There seems to be two kind of peoples regardless of their mental health. People who want to better themselves, become the best possible version of themselves and add value to society. And people who bring up the worst of themselves, victimize themselves and harm society. You guys are definitely adding value to yourself and society. Loads of respect. I’ve seen both people with personality disorders and without disorders get the best or worst out of themselves. In the end, the actions matter, not the label.
Society hates the former and exalts the latter. They try to make the former the latter. Because society is composed of the latter. Society is more powerful and effective if it's inhabitants are addicted to and dependent on it's approval.
I agree that their conversation contributes to understanding the issue so that as a society we become aware of what causes people to become narcissistic or sociopathic and that way we can hopefully avoid treating or neglecting our kids in certain ways to ensure a better mental health for them as much as possible.
Really great interview on both sides. I loved that bit about how cluster B’s who have gone through treatment and recovery can actually be healthier than regular people who have never worked on themselves. So true I think.
@@lesleybrown1583 that’s a ridiculously harmful thing to say. “Nobody can heal themselves?!?” That’s stupid. Your “god” created free will right? “He” didn’t do that so we could just always choose wrong, in theory “He” did that so we could make our own destiny and carve our own paths and choose better for ourselves. Do everyone you ever speak to the goodness of never saying that again. The harm you do by telling people that “you can’t heal” is unfathomable. Just stop.
@@lesleybrown1583 I totally disagree with your opinion, even though I respect your right to have the view that only Jesus can heal people, which is a common one. I grew up in New Zealand and have had many traumatic experiences throughout my life, yet I've managed to do a lot of extremely difficult, not to mention painful, healing work by myself and hope to assist others eventually. ❤
It’s definitely in the eyes. Very intense. Thank you for this video. I’m learning how to refrain from demonizing individuals who have these personalities.
Love the "all cluster B are borderline at the core" idea. That's how it's always struck me- it all comes down to intolerability for strong emotions and trauma, but the behaviours come out in different ways.
Didn't Sam Vaknin say something similar? Along the lines of that a narcissist is a borderline but with defenses. Thus when the narc collapses, as in the defenses break, he becomes functionally and emotionally like the borderline(narcissistic injury).
I listened to a professor of psychology recently who argues that all Cluster B *and* other common mental health issues like anxiety and depression are all the same thing. Not being able to deal with strong emotions due to trauma and the only difference is the type of defence mechanisms we built up and the strength of those defence mechanisms (often relative to the amount of trauma). If you look in to schema therapy it basically says the same thing.
@@DivineLogos please don't quote Dr Sam Vaknin incorrectly. Any DSV is his word for word. Others are a summary of his long talks and my conclusive theory. Also ASPD is just physchopath in my rant (that's how Dr Sam Vaknin refers to it) I'll say it like he says it: A borderline is a failed narcissists. DSV Borderline has an issue turning it's internal good self object to be an external good self object, so they feel they are right in the moment, try to be good to others but helplessly (horrible at executing their plan externally) just flat out can't make things work and display horrible behaviour to society and loved ones. Then go back and forth with external objects being bad and good, making horrible life choices. A cover narcissists wishes to be an over narcissists. DSV A narcissists wants people to feed their delusion. They absolutely hate their reality being destroyed, so they can't take it and will run away thinking you are the narcissists trying to manipulate them. DSV However they will try to manipulate people to feed their delusion of self (that they are the perfect ones) A psychopath is not looking for glorification from others, they just wants to do what they want regardless of how people feel (infact toying with humans emotions ro get what they want is an experiment to see if their goals are achievable) . A psycho will either shutdown to a covert physchopath if they fail their goals. Or lash out physically... hence why they run into problems with the law (not like they care much for the law in the first place). A borderline is at the bottom of the barrel of these developed denfense mechanisms. A borderline wish they were better at manipulating people for themselves (Narcissists) A narcissists wishes to be a psychopath. Better at planning long term and not getting their false reality broken down (the problem is they live in delusion already) A psychopath lives in reality. They can lash out. they know the consequences but couldn't be bordered, because in the moment their goal is to cause damage (and they are good at achieving a goal) hence the law, other people's emotions are irrelevant in achieving their plans (destruction). The only thing a psychopath wishes to be better at, is lashes out in a without getting punished by the law. I've spent 40+ hours watching his video over the past year. Am I mentally well, not entirely because i have ADHD. The reason for my peaked interest in mental health was my new found relationship of over 1 year, so I take mental health topic seriously. It's a characteristic flaw of mine (hyperfocusing on things). I'm still trying to learn my covert problem as I only got to know my overt issue through Sam while seeking what was making my partner stone wall without any fault of mine. Please watch more Sam Vaknin, that man has published experience as long as I've been in the womb. And even more before my parents met. Just watch the interview and count how many times "interviewer" wish he could do something the "interviewee" said he does. I've always been good at reading humans, thankfully I'm not using it for utter evil. Humans are easy to read, but I just for some reason try to give all a benefit of a doubt. Borderline however wishes to be a mere narcissists (they both live in delusions constantly as their coping mechanism) just watch a real overt borderline interviewed by a narcissists.
Absolutely fantastic video and so relatable and well articulated. Also Jacob fantastic questions. The revenge side for me is strong, if you do bad to me, I will retaliate and I have the mindset of "how dare you" it isn't okay and you will pay the price sort or thing. I have had a lot of previous issues with the police but couldn't put that down to my ASPD, more the upbringing I had and what I was taught was right and wrong. I call my BPD my humanity, how I describe it is that it levels me out and levels out the ASPD. They balance each other out and work together. In regards to Sociopath vs ASPD, if I had a preference it would be Sociopath but even though they're the same thing it feels like the word Sociopath has more negative stigma than ASPD. But yeah I smile when I hear or say the word. Thank you Jacob for the video I feel heard and seen. Joe you explained everything so well. Thank you.
@@noisyglamourappreciate your story, I find it fascinating the interactions between the mechanics of the two disorders considering parts of them seem to be contradictory to each other.
Something I've learned over the past few years is that social anxiety/GAD (which I was diagnosed with at 14) can also manifest with symptoms that are similar to ASPD, i.e. a dislike/distrust of other humans and society as a whole. Also can cause people to be easily agitated, aggressive and prone to violence. I find it interesting how different personality disorders and mental illnesses can manifest in the most unusual and seemingly unrelated ways. I guess the point of my comment is that the more we learn about and get to know ourselves the more control we can have over our symptoms.
I have GAD and my ex has ADHD and sociopathy. It doesn't at all manifest the same way. You would need to either be in a relationship with a person with ASPD whether friend, family, or spouse to see the difference.
So true! Im an adult child of an alcoholic and dysfunctional family, was also diagnosed with GAD as early as 8 years old because I had panic attacks every night and severe OCD up til high school. I share a lot of ASPD traits and have wondered if I was a sociopath or a narcissist. But I very clearly know that I have empathy and I get so much happiness from being kind and connecting with others in a deep way. But among what you mentioned, I also lack sensitivity and I suppose I am manipulative, but just in the way that I know I will get more assistance in life by playing up my sweet innocent girl qualities. I don't know if that's manipulative or just human. But I never manipulate for bad or at the expense of others, Im just extremely observant and analytical and have gathered data on how certain ways we act lead to what. But the lack of sensitivity definitely has to do with my upbringing - absolutely no one let me cry or feel sorry for myself, so I am repulsed by that behavior in others. It's something I'm trying to work on though because I know it comes from my wounds and empathy/sensitivity is a good thing.
Absolutely, have you heard of PDA ? Just learning because looks like my Granddaughter of 28 months might have it, it’s part of the autistic spectrum makes a lot of sense.
Interesting when he made the comment about being sexually assaulted his mind went blank. It occurs when you revisit traumatic experiences and the mind wants to block it.
Because it is too painful to reexperience. I think that is why they blocked all feelings as they were secerly abused psychologically physically and emotionally. It make Total sense to me
CPTSD core makes so much sense especially when you said “Borderline will get in a relationship, NPD will get a new job based on a fantasy, and ASPD will go on a destruction spree.” It’s like all various forms of extreme coping for extreme chronic trauma you feel deep down you can’t escape from.
every high school student is sold a fantasy about a career 😂 nobody knows what the job is like until they’re there (unless they have a really good critical thinking faculty)-what I saw with NPD was frequent job changes. edit: ofc the guy i’m thinking of is delusional, and had delusional thinking about his jobs, but having illusions itself isn’t necessarily delusions. that’s all. might want to draw the distinction or else we might start to admit that our civilization is what makes us crazy.
Perception of slights CAN be very accurate. It doesn’t necessarily automatically mean you’re wrong in feeling mad at someone or annoyed at someone. I honestly find that the honesty and what others see as “remorseless” is actually respectable. You’re standing up for yourself.
As a UK parent of a lovely lad with adhd, aspd & bpd this interview was hugely insightful. The complexity of these personalities can indeed be such a struggle for those living it and those supporting it and even worse for those who simply don't understand it so thank you both for this discussion. However just to note my lad, now in his 30's, has achieved many things most of us would dare not contemplate as he is a risk taker and won't bow down to social norms but gets things done in his own, often chaotic, way, most of all he achieves being a single father on a daily basis, which I have the ultimate respect for, as we know parenting is the hardest job going!! Just wanted to share I'm immensely proud of my lad ❤ We still do clash at times, rarely now, but we both understand how exhausted our relationship can get and on that basis any authentic knowledge and lived experience on this is very beneficial and grounding... For me at least, 'cos he couldn't care less 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Just kidding, Cheers fellas 👍
Thx for having this interview/ conversation. I have ADHD and ASPD as well, and could really relate to what he was saying. Used to be a criminally inclined drug abuser, though after starting ADHD meds and working out every day, I’ve put all that far, far behind me. It’s a struggle though as I sometimes just wanna hurt people physically and/ or verbally, though the thought of jailtime again, being on probation yet again and having to pay fines really stops me from doing so. Used to be suicidal as well though my dog, meditation, correct medication, working out and quitting illegal drugs fixed that as well. What can I say, I am what I am and work on myself every day to be and do better in life and with people.
You know The side when you just want to hurt people, I get that a lot nowadays. Used to be a inside emotion where I'd hurt myself to contain the danger I posed nowadays I stopped harming myself and kept my Socialness to a minium or I have my Partner with me. I still struggle to fit in with some Social norm and chose to hold this 'persona' that people see 'someone who looks capable of the situation' when the reality is im showing you this person so you don't know who I am really am. You don't need to know me you just need to know what I want you to know.
Fascinating interview. It seems that ASPD is largely due to major hardships and deprivation in childhood, and maybe environments with a lot of brutality or cruelty. So sociopaths have learned certain types of coping mechanisms, essentially they are survivors... which is very different from psychopaths, who were born with a chip missing in their brains
Not necessarily, there is a big difference between sociopathy and psychopathy. Psychopaths are born, not made. And so it is kind of like the difference between being a man with no legs, or who is literally paralyzed from the waist down, as opposed to someone who was forced to use a wheelchair for the first 15 years of their lives. And so while their leg muscles have indeed atrophied down to next to nothing, and while their instincts may be all wrong for walking, they *do* have the ability to learn to walk, they *could* still try and actually walk and learn how to use their legs with massive amounts of rehab and physical therapy. This is not so with the clinical psychopath that literally just does not have those brain structures there and active. So I think that it's really questionable dealing with ASPD as if they are all the same, and I don't mean to just write someone off as a total loss, but you're going to have a much harder time as a psychopath because psychopaths can be born to completely normal families and lack any empathy, and so it's more like autism. It really doesn't matter which family you get born into while having the genes for psychopathy, although in fairness its the upbringing which defines that nature of psychopathy, that is, the one raised by a family of quiet librarians and academics is more likely to just take a clinically detached perspective and be a functional adult and neurosurgeon, as opposed to the ones born and raised into hookers and addicts or mafia families who are going to be set up for being abusive street dudes since day one because that is what their parents are. But yes SOCIOPATHY is lol I'm sorry I just got to 28:10 "victimless crimes man victimless crimes like what's the problem" hahaha that's the most classic sociopathic statement ever. "Like I don't get what's the big fucking deal to you people, so what if I set a few mailboxes on fire and sold some smack, you know I didn't rob anyone or anything I didn't commit CRIMES I just broke some stupid laws." I'm sorry this is just very funny to me but anyway sociopathy is yes a bad upbringing thing and so the self sabotage is the saddest part about that, and you need to basically overcome it and work every single day from literally the moment you wake up to when you finally pass out resisting that internal urge, structure, or personality defect, partly because they are socialized so wrong by their parents and the people around them. I honestly expect public schools massively accelerate it and take any latent trauma or abuse by families and turn just abused kids into full on clinical grade sociopaths because now they've taken that abuse, power, control, and violence, as well as being smooth talkers and manipulative, or using deception and charm, and applied it at the entire societal level and now seen things as being in terms of societies and power structures and not just the people that abused them. So those are even harder to work on and you get like Klebold and Harris kind of guys, or street guys or even just corporate sharks and vulture Capitalists and power abusing corrupt cops from that background, when what normally it could have been is just a sort of hurt lonely child setup that at least that person can work really hard to overcome being taught the wrong lessons by their parents or abusive older brother or whatever. I think that what it takes is massive amount of time, energy, and concentration effort while being surrounded by "normal" people but the problem with that too is, I think, that because they are not like them, it just increases the alienation. And so I don't even know for sure that putting sociopaths in better social concepts is even a good fix, just because all that teaches them is more charm and better masking, than feeling a real connection with anybody. I strongly suspect that for most sociopaths, it is either another abused child or someone who has psychological issues or a borderline girl or something like that that brings them back from the edge. They basically seem to need to be around people that know where they are coming from, but can still love and be functional in a society. Of course, if you leave them around lots of street dudes and in an organized crime family they're never going to change for the better and are going to slip back immediately into their basic instincts so it is also important for them to get away from those bad environments like abusive homes, juvie system, and public school system. I'd imagine something like Montessori schools or something more like laid back scholarly environments that reward passionless critical thinking and functional cognitive empathy are places where they can thrive the best and begin healing the most.
