Calling Attention To Absurdity│Avatar The Last Airbender Vs Voltron: Legendary Defender
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ม.ค. 2025
- A short thought piece about a cool moment in Avatar and a not so cool moment in Voltron.
#AvatarTheLastAirbender #VoltronLegendaryDefender #ATLAvsVLD
Second channel: / @kross278
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Background music by Potsu:
I don't wanna: • i dont wanna
this reminds me of that one tumblr post that was like "maybe people on here pretend voltron is a good show because they miss avatar the last airbender"
That's what I say about The Dragon Prince verbatim
@@Kat-xy7fm TDP was made by ATLA people who didn't work on Korra. VLD was made by Korra people but no major players from ATLA.
So expectations should be pretty different, but in both cases they're way too high, even if TDP does turn out better.
I don’t think voltron was to bad.... it was ok some of it was good
@@Kat-xy7fm
The Dragon Prince is a mediocre show with a few good scenes.
wow okay that’s accurate
What Avatar is saying: haha more trouble is coming :)
What vld is saying: ignore our gaping plot holes :(
@sos sos Like what?
@sos sos Yeah, like what?
sos sos ʟᴍᴀᴏ u can’t even defend yourself
sos sos I’m waiting for a response 🤗
sos sos
Waiting on that response buddy
Short answer: Voltron used it to excuse their bad writing; ATLA used it to joke about their characters.
True
Thank You, I will be using this mindset for when I'm writing my own story.
Imo viewing avatar from sokkas perspective is how any person who was teleported in to the universe would act
We stan our warrior bun lad👏
@@lanatherana157 He is also a *Chad*
Hol Horse But his girlfriend became the moon .°(ಗдಗ。)°.
So you can make some splashes with magic, big deal!
Park ChimMin that’s rough buddy
I can't remember the episode, but in Season 7 of Voltron when the paladins are lost floating through space Keith says something to the effect of "are any of us even really friends?" and I remember being like damn... are they even friends? Because they did NOT develop these characters and their relationships at all, despite a major theme being found family. I was shocked that the writers would even include that line, and it did not come across the way I think they intended it to (at least to me). The complete opposite of ATLA, their relationships and characters were so fleshed out.
There were individual relationships. I could easily see Pidge and Hunk hanging out together after everything. Definitely Shiro and Keith. The rest of the cast? Eh. I couldn't see any of them hanging out with Lance ever again because he had nothing in common with anyone
@Zachle Mentor
Same! Season 3 was my breaking point bruv.
Imo most of the plot holes in Voltron and bad writing can be summed up to the writers being forced to cut the show where didn't want to, and cutting it early, and executives making story decisions they thought would make them more money.
@Zachle Mentor The original Voltron is so bad it's good. But it's still bad.
@@TexGaming nah, it can be summed up by writers being stubborn and not wanting to change their original story, even though their original story would have been trash
I'm surprised you didnt mention the fact that sokka is quite literally covering zuko's wanted poster during the scene which we only see after his line subtly breaking the fourth wall
I forgot that little detail. Show is over 10 year old and it's still amazing hehe.
Unfortunately, I feel like Lance's self doubt was NEVER addressed
I KNOW RIGHT!?! they did him so dirty :c they straight up were like "lol ur gf died go become a depressed flower farmer bye"
Neither was Shiro’s PTSD :(
My boi deserves better then what he was given
Yeah, the poor boy barley got any character development.
literally his only personality traits were being goofy and "in love" with allura. he deserved so much better
The only and I mean ONLY reason Voltron got such a fan base in the beginning was because it had interesting and diverse characters, and with that a lot of potential. But then the later seasons came, destroyed those characters and everything else but the fan base was already attached to the characters and that’s the only reason anyone even watched the last season.
I just wanted to know how everubody ended up and until this day I don't really know what happend. I'd have liked to see more about allura's powers. The only character we got to see a development was Keith, and that's probabilly why he's evryone's favorite, but in the end that development didn't lead to anything. The whole series had so much potencial, but whatever, I still like it lol
Nah, it only got a fanbase because of crazy shippers.
*cough* Klance *cough*
Galactic Jewels I came for the diversity, and that it had a similar animated style to ATLA
The characters were pretty stock.
I'm currently rewatching the show, too, and I'm also noticing single sentences that support/build their characters. One caught my eye in the Winter Solstice Part 1. Sokka says he doesn't want to stand by and do nothing while Aang is attacked by the spirit monster, and this ties into his backstory of being left behind when he wanted to fight with his father. It's a single sentence but it could only be said by him, not Katara or anyone else. You are so right--the writers took so much care in every single line, and it shows 10 years later! This show truly IS fantastic!
They really do understand how one point of a character's history can lead up to a point of revelation
I love de show so much 😭
The reason (if not one of them)why shows like Avatar is written well is because they're simple and not convoluted. The goal of our protagonist is the same throughout the series: Aang, with the help of friends and allies, must master all 4 elements so he can defeat the big bad fire lord and save the world. Then the writers proceed to develop their characters and the world they live in to portray its complex nature without complicating the main plot and their priorities for the show. For example, when they do add new characters and plot devices (e.g Toph and Azula in season 2), they are able to fit them into the main objective as an ally and/or foe and anything diverting them from the main plot is a chance to flesh them out as their own individual person and the story as a whole
(e.g n SPOILERS) like when Toph invented metal bending and how its development correlated with Guru's lessons to Aang about chakras.
Nowadays, tv shows tend to add a lot of concepts and themes to their story and at times diversify ongoing seasons from the initial plot, which isn't bad and quite beneficial, but the problem lies when they bite off more than they can chew and loss priorities on the main plot points and subjects in a show that at times would come of as half baked and underwhelming
well said! I agree!
