Timestamps for ease of navigation Introduction: 0:00 Main Titles 1:32 The Hardcover - size, binding,jacket, covers, flaps, endpapers, 1:42 The Singles - front and back covers, Kitchen SInk and Fantagraphics history, David Bowie 5:03 The SIngles - the endpapers 8:21 The Singles - the before and after portraits 9:31 The Singles vs the Hardcover - Blacks Battle 11:24 A Tangent 12:12 Back to the Blacks , A Side-by-Side Comparison 12:26 The Singles - the 12 Monologues 13:32 The Singles - A Secret Ending? (SLIGHT SPOILER): 16:25 Conclusion (SPOILERS OVER) 18:35
Nowhere in the depth of the internet there is a comparison between hardcover and the tpb.i had no knowledge of the subtle differences and omg the backcovers look so beautiful and the color does add something. Ty for this P. S. I love the anticlimatic ending without the blurb
I'm so glad you enjoyed this video! Isn't it interesting how even these small and 'outside of story' details can make a difference? As for the ending, it could maybe even be said that the extra text makes it even more anticlimactic? 😋
Ah I know what you mean! But pointlessness - all for nothing, or violence or cruelty coming from thinking something is one way when it is not - that can also be a kind of tragedy I think, and for some people may be even more tragic, the way unnecessary waste is more tragic.
I actually saw a video where someone had the hardcover Black Hole with no dust jacket and I was like "what is that?!?!" I was so excited when I picked up the hardcover this week, beautiful book.
P.S. if you love Burns, I recently uploaded a 2 part video going through (almost) his entire bibliography, including early uncollected anthology work, foreign art books, etc. Part 3 should be up later this week. (covering Charles Burns and Gary Panters collaborations "Facetasm" and Pixiemeat as well as more obscure early work)
Love this video. So cool to see someone talking about these changes. Losing that last blurb changed the way the ending landed for me. It feels more tragic in the singles. You get the light at the end of the tunnel with the bug passing relatively quickly, but also the unnecessary pain that they cause each other... At a book signing, i asked Charles Burns about leaving it out, and he said that he felt it was a little on the nose; puberty IS short lived, and the hormones that make us feel like mutants mellow out. Felt like it didn't need to be spelled out. I understand his reasoning...but I still prefer the story with them included. Im not sure about the availability of bookbinding where you are, but i took my single isses and had them bound into one hardcover. Got to keep the glossy paper, the full issue size, and all the covers / portraits / blurbs. You make great videos, im a new fan!
Wow, what a terrific story; thank you so much for sharing that! And I will have to agree with you; while I understand the need to not underline things, I do feel the story is so free floating otherwise that it is quite easy to take a completely different reading. And that binding job sounds lovely. There are some options like that around here, but I'd have to do a lot of research and probably spend a lot of money! 😁
I read this a few years back digitally as the individual issues, got the collected edition recently for my gf and she just finished it. I totally forgot about these character portraits with the lore - but remembered the info. So when she finished it (reading aloud) i was confused because she never got to the part about the disease being temporary etc. Not having these story bits is a HUGE omission from the collected edition, so disappointing. Good video and thanks for the breakdown 👍
So glad you enjoyed the video! And absolutely, I find it a very curious omission. I suppose I can understand how the chapter breaks may not pace the way they wanted a 'novel' to read, but this little detail it seems significant for the metaphor and for the doom-soaked tone. I knew this video would be a very niche one, but I'm glad to know it serves its purpose somehow! 😁
@@ftloc I kept searching for "Black Hole Epilogue" because I remembered that bit about the bug not being permanent not realizing it had been thin these character portraits this whole time. It would have been nice if they included this on the last page or something, Also in the collected edition we have it is not hardback and does not include the blurb on the back (instead it is just praise and recognition for Black Hole).
EXCELLENT video! Thanks so much for presenting this material showing the differences between the novel and the original series of comic books. I read the originals when they came out, but it was so long between issues that it was kind of hard to keep track of the story. As a result, I was thrilled when the novel came out and I could read it all in one sitting as a novel. What's really amazing to me was the way that Burns was able to maintain the continuity of both the story and the art over a 10-year period of time. From year to year, issue to issue, it's literally seamless. Truly one of the major works in the history of comics!
Thank you so much! And yes, it is a really commendable feat; the storytelling here is both urgent and nonchalant, very much the way teen life feels, and very consistent in its portray through some significant changes.
I appreciate the quality of your analysis. You are not only focusing on the aesthetic of the book but also searching for the little details, motifs, metaphors. Keep it going! Also, wow.. what a significant artistic difference. I wonder why they made that choice to eliminate such beautiful covers to create one single identity to the book...
Thank you so much! Yes, I think I understand the editorial approach to make it a novel, as well as to manage the costs (4 colour plates and art paper would make the book very expensive), but I can't help wonder how a publisher like Fantagraphics would have approached the volume. In fact, I was trying to think of how I would do it myself, and even if I accommodated the covers in a gallery, I think it would be pretty impossible to retain the endpapers or the portraits in any meaningful way.
