Performance of Republic of the Fiji Islands, Kadavu Island Group and Rotuma Island Group in The 9th Festival of Pacific Arts in Palau, July 2004. 2004年の第9回太平洋芸術祭パラオ大会での、フィジー諸島共和国、カンダブ島グループとロトゥマ島グループのパフォーマンス。
Polynesians were in Fiji first. No matter if it's in Melanesia region your culture will always follow what your neighbors Samoa and Tonga do. Fiji is west of the poly triangle and will always be. Poly's have lived in Fiji for over 4000 years, through pottery. Fijians are brown, not to mention Samoa and Tonga have small population of melanesians in some villages. But we are still Polynesians. I wouldn't call it an invasion it though contact between Fiji, Tonga and Samoa was close whether it be trading, voyaging or intermarriage
The group from Rotuma was awesome. The rhythm and their voices was almost hypnotizing. I'm looking forward to seeing them in American Samoa when I go in July!!!
You cant click on a traditional dance without some thing racial or ethnic going on in the comment section. Dude, the person's voice from 1:40 to 2:56! Can you hear it?! It's beautiful! I wish I had the grace to dance the seasea or something similar. :( The Rotuma dance and song is beautiful too! Moments like this I'm so proud to be Fijian.
The Rotuman sound here is very unique and fascinating. Hats off to the indigenous Roumans. It is very unfortunate however, that most traditional Fijian mekes that are presented abroad such as in this one here by the Kadavu dance group and even to tourists in our hotels here have lost the authentic sound of the Fijian i Taukei chant. Very sad. As a historian, a music enthusiast and a keen observer of traditional arts and customs, i strongly believe that if we take this for granted, we are going to lose of the defining pieces of our indigenous culture in the years to come.
I read about this as well in more than one source..internet and library sources....its no wonder some of our Fijian vocab are similar to our poly 'cousins'...
bEING ON THE "CUSP" WE HAVE TONGA, SAMOA , FIJI~ WIVES WERE TAKEN FROM OTHER IS. GROUPS~KEEPING THE "GENE~POOL" STRONG`~ LANGUISTICS SHOW CERTAIN SIMILARITIES~
i see alot commenting whether fiji is melanesian or polynesian. Just search for Te vaka -lakalaka music video and Fiji is included as a polynesian although they have the same phenotype of so called african americans. Beautifully exotic.
OSEANIA IS AN AMAZING GROUP OF CULTURES OF THE PASIFIK OCEAN~ AS A KIWI~YANK WITH A FEW .5 % MAORI RELATIVES , AND POSSIBLY .25% SO A FEW % LESS~ 12.5 % WITH ENG~FRENCE ~IRISH ~ SPANISH INFUSIONS~ i'M JUST A WHITE MAN~ WITH A FEW FLAVOURS OF POLYNESIAN , i AM IN A AREA OF NO. CA. & LOVE THAT I KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT MY AND wORLD HISTORY , ALSO MIGRATION ROUTES (HISTORICAL) I MAINLY LEARNED MAORI LANG. /CULT./ AND POLYNESIAN TRI ANGLE~ANY WAY I'M JUST IN THE MOOD TO WRITE ON A FEW SITES~KA PAI E HOA~ "D"
Truzz up! A fijian woman doin the "hula" is like an insult to Fijians.Becoz it simply looks silly..lol.Now this clip perfectly represent the real tradition and diverse of a fijian community.Great video!
No mate am from the nothern side, Vanualevu in savusavu. Thats a great story bro and an interesting one...... Levuka is actually the connerstone or foundation of what fiji is today. Good one bro.
I am dark coco as you say but I would be identified as black. When people are identified as black or white it isn't necessarily because of their skin color but because of shared physical similarities within a group. Here in America, African Americans are called black but come in a variety of shades. Some have skin lighter than all the people featured in this video and it ranges to skin darker than those in the videol
aS A KIWI YANK I CAN ALWAYS SPOT A FIJIAN WOMAN ~THEY ARE SHOCKED ~SAYING YOU KNOW I'M NOT A AFRO~AM! ? BULA BULA~ MET SOME TONGAN LADIES AT A CAMPSITE IN NORTHERN CA~ I ASKED IF THEY KNEW A FELLOW NAMED KONGIKA HALA'API'API? ~THEY KNEW HIM ~ HES A MINISTER NOW~ THEY INSISTED ON MAKING A POI TYPE DISH & SOME FISH THEY BOUGHT~ AMAZINGLY INTER~TWINED VILLAGES & ISLANDS NOW WHERE IS STAN VALE~VALE FROM WESLEY COLLEGE NZ 73-75?
thanks for putting this video up, i've never seen a dance from kadavu or rotuma.. i didn't even know there was a group of islands called kadavu! where is it?..
