I think it could have went even better though, to be honest. Like, for example, if "Tara" actually showed up to Willow instead of that girl from a few episode ago that she had no connection with. And I've read somewhere that there was plans to have Xander see Jesse, his friend from the Pilot episodes that got turned into a vampire and that Xander kinda-sorta killed by accident. Don't get me wrong, the episode IS great for sure. But those things I mentioned here, I think it could have made it even better, maybe!
@@minuette1752 I know the why of it, but I still think it would have been more impactful if it took Tara's form, rather than that one person they failed to save a few episode ago. It's like, why didn't it try to do that to begin with, is it stupid? I think I might have bought it more if there was an in-show explanation for that, like maybe Tara still has magic in the afterlife and is using it to protect Willow by preventing it from using her face, for example. Something like that.
@@ChevaliersEmeraudeBut that's not "better written." An actress opting out has nothing to do with writing quality. I do wish they could have found someone more impactful than Cassie, a girl Willow never met. Like Jenny. Or, they could have thrown us a huge curve ball, and had it be Oz. And that being the eventual lead in yo realizing he'd died at some point. But within the confines of the actors at their disposal, they did a perfectly good job at the writing.
A lot of things happened in this episode, but poor Jonathan! For years he was bullied at school to the point when he tried to end his suffering. Then he joined a couple of losers hoping for some sort of friendship. He was betrayed by those losers, but apparently forgave Andrew... only to be betrayed again in a much, much more horrible way. It's sad, because he was never a bad person and didn't deserve to be murdered like that.
100%! Jonathan never really wanted to hurt anybody. he just fell into the wrong crowd with 2 guys he thought he had a lot in common with. he was against it every time the other 2 wanted to do BAD stuff. he even helped Buffy a few times, even when it meant him going against his friends. the only bad thing he did/almost did was when Warren got that hypno-ball and were gonna use it on women...but he felt immediate remorse once he was hit with the reality of what they were doing. he only just wanted friends. he should have been part of the Scoobies.
@@HelloXrancidkitteh Unfortunately, he would have been Xander 2.0, in terms of being the Zeppo of the group. It would have been better if Xander had been killed off instead of Tara around season six, and Jonathan replaced him. We would have seen better development from him, character wise.
Buffy was under a spell, so it wasn't of her own volition, the Cordelia-Conner thing is weird I agree. The audio series is in an alternate universe or time line where Cordy is the Slayer, so it means nothing in regards to the continuity of the show
This is the only episode Xander never appeared in. Early drafts was meant to be him having a convo with Jesse, his friend who died in the first episode of season 1. And anya was meant to be having a chat with Halfrek. But it didn’t happen. Would have been cool.
Amazing episode. Always loved that the evil saw Willow as a big threat and tried to get her out of the way - with what she did before (taking on Glory, the finale of s6), anything else wouldn't make sense
Scott Hope, Buffy's ex, coming out as gay is an easter egg. The actor, Fab Filippo, has a recurring guest role on Queer As Folk the previous year. It's a nod to that.
Conversations With Dead People was a brilliant episode and continues the build up to finale. We see similar here to that we first saw in S3 episode Amends with the torturing of Angel through the dead Jenny Calendar and other victims of Angels past. Cassie is of course not real, and plays psychological games by taking on the persona of dead people and getting under the skin of all the living trying to turn them on each other, with Joyce returning as well to appear to Dawn. Willow eventually sees that is not Cassie. The interesting thing about this episode was it was also trying to show how Charlatan Mediums can manipulate the living missing loved ones and pretending to speak to them. Revelations too with Spikes actions, and the the reappearance of the dead Warren, and the death of Jonathan at the hands of Andrew influenced of course by the abominable Warren.