That make sense. Thank you for sharing your editorial insights. Would love to hear more about what you do perhaps in a Q & A? Considering the reputation of Fantagraphics and the amazing quality of their prints, one approach could have been dividing the book into chapters and incorporating the covers there, or at least including them in a one page reference toward the end. Regardless, they had their reasons. Looking forward to seeing more of your videos :)
I like the idea of keeping them as separate chapters, maybe even issues. I always wished more publishers would do 'multiple volumes in a box' sort of comics collections, but I know those can get pretty costly and also get damaged easily. The form of the hardcover book has been tried and tested for centuries now! 😋
Great video! Glad I found this as I was thinking of selling my set of single issues to make space, now that I have the hardcover. I didn't realise how much was missing apart from the covers - definitely keeping both formats now! Thanks! Fantastic channel by the way, I only came across it tonight and have been going through it for 3 hours so far. I really like your approach, analysis and the way the strands/playlists are organised. Awesome content.
Thank you so much - I'm so glad you've enjoyed these little videos! Also, this may be the first time someone has complimented the playlist/strand organization so thank you for that - I really did want there to be a variety of ways one can approach the videos in this channel! 😁 And yes, good call on retaining the singles of Black Hole; I now know a handful of people who have now sought out the singles in spite of already having the hardcover. Cheers and here's hoping you continue to enjoy this channel for a long time to come!
Just finished the HC collection and I am really glad you highlight the differences between the single issues and the book! It is a major change to the story and I wish these were included in the collection!!
Me too! I sort of get why it's not in there, from the structure of the 'novel', I suppose, but I think they could have come up with a way to have this important shade to the story. Maybe one day there will be a 'definitive edition' of Black Hole. And on that day I will spend more money I don't really need to...
Thank you; it was a fascinating thing to study and I was really excited to share what I saw, so it makes me feel very happy to hear the video hit the mark for you! Cheers!
What an interesting video! I'm not likely to read Black Hole because it's not really my kind of story and seems like it might creep me out too much. But as someone who works in publishing and takes nerdy delight in little production details like the ones you point out, I enjoyed this video very much indeed.
I have recently started reading Black Hole (just finished issue 1) and I'm leaning towards the single issue format. That said, the cheapest I've seen them is for 400 quid, which I'm not even considering. A pity they haven't been reprinted (and probably never will as the author prefers the matte finish of the collected edition). Great video (again? I don't know if I commented when it came out).
Thank you! And 400 quid? What on earth? Is that for the first printings of the first issues? I know there are reprints from Fantagraphics of those from when they took over the series from Kitchen Press, do you think those would be more reasonably priced? And yes, I don't think they will ever reprint the singles, although I saw a German edition with two-issues-in-one volumes in a slipcase/box set that I thought was just lovely as well - maybe we can hold out hope for some sort of anniversary edition in that form one day? 😋
Thanks for a very interesting overhaul of one my favourite graphic novel. I've started collecting Black Hole right from the beginning and was a persistent fan for the duration of the single issues, because of the 10 years in the making!!! When the hardcover was published I've flinched and I knew then, there was something missing in that hardbound edition. The colour covers, were nowhere to be seen! Although, I'm fan of matte paper, I completely concur that the glossy paper, would have been a better choice only because of the deep black perception. But it would be more expensive to publish, as also if the colour pages were included. Probably in the future, something could be done for the hardcore fans? Keeping the fingers crossed...
Thank you, I'm so glad that you - as an 'original' and consistent fan - enjoyed this video! And yes, cost definitely had a lot to do with the choices made for the collection. Keeping the lower-grammage paper and black-and-white throughout would have kept the hardcover and paperback closer in price to a prose book of that size than comics (which, as well know, can be expensive). But I also wonder about the publishers wanting to present it more as a novel from the 'literary judgement' view as well - they seem to have removed everything that would keep it in the 'ghetto' of comics and tried to promote it to the penthouse suite of 'graphic novels'. So I wonder what a full-time comics publisher like Fantagraphics would have done instead: when I look at their collected edition of Delphine, for example, I see all the covers reproduced as chapter openers. Maybe Fantagraphics themselves will bring out the kind of deluxe edition you, and some others on these comments, mention!
Love your enthusiasm about Black Hole! Personally I'm less of a fan of the story. I think the art is absolutely great, but story-wise I think Junji Ito executed this kind of story much better in his works.
Thank you! I think that although Ito and Burns get talked about together a lot, there are only superficial similarities between Black Hole, at least, and Ito's works (that I have read). Where the dread in Ito's work seems otherworldly, in Black Hole it seems more internal, caused and affected more directly, by the characters. The disassociation of these characters, which makes them unlikable to many readers, also contributes to the horror in a choice driven way that almost seems the opposite of how Ito's characters often become puppets. I have definitely enjoyed many more of Ito's works than Burns', although I am not by any means an expert on either. It's just Black Hole that seems to connect as a story in a way that I think is quite unique.