@@pandemicneetbux2110 brother, I love your bright mind, you're a good human being. feel hugged man bc you were dropping pure facts the way I wouldn't be able atm while PMSing 💀 your rhetorical skills are beautiful to watch and enjoy. thx for the fresh breeze. PS. but made one big mistake so let me correct you bc I'm autistic, you can trust me:we have NOTHING in common with psychopaths, pls never do that again bc we're the exact opposite. we're even more empathetic than neurotypicals, it's just damn hard masking 24/7 and then seeing we're being lied to the whole time by NT's so we have to also put a mask on for this case, so double masking for NOTHING. like wth, let us be weird bc neurotypicals are the weirdos to us with those nonsense social ettiquette just for pseudo harmony. We often feel what is happing inside you before you even know it, I understand why it triggers many ppl, that's why correct education is important. sry man but this triggered me hard ngl, no hate ❤️🦖 if you get what I mean and where on the same boat I would appreciate an edit bc the stigma with autistics lacking empathy is wrong and very hurtful for us neurospicy t-rexes 🦖 :C just bc we have our own way of living life and feeling things doesn't mean we lack a basic human emotion, that keeps us healthy, socialized and alive. I just prioritize a well made selection of two hands full of kind good humans and put my time in them. I don't have more time for risking my mental health, ppl are evil af, I know it, I analyze them since I opened my eyes. strange monkies those humans are... living their life not seeing the fire behind them. correct mental health education is a must to make a step further in the right direction.
I agree that sociopath and psychopath should be separate diagnoses. Psychopathy is basically a lack of emotions, but I find that sociopaths can be very emotional. Those strong emotions is what causes problems for them sometimes.
Antisocial personality disorder is the diagnosis. Psychopathy and sociopathy are both descriptors when diagnosing APSD. Sociopathy specifically is not even recognized as an actual clinical condition. And with all due respect, you can't actually know if a sociopath is "very emotional" in the genuine sense. They display emotions either for narcissistic and egotistical purposes or as a manipulation tactic to get what they want. They'll never cry for you as a sign of empathy. They'll cry for themselves to emotionally manipulate you.
Do your research. Both sociopathy and psychopathy aren’t technically diagnoses themselves in the first place. It’s simply just ASPD and what spectrum of it you lie on (high functioning and low functioning) And no, they do NOT have strong emotions. They in fact significantly lack it. That is the key factor for diagnosis. If you meant strong emotions in a different context, I’d assume the impulsiveness and excessive boredom displayed in (typically) low functioning ASPD.
You can see from the body language who’s ASPD and who’s NPD. The NPD is on the empathy-connection-recognition-move. The ASPD is firm, laid back,.. Cool interview.
I think that comment illustrates very well what they talked about: that once they share their diagnosis, every single move of them is being analyzed and interpreted to fit some sort of stereotype the person has
The honesty and the openness about your mental health is so vital in today's world. You can not reverse your "condition", but being this truthful and brave is a long step towards not only healing yourself but setting an example for everybody else. I truly admire you guys, godspeed!
One interesting point: you mentioned that once you become self aware, you experience more internal suffering and cognitive dissonance. That's super wild because the most common side effects on other people in relationships with people who have cluster bs is cognitive dissonance. So in other words, someone is always suffering cognitive dissonance! How daunting.
Excellent interview. Someone made a valid comment: a selfaware narc or sociopath that undergo treatment are better than normals that have traits of both. Glad to see you are so well informed and there is a lot to learn from you. Thank you both.
@theolouk9346 Enjoy being gullible and manipulated by cluster B personalities. 😂😂 He makes money from the videos, that's why. I've seen so many people simp for self-declared cluster b personalities, and they literally tell you how evil they are, and still, people with tiny IQs who are wishful thinkers will still buy thier bullshit. Hilarious. 😂
Idk if you are sarcastic but idk how that is a deep bond? It just means they use each other for their benefits and if that doesn’t work anymore it’s bye-bye
Why is everyone so rude. These people are coming on here talking from their experience. Its from a place where they’ve already grown. Regards of the issues they have people need to except that people can tweak their lives in a healthier direction and that just because they have a disorder, doesn’t mean they are doomed for life!! It takes balls to talk about it when you already know you are hated for what you are. What is concerning, is the people who are undiagnosed and use this disorder to their advantage!! These people are just not that. In fact I sympathise with them because at one point they were just kids who probably felt more emotions that we did and were that hurt they spiralled in that direction!!
Don't worry too much. People with cluster B personality disorders don't feel many private emotions such as guilt or shame. They might get upset but that will pass. They couldn't care less in the long run.
Lots of people think they are better than others and that includes the people who dont have disorders at all. Its funny how similair we all just really are.
Shut up. No one cares about your feelings or these guy's feelings especially. No matter what these guys say, ALL cluster b types are abusive and exploitative so no one should be coddling them. Get over it.
Nothing to do with intelligence, rather the result of years of therapy work. And if you listen closely you’ll still see traits that are still there, still ingrained and hidden from their own perception.
@@HonestlyHolistica very high functioning sociopath would eventually take advantage of the narcissist. By simply playing and feeding the narcissists ballooned ego because they like it soo much and then overtly taking that away whenever to create a type of manipulation.
@@bellioncrazr sure, if I had friends, but they admit they can’t really care for anyone so I wonder how it works for them you know, they can’t really trust each other
Something I noticed - as he was talking about his attempted sucide I felt empathy and when he finished talking, I was expecting the other guy to empathize but when he quickly moved on to another subject ...my mind felt uneasy but quickly realized that he is diagnosed with narcissism and would not know the emotional empathy therefore can not express it. I just thought this was a good insight. What some of us think is normal is not normal to others. We all live in one reality but we also have a secondary reality we live in (in out head). Some of us are empathic and others are narcissistic, sociopaths, bpd ....all of this are secondary reality.
As someone with ADHD and possible ASPD, I would want to swiftly move on from that subject. Being shown empathy always makes me uncomfortable. I don't know how to respond to someone caring. It's weird.
@@lalinera8279 obviously I can't speak for everyone. But at least me personally... Yeah. It's a strange thing I'm finding. Like go ahead and say that's awful or whatever, but then... Dwelling on it gets weird for me.
I can understand your logic, but I think you're doing what the host often talks about where he says that people often view him as a 'narcisist' and then see him through that lense, and forget that he's an actual person. You've made the assumption that he handled that interaction that way due to his narcissism and overlaid a pathological response onto his reaction, effectively you've seen him as a 'narcisist' and failed to consider that he may have in fact felt an emotion (empathy) towards what he was saying, though chose to continue the stream of questions as that is the main purpose of the video.
@chap8938 Offering emotional empathy would not have changed the topic of stream. It is a normal social norm. For example, if you hear someone say they lost their loved one recently, you give comfort, condolences...it doesn't matter what kind of situation you are in...as a person, you know that emotionally, it is difficult for anyone to go through that. It is the behavior of comforting eachother that makes us social animals. I do see him as a person obviously. What I wrote is my observation. That moment was not a mistake. He was not in a rush. A person not addressing suicide, death, sickness, in general human suffering.....has some kind of issue. And that is what I pointed out.
It's actually very rare for people with Cluster B personality disorders to be honest about their condition and to go public like this. There's no doubt that these are dangerous to others as well as themselves and are best avoided in real life, but thanks for sharing your stories.
Yea, I don't get sociopath from is personality traits especially with his fear that his friends are mad at him when they don't call right back. Definitely seems like he has the spectrum of BPD but not sociopathy. Trust me, my ex is a sociopath and he was the complete opposite. He definitely didn't care if you didn't call him back because he was on to the next person.
Amazing interview Guys 😊 I have a family full of mental health issues. My sister being a schizophrenic is the one which gets the most stigma. Yes, she hears auditory voices and has done many inappropriate things due to her illness but she is not aggressive whatsoever and is a very sweet person afflicted. Keep up dispelling myths and providing brilliant content 👌
I can see that both of you have done work on yourself. Well done! I've known people with ASPD and I've always understood it as a need to control their own life completely. The trouble is, social organizations require some relinquishing of autonomy to follow the rules of the organization. That's why ASPD people don't fit in. I've noticed the need to get revenge (e.g. outsmarting in some way) when their freedom is restricted. I have also seen the compulsive lying to justify the rule breaking. I can see it requires a lot of managing. What your guest has to his advantage is that he's smart.
Been waiting for this, thank you J. and J.! 🔥 Ho-ly f*ck, except for a few differences, I totally relate! I always say that I'm the nicest person you'll meet--unless you step on my toes, then hell hath no fury. RE expressions, I actually left a comment on another channel a long time ago, saying that I prefer the term "sociopath" over "AsPD." Due to the misconceptions and the stigma though, I've changed my mind and now prefer the latter. Apart from that, sociopathy isn't synonymous with "pure" AsPD, but it's still a subtype, similar to the BPD/NPD subclassifications. Yep, we definitely have our own moral code. You harm someone we deem as needing protection, you're toast. Btw, you heard me say that CB peeps who underwent therapy are much more advanced than "norm-al" folks who haven't, and I stand by that. Anyway, would love it if you guys did more collabs.
Thank you for making this video happen, you are both amazing role models both for men and trauma survivors everywhere. You are living proof that the work is worth it
Yes I've been a member of alcoholics anonymous to sinse 2002, joined when I was 28. I'm 49 now. Work the 12 steps daily. I've had about roughly 18 years sober time. Well done son your an inspiration to your aspd brethren. Saint Anger Wales. Great Britain.
It is embarrassing to admit i was diagnosed with Paranoid Schizophrenia, Psychosis, ASPD, ADHD and just Psychopathy itself i take medication for my symptoms and I have to check in with my therapist and psychiatric nurse..i just don't want to feel judged by others i have a hard time living like this i live in the woods in a tent away from society for over 12 years because of this i don't want to hurt myself or others
I think my ex is a sociopath. She is nice enough and is high functioning. Her lack of remorse and empathy is a bit eerie. And in an intimate relationship there was a lot of controlling behaviour, lying and being manipulative. Very anti establishing too! And just something lacking in general. We stay in touch but I'm much more boundaried than i was and just try to give her what she needs (human connection on her terms) and have zero expectation of reciprocity
wow, you managed to stay friends and humane with your ex despite her mental disorder. Good lad you are. Good to establish healthy boundaries for yourself too.
“I don’t start things” Yesssss and revenge is what I relate to. For me the revenge is impulsive and I feel guilt. I also relate to the reputation part… I don’t care who sees me acting a fool when I’m angry.
Revenge, the impulsive vindictiveness, is one of the very incomprehensible elements of the Cluster B personality, for me. The other element is the sadistic pleasure from other's pain that I've witnessed Narcissists enjoy. Between those two things, I got trapped for lots of years with Narcissists, from my parents to my last boyfriend. I've heard it from lots of others, and found it to be true myself, that we just could not BELIEVE that what we thought was happening was actually what was what was happening.