I know I throw SEASON 7 of ‘BTVS’ under the bus a lot but ‘Conversations With Dead People’ is exceptional! Just watched it again for only the very second time. The ability to write a character study all the while advancing the plot. To be able to provide strong character development all the while continuing on important plot development. It is so rare to find. It is by far my favourite episode of Season 7. And there is actually some good contenders in that season despite how much I say that I don’t like it as a whole. I mean ‘Same Time, Same Place’, ‘Help’ and ‘Selfless’ are really great episodes too but ‘Conversations With Dead People’ is on a whole other level of greatness. It’s probably up there with ‘Hush’, ‘The Body’, ‘Once More, With Feeling’ and ‘Restless’. The thing is though is that they’re all solely Whedon’s work. They’re all the creative, innovative brilliance of one mastermind of TV show making. ‘Conversations With Dead People’ isn’t. But I bet he wishes it was. Because it’s just as good in that it is epic dramatic storytelling all the while being thematically and narratively consistent with everything we have seen so far in the show. And that’s hard to do in a season that loses much of its consistency thereafter. I am extremely impressed. Jane Espenson, Drew Goddard and Nick Marck That was phenomenal. Well fucking done 👏👏👏
The whole topic about Buffy feeling she’s better than her friends and that their opinions don’t matter is *very* reminiscent of Faith telling Buffy the exact same thing in Season 3.
Someone may have told you on Patreon already, but the audio book is some kind of alternate reality (I haven't listened to it yet so idk the full story tbh.) Just saying in case you've seen anything about it, it's not fully cannon, so don't worry too much about "spoilers" or "hints" from that 😊
The episode was born out of scheduling conflicts so none of the main characters share any scenes together so it could all be filmed separately and scheduling was less.of an issue.
@@nagashthegodthey’d planned to but Eric Balfour was busy.. it woulda been a little weird anyway seeing the non-aging Jesse (vamped and then dead) suddenly appear looking much older
As we later would find out, when a vampire is sired by a vampire that has a soul, they retain some of their humanity, and possess somewhat an “echo” of a soul. It’s a very interesting concept and wasn’t explored, but is fascinating nevertheless.
All Buffy needed to do to deal with her issues was to talk to someone not in the group. And a vampire it seems. 🤣 I think Buffy deals with her root issue after having known about it since this Cordelia and Buffy exchange in _The Invisible Girl:_ *Cordelia* _"Hey! You think I'm never lonely because I'm so cute and popular? I can be surrounded by people and be completely alone. It's not like any of them really know me. I don't even know if they like me half the time. People just want to be in a popular zone - sometimes when I talk, everyone's so busy agreeing with me, they don't hear a word I say."_ *Buffy:* _"Well, if you feel so alone, then why do you work so hard at being popular?"_ *Cordelia:* _"Well, it beats being alone all by yourself."_ Good for Buffy for finally opening up (even if it was to a vampire). She clearly couldn't say anything to the group. Spike would have been the next choice, but considering what the end of this episode does, even he wasn't as good an option as he could have been. Buffy has always and will always feel lonely in the way the episode describes; in the same way Willow will always be an addict, but now knows better how to deal with it. Willow's not there on her addiction. The series is wrapping up, though, so who knows.
I really like this episode. I thought Azura Skye, the woman who played Cassie, was spectacular in both these episodes, I was kind of disappointed she never really took off as an actress as far as I can tell. IMDB for her looks like a workmanlike career but no real breakout role. I thought the guy who played the vampire psychologist was excellent also.
They originally planned to have Tara come back to visit Willow, but Amber Benson was either busy or uncomfortable coming back for THIS role as a dark Tara (or possibly both), so they used Cassie instead.
Uncomfortable, she’s said in interviews that since the fans had so much trouble with losing Tara she didn’t want to reprise the role as an evil entity because it would just be trauma all over again
@@jack_m100 I just meant because you stopped watching, just found it funny you'd even comment, like why you would care or even watch reactions lol your prerogative of course.
"It eats you starting with your bottom" :P
"From Beneath you, it devours" ;)
this is one of the highest ranked eps of the series and it deserves it IMO
I think it could have went even better though, to be honest. Like, for example, if "Tara" actually showed up to Willow instead of that girl from a few episode ago that she had no connection with. And I've read somewhere that there was plans to have Xander see Jesse, his friend from the Pilot episodes that got turned into a vampire and that Xander kinda-sorta killed by accident.
Don't get me wrong, the episode IS great for sure. But those things I mentioned here, I think it could have made it even better, maybe!
@@ChevaliersEmeraude Amber Benson did not want have Tara come back in that way. I fully agree as well.
@@minuette1752 I know the why of it, but I still think it would have been more impactful if it took Tara's form, rather than that one person they failed to save a few episode ago. It's like, why didn't it try to do that to begin with, is it stupid?
I think I might have bought it more if there was an in-show explanation for that, like maybe Tara still has magic in the afterlife and is using it to protect Willow by preventing it from using her face, for example. Something like that.