@@ftloc I completely agree with you. I think they are too completely different categories like dazed and confused is not in the same movie category as the exorcist... I think that my disappointment from the book mainly comes from my expectation of a cosmic horror story when the theme is actually teen angst and coming of age kind of story? Not sure. But the art is gorgeous and even if I don't like the narrative I can't ignore Burns talent as an artist. Would love to see you review some of Ito's work as well in the future. 💙💙
Yes, I've been wondering about that - it's easy enough to have a cover gallery, but what do you think the best way of presenting the endpages, the character portraits and the smaller paragraphs would be? It seems to me you can neither group them together nor have them spread through and interrupt the 'novel' in an aesthetically and narratively pleasing manner...
@@ftloc It wouldn't be too complicated as there are plenty of good examples from, for example, Fantagraphics. In my opinion a special european sized splicover with the main work in 1 volume and a 2nd one with extras would work just fine, and, maybe a limited edition with a signed serigraphy or litho. As for the end pages i would probably commission an exclusive illustration and leave the rest as it is. Also i would increase the white around the the page. Wait. oops I'm giving ideas... 1 copy for me , please...
@@ftloc Adding to my previous comment, organising a new volume including the end pages wouldn't be that hard, quite the contrary - it would add to reading experience, like chapters (which what they are....). Also using a similar paper would improve the overall experience too. On an extra note it seems the one volume publishers opted for a more "friendly" book shop format (the smaller size with no extras...) but ignored (on purpose?..) the paper stock, the covers and endpapers.
@@rewanji I absolutely think it was a 'literary prose' presentation gambit to divorce all the serial-comics trappings and was saying just as much elsewhere in these comments. I love the idea of making the endpapers chapter starting and closing pages, with the dual portraits and text in there as well. Of course, this creates a much bigger break between the segments of the story, which is what they wanted to avoid with the Pantheon edition, but if a collector's, slipcased edition (which it already is in my mind, haha) and not a general trade friendly hardcover. This would be a little different from a second volume with extras though, so definitely needs a choice to be made. I like this game, playing at being a publisher! 😁
Aren't they stunning? The fact that they are often from the dream/nightmare/hallucination sequences or or the chapter opening spreads (more abstracted, not 'literal') give them an extra layer of story-commentary I feel.
I think I really like to read single issues, because of all the ancillary materials , like ads or whatever. Makes a nice timestamp for the era. But always Hardcovers for collecting on the shelf.
It's funny how in old comics I really enjoy the ads, for the exact time-capsule reason you identify, but absolutely hate contemporary ads in contemporary comics. I do love letters to the editor, though. Black Hole, however, is absolutely bereft of any ads, but the earliest issues do have some extras and letters that I'll share pictures of on the FB page/TH-cam community.
Well, first of all these have those stiff card covers and thick pages that just hold up better than most singles, I guess? Other cardstock-covered singles (Berlin comes to mind) also preserve very handsomely. The extreme glossiness also helps sell the 'new' look. And I usually keep them bagged and boarded away from sunlight, as one is supposed to do.
What a book! I teared up on so many occasions. Here's a thought - how many such moments have you come across in comics? (the ones that make you wonder if there are invisible ninjas slicing onions somewhere in the room)
I have definitely been moved to tears through both sadness and beauty, but interestingly a number of the most moving moments that come to mind immediately are from nonfiction comics, both autobiography and journalism. Maybe I should explore a "Top 10 Comics That Made Me Cry" list? 😋
Just finished the collected edition. Didn't remember much from when I originally read it but certainly enjoyed it this time round. Will hunt down the single issues on eBay for the covers as I had no money when they originally came out. I thought about the gallery edition but CB's art is so slick it seemed an expensive extravagance for bigger repro and not much more. Felt the same with Jaime Hernandez's gallery edition and the Will Eisner Spirit Artists Editions although I bought first one. Anyway, I found the book a gripping page turner with sublime art and plenty of extra weirdness. I'll give the X'ed Out trilogy another go as once again I remember very little from when I read it originally. Three excellent videos so thanks a lot.
Thank you so much and I'm thrilled that you enjoyed them. I was planning a re-read of the X'ed Out Trilogy soon myself! As for Artist Editions - they're always too much of an extravagance, I think 😋 but what can I do? I love original art pages and oversized reproductions so much! But in the case of Black Hole, if one *had* to choose between the singles and the Studio Edition, I may have to give the edge to the singles.
As always, you know how to tempting us :) I am looking to the single issues to see how much can cost in total. But the prizes are a little crazy. I will add to my must to buy list. Did you heard about the absolute edition of Metabarons? I will like to know your opinion on the serie and in that particular edition.
@@ftloc I will cross my arms and wait for the video with a judging look to you :P Hope you do more videos of what will you carry on your trip ;) Also, I know that you are like me and love books, but what do you think about move to read in a tablet digital comics?