@@sunnyadams5842 It often comes about through child abuse and so you need to basically be patient with these people, show you are not weak, and show that you are willing to be loyal and call them out on it and outright demand that they grow tf up and stop being so weak--because falling back onto your pathological childhood behaviors IS weakness. And they need to stop seeing compassion as weakness too tbh, the worst always end up seeing love and vulnerability as being weak, but then fall back on the terrible parts of their childhood. Like for example, a girl that had cigarette burns because her abusive father put cigarettes out on her, is going to do weird shit like wanting her lover to put out cigarettes on her. It's actually pretty sick now that I see myself saying this out loud, but these are the kind of messed up things you see with some people that they can hide very well behind their social mask, and makes them so difficult to deal with for normal empathetic people (and is funny to me when guys complain about "badboy" types as if that and sociopathy is the same, and not getting that the girl they put on a pedestal is like this and not the sweet person everyone thinks she is). So in other words, a basic part of the sadism is I think a control and power thing from being so powerless as children, back when they didn't have any ability to control the damage and pain and lovelessness being done to them. So there's a component to the impulsive revenge thing which is basically all about them just wanting to assert their own agency and sense of control, which makes people like this have to struggle very very hard not to retaliate against you for being hurt or feeling their trust is broken because keeping in mind, these are literally the behaviors they learned from their parents since infancy and so they are struggling and fighting it daily in interpersonal relations. Which I think makes some people weak or suckers to them, is the ones that don't want to change end up more easily exploiting and taking advantage of the normal amounts of pity, empathy, and sympathy which we tend to feel once we KNOW why they are this way, which other than psychopathy most disorders typically stem from childhood traumas (although not always, I knew someone who said her childhood was totally normal, in fact two relations I remember them saying they didn't have any abuse or trauma and it kinda confused and shocked me because they both acted like abused children in a sense, one of whom allegedly had a personality disorder so idk where that came from but then I think her non-abusive past may be why she appears way more normal and not borderline to me and why she's such a loving, sweet, loyal, wonderful person and is not as vindictively chaotic in a hurtful and manipulative way the way many BPD are though also in fairness she's self aware and went to therapy so :shrugs:) But of course you already know all about this, because you basically just relived all those traumas with your boyfriend by trying to subconsciously replicate your fucked up parental relationship and trying to vicariously use him to heal the damage and make yourself feel loved and validated by your parent by getting another person to basically help you relive that abusive relationship only now you're the one that is in control and trying to get your mom or dad to love you by making your boyfriend love you. If that makes sense. I see it all the time and sadly a lot of people especially young girls just do not make it, they get to like age 40 without ever having therapy and getting things worked out so they repeat this cycle hoping the next guy to change. I think that is often not something that is talked about, and people like to dump on Cluster B's (rightfully) for the shit they pull, but that does not ever touch on the reason why (usually women) pursue those relationships in the first place. It is not as if these guys are just out there pulling women left and right to hurt them for their own sick pleasure and discard them. Some guys do, but there are some women that just straight up actively chase these men or try and seduce them just because of their own reasons. It's like, if you are raised by alcoholics, and you KNOW that they are alcoholics, and that now that you are too, you can't just sit there and keep blaming the liquor store for existing when it is you who chooses to go there and get get a couple handles of vodka every single week. That is you deliberately putting yourself there to get yourself drunk and repeat the habit and behaviors that you (mis)learned from childhood and that you're never gonna be truly satisfied and happy in having a normal life without purposefully walking PAST the liqour store this time, that only some do, and many do not, but just go right back in there and wind up in pain and hungover tomorrow just like they did every single other day all year. Then they whine and complain about the laws or some shit because they never bothered changing their own behavior and what the real problem with that is, it's because if you ever want to have a family (or just end up with one accidentally, which tends to happen a lot for people with mental health issues and substance abuse) then all you're ever going to do is inflict yourself and inflict your own parents onto your children through yourself by not changing. And so therefore the cycle literally HAS TO end with you. Because if you're not the one who's already broken it before your children can learn to walk and say their first words, then you've just guaranteed that it is your own son and daughter that are not going to walk past and they are going right in that liquor store and they are buying a handle and dating a narcissist because you never fixed you.
@pandemicneetbux2110 I admire your input. I just have one more thing to add. Many woman from traumatic childhood where dad was not emotionally present often choose someone just like dad.
I think sociopath is a “hot” personality (anger/defensive/against others) and “loosing the temper” is when they get overwhelmed and the pre frontal cortex goes offline for a while and the PFC is the “guardian of good behavior” according to Raine, so when that goes off line things can get fruity. Whereas I think a psychopath is a “cold” personality (manipulative/calm/calculating) and they are born with a smaller than average amygdala (18% smaller than average) and so they just don’t feel emotions like regular people and don’t feel empathy. They are cold.
I think your sadly mistaken. Sociopaths are highly manipulative and lie to get supply. As do most that are on the dark spectrum of psychology......basic fundamentals of love. Genuine love that is. The foundation is honesty and treating others way want to be treated. The sociopath will say they love you whole time doing and saying things that oppose love due to their self centered motivations. Basically pathological liars. The lack of empathy equates to a lack of genuine love. If someone lies to you , then it erodes trust. It's also emotional abuse. Even a sociopath hates being lied to. It's also disrespect. Trust, respect, and if you really think about it genuine love is an absence of abuse in any form. A person who intentionally lies to you will eventually betray you if it benefits them. Generally when engaging with sociopaths and you begin calling them on their lies. Well they know they can't control their supply for their selfish ends and will usually backstab and betray and move to the next victim. Again beginning each relationship with lies. Including fawning and love bombing and flattery etc. But they don't mean the words .......lack of integrity and sure .....if they can turn you sociopathic and get you to join in on their shenanigans. I suppose it could work long term. But when comes to character makes both them and you low life's. And deceptive manipulative people with low self esteem and integrity...less human really. Have a brother calling himself a sociopath and has demons etc. Then he wanna tell me that just because I'm blood doesn't make me family that love does. Riddle me this tho. What does a sociopath know about love? Even sociopaths really don't enjoy being around other sociopaths. Neah they tend to need empathetic people they can lie to to get what they want at others expense and use alot of manipulation tactics to get it. Very entitled and self centered and is also true sociopaths and psychopaths are really narcissistic also....can be quite cold and heartless. False selves and kind of ......no. really fake. Basically lacking in conscience and impulsive people. Hot? Neah. Charming perhaps. But they'll even bite the hands that feed them often then use words to get the upper hand. Lots of lies too. Better is an honest enemy than a lying friend. Me.....I've been screwed over by these types many times. Rather be alone cleaning my toilet than in the presence of a compulsive or pathological liar. These types have zero conscience about lying if it benefits them.
I wish I was more sociopathetic sometimes. It must be nice not to feel guilt or remorse and be able to easily block shitty people. I wish I could do this easily.
@@MapsLab-u5zI think the person is talking about emotional detachment. This is one of the most clear sign: you can pretty much avoid people and left people forever without caring and feeling nothing about it.
That little smile…Im here smiling with you ASPD, BPD, NPD check. I’ve done and am still doing the work but that little smile is pervasive and enduring or is it endearing and persuasive 😂
Props to you guys in being aware of who / what you are, speaking openly about it, and educating others on the condition / perspectives you experience. Everyone out there has different reactions, setbacks and potencies in feeling different things in day to day life. Many of us "neurotypicals" have flaws that you guys likely do not, that would likely baffle you guys too. Maybe they aren't as potent or noticeable as the conditions you both have, but they are there. Thanks for your metacognition and efforts in mitigating the harmful elements of yourselves, as we all should be, gents.
Every life has a purpose or you would not be here. Sometimes it's hard to know your purpose but I've found that by just continuing to follow your positive emotions, whenever you can access them, over the long-term, you will get closer and closer to knowing what you were meant to do in this life and that will feel more and more fulfilling. I wish you both love and a fulfilling life. It took me about 20 years to figure it out but now I absolutely know my purpose and am passionate about it and fulfilled. We ALL can obtain that over time. Just keep going. You guys have already achieved so much in life just by breaking the cycles of toxicity and abuse from your childhoods. That's a beautiful thing and you should feel proud of yourselves. Hugs to you both!
Felt like I was listening to myself talk. Dropped out of school and never thought lying about a college degree was anything other than checking the box on some HR managers chart as they complied to nonsense system of poor education and indoctrination. Adulting is hard and sportsball is a waste of human experience… don’t even get me started on revenge
I learned in therapy for major depression how it was on a spectrum and that's SO important to understand. You have Sociapaths that work hard at managing their lives ,understanding themselves and idk if it's a change as much as it's a choice not to act on.. One may lie habitually, tell stories and screw your boyfriend. Another may spit in peoples food all the time. My sister was a spitter, liar , theif , beat my ass .. made me fight people, shoved me in weird places. But she didn't kill me and she also had a hilarious sence of humor and she was fun 😂.. i miss her , i choose to stay away from her now but seriously she was so important to me for decades. But when i learned how real certain hate feelings were for me , i had to stop seeing her... I'm happy hearing this guy ❤.. i don't think he cares if anyones happy with him as much as he just wants a better life for himself.
I was diagnosed with NPD, and I totally see a lot of each of you, in me. My morales are different tho, I go by one golden rule: "Treat others as you would like to be treated". I tend to always find a way to blame myself for everything. I also suffer from panic attacks (happened my entire life). I used to throw up before and during my hockey games, in what everyone told me was called "the butterfly's" (more like fireflies if you ask me). History of substance abuse. High intelligence. I was shocked when I got my diagnosis, and still find myself trying to fully understand.
Yep I understand that reactive revenge or justice. Also a friend of mine in his 20's who's diagnosed as a Primary Psychopath, was being bullied in the local bus station by 5 male bullies his age. It went on for day's, then he snapped, and went to the bus station with a claw hammer in his hand to smash them all up and put them in hospital. I admired his courage. Thankfully, he was stopped by the police , taken to his psychiatrist. What pissed me off was he was stigmatized but nothing was done to the bullies by the police. It was wrong him wanting to beat them with a claw hammer I know, but they provoked him. Leave him alone and he's fine. He's a good kid, he's primary psychopath and also diagnosed co morbid with ADHD and bi-polar. But he's lovely. I've taken him under my wing, I'm an old dude now at age 49 lol. I can relate to this guy's upbringing and aspd, thankfully I never crossed over into primary psychopathy from secondary Psychopathy. I do have a shit load of empathy, compassion, regret, guilt etc. I despise the institutions, schools, governments etc, only the bad parts though. Brilliant thanks dudes. Saint Anger
dialectical behavioral therapy changed my life as someone with BPD. learning to be able to understand that the world isn't black and white, and instead of living an "either-or" life, but a "both-and" kinda life, ya know ya know?
Jacob, the job you are doing on line is so important. You might not even know it, but you are shining a light in the world by exposing your condition. I really wish you inpprove in Therapy and bring light to your symptons ! You may not see it but there are amazing things that make you a good person. Lots of love
If society is fucked up isnt it just healthy to be against the society? As Krishnamurti said, it is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society. I am against society too, in a way, but I am not antisocial or sociopath. It seems more like a political/philosophical stance than a disorder.
Right on point! Society is above all a social construct and is defined by the majority of the community. In the place where I live it is considered perfectly normal to abuse and torture animals because they are...well...animals...It is not even seen as wrong. Also, it is normal to verbally and even physically abuse people from LGBT community or any community that is considered "different"...In Iran it is normal to beat women who are not wearing hijab, in Afghanistam it is normal to stone a woman to death for leaving a house without permission, in Jemen it is normal that a 55 year old marries an 8- year old...Am I to accept that just because it's normal somewhere? For me any kind of abuser should bite the sidewalk if you know what I mean. And if that makes me mentally ill, so be it! I'll gladly be the illest of all.
I have similar traits of a narcissist, but I’m not. I’m a serious introvert including depression and anxiety. It’s a daily struggle. I’m grateful to my mental health professionals and medicine.
I really love this. I love the fact that you two are doing the hard work on yourselves. As an “empath” who has been in relationships with people who demonstrate narcissistic traits, it’s really refreshing to hear what people with these kinds of traits/behaviors are dealing with internally in comparison to a person with ASPD. (Of course, I too am working on myself to diminish co-dependent tendencies.) CPTSD is no joke and we all react differently to it. My thinking is that - in some cases - a narcissist is an empath that got hurt or betrayed too many times while growing up. The space to be vulnerable was shut down. But this interview is wonderfully insightful and vulnerable at the same time.
They are calculating! They love deeply, obsessively even sometimes, but the drive to get something easy or for free is pathological... predatory! I see the cogs turning with my friend and I then have to be one step ahead as a psychologist and think about how we can navigate both our psyches towards common goals x Great interview, thank you ❤ x
what a mind blowing and honest conversation. I can relate in so many ways to the guy being interviewed. I just got the label "Personality disorder not otherwise specified".
@@kalyasaifywhat are you even trying to say? You are all over the place with that word salad. There is no "healthy arrogance". Go read the Bible, find Jesus and find some peace. I'm not the healthiest individual, but even I can see through your comment that you are lost. Jesus can help you. It helped me due to always trying to keep the commandments aswell, because otherwise I would just go around and get what I want one way or the other. Jesus teaches no arrogance, no stupid behavior (or writing comments like yours), and bring people to the truth. Without God you will have people like you saying "I love me a good narc", like what is that? Jesus does more for you than any therapy once you value his word, I can guarantee you that. Its either Jesus way or the highway in that case. Took me some time to get that into my head, and I'm still learning and far from perfect.
