gotham.
Went to high school with the orphan actor and had this rose tinted perspective on this film mostly because of that. Thank you for including his one liner in this video 😂
@@michadmochowski1246 Definitely not. The best comics are beyond all 3 of Nolan's trilogy besides possibly The Dark Knight. Tho even then, I'd argue that The Long Halloween is better or at least somewhat comparable
The "kangaroo courts" that you referred to seems like an example of doubling, in this case, it's the Dent Act. That act gave Gotham more power to overstep judicial boundaries, and now the people in power (Bane's crew) was exercising the same abuse of power.
It doesn't really work because the bad guys would've set up kangaroo courts regardless of whether they were allowed to, plus we don't see the Dent Act enabling anyone to set up kangaroo courts.
The problem in a lot of cases is that people are reading it as an organically developed movement in the Dark Knight Rises. It's not. It's an artificially created movement that had very little real public support. They removed the organized armed resistance, then released fuel for their own army. They pretended to be a revolution of the people, but the people didn't want it near as anyone can tell. It demonstrates how an outside operator can pretend that the people are behind him in spite of no such thing existing, and how those claims will cause outsiders, the viewers, to turn blame from the actual instigator.
And as for why they would do this, it's the "League of Shadows." Shadows. They're influence isn't meant to be common knowledge. An outside force randomly destroying a city, no message. No effect in changing politics except during military action against the outside force. Having a city fall to internal corruption and revolution? That makes people think about the politics of the situation and what change may be necessary.
This movie is absolutely incredible I think I enjoy it more than the dark knight it's not the better film of the two but its metaphors and execution was near flawless in my opinion
In general, trilogies tend to have this issue where the final film tends to be the weakest of the bunch (i.e. Return of the Jedi, Toy Story III, Spider-man 3, Godfather III, Indiana Jones: The Last Crusade, etc). This isn't always the case, such as Return of the King for Lord of the Rings. However, as you can see a lot of these movies were undeniably good films, just lesser than their predecessors. If this (and others) was/were a standalone I think everyone would think it's incredible, but when you have to follow a masterpiece like The Dark Knight, it is pretty damn hard to beat that.
@Robin Banks saying this is worst than Origins is just stupid. The movie has problem (a lot of them) but it still has better acting, directing, dialogue and a great villain. Theres two good things at Origins: Wolverine and Sabertooth, and only one good scene. This movie is very far away from being that
I agree with some of the negative but so many other films get a pass for many of the same things. I consider it the weakest of the trilogy but better than 95% of other comic book movies.
Lover of everything Nolan's films weren't based on any comic book. cosmicbook.news/content/christopher-nolan-didnt-refer-batman-comic-books-source-material-irrelevant
What movies get a pass, a lot of movies get the shit they deserve, man of steel, TMNT, iron man 2, Thor’s first two movies, bvs even if it’s very overrated (overrated as in praised by people which makes no sense the movie is horrible) captain marvel, birds of prey. I’m not saying these movies are better than tdkr, I’m saying movies don’t get passes bc many get shit for different reasons, and it isn’t better than 95%, Spider-Man 1 & 2, X2, captain America winter soldier and civil war, iron man, kick-ass, infinity war, joker, Logan, guardians of the galaxy, Deadpool, X-men days of future past and first class, all top tier comic book movies, tdkr is more of second tier with movies like endgame, shazam, Thor ragnarock and ant man
not even 5 minutes released and people already disliked this. Come on, guys, you haven't even watched the vid. Even if you like the Dark Knight Rises, there's always something good in listening to well-thought out critiques of the movie.
This video is rather rambling. The two lies of the two films, the first of Batman taking the blame and the other of Batman staging his own death, aren't really so relevant in comparison. In The Dark Knight, Batman creates the lie because revealing the truth would plunge Gotham into despair, he believes. So it has rather large ramifications for the city as a whole. In The Dark Knight Rises, when Batman stages his own death, he effectively retires. That's it. His actions in saving the city and exposing Bane's false revolution are neither more or less noble by choosing to "kill" the Batman so he can leave the cowl behind. So we do not end up in the "exact same spot as the end of The Dark Knight", as Jared says in the video. I think to deal with the two lies in the same way is rather confused. Besides, the entire revolution business is in effect Bane's great lie, so the people against the elite dichotomy the video tries to look for (and complains about not being there enough) is not really at the heart of the film. The Dent Act did lots of good, but it was based on a lie. That is the issue. So the police remain the good guys all the way through. The issue is not that the Dent Act was invasive or unjust (again the video complains this is not fleshed out more although it is not central to the film), but rather that in exposing the lie of Dent, the Dent Act can no longer be upheld. In the end, Bane only recruits criminals and is terrorizing the public, so his revolution so-called is only for the criminal underworld and for the criminals to "rise up from the darkness" and take over the city. Bane is evil and wants to destroy Gotham and the souls of all the people who live there. He doesn't really care about overthrowing the elitist overlords. It is here, if anywhere, the drawing upon A Tale of Two Cities falls short. (And yes, I am aware my profile pic is a pic of Bane, so before anyone assumes it, I do not think TDKR is the best of the three films, I think Batman Begins is the best of the three).
bbkingzor you have Bane as your profile pic because he looks fucking great in this movie. look at his arms and his traps. Tom Hardy went Savage in the gym for this role. I'm sorry to just go off about bane when you typed up a golden thesis above me but everyone just needs to realize how amazing he looks.
Great analysis. I agree with you on every point (apart from Begins being the best of the three but that is up to personal taste). I found your analysis way more accurate than that of the video.
Exactly. Also in a Tale of Two Cities, the poor rebel and turn bloodthirsty and become bad men too, they're not supposed to be the good guys in this, they get out of control and kill innocents. They're angry and feel oppressed and are taking it out on the rich, so yes it's making them look mindless on purpose as you said because in real life a lot of mobs act like that. BTW this is was made in the backdrop of when the recession was happening so I'm sure there was some inspiration from that when making the film look like many were poor. Look at when rioters riot, for example recently those stories of cops shooting an African American, they get violent and hurt innocent people to make a point like ransacking a store. Or hurting some other cop who wasn't even there but because he has a badge they assume he's a bad guy as well, or so in TDKR, they're rich they must be a bad guy is their logic. Plus like bbkinzor said it's the criminals that are actually uprising and benefit from this, hence that shot of prisoners breaking out of prison. Bane is born from hell, poor, and with nothing, his revenge is taking it on the rich, but he's not picking sides necessary I think maybe he might feel everyone hasn't gone through what he has so another reason why it's a fake ploy to distract while the bomb counts down, anyway he's a bad guy. Also why say this is all an elaborate replication of Ras Al Ghul's plan like it's degrading, I can understand if you think it's repetitive but he was working with Talia who's father was the leader of the League of Shadows that believed in purging Gotham because it was corrupt, but Bane is more angry and its personal for him to see the city tear itself apart and not like Ra's ideology who believed he was purging the bad to establish a fresh chance at Good. Also I think a lot of people nowadays are too used to the philosophy you see all the time with power is wrong, rebel, people should be able to do whatever they want, people have the power, government can't do anything to people, but batman is a vigilante and if you even read the synopsis for what TDK is about it says Batman has to tread the line between heroism and vigilantism because he does whatever he finds necessary to get the bad guys and keep the peace so he will go beat the crap out of someone, spy on people, search without a warrant, etc but he doesn't abuse his power, especially with that machine at the end, he destroys it after finding the terrorist Joker because he never abuses his power. The Dent act gave more power to the police, but remember Gordon is commissioner still and i'm sure he was putting in effort to try to weed out corrupt cops because in TDK that's what bit him in the ass which Harvey reminded him that he didn't listen to him when he warned him of the corruption from the police. If you take a step back, just look at the villains for a moment: 1. You have Ra's who represents the cold emotionless swift hand of justice which is the flaw that he's willing to kill innocent people to make a point and be a check to crime and corruption. 2. You have the Scarecrow who loves the reversal of power that happens with his gas that makes his victims violently panic with terror. If you know his backstory he was bullied and picked on for having a lanky thin frame and his gas is his way of getting back at people for that. 3. Two Face who represents the emotional side of justice and takes it too personally and is willing to kill innocent people to get even for the death of Rachel and the corruption that's brooding in the city which Ra's warned in the first film how corrupted it was which Batman didn't solve yet and Gordon ignored to focus on trying to catch bad guys. Also remember in Begins Flass tells Gordon it makes the corrupt cops nervous when he doesn' t take a cut and Gordon's first response is "I'm no rat!" and in TDK his response to Harvey about corrupt cops is "If I put away all the cops you investigated in IA I'd be working alone." 4. The Joker, well I'll skip him because his motivations are chaos. 5. Catwoman who is poor and steals to get even with the rich for having a better life and opportunities and also to get even against men who she believes may have predetermined advantages in life. 6. Bane I've already explained above. Look at these villains, Batman is different that he gains this power to get justice but he doesn't do it apathetically like Ras, and he doesn't do it emotionally or personally like Harvey. He the right amount, the perfect balance hence why Batman provides the peace to the world by serving as the dark knight. The philosophy in the trilogy is power isn't bad when it's in the right hands, hence why Batman still beats up the vigilante's who dress up like him to take the law into their own hands in TDK. Only Batman can do that. Only Batman is noble enough to be trusted with this power.
bbkingzor I lied and faked my own death. I'm such a nice guy. now I get my own statue, get my name into the history books as the baddest super hero ever, I get to start over probably loaded to live a rich and secluded life that involves bagging the shit out of Catwoman. Sounds like a terrible fucking sacrifice to me. So noble!!!
I always saw Bane’s social revolution not about actual social class conflict but as a way to prove that Gotham would consume itself when given the chance during the months before the bomb goes off. That way the league of shadows reasoning as to why Gotham needed to be purged to begin with was proven justified.
It didn't consume itself, though. Bane set up a totalitarian system and has monopoly on the means of violence (the bomb, the tanks, criminals on his side). He yapped yapped yapped about the "power of the people", but really, the power is centralised on his camp. Normal, every day sort of people, apparently just stayed at home during the whole five months. It could be a single scene of an average citizen looting a jewellery shop, or on the other side, groups of people meeting in secret to overthrow Bane's hold on the city. But no, we barely got a glimpse of the people of Gotham.
Bane revealing what happened to Dent and people going crazy over it was a callback to the interrogation scene with Joker and Joker's final words where he says that the city's spirit would break once they learned the truth about Harvey, and what he said came to pass.
The problem is that Bruce giving up his identity of Batman is not the "easy way out," like Jared argues. Giving up Batman means he truly puts away the cowl AND moves on, to use Alfred's words, which the movie has set up that Bruce has not been capable of doing up to this point. He does, in a sense, die -- the loss of an identity is often seen as a death both in art and in psychology -- and he does, in a sense, rise again, as a new man. (Arguably, this is the meaning behind the metaphor of Christ's ressurcection.) What Jared might not be seeing is that Nolan's message could be, in fact, conservative. Jared is waiting for the payoff to his beliefs that lies are NOT in fact good, but maybe the message is that lies are necessary for a life of dignity, as Plato argued in The Republic. DKR is far from perfect but I think Wisecrack is not looking enough into the meanings.
You can infer that Bane strongly hates harsh imprisonments because Bane grew up in prison. His crime was just being in the wrong place and time thus furthering his motivation to full fill Ras Al Ghuls destiny.
@@MoonwalkerWorshiperHe was a former member of the League of Shadows, outcast because he reminded one of the leaders of the League of that prison. But even after being outcast, he supported their ideals.