Is that on Amazon India? I think that's the mislabelling of one copy of a single issue , and way overpric d at that! There's no other 'pamphlet' version of this, certainly not of the whole story.
Wow, that would be incredible if true! It feels like a perfect design choice for the work, not just the gloss but also the thick art paper that can take more ink without becoming damp and 'wavy'. I'd love to know more so I'll look around but please do let me know if you find a link with more information! Thanks so much for sharing!
Mentioned in passing on a Cartoonish Kayfabe episode (which I can’t remember!!). Could just be industry gossip tho, but they’ll be able to fill you in.
I just received my hardcover a few minutes ago and the pages inside are glossy with true blacks. My edition is from Jonathan Cape Random House and my copy is a bit thinner than yours.
Oh that's great! I was just going to note that there are two editions out there - the Jonathan Cape and the Pantheon. Since mine is the Pantheon one, I'm guessing withe the UK/ JC version always had these glossy pages or they changed it. We need someone who buys a Pantheon edition today to weigh in to help complete the picture😁!
can someone explain the idea of dust jackets to me? they are flimsy and get damaged very easily, usually the art under them is better (this is true for this case), unless there is additional art on the reverse side that you can use as a poster or something I just don't see the point. They aren't like Absolutes or something with an actual slipcase to protect the book, they are just an extra paper that is the most damaged part of the comic.
Dustjackets have a very interesting history in which they've gone all over the place - from being essentially wrapping paper torn off when the book is bought to being the one element that held design, art and writing over plain, almost-unmarked bindings, and everything in between. But yes, these days they are mainly decorative, not very practical at all. They can be a place for additional art and text, but usually end up being for 'marketing'. Some of my friends like dustjackets because they take all the advertising, price information, barcode etc, then you can remove them and be left with a handsome 'unsullied' hardcover! People like Chris Ware can use it as an opportunity to do very interesting things with design and narrative, but they're few and far between. Then there's absolutely unusual things like the paperback dustjackets of the Coconino/Fantagraphics books (Delphine/Children of Palomar/Ganges and others) that are just pleasures of design and invention. But in common practice, I would always prefer a slipcase myself, but if the choice is between having a dustjacket or nothing at all, I don;t mind having the option of a dustjacket as a second cover, so you have the choice of either keeping the image on the jacket or the cover underneath! (two covers are better than one, essentially! 😁)
@@ftloc wow thanks, was not expecting such a detailed reply. Chris Ware is definitely one of the best at experimenting with the comic medium and how books are put together (been contemplating getting Building Stories), so it's no surprise he takes extra steps on this as well. The one dust jacket I have that I really like is Witchblade First Born, it comes in a slipcase AND a dust jacket and the dust jacket has some great art on the back side when you pull it off. So in that case I have no issues with it, cause they used it to pack in extra artwork. The only reason I don't take off my dust jackets is cause I don't know where to store them if I do, and they would take up more space if even if I figured it out. So basically I just take them off when reading the book and put them back on when the book goes back in the shelf.
Oh how interesting! We get a lot of Jonathan Cape books here in India, as they are distributed by Penguin and usually reprint the Drawn and Quarterly stuff for outside North America, so I'll do my best to seek out a copy to borrow and check. Although I am sure they will be the same, are you referring to a Johnathan Cape paperback or hardcover? Cheers!
Could Charles Burns’s before-and-after portrait be telling us he remained a virgin during high school? Or that his mutation eventually cleared up? (Or maybe he's got one of those neck mouths.)
Timestamps for ease of navigation
Introduction: 0:00
Main Titles 1:32
The Hardcover - size, binding,jacket, covers, flaps, endpapers, 1:42
The Singles - front and back covers, Kitchen SInk and Fantagraphics history, David Bowie 5:03
The SIngles - the endpapers 8:21
The Singles - the before and after portraits 9:31
The Singles vs the Hardcover - Blacks Battle 11:24
A Tangent 12:12
Back to the Blacks , A Side-by-Side Comparison 12:26
The Singles - the 12 Monologues 13:32
The Singles - A Secret Ending? (SLIGHT SPOILER): 16:25
Conclusion (SPOILERS OVER) 18:35
Nowhere in the depth of the internet there is a comparison between hardcover and the tpb.i had no knowledge of the subtle differences and omg the backcovers look so beautiful and the color does add something. Ty for this
P. S. I love the anticlimatic ending without the blurb
I'm so glad you enjoyed this video! Isn't it interesting how even these small and 'outside of story' details can make a difference? As for the ending, it could maybe even be said that the extra text makes it even more anticlimactic? 😋
@@ftloc no that line gives hope and i love some tragedy in this. Tragedy suits mr burns work. 😋
Ah I know what you mean! But pointlessness - all for nothing, or violence or cruelty coming from thinking something is one way when it is not - that can also be a kind of tragedy I think, and for some people may be even more tragic, the way unnecessary waste is more tragic.
I actually saw a video where someone had the hardcover Black Hole with no dust jacket and I was like "what is that?!?!"