You both have remained in positive alignment regardless of the shit others have given you. I believe that you will definitely be able to make a difference in society
Great interview brother, and really cool hair. You're well reseached and honesty this had better information than 99% of the so called psychology channels on here. Keep up the good work!
@@Afo2550 they absolutely are, in research, as faktor 1, and factor 2 psychopathy. just because they arent used in a area, doesnt mean they dont exist. it has never been disproven, and only proven from time to time again.
I am neurotypical and have a Sociopath as a friend, and another who is a Narcissist. I do see logically how interest in one's own gains is advantageous, and even imperative for us all to succeed. The only thing I don't get re them both (they aren't friends) is that their approaches seem to be so heavily (even comically) focused on their gains in the short term, but so so lacking a long-game plan. It seems to be a policy of very short term, sharp benefit in return for a range of mid and longer game negative outcomes for them. E.g: losing friendships, losing trust of broad swathes of people, creating sometimes dangerous enemies committed to revenge, an overall bad reputation not just socially but professionally also. Thus a refusal of others to cooperate with them further, hampering their advancement etc as a whole. Fascinating, and I have to admire their resourcefulness and agility in the short term, particularly in business. I wonder, does either type see a kindred spirit at least in a sense with a psychopath, or are you as disgusted and as baffled by them as we are? :)
I find the man on the left disturbingly relatable, sans the lack of guilt. I felt immediately guilty of my own behavior when he talked about the "stores" (this used to be embarrassingly common for me) and the assumptions that people hated me or were annoyed by me if they didn't respond to my attention/texts. I'm overwhelmingly empathetic, so while my poor impulse control causes me to act ot think irrationally in one moment, in the next I feel regretful and as if they would be justified in their hate towards me because I deserve it. My sister, mom, and I made a pact to never commit suicide because we've experienced so much in our family. So I simultaneously think they would be better off if I died and cannot do it because I'm worried and feel guilty about potentially hurting them. I relate so much to the "empty" feeling, but i have learned to recognize it and pull myself out.
I commend both of you for speaking honestly to the disorders. Clusters B's are a very challenging construct and defense mechanism for the diagnosed and the people in their lives that they affect. Thank you
I absolutely love this interview, you're one of the only people who can make me watch interviews this long :) I am so glad to hear so much about aspd, the internal experience has been such a mystery, such a shame.
Congratulations to these 2 gentlemen for being upfront and honest with the world about their personality disorder. So that we have more of an accurate understanding of it. Most people with these conditions try and hide it to manipulate the people around them. Be very thankful guys for this!!
Thanks so much, guys. As a lifetime empathic victim of narcs and sociopaths, this helped me so much. No longer do I think of those people who struggle with these issues as monsters. Some psychologists out there on YT want us to believe that narcs are hopelessly sick and will never change because they don’t think anything is wrong with them. These videos are certainly eye openers for sure. Much gratitude for you both. Keep up the good work and keep the videos coming, please!
I LOVE that you did this video! I have just started watching and Iam laughing so hard my tummy hurts 😂😂. You have a good attitude about this tuff subject. And I commend you for it. I have dated a version of you both 😉 so its very interesting to see you two next too each other, because it makes the difference SO clear! Anti social might not be social phobia, but In my experience you can have it either way. You dont need the validation to sustain yourself. While a narc does. And we can see this in your body language. Joe is calm and centerd while TNM is out going, takes more eye contact and entertain the audience more frequent. When you turn and show you dark side, Joe will go from 0 to murder in under a minute. While TNM will degrade and backstab you over a longer period of time. So you both have good qualities in relationships AND you will cost people. Sadly a hell of a lot more than the average person. Thats whats makes these personalities a problem. But I stay positiv and hope that Psychiatry one day will find answers and healing for this.
I know someone with NPD and sociopathy, with a high I.Q., and his whole life he has never said “sorry “. He also has no friends. Character and reputation matter and these bullies eventually end up in their own special universe. Better than everybody and looking for ways to use lesser beings they rationalize their evil acts.
What a interesting interview. I have ADD(ADHD), so yeah I get some of what he is dealing with. I think we are wired a little differently from the norms. We get calm/focus better in stressful situations and so on. I don't think all of who this guy is just comes down to some type of sociopathy, it could just be his ADHD. I loved the part were he talked about the self-destructive behavior's being the root to some of this. I very much relate, except I grew up with a sociopathic parent so I have a deep hatred of people who physically harm others. I think that prevented me from becoming my parent . So yeah we all have our issues.😆
Thank you for sharing, I'm a therapist and I really appreciate that you brought those questions of the internal experience that is not well defined in the DSM. It's very helpful to me in order to better help my patients.
@@PaisleyMarie80 you got a lot to learn. I didn't say I like them. There's a difference. But you wouldn't understand that it seems. Did you know that we ALL have 1-3 traits in us so we're all a bit narcissistic from one degree to the other. You have to have 5 or more to be one. Also people see a trait or two in someone and automatically they're a narc. There's overlapping disorders that kinda look like NPD also. Also think about this. You meet someone. You can't believe how much you like and think about this person so quickly. You miss them. You laugh with them. They are kind and patient but most of all they listen good. You two have so much in common. You stare into their eyes and fall in love. The narc let's you talk so they can get to know you fast and so they can take on your traits to make them a person. They're not out to get you ( unless they're the psychopathic kind) They actually really want to know what love is. They need to feel it. They weren't taught or shown it. They turned their empathy off in childhood as a defense mechanism as to not have to feel the horrible things they felt from abuse so bad that normal people wouldn't understand. Or they were highly spoiled in all the wrong ways and not shown love. Anyways they walk in hell everyday and the empath is supposed to be empathetic, kind, loving, and forgiving. That's why they're drawn to them. However an empath needs to know boundaries and keep them. She can still show the narc what love is even from afar. She's never ugly and hateful or revengeful. Theyve seen enough hate. Yes I do love them and my heart hurts for them. They never mean to hurt people unless they're a psychopath. Í think they're screaming and trying to show people their pain so it's not so lonely. Most psychopaths aren't killers. You prob work with one or two. They do have their place in this world. They can be very intelligent. All psychopaths are narcs but not all narcs are psychopaths. Anyways my whole point before my little tangit was when you look into the narcs eyes and fall in love, what you're looking into are mirrors reflecting yourself back to you. So you fell in love with yourself. Who's the narc?? I don't even know why I wrote all of this out. You prob don't care. Oh well maybe someone will read it and learn something. Take care
Thank you for this video, I love educating myself about personality disorders. I believe there are different spectrums of it and no 2 people are same, we all have our individual characteristics, that’s what makes every person unique. You look very much like my New Zealand ex, but a much younger version of him - you have the same nice eyes and similar features. He had something too, different but was quite loving towards me until the split, he got nasty and took away everything he gave me, he discarded me. Later he did try to come back to me but I didn’t take him back and moved on. I do miss him though and think of him sometimes. I think we learn from all our relationships, they bring a little something into us and we in them. Keep up the great videos ❤
As an empath living with a spouse with ASPD I didn't think I was going to be able to make it thru this episode but I was pleasantly surprised at the honesty and truthfulness. Thanks for validating what I have perceived as the thought processes behind the outbursts and behaviors.
Please get out. You're not an empath, you're codependent. Empath is a concept people use to stay comfortable being a victim. Not an actual real world verifiable concept. You're hurting both them and yourself by being there. If you're as empathetic as you think, please have some empathy for yourself. If you still believe you're an empath and not codependent ask yourself what feeling and motivation I have for this. I'm willing to bet your default reaction was defensiveness and feeling personally attacked, not reading the sheer terror and fear and love and compassion that are actually behind this. If I'm wrong, that's awesome. I hope I'm wrong. I worry I'm not, and I've seen myself and far too many others give up years or decades of their life thinking "this person just hasn't been loved enough. My love will heal them" only to find out later "this person does not value my love at all. They value me as a tool and a resource"
This is amazing content 🎉😍💘 Jo and Jacob , these hunks must do MOREEE ❤ 🔥🔥 Jo how is your relationships , do you need a partner to feel stable and secure ? Since you mentioned you have an identity is your relationships for any resource your lacking or is it for your own kind of “love” and what is love defined as to you?
I like this a lot it makes me feel less alone ❤ sometimes i wonder if i have anything. I have bipolar but i seem to feel like i am lacking in empathy lately
Did you see his eyes when the music went off on your computer?!? That right there is the perfect definition of a sociopath- they're always waiting for a threat. It's like their brains are always in defensive mode.
This is good for other people with these disconnections to see, specifically within this format, just two seemingly-normal guys chatting with no stigma attatched; neither of them feeling interrogated by the other, so that maybe at least one person can see themselves in this and can potentially encourage them to consider whether they should seek help for similar issues, and ultimately become more transparent about who they are, in order to reduce harm for others they interact with. A disorder like this is only as bad as one lets it get (and its easier to let it get worse), as they can either deny or take ownership their true natural impulses. If they begin to own the the reality of their conscience, then they can potentially start to navigate it better.
I can relate to a few things Jo has described. Wondering if thats the adhd, either that or clusterbmilkshake was right on her past comment regarding us adhd’ers are for the watching 🙈😂 This was a great interview Jacob & Jo & a topic I’ve been wanting to learn a lot more of. I agree Jacob, learning more of what’s going on internally & the thought processes would be very helpful in understanding aspd. I realise every person with a condition is different. Can you ask Jo next time if he sees people as objects? How does Jo view/treat friends & has this changed over time being self aware & doing the work? What age did Jo become fully self aware? Does Jo take medication for adhd & if so how does it change his aspd & adhd symptoms internally & externally.
The most interesting part about this interview was when they touched on splitting! He said I won’t split on my clinician/therapist! Which would imply a choice when it comes to splitting. Now I was under the impression that splitting which is a form of black and white thinking (All good or all bad) was purely a subconscious thing, it would seem not if we are to take what they say literally.
When someone is already entering therapy, that means they know they are sick and submitting themselves to recovery; by that time, they know they have to put everything on the table to get better. So why would you see this as some big AHA relevation when it's moreso they splitted on you when they didn't realise they were wrong back then? You also fail to realise a therapist is strictly a professional and not someone personal relations with the ill person, so they wouldn't likely be as emotionally charged or triggered in any way to "split" on the therapist either. But at the end of the day you can only perceive it the way you want, so do you.
There seems to be two kind of peoples regardless of their mental health. People who want to better themselves, become the best possible version of themselves and add value to society. And people who bring up the worst of themselves, victimize themselves and harm society. You guys are definitely adding value to yourself and society. Loads of respect. I’ve seen both people with personality disorders and without disorders get the best or worst out of themselves. In the end, the actions matter, not the label.
Truer words have never been spoken.
Perfectly stated
Its not that simple. People give and take in different ways
Society hates the former and exalts the latter.
They try to make the former the latter. Because society is composed of the latter. Society is more powerful and effective if it's inhabitants are addicted to and dependent on it's approval.
I agree that their conversation contributes to understanding the issue so that as a society we become aware of what causes people to become narcissistic or sociopathic and that way we can hopefully avoid treating or neglecting our kids in certain ways to ensure a better mental health for them as much as possible.
Really great interview on both sides. I loved that bit about how cluster B’s who have gone through treatment and recovery can actually be healthier than regular people who have never worked on themselves. So true I think.
I know right?? one of the most encouraging things I've heard
great comment.. if "healthy" means adapting to our circumstances and learning to be truly functional, then (as a person w NPD) I agree with you.
NOBODY can heal themselves ,maybe modify a few outward behaviours.ONLY Jesus your maker can heal your heart!Bless
@@lesleybrown1583 that’s a ridiculously harmful thing to say. “Nobody can heal themselves?!?” That’s stupid. Your “god” created free will right? “He” didn’t do that so we could just always choose wrong, in theory “He” did that so we could make our own destiny and carve our own paths and choose better for ourselves. Do everyone you ever speak to the goodness of never saying that again. The harm you do by telling people that “you can’t heal” is unfathomable. Just stop.
@@lesleybrown1583 I totally disagree with your opinion, even though I respect your right to have the view that only Jesus can heal people, which is a common one.
I grew up in New Zealand and have had many traumatic experiences throughout my life, yet I've managed to do a lot of extremely difficult, not to mention painful, healing work by myself and hope to assist others eventually. ❤
It’s definitely in the eyes. Very intense. Thank you for this video. I’m learning how to refrain from demonizing individuals who have these personalities.
The guy on the left’s eyes or both men?
This is a valuable inside perspective. This interviewed sociopath has a deep insight into his problem, which makes him likeable.
Strangely I'd trust him more than the other guy lol
True.
@@samxsarai don't know about that but the sociopath is certainly more likeable and relatable.
@@samxsaralol
Love the "all cluster B are borderline at the core" idea.
That's how it's always struck me- it all comes down to intolerability for strong emotions and trauma, but the behaviours come out in different ways.
Wait until Autism gets introduced into the formula...
Didn't Sam Vaknin say something similar?