JoseorErik IMO, They can’t top this series for a few reasons but mainly, #1- It’s Relatable #2 Insane Casting,#3 Not Hoky- it’s serious and grounded in reality and finally#4, Most important, Limited CG And it doesn’t look like a fucking video game with aliens n such. But keeping it a story about a real human that’s grounded in reality is it’s selling point for me. One thing that did get me was the goddamn PG-13 rating. But let’s face it, that’s ALWAYS a fucking issue.Let’s stop kidding ourselves already ok? Kids under 17 will see this no matter what so wtf not capitalized on it? I read where Heath got so into it that more than once he needed reminding of the rating. I’ve always imagined what Tarantino woulda done with it. Enough outta me. Peace.✌🏻
There is a way of not over-analysing the film, and results in no plot holes. The work of Bane is a lie; he worked for Raas, who had fat issues with his vision of destroying Gotham. Bane wanted to finish his work, and the corruption of Falcone and City Gangsters still stood above the law. The Police are good because they are retaliating against the terrorist occupation. Batman simply saves the city once again.
But Batman dies at the end. #FilmTheory So according to me: In TDK, we were left with the words, "Sometimes, truth isn't good enough, sometimes people deserve more. Sometimes, people deserve to have their faith, rewarded." In a universe largely grounded in reality, and with 5 seconds to go before the bomb went off, he was still in the cockpit, I don't think it leaves much room for suspension of disbelief.. ALSO, when you watch the scene at the end, with Alfred sitting at the cafe, there's crucially a reverse shot immediately after Alfred sees Bruce and nods. You'll notice there's an extra, wearing something gray, that walks right across the screen, in both shots (Alfred nodding, and Bruce & Selina sitting at their table) to clearly indicate a perspective shift. That you're looking at Bruce through Alfred's eyes now. Alfred at this point is an old, weak and largely lonely man who has lost everything that ever meant something to him with Bruce disappearing post the war against Bane and the terrorists. It's not a stretch to think he'd turn a bit delusional, especially when you consider how profoundly he wanted that fantasy to be true some day. Bruce sacrificed his life, leaving behind all the tools and resources necessary for Robin to someday earn his cowl, a city with a reformed and firmly reunited, post-war, post-corruption PD, and he did that because his work there was done. He gave everything to Gotham, only to receive grief and loss throughout his life. It was a deep and heroic sacrifice. The ending is one instance when the audience's faith needed to be rewarded with something better than truth, perhaps an #alternativefact lol? But this was certainly left open for viewers to decide or decipher, since the clues were all there. The autopilot scene was left in there to suggest that Bruce made a choice. Despite having the option of escaping, Batman willingly chooses to leave, because "There's nothing out there for (him) anymore," something that he had chosen to believe for a long time. That's what made that moment with him in the cockpit, staring out into nothingness in total silence, all the more poignant.
anujbeatles I guess the end is open ended like Inception. I hate it people consider Rises a "failure" like Spider-Man 3 X3 Iron Man 3 & Godfather Part III. Hell this movie is better than Batman v Superman.
I've been waving the flag that this movie was really weak for years now. There's just so many leaps in logic that go incredibly beyond the pale. Why was no one ever able to escape a pit that a nine year old was able to? Why were there no guards around the pit to make sure that no one ever got out of it? How did Batman make it back to Gotham without any money or equipment? Why were none of those cops immediately gunned down when they tried to rush Bane's army? The movie really falls short of the philosophical platitudes that it's reaching for when they can't even get basic logical plot details right.
Well, ok...if the dark knight rises was the trilogy “going wrong”, it certainly went wrong in a far better way than say.....Star Wars, Game of Thrones or The Matrix. At the very least, it kept its artistic vision/credibility intact.
I can sort of get the first two (even if I might disagree), but the Matrix sequels didn't ruin the artistic vision/credibility. They were just more clumsy.
"What went wrong" was Heath Ledger's untimely passing. The final in the trilogy was always supposed to be a showdown between the Batman and the Joker, not a morality tale about the perils of crony capitalism.
"crony capitalism" yeah like there is some other "not crony" capitalism lol. You let your politics ruin your enjoyment of the film, who determined that it was supposed to be a showdown between joker and batman?
@@whoshotashleybabbitt4924 There is no actual way theoretically or practically you cant prevent capitalism from becoming corporatism by entirely legal means, pure legal competition inherently produce a very limited number of winners in the long run resulting in corporate corruption. Money is inherently a corruption inducer.
you cant compare the mcu to the dark knight trilogy. don't get me wrong, I love marvel but the formula is always the same. this is batman, christopher nolan's batman. and the best damn joker we'll ever get. and you're gonna compare that to loki or red skull. it's not comparable.
MacKenzie Carnathan The Dark Knight is really not a good movie(actually its pretty bad). Ledger did a great performence, but the joker was a pretty shit villain. He was way to random! He had no motivations and he did stuff just for the sake of doing stuff! And Two Face was completely wasted! The story is all over the place, the action is shit, large plot holes that take you out of the experience, reall boring dialog at times and has verry boring scenes! Batman s voice was just terrible! Completely overacted! Batman does not feel like Batman (he fucking kills)! Out of TDK triology I only enjoy Batman Begins! TDKR is absolute garbage! TDK is not even compareble to the worst MCU movies! Batman 1989 is a much supirior Batman movie!
MacKenzie Carnathan that’s an unfair statement in my opinion. Are the movies formulaic? Perhaps, but that doesn’t stop them from being well written movies with likable heroes. The joker and Loki comparison also doesn’t make sense, since they’re totally different characters. One is a crazy psychopath while the other one is morally grey person with childhood issues. They’re both excellently written but in different ways.
they're only comparable in that they are MCU villains because my point was that Heath Ledger is far above every Marvel villain, even thanos. As to the formula of Marvel movies, I love it. They figured out what people want and it works. But it's not Christopher Nolan-worthy. Someone saying the dark knight is the best "superhero" movie is almost doing it a discredit because it's just a good movie on its own without needing a hero everyone knows and loves. the dark knight trilogy gets consistently better than any marvel superhero's movies. Marvel > DC obviously, but all marvel movies < the dark knight.
Bane was essentially finishing his sentence. "If I pull that [the mask] off, will you die?" "It would be extremely painful..." "You're a big guy." "...for you."
11:47 No he didn't. He overcame his pain, and when he has overcome his pain, he used his fear of pain for one last mission to save his city from utter destruction, and when the city is saved there is no pain to fear, he overcame his pain in the pit. So now he can let go of Batman who is the embodiment of pain and fear.
@@Tommy_7178 That movie is so over rated. It is laden with plot holes, poor writing, incomplete writing, and , other than Ledger and Oldman, mediocre acting. Still, better than The Dark Knight Rises( almost anything is). Ledger's phenomenal performance has people believing it is a much better movie than it actually is.
White Power Stop worshipping this trilogy to the point where if someone doesn’t like it, you think they’re idiots, thats childish. My problems with TDKR are the fight scenes besides Batman against Bane were bad, theres plenty of moments where you can see Extras not knowing whats going on and just making up stuff after looking at Batman and Bane. While the cops rush Banes terorrists, banes terrorists drop their guns and rush them for no reason. Bane’s motivation was just to blow up gotham, unlike Joker’s psychological motivation. He also had a bad death (just because it’s realistic doesn’t mean its good) since he was praised as this strong and unstoppable man throughout the film and died so easily. Bruce Wayne told Blake he’s Batman out of nowhere. They tried to make Batman seem old and broken with his cane when he isn’t even really old, especially after TDK ended. Talia al ghul also had a bad death.
TDKR is the weakest out of the trilogy but I love this Movie so much idk why it's just so motivational and the music is perfect and the ending was amazing.
Anthony Espinoza it earned the most money of the trilogy and had an 87% on rotten tomatoes which is higher than batman begins. It was in no way the weakest of the trilogy. It was an incredible movie and lived up to expectations. There was no chance it was going to be better than the dark knight because of how good it was. It was the best superhero movie of all time and it's been mentioned among the best movies of all time
Neil deGrasse Tyson it's been called that by MANY critics and it made over a billion. Not to mention heath ledger won a best supporting actor for the best portrayal of the joker ever. What other movie compares to it? Idiot
mikevickisabeast If making money is all that matters when judging a film, Avatar and Titanic are the best movies ever made and it's not even close. They're all overrated movies. They're decent comic book movies, but they're not great pieces of cinema.
I love Nolan, he's my favorite director, and TDKR is an awesome film. That's exactly why it's analysed; that's what makes it an interesting topic. Imagine a video on what went wrong with Transformers, it would be dull (and about 10hrs long). If anything, I found myself appreciating this movie more after watching this video.
I get why theres a critique...TDK was a solid " A+" maybe A-.....but TDKR is most definitely a " B- " "B+" initiative .... meaning it was a great film just not a "masterpiece" like its predecessor
actually, very few things went wrong, and most of the time people get them wrong. Even The Dark Knight has flaws, but that doesn't ruin the movie, just as some flaws don't make TDKR the shitty movie everyone whines about.
Nothing went wrong. Y’all expected Dark Knight 2. Chris Nolan has said time and time again, each film they shifted genre, and Rises was “Historical Epic” as opposed to the “Crime Epic” of TDK. Rises is a brilliant film, if you’re willing to look at it as a stand alone film and NOT a sequel to TDK, which it was never meant to be!
Beatness BvS is worse because Batman kills. He has a moral code normally, and in fact, it's one of his most important characteristics, and it's just gone in BvS, which actually means that BvS is factually worse because it dettered the development and original qualities of such an interesting character like Batman.
daniel henderson the only thing better about Batman V Superman is that Batman actually kicks ass and looks natural doing it. In the Dark night trilogy he is so stiff fighting and moving he looks like a plank.
Thank you! Seriously how can anyone claim that there is no character resolution? Batman dies a hero in order for Bruce to get a fresh start with Selena hence moving on in life which was possible due to him knowing the truth that Alfred had previously revealed. In the final scene we also get to see a Bruce who has forgiven Alfred showing an approval sign to Alfred by smiling. Also Bruce had moved on with his life precisely as Alfred had dreamt it.
racewiththefalcons1 What the fuck? Well maybe if you're not white get off your phone and the internet because both of those things were made by white people. Stop appropriating MY culture.
that was the real problem. the movie required serious reconfiguring because I don't think anyone could have done the job that Heath Ledger did as the Joker. I seriously wonder what the last movie could have been if Heath Ledger had not died. It's certainly not a bad movie but could've been better, and that is made even more obvious because it followed TDK.
A very good breakdown of the themes in Dark knight rises. I liked Tom Hardy's fiery performance, but it would've been MUCH better had they made Gotham's society in the wake of the dent act more corrupt and wrongheaded. That way Bane's revolution and motives would've been more relatable, and perhaps a certain other character's as well, though that would require a little more fixing. Then that corrupt society could reinforce Gordon's "structures becoming shackles" frustration, and then Batman could play on that as a good "individual" free of society's shackles. And Revolution's double meaning, Batman could symbolize good individuals rising above and "breaking the cycle", earning his redemption in Gotham's eyes. And such a conclusion would be an appropriate contrast to the Dark Knight, where Batman found his good intentions lost in the "structures" of society's laws and what the public is willing to accept, having to settle for a lie with the false idolization of Dent, the Dent act, the blackening of his name, and resigning to just letting society go through the cycles again for whatever momentary peace he could manage, until it all went wrong again.
....Bane's motivation/revolution isn't supposed to be "relatable". He even states several times he's only using this revolution to distract from the bomb. That's literally his motivation. The revolution is a background, and not meant to be this deep and meaningful. Sorry but you really misread it, and this comment kinda proved Bane's entire point. Everyone is sheep who'll listen to the loudest clown as long as you sell them "hope" or "relatability" without thinking of the other circumstances.
i thought it was a very worthy finale to end a great trilogy. especially since they had to re-write around the death of ledger. imagine how much better it could have been if the joker was in it.