The second meta joke reminds me of the Simpsons. *Homer:* It looks like the SImpsons are getting a horse *ComicBook Guy:* You have already gotten a horse in season 4 episode 6. Homer gets Lisa a pony and has to get a second job at the Kwiki Mart to Hilarious effect *Homer:* Does anyone care what this nerd thinks *Crowd:* NOOOOOOOOO
That's a problem I have with Korra. They had a new main goal/antagonist for each season. All the focus was on developing those new ideas instead of developing the characters. I have a love/hate relationship with LoK
@@haylied1265 Korra probably would've been considerably better I've they kept four seasons but the first two were for developing the first major antagonist. While seasons 3 and 4 develop the second major antagonist.
Basically two major antagonists over 4 seasons. Not a bad idea tbh.
@@saminates2002 I give the LoK writers a little bit of slack. When LoK was first greenlit it was only for one season, then when it did well Nick decided to order three more and then during season 4 Nick decided it didn't like LoK anymore and tried to kill it. So while I agree that LoK could have and should have been better I blame 70 percent of the issues on the studio.
Voltron had so much potential, and then everything crashed and burned
Have to disagree. Just because some fan service shipping didn’t happen doesn’t mean the series didn’t have a good ending
*but everything changed when the fire nation attack*
AnimeTechnoBlade 100 it wasn’t bad because of that though. The series had genuine problems especially in the last season.
@AnimeTechnoBlade 100 I mean...many people were much more disappointed in Voltron for more than "fan service shipping didn't happen" lol
It's okay if you thought the ending was good, I'm glad you enjoyed it. But for people like me, I disliked the last couple seasons. Some plot issues, characters making actions or going through changes that goes against who they are, the way Shiro's homosexuality was handled, etc etc. It had a lot of potential after the first two seasons, and honestly, I actually enjoyed the show (while fully acknowledging its flaws) up until season 7. Season 7 was eh, and while season 8 had its moments, it was just...kinda bad. And if you’d even bothered to watch the video, you would know that the reasoning many of us are disappointed in how Voltron ended goes so far beyond some stupid fan service shipping.
@@animetechnoblade1009 you do realise the show is straightup wasted potential right?
I dont remember these episodes from voltron, it only has 4 seasons right, weird
There is no season 8 in Ba Sing Se
It has 8
@@blackhole7909 Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's the joke going over your head
@@blackhole7909 no, it has 4
@@Sk8thud it has 8 seasons
every time i watch a video critiquing voltron im blown away at just how much was wrong with the show that i didnt notice. like i was very disappointed with the last few seasons, but that was also in the sense of "i hate what they're doing (or more accurately not doing) with the character arcs" but it seems just structurally it was disastrous too. Its such a weird feeling to me, but it does make me appreciate the fan works just that much more
I'm so disappointed in how Voltron after season 4/5 turned out. This example is a perfect show of why it didn't work. Thank's for talking about it!
Yeah I actually just finished Voltron yesterday after so many months of not watching it anymore and I have to say.. I was far less interested in the story compared to the first few seasons, which is a shame cuz it had so much potential
Yeah it’s really sad it could have been amazing but in the end Voltron became a Legendary Disappointment.
Ya I immediately dropped it after the whole clone bs because it felt weird and kinda like an ass pull
I have to disagree. Season 7 and Season 8 were great seasons to watch and amped the storyline. The only people who dislike them are the hard-core shippers who didn’t get the fan service they wanted in the end (particularly Klance shippers)
@@animetechnoblade1009 I thought Season 7 was great. Season 8 however was pretty weak, and that's not because I'm a Klance shipper, I was Lance/Alurra all the way (still salty about that btw). To me it just felt...I dunno lacking in some way.
Voltron had us in the first half ngl
This. This is the best comment I've read
@@jaden3898 Thanks
I hate how they made Lotor a villian when he is a complex character. He didn't even seem like a villian !! He wanted to actually change the universe. Yet the paladins didn't see this and decided to be a judge, jury, and executioner.
What makes it even more frustrating is that they decided to make Lotor a unsympathetic villain, and then the final season the writers revert back saying "Oh btw Lotor is actually a tragic character" Like WTF
Following up on the points made here in this thread of comments, I really, really disliked how he ostracized his teammates.
It would have been nice to see them stay fighting by his side to show how that he earned their loyalty and is a nice reflection of Team Voltron. Instead, the show made him just insult his teammates which just caused them to abandon him.
Lotor when he was first introduced: Im a bad guy lol
Lotor in season 5: Im actually a good guy
Lotor in season 6: Nah actually, im a bad guy again
Wtf, i was honestly quite happy when Lotor became an ally to the paladins but NOOOO, they had to fcked this up
I felt like Allura was way to quick to say Lotor was a liar after he helped her learn of the altaen alchemy after thinking her whole race was killed off you'd think she'd question where the altaen girl (forgot her name) came from and be in a state of confusion
@@Dontedreadedup
Well, that was because she trusted Keith's word over Lotor's
And this is why shows like Avatar: The Last Airbender will be remembered as being great through and through.
And why Voltron will be remembered as a show that...started great...
Why ATLA is great:
IROH
I have sooo many respects for that man. If he was my uncle, I brew him tea everyday!
Do you have Ginseng tea? It's my favorite! -- Iroh
yeah!!!
Leaves from the vine
Iroh is one of the best characters in all of media. Change my mind.
We all need an Iroh, not only in media but also in our lives
“A show calling attention to its own absurdity”
My brain: *plays the entirety of the Ember Island Players episode in five seconds*
Any mention of Voltron and INSTANTLY I get war flashbacks... Both the show and the fandom crashed and burned s o badly..