I was so excited when I picked up the hardcover this week, beautiful book.
P.S. if you love Burns, I recently uploaded a 2 part video going through (almost) his entire bibliography, including early uncollected anthology work, foreign art books, etc.
Part 3 should be up later this week.
(covering Charles Burns and Gary Panters collaborations "Facetasm" and Pixiemeat as well as more obscure early work)
Love this video. So cool to see someone talking about these changes. Losing that last blurb changed the way the ending landed for me. It feels more tragic in the singles. You get the light at the end of the tunnel with the bug passing relatively quickly, but also the unnecessary pain that they cause each other...
At a book signing, i asked Charles Burns about leaving it out, and he said that he felt it was a little on the nose; puberty IS short lived, and the hormones that make us feel like mutants mellow out. Felt like it didn't need to be spelled out. I understand his reasoning...but I still prefer the story with them included.
Im not sure about the availability of bookbinding where you are, but i took my single isses and had them bound into one hardcover. Got to keep the glossy paper, the full issue size, and all the covers / portraits / blurbs.
You make great videos, im a new fan!
Wow, what a terrific story; thank you so much for sharing that!
And I will have to agree with you; while I understand the need to not underline things, I do feel the story is so free floating otherwise that it is quite easy to take a completely different reading.
And that binding job sounds lovely. There are some options like that around here, but I'd have to do a lot of research and probably spend a lot of money! 😁
I read this a few years back digitally as the individual issues, got the collected edition recently for my gf and she just finished it. I totally forgot about these character portraits with the lore - but remembered the info. So when she finished it (reading aloud) i was confused because she never got to the part about the disease being temporary etc. Not having these story bits is a HUGE omission from the collected edition, so disappointing. Good video and thanks for the breakdown 👍
So glad you enjoyed the video! And absolutely, I find it a very curious omission. I suppose I can understand how the chapter breaks may not pace the way they wanted a 'novel' to read, but this little detail it seems significant for the metaphor and for the doom-soaked tone. I knew this video would be a very niche one, but I'm glad to know it serves its purpose somehow! 😁
@@ftloc I kept searching for "Black Hole Epilogue" because I remembered that bit about the bug not being permanent not realizing it had been thin these character portraits this whole time. It would have been nice if they included this on the last page or something, Also in the collected edition we have it is not hardback and does not include the blurb on the back (instead it is just praise and recognition for Black Hole).
EXCELLENT video! Thanks so much for presenting this material showing the differences between the novel and the original series of comic books. I read the originals when they came out, but it was so long between issues that it was kind of hard to keep track of the story. As a result, I was thrilled when the novel came out and I could read it all in one sitting as a novel.
What's really amazing to me was the way that Burns was able to maintain the continuity of both the story and the art over a 10-year period of time. From year to year, issue to issue, it's literally seamless. Truly one of the major works in the history of comics!
Thank you so much! And yes, it is a really commendable feat; the storytelling here is both urgent and nonchalant, very much the way teen life feels, and very consistent in its portray through some significant changes.
I appreciate the quality of your analysis. You are not only focusing on the aesthetic of the book but also searching for the little details, motifs, metaphors. Keep it going!
Also, wow.. what a significant artistic difference. I wonder why they made that choice to eliminate such beautiful covers to create one single identity to the book...
Thank you so much! Yes, I think I understand the editorial approach to make it a novel, as well as to manage the costs (4 colour plates and art paper would make the book very expensive), but I can't help wonder how a publisher like Fantagraphics would have approached the volume. In fact, I was trying to think of how I would do it myself, and even if I accommodated the covers in a gallery, I think it would be pretty impossible to retain the endpapers or the portraits in any meaningful way.
That make sense. Thank you for sharing your editorial insights. Would love to hear more about what you do perhaps in a Q & A? Considering the reputation of Fantagraphics and the amazing quality of their prints, one approach could have been dividing the book into chapters and incorporating the covers there, or at least including them in a one page reference toward the end. Regardless, they had their reasons.
Looking forward to seeing more of your videos :)
I like the idea of keeping them as separate chapters, maybe even issues. I always wished more publishers would do 'multiple volumes in a box' sort of comics collections, but I know those can get pretty costly and also get damaged easily. The form of the hardcover book has been tried and tested for centuries now! 😋
Great video! Glad I found this as I was thinking of selling my set of single issues to make space, now that I have the hardcover. I didn't realise how much was missing apart from the covers - definitely keeping both formats now! Thanks! Fantastic channel by the way, I only came across it tonight and have been going through it for 3 hours so far. I really like your approach, analysis and the way the strands/playlists are organised. Awesome content.
Thank you so much - I'm so glad you've enjoyed these little videos! Also, this may be the first time someone has complimented the playlist/strand organization so thank you for that - I really did want there to be a variety of ways one can approach the videos in this channel! 😁
And yes, good call on retaining the singles of Black Hole; I now know a handful of people who have now sought out the singles in spite of already having the hardcover. Cheers and here's hoping you continue to enjoy this channel for a long time to come!