I can't count really the number of Fijians with Polynesian blood. Inter marriages between the indigenous and Rotumans is so prevalent that almost every light person in Fiji I know and meet has it too....
Fiji is a Melanesian Country!!! However, its culture and tradition is similar to the Polynesians. Rotumans are Polynesians and people from Rabi&Kioa are Micronesians. All are administered by the Fijian Government. Its true that some parts of Fiji have a mixture of Mela-Poly blood but the first group that presented, Kadavu Island (where my village is), we were not influenced by the Tongans but most of us have brown skin. Also, if you do your research about the Pacific people, Mela-nesia means 'large islands', Micro-nesia means 'small islands' and Poly-nesia means 'many islands', So, it doesnt really matter if some parts of Fiji have black skin, brown and even white skin, our islands are large and bigger then most other islands of the Pacific, this makes us Melanesians. Besides, if you from Fiji, skin color doesn't really matter.
whatever u think..but Fijians are proud of who they are and what they are known for despite their colour, religion or ancestral inheritance, we are different and our ways of doing things are unique compared to the rest of the pacific island and African nations and i i'm proud to be a Fijian...but appreciate your comparison
(cont.) are ethnic groups. There is a big difference, and so much confusion between the two words in society (by society- I only speak of America, as that is my only experience). You should be proud of being from Figi! such a beautiful culture, but race should not take away from your pride. A person can be from Figi and black at the same time b/c the two are different. Just as I can be called black and from the DRC. And the cool thing is that those termed black come in so many different shades.
Uh, most people who would be identified as black don't have black skin; they have brown skin. But black is an umbrella term that spans many different shades. There are African Americans, and people of other ethnic groups who are identified as black but some have light yellow skin. The same goes for those who are identified as white, and yes I have seen human beings with white skin.
We are all pacific islanders only the vavalagi or papalagi called us mela, polly or micro shame on them to create a division among us , plis we stand together for our very tiny pacifika...gb all pacific islanders
@kaimara26076..both of you seem to have good discussions here. Tell me how Fiji is related to Melanesians..I mean which tribes??..Fiji is Melanesian but all the tribes in Melanesia are related.
well vuaka samoan is independent and not ruled by white people whatsoever, and yet there are some famous samoan bloods out there that you might have heard of, and as far as our culture, tradition and christianity...those 3 things make us well known too, i have white people telling me here in Australia how awesome it is to be an islander, how people respect each other especially the youngsters to the elders...and most of these palagis do wish they were part of us...
u said: "be reminded that Fijans are brown skinned and NOT black".....so my mature adult sir....with all doo respect what the heck do you mean by "black" ? (note to self...will he get this or will i have to spell out his apparent contradiction)
Rotuma is Fiji like any other Islands in the country of Fiji. People who think that Fiji does not do Hula is wrong. Rotuma which an Island north of Fiji does the hula and so does the people of Rabi. I say this because I know my country more then people from any poly crap nonsense
The answer to that question lies within those countries themself. Why do you have to ask the question to someone who has not got a hint why these countries hatred the Fijians . May be .....!! because you are so knowlegeable and talented. Why dont you highlighted us?. But, that does'nt exclude Fiji from being Melanasians simply because those countries dont regarded them as wantoks or whatever !!
i know you're trying to be pc but i think we are also all different! and thats what makes the world interesting!.. saying we're all the same is like stripping ppl of their identity and saying it's not ok to be diff but metaphorically i kno what u mean.. we all mean well and want the same things in general.. love, peace..etc
That sounds like a color complex that all people of different non-white ethnic groups suffer from. When people of different ethnic groups are identified as being black, it should be understood that not everyone under the umbrella term has black skin. Some African Americans who are called black have skin that is as light as a white person. I'm not AA but I know they don't like the word nigger b/c of its historical significance. I don't know if the same is true for Figi not liking the word black.