You should've considered ras al gul's daughter's role in the movie and the fact that bane and her didn't care about anything other than avenging ras and completing his mission. The detective also felt a way about crediting batman with all the bad Dent did. Maybe he valued truth and legacy. Did the citizens of gotham riot because of the lie or the chaos bane unleashed (the bomb threat and wall street heist)?
I think Bruce lied about his death because he knew that the Batman was bigger than him. So by killing the Batman and living his life apart, he's was able to finally live like a normal person and, at the same time, create the everlasting symbol he wanted from the beginning.
There is a lot of problems with this Wisecrack Edition but I will narrow it down to three. v 1. Assuming that ending of TDKR was save by a "noble lie" like the previous film. Except it wasn't, Batman did sacrifice himself to save Gotham, the fact that he miraculously survived doesn't mean that he "lied". Sure, he may have lied about the autopilot but that doesn't equate to the lie about Harvey Dent/Two-Face in TDK. As a working autopilot is the only plausible way Bruce could have survived a nuclear blast, but even then how he manage to survive is nothing short of a miracle, thus making his "resurrection" genuine. 2. The theme of pain, is not about Bruce enduring pain for the rest of life, it's about him finding a way out of pain. As Alfred, said to Bruce he wanted more for him then just life of pain and misery. Bruce believes that without Batman his life has no meaning, that his life is defined by pain, thus losing his fear of death and his will to live. Instead of the Batman symbolizing hope as Bruce intended, it began to symbolize pain and despair. And by Bruce letting go of Batman, he let's go of pain and as result the Bat symbol is recontextualize into a symbol of hope and heroism for Gotham. 3. The revolution against the rich is a result of systemic injustice and not necessarily because the rich directly did anything bad to the poor. Because it's the rich who benefits from the police state, it makes sense why the poor and oppressed would be resentful towards the privileged even if technically the privilege haven't done anything other than be privileged. You can argue that we weren't shown the rich oppression against the poor but we didn't have to be shown. As the film gives us of good enough understanding of the "Dent act" for the audience grasp the social inequalities that could arise from it.
1) The movie states a few times the Dent act was overreaching. They say it's even been unfair to certain people who have been locked up. And the Mayor's office is depicted, albeit only in one scene, as having used this power to have made re-election and being in office easy for himself. Also, it completely emptied Arkham, which while beneficial in that no one can avoid prison anymore by acting insane, closes it up for those who actually are mentally ill. 2) Bataman DID sacrifice himself. You're clearly ignoring the dichotomy that both the comics and the movies make between who Bruce Wayne is and who Batman is. The problem with Bruce is that he doesn't want to sacrifice the Batman part of himself. The entire first 40 minutes of the movie is spent focused on how much he can't let go of it. In the end, Bruce is sacrificing a persona, a part of himself, an identity he has to give up so that whatever is left of the boy that watched his parents die can move on. If anything, it serves as a double meaning, for both the sacrifice to save Gotham and the sacrifice Bruce has to make for himself. 3) Have you paid attention to real life? People will get all up in arms and chaotic over the smallest thing. They will start rioting at colleges simply because they don't like the political affiliation of a person speaking there. Bane's scenario where he reveals Gotham's corruption before encouraging people to eat the rich isn't that much of an unlikely scenario. Sometimes all it takes is one crazy willing to go into the streets and cause chaos for those who wanted to, but were too timid at first to go out and follow.
2 No, Batman didn't sacrifice himself. That was entirely a ruse. He could've easily just quit being Batman, and not pretended that Bruce Wayne was also dead. The animated Dark Knight Rises movie does a better job with Batman Dying/Retiring, because it's not convoluted and stupid as fuck. No one was hunting down Brucy, and he had already "sacrificed" Batman for much better reasons at the introduction of the film! 1 The old adage of "show don't tell" is crucial here. We can say that puppies would eat you alive if they were desperate enough to; But if you just see an adorable happy puppy in front of you, then my words are likely to go in one ear and out the other. The words of how the "Dent Act did bad shit" aren't even well done enough to create a cognitive dissonance for the viewer. Which means that they're nowhere near as influential on the viewer as the "good guys are always good" cliche that the movie abuses in favor of a propagandic narrative. 3 I'm pretty damn certain that economic disparity, state abuses of power, and creeping fascism within deep state structures like the police and military industrial complex are all *WAY* fucking worse then some college kids protesting people who say shit they don't like!
3 They are intimately related though? Political correctness comes from state institutions, not "the people." Pretty sure the erosion of our rights is advocated by those same college kids.
@SoCalAries - I don't think we completely disagree. The erosion of our rights is advocated by those college kids, but from a different angle. Think of it as the Bush-era surveillance vs. the political correctness of college kids. The mayor of Gotham advocated the Dent Act, a symbol of the Patriot Act. The college SJWs want erosion of freedom of speech. And unfortunately, both sides end up doing what the other is doing anyway on a long enough timetable. They're both eroding our rights.
As always, you provide a compelling argument, but in this case, I am not persuaded by it. I understand the Dark Knight Rises is thematically inconsistent, but I would argue that's why it is so good (as a standalone film, viewed apart from the tone established i the previous film). Obviously, this is a TH-cam comment so I can't flesh my ideas out completely, but the main theme of the film is inciting chaos to destroy a city from the inside. Scarecrow and Joker's fear didn't work (both the existential and physical), so Bane does something more akin to reality: proves that humans are messy, and exposes them for it, in a world which hates messiness. What I mean by this, is that inciting chaos within people makes them dangerous and unpredictable, and as a result thematically inconsistent. I found this film the most honest in the series, and the most cynical, as it (through Bane) demonstrates that most people are not as moral or reasonable as they thought, and that these things can be exploited. It takes moral and reasonable individuals to change the course of Bane's revolution: Batman, Gordon, Cat Woman (who Bruce persuades to take the morally just action), and Joseph Gordon Levitt's character who I do not remember the name of.
Your point sounds interesting, but that were not shown much during the film, maybe a scene with the normal citizens discussing the riot will strengthen your point.
This would make a lot more sense if the previous movie didn't show criminals and everyday people refusing to murder each other to prove the Joker right.
I think Bane was spreading a false lie by telling the truth about the lie on the Dent act even if the Dent act was for good Bane wanted to spread chaos and havoc for his mission. Bane made it sound justified in that sense even though he was just trying to destroy Gotham the people believed him and that is what he wanted I think at least.
I felt Dark Knight Rises didn't know what it was doing. For example you expect me to believe the cops were buried underground for 5 months and are just fine after all ready to fight Bane?
yeah Bane had zero problem killing whoever, but he leaves the police buried for no reason. Not to mention, how did they survive for five months (I think it was five?)....this movie had too many plot conveniences, such as Robin Cop, just happening upon Gordon, or Bruce Wayne healing from a crippling back injury to break out of an "inescapable" prison (which didn't seem all that inescapable to me)....but it's just a movie I guess.
@@imperfect_dan7519 I dunno they were buried underground. Flood em? But that was just a little nitpick. I really love this movie, I've been thinking about it today, because I just watched it last night.
Like other DC movies, if they had worked on the script longer, they would have made better films. Like the video shows, they had some great ideas and themes to work with, that didn't quite make it into the final cut.
I think you're wrong about Sydney Carton. Interestingly enough, if you understand that better, you might gain insight into how batman does actually sacrifice himself at the end of the movie. As you say, Sydney Carton looked like Charles Darnay. Enough to swap places with him at the end of the book. Think about it... Who looks like Bruce? Who sacrifices himself? .... Batman, Batman looks like Bruce. At the end of the movie Batman metaphorically sacrifices himself to save Bruce Wayne. When I got to the end, it was clear to me that Bruce had let go of his past, and with that, had let go of the need to be the Batman to cope with it. He had discovered that his life, Bruce Wayne's life, was worth living. That batman, Bruce's batman, is gone (or dead) at that point in the movie. Also, you were presented with the idea that the toxic lie lead to so much corruption that revealing it was more beneficial. The toxic lie was corrupting Bruce's spirit, not the city. In the beginning he is a shell of his former self. Is that not corruption in a sense? So much of this is symbolic, yet you look for physical answers. I don't mean this as an insult, but if you tried looking at the movie from a different perspective, perhaps you'd enjoy it more. I also think you're too stuck in the Dark Knight. Let the Dark Knight Rises be its own movie. It has a lot of themes exploring Bruce's internal struggle and I think that's where you're making your mistake. The Dark Knight felt like a man vs man conflict (Batman vs Joker as they fight over the heart of the city). The Dark Knight Rises felt far more like a man vs self conflict, but you seem to keep viewing it as man vs man. My reasoning for saying its man vs self is that the movie focuses itself on Bruce's internal struggle. Many of the major plot devices and characters in the film revolve around him. The Weapons used against Batman are his own. How is the city thrown into chaos? Bane uses Batman's tools against him, namely the Dent act. How does Bane arm his men? With Batman's weapons (Your precious armoury, graciously accepted). What creates the bomb? Batman's property. How does Bane beat up Batman? With the same training batman had (training from the League of Shadows). Who is Bane? The Batman that never escaped the Pit. Speaking of the Pit, how can you look at the scene where Bruce climbs out of the Pit as anything but an internal struggle? The key to him overcoming it is by symbolically releasing himself from his past (the rope). I beg you, please rewatch the movie and consider it from that perspective. Maybe you'll enjoy it more. EDIT: grammar
Can you do a "what went wrong" on my life next?
Nils Martin Bad day?
Xdd
Snapdragon Fisticuffs yeah:/
Nils Martin My guess; fast women & cheap booze...
or cheap women and fast booze.
Isn't there a limit on youtube video length? :P
The Dark Knight Rises is like winning a silver medal, only disappointing if you're used to winning gold
This is the best analogy about the film that I've heard!
You finally summed up how I feel about this movie. I couldn't quite put my finger on why I like to rewatch this movie so often, yet it is not as satisfying at the Dark Knight. Also explains why I fear rewatching the Dark Knight too often (seeing the imperfections of the gold), yet don't have the same reserve to rewatching The Dark Knight Rises
Batman Begins - Bronze
The Dark Knight Rises- Silver
The Dark Knight-Gold
Christopher Nolan-God
It's more like competing in a triathlon in which you swim like aquaman, bike like Lance Armstrong, and then get hit by a bus when running the marathon. It sucks.
@@MrMathsimon nah begins gold
Dark knight gold
Rises silver
Can we be real ? Nothing they did was going to beat the dark knight
I think Nolan and Ledger would've topped themselves. They're both legends, and they were only getting started with each other. It was a symbiotic relationship with so much potential.
It's not all about The Joker, and no going by certain Batman comics I know there are several stories that could've made better movies than The Dark Knight; it's all about execution.
Benjamin Francis that’s the problem with making a masterpiece. The sequel will always be compared to it no matter what.
I actually like DKR. The Dark Knight was better, yes, but I respect Nolan’s ambition and I like that he didn’t try to create a villain to out-Joker the Joker. Nolan just stuck to his guns and made a stand alone film, although with parallels to the first two. I liked it.
Id argue that this one has aged better than the other 2.
Rewatched the Trilogy this past weekend and if you watch the films back to back, you appreciate Rises more, infact after seeing all 3 movies 7 years after it concluded, i can't help but feel like this is a damn near perfect trilogy of films. The only thing keeping it from being "perfect" is because The Joker isn't seen or wasn't even mentioned in Rises which cannot be helped due to the death of Heath Ledger. With all that in mind, The Dark Knight Rises is still an amazing film. And what Chris Nolan and co. accomplished in the end is quite a feat. They really dont make super hero films like this anymore.
Nolan Gave A Tribute To The Joker In The End. The Arrangement of the Seats When Batman's Statue Was Unveiled
It has it strong points and a great movie in TDK. But perfect? Light years away from it. Specially rises. It has more nonsense and holes that you can overlook. I still love the trilogy though
Quite the opposite when you watch all 3 in sequence than it highlights how bloated and preposterous DKR is
Dude, I love the trilogy but these are hardly even superhero films. TDKR is not a great film either it’s very flawed.