Just finished the HC collection and I am really glad you highlight the differences between the single issues and the book! It is a major change to the story and I wish these were included in the collection!!
Me too! I sort of get why it's not in there, from the structure of the 'novel', I suppose, but I think they could have come up with a way to have this important shade to the story. Maybe one day there will be a 'definitive edition' of Black Hole. And on that day I will spend more money I don't really need to...
A fantastic review for a fantastic piece of art! Thoroughly enjoyed it
Thank you; it was a fascinating thing to study and I was really excited to share what I saw, so it makes me feel very happy to hear the video hit the mark for you! Cheers!
Amazing video. I am now realizing how much I prefer the more garish, in your face single issue presentation.
I think I may agree with you there; each has its merits but if I had to choose just one, I think I'd take the singles 😁
What an interesting video! I'm not likely to read Black Hole because it's not really my kind of story and seems like it might creep me out too much. But as someone who works in publishing and takes nerdy delight in little production details like the ones you point out, I enjoyed this video very much indeed.
Hey, thank you! I take this as high praise indeed, even if I suspect you may be a tad biased!
Loved the video!
I haven't really paid Black Hole any attention but after your review and this video, I'm gonna have to get myself a copy
That's wonderful! Do let me know what you think of it whenever you get to read it!
I have recently started reading Black Hole (just finished issue 1) and I'm leaning towards the single issue format.
That said, the cheapest I've seen them is for 400 quid, which I'm not even considering.
A pity they haven't been reprinted (and probably never will as the author prefers the matte finish of the collected edition).
Great video (again? I don't know if I commented when it came out).
Thank you! And 400 quid? What on earth? Is that for the first printings of the first issues? I know there are reprints from Fantagraphics of those from when they took over the series from Kitchen Press, do you think those would be more reasonably priced?
And yes, I don't think they will ever reprint the singles, although I saw a German edition with two-issues-in-one volumes in a slipcase/box set that I thought was just lovely as well - maybe we can hold out hope for some sort of anniversary edition in that form one day? 😋
@@ftloc A twelve-issue, thin-hardcover boxset would be the best thing, fingers crossed...
Thanks for a very interesting overhaul of one my favourite graphic novel. I've started collecting Black Hole right from the beginning and was a persistent fan for the duration of the single issues, because of the 10 years in the making!!! When the hardcover was published I've flinched and I knew then, there was something missing in that hardbound edition. The colour covers, were nowhere to be seen! Although, I'm fan of matte paper, I completely concur that the glossy paper, would have been a better choice only because of the deep black perception. But it would be more expensive to publish, as also if the colour pages were included. Probably in the future, something could be done for the hardcore fans? Keeping the fingers crossed...
Thank you, I'm so glad that you - as an 'original' and consistent fan - enjoyed this video!
And yes, cost definitely had a lot to do with the choices made for the collection. Keeping the lower-grammage paper and black-and-white throughout would have kept the hardcover and paperback closer in price to a prose book of that size than comics (which, as well know, can be expensive).
But I also wonder about the publishers wanting to present it more as a novel from the 'literary judgement' view as well - they seem to have removed everything that would keep it in the 'ghetto' of comics and tried to promote it to the penthouse suite of 'graphic novels'. So I wonder what a full-time comics publisher like Fantagraphics would have done instead: when I look at their collected edition of Delphine, for example, I see all the covers reproduced as chapter openers.
Maybe Fantagraphics themselves will bring out the kind of deluxe edition you, and some others on these comments, mention!
Love your enthusiasm about Black Hole!
Personally I'm less of a fan of the story. I think the art is absolutely great, but story-wise I think Junji Ito executed this kind of story much better in his works.
Thank you!
I think that although Ito and Burns get talked about together a lot, there are only superficial similarities between Black Hole, at least, and Ito's works (that I have read). Where the dread in Ito's work seems otherworldly, in Black Hole it seems more internal, caused and affected more directly, by the characters. The disassociation of these characters, which makes them unlikable to many readers, also contributes to the horror in a choice driven way that almost seems the opposite of how Ito's characters often become puppets.
I have definitely enjoyed many more of Ito's works than Burns', although I am not by any means an expert on either. It's just Black Hole that seems to connect as a story in a way that I think is quite unique.
@@ftloc I completely agree with you. I think they are too completely different categories like dazed and confused is not in the same movie category as the exorcist... I think that my disappointment from the book mainly comes from my expectation of a cosmic horror story when the theme is actually teen angst and coming of age kind of story? Not sure. But the art is gorgeous and even if I don't like the narrative I can't ignore Burns talent as an artist. Would love to see you review some of Ito's work as well in the future. 💙💙
We definitely need a omnibus edition including the missing extras and other unpublished or rare material.