@@ChevaliersEmeraude Eh I disagree, I think it would have been less impactful if Tara had been used. That is just me though.
@@ChevaliersEmeraudeBut that's not "better written." An actress opting out has nothing to do with writing quality.
I do wish they could have found someone more impactful than Cassie, a girl Willow never met. Like Jenny. Or, they could have thrown us a huge curve ball, and had it be Oz. And that being the eventual lead in yo realizing he'd died at some point.
But within the confines of the actors at their disposal, they did a perfectly good job at the writing.
A lot of things happened in this episode, but poor Jonathan! For years he was bullied at school to the point when he tried to end his suffering. Then he joined a couple of losers hoping for some sort of friendship. He was betrayed by those losers, but apparently forgave Andrew... only to be betrayed again in a much, much more horrible way. It's sad, because he was never a bad person and didn't deserve to be murdered like that.
100%! Jonathan never really wanted to hurt anybody. he just fell into the wrong crowd with 2 guys he thought he had a lot in common with. he was against it every time the other 2 wanted to do BAD stuff. he even helped Buffy a few times, even when it meant him going against his friends. the only bad thing he did/almost did was when Warren got that hypno-ball and were gonna use it on women...but he felt immediate remorse once he was hit with the reality of what they were doing. he only just wanted friends. he should have been part of the Scoobies.
@@HelloXrancidkitteh Unfortunately, he would have been Xander 2.0, in terms of being the Zeppo of the group. It would have been better if Xander had been killed off instead of Tara around season six, and Jonathan replaced him. We would have seen better development from him, character wise.
Buffy was under a spell, so it wasn't of her own volition, the Cordelia-Conner thing is weird I agree. The audio series is in an alternate universe or time line where Cordy is the Slayer, so it means nothing in regards to the continuity of the show
This era on Buffy & Angel is Joss' "actresses that rebuffed my sexual advances" character assassination arc.
I think this is the creepiest episode they ever did, and the Dawn/Joyce bit was the creepiest part of it.
This is the only episode Xander never appeared in. Early drafts was meant to be him having a convo with Jesse, his friend who died in the first episode of season 1. And anya was meant to be having a chat with Halfrek. But it didn’t happen. Would have been cool.
jesse was cut because they couldn't get the actor back. halfrek i'm not sure about.
The episode that won Buffy a Hugo Award! And a fan favorite episode.
This is my 'Dawn becomes a full scooby' episode because she really held her own here.
The brats mistranslated 'from beneath you it devours' in the worst way.
Amazing episode. Always loved that the evil saw Willow as a big threat and tried to get her out of the way - with what she did before (taking on Glory, the finale of s6), anything else wouldn't make sense
Scott Hope, Buffy's ex, coming out as gay is an easter egg. The actor, Fab Filippo, has a recurring guest role on Queer As Folk the previous year. It's a nod to that.
Conversations With Dead People was a brilliant episode and continues the build up to finale. We see similar here to that we first saw in S3 episode Amends with the torturing of Angel through the dead Jenny Calendar and other victims of Angels past. Cassie is of course not real, and plays psychological games by taking on the persona of dead people and getting under the skin of all the living trying to turn them on each other, with Joyce returning as well to appear to Dawn. Willow eventually sees that is not Cassie. The interesting thing about this episode was it was also trying to show how Charlatan Mediums can manipulate the living missing loved ones and pretending to speak to them. Revelations too with Spikes actions, and the the reappearance of the dead Warren, and the death of Jonathan at the hands of Andrew influenced of course by the abominable Warren.
And this is where it begins 😈
I know I throw SEASON 7 of ‘BTVS’ under the bus a lot but ‘Conversations With Dead People’ is exceptional! Just watched it again for only the very second time.
The ability to write a character study all the while advancing the plot. To be able to provide strong character development all the while continuing on important plot development. It is so rare to find.
It is by far my favourite episode of Season 7. And there is actually some good contenders in that season despite how much I say that I don’t like it as a whole. I mean ‘Same Time, Same Place’, ‘Help’ and ‘Selfless’ are really great episodes too but ‘Conversations With Dead People’ is on a whole other level of greatness.
It’s probably up there with ‘Hush’, ‘The Body’, ‘Once More, With Feeling’ and ‘Restless’. The thing is though is that they’re all solely Whedon’s work. They’re all the creative, innovative brilliance of one mastermind of TV show making. ‘Conversations With Dead People’ isn’t. But I bet he wishes it was. Because it’s just as good in that it is epic dramatic storytelling all the while being thematically and narratively consistent with everything we have seen so far in the show. And that’s hard to do in a season that loses much of its consistency thereafter. I am extremely impressed.