@@alejandrovillalba3143 nostronzo
Batman did die for Gotham, Bruce is out fuckin tho
My B Edits
Respect your elders
nice
That was my first thought when I heard it. Batman did die, because he was always a symbol to begin with. Bruce killed Batman. It wasn't really a lie in that sense, and it's ambiguous what JGL will do with it.
And it's a real sacrifice, because Bruce has to stay away from a pivotal part of his life forever.
🔥😭
Nothing, it was great and an epic ending to an amazing franchise.
Yes, but it had to bear with the legacy of The Dark Knight. It fell short on that, not that it was a bad film but because its story and plot, though amazing if you read them, were not executed that masterfully.
If you ask me ''does it worth our time then?'' ill fucking say '' YES! ''. Its just that sence of pity of the grandieur that could have been; an Epic movie held as pinacle of art like The Return of the King.
It was crap. Definitely proof that Nolan fanboys will jerk off to anything that has his name on it.
^
Xavier Vega Why wouldn't they? They have no reason if they loved his work for this long.
stryder HD
It was average. It got increasingly stupid like the stupid battle at the end, Catwoman's cringy lines and Bane had the most anticlimactic death of all time
Average film in an average trilogy
BB-7/10
TDK-8.9/10
TDKR-7.8/10
I actually love Rises. Tom Hardy knocked it outta the park. As did Anne Hathaway
I agree, people poo on Anne Hathaway. I like her as an actress, don't know her personally. She was amazing in the wonderful film Colossal, which I highly recommend.
How many times have great actors been let down by poor writing? While the writing here isn't bad it is at least sub par.
I love it too
, brother... When u look at this film as a product of reference to literary masterpieces like a tale of two cities or any other underlying theme that nolan has built upon, it might seem like a great work of art...
Now looking at it from a narrative standpoint, its 2 hours of total bullshitting... Myself being a hard core nolan fanboy, its still hard for me to digest this film despite its lunatic plot holes, vague character motivations, pathetic 3rd act villain reveal, below average action choreography, and totally ruining batman as a character...
In dark knight we witnessed a batman who beat all odds and overcame his emotional hardships to truly stand up and become a noble person as a whole and you could genuinely relate to him as a character but this film honestly dumps all that character development into a paper shredder...
@@SupersonicSpinach fair points 👍
I understand the people who say that "Batman cannot sacrifice himself if Bruce Wayne is alive because they're the same person" but I believe those people miss the point or simply they don't want to see it.
The point is that Bruce finally managed to live without Batman, without his fear, without his traumas, without his pain and anger... he finally "Rises from the darkness" and he did it by escaping the pit (which is my favourite scene in the trilogy) in that scene not only Batman rises to fight for Gotham against Bane and save the city, but more importantly BRUCE escapes from his pain finding the will to finally live his life and in a way he frees himself from Batman who was consuming him. Until that moment Bruce couldn't live without Batman because he needed him.
Throughout all the movie there's this dualism and theme of "You need to find another way, you're not Batman anymore" or "you don't own these people anymore...you've given them everything" but he didn't give everything, not yet... Bruce knew that a legend is more powerful in death. After Escaping the pit Batman has to do the definitive sacrifice...he dies to give people hope and to give them an ideal. Doing this Batman finally completes his path and Bruce Wayne can start his own.
So I believe this "Batman's sacrifice" needs to be seen more metaphorically because Bruce really lets die a part of him that has always been there since he fell in the pit when he was young. You couldn't still accept this and you may prefer an end where Bruce literally dies, but you can't say "Batman's sacrifice is a lie", it's not that superficial. I personally think the dualism of Batman/Bruce Wayne is very fascinating and I love the way Nolan ended this amazing trilogy, to me this is the end this character truly deserves. It's a story of a man who has to find the will to live again after a life spent fighting for justice and for people torturing himself physically and mentally with all his resources. This end symbolizes that out of tragedy and darkness comes greatness.
It's up to us.
Sorry if I made any mistakes, english is not my first language
Well Said, great analysis man👌
Francesco Mattia De Luca this is actually genius
Which is why nothing "went wrong." TDKR is an amazing movie. Is it as good as Dark Knight? No, but that should be expected
@@DrDolan2000 Exactly. I think we all agree The Dark Knight is the best out of the three movies objectively (and one of the greatest of all), but for me when it comes to choose between one of them I don't know what to say really. I simply love the trilogy in its entirety, the way Nolan and all the staff crafted it, the amazing music, the evolution of it.
The theme developed through each one of the three : fear, fall, rise. These movies are so important to me, so inspiring, this character has helped and still help me during my darkest times. I remember myself as a child watching Batman Begins in DVD and I remember how fascinated I was with this character that I could not fully understand yet. The third one is so epic to me, so inspiring, so hopeful, so effective, it focuses on the relationship between Bruce and Batman, it explores what the legacy of Batman could be, which are themes that I love. Unlike other Batman stories, this movie really explores the toxic effects that Batman has on Bruce in long terms, it taught me that maybe we can rise from our strongest fears and traumas, our darkest sides, from our deepest failures. And this creates a beautiful contrast in Batman, who of course is a symbol of hope and justice, something absolutely positive and necessary, a symbol of the best that we can be, but it's so toxic to the man behind it, it's so toxic to the man behind the physical personification of it (at least in long terms), so Bruce could only rise from it or die for it. The climbing scene is one of my favorite scenes of all time, the powerful Hans Zimmer's music, the symbolism, the meaning, it really gets me. For these reasons It pains me when people complain so much about it. Everyone can have a personal opinion and I'm not saying you're wrong if you don't like it, but I believe that despite its flaws, it's still so great. I love stories and I love movies, and the Dark Knight trilogy has made me love Batman so much, it has made me (and all of us) explore the meaning and the greatness of the idea of Batman, a character that I will always remember.
Anyway thank you for your attention guys, I really appreciate :)
Very well put. That was my reading of the movie from maybe the second or third viewing. Well, put.
Your English is also quite clear and concise.
batman DID sacrificed himself, it was bruce wayne who survived. The end of the movie suggests that wayne wont encarnate the bat no more.
This bih said did sacrificed 😂😂
Batman sacrificed himself, for the greater good. His sacrifice was not based on a lie.
That is why this "lie" of self-sacrifice has more chances of working than the flawed "Dent" lie.
I do agree with the other points, I wish they had gone deeper into the evil's of the Dent's act under a corrupt government and shown some actual cases of Rich stealing from the Poor..
Though-provoking analysis! Enjoyed the video immensely!
@David Elliott stfu dummy
@@DB-sd3cw why are u making fun of him? It might not be his 1rst language asshole
@@AlexValorant yep these 12 year little kids also annoys me for my really bad english ..
The conversation between Alfred and Bruce showed why Bruce faked his death "when Rome's protector didn't leave they called him Caesar." Bruce didn't want to end up the City's judge, jury, and excutioner.
Honestly I think they could have done something better than just ripping off some crappy old book. The Riddler would have been a way better choice as a kind of Zodiac-like serial killer manipulating Batman personally, leaving clues at crime scenes. They still could have included Catwoman, maybe even Poison Ivy as well as a serial killer who uses botanical poisons, Deadshot too as a hitman using stolen Waynetech to increase his accuracy (seeing as how there are no superpowers in the Nolan-Verse) and hell maybe they could all be connected somehow to the Court of Owls...idk...The Dark Knight Rises was the weakest part of the trilogy.
@@John-X embarrassing mess of words tbh
@@John-X The Riddler part of your comment seems to be what Matt Reeves is doing with The Riddler in The Batman. But for the rest of your post, it kinda seems messy.
I didn't know there is something wrong with the film 🤔
its anti-revolutionary, pro-neoliberal propaganda
Bane getting killed in the movie like that was disappointing
@@saimsadit5046 I agree
I know bro I’ve been calling it my favorite superhero movie since it came out. I fucking loved this movie.
Virtu0city me neither
I think the dark knight rises did an extremely good job at following up to the best comic book movie of all time. It was a very emotional, powerful and satisfying end to the trilogy
So it was the bane of the trilogy?
For you.
ba-dum tss.
HA!
*(slaps knee)*
KNEE SLAPPER!
Good job man.
Koyote, for you.
Well played sir *insert claps*
TDKR doesn't end with a lie. Batman did die. Bruce Wayne chose to live.
Also it's funny the way you say 'Blackgate is an obvious analogy to Bastille' and a few sentences later you conclude there are no similarities between the two except excessive amount of prisoners.
Favourite Douchebag I'd argue that beyond the symbolism, it was a lie as Batman obviously wasn't actually dead and it was just a cover up from Bruce not wanting to be Batman anymore. Also, he said that the prisons were intended to be similar but lacked anything beyond the excessive level of prisoners to demonstrate how poor the writing of TDK was.
I believe they mean that Blackgate was supposed to be the Bastille to continue the "A Tale of Two Cities" connections, but beyond the prisoners and the storming, has too little in common to serve the same purpose: showing the brutality of the authority and their excessive overreaching powers.
Huzzamossi : Batman is Bruce's mission. Even though we usually think one equals another, Alfred is emphasising within the movie that Batman is just a part of Bruce and not vice versa. Bruce decided his mission is complete, thus Batman actually did die. It's not just symbolism unless you consider Batman to be symbolic in his entirety.
I don't know why he concluded that the prisons were intended to be similar to that degree, to me the idea that a more aggressive government control would produce fuller prisons and bigger inequality is pretty elementary, and the idea that it is SUPPOSED to be a depiction of medieval France is definitely not something I would judge the movie by.
Favourite Douchebag Except that through the entire franchise we're led to believe that like in the comics Bruce is Batman's mask and not vice versa, Batman cannot die without Bruce dying so it's just strange to end it that way. Also Bruce also "died" hence his funeral so that's a lie... then there's the fact that the bat signal was fixed and that Blake was basically given the batcave implying that Batman isn't dead so it's just kind of a mess
People missed the "What went right?" part.
Dude don’t you know you can’t criticize the holy Nolan trilogy they coming for you
That's not true at all. But I don't get why people don't like Dark Knight Rises. I can understand if you don't like Batman Begins. I can understand if you don't like Dark Knight. But Rises? Seriously how can anyone dislike this movie. I was at the edge of my seat and some of the scenes I can't even forget. I saw Dark Knight four times and forgot most of the scenes. I saw Rises twice and remember most of it and people don't understand depth. It was artistic and way better than DCEu crap
Achyuth Thouta I like rises . Imo it’s the weakest of the three. But that’s just my opinion , my favorite of the series is begins and I know I’m in the minority on that one , but it can’t be denied Nolan has got some of the most annoying fanboys around , the guy is going to get heavily criticized simply for stating his opinion
@Julian Harden Maybe few fans are emotionally not stable but Nolan definitely makes quality movies
Achyuth Thouta the truth of the matter is that the movie could’ve been made way better nowadays and in all honesty with a better Batman and bane and cat women in the trilogy. Ben Affleck’s batman is a much more realistic Batman that could’ve been easily used to set a theme and philosophy set by Nolan
That trilogy was an insult.
Batman didn't sacrifice himself at the end of The Dark Knight Rises. This wasn't his intention. The "death" of Batman wasn't meant to be a selfless act of self-sacrifice, it was a "selfish" act of unburdening himself of a weight too heavy to bear for him.