Along the lines of that a narcissist is a borderline but with defenses.
Thus when the narc collapses, as in the defenses break, he becomes functionally and emotionally like the borderline(narcissistic injury).
I listened to a professor of psychology recently who argues that all Cluster B *and* other common mental health issues like anxiety and depression are all the same thing. Not being able to deal with strong emotions due to trauma and the only difference is the type of defence mechanisms we built up and the strength of those defence mechanisms (often relative to the amount of trauma). If you look in to schema therapy it basically says the same thing.
I like that he corrected BPD to CPTSD and the overlap is so strong between the two criteria. I would lean towards CPTSD.
@@DivineLogos please don't quote Dr Sam Vaknin incorrectly.
Any DSV is his word for word. Others are a summary of his long talks and my conclusive theory.
Also ASPD is just physchopath in my rant (that's how Dr Sam Vaknin refers to it)
I'll say it like he says it: A borderline is a failed narcissists. DSV
Borderline has an issue turning it's internal good self object to be an external good self object, so they feel they are right in the moment, try to be good to others but helplessly (horrible at executing their plan externally) just flat out can't make things work and display horrible behaviour to society and loved ones. Then go back and forth with external objects being bad and good, making horrible life choices.
A cover narcissists wishes to be an over narcissists. DSV
A narcissists wants people to feed their delusion. They absolutely hate their reality being destroyed, so they can't take it and will run away thinking you are the narcissists trying to manipulate them. DSV However they will try to manipulate people to feed their delusion of self (that they are the perfect ones)
A psychopath is not looking for glorification from others, they just wants to do what they want regardless of how people feel (infact toying with humans emotions ro get what they want is an experiment to see if their goals are achievable) . A psycho will either shutdown to a covert physchopath if they fail their goals. Or lash out physically... hence why they run into problems with the law (not like they care much for the law in the first place).
A borderline is at the bottom of the barrel of these developed denfense mechanisms.
A borderline wish they were better at manipulating people for themselves (Narcissists)
A narcissists wishes to be a psychopath. Better at planning long term and not getting their false reality broken down (the problem is they live in delusion already)
A psychopath lives in reality. They can lash out. they know the consequences but couldn't be bordered, because in the moment their goal is to cause damage (and they are good at achieving a goal) hence the law, other people's emotions are irrelevant in achieving their plans (destruction). The only thing a psychopath wishes to be better at, is lashes out in a without getting punished by the law.
I've spent 40+ hours watching his video over the past year.
Am I mentally well, not entirely because i have ADHD. The reason for my peaked interest in mental health was my new found relationship of over 1 year, so I take mental health topic seriously. It's a characteristic flaw of mine (hyperfocusing on things). I'm still trying to learn my covert problem as I only got to know my overt issue through Sam while seeking what was making my partner stone wall without any fault of mine.
Please watch more Sam Vaknin, that man has published experience as long as I've been in the womb. And even more before my parents met.
Just watch the interview and count how many times "interviewer" wish he could do something the "interviewee" said he does.
I've always been good at reading humans, thankfully I'm not using it for utter evil. Humans are easy to read, but I just for some reason try to give all a benefit of a doubt.
Borderline however wishes to be a mere narcissists (they both live in delusions constantly as their coping mechanism) just watch a real overt borderline interviewed by a narcissists.
It's so good to see someone else with BPD and ASPD. Look forward to watching this!
Absolutely fantastic video and so relatable and well articulated. Also Jacob fantastic questions. The revenge side for me is strong, if you do bad to me, I will retaliate and I have the mindset of "how dare you" it isn't okay and you will pay the price sort or thing. I have had a lot of previous issues with the police but couldn't put that down to my ASPD, more the upbringing I had and what I was taught was right and wrong.
I call my BPD my humanity, how I describe it is that it levels me out and levels out the ASPD. They balance each other out and work together. In regards to Sociopath vs ASPD, if I had a preference it would be Sociopath but even though they're the same thing it feels like the word Sociopath has more negative stigma than ASPD. But yeah I smile when I hear or say the word.
Thank you Jacob for the video I feel heard and seen. Joe you explained everything so well. Thank you.
I'm really glad you related! Honestly it gave me so much comfort about my sister since she had the same conditions
@@noisyglamourappreciate your story, I find it fascinating the interactions between the mechanics of the two disorders considering parts of them seem to be contradictory to each other.
you look amazing 😍😮
ASPD/BPD that's a gnarly combo to live with.
Same as my sister LOL
Why they call it BPD.. EMOTIONAL DEREGULATION.. THAT CROSSES THE BORDERLINE TO FACTOR 2 PSYCHO = BPD..ALSO Most ARE ADHD..
@@Thenamelessnarcissist😵💫 Do you think you and your sister’s diagnoses were affected by your childhood or is it genetic?
yes, very common though
@@stuff1784 All cluster Bs are developmental trauma disorders.
It's in they eyes.
Yeah, you can see if somebody is fucked in the head or not from the eyes. I have crazy eyes too and it makes me wonder what kind of fucked up I am
You can see the fight flight response.
Totally amazing, compassionate and appropriate response after the brutally honest and educational video these two gentlemen put out. Really. Kudos.
Actually, i think it is more in the blink rate of the eyes...
@breemorrison901 that's what they meant, no doubt.
Something I've learned over the past few years is that social anxiety/GAD (which I was diagnosed with at 14) can also manifest with symptoms that are similar to ASPD, i.e. a dislike/distrust of other humans and society as a whole. Also can cause people to be easily agitated, aggressive and prone to violence. I find it interesting how different personality disorders and mental illnesses can manifest in the most unusual and seemingly unrelated ways. I guess the point of my comment is that the more we learn about and get to know ourselves the more control we can have over our symptoms.
I have GAD and my ex has ADHD and sociopathy. It doesn't at all manifest the same way. You would need to either be in a relationship with a person with ASPD whether friend, family, or spouse to see the difference.
So true! Im an adult child of an alcoholic and dysfunctional family, was also diagnosed with GAD as early as 8 years old because I had panic attacks every night and severe OCD up til high school. I share a lot of ASPD traits and have wondered if I was a sociopath or a narcissist. But I very clearly know that I have empathy and I get so much happiness from being kind and connecting with others in a deep way.
But among what you mentioned, I also lack sensitivity and I suppose I am manipulative, but just in the way that I know I will get more assistance in life by playing up my sweet innocent girl qualities. I don't know if that's manipulative or just human. But I never manipulate for bad or at the expense of others, Im just extremely observant and analytical and have gathered data on how certain ways we act lead to what. But the lack of sensitivity definitely has to do with my upbringing - absolutely no one let me cry or feel sorry for myself, so I am repulsed by that behavior in others. It's something I'm trying to work on though because I know it comes from my wounds and empathy/sensitivity is a good thing.
Absolutely, have you heard of PDA ?
Just learning because looks like my Granddaughter of 28 months might have it, it’s part of the autistic spectrum makes a lot of sense.
Check out PDA something I’m just learning about because of my Granddaughter sometimes people are misdiagnosed.
@@straykittsco.950curious to know more?
Definitely agree on the connection between all of these disorders and CPTSD
Interesting when he made the comment about being sexually assaulted his mind went blank. It occurs when you revisit traumatic experiences and the mind wants to block it.
It made me feel very sad for him.
Because it is too painful to reexperience. I think that is why they blocked all feelings as they were secerly abused psychologically physically and emotionally.
It make Total sense to me
CPTSD core makes so much sense especially when you said “Borderline will get in a relationship, NPD will get a new job based on a fantasy, and ASPD will go on a destruction spree.” It’s like all various forms of extreme coping for extreme chronic trauma you feel deep down you can’t escape from.
every high school student is sold a fantasy about a career 😂 nobody knows what the job is like until they’re there (unless they have a really good critical thinking faculty)-what I saw with NPD was frequent job changes. edit: ofc the guy i’m thinking of is delusional, and had delusional thinking about his jobs, but having illusions itself isn’t necessarily delusions. that’s all. might want to draw the distinction or else we might start to admit that our civilization is what makes us crazy.
Perception of slights CAN be very accurate. It doesn’t necessarily automatically mean you’re wrong in feeling mad at someone or annoyed at someone. I honestly find that the honesty and what others see as “remorseless” is actually respectable. You’re standing up for yourself.
@@michelle1813 Tout à fait d’accord !
Ngl this sounds like a really cheesy setup for a joke.
"So a narcissist and a sociopath walk into a bar..."
That’s EXACTLY what I was thinking.
As a UK parent of a lovely lad with adhd, aspd & bpd this interview was hugely insightful. The complexity of these personalities can indeed be such a struggle for those living it and those supporting it and even worse for those who simply don't understand it so thank you both for this discussion. However just to note my lad, now in his 30's, has achieved many things most of us would dare not contemplate as he is a risk taker and won't bow down to social norms but gets things done in his own, often chaotic, way, most of all he achieves being a single father on a daily basis, which I have the ultimate respect for, as we know parenting is the hardest job going!! Just wanted to share I'm immensely proud of my lad ❤ We still do clash at times, rarely now, but we both understand how exhausted our relationship can get and on that basis any authentic knowledge and lived experience on this is very beneficial and grounding... For me at least, 'cos he couldn't care less 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Just kidding, Cheers fellas 👍
adhd isn’t a personality but i get what you mean
U asked for the whole alphabet?
Thx for having this interview/ conversation.
I have ADHD and ASPD as well, and could really relate to what he was saying.
Used to be a criminally inclined drug abuser, though after starting ADHD meds and working out every day,
I’ve put all that far, far behind me.
It’s a struggle though as I sometimes just wanna hurt people physically and/ or verbally,
though the thought of jailtime again, being on probation yet again and having to pay fines really stops me from doing so.
Used to be suicidal as well though my dog, meditation, correct medication, working out and quitting illegal drugs fixed that as well.
What can I say, I am what I am and work on myself every day to be and do better in life and with people.
You know The side when you just want to hurt people, I get that a lot nowadays. Used to be a inside emotion where I'd hurt myself to contain the danger I posed nowadays I stopped harming myself and kept my Socialness to a minium or I have my Partner with me. I still struggle to fit in with some Social norm and chose to hold this 'persona' that people see 'someone who looks capable of the situation' when the reality is im showing you this person so you don't know who I am really am. You don't need to know me you just need to know what I want you to know.
Fascinating interview. It seems that ASPD is largely due to major hardships and deprivation in childhood, and maybe environments with a lot of brutality or cruelty. So sociopaths have learned certain types of coping mechanisms, essentially they are survivors... which is very different from psychopaths, who were born with a chip missing in their brains
life is complex... mother nature is not easy to figure out humans or animals... but its fascinating indeed
Not necessarily, there is a big difference between sociopathy and psychopathy. Psychopaths are born, not made. And so it is kind of like the difference between being a man with no legs, or who is literally paralyzed from the waist down, as opposed to someone who was forced to use a wheelchair for the first 15 years of their lives. And so while their leg muscles have indeed atrophied down to next to nothing, and while their instincts may be all wrong for walking, they *do* have the ability to learn to walk, they *could* still try and actually walk and learn how to use their legs with massive amounts of rehab and physical therapy. This is not so with the clinical psychopath that literally just does not have those brain structures there and active. So I think that it's really questionable dealing with ASPD as if they are all the same, and I don't mean to just write someone off as a total loss, but you're going to have a much harder time as a psychopath because psychopaths can be born to completely normal families and lack any empathy, and so it's more like autism. It really doesn't matter which family you get born into while having the genes for psychopathy, although in fairness its the upbringing which defines that nature of psychopathy, that is, the one raised by a family of quiet librarians and academics is more likely to just take a clinically detached perspective and be a functional adult and neurosurgeon, as opposed to the ones born and raised into hookers and addicts or mafia families who are going to be set up for being abusive street dudes since day one because that is what their parents are.
But yes SOCIOPATHY is lol I'm sorry I just got to 28:10 "victimless crimes man victimless crimes like what's the problem" hahaha that's the most classic sociopathic statement ever. "Like I don't get what's the big fucking deal to you people, so what if I set a few mailboxes on fire and sold some smack, you know I didn't rob anyone or anything I didn't commit CRIMES I just broke some stupid laws." I'm sorry this is just very funny to me but anyway sociopathy is yes a bad upbringing thing and so the self sabotage is the saddest part about that, and you need to basically overcome it and work every single day from literally the moment you wake up to when you finally pass out resisting that internal urge, structure, or personality defect, partly because they are socialized so wrong by their parents and the people around them. I honestly expect public schools massively accelerate it and take any latent trauma or abuse by families and turn just abused kids into full on clinical grade sociopaths because now they've taken that abuse, power, control, and violence, as well as being smooth talkers and manipulative, or using deception and charm, and applied it at the entire societal level and now seen things as being in terms of societies and power structures and not just the people that abused them. So those are even harder to work on and you get like Klebold and Harris kind of guys, or street guys or even just corporate sharks and vulture Capitalists and power abusing corrupt cops from that background, when what normally it could have been is just a sort of hurt lonely child setup that at least that person can work really hard to overcome being taught the wrong lessons by their parents or abusive older brother or whatever.