Rotumans are Fijian and so as my kai, the Kadavuans. But the Lauans.....Mmmmm!!...not sure about them. I heard that tey are the descendants of Pontias Pilot.
please people i dnt think you all know your colors...there is no human on earth who is white in color with all due respect to my poly brothers and sisters..and be reminded that the Fijians are brown skin people and not black..
and as a samoan combined with bit of asians in my blood, i myself do not look at the melanesians any different, that's jst straight up racist, im with a mixed african and caucasian guy and our kids turned out looking brown,so yeah, it doesnt really matter what color our skin are, we are all considered humans and Adam and Eve are our first parents and maybe there's a reason why God colored us all different but one thing i know, we are all bros and sisters in God's eye n yet we're all equal..
I knew you will come out with something like that because you just dont know where you left your brain..!!!! May be still in ur little village i supposed.....hahahahahahahahaha
@tilioism.... I did it below. The truth is that you just dont like the Fijians. I am a fijian and have no problems with the other Melanesian people. Who are "YOU".
bylelm tam....bida az ku.......a piszczy ...a jak pada to woda nie jest lazurowa a w morde szara bo cale gowno z ladu splywa i taka prawda jest he eh ehe a cfoki pija kawe i nie sa w stanie potem dupczyc bo spac chce sie im ha ha ah ..musialem za nich robote odwalac ale ilez tez mozna ?? Bylem 3 tyg i dalem dyla bo juz nic nie czulem procz smrodu i bulu....
Society has a way of clumping all people of a certain race together, and marginalizing that race. So, I understand your hesitance at being called black. But even in Africa, each country has it's own unique culture. There are similarities that tie us together, as is true of the Pacific Islands, Samoa, etc- but there are enough differences to show a unique identity. Calling someone black or white is merely to show physical similarities. Fijian, African America, Congolese, etc aren't races but
I am proud to be a rotuman and a Fijian. I was born in Fiji but both of parents are from the island of rotuma.
Polynesians were in Fiji first. No matter if it's in Melanesia region your culture will always follow what your neighbors Samoa and Tonga do. Fiji is west of the poly triangle and will always be. Poly's have lived in Fiji for over 4000 years, through pottery. Fijians are brown, not to mention Samoa and Tonga have small population of melanesians in some villages. But we are still Polynesians. I wouldn't call it an invasion it though contact between Fiji, Tonga and Samoa was close whether it be trading, voyaging or intermarriage
Agreed, I'm Samoan Chinese part Tongan Fijian and they are all compatible
Cause you must be a drop out
Fijian are melanesian!
Well done! I am Rotuman, born and raised in Rawai, Fiji. I miss home.
Thank you, I enjoyed the Fijian and Rotuman dances. I'm a Rotuman from Las Vegas, Nevada. Hanisiof se aus atakoa!
The group from Rotuma was awesome. The rhythm and their voices was almost hypnotizing. I'm looking forward to seeing them in American Samoa when I go in July!!!
Love this Rotuman traditional sound - very unique
You cant click on a traditional dance without some thing racial or ethnic going on in the comment section. Dude, the person's voice from 1:40 to 2:56! Can you hear it?! It's beautiful!
I wish I had the grace to dance the seasea or something similar. :(
The Rotuma dance and song is beautiful too!
Moments like this I'm so proud to be Fijian.
The Rotuman sound here is very unique and fascinating. Hats off to the indigenous Roumans. It is very unfortunate however, that most traditional Fijian mekes that are presented abroad such as in this one here by the Kadavu dance group and even to tourists in our hotels here have lost the authentic sound of the Fijian i Taukei chant. Very sad. As a historian, a music enthusiast and a keen observer of traditional arts and customs, i strongly believe that if we take this for granted, we are going to lose of the defining pieces of our indigenous culture in the years to come.
A beautifull performance!!!
My Dad is Philipino and mum is Fijian..but i live in Fiji.
Fijians are mixed Polynesians for over 2000 years. I love the brethren of the Pacific.
alexandre jerus Tonga and Fiji a same blood. Lau group.
isi naulu Bula vinaka, Happy new year.
I read about this as well in more than one source..internet and library sources....its no wonder some of our Fijian vocab are similar to our poly 'cousins'...