God same. We don’t talk about that show anymore 💀
The biggest thing I have against it was the shipping. Sometimes I think that seasons 7 and 8 happen just to spite the klance shippers.
Sup I’m here and still I’m the fandom
Mainly because I finally got into watching the show during quarantine cause my friends wouldn’t stop recommending it
Now I love it
I’m on season 6 but I know what happens afterwords
They did Lance dirty how dare they
Burt Macklin FBI First rule of Voltron, we don’t talk about Voltron.
I think the fandom led to the show's downfall
Tbh I remember watching the first two seasons of Voltron, being like ‘woah, this is good!’ And then I waited like a year for some reason or another, and all of a sudden there were eight seasons
Samee lol
LMFAOOOO
My favorite "absurd" moment from Avatar was when they learned the Earth King had a bear and the entire show ground to a halt for 5 minutes as the characters struggled to grasp this concept.
I forgot about that 😂
I hated the Earth King. Someone so oblivious in charge. You really did not need to be as smart as his advisor to usurp the king.
This is why i prefer shows tht has characters who drives the plot in a given setting rather than the plot driving them. It enhances character personality which most shows fails to deliver, i feel
This exactly!! Shows that use plot to drive the show and not build strong characters is a problem I’ve seen in a lot of cartoons and anime, and it’s hard to get into it for me. Avatar is so strong in this and that’s why it excels, I think
I’m watching a show right now that feels like they plotted it out, then had to give the characters reasons to get to the next plot point. Characters make weird choices to push the story, vs the characters moving organically to the next logical conclusion, like avatar.
@@golden.fire.princess9653 totally! I loved anime but anime these days (other than aot, isayamas a genious, i feel) just doesnt fit with me bc of this haha
@@OctoberLotus oh my! Care to share what ure watching? I feel like im deprived of good shows lately aha
Voltrons creators knew they had messed up and didn’t care so they just tried to throw things in to make it seem interesting. In actuality they hurt many fans. My bbys deserved better :’(
yeah allura dies along with keith and lances relationship but hey lance becomes a farmer
Nina Shah a fxckin farmer....he deserved so much
I was actually thinking of these two shows and comparing them, lol.
The problem with Voltron is that they made the plot entirely too intricate. There was always something added to the lore or the back stories. This left little to no development for the characters (outside of Keith, which is unfair because they could have done so much with everyone, Allura especially). Because of this, Voltron had plot holes, unfinished arcs, and failed to wrap everything up. Essentially, they wrote themselves into a corner.
A lot of people don't get how truly simple ATLA's plot was. Yes it had lore and its own twists, but it stayed the same throughout. A boy with extraordinary powers chosen to defend the world against dictatorship with his friends. It focused more on the characters. The development of the characters develops the plot. And hate it or love it, She-Ra took a page out of Avatar's book and made their finale something worth watching. She-Ra excelled where Voltron did not
@@flightofthestars
Oh, thanks! I like VLD too still, but they just didn't know how to balance characters and plot like ATLA and SPOP
I get war flashbacks whenever someone mentions Voltron and then I remember my google icon has been Krolia for the past three years
I legit always forget my pfp is Voltron related because I've had it so long and keep forgetting to change it
same.
i'm too lazy to change my profile pic. its been lance looking done for almost two years now
@@EvolverForU your pfp is basically me when I watched voltron and getting hate from the voltron fandom
lmao mine was Pidge from that D&D episode for what felt like forever. I only remembered to change it a few months ago I belive.
GIRL same mine is shiro lmaooo
The ATLA line feels like a fun, organic joke.
The Voltron line feels like a defensive comment from the writers to cover up their mistakes.
They could have gone without it, honestly
I really like the small little review. It’s pretty nice to have a little bite sized analysis. Also maybe you should watch The Dragon Prince. It has this ATLA feel and is even co-created by the head writer of ATLA. Even though the animation is a bit choppy it does get better later on.
The animation especially got better in Season 3. Good God there were some beautiful scenes in that season. Also patiently waiting for Netflix to announce Season 4 seems like they've announced a new season for so many of it's animated shows but the Dragon Prince.
@@ryushin6 Aaron Ehasz said on twitter very recently that the team is still working hard but there isnt a confirmed date yet if that helps any. Just feels good to know it isnt forgotten lol
@@ebaygarfield8356 didn't it come out that they were already allowed to make the whole show after season 2 and were only pretending that they needed to be renewed for more seasons? or was that voltron...
It has an interesting world with a history I'd love to know more about, but everything else, from writing to pacing to character interactions to plot progression is. Questionable. The setting is great but the show itself is bad, and every moment that isn't on worldbuilding is agonizing to get through. Any actual analysis on it is going to end up picking apart all of the plot holes, backtracking, rewriting, time wasting, shallow and inconsistent character writings, and the blatant nerdboy self-insert shenanigans (including "strong female" girlfriend to act as his mother because if he wasn't wildly and uncharacteristically incompetent at times then he'd just be a mary sue with no chemistry with his manic pixie dream mom).
Even saying all that, I've seen every episode because the world of the story is capable of carrying it through how godawful the story itself is.
@@Kat-xy7fm While I do agree that these problems are within the first season I do think that it does improve from there. I really like how the two princes' arcs parallel each other even though they should technically be enemies. I do agree with the pacing issues. A lot of info is given between separate story cars in the same episode. But I feel like more episodes would be able to flesh everything out a bit. Overall I think Dragon Prince is a really fun watch, even though the show handles themes such as death and the stages of grief through the main cast. But I am curious to see your thoughts.