Bruce Wayne actually came full circle at that point. He originally created Batman as a symbol that could've been anyone, yet in the course of the movies, he was so consumed by this symbol that he lost track of his own idinity in it. By the beginning of the Dark Knight Rises he felt like he only had two choices: To be Batman, or to be nothing. He lost sight over the fact that Batman was a symbol, he obsessively internalized the identity. The very same identity that he felt lead to the death of his loved ones. Being Bruce Wayne killed his parents. Being Batman killed Rachael. But when Gotham started going bad again, he felt like he had to Batman again to save it. Not realizing, as Alfred put it, that he had to help the Gotham police force as Bruce Wayne -- his actual identity --- to help himself too.
Rachel said that Bruce Wayne was the mask and that Batman was his true self. But nah. Bruce was his true self around Rachel, Lucius and Alfred. When he encapsulated both sides of his psyche. A man, but a righteous one. And it was at the end of the the Dark Knight that he regained sight over what it means to be himself. And that Batman was a symbol that exists outside himself, that could be adopted by anyone. In this case, John Blake.
john blake or ....THE ROBIN
blackholecat Dude...this is WAY to long a defense
I wish the movies made this overarching theme more clear rather than trying to cram in random references to real life events and other peoples' works. Batman's story should be about the man under the mask, not the shitty ass city he lives in.
blackholecat I couldn't have said it better. Good analysis
you missed the point idiot...
What went wrong?
heath ledger died
the end
backup41 How
He was suppose to be a big part in rises. they had the story all laid out for the third one before ledger died
Dark knight would have been much better movie if it simply ended with Joker's victory. Gotham was doing great in the beginning, crime was disappearing, everyone was doing great, than Joker came and f-ed it all up. That should have been the story. That would provide a nice contrast and a great set-up for the next movie.
Instead, "dark Knight" continued with two villains running around on the screen, people being all noble and not blowing each other up, Joker just arbitrarily loosing, and worst of all: "I am sacrificing myself for you" Bullsh.
Yeah, but they built up Harvey Dent and then Two-Face got only 10 minutes of actions.
Joker was the villain in the 3rd one too. They had to rewrite the script and kept it under wraps to keep pyblic confidence in the movie.
Not gonna lie, that random F-bomb was out of nowhere
Lol movie made him pretty mad I guess.
True😂
very true.
I agree with it. The movie was too long.
Batman Begins: 10/10
The Dark Knight: 10/10
The Dark Knight Rises: 10/10
A masterpiece
Dark Knight: 11/10
The Dark knight 11/10
@Kritzberg YEP
The right answer
Nothing is wrong, its just not better then the best superhero movie of all time.
awesome comment guys
Careful marvel fanboys will come.
Yeah nothing compares to Batman Forever
@@Winteramen 😂😂😂 no batman and Robin is the best 😂😂😂
@@Tommy_7178 oh my god, i actually made a mistake. Batman and Robin is the one with Clooney. You're absolutely right, that one was pretty n-ice.
15:44 this actually reinforces Jokers’ philosophy
“When the chips are down these civilised people, they’ll eat each other”.
As he said, people’s values and morals are a bad joke, and dropped at the first sign of trouble. And he was absolutely right
The people are not fighting for a socialist revolution. It’s just chaos now and the citizens of Gotham have been reduced to primitive barbaric but ultimately true form of the human state and condition.
The dent act feeds into therevokution created by bane. The dent act took out the organized crume bht it didnt solve any of the underlying causes of the problem. And bane swooped in and took advantage of the vulnerabilities in the system.
I truly believe it was a great movie, I also believe that Nolan's Trilogy remains unbeatable as far as comic based movies goes.
This review actually made me like TDKR even more now.
right eh?
Agreed with Darwin Esp.
Are you related to that philosopher spinosa?
Dark Knight Rises is fantastic. IMO The trilogy is great, people just have unfair expectation for the other two as a result of The Dark Knight
You have exactly stated my point. Thanks Man!!!!
Way better than any other DCU
No. Nolan just gave a crappy ending to the build-up of his former films. Nolan's work is overrated.
@@frankgeez6584 ok anime guy
To me tdkr>tdk
I honestly thought TDKR was a great film to conclude the entire trilogy, not as impressive as The Dark Knight obviously, but very exceptional..
This was a great video and helped me understand why I felt that this film had something missing as opposed to the other two in terms of its thematic structure
Bruce Wayne sacrificed Batman for Gotham. Batman symbolically died.
Nah. He just let somebody else put on the costume for him while he goes off with the claim that Bruce Wayne is dead.
I don't see how my comment could make you think that was what I was saying.....
that doesn't mean much considering that the Batman had only just returned and that in his sacrifice he was no longer needed. It's like throwing away your back brace in exchange for healthy back, there's no sacrifice.
sanderflop good analogy
Look, through the series we're shown that Batman would risk his life for Gotham.
He'd not only risk his own life, he'd compromise the fundamental right to privacy (when he hacks everyone's phones) and the lives of the people closes to him (when he chooses Harvey over Rachel).
He's obsessed with saving Gotham but Alfred points out to him that it's this obsession with doing things as this solo vigilante that's actually leading to WORSE and more EXTREME problems as personified in the Joker.
By killing Batman he actually sacrifices the portion of himself that pushed him to the point where he could perform as Batman. He basically killed his own self identity, the thing that he dedicated his life to.
When he gives it up the first time he's broken, he's directionless and basically he's living without living. He's dead while alive, he's given it up but he's just regretting the sacrifice of Dent, as soon as it's plausible to be Batman again when it's shown that trying to preserve the Dent lie backfired he immediately retakes the cowl again.
At the end of the trilogy he's found away to definitively kill/let go that part of himself that gave him the drive/obsession to be the Dark Knight while acknowledging that it's Gotham that needs to choose it's destiny without his interference.
He sacrificed himself for Gotham.
Batman should have known that THIS IS LIBRARY.
.....hey!......Hey!.......HEY!!!!...........
THERE IS NO TALKING IN THE LIBRARY! SHHH!!!
RIBRARY
Joan Alba Yes.
You look nervous is it the scars wanna know how I got them
When you’re so mad at your parents that you gather all your family, relatives, and neighbours in front of your house and say
13:02
Went to high school with the orphan actor and had this rose tinted perspective on this film mostly because of that. Thank you for including his one liner in this video 😂
The dark Knight trilogy is a masterpiece in comic live action.
Hahahahahahahahahaha!
Good one.
True
It has far exceeded its comic source material
@@michadmochowski1246 Definitely not. The best comics are beyond all 3 of Nolan's trilogy besides possibly The Dark Knight. Tho even then, I'd argue that The Long Halloween is better or at least somewhat comparable
@@michadmochowski1246 spoken like someone who never read the comics lol
If there is not a single Bane meme in this video, I'm going to kill myself.
RIP
Masked Man.
When there is no Bane meme in this video, you have my permission to die.
You dead yet?
Only when Gotham is ashes will you have his permission
Bruce self isolating? Back in 2012? I think Bruce is onto something here. 😂😂😂
The "kangaroo courts" that you referred to seems like an example of doubling, in this case, it's the Dent Act. That act gave Gotham more power to overstep judicial boundaries, and now the people in power (Bane's crew) was exercising the same abuse of power.
It doesn't really work because the bad guys would've set up kangaroo courts regardless of whether they were allowed to, plus we don't see the Dent Act enabling anyone to set up kangaroo courts.
The problem in a lot of cases is that people are reading it as an organically developed movement in the Dark Knight Rises. It's not. It's an artificially created movement that had very little real public support. They removed the organized armed resistance, then released fuel for their own army. They pretended to be a revolution of the people, but the people didn't want it near as anyone can tell. It demonstrates how an outside operator can pretend that the people are behind him in spite of no such thing existing, and how those claims will cause outsiders, the viewers, to turn blame from the actual instigator.
And as for why they would do this, it's the "League of Shadows." Shadows. They're influence isn't meant to be common knowledge. An outside force randomly destroying a city, no message. No effect in changing politics except during military action against the outside force. Having a city fall to internal corruption and revolution? That makes people think about the politics of the situation and what change may be necessary.
cough ... cough America. VIVE ALLENDE!
i dont understand the last sentence. can u explain?
Brilliantly put
YOU'RE A BIG GUY
me me big boy
For who?
Fist of the World King
4U
BattleUp Saber for pooh.
Tell me about Bane. Why does he wear the mask?
Batman did sacrifice himself for Gotham, and Bruce Wayne lived on after.
This movie is absolutely incredible I think I enjoy it more than the dark knight it's not the better film of the two but its metaphors and execution was near flawless in my opinion
I just watched the movie yesterday and it's amazing
Roddy Rod 4U
No, it's not. I was so excited, loved the first 2... it just sucked.
Kornobi Starcatcher it didn’t suck, it just wasn’t as amazing as TDK. It’s like a 7.5 or a 8 . Sucks that people r always comparing it to TDK
In general, trilogies tend to have this issue where the final film tends to be the weakest of the bunch (i.e. Return of the Jedi, Toy Story III, Spider-man 3, Godfather III, Indiana Jones: The Last Crusade, etc). This isn't always the case, such as Return of the King for Lord of the Rings. However, as you can see a lot of these movies were undeniably good films, just lesser than their predecessors.
If this (and others) was/were a standalone I think everyone would think it's incredible, but when you have to follow a masterpiece like The Dark Knight, it is pretty damn hard to beat that.
It's laughbly bad. But it is ok to think it is good when you watched it so recently; it leaves an impression on you.
What do you mean "despite" your Dark Knight infatuation?
Peoples love and adoration for the second film was the biggest hindrance for this film
Mr Super-Kami Popo so true. It’s biggest flaw was that it was a sequel to the dark knight. I don’t understand what people wanted
@@BryanVGK23 If you actually bothered to watch the whole video you know that wasn't it's biggest flaw.
__________ I guess that’s why it’s called an “opinion”
You said it, man.
@@BryanVGK23 how is peoples enjoyment of a film a hindrance?
Nothing went wrong, it's a perfect ending to the best superhero trilogy ever
Except there are many flaws
@Robin Banks saying this is worst than Origins is just stupid. The movie has problem (a lot of them) but it still has better acting, directing, dialogue and a great villain. Theres two good things at Origins: Wolverine and Sabertooth, and only one good scene. This movie is very far away from being that
I agree with some of the negative but so many other films get a pass for many of the same things. I consider it the weakest of the trilogy but better than 95% of other comic book movies.
None of Nolan's movies were comic book movies. Nolan doesn't even like comics.
Lover of everything cosmicbook.news/content/christopher-nolan-didnt-refer-batman-comic-books-source-material-irrelevant
Lover of everything Nolan's films weren't based on any comic book. cosmicbook.news/content/christopher-nolan-didnt-refer-batman-comic-books-source-material-irrelevant
I agree
What movies get a pass, a lot of movies get the shit they deserve, man of steel, TMNT, iron man 2, Thor’s first two movies, bvs even if it’s very overrated (overrated as in praised by people which makes no sense the movie is horrible) captain marvel, birds of prey. I’m not saying these movies are better than tdkr, I’m saying movies don’t get passes bc many get shit for different reasons, and it isn’t better than 95%, Spider-Man 1 & 2, X2, captain America winter soldier and civil war, iron man, kick-ass, infinity war, joker, Logan, guardians of the galaxy, Deadpool, X-men days of future past and first class, all top tier comic book movies, tdkr is more of second tier with movies like endgame, shazam, Thor ragnarock and ant man
not even 5 minutes released and people already disliked this.
Come on, guys, you haven't even watched the vid. Even if you like the Dark Knight Rises, there's always something good in listening to well-thought out critiques of the movie.
+
Bump'n'Jump welcpme to youtube. people dislike videos, life goes on
Bump'n'Jump some people just want to watch the world burn
Get this hothead outta here.
It needed more female characters. maybe Nora Fries and Francince Langstrom.