I think that what it takes is massive amount of time, energy, and concentration effort while being surrounded by "normal" people but the problem with that too is, I think, that because they are not like them, it just increases the alienation. And so I don't even know for sure that putting sociopaths in better social concepts is even a good fix, just because all that teaches them is more charm and better masking, than feeling a real connection with anybody. I strongly suspect that for most sociopaths, it is either another abused child or someone who has psychological issues or a borderline girl or something like that that brings them back from the edge. They basically seem to need to be around people that know where they are coming from, but can still love and be functional in a society. Of course, if you leave them around lots of street dudes and in an organized crime family they're never going to change for the better and are going to slip back immediately into their basic instincts so it is also important for them to get away from those bad environments like abusive homes, juvie system, and public school system. I'd imagine something like Montessori schools or something more like laid back scholarly environments that reward passionless critical thinking and functional cognitive empathy are places where they can thrive the best and begin healing the most.
@@pandemicneetbux2110 very well explained
The sociopath I know has confirmed brain damages. "They found..Abnormalities" He said.
@@pandemicneetbux2110 brother, I love your bright mind, you're a good human being. feel hugged man bc you were dropping pure facts the way I wouldn't be able atm while PMSing 💀 your rhetorical skills are beautiful to watch and enjoy. thx for the fresh breeze. PS. but made one big mistake so let me correct you bc I'm autistic, you can trust me:we have NOTHING in common with psychopaths, pls never do that again bc we're the exact opposite. we're even more empathetic than neurotypicals, it's just damn hard masking 24/7 and then seeing we're being lied to the whole time by NT's so we have to also put a mask on for this case, so double masking for NOTHING. like wth, let us be weird bc neurotypicals are the weirdos to us with those nonsense social ettiquette just for pseudo harmony. We often feel what is happing inside you before you even know it, I understand why it triggers many ppl, that's why correct education is important. sry man but this triggered me hard ngl, no hate ❤️🦖 if you get what I mean and where on the same boat I would appreciate an edit bc the stigma with autistics lacking empathy is wrong and very hurtful for us neurospicy t-rexes 🦖 :C just bc we have our own way of living life and feeling things doesn't mean we lack a basic human emotion, that keeps us healthy, socialized and alive. I just prioritize a well made selection of two hands full of kind good humans and put my time in them. I don't have more time for risking my mental health, ppl are evil af, I know it, I analyze them since I opened my eyes. strange monkies those humans are... living their life not seeing the fire behind them. correct mental health education is a must to make a step further in the right direction.
I agree that sociopath and psychopath should be separate diagnoses. Psychopathy is basically a lack of emotions, but I find that sociopaths can be very emotional. Those strong emotions is what causes problems for them sometimes.
They are.
@@Jewifer333x2 theyre not, psychopathy is not a diagnosis
Antisocial personality disorder is the diagnosis. Psychopathy and sociopathy are both descriptors when diagnosing APSD. Sociopathy specifically is not even recognized as an actual clinical condition.
And with all due respect, you can't actually know if a sociopath is "very emotional" in the genuine sense. They display emotions either for narcissistic and egotistical purposes or as a manipulation tactic to get what they want. They'll never cry for you as a sign of empathy. They'll cry for themselves to emotionally manipulate you.
Do your research. Both sociopathy and psychopathy aren’t technically diagnoses themselves in the first place. It’s simply just ASPD and what spectrum of it you lie on (high functioning and low functioning)
And no, they do NOT have strong emotions. They in fact significantly lack it. That is the key factor for diagnosis. If you meant strong emotions in a different context, I’d assume the impulsiveness and excessive boredom displayed in (typically) low functioning ASPD.
Neither of the 2 are diagnoses
You can see from the body language who’s ASPD and who’s NPD. The NPD is on the empathy-connection-recognition-move. The ASPD is firm, laid back,..
Cool interview.
Weird ass people, all three of you.
I think that comment illustrates very well what they talked about: that once they share their diagnosis, every single move of them is being analyzed and interpreted to fit some sort of stereotype the person has
Imagine diagnosing people based on a peudo-science (body language) 🤡
They're alreadt diagnosed. Pointing out that they inseed show the symptoms is not diagnostic @@allinix7
@@nightowl334 i could tell before they even said who was who
The honesty and the openness about your mental health is so vital in today's world.
You can not reverse your "condition", but being this truthful and brave is a long step towards not only healing yourself but setting an example for everybody else.
I truly admire you guys, godspeed!
One interesting point: you mentioned that once you become self aware, you experience more internal suffering and cognitive dissonance. That's super wild because the most common side effects on other people in relationships with people who have cluster bs is cognitive dissonance. So in other words, someone is always suffering cognitive dissonance! How daunting.
BPD can be so intense, thanks for shedding light on these subject, it helps everyone, understand better.
Excellent interview. Someone made a valid comment: a selfaware narc or sociopath that undergo treatment are better than normals that have traits of both.
Glad to see you are so well informed and there is a lot to learn from you. Thank you both.
Wtf are you talking about 😂😂😂
@theolouk9346
Enjoy being gullible and manipulated by cluster B personalities. 😂😂
He makes money from the videos, that's why.
I've seen so many people simp for self-declared cluster b personalities, and they literally tell you how evil they are, and still, people with tiny IQs who are wishful thinkers will still buy thier bullshit. Hilarious. 😂
When 2 people know that nothing of what was said matters to either of them. Thats actually a deep bond
Idk if you are sarcastic but idk how that is a deep bond? It just means they use each other for their benefits and if that doesn’t work anymore it’s bye-bye
You’re just saying anything here. No deep bond can be created
Why is everyone so rude. These people are coming on here talking from their experience. Its from a place where they’ve already grown. Regards of the issues they have people need to except that people can tweak their lives in a healthier direction and that just because they have a disorder, doesn’t mean they are doomed for life!! It takes balls to talk about it when you already know you are hated for what you are. What is concerning, is the people who are undiagnosed and use this disorder to their advantage!! These people are just not that. In fact I sympathise with them because at one point they were just kids who probably felt more emotions that we did and were that hurt they spiralled in that direction!!
Don't worry too much. People with cluster B personality disorders don't feel many private emotions such as guilt or shame. They might get upset but that will pass. They couldn't care less in the long run.
Probably lots of narcissistic sociopaths in comments what did u expect??
Its not rudeness, they're projecting their trauma, as a subconscious reaction
Lots of people think they are better than others and that includes the people who dont have disorders at all.
Its funny how similair we all just really are.
Shut up. No one cares about your feelings or these guy's feelings especially. No matter what these guys say, ALL cluster b types are abusive and exploitative so no one should be coddling them. Get over it.
This made me feel less alone🖤 thank you
It takes a high level of intelligence to be this self aware.
and zero empathy, you flying money
say you are proud. say it.
Dangerous asf
❤they defend their own kind
Nothing to do with intelligence, rather the result of years of therapy work. And if you listen closely you’ll still see traits that are still there, still ingrained and hidden from their own perception.
Them at the Beginning:
I'm a narcisist🥰
I'm a sociopath😍
Hahawhhwwhuwwhuwwhahahwh
Yeah I wonder how this friendship works… just benefiting from each other lol
😂😂😂😂
@@HonestlyHolistica very high functioning sociopath would eventually take advantage of the narcissist. By simply playing and feeding the narcissists ballooned ego because they like it soo much and then overtly taking that away whenever to create a type of manipulation.
@@HonestlyHolisticdo you not “benefit” from your friends in some way emotionally? 😂
@@bellioncrazr sure, if I had friends, but they admit they can’t really care for anyone so I wonder how it works for them you know, they can’t really trust each other
Something I noticed -
as he was talking about his attempted sucide I felt empathy and when he finished talking, I was expecting the other guy to empathize but when he quickly moved on to another subject ...my mind felt uneasy but quickly realized that he is diagnosed with narcissism and would not know the emotional empathy therefore can not express it. I just thought this was a good insight. What some of us think is normal is not normal to others. We all live in one reality but we also have a secondary reality we live in (in out head). Some of us are empathic and others are narcissistic, sociopaths, bpd ....all of this are secondary reality.
As someone with ADHD and possible ASPD, I would want to swiftly move on from that subject. Being shown empathy always makes me uncomfortable. I don't know how to respond to someone caring. It's weird.
@samanthas2280 Wow, interesting. I never thought that giving empathy to some people might make them uncomfortable. Thanks for sharing your experience
@@lalinera8279 obviously I can't speak for everyone. But at least me personally... Yeah. It's a strange thing I'm finding. Like go ahead and say that's awful or whatever, but then... Dwelling on it gets weird for me.
I can understand your logic, but I think you're doing what the host often talks about where he says that people often view him as a 'narcisist' and then see him through that lense, and forget that he's an actual person. You've made the assumption that he handled that interaction that way due to his narcissism and overlaid a pathological response onto his reaction, effectively you've seen him as a 'narcisist' and failed to consider that he may have in fact felt an emotion (empathy) towards what he was saying, though chose to continue the stream of questions as that is the main purpose of the video.
@chap8938 Offering emotional empathy would not have changed the topic of stream. It is a normal social norm. For example, if you hear someone say they lost their loved one recently, you give comfort, condolences...it doesn't matter what kind of situation you are in...as a person, you know that emotionally, it is difficult for anyone to go through that. It is the behavior of comforting eachother that makes us social animals. I do see him as a person obviously. What I wrote is my observation. That moment was not a mistake. He was not in a rush. A person not addressing suicide, death, sickness, in general human suffering.....has some kind of issue. And that is what I pointed out.
It's actually very rare for people with Cluster B personality disorders to be honest about their condition and to go public like this. There's no doubt that these are dangerous to others as well as themselves and are best avoided in real life, but thanks for sharing your stories.
Yea, I don't get sociopath from is personality traits especially with his fear that his friends are mad at him when they don't call right back. Definitely seems like he has the spectrum of BPD but not sociopathy. Trust me, my ex is a sociopath and he was the complete opposite. He definitely didn't care if you didn't call him back because he was on to the next person.
@@straykittsco.950 he has both ASPD and BPD
I agree
@@straykittsco.950 he did say he’s got both of the disorders.
@@straykittsco.950you’re not a doctor, are you -_-
Amazing interview Guys 😊
I have a family full of mental health issues. My sister being a schizophrenic is the one which gets the most stigma.
Yes, she hears auditory voices and has done many inappropriate things due to her illness but she is not aggressive whatsoever and is a very sweet person afflicted.
Keep up dispelling myths and providing brilliant content 👌
I can see that both of you have done work on yourself. Well done! I've known people with ASPD and I've always understood it as a need to control their own life completely. The trouble is, social organizations require some relinquishing of autonomy to follow the rules of the organization. That's why ASPD people don't fit in. I've noticed the need to get revenge (e.g. outsmarting in some way) when their freedom is restricted. I have also seen the compulsive lying to justify the rule breaking. I can see it requires a lot of managing. What your guest has to his advantage is that he's smart.
Thank you both! I agree with the CPTSD core as a scaffolding for many Cluster B adaptations.
Been waiting for this, thank you J. and J.! 🔥
Ho-ly f*ck, except for a few differences, I totally relate!
I always say that I'm the nicest person you'll meet--unless you step on my toes, then hell hath no fury.
RE expressions, I actually left a comment on another channel a long time ago, saying that I prefer the term "sociopath" over "AsPD." Due to the misconceptions and the stigma though, I've changed my mind and now prefer the latter.
Apart from that, sociopathy isn't synonymous with "pure" AsPD, but it's still a subtype, similar to the BPD/NPD subclassifications.
Yep, we definitely have our own moral code. You harm someone we deem as needing protection, you're toast.
Btw, you heard me say that CB peeps who underwent therapy are much more advanced than "norm-al" folks who haven't, and I stand by that.
Anyway, would love it if you guys did more collabs.
Damn I so glad you relate in a weird way LOL
Thank you for making this video happen, you are both amazing role models both for men and trauma survivors everywhere. You are living proof that the work is worth it
All the comments about THE EYES are so hilarious to me 😄 anyway love the work you put into your lives and this interview
Thanks for the shout-out! :)
I’m kinda beside myself haha I’m honored you watched my video!! Didn’t expect it and that’s really awesome. I really admire your work!!
If you have a problem with social norms, you're absolutely NORMAL!
Felt privileged to have watched this✨❤️ lovely talk. 🙂
Yes I've been a member of alcoholics anonymous to sinse 2002, joined when I was 28. I'm 49 now.
Work the 12 steps daily. I've had about roughly 18 years sober time.
Well done son your an inspiration to your aspd brethren.
Saint Anger
Wales.
Great Britain.