Avatar gave me a childhood and voltron ripped it away
To me my favorite season of voltron is season two and season six. But season seven and season eight are horrible
is it sad that its the same here
Why? Because your hardcore shipping didn’t come to be?
ATLA may have better writing but Voltron is still a wonderful show to watch from start to finish
@@aaronjohnson1286 Season 7 actually started out pretty bad but became good, although season 8 was bad
@@animetechnoblade1009 man s7 ending was just beautiful and s8 was just 🥵
Would now be a good time to bring up how Shiro’s arc was never resolved? he still had ptsd and never got better. And he never even got a family or anything about them. Anyways ATLA is a far better show.
He even get married with a total stranger for us lol. They really didn't wanted to show us people he loved, did they? Long live to ATLA
Of course he had a 'family'. Remember the love of his life that he's never spoken about to anyone that immediately dies offscreen after the one flashback where we see him. Such a memorable character.
Dumbledoresarmy13 you mean the love of his life who he broke up with because said love of his life wanted him to give up on his dreams
FINALLY! Someone said it. Shiro's character was something I was excited to learn about, especially after the end of Season 2 (the last great season of voltron). The show portrayed him as the perfect leader, but since no one is perfect, we should've actually got to know him a lot better. We didn't. Where's his backstory? His story of becoming one of the most respected people on Earth? His story of his relationship with Adam and his sexuality? His struggles and all the torture he endured while captured? HIS FUCKING PTSD THAT NEVER GOT BETTER? No, the writers made him completely useless after Season 2. Such a shame.
I love that Avatar is being the talk of the town again.
Voltron? What's that? And why does it smell like trash?
Maybe because it is
And this time, instead of a Zutara/Kataang ship war, we just have a bunch of Zukka shippers.
Avatar is overrated
@@kayleighannaoconnor6904 i don't care about the ships. If it is not a shit show like Voltron, I'll watch it.
@@stefon815 i kinda don't wanna disagree with you, but the show really does get tons of praise - doesn't mean most of it is underserved, i'd say that i personally don't like certain moments, i find a lot of times when Aang is in the avatar state to be exaggerated, especially when he uses some of that multi-voice stuff that happens occasionally, but it doesn't take away from the wonderful story, character arcs, animation and design, voice acting, and absolutely incredibly choreographed fight scenes.
IIRC this trope is called "Lampshading" there are several methods of doing this. Tvtropes has an excellent article on it, in fact their logo is inspired by this trope.
I FINALLY got caught up with Voltron thanks to Quarantine. I fell off a few years ago and never found the time to catch up. I literally just finished the final episode of season 7 last night. Not gonna go any further cause every fan that I know has told me to not bother with season 8. The general consensus is, it's not worth it. Honestly, I'm just gonna check out your 2 hour video analysis of it and skip to the part about season 8. Anyways, I'm biased towards ATLA. It's legit one of my all time favorite shows. I didn't grow up with Voltron. I don't know "the lore". I didn't have any sort of attachment to that universe going in. So, I honestly don't know if they did a disservice to the characters, universe or anything like that.
For the most part, I genuinely enjoyed the show. The first 6 seasons were solid in my opinion. It kinda started to fall apart around the end of season 6 for me. Just not fan of the way Lotor was handled towards the end that's all. Went from interesting villain, to sympathetic character/villain to straight up generic villain. And the first half of season 7 was SO hard to get through. So much cringe. It was kinda "saved" in the second half with The Earth invasion arc but the first half just left a bad taste in my mouth. Felt like 2 COMPLETELY different seasons. I still think it's a solid show. But nowhere near on the same level as ATLA.
Indeed, int he begining of season 7 I was like "wtf" and then "Oh good, Earth is taken, that's what I'm talking about" and then season 8 just returned to the "wtf" kkkkk
I love how you compared these small little moments but they wound up clearly showing how the differences in consistent writing and continuity are what make avatar good and Voltron very flawed.
Not to mention the Ember Island Players episode. That's essentially a distrack disguised as a recap and it's done spectacularly.
Things that Voltron NEVER addressed:
-Shiro's disease and PTSD.
-Keith almost sacrificing himself to save a mission
-Pidge and Hunk making fun of Lance for being worried about Allura
-Keith's father name
-Lance's lack of self confidence in season 3-7
-Lance being called an idiot for like ten times in one episode
- Keith's "Are we even friends?" line in season 7
-How altean alchemy works
-Lance's arc.
-Lotor and Allura's unnecessary death
-The whole shiro clone nonsense and basically never being mentioned again
-Keith and Shiro not interacting for like two season
Everytime I stumble across these analysis videos, I always think: Voltron wasn’t bad, what are you talking about?
Then I remember I stopped after the first 2 seasons to preserve my sanity.
This is a good video, but you forgot one very important part of Sokka's personality.
He's SASSY.
@1:45 the easy anwser; in avatar it supports the story; in the whole context of where they are and the character katara normally has the logical conclusion would be sokka gets his way...but as the show is unlike its sequal serial they HAVE to go into that town and see firebenders, so the begruding agreement with mention that "they will get into an adventure" is a promiss that will get a resolution...in your vortex example is just a statement of facts, which also to way to many words, when stating the obvious you need to rely on your public filling in the memories context and predictions rather then simply tell them, people like to feel smart and thats what the scene in avatar does; it gives an easy associative source for people to remember their joyful imagination and people are generally content with them self
I feel like the big huge difference between the lines is that
Voltrons was like: haha, remember this? Don't. It's over now. Also none of the characters care because they're idiots.
while Avatar was like: haha, remember this? you should 'cause hijinks are incoming ;) and Sokka is a good team mate, always sticking with his idiot friends because he cares, even if he wont say it outright
Just so you know, Avatar was *re*released on netflix.