This video is rather rambling. The two lies of the two films, the first of Batman taking the blame and the other of Batman staging his own death, aren't really so relevant in comparison. In The Dark Knight, Batman creates the lie because revealing the truth would plunge Gotham into despair, he believes. So it has rather large ramifications for the city as a whole. In The Dark Knight Rises, when Batman stages his own death, he effectively retires. That's it. His actions in saving the city and exposing Bane's false revolution are neither more or less noble by choosing to "kill" the Batman so he can leave the cowl behind. So we do not end up in the "exact same spot as the end of The Dark Knight", as Jared says in the video. I think to deal with the two lies in the same way is rather confused.
Besides, the entire revolution business is in effect Bane's great lie, so the people against the elite dichotomy the video tries to look for (and complains about not being there enough) is not really at the heart of the film. The Dent Act did lots of good, but it was based on a lie. That is the issue. So the police remain the good guys all the way through. The issue is not that the Dent Act was invasive or unjust (again the video complains this is not fleshed out more although it is not central to the film), but rather that in exposing the lie of Dent, the Dent Act can no longer be upheld. In the end, Bane only recruits criminals and is terrorizing the public, so his revolution so-called is only for the criminal underworld and for the criminals to "rise up from the darkness" and take over the city. Bane is evil and wants to destroy Gotham and the souls of all the people who live there. He doesn't really care about overthrowing the elitist overlords. It is here, if anywhere, the drawing upon A Tale of Two Cities falls short.
(And yes, I am aware my profile pic is a pic of Bane, so before anyone assumes it, I do not think TDKR is the best of the three films, I think Batman Begins is the best of the three).
bbkingzor you have Bane as your profile pic because he looks fucking great in this movie. look at his arms and his traps. Tom Hardy went Savage in the gym for this role.
I'm sorry to just go off about bane when you typed up a golden thesis above me but everyone just needs to realize how amazing he looks.
Great analysis.
I agree with you on every point (apart from Begins being the best of the three but that is up to personal taste).
I found your analysis way more accurate than that of the video.
Exactly. Also in a Tale of Two Cities, the poor rebel and turn bloodthirsty and become bad men too, they're not supposed to be the good guys in this, they get out of control and kill innocents. They're angry and feel oppressed and are taking it out on the rich, so yes it's making them look mindless on purpose as you said because in real life a lot of mobs act like that. BTW this is was made in the backdrop of when the recession was happening so I'm sure there was some inspiration from that when making the film look like many were poor.
Look at when rioters riot, for example recently those stories of cops shooting an African American, they get violent and hurt innocent people to make a point like ransacking a store. Or hurting some other cop who wasn't even there but because he has a badge they assume he's a bad guy as well, or so in TDKR, they're rich they must be a bad guy is their logic.
Plus like bbkinzor said it's the criminals that are actually uprising and benefit from this, hence that shot of prisoners breaking out of prison. Bane is born from hell, poor, and with nothing, his revenge is taking it on the rich, but he's not picking sides necessary I think maybe he might feel everyone hasn't gone through what he has so another reason why it's a fake ploy to distract while the bomb counts down, anyway he's a bad guy.
Also why say this is all an elaborate replication of Ras Al Ghul's plan like it's degrading, I can understand if you think it's repetitive but he was working with Talia who's father was the leader of the League of Shadows that believed in purging Gotham because it was corrupt, but Bane is more angry and its personal for him to see the city tear itself apart and not like Ra's ideology who believed he was purging the bad to establish a fresh chance at Good.
Also I think a lot of people nowadays are too used to the philosophy you see all the time with power is wrong, rebel, people should be able to do whatever they want, people have the power, government can't do anything to people, but batman is a vigilante and if you even read the synopsis for what TDK is about it says Batman has to tread the line between heroism and vigilantism because he does whatever he finds necessary to get the bad guys and keep the peace so he will go beat the crap out of someone, spy on people, search without a warrant, etc but he doesn't abuse his power, especially with that machine at the end, he destroys it after finding the terrorist Joker because he never abuses his power.
The Dent act gave more power to the police, but remember Gordon is commissioner still and i'm sure he was putting in effort to try to weed out corrupt cops because in TDK that's what bit him in the ass which Harvey reminded him that he didn't listen to him when he warned him of the corruption from the police.
If you take a step back, just look at the villains for a moment:
1. You have Ra's who represents the cold emotionless swift hand of justice which is the flaw that he's willing to kill innocent people to make a point and be a check to crime and corruption.
2. You have the Scarecrow who loves the reversal of power that happens with his gas that makes his victims violently panic with terror. If you know his backstory he was bullied and picked on for having a lanky thin frame and his gas is his way of getting back at people for that.
3. Two Face who represents the emotional side of justice and takes it too personally and is willing to kill innocent people to get even for the death of Rachel and the corruption that's brooding in the city which Ra's warned in the first film how corrupted it was which Batman didn't solve yet and Gordon ignored to focus on trying to catch bad guys. Also remember in Begins Flass tells Gordon it makes the corrupt cops nervous when he doesn' t take a cut and Gordon's first response is "I'm no rat!" and in TDK his response to Harvey about corrupt cops is "If I put away all the cops you investigated in IA I'd be working alone."
4. The Joker, well I'll skip him because his motivations are chaos.
5. Catwoman who is poor and steals to get even with the rich for having a better life and opportunities and also to get even against men who she believes may have predetermined advantages in life.
6. Bane I've already explained above.
Look at these villains, Batman is different that he gains this power to get justice but he doesn't do it apathetically like Ras, and he doesn't do it emotionally or personally like Harvey. He the right amount, the perfect balance hence why Batman provides the peace to the world by serving as the dark knight.
The philosophy in the trilogy is power isn't bad when it's in the right hands, hence why Batman still beats up the vigilante's who dress up like him to take the law into their own hands in TDK. Only Batman can do that. Only Batman is noble enough to be trusted with this power.
bbkingzor I lied and faked my own death. I'm such a nice guy. now I get my own statue, get my name into the history books as the baddest super hero ever, I get to start over probably loaded to live a rich and secluded life that involves bagging the shit out of Catwoman. Sounds like a terrible fucking sacrifice to me. So noble!!!
bbkingzor talk about rambling xD
I always saw Bane’s social revolution not about actual social class conflict but as a way to prove that Gotham would consume itself when given the chance during the months before the bomb goes off. That way the league of shadows reasoning as to why Gotham needed to be purged to begin with was proven justified.
It didn't consume itself, though. Bane set up a totalitarian system and has monopoly on the means of violence (the bomb, the tanks, criminals on his side). He yapped yapped yapped about the "power of the people", but really, the power is centralised on his camp. Normal, every day sort of people, apparently just stayed at home during the whole five months. It could be a single scene of an average citizen looting a jewellery shop, or on the other side, groups of people meeting in secret to overthrow Bane's hold on the city. But no, we barely got a glimpse of the people of Gotham.
Bane revealing what happened to Dent and people going crazy over it was a callback to the interrogation scene with Joker and Joker's final words where he says that the city's spirit would break once they learned the truth about Harvey, and what he said came to pass.
The problem is that Bruce giving up his identity of Batman is not the "easy way out," like Jared argues. Giving up Batman means he truly puts away the cowl AND moves on, to use Alfred's words, which the movie has set up that Bruce has not been capable of doing up to this point. He does, in a sense, die -- the loss of an identity is often seen as a death both in art and in psychology -- and he does, in a sense, rise again, as a new man. (Arguably, this is the meaning behind the metaphor of Christ's ressurcection.)
What Jared might not be seeing is that Nolan's message could be, in fact, conservative. Jared is waiting for the payoff to his beliefs that lies are NOT in fact good, but maybe the message is that lies are necessary for a life of dignity, as Plato argued in The Republic. DKR is far from perfect but I think Wisecrack is not looking enough into the meanings.
Hahaha someone read my mind, but far better worded.
But the Republic's philosophy sucked...
+Jonny Lupus i think he's talking about about part of the philosophy in the Republic, not overall.
+Jonny Lupus Oh, right, I forgot. Guess that settles it. :P
Maybe it's just a story about a guy dressed as a bat
"Maybe it's just a story about animals and a farm."
Dressed like a bat. I dig it.
orestisDisturbed Lol
orestisDisturbed animal farm
Animal Farm was explicitly allegorical. Batman isn't.
Nothing is wrong in this movie. This movie is a masterpeice. Perfect ending of a great trilogy.
You can infer that Bane strongly hates harsh imprisonments because Bane grew up in prison. His crime was just being in the wrong place and time thus furthering his motivation to full fill Ras Al Ghuls destiny.
I don´t get it. He was a Ra´s al Ghul wannabe?
@@MoonwalkerWorshiperHe was a former member of the League of Shadows, outcast because he reminded one of the leaders of the League of that prison. But even after being outcast, he supported their ideals.
The pigs were greedy capitalists? I think you may need to reread Animal Farm.
Exceptionally greedy hypocrites maybe?
the pigs were the communists, actually. The whole story is an allegory of the soviet revolution, and its outcome.
lol i was going to say this. the story was about socialism and government, not capitalism...
jo c they're literally communists. stallin. Russia.
George Orwell was deff also a social democrat and anti communism so of course that would be the propaganda he shows in the show
I liked it. Was a very fitting ending to the trilogy in my opinion
It sucked
cdg03 you only say that because you think it's not as good as TDK. That's pretty much the only reason why people say TDKR was a bad movie.
Agree with this: I think TDK is a bit over-rated and DKR very much under-rated. I didn't feel any obvious drop in quality.
Christian Köhn it’s good nothing went wrong
Y’all cant blame Nola if Ledger wouldn’t of passed away there would’ve been 2 masterpieces and a trilogy that no other superhero will top
JoseorErik IMO, They can’t top this series for a few reasons but mainly, #1- It’s Relatable #2 Insane Casting,#3 Not Hoky- it’s serious and grounded in reality and finally#4, Most important, Limited CG And it doesn’t look like a fucking video game with aliens n such. But keeping it a story about a real human that’s grounded in reality is it’s selling point for me. One thing that did get me was the goddamn PG-13 rating. But let’s face it, that’s ALWAYS a fucking issue.Let’s stop kidding ourselves already ok? Kids under 17 will see this no matter what so wtf not capitalized on it? I read where Heath got so into it that more than once he needed reminding of the rating. I’ve always imagined what Tarantino woulda done with it. Enough outta me. Peace.✌🏻
Precisely.
Bruh I really wish he didn’t passed away 😪
Would have been so nice to see the interaction of the Joker and Bane in this movie...
Jack Nicholson told him not to do it as well. Playing The Joker as a method actor isnt going to end well.
There is a way of not over-analysing the film, and results in no plot holes.
The work of Bane is a lie; he worked for Raas, who had fat issues with his vision of destroying Gotham. Bane wanted to finish his work, and the corruption of Falcone and City Gangsters still stood above the law. The Police are good because they are retaliating against the terrorist occupation. Batman simply saves the city once again.
But Batman dies at the end. #FilmTheory
So according to me:
In TDK, we were left with the words, "Sometimes, truth isn't good enough, sometimes people deserve more. Sometimes, people deserve to have their faith, rewarded."
In a universe largely grounded in reality, and with 5 seconds to go before the bomb went off, he was still in the cockpit, I don't think it leaves much room for suspension of disbelief..
ALSO, when you watch the scene at the end, with Alfred sitting at the cafe, there's crucially a reverse shot immediately after Alfred sees Bruce and nods. You'll notice there's an extra, wearing something gray, that walks right across the screen, in both shots (Alfred nodding, and Bruce & Selina sitting at their table) to clearly indicate a perspective shift. That you're looking at Bruce through Alfred's eyes now.
Alfred at this point is an old, weak and largely lonely man who has lost everything that ever meant something to him with Bruce disappearing post the war against Bane and the terrorists. It's not a stretch to think he'd turn a bit delusional, especially when you consider how profoundly he wanted that fantasy to be true some day.