It is embarrassing to admit i was diagnosed with Paranoid Schizophrenia, Psychosis, ASPD, ADHD and just Psychopathy itself i take medication for my symptoms and I have to check in with my therapist and psychiatric nurse..i just don't want to feel judged by others i have a hard time living like this i live in the woods in a tent away from society for over 12 years because of this i don't want to hurt myself or others
Hugs
Big hugs and positive emotions to you ⚘
"Society" is overrated. Some folk might think you've got it made with the tent in the woods life 🤔
I love to see these ads on your videos 👏🏼 I’m watching them all 😅
RIGHT I never skip ads here HAHA
Oops, I mostly skip 'em--unless they're US ads, which I rarely get. Damn algorithm isn't all that smart after all. Lol
I’m autistic so I view you boys as my less empathetic extended fam
they completely chew up our types and spit us out. careful.
I think my ex is a sociopath. She is nice enough and is high functioning. Her lack of remorse and empathy is a bit eerie. And in an intimate relationship there was a lot of controlling behaviour, lying and being manipulative. Very anti establishing too! And just something lacking in general. We stay in touch but I'm much more boundaried than i was and just try to give her what she needs (human connection on her terms) and have zero expectation of reciprocity
wow, you managed to stay friends and humane with your ex despite her mental disorder. Good lad you are. Good to establish healthy boundaries for yourself too.
“I don’t start things” Yesssss and revenge is what I relate to. For me the revenge is impulsive and I feel guilt.
I also relate to the reputation part… I don’t care who sees me acting a fool when I’m angry.
Oh my, that was me for the first three decades of my life!! 😳 You described how I used to feel & behave to a T.
You have awesome awareness!! ❤
Revenge, the impulsive vindictiveness, is one of the very incomprehensible elements of the Cluster B personality, for me. The other element is the sadistic pleasure from other's pain that I've witnessed Narcissists enjoy.
Between those two things, I got trapped for lots of years with Narcissists, from my parents to my last boyfriend. I've heard it from lots of others, and found it to be true myself, that we just could not BELIEVE that what we thought was happening was actually what was what was happening.
@@sunnyadams5842 It often comes about through child abuse and so you need to basically be patient with these people, show you are not weak, and show that you are willing to be loyal and call them out on it and outright demand that they grow tf up and stop being so weak--because falling back onto your pathological childhood behaviors IS weakness. And they need to stop seeing compassion as weakness too tbh, the worst always end up seeing love and vulnerability as being weak, but then fall back on the terrible parts of their childhood. Like for example, a girl that had cigarette burns because her abusive father put cigarettes out on her, is going to do weird shit like wanting her lover to put out cigarettes on her. It's actually pretty sick now that I see myself saying this out loud, but these are the kind of messed up things you see with some people that they can hide very well behind their social mask, and makes them so difficult to deal with for normal empathetic people (and is funny to me when guys complain about "badboy" types as if that and sociopathy is the same, and not getting that the girl they put on a pedestal is like this and not the sweet person everyone thinks she is).
So in other words, a basic part of the sadism is I think a control and power thing from being so powerless as children, back when they didn't have any ability to control the damage and pain and lovelessness being done to them. So there's a component to the impulsive revenge thing which is basically all about them just wanting to assert their own agency and sense of control, which makes people like this have to struggle very very hard not to retaliate against you for being hurt or feeling their trust is broken because keeping in mind, these are literally the behaviors they learned from their parents since infancy and so they are struggling and fighting it daily in interpersonal relations. Which I think makes some people weak or suckers to them, is the ones that don't want to change end up more easily exploiting and taking advantage of the normal amounts of pity, empathy, and sympathy which we tend to feel once we KNOW why they are this way, which other than psychopathy most disorders typically stem from childhood traumas (although not always, I knew someone who said her childhood was totally normal, in fact two relations I remember them saying they didn't have any abuse or trauma and it kinda confused and shocked me because they both acted like abused children in a sense, one of whom allegedly had a personality disorder so idk where that came from but then I think her non-abusive past may be why she appears way more normal and not borderline to me and why she's such a loving, sweet, loyal, wonderful person and is not as vindictively chaotic in a hurtful and manipulative way the way many BPD are though also in fairness she's self aware and went to therapy so :shrugs:)
But of course you already know all about this, because you basically just relived all those traumas with your boyfriend by trying to subconsciously replicate your fucked up parental relationship and trying to vicariously use him to heal the damage and make yourself feel loved and validated by your parent by getting another person to basically help you relive that abusive relationship only now you're the one that is in control and trying to get your mom or dad to love you by making your boyfriend love you. If that makes sense. I see it all the time and sadly a lot of people especially young girls just do not make it, they get to like age 40 without ever having therapy and getting things worked out so they repeat this cycle hoping the next guy to change. I think that is often not something that is talked about, and people like to dump on Cluster B's (rightfully) for the shit they pull, but that does not ever touch on the reason why (usually women) pursue those relationships in the first place. It is not as if these guys are just out there pulling women left and right to hurt them for their own sick pleasure and discard them. Some guys do, but there are some women that just straight up actively chase these men or try and seduce them just because of their own reasons.
It's like, if you are raised by alcoholics, and you KNOW that they are alcoholics, and that now that you are too, you can't just sit there and keep blaming the liquor store for existing when it is you who chooses to go there and get get a couple handles of vodka every single week. That is you deliberately putting yourself there to get yourself drunk and repeat the habit and behaviors that you (mis)learned from childhood and that you're never gonna be truly satisfied and happy in having a normal life without purposefully walking PAST the liqour store this time, that only some do, and many do not, but just go right back in there and wind up in pain and hungover tomorrow just like they did every single other day all year. Then they whine and complain about the laws or some shit because they never bothered changing their own behavior and what the real problem with that is, it's because if you ever want to have a family (or just end up with one accidentally, which tends to happen a lot for people with mental health issues and substance abuse) then all you're ever going to do is inflict yourself and inflict your own parents onto your children through yourself by not changing. And so therefore the cycle literally HAS TO end with you. Because if you're not the one who's already broken it before your children can learn to walk and say their first words, then you've just guaranteed that it is your own son and daughter that are not going to walk past and they are going right in that liquor store and they are buying a handle and dating a narcissist because you never fixed you.
@pandemicneetbux2110 I admire your input. I just have one more thing to add. Many woman from traumatic childhood where dad was not emotionally present often choose someone just like dad.
I think sociopath is a “hot” personality (anger/defensive/against others) and “loosing the temper” is when they get overwhelmed and the pre frontal cortex goes offline for a while and the PFC is the “guardian of good behavior” according to Raine, so when that goes off line things can get fruity.
Whereas I think a psychopath is a “cold” personality (manipulative/calm/calculating) and they are born with a smaller than average amygdala (18% smaller than average) and so they just don’t feel emotions like regular people and don’t feel empathy. They are cold.
I think your sadly mistaken. Sociopaths are highly manipulative and lie to get supply. As do most that are on the dark spectrum of psychology......basic fundamentals of love. Genuine love that is. The foundation is honesty and treating others way want to be treated. The sociopath will say they love you whole time doing and saying things that oppose love due to their self centered motivations. Basically pathological liars. The lack of empathy equates to a lack of genuine love. If someone lies to you , then it erodes trust. It's also emotional abuse. Even a sociopath hates being lied to. It's also disrespect. Trust, respect, and if you really think about it genuine love is an absence of abuse in any form. A person who intentionally lies to you will eventually betray you if it benefits them. Generally when engaging with sociopaths and you begin calling them on their lies. Well they know they can't control their supply for their selfish ends and will usually backstab and betray and move to the next victim. Again beginning each relationship with lies. Including fawning and love bombing and flattery etc. But they don't mean the words .......lack of integrity and sure .....if they can turn you sociopathic and get you to join in on their shenanigans. I suppose it could work long term. But when comes to character makes both them and you low life's. And deceptive manipulative people with low self esteem and integrity...less human really. Have a brother calling himself a sociopath and has demons etc. Then he wanna tell me that just because I'm blood doesn't make me family that love does. Riddle me this tho. What does a sociopath know about love? Even sociopaths really don't enjoy being around other sociopaths. Neah they tend to need empathetic people they can lie to to get what they want at others expense and use alot of manipulation tactics to get it. Very entitled and self centered and is also true sociopaths and psychopaths are really narcissistic also....can be quite cold and heartless. False selves and kind of ......no. really fake. Basically lacking in conscience and impulsive people. Hot? Neah. Charming perhaps. But they'll even bite the hands that feed them often then use words to get the upper hand. Lots of lies too. Better is an honest enemy than a lying friend. Me.....I've been screwed over by these types many times. Rather be alone cleaning my toilet than in the presence of a compulsive or pathological liar. These types have zero conscience about lying if it benefits them.
Thank you for sharing and being honest. Continue the self-care and accept that other people care
I wish I was more sociopathetic sometimes. It must be nice not to feel guilt or remorse and be able to easily block shitty people. I wish I could do this easily.
Blocking toxic people is healthy. I'm not a sociopath and I do that to protect my little family from drama
@@MapsLab-u5zI think the person is talking about emotional detachment. This is one of the most clear sign: you can pretty much avoid people and left people forever without caring and feeling nothing about it.
That little smile…Im here smiling with you ASPD, BPD, NPD check. I’ve done and am still doing the work but that little smile is pervasive and enduring or is it endearing and persuasive 😂
Props to you guys in being aware of who / what you are, speaking openly about it, and educating others on the condition / perspectives you experience. Everyone out there has different reactions, setbacks and potencies in feeling different things in day to day life. Many of us "neurotypicals" have flaws that you guys likely do not, that would likely baffle you guys too. Maybe they aren't as potent or noticeable as the conditions you both have, but they are there. Thanks for your metacognition and efforts in mitigating the harmful elements of yourselves, as we all should be, gents.
Every life has a purpose or you would not be here. Sometimes it's hard to know your purpose but I've found that by just continuing to follow your positive emotions, whenever you can access them, over the long-term, you will get closer and closer to knowing what you were meant to do in this life and that will feel more and more fulfilling. I wish you both love and a fulfilling life. It took me about 20 years to figure it out but now I absolutely know my purpose and am passionate about it and fulfilled. We ALL can obtain that over time. Just keep going. You guys have already achieved so much in life just by breaking the cycles of toxicity and abuse from your childhoods. That's a beautiful thing and you should feel proud of yourselves. Hugs to you both!
Felt like I was listening to myself talk. Dropped out of school and never thought lying about a college degree was anything other than checking the box on some HR managers chart as they complied to nonsense system of poor education and indoctrination. Adulting is hard and sportsball is a waste of human experience… don’t even get me started on revenge
I'm the female version of the male with aspd. I've never heard a more accurate description about myself. Wow.
I learned in therapy for major depression how it was on a spectrum and that's SO important to understand. You have Sociapaths that work hard at managing their lives ,understanding themselves and idk if it's a change as much as it's a choice not to act on.. One may lie habitually, tell stories and screw your boyfriend. Another may spit in peoples food all the time. My sister was a spitter, liar , theif , beat my ass .. made me fight people, shoved me in weird places. But she didn't kill me and she also had a hilarious sence of humor and she was fun 😂.. i miss her , i choose to stay away from her now but seriously she was so important to me for decades. But when i learned how real certain hate feelings were for me , i had to stop seeing her...
I'm happy hearing this guy ❤.. i don't think he cares if anyones happy with him as much as he just wants a better life for himself.
I was diagnosed with NPD, and I totally see a lot of each of you, in me. My morales are different tho, I go by one golden rule: "Treat others as you would like to be treated". I tend to always find a way to blame myself for everything. I also suffer from panic attacks (happened my entire life). I used to throw up before and during my hockey games, in what everyone told me was called "the butterfly's" (more like fireflies if you ask me). History of substance abuse. High intelligence. I was shocked when I got my diagnosis, and still find myself trying to fully understand.
Yep I understand that reactive revenge or justice.
Also a friend of mine in his 20's who's diagnosed as a Primary Psychopath, was being bullied in the local bus station by 5 male bullies his age.
It went on for day's, then he snapped, and went to the bus station with a claw hammer in his hand to smash them all up and put them in hospital. I admired his courage.
Thankfully, he was stopped by the police , taken to his psychiatrist.
What pissed me off was he was stigmatized but nothing was done to the bullies by the police. It was wrong him wanting to beat them with a claw hammer I know, but they provoked him. Leave him alone and he's fine.
He's a good kid, he's primary psychopath and also diagnosed co morbid with ADHD and bi-polar. But he's lovely.
I've taken him under my wing, I'm an old dude now at age 49 lol.
I can relate to this guy's upbringing and aspd, thankfully I never crossed over into primary psychopathy from secondary Psychopathy. I do have a shit load of empathy, compassion, regret, guilt etc.
I despise the institutions, schools, governments etc, only the bad parts though.
Brilliant thanks dudes.