It was on there several years ago as well.
*sigh* yeah. Voltron really was disappointing. I guess it’s also a good time to pick up ATLA again since it’s been a while. Maybe I might turn into a fan this time.
Can this question have an answer?
"fan this time" ? you didn't like it the first time?
Lala Land I liked it, but I just watched in passing at that time.
imo, voltron is lacking time for characters to breathe, interact and grow their relationship without the flashy action stuff
I love how we are now at the point of quarintine where someone will make a video about literally 1 line from two different shows, the video will be 7 minutes long and thousands of of the internet squad will watch it. Or maybe it's because it's about Avatar...
Can you do an expanded video regarding cartoon/shows being meta because I feel more modern examples have been using it real poorly to seem clever basically “hey I’m pointing out all my flaws so that means I’m exonerated from them”
Digibro already did
Gumball is the worst offender of meta jokes tbh
MajesticBoy YT yeah but I can give them somewhat a pass since it’s a comedy show so they don’t have to take themselves to seriously but this is more regarding serious shows with an overall story to them
Kross oh really can you send a link or title
@@christopherauzenne5023 agreed, although I hated gumball after they started doing meta jokes, there are still worse shows that try to be meta
I've never really watch Netflix Voltron, but the one thing that always jumps out to me about it throughout everywhere it's discussed is how no one, absolutely no one within the fandom, ever mentions any of the previous shows. Sure classic Voltron is cheesy but it also shares that and the same badass factor that Power Rangers has, the Nickelodeon series was also genuinely good and was a canonical continuation of the original series, anyone who liked Netflix Voltron should genuinely go check it out.
I've searched the old show but couldn't find it. Do you know any where I can watch it?
Unpopular Opinion: I still love Voltron! It’s one of my favorite shows and I love all seasons (even the 8th season) Honestly, I don’t understand why people don’t like the 8th season. Personally, I had nothing wrong with it at all. But oh well everyone has their opinions and I will respect them.
What made avatar work is that the writers took time and care to fully develop something...they didn’t just have ideas they thought those ideas through, and knew exactly how they were going to do them...they did what a lot of shows no longer do, they took advantage of the season length of their shows to flush out and set down their ideas and then develop them, whereas many shows now like star vs forces of evil or Steven universe make up the plot and ideas as they go along leaving many unfinished, falling flat etc.
They not only were able to take time to establish the rules of the world, character development, but they were also able to allow some episodes to be self contained while others having season long serial format
one of the few shows that has ever done that well...
Seeing how Voltron almost instantly made its way into my heart, it just depresses me to read the comments here basically just bruning and flaming Voltron for being bad, instead of just enjoying the comedy... Why am I even still here...
This!!! I totally agree with you, it also made its way in my heart but it’s sad how people are talking bad about Voltron. Yes I can agree with some of them but just enjoy the show 😔
(Ik I’m four years late but I just want to say I totally agree with you)
I feel like it's important to note that sokka's line is an observation, which allows the creators to say yeah we know it's ridiculous as well. Meanwhile Romelle is asking a question as the audience, and if a satisfactory answer is not given then it ultimately leaves a bad taste. One has the creators winking at the audience, while the other simply tries to be self aware.
Voltron will always have a special place in my heart just as Avatar has. They've both really helped me mentally so I will never think of them as bad.
This brought back so many memories I had forgotten about, I now know why I kept getting flashbacks to glance when I saw sokka and zuko in scenes together lmfao, what a terrible terrible time
that line in voltron is literally there to signal "hey we couldn't find a good segue, so take this as a sign that we're just starting something new"
Rewatching Avatar recently I have come to the same conclusions. You can really tell that the creators loved and deeply understood each of the characters. I agree that it feels like in each scene, event, and dialogue, the writers asked themselves what every character would be thinking and feeling. This is what makes them such loveable characters that feel so incredibly real.
Yo, I actually usually like your reviews. And even those I dont like or agree with have things I do end up considering.
So yeah, glad I found your channel.
This was a perfect comparison. Thank you
When Romelle says that she is not speaking as a character in the story and she's not speaking about the characters in the story. She's talking about executive intervention in the development of the story. Intervention that happened because someone saw opportunities to milk the cash cow and wouldn't let it go.
comparing AtLA to VLD is like comparing Captain America to Rickon Stark. like, come on.
Avatar is always a good example when it comes to cartoons. It can do no wrong
That Voltron line totally baffles me because, well... our heroes essentially murdered one of their own in his sleep to steal his body because they decided that clones aren't people.
The clone was still very much alive, this is both said and shown multiple times, yet the real Shiro tells the audience to think of the clone as a "thing," and Allura goes It's Free Real Estate on him, and they all cheer. Even though most of them knew the clone for longer than they knew the real Shiro, and even though they just fought Lotor because harvesting people is wrong. They even call Kuron an evil villain afterwards, even though both the story and Word Of God made it clear that he was innocent, didn't even know he wasn't the real Shiro, and only betrayed the team because Haggar mind-controlled him against his will.
S7E1 would have been the perfect chance to address that. Maybe have the characters pull out some pseudoscience reason why they couldn't save Kuron (despite having both healing pods and healing magic) and show them being sad over that loss of a comrade. Maybe say that the two essences merged together like in a Dragon Ball fusion so the heroes saved both Shiros. Maybe have Kuron and Shiro talk within the body and find closure.
Instead, they doubled down on othering and discarding the clone. Later on they flat out confirm they killed him, and it's played as a joke.