Ofcourse no shit, words can be found in both Tongan and Samoan. So we always call you guys our poly brother in the west part of the poly triangle.
bEING ON THE "CUSP" WE HAVE TONGA, SAMOA , FIJI~ WIVES WERE TAKEN FROM OTHER IS. GROUPS~KEEPING THE "GENE~POOL" STRONG`~ LANGUISTICS SHOW CERTAIN SIMILARITIES~
Beautiful reminder of home. Thanks heaps for posting it up!
beautiful music love the dancers
interesting culture,such beautiful sinchronisation,very beautiful I like it :)
Really great performance!
i see alot commenting whether fiji is melanesian or polynesian. Just search for Te vaka -lakalaka music video and Fiji is included as a polynesian although they have the same phenotype of so called african americans. Beautifully exotic.
OSEANIA IS AN AMAZING GROUP OF CULTURES OF THE PASIFIK OCEAN~ AS A KIWI~YANK WITH A FEW .5 % MAORI RELATIVES , AND POSSIBLY .25% SO A FEW % LESS~ 12.5 % WITH ENG~FRENCE ~IRISH ~ SPANISH INFUSIONS~ i'M JUST A WHITE MAN~ WITH A FEW FLAVOURS OF POLYNESIAN , i AM IN A AREA OF NO. CA. & LOVE THAT I KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT MY AND wORLD HISTORY , ALSO MIGRATION ROUTES (HISTORICAL) I MAINLY LEARNED MAORI LANG. /CULT./ AND POLYNESIAN TRI ANGLE~ANY WAY I'M JUST IN THE MOOD TO WRITE ON A FEW SITES~KA PAI E HOA~ "D"
Says who?
They are Melanesians not Polynesian. Only Rotumans are Polynesian.
Truzz up! A fijian woman doin the "hula" is like an insult to Fijians.Becoz it simply looks silly..lol.Now this clip perfectly represent the real tradition and diverse of a fijian community.Great video!
Nice work ... Fiji and Rotuma.
No mate am from the nothern side, Vanualevu in savusavu. Thats a great story bro and an interesting one...... Levuka is actually the connerstone or foundation of what fiji is today. Good one bro.
love the rotuman dance so unique
Very impressed
love the dances. never heard of melanesian or any other -sian..lol. i think we all the same.
this is wat i call real fijian pride...bula mai!
fiji for ever
FIJI, I love you full speed!
the dancers are native fijians just like the maoris in new zealand and aborogines in aussie, the fijians are other people of other race.
One love
yeah its interesting to note the diversity of people inheriting the globe.
I'm Fijian and I'm proud
I am dark coco as you say but I would be identified as black. When people are identified as black or white it isn't necessarily because of their skin color but because of shared physical similarities within a group. Here in America, African Americans are called black but come in a variety of shades. Some have skin lighter than all the people featured in this video and it ranges to skin darker than those in the videol
cumensu Tonga Fiji a the same blood.
aS A KIWI YANK I CAN ALWAYS SPOT A FIJIAN WOMAN ~THEY ARE SHOCKED ~SAYING YOU KNOW I'M NOT A AFRO~AM! ? BULA BULA~ MET SOME TONGAN LADIES AT A CAMPSITE IN NORTHERN CA~ I ASKED IF THEY KNEW A FELLOW NAMED KONGIKA HALA'API'API? ~THEY KNEW HIM ~ HES A MINISTER NOW~ THEY INSISTED ON MAKING A POI TYPE DISH & SOME FISH THEY BOUGHT~ AMAZINGLY INTER~TWINED VILLAGES & ISLANDS NOW WHERE IS STAN VALE~VALE FROM WESLEY COLLEGE NZ 73-75?
love it:) Awesome:):)
These lads, along with the Maori and the tongans should be known by everyone
the rotuman war dance is similar to the tongan kailao ....but only danced in very big occassions
thanks for putting this video up, i've never seen a dance from kadavu or rotuma.. i didn't even know there was a group of islands called kadavu! where is it?..
I can't count really the number of Fijians with Polynesian blood. Inter marriages between the indigenous and Rotumans is so prevalent that almost every light person in Fiji I know and meet has it too....
Yes it's good to be multicultural but also to remember, respect.and keep the native side & environment alive.