Yes, I've been wondering about that - it's easy enough to have a cover gallery, but what do you think the best way of presenting the endpages, the character portraits and the smaller paragraphs would be? It seems to me you can neither group them together nor have them spread through and interrupt the 'novel' in an aesthetically and narratively pleasing manner...
@@ftloc It wouldn't be too complicated as there are plenty of good examples from, for example, Fantagraphics. In my opinion a special european sized splicover with the main work in 1 volume and a 2nd one with extras would work just fine, and, maybe a limited edition with a signed serigraphy or litho. As for the end pages i would probably commission an exclusive illustration and leave the rest as it is. Also i would increase the white around the the page. Wait. oops I'm giving ideas... 1 copy for me , please...
A two volume slipcase would be perfect. Is there an order form I should be signing up on?
@@ftloc Adding to my previous comment, organising a new volume including the end pages wouldn't be that hard, quite the contrary - it would add to reading experience, like chapters (which what they are....). Also using a similar paper would improve the overall experience too. On an extra note it seems the one volume publishers opted for a more "friendly" book shop format (the smaller size with no extras...) but ignored (on purpose?..) the paper stock, the covers and endpapers.
@@rewanji I absolutely think it was a 'literary prose' presentation gambit to divorce all the serial-comics trappings and was saying just as much elsewhere in these comments. I love the idea of making the endpapers chapter starting and closing pages, with the dual portraits and text in there as well. Of course, this creates a much bigger break between the segments of the story, which is what they wanted to avoid with the Pantheon edition, but if a collector's, slipcased edition (which it already is in my mind, haha) and not a general trade friendly hardcover. This would be a little different from a second volume with extras though, so definitely needs a choice to be made.
I like this game, playing at being a publisher! 😁
Thanks for sharing this! Superloved!
Thrilled you enjoyed it! In spite of the technical challenges, I had a great time making it! 😋
Wow - love the covers of the single issues!
Aren't they stunning? The fact that they are often from the dream/nightmare/hallucination sequences or or the chapter opening spreads (more abstracted, not 'literal') give them an extra layer of story-commentary I feel.
I think I really like to read single issues, because of all the ancillary materials , like ads or whatever. Makes a nice timestamp for the era. But always Hardcovers for collecting on the shelf.
It's funny how in old comics I really enjoy the ads, for the exact time-capsule reason you identify, but absolutely hate contemporary ads in contemporary comics.
I do love letters to the editor, though.
Black Hole, however, is absolutely bereft of any ads, but the earliest issues do have some extras and letters that I'll share pictures of on the FB page/TH-cam community.
@@ftloc I noticed the single issues you showcased here looked spanking new. What's the secret behind that? 👾
Well, first of all these have those stiff card covers and thick pages that just hold up better than most singles, I guess? Other cardstock-covered singles (Berlin comes to mind) also preserve very handsomely. The extreme glossiness also helps sell the 'new' look. And I usually keep them bagged and boarded away from sunlight, as one is supposed to do.
What a book! I teared up on so many occasions. Here's a thought - how many such moments have you come across in comics? (the ones that make you wonder if there are invisible ninjas slicing onions somewhere in the room)
I have definitely been moved to tears through both sadness and beauty, but interestingly a number of the most moving moments that come to mind immediately are from nonfiction comics, both autobiography and journalism. Maybe I should explore a "Top 10 Comics That Made Me Cry" list? 😋
@@ftloc o.k. where is it? The list😁
Just finished the collected edition. Didn't remember much from when I originally read it but certainly enjoyed it this time round. Will hunt down the single issues on eBay for the covers as I had no money when they originally came out. I thought about the gallery edition but CB's art is so slick it seemed an expensive extravagance for bigger repro and not much more. Felt the same with Jaime Hernandez's gallery edition and the Will Eisner Spirit Artists Editions although I bought first one. Anyway, I found the book a gripping page turner with sublime art and plenty of extra weirdness. I'll give the X'ed Out trilogy another go as once again I remember very little from when I read it originally. Three excellent videos so thanks a lot.
Thank you so much and I'm thrilled that you enjoyed them. I was planning a re-read of the X'ed Out Trilogy soon myself!
As for Artist Editions - they're always too much of an extravagance, I think 😋 but what can I do? I love original art pages and oversized reproductions so much! But in the case of Black Hole, if one *had* to choose between the singles and the Studio Edition, I may have to give the edge to the singles.
Will check out! Thx...
Let me know what you think!
As always, you know how to tempting us :)
I am looking to the single issues to see how much can cost in total. But the prizes are a little crazy. I will add to my must to buy list. Did you heard about the absolute edition of Metabarons? I will like to know your opinion on the serie and in that particular edition.
Thank you so much! Re: the Metabarons, did you mean the oversized deluxe from Humanoids?
@@ftloc yes, for me it is a beautiful edition :)
It'll be at least a year before I can get my hands on my copy, with all the travel plans thrown in disarray! 😥
@@ftloc I will cross my arms and wait for the video with a judging look to you :P
Hope you do more videos of what will you carry on your trip ;)
Also, I know that you are like me and love books, but what do you think about move to read in a tablet digital comics?