You should make a video on the Ember Island Players episode, it's a great "calling attention to absurdity"
Both ending made me cry but Avatar made happy cry while Voltron made me angry and sad cry
A problem that i never had with with avatar but have with a lot of other media is the fact that sometimes the show doesn't give a fuck about its own rules, even when avatar does some shit that break its own rules, the explanation provided (where some doesn't even to bother to explain the rule break) makes sense with the universe. Like Aang removing Fire Lord's Bending.
Remember the screen wrters of Avatar TLAB are the same Writer of the Dragon Prince. you can see similar great wiring in the Dragon Prince
I really love the atla but to be honest I never got into the dragon prince. I tried but after every episode I just rolled my eyes.
If voltron ended at season 6 like it should’ve we wouldn’t have this problem ✨
Avatar, the greatest cartoon to exist and destroyed the media in the process.
The other reason the line works so well and it barely noticeable as a break in the 4th wall is because it fits with Sokka's character. He has been making snarky/sarcastic comments like this since the beginning, so you don't think twice when he does it here. If someone else had said this, it would be incredibly jarring.
The way I like to describe comparisons like this in TV writing is "writing for your plot vs writing for your characters." Voltron's writing was constructed for its plot. The priority of each episode was to get the story from one plot point to another, and the characters were used as vessels to carry out the writers' intended arcs. This isn't an inherently bad thing, but the strategy definitely has more potential for inauthentic/out of character moments (as seen in the video). With Avatar, however, the dialogue was designed for the characters first and for plot second. The dialogue of the show is prioritized in a way that takes each character's specific feelings into account according to their set personalities. Characters in Avatar respond to events as if they were real people in those scenarios, not as if their personalities only exist to benefit the viewer's understanding of the show. In order to move their plot along, writers for Avatar didn't force their characters to act according to plot necessitated, but rather REACT according to the world and given circumstances of the story, which automatically makes the characters feel more real, tangible, and believable.
At this point I'm convinced that someone can make a video essay for each line in avatar
The Voltron line also has the problem that its intended to tell the audience, “We know you want an end, and it should have ended by now but we are still going to keep going” It actually draws your attention to the fact that any normal show with a predetermined endpoint(like Avatar) would have ended by now, we bet the big twist villain, we saved a main character’s life and gave everyone a happy ending and we sacrificed in a way where it is clear we can’t have a pointless season of undoing the sacrifice.
I love Romell. Reminds me of Serena from Sailor moon. But ya Avatar is an amazing work of written art. Currently rewatching the Avatar last Airbender Series on Netflix. It’s still amazing 😊😊 I loved Voltron but it was rushed or simply destroyed by the written. I love that Romell is aware of this and she speaks my mind in this line. I’m ashamed in how Voltron ended. It was like all the build up and character growth was ruined. And characters changed for the worse and didn’t follow their own character personality. I wish they could redo the last season.
y'all can't compare this masterpiece with whatever voltron was.
This reminds me of the days of hoping Lance's character development would be taken seriously, and they would reveal him to be bisexual, and he'd re-evaluate his insecurities, realizing his insecurities relating to Keith were attraction and realizing he needed to change himself in other ways to keep himself from continuing being insecure about things he did not need to be insecure about.
Ahh, those were the days... before we found out that all of Lance's problems would be fixed by harassing a girl into dating him, and then all his problems just floating away...
.
Little FAQ, since there's a lot of replies here!
*Q:* This is fanservice.
*A:* Not really a question, but yes, it is! It’s a headcanon of mine that I had about four years ago.
*Q:* How did Lance “harass” Allura?
*A:* Well, harassment is a bit too strong, but I didn’t know what other word to replace it with, and I thought it fit better than anything else I could say (plus I was over-exaggerating/summarizing a little, like how I didn’t write my headcanon to the exact detail I had it laid out in my head four years ago). From what I remember, there was flirting that made Allura very uncomfortable/annoyed many times, and I think a couple of instances of unwanted touching, but that’s a little more hazy than the flirting. It’s debatable whether it should be considered harassment, but if someone I lived with constantly flirted with me despite my visible (and expressed) discomfort, I might consider it harassment.
*Q:* Are you saying straights are bad?
*A:* No, obviously not. I’m not an SJW, I do, infact, like straight people, and think they are wonderful people, besides the few bad apples. There are bad apples in every group, including LGBT+.
*Q:* What do you actually think about klance?
*A:* Love it, my favorite ship. I would’ve loved to see it actually developed in canon, but it wasn’t something I would’ve expected or really wanted in the show.
*Q:* What do you think about Allurance?
*A:* Allura started having a crush on him within a few days. Then he asked her out on day two of her starting to crush on him. Then they started cuddling and kissing on day three or something. It was just so quick and forced, and his insecurities were never addressed after he started dating Allura. Like, he suddenly was this completely carefree person, like he no longer had this deep character flaw that made him interesting and relatable. It was just bad writing, and I think it could have been avoided completely if they had never promised an end relationship for Lance. I would’ve liked the show way better if they hadn’t sacrificed their characters’ personalities and flaws for “fan service”. Throughout all the seasons, Allura showed no interest until the end of the last season (and very little, platonic-looking, sympathy in an earlier season as well, I believe). It was just so forced, and it was very disappointing. I would’ve been okay with it, if from the moment they met, Allura showed she wasn’t interested, and continued to throughout the show., until he last season, at least.
*Q:* That's some Grand Canyon wide reaching. Make sure you stretch and limber up first.
*A:* Not a question, but that’s a good one, lmao. I did have some rather conspiracy theory-like headcanons lol.
*Q:* this comment is everything regarding rabid voltron fans
*A:* Again, not a question, but I’d still like to address it. Rabid? Rather strong word, lol. But yeah, my headcanon was quite a stretch, and I wanted to see many changes and plots that the show was unwilling to explore.