Fiji is a Melanesian Country!!! However, its culture and tradition is similar to the Polynesians. Rotumans are Polynesians and people from Rabi&Kioa are Micronesians. All are administered by the Fijian Government. Its true that some parts of Fiji have a mixture of Mela-Poly blood but the first group that presented, Kadavu Island (where my village is), we were not influenced by the Tongans but most of us have brown skin. Also, if you do your research about the Pacific people, Mela-nesia means 'large islands', Micro-nesia means 'small islands' and Poly-nesia means 'many islands', So, it doesnt really matter if some parts of Fiji have black skin, brown and even white skin, our islands are large and bigger then most other islands of the Pacific, this makes us Melanesians. Besides, if you from Fiji, skin color doesn't really matter.
BoCi Polynesians wasn't the first on Fiji ^^. Where the fak did u hear that bullshit
Josevatz293 thank for telling Joe!! it sounded racist the way he said it
+Josevatz293 Who said that Polynesians was the first to arrive in Fiji???... Mata qori se sona??.. Kulina
brass my comment was to another comment before mine..looks like it was deleted i wasnt talking to you if i did i woulda said your name
If you didn't know the word "Melan" means dark skin. Get your facts right
What do you know about FIjian culture or dance? ... what confirmation you gathered from this clip to suggest that Fijians are Polynesians?
bula vinaka thanks great vid of rotuma iz fijian at heart lol.
whatever u think..but Fijians are proud of who they are and what they are known for despite their colour, religion or ancestral inheritance, we are different and our ways of doing things are unique compared to the rest of the pacific island and African nations and i i'm proud to be a Fijian...but appreciate your comparison
@lostislandchick ..all my neighbours sell "Kadavu Waka" only!...quite interesting though
(cont.) are ethnic groups. There is a big difference, and so much confusion between the two words in society (by society- I only speak of America, as that is my only experience). You should be proud of being from Figi! such a beautiful culture, but race should not take away from your pride. A person can be from Figi and black at the same time b/c the two are different. Just as I can be called black and from the DRC. And the cool thing is that those termed black come in so many different shades.
vinaka my brother we all family
u don't get me, its jst a simple definition...black is black, white is white and brown is brown...
Uh, most people who would be identified as black don't have black skin; they have brown skin. But black is an umbrella term that spans many different shades. There are African Americans, and people of other ethnic groups who are identified as black but some have light yellow skin. The same goes for those who are identified as white, and yes I have seen human beings with white skin.
mutu bula na weka....nomu liga nomu laga...manu dui tagi
Fijians are not black!!! They are brown.
maflelei Rotuma.....hahaha...vinaka Kadavu...
Fiji and Tonga have same Culture dace and blood. Rotuma I don't know lol
We are all pacific islanders only the vavalagi or papalagi called us mela, polly or micro shame on them to create a division among us , plis we stand together for our very tiny pacifika...gb all pacific islanders
well said ;-) ..
Mutu cola vina na turaga qwaqwa mai Kadavu, qi vo rogocia ni levu no na me era vo tagitagi no mai yata....hahaha cola tau.
Are you going to answer my question above?
@kaimara26076..both of you seem to have good discussions here. Tell me how Fiji is related to Melanesians..I mean which tribes??..Fiji is Melanesian but all the tribes in Melanesia are related.
ya Fiji is like mix....melanesian and lil bit of poly
noai'a e mak lele'......
Answer the question?
well vuaka samoan is independent and not ruled by white people whatsoever, and yet there are some famous samoan bloods out there that you might have heard of, and as far as our culture, tradition and christianity...those 3 things make us well known too, i have white people telling me here in Australia how awesome it is to be an islander, how people respect each other especially the youngsters to the elders...and most of these palagis do wish they were part of us...
There is no need of rude word. where in fiji you from?
u said: "be reminded that Fijans are brown skinned and NOT black".....so my mature adult sir....with all doo respect what the heck do you mean by "black" ? (note to self...will he get this or will i have to spell out his apparent contradiction)
malo rotuma...uro ga vei nomudou goneyalewa
farr dis is gun i like dis
im tongan but mayne dis is hektiks aye
Rotuma is Fiji like any other Islands in the country of Fiji. People who think that Fiji does not do Hula is wrong. Rotuma which an Island north of Fiji does the hula and so does the people of Rabi. I say this because I know my country more then people from any poly crap nonsense
The answer to that question lies within those countries themself. Why do you have to ask the question to someone who has not got a hint why these countries hatred the Fijians . May be .....!! because you are so knowlegeable and talented. Why dont you highlighted us?. But, that does'nt exclude Fiji from being Melanasians simply because those countries dont regarded them as wantoks or whatever !!
why do you forgot the Moluccan people?
i know you're trying to be pc but i think we are also all different! and thats what makes the world interesting!.. saying we're all the same is like stripping ppl of their identity and saying it's not ok to be diff but metaphorically i kno what u mean.. we all mean well and want the same things in general.. love, peace..etc
who is arguing? he said he knew them so as me. duh....!!