Is the paperback edition good enough?
Yes, absolutely. It's just like the hardcover shown here.
Yes, absolutely. It's just like the hardcover shown here.
There is even an “pamphlet edition” of black hole ..!
Can you tell whats the difference..!?
Is that on Amazon India? I think that's the mislabelling of one copy of a single issue , and way overpric d at that! There's no other 'pamphlet' version of this, certainly not of the whole story.
I’ve heard the glossy paper stock was a printer mistake and he decided to retain it throughout the series for consistency’s sake!
Wow, that would be incredible if true! It feels like a perfect design choice for the work, not just the gloss but also the thick art paper that can take more ink without becoming damp and 'wavy'. I'd love to know more so I'll look around but please do let me know if you find a link with more information! Thanks so much for sharing!
Mentioned in passing on a Cartoonish Kayfabe episode (which I can’t remember!!). Could just be industry gossip tho, but they’ll be able to fill you in.
Here you go th-cam.com/video/LYsf3ehXHtM/w-d-xo.html Jim Rugg mentions the printing mistake.
I was watching this the other day and wondered how on earth you had heard it two months before they published it! Are you a time traveler? 😋
@@ftloc LoL! He must have mentioned it in passing in another video. ;)
I just received my hardcover a few minutes ago and the pages inside are glossy with true blacks. My edition is from Jonathan Cape Random House and my copy is a bit thinner than yours.
Oh that's great!
I was just going to note that there are two editions out there - the Jonathan Cape and the Pantheon. Since mine is the Pantheon one, I'm guessing withe the UK/ JC version always had these glossy pages or they changed it. We need someone who buys a Pantheon edition today to weigh in to help complete the picture😁!
@@ftloc Hahaha. Let's hope a third publisher adds the complete collection with everything that is missing. ;)
@@apjferreira1 An excuse for another video? Bring it on! 😁
can someone explain the idea of dust jackets to me? they are flimsy and get damaged very easily, usually the art under them is better (this is true for this case), unless there is additional art on the reverse side that you can use as a poster or something I just don't see the point. They aren't like Absolutes or something with an actual slipcase to protect the book, they are just an extra paper that is the most damaged part of the comic.
Dustjackets have a very interesting history in which they've gone all over the place - from being essentially wrapping paper torn off when the book is bought to being the one element that held design, art and writing over plain, almost-unmarked bindings, and everything in between.
But yes, these days they are mainly decorative, not very practical at all. They can be a place for additional art and text, but usually end up being for 'marketing'.
Some of my friends like dustjackets because they take all the advertising, price information, barcode etc, then you can remove them and be left with a handsome 'unsullied' hardcover!
People like Chris Ware can use it as an opportunity to do very interesting things with design and narrative, but they're few and far between.
Then there's absolutely unusual things like the paperback dustjackets of the Coconino/Fantagraphics books (Delphine/Children of Palomar/Ganges and others) that are just pleasures of design and invention.
But in common practice, I would always prefer a slipcase myself, but if the choice is between having a dustjacket or nothing at all, I don;t mind having the option of a dustjacket as a second cover, so you have the choice of either keeping the image on the jacket or the cover underneath! (two covers are better than one, essentially! 😁)
@@ftloc wow thanks, was not expecting such a detailed reply. Chris Ware is definitely one of the best at experimenting with the comic medium and how books are put together (been contemplating getting Building Stories), so it's no surprise he takes extra steps on this as well. The one dust jacket I have that I really like is Witchblade First Born, it comes in a slipcase AND a dust jacket and the dust jacket has some great art on the back side when you pull it off. So in that case I have no issues with it, cause they used it to pack in extra artwork.
The only reason I don't take off my dust jackets is cause I don't know where to store them if I do, and they would take up more space if even if I figured it out. So basically I just take them off when reading the book and put them back on when the book goes back in the shelf.
UK collected edition from Jonathan cape has glossy paper, hm.
Oh how interesting! We get a lot of Jonathan Cape books here in India, as they are distributed by Penguin and usually reprint the Drawn and Quarterly stuff for outside North America, so I'll do my best to seek out a copy to borrow and check. Although I am sure they will be the same, are you referring to a Johnathan Cape paperback or hardcover? Cheers!
@@ftloc I have a hardcover edition. Also it's a great video that you did, it goes into interesting details.
@@Spleemce Thank you so much; I'm thrilled you enjoyed it! And thanks again for that head-up on the UK edition!
I believe the single issue are kinda rare to find in India Where did u get them
I picked them up on ebay and had a colleague carry them over!
Could Charles Burns’s before-and-after portrait be telling us he remained a virgin during high school? Or that his mutation eventually cleared up? (Or maybe he's got one of those neck mouths.)
All possibilities, with the third one being a bit distant 😁
But if the secret story is taken as definitive, yes, maybe it got better.
What is your main source of income
Haha my main source is my only source. I work in publishing, in editorial.