Jane Espenson, Drew Goddard and Nick Marck
That was phenomenal. Well fucking done 👏👏👏
The whole topic about Buffy feeling she’s better than her friends and that their opinions don’t matter is *very* reminiscent of Faith telling Buffy the exact same thing in Season 3.
Miss Kitty Fantastico
This is one of my all time favorites.
Someone may have told you on Patreon already, but the audio book is some kind of alternate reality (I haven't listened to it yet so idk the full story tbh.) Just saying in case you've seen anything about it, it's not fully cannon, so don't worry too much about "spoilers" or "hints" from that 😊
yes it isn't at all canon it's an alternate reality like the Wish universe or any other encountered previously
The episode was born out of scheduling conflicts so none of the main characters share any scenes together so it could all be filmed separately and scheduling was less.of an issue.
This was one of the best episodes in all of btvs
Only Buffy episode ever with no Xander.
I never noticed that but you're right
Wish they'd brought Jesse back from episode 1. Just to see Xander's reaction - perhaps the guilt of not saving him, and accidentally staking him.
@@nagashthegodthey’d planned to but Eric Balfour was busy.. it woulda been a little weird anyway seeing the non-aging Jesse (vamped and then dead) suddenly appear looking much older
@@vannthybun2546yeah but not as if they ever explained why Angel or spike never aged
I feel bad for Jonathan.
As we later would find out, when a vampire is sired by a vampire that has a soul, they retain some of their humanity, and possess somewhat an “echo” of a soul.
It’s a very interesting concept and wasn’t explored, but is fascinating nevertheless.
Okay so you're allowed to know now, episode 7 of each season is usually a big one 😂
All Buffy needed to do to deal with her issues was to talk to someone not in the group.
And a vampire it seems. 🤣
I think Buffy deals with her root issue after having known about it since this Cordelia and Buffy exchange in _The Invisible Girl:_
*Cordelia* _"Hey! You think I'm never lonely because I'm so cute and popular? I can be surrounded by people and be completely alone. It's not like any of them really know me. I don't even know if they like me half the time. People just want to be in a popular zone - sometimes when I talk, everyone's so busy agreeing with me, they don't hear a word I say."_
*Buffy:* _"Well, if you feel so alone, then why do you work so hard at being popular?"_
*Cordelia:* _"Well, it beats being alone all by yourself."_
Good for Buffy for finally opening up (even if it was to a vampire). She clearly couldn't say anything to the group. Spike would have been the next choice, but considering what the end of this episode does, even he wasn't as good an option as he could have been. Buffy has always and will always feel lonely in the way the episode describes; in the same way Willow will always be an addict, but now knows better how to deal with it. Willow's not there on her addiction. The series is wrapping up, though, so who knows.
I really like this episode. I thought Azura Skye, the woman who played Cassie, was spectacular in both these episodes, I was kind of disappointed she never really took off as an actress as far as I can tell. IMDB for her looks like a workmanlike career but no real breakout role. I thought the guy who played the vampire psychologist was excellent also.
I always thought this actress would make a great lead final girl in a horror franchise of some kind.
They originally planned to have Tara come back to visit Willow, but Amber Benson was either busy or uncomfortable coming back for THIS role as a dark Tara (or possibly both), so they used Cassie instead.
Uncomfortable, she’s said in interviews that since the fans had so much trouble with losing Tara she didn’t want to reprise the role as an evil entity because it would just be trauma all over again
@@vannthybun2546 I like it better that the entity couldn't use her, like her soul was too good or too pure for ito even touch.
I am curious...which episode from Season 2 she's referring to.
Hero down!
Angel, not Giles 🤦🏽♀️
Eh the Summers home gets destroyed all the time. :) Dawn did not really do anything horrible.
Willow and Dawn were seeing lying hallucinations. Spike's sire may not be his sire. Idk, I stopped watching by season 7.
why comment then 😂
@@paulinerobertson6836 just saying shouldn't blame Spike yet. And should I speak when it's a spoiler?
@@jack_m100 I just meant because you stopped watching, just found it funny you'd even comment, like why you would care or even watch reactions lol your prerogative of course.