@ Hannah Smith.....do not claimed to be something you not.
@Junior Rex alias Tiloism...... Changing your username...hahahahahahaha
That sounds like a color complex that all people of different non-white ethnic groups suffer from. When people of different ethnic groups are identified as being black, it should be understood that not everyone under the umbrella term has black skin. Some African Americans who are called black have skin that is as light as a white person. I'm not AA but I know they don't like the word nigger b/c of its historical significance. I don't know if the same is true for Figi not liking the word black.
@Junor Rex Why you forcing this issue to other people? Our hate for the Fijans being Melanesians is unbelievable. Why do you hate the fijians so much?
@kaimara26076..hahahhahaha oh really...argue among yourselves!!
@MrCoconutislander....hahahahhhahaahahahhahaha..Imao..
Rotumans are Fijian and so as my kai, the Kadavuans. But the Lauans.....Mmmmm!!...not sure about them. I heard that tey are the descendants of Pontias Pilot.
please people i dnt think you all know your colors...there is no human on earth who is white in color with all due respect to my poly brothers and sisters..and be reminded that the Fijians are brown skin people and not black..
and as a samoan combined with bit of asians in my blood, i myself do not look at the melanesians any different, that's jst straight up racist, im with a mixed african and caucasian guy and our kids turned out looking brown,so yeah, it doesnt really matter what color our skin are, we are all considered humans and Adam and Eve are our first parents and maybe there's a reason why God colored us all different but one thing i know, we are all bros and sisters in God's eye n yet we're all equal..
I knew you will come out with something like that because you just dont know where you left your brain..!!!! May be still in ur little village i supposed.....hahahahahahahahaha
hahaha....se really!!!!!.........lol
@kols man..that's right. they are Polynesians..full stop
Melanesians are dark skin people and the fijians are.Google Melanesian zone and you will learn more from it.
@80TABS
Oi, Drau vosota Tau, e tacaqe na Yamequ
Ro Lala ga Na qaqa
@tilioism.... I did it below. The truth is that you just dont like the Fijians. I am a fijian and have no problems with the other Melanesian people. Who are "YOU".
sa maleka baci na meke... O)(O)(
hahhhahhahahahahahahaha.... may be bro.!!
bylelm tam....bida az ku.......a piszczy ...a jak pada to woda nie jest lazurowa a w morde szara bo cale gowno z ladu splywa i taka prawda jest he eh ehe a cfoki pija kawe i nie sa w stanie potem dupczyc bo spac chce sie im ha ha ah ..musialem za nich robote odwalac ale ilez tez mozna ?? Bylem 3 tyg i dalem dyla bo juz nic nie czulem procz smrodu i bulu....
Samoa and tonga are from fiji facts
@kaimara26076...hahhahahahahhahhahahhahahahahaha..Imao/...
what are you guys trying to say?? fijian are black?? fijians are dark coco you guys tongan samoan got same colour only in the lands,
u don't get me right..that is exactly what i'am trying to say..u confused child.
Society has a way of clumping all people of a certain race together, and marginalizing that race. So, I understand your hesitance at being called black. But even in Africa, each country has it's own unique culture. There are similarities that tie us together, as is true of the Pacific Islands, Samoa, etc- but there are enough differences to show a unique identity. Calling someone black or white is merely to show physical similarities. Fijian, African America, Congolese, etc aren't races but
@Fijihopeandglory..no men..Fijians are Polynesians...there is no prove that they are Melanesians
@kaimara26076...you got what you want from Hannah Smith...hahahhahahaha..Polynesians = Fiji
"a simple definition" ?...of what? lol
power to the brown skin....
@Fijihopeandglory..liar..prove it...you have no prove!