Bruce sacrificed his life, leaving behind all the tools and resources necessary for Robin to someday earn his cowl, a city with a reformed and firmly reunited, post-war, post-corruption PD, and he did that because his work there was done. He gave everything to Gotham, only to receive grief and loss throughout his life. It was a deep and heroic sacrifice.
The ending is one instance when the audience's faith needed to be rewarded with something better than truth, perhaps an #alternativefact lol? But this was certainly left open for viewers to decide or decipher, since the clues were all there.
The autopilot scene was left in there to suggest that Bruce made a choice. Despite having the option of escaping, Batman willingly chooses to leave, because "There's nothing out there for (him) anymore," something that he had chosen to believe for a long time. That's what made that moment with him in the cockpit, staring out into nothingness in total silence, all the more poignant.
anujbeatles I guess the end is open ended like Inception. I hate it people consider Rises a "failure" like Spider-Man 3 X3 Iron Man 3 & Godfather Part III. Hell this movie is better than Batman v Superman.
I've been waving the flag that this movie was really weak for years now. There's just so many leaps in logic that go incredibly beyond the pale. Why was no one ever able to escape a pit that a nine year old was able to? Why were there no guards around the pit to make sure that no one ever got out of it? How did Batman make it back to Gotham without any money or equipment? Why were none of those cops immediately gunned down when they tried to rush Bane's army?
The movie really falls short of the philosophical platitudes that it's reaching for when they can't even get basic logical plot details right.
Well, ok...if the dark knight rises was the trilogy “going wrong”, it certainly went wrong in a far better way than say.....Star Wars, Game of Thrones or The Matrix. At the very least, it kept its artistic vision/credibility intact.
I can sort of get the first two (even if I might disagree), but the Matrix sequels didn't ruin the artistic vision/credibility. They were just more clumsy.
"What went wrong" was Heath Ledger's untimely passing. The final in the trilogy was always supposed to be a showdown between the Batman and the Joker, not a morality tale about the perils of crony capitalism.
cRoNy cApItalisM
"crony capitalism" yeah like there is some other "not crony" capitalism lol.
You let your politics ruin your enjoyment of the film, who determined that it was supposed to be a showdown between joker and batman?
@@KZ-xt4hl sounds like you got offended because people don't buy your socialist bullshit.
@@letourneauvt9566 awww , cute deflection....now go back to facebook grandpa
@@whoshotashleybabbitt4924 There is no actual way theoretically or practically you cant prevent capitalism from becoming corporatism by entirely legal means, pure legal competition inherently produce a very limited number of winners in the long run resulting in corporate corruption.
Money is inherently a corruption inducer.
Every superhero movie pales in comparison to the dark knight..
mjstory1976 how???
you cant compare the mcu to the dark knight trilogy. don't get me wrong, I love marvel but the formula is always the same. this is batman, christopher nolan's batman. and the best damn joker we'll ever get. and you're gonna compare that to loki or red skull. it's not comparable.
MacKenzie Carnathan The Dark Knight is really not a good movie(actually its pretty bad). Ledger did a great performence, but the joker was a pretty shit villain. He was way to random! He had no motivations and he did stuff just for the sake of doing stuff! And Two Face was completely wasted! The story is all over the place, the action is shit, large plot holes that take you out of the experience, reall boring dialog at times and has verry boring scenes! Batman s voice was just terrible! Completely overacted! Batman does not feel like Batman (he fucking kills)! Out of TDK triology I only enjoy Batman Begins! TDKR is absolute garbage! TDK is not even compareble to the worst MCU movies! Batman 1989 is a much supirior Batman movie!
MacKenzie Carnathan that’s an unfair statement in my opinion. Are the movies formulaic? Perhaps, but that doesn’t stop them from being well written movies with likable heroes. The joker and Loki comparison also doesn’t make sense, since they’re totally different characters. One is a crazy psychopath while the other one is morally grey person with childhood issues. They’re both excellently written but in different ways.
they're only comparable in that they are MCU villains because my point was that Heath Ledger is far above every Marvel villain, even thanos. As to the formula of Marvel movies, I love it. They figured out what people want and it works. But it's not Christopher Nolan-worthy. Someone saying the dark knight is the best "superhero" movie is almost doing it a discredit because it's just a good movie on its own without needing a hero everyone knows and loves. the dark knight trilogy gets consistently better than any marvel superhero's movies. Marvel > DC obviously, but all marvel movies < the dark knight.
"You're a big guy" "For you"
What did Nolan mean by this?
Bane was essentially finishing his sentence.
"If I pull that [the mask] off, will you die?"
"It would be extremely painful..."
"You're a big guy."
"...for you."
11:47
No he didn't. He overcame his pain, and when he has overcome his pain, he used his fear of pain for one last mission to save his city from utter destruction, and when the city is saved there is no pain to fear, he overcame his pain in the pit. So now he can let go of Batman who is the embodiment of pain and fear.
The dark knight rises in my opinion is still amazing but not as good as the dark knight
It isn't as good as a meh , over rated movie that everyone fawned over due to a fantastic portrayal by Heath Ledger. Agree there.
@@daverobson3084 the dark knight is one of the greatest superhero movies ever, dont lie
@@Tommy_7178
That movie is so over rated. It is laden with plot holes, poor writing, incomplete writing, and , other than Ledger and Oldman, mediocre acting. Still, better than The Dark Knight Rises( almost anything is). Ledger's phenomenal performance has people believing it is a much better movie than it actually is.
@@daverobson3084 so then I ask you, what are the plotholes, poor writing, and incomplete writing?
White Power Stop worshipping this trilogy to the point where if someone doesn’t like it, you think they’re idiots, thats childish. My problems with TDKR are the fight scenes besides Batman against Bane were bad, theres plenty of moments where you can see Extras not knowing whats going on and just making up stuff after looking at Batman and Bane. While the cops rush Banes terorrists, banes terrorists drop their guns and rush them for no reason. Bane’s motivation was just to blow up gotham, unlike Joker’s psychological motivation. He also had a bad death (just because it’s realistic doesn’t mean its good) since he was praised as this strong and unstoppable man throughout the film and died so easily. Bruce Wayne told Blake he’s Batman out of nowhere. They tried to make Batman seem old and broken with his cane when he isn’t even really old, especially after TDK ended. Talia al ghul also had a bad death.
TDKR is the weakest out of the trilogy but I love this Movie so much idk why it's just so motivational and the music is perfect and the ending was amazing.
Anthony Espinoza it earned the most money of the trilogy and had an 87% on rotten tomatoes which is higher than batman begins. It was in no way the weakest of the trilogy. It was an incredible movie and lived up to expectations. There was no chance it was going to be better than the dark knight because of how good it was. It was the best superhero movie of all time and it's been mentioned among the best movies of all time
mikevickisabeast why are you going against me? I'm on your side
Anthony Espinoza I'm saying you're wrong about it being the weakest in the trilogy. I was just pointing out why but I know you're "on my side"
Neil deGrasse Tyson it's been called that by MANY critics and it made over a billion. Not to mention heath ledger won a best supporting actor for the best portrayal of the joker ever. What other movie compares to it? Idiot
mikevickisabeast If making money is all that matters when judging a film, Avatar and Titanic are the best movies ever made and it's not even close. They're all overrated movies. They're decent comic book movies, but they're not great pieces of cinema.
What went wrong? Nothing
Lotta loyalty for an average consumer
Well perhaps he's wondering why someone would criticize a masterpiece of a film, before throwing it out of a plane
this movie is a garbage
sajeewa dilshan for you
Batmans voice :D
imdb : 8.4
RT: 87℅
Wisecrack: What went wrong in TDKR
I love Nolan, he's my favorite director, and TDKR is an awesome film. That's exactly why it's analysed; that's what makes it an interesting topic. Imagine a video on what went wrong with Transformers, it would be dull (and about 10hrs long). If anything, I found myself appreciating this movie more after watching this video.
So Wisecrack is one of the 13%. That's not a problem.
Lol
I get why theres a critique...TDK was a solid " A+" maybe A-.....but TDKR is most definitely a " B- " "B+" initiative .... meaning it was a great film just not a "masterpiece" like its predecessor
Watch the video before commenting.
What? I loved this movie. the end made me cry
me2 :) I love the end.
What went wrong with The Dark Knight Rises: Nothing
that's a fanboy reaction
actually, very few things went wrong, and most of the time people get them wrong. Even The Dark Knight has flaws, but that doesn't ruin the movie, just as some flaws don't make TDKR the shitty movie everyone whines about.
Kinda find it funny that this is my third comment on this video, and it's my third reason to unsubscribe from Wisecrack.
Absolutely right.
Dak F -The insulting plot holes and conveniences are what went wrong, fanboy.
"3 fUcKING hours"
So outta nowhere and unnecesary, it's fucking hilarious
If Bane had more of an emotional connection other than revenge for someone else
Nothing went wrong. Y’all expected Dark Knight 2. Chris Nolan has said time and time again, each film they shifted genre, and Rises was “Historical Epic” as opposed to the “Crime Epic” of TDK. Rises is a brilliant film, if you’re willing to look at it as a stand alone film and NOT a sequel to TDK, which it was never meant to be!
Scrubs or Community philosophy please
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GAY
but yes, do it
I'm glad you Chang-ed your mind.
Still ten times better than Batman V Superman: Dawn of Shit!
daniel henderson WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?, MARTHAAAAAAAA
BUCKY!!!!!!!
No way, for one simple reason: Batman would NEVER retire to go live in Italy. That just annoys me so much
Beatness BvS is worse because Batman kills. He has a moral code normally, and in fact, it's one of his most important characteristics, and it's just gone in BvS, which actually means that BvS is factually worse because it dettered the development and original qualities of such an interesting character like Batman.
daniel henderson the only thing better about Batman V Superman is that Batman actually kicks ass and looks natural doing it. In the Dark night trilogy he is so stiff fighting and moving he looks like a plank.
9:05
No the Batman is death
At the end they showed Bruce not Batman
Thank you! Seriously how can anyone claim that there is no character resolution? Batman dies a hero in order for Bruce to get a fresh start with Selena hence moving on in life which was possible due to him knowing the truth that Alfred had previously revealed. In the final scene we also get to see a Bruce who has forgiven Alfred showing an approval sign to Alfred by smiling. Also Bruce had moved on with his life precisely as Alfred had dreamt it.
"It was the best of times -IT WAS THE BLURST OF TIMES???!"
That Simpson reference
Iron Fist: What Went Wrong?
Brad Bazor they choose a guy who couldn't do martial arts over a guy who could
Brad Bazor some terrible acting and awful cliches
Non-martial artist in martial arts show whitesplaining Asian culture to Asian characters, maybe?
racewiththefalcons1 'Whitesplaining' isn't a word, I think you mean whitewashing.
Also, Danny Rand is white.
racewiththefalcons1 What the fuck? Well maybe if you're not white get off your phone and the internet because both of those things were made by white people. Stop appropriating MY culture.
What went wrong is the fact that Heath Ledger died.
Anthony Visco agreed
that was the real problem. the movie required serious reconfiguring because I don't think anyone could have done the job that Heath Ledger did as the Joker. I seriously wonder what the last movie could have been if Heath Ledger had not died. It's certainly not a bad movie but could've been better, and that is made even more obvious because it followed TDK.
Anthony Visco They had no script for this film before he dies
it was a great film untill the bane and talia twist
HL was amazing but TDK was not perfect.
I laughed so hard at
"3 fucking hours" and
"Bruce fucks off to Italy"
Nothing went wrong. It was a masterpiece
Cooraline Xavier No it’s not, it’s pretty slow
The Dark Knight is amazing, The Dark Knight Rises is amazing. You can like both. They're not mutually exclusive.