*Q:* You don’t know what shipping is do you?
*A:* I actually do. I know this wasn’t directed at me, but this was a little excessive, don't you think? I think if someone is talking about a ship, they probably know what shipping is.
*Q:* Sheith?
*A:* Keith called Shiro his brother twice, and they met when Shiro was a teacher and Keith was like twelve. This makes me uncomfortable, which is why I don’t respond to Sheith shippers. Sometimes this group of shippers makes me uncomfortable. Shiro shipped with any of the paladins makes me a bit uncomfortable, but I’m still not gonna harass them or call them pedos or people who like incest or something.
*Q:* Let it go.
*A:* Again, not a question, but it's been said a couple times. What makes you think I haven’t? Lmao, this is just a little amusing because a lot of people replying seem to be more involved in Voltron still than I do. I know this is gonna warrant more replies, but like, I just never thought the only harassment I’d get for being a klancer would be way after I left the fandom, lmao.
This is literally just fan service wrapped in one comment....
How did he harrassment allura into dating him? Just because he doent turn out to be bisexual and in love with Keith, doesnt mean that he was harassing allura because straights are bad
Homez18 Allura was never interested in him. Outright rejected him. Not really talked about for seasons, no interactions suggesting a budding attraction. Then completely changed her mind in the last season. Nothing led up to it. Keith had many moments with Lance that could be interpreted as having romantic tension. The problem isn’t that Klance didn’t happen. The problem is that Allurance happened out of nowhere with nothing preceding it to allow the audience to feel a connection. A lesson I learned in a creative writing course I’m in right now is about “earned surprises”. The Stuff of Fiction: Advice On Craft, page 80, last paragraph. Paraphrased here. “Earned surprises don’t come out of nowhere. They grow from the narrative’s soil. They emerge from the context of the story’s events and the characters’ personalities. They make a fictional moment individual and credible. Maybe even making it seem- not predictable, which is narrative’s worst sin- but inevitable, which is its highest virtue.” Lance and Allura, prior to the episode that forced them together, did not once seem inevitable. When it happened, it did not feel credible. “Harassed” is certainly a strong word, one I wouldn’t agree with based on what I remember, but that misuse doesn’t change the fact that certain characters’ development was ignored and Allurance was thrown in with no foreshadowing in any of its prior 7 seasons. I know some shipped them, but most were never given reason by the show to do so. So it didn’t feel investing and felt a little like a middle finger to the many people who shipped Klance.
That's some Grand Canyon wide reaching. Make sure you stretch and limber up first
Homez18 Allura doesn’t seem interested or having fun of Lance’s attention to her. She was kinda forced by her friends to go to the date with him in season 8 and the fact she joined Lotor, the character she has actual interest in, to the afterlife when given the chance.
IMO, one of the best ways the Avatar series tastefully was able to transition narrative is in episode one of Legend of Korra. At the end of TLA, the last question asked was where Zuko's mother went. When Jinora asks Katara that same question in Korra, she's quickly interrupted by Ikki goofing around and Korra's frustrations, which in that moment tells the watcher that "this is Korra now, time for a new narrative".
Compare that to Hunk's dismissive response to a similar narrative shift, and the two feel worlds apart.
I feel like Voltron’s scene would have been better had he not said, ‘These guys like to move on,’ but rather said this - “We all have to learn when to move on.”
Watching Hunk's response again, it occurred to me that he might just be a stand in for the creators. Who clearly just like "moving on" to weirder, less coherent story arcs without ever cleaning up the previous ones.
I honestly knew something would go wrong from the start, they desperately tried to imitate avatar and last time we fell for this Came legend of korra! Maybe if C.N get avatar instead this wouldn't have happened
Voltron started out so strong... I _love_ the main cast, and it was so sad to watch it crash and burn...
This dude out here making a whole ass video out of 2 sentences, gotta respect the struggle
It’s weird seeing this because i used to be in voltron fandom and now I’m in ALTA fandom-
Comparing any show to ATLA, you know they are going to lose no in any way no matter what.
1:16
i get your point . she overthink an obvious problem that doesn't feels like natural thing to say . unlike also sokka is the brain of the group and the logical one . it part of his character to say something like that . keep in mind . this is not the first time he call something absurd . in earlier episode , the "fortune teller" he point it make sense how someone can rely on unrelated thing to make up the future . like pointing out to someone that got told by the fortune teller that will find true love if he were some shoes . that guy now have these same shoes on all the time . sokka point obviously he will find true love if he wear them everyday .
Don't worry Voltron, I still love you. Not the very final ending but I still enjoyed it all.
That's some excellent analysis
I had to learn not to despise the show/characters within it, and realize that it's whoever is making it that shows its' problems. After season 3 of VLD, I kept thinking "who's writing this script??"
10sec summary-it is in character for Avatar while break character for Voltron
Voltron was good at first then it started to fall apart . I was late to the fandom and I got on the show bc of quarantine . The first 2 seasons had me hooked and I was staying up nightly blatantly enjoying the show . Then as soon as it got to season 4 that enthusiasm went downhill . In my honest opinion Voltron had so much potential, and it just crashed in burned. And the fact that FAN FICTIONNN is better than the last seasons Is sad .
Any time I hear or see mention of Voltron anywhere it makes me want to cry. I hope that it gets another reboot. What would be awesome is if Dreamworks could do for Voltron what was done for FMA with Brotherhood. (that's not to say that FMA'03 was anywhere near as disappointing or broken as Voltron: Legendary Defender, but I think it's undeniable, especially considering the movie finale, that Brotherhood's ending was an upgrade.)