*Dr. Pavel, I'm CIA.*
oral sex
A very good breakdown of the themes in Dark knight rises. I liked Tom Hardy's fiery performance, but it would've been MUCH better had they made Gotham's society in the wake of the dent act more corrupt and wrongheaded. That way Bane's revolution and motives would've been more relatable, and perhaps a certain other character's as well, though that would require a little more fixing. Then that corrupt society could reinforce Gordon's "structures becoming shackles" frustration, and then Batman could play on that as a good "individual" free of society's shackles. And Revolution's double meaning, Batman could symbolize good individuals rising above and "breaking the cycle", earning his redemption in Gotham's eyes.
And such a conclusion would be an appropriate contrast to the Dark Knight, where Batman found his good intentions lost in the "structures" of society's laws and what the public is willing to accept, having to settle for a lie with the false idolization of Dent, the Dent act, the blackening of his name, and resigning to just letting society go through the cycles again for whatever momentary peace he could manage, until it all went wrong again.
....Bane's motivation/revolution isn't supposed to be "relatable". He even states several times he's only using this revolution to distract from the bomb. That's literally his motivation. The revolution is a background, and not meant to be this deep and meaningful. Sorry but you really misread it, and this comment kinda proved Bane's entire point. Everyone is sheep who'll listen to the loudest clown as long as you sell them "hope" or "relatability" without thinking of the other circumstances.
i thought it was a very worthy finale to end a great trilogy. especially since they had to re-write around the death of ledger. imagine how much better it could have been if the joker was in it.
Honestly I loved the dark Knight rises..
Thank you. I love this movie too. It's right up there with TDK for me.
love the what went wrong videos, but how far out is the philosophy of Archer video?
You should've considered ras al gul's daughter's role in the movie and the fact that bane and her didn't care about anything other than avenging ras and completing his mission. The detective also felt a way about crediting batman with all the bad Dent did. Maybe he valued truth and legacy. Did the citizens of gotham riot because of the lie or the chaos bane unleashed (the bomb threat and wall street heist)?
I think Bruce lied about his death because he knew that the Batman was bigger than him. So by killing the Batman and living his life apart, he's was able to finally live like a normal person and, at the same time, create the everlasting symbol he wanted from the beginning.
There is a lot of problems with this Wisecrack Edition but I will narrow it down to three. v
1. Assuming that ending of TDKR was save by a "noble lie" like the previous film. Except it wasn't, Batman did sacrifice himself to save Gotham, the fact that he miraculously survived doesn't mean that he "lied". Sure, he may have lied about the autopilot but that doesn't equate to the lie about Harvey Dent/Two-Face in TDK. As a working autopilot is the only plausible way Bruce could have survived a nuclear blast, but even then how he manage to survive is nothing short of a miracle, thus making his "resurrection" genuine.
2. The theme of pain, is not about Bruce enduring pain for the rest of life, it's about him finding a way out of pain. As Alfred, said to Bruce he wanted more for him then just life of pain and misery. Bruce believes that without Batman his life has no meaning, that his life is defined by pain, thus losing his fear of death and his will to live. Instead of the Batman symbolizing hope as Bruce intended, it began to symbolize pain and despair. And by Bruce letting go of Batman, he let's go of pain and as result the Bat symbol is recontextualize into a symbol of hope and heroism for Gotham.
3. The revolution against the rich is a result of systemic injustice and not necessarily because the rich directly did anything bad to the poor. Because it's the rich who benefits from the police state, it makes sense why the poor and oppressed would be resentful towards the privileged even if technically the privilege haven't done anything other than be privileged. You can argue that we weren't shown the rich oppression against the poor but we didn't have to be shown. As the film gives us of good enough understanding of the "Dent act" for the audience grasp the social inequalities that could arise from it.
1) The movie states a few times the Dent act was overreaching. They say it's even been unfair to certain people who have been locked up. And the Mayor's office is depicted, albeit only in one scene, as having used this power to have made re-election and being in office easy for himself. Also, it completely emptied Arkham, which while beneficial in that no one can avoid prison anymore by acting insane, closes it up for those who actually are mentally ill.
2) Bataman DID sacrifice himself. You're clearly ignoring the dichotomy that both the comics and the movies make between who Bruce Wayne is and who Batman is. The problem with Bruce is that he doesn't want to sacrifice the Batman part of himself. The entire first 40 minutes of the movie is spent focused on how much he can't let go of it. In the end, Bruce is sacrificing a persona, a part of himself, an identity he has to give up so that whatever is left of the boy that watched his parents die can move on. If anything, it serves as a double meaning, for both the sacrifice to save Gotham and the sacrifice Bruce has to make for himself.
3) Have you paid attention to real life? People will get all up in arms and chaotic over the smallest thing. They will start rioting at colleges simply because they don't like the political affiliation of a person speaking there. Bane's scenario where he reveals Gotham's corruption before encouraging people to eat the rich isn't that much of an unlikely scenario. Sometimes all it takes is one crazy willing to go into the streets and cause chaos for those who wanted to, but were too timid at first to go out and follow.
Good comment. Also, that's a relevant profile pic.
2 No, Batman didn't sacrifice himself. That was entirely a ruse. He could've easily just quit being Batman, and not pretended that Bruce Wayne was also dead. The animated Dark Knight Rises movie does a better job with Batman Dying/Retiring, because it's not convoluted and stupid as fuck.
No one was hunting down Brucy, and he had already "sacrificed" Batman for much better reasons at the introduction of the film!
1 The old adage of "show don't tell" is crucial here. We can say that puppies would eat you alive if they were desperate enough to; But if you just see an adorable happy puppy in front of you, then my words are likely to go in one ear and out the other.
The words of how the "Dent Act did bad shit" aren't even well done enough to create a cognitive dissonance for the viewer. Which means that they're nowhere near as influential on the viewer as the "good guys are always good" cliche that the movie abuses in favor of a propagandic narrative.
3 I'm pretty damn certain that economic disparity, state abuses of power, and creeping fascism within deep state structures like the police and military industrial complex are all *WAY* fucking worse then some college kids protesting people who say shit they don't like!
ZerogunRivale I agree with you until your third point.
3 They are intimately related though? Political correctness comes from state institutions, not "the people." Pretty sure the erosion of our rights is advocated by those same college kids.
@SoCalAries - I don't think we completely disagree. The erosion of our rights is advocated by those college kids, but from a different angle. Think of it as the Bush-era surveillance vs. the political correctness of college kids. The mayor of Gotham advocated the Dent Act, a symbol of the Patriot Act. The college SJWs want erosion of freedom of speech. And unfortunately, both sides end up doing what the other is doing anyway on a long enough timetable. They're both eroding our rights.
6:55 huh. I wonder who would do that....
Nothing went wrong, awesome end to an awesome trilogy
Exactly
Wrong
Didn't know this movie went wrong I found it entertaining and feel satisfied about its ending also concluding the one of the best trilogy of all time.
As always, you provide a compelling argument, but in this case, I am not persuaded by it. I understand the Dark Knight Rises is thematically inconsistent, but I would argue that's why it is so good (as a standalone film, viewed apart from the tone established i the previous film). Obviously, this is a TH-cam comment so I can't flesh my ideas out completely, but the main theme of the film is inciting chaos to destroy a city from the inside. Scarecrow and Joker's fear didn't work (both the existential and physical), so Bane does something more akin to reality: proves that humans are messy, and exposes them for it, in a world which hates messiness. What I mean by this, is that inciting chaos within people makes them dangerous and unpredictable, and as a result thematically inconsistent. I found this film the most honest in the series, and the most cynical, as it (through Bane) demonstrates that most people are not as moral or reasonable as they thought, and that these things can be exploited. It takes moral and reasonable individuals to change the course of Bane's revolution: Batman, Gordon, Cat Woman (who Bruce persuades to take the morally just action), and Joseph Gordon Levitt's character who I do not remember the name of.
Bryce
Robin John Blake
I like this interpretation a lot.
Your point sounds interesting, but that were not shown much during the film, maybe a scene with the normal citizens discussing the riot will strengthen your point.
ppl are not moral or reasonable in real life.
we should not count on the cops, or a few extraordinary ppl to help us all.
This would make a lot more sense if the previous movie didn't show criminals and everyday people refusing to murder each other to prove the Joker right.
Rewatching The Dark Knight rises in 2020 like...damn was Bane right?
But Batman is also right because it is hard to have patience like him.
this was badass through and through. I wished for these types of movies when I was kid
I think Bane was spreading a false lie by telling the truth about the lie on the Dent act even if the Dent act was for good Bane wanted to spread chaos and havoc for his mission. Bane made it sound justified in that sense even though he was just trying to destroy Gotham the people believed him and that is what he wanted I think at least.
I felt Dark Knight Rises didn't know what it was doing. For example you expect me to believe the cops were buried underground for 5 months and are just fine after all ready to fight Bane?
yeah Bane had zero problem killing whoever, but he leaves the police buried for no reason. Not to mention, how did they survive for five months (I think it was five?)....this movie had too many plot conveniences, such as Robin Cop, just happening upon Gordon, or Bruce Wayne healing from a crippling back injury to break out of an "inescapable" prison (which didn't seem all that inescapable to me)....but it's just a movie I guess.
@@Psilocybin77 that makes no sense. How could bane have took out all of them wtf
@@imperfect_dan7519 I dunno they were buried underground. Flood em? But that was just a little nitpick. I really love this movie, I've been thinking about it today, because I just watched it last night.
Like other DC movies, if they had worked on the script longer, they would have made better films. Like the video shows, they had some great ideas and themes to work with, that didn't quite make it into the final cut.
I think you're wrong about Sydney Carton. Interestingly enough, if you understand that better, you might gain insight into how batman does actually sacrifice himself at the end of the movie. As you say, Sydney Carton looked like Charles Darnay. Enough to swap places with him at the end of the book. Think about it... Who looks like Bruce? Who sacrifices himself? .... Batman, Batman looks like Bruce. At the end of the movie Batman metaphorically sacrifices himself to save Bruce Wayne. When I got to the end, it was clear to me that Bruce had let go of his past, and with that, had let go of the need to be the Batman to cope with it. He had discovered that his life, Bruce Wayne's life, was worth living. That batman, Bruce's batman, is gone (or dead) at that point in the movie. Also, you were presented with the idea that the toxic lie lead to so much corruption that revealing it was more beneficial. The toxic lie was corrupting Bruce's spirit, not the city. In the beginning he is a shell of his former self. Is that not corruption in a sense? So much of this is symbolic, yet you look for physical answers. I don't mean this as an insult, but if you tried looking at the movie from a different perspective, perhaps you'd enjoy it more. I also think you're too stuck in the Dark Knight. Let the Dark Knight Rises be its own movie. It has a lot of themes exploring Bruce's internal struggle and I think that's where you're making your mistake. The Dark Knight felt like a man vs man conflict (Batman vs Joker as they fight over the heart of the city). The Dark Knight Rises felt far more like a man vs self conflict, but you seem to keep viewing it as man vs man. My reasoning for saying its man vs self is that the movie focuses itself on Bruce's internal struggle. Many of the major plot devices and characters in the film revolve around him. The Weapons used against Batman are his own. How is the city thrown into chaos? Bane uses Batman's tools against him, namely the Dent act. How does Bane arm his men? With Batman's weapons (Your precious armoury, graciously accepted). What creates the bomb? Batman's property. How does Bane beat up Batman? With the same training batman had (training from the League of Shadows). Who is Bane? The Batman that never escaped the Pit. Speaking of the Pit, how can you look at the scene where Bruce climbs out of the Pit as anything but an internal struggle? The key to him overcoming it is by symbolically releasing himself from his past (the rope). I beg you, please rewatch the movie and consider it from that perspective. Maybe you'll enjoy it more.
EDIT: grammar
You have only made it better for me. Thanks