Conclusion: ATLA is a great show, Voltron fucked up Dreamworks’ reputation, and She-Ra had to fix it
Its kinda weird since I do like avatar, but I didn't see it as kid, so when anyone is talking about how much effort the writers must have put into show to make it near ultimate perfection, I'm like "Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaah sure, no rose colored glasses at all no nope not at all" :p I mean don't get it wrong I'm sure they did put lot of effort into it, but I think its easy to overestimate amount of thoughts creators put into stuff you liked.
Like I know that some of avatar's writers WERE perfectionists, but still, hearing about their ideas for what the hypothetical fourth book would have been like is weiiiiiiird :p
ShadowoftheMask I grew up watching avatar, and while the show is amazing, after rewatching it I found a bunch of stuff that didn’t really age well. Or things that I thought were amazing were really weirdly paced, like aang’s ability to take away bending. I also rewatched legend of korra and that show does have its glaring problems but I don’t think ppl give it enough credit.
As someone who did grow up watching Avatar, and still thinks it's amazing, and attributes it to being a major influence... Yeah, it's not perfect. And if my time as an English Major and dissecting texts has taught me anything at all, it's that it is super easy to come to conclusions of what the texts means that the original author probably never thought of or would have cared to. Avatar IS still an amazing show, and for as much as some of the jokes aren't as good as I remember, that it does so much so well and better than many of it's contemporaries is likely why it is so lauded.
I'm also really glad that fourth season never happened, because... the show's already as good as it can be, don't do anything to potentially ruin that.
@@candycane4419 What felt poorly aged to you? I'm just curious because watching back through I feel like there's some things that don't sit quite right with me so I'd like to know your thoughts.
I'm pretty sure the 4th book wasn't actually a thing
Candy Cane I think it’s kinda weird they didn’t introduce Aang’s ability to take away bending or never even mentioned such a thing before. Like, yes, they foreshadowed the lion turtles back in season one, so I’m thinking it truly may have been planned from the beginning, but typically they’ll drop tidbits (like how they demonstrated Iroh lightning bending), so part of me thinks they never mentioned it because it was supposed to be kind of a “twist” that they didn’t want anyone to figure out. But I’ve no clue. Either way, for as much as I adore the show, that kinda struck me as iffy
That’s what happens when you focus on plot and forget about character growth.
Some people think of lotor as an azula and was always evil but in reality he has much more in common with zuko. Being shunned by their dad trying to prove themselves worthy and lets be honest both had alot of internal conflict.. zuko had iroh thank goodness, hey, even keith was like lotor both being half gulra and having internal conflict but keith had shiro early on.. lotor had no guidance. I mean his mom wasnt sane and his father looked at him as a weakling because he actually befriended other races rather than having a superiority complex. Both zuko and lotor were favored by their mothers aswell..as soon as lotor tried to make a plan to change things(not saying it was the best way) nope you're automatically a villain.. like when Allura was told of his his plan you'd think seeing her thought to be dead race would be more of a shocker to her, most people would've been in state of not knowing who to trust..on one hand you have a close friend coming back with my race thought to be long dead, on the other hand i have this person who seems to be helping you and went the extent to save me from death by his father by killing him whom at this point you're starting to trust... the judgment was too fast, she didnt even seem to wonder she just outright went at lotor no thought. They should've had atleast 2-3 episodes of Allura trying to figure out what was going on and who to trust. Lotor could've atleast made a better villain/anti hero and impact this way.. instead the creators rushed it
Vtld was good in its own right i wouldn't personally hold it up to avatar overall as whole because avatar will outshine it just about every time but it definitely shared similarities and vibes
I think as an avatar community we all need to pull together like the 4 nations at the end of the war. I think we need a new avatar animated series of some kind. Let’s start a petition and get thousands to sign. Please talk about this, help the community.
I feel a major difference between the ATLA and Voltron bits shown here is that ATLA only uses a single, short line and moves on, while Voltron stops everything else to go over multiple plot points for at least 10 seconds. ATLA is concise and doesn't dwell on the absurdity it's poking fun at, nor does it draw attention to the fact it's drawing attention to it's own absurdity, which flows much better
Voltron *was* a great show, with a great premise, and it was looking to be a great reboot (they are in scarcity unfortunately). That was up until it was thoughrally dashed, smashed, obliterated, I could go on.
*how they managed to fuck up so badly I will never know*
What are you talking about... I can't remember any of these sences there were only 3 seasons
I loved Voltron at first but when shiro gave keith the black lion i liked it imo but keith doesn’t progress at all but everyone else does they had mad potential but failed deeply
So, there's this video on TH-cam that I watched a while back that sort of explains why Voltron's plot crashed and burnt. This is unconfirmed information (but I think it's pretty solid reason).
The original plot states that Shiro is permanently dead, as in he did not come back to join the paladins anymore, and will never return. But, who ever it was probably the studio(It is not confirmed but speculated) , told the team, that makes Voltron to change the whole story. Why would they let a character who's meant to die live? Because of money(speculated), because Shiro is the most favourite character.
So they had to plastered Shiro's character into Keith's. To explain it simply, remember those scenes where Shiro talked to Lotor, and helping him? All of those actions are actually meant for Keith, for him to relate himself to Lotor, both are half Galras, and for Keith's character growth. Not Shiro, he is meant to die at that fight with Zarkon. But since they need to fit Shiro in somewhere they put Shiro into Keith's position.
I didn't binge watch it on Netflix when it first released....
I binge watched it a month before on BluRay!
When they put Avatar on Netflix I remember the voltron fandom was tryna start something saying Zuko copied Keith's design. Like ??? Do they not know Avatar came out 6 years before voltron or? Now I remember why I left the voltron fandom. The only ones left are toxic tbh.