Saint Anger
The interviewee has done a lot of personal development. Well done
dialectical behavioral therapy changed my life as someone with BPD. learning to be able to understand that the world isn't black and white, and instead of living an "either-or" life, but a "both-and" kinda life, ya know ya know?
Jacob, the job you are doing on line is so important. You might not even know it, but you are shining a light in the world by exposing your condition. I really wish you inpprove in Therapy and bring light to your symptons ! You may not see it but there are amazing things that make you a good person. Lots of love
If society is fucked up isnt it just healthy to be against the society? As Krishnamurti said, it is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society. I am against society too, in a way, but I am not antisocial or sociopath. It seems more like a political/philosophical stance than a disorder.
Right on point! Society is above all a social construct and is defined by the majority of the community. In the place where I live it is considered perfectly normal to abuse and torture animals because they are...well...animals...It is not even seen as wrong. Also, it is normal to verbally and even physically abuse people from LGBT community or any community that is considered "different"...In Iran it is normal to beat women who are not wearing hijab, in Afghanistam it is normal to stone a woman to death for leaving a house without permission, in Jemen it is normal that a 55 year old marries an 8- year old...Am I to accept that just because it's normal somewhere? For me any kind of abuser should bite the sidewalk if you know what I mean. And if that makes me mentally ill, so be it! I'll gladly be the illest of all.
I have similar traits of a narcissist, but I’m not. I’m a serious introvert including depression and anxiety. It’s a daily struggle. I’m grateful to my mental health professionals and medicine.
The lack of awareness and accountability is a huge issue as well.
I really love this. I love the fact that you two are doing the hard work on yourselves. As an “empath” who has been in relationships with people who demonstrate narcissistic traits, it’s really refreshing to hear what people with these kinds of traits/behaviors are dealing with internally in comparison to a person with ASPD. (Of course, I too am working on myself to diminish co-dependent tendencies.) CPTSD is no joke and we all react differently to it. My thinking is that - in some cases - a narcissist is an empath that got hurt or betrayed too many times while growing up. The space to be vulnerable was shut down. But this interview is wonderfully insightful and vulnerable at the same time.
They are calculating! They love deeply, obsessively even sometimes, but the drive to get something easy or for free is pathological... predatory!
I see the cogs turning with my friend and I then have to be one step ahead as a psychologist and think about how we can navigate both our psyches towards common goals x
Great interview, thank you ❤ x
what a mind blowing and honest conversation. I can relate in so many ways to the guy being interviewed. I just got the label "Personality disorder not otherwise specified".
It's in his eyes damn, but cool interview dude seems smart . You're heading the way for personality disorder research
He's smart as hell. He's the me of ASPD lmao
@@Thenamelessnarcissist 😂😂
@@Thenamelessnarcissisthis eyes are dead bro lol
@@N0N4M30 thats what YOU see in him ;-)
@@kalyasaifywhat are you even trying to say? You are all over the place with that word salad. There is no "healthy arrogance". Go read the Bible, find Jesus and find some peace. I'm not the healthiest individual, but even I can see through your comment that you are lost. Jesus can help you. It helped me due to always trying to keep the commandments aswell, because otherwise I would just go around and get what I want one way or the other. Jesus teaches no arrogance, no stupid behavior (or writing comments like yours), and bring people to the truth. Without God you will have people like you saying "I love me a good narc", like what is that? Jesus does more for you than any therapy once you value his word, I can guarantee you that. Its either Jesus way or the highway in that case. Took me some time to get that into my head, and I'm still learning and far from perfect.
You both have remained in positive alignment regardless of the shit others have given you. I believe that you will definitely be able to make a difference in society
The most important thing to remember is that everyone with psychopathy has ASPD but not everyone with ASPD has psychopathy..
The more important thing is to remember that one is a clinical diagnose and the other more of a slang word for rude people.
@@paulgoogol2652exactly
The most important thing is to shut up when you're not a professional about what you are talking about.
Great interview brother, and really cool hair. You're well reseached and honesty this had better information than 99% of the so called psychology channels on here. Keep up the good work!
Very good and informative interview! Thank you both very much.
Thanks for this interview...this will hopefully make many of us RUN...RUN AS FAST AND AS FAR AWAY AS YOU/WE CAN !
“away”…from what / whom?
This was really illuminating. Thank you both!
Sociopath is made, phycopath is born...wired different... injoying your truthful conversation
Those terms are not used anymore.
@@Afo2550 they absolutely are, in research, as faktor 1, and factor 2 psychopathy.
just because they arent used in a area, doesnt mean they dont exist.
it has never been disproven, and only proven from time to time again.
I am neurotypical and have a Sociopath as a friend, and another who is a Narcissist. I do see logically how interest in one's own gains is advantageous, and even imperative for us all to succeed. The only thing I don't get re them both (they aren't friends) is that their approaches seem to be so heavily (even comically) focused on their gains in the short term, but so so lacking a long-game plan. It seems to be a policy of very short term, sharp benefit in return for a range of mid and longer game negative outcomes for them. E.g: losing friendships, losing trust of broad swathes of people, creating sometimes dangerous enemies committed to revenge, an overall bad reputation not just socially but professionally also. Thus a refusal of others to cooperate with them further, hampering their advancement etc as a whole. Fascinating, and I have to admire their resourcefulness and agility in the short term, particularly in business. I wonder, does either type see a kindred spirit at least in a sense with a psychopath, or are you as disgusted and as baffled by them as we are? :)
I find the man on the left disturbingly relatable, sans the lack of guilt. I felt immediately guilty of my own behavior when he talked about the "stores" (this used to be embarrassingly common for me) and the assumptions that people hated me or were annoyed by me if they didn't respond to my attention/texts. I'm overwhelmingly empathetic, so while my poor impulse control causes me to act ot think irrationally in one moment, in the next I feel regretful and as if they would be justified in their hate towards me because I deserve it. My sister, mom, and I made a pact to never commit suicide because we've experienced so much in our family. So I simultaneously think they would be better off if I died and cannot do it because I'm worried and feel guilty about potentially hurting them. I relate so much to the "empty" feeling, but i have learned to recognize it and pull myself out.
Raising hand: trauma is not the root cause of my personality. I was born this way (psychopathy).
Hey
Im like you
Its ok
🫶🏼🃏🖤
I'm better than you, and proud.
- Narcissist
I commend both of you for speaking honestly to the disorders. Clusters B's are a very challenging construct and defense mechanism for the diagnosed and the people in their lives that they affect. Thank you
Really great interview! To be able to speak openly about this is so freeing to watch. Thank you for the work that you do!
Thank you!!!
I absolutely love this interview, you're one of the only people who can make me watch interviews this long :) I am so glad to hear so much about aspd, the internal experience has been such a mystery, such a shame.
A recovered cluster b is probably more healthy than a normal person, who has never worked on themselves.
So true! What a great quote
Lol, lie to urself. Good job.
@@nemiw4429this is definitely not a lie
Congratulations to these 2 gentlemen for being upfront and honest with the world about their personality disorder. So that we have more of an accurate understanding of it. Most people with these conditions try and hide it to manipulate the people around them. Be very thankful guys for this!!
Thanks so much, guys. As a lifetime empathic victim of narcs and sociopaths, this helped me so much. No longer do I think of those people who struggle with these issues as monsters. Some psychologists out there on YT want us to believe that narcs are hopelessly sick and will never change because they don’t think anything is wrong with them. These videos are certainly eye openers for sure. Much gratitude for you both. Keep up the good work and keep the videos coming, please!
I LOVE that you did this video! I have just started watching and Iam laughing so hard my tummy hurts 😂😂. You have a good attitude about this tuff subject. And I commend you for it.
I have dated a version of you both 😉 so its very interesting to see you two next too each other, because it makes the difference SO clear! Anti social might not be social phobia, but In my experience you can have it either way. You dont need the validation to sustain yourself. While a narc does. And we can see this in your body language. Joe is calm and centerd while TNM is out going, takes more eye contact and entertain the audience more frequent.
When you turn and show you dark side, Joe will go from 0 to murder in under a minute. While TNM will degrade and backstab you over a longer period of time. So you both have good qualities in relationships AND you will cost people. Sadly a hell of a lot more than the average person. Thats whats makes these personalities a problem. But I stay positiv and hope that Psychiatry one day will find answers and healing for this.
I know someone with NPD and sociopathy, with a high I.Q., and his whole life he has never said “sorry “. He also has no friends. Character and reputation matter and these bullies eventually end up in their own special universe. Better than everybody and looking for ways to use lesser beings they rationalize their evil acts.
You described them perfectly.
Way to go guys!!! This was so well done!🎉 🤍🙏🏻 Joe!!! You done did it sonnnn! 👏🫂
What a interesting interview. I have ADD(ADHD), so yeah I get some of what he is dealing with. I think we are wired a little differently from the norms. We get calm/focus better in stressful situations and so on. I don't think all of who this guy is just comes down to some type of sociopathy, it could just be his ADHD. I loved the part were he talked about the self-destructive behavior's being the root to some of this. I very much relate, except I grew up with a sociopathic parent so I have a deep hatred of people who physically harm others. I think that prevented me from becoming my parent . So yeah we all have our issues.😆
My son has adhd and he definitely is too sensitive and caring to hurt others without feeling bad.
Thank you for sharing, I'm a therapist and I really appreciate that you brought those questions of the internal experience that is not well defined in the DSM. It's very helpful to me in order to better help my patients.
This sociopath is smarter thinking than most people ive met and seen. Love this guy
People love their own kind.
@@PaisleyMarie80 I love everyone
@@deonaeddy7749 You're acting like that's a virtue? Loving predators is not a virtue.
No their not
@@PaisleyMarie80 you got a lot to learn. I didn't say I like them. There's a difference. But you wouldn't understand that it seems. Did you know that we ALL have 1-3 traits in us so we're all a bit narcissistic from one degree to the other. You have to have 5 or more to be one. Also people see a trait or two in someone and automatically they're a narc. There's overlapping disorders that kinda look like NPD also. Also think about this. You meet someone. You can't believe how much you like and think about this person so quickly. You miss them. You laugh with them. They are kind and patient but most of all they listen good. You two have so much in common. You stare into their eyes and fall in love. The narc let's you talk so they can get to know you fast and so they can take on your traits to make them a person. They're not out to get you ( unless they're the psychopathic kind) They actually really want to know what love is. They need to feel it. They weren't taught or shown it. They turned their empathy off in childhood as a defense mechanism as to not have to feel the horrible things they felt from abuse so bad that normal people wouldn't understand. Or they were highly spoiled in all the wrong ways and not shown love. Anyways they walk in hell everyday and the empath is supposed to be empathetic, kind, loving, and forgiving. That's why they're drawn to them. However an empath needs to know boundaries and keep them. She can still show the narc what love is even from afar. She's never ugly and hateful or revengeful. Theyve seen enough hate. Yes I do love them and my heart hurts for them. They never mean to hurt people unless they're a psychopath. Í think they're screaming and trying to show people their pain so it's not so lonely.
Most psychopaths aren't killers. You prob work with one or two. They do have their place in this world. They can be very intelligent. All psychopaths are narcs but not all narcs are psychopaths. Anyways my whole point before my little tangit was when you look into the narcs eyes and fall in love, what you're looking into are mirrors reflecting yourself back to you. So you fell in love with yourself. Who's the narc??
I don't even know why I wrote all of this out. You prob don't care. Oh well maybe someone will read it and learn something. Take care
Thank you for this video, I love educating myself about personality disorders. I believe there are different spectrums of it and no 2 people are same, we all have our individual characteristics, that’s what makes every person unique. You look very much like my New Zealand ex, but a much younger version of him - you have the same nice eyes and similar features. He had something too, different but was quite loving towards me until the split, he got nasty and took away everything he gave me, he discarded me. Later he did try to come back to me but I didn’t take him back and moved on. I do miss him though and think of him sometimes. I think we learn from all our relationships, they bring a little something into us and we in them. Keep up the great videos ❤
As an empath living with a spouse with ASPD I didn't think I was going to be able to make it thru this episode but I was pleasantly surprised at the honesty and truthfulness. Thanks for validating what I have perceived as the thought processes behind the outbursts and behaviors.
cut the weed out
@@Schizohandlerstrue, and also if an individual is predisposed to schizophrenia, avoid weed and stress. Both can trigger schizophrenia.
Please get out. You're not an empath, you're codependent. Empath is a concept people use to stay comfortable being a victim. Not an actual real world verifiable concept. You're hurting both them and yourself by being there. If you're as empathetic as you think, please have some empathy for yourself.
If you still believe you're an empath and not codependent ask yourself what feeling and motivation I have for this. I'm willing to bet your default reaction was defensiveness and feeling personally attacked, not reading the sheer terror and fear and love and compassion that are actually behind this. If I'm wrong, that's awesome. I hope I'm wrong. I worry I'm not, and I've seen myself and far too many others give up years or decades of their life thinking "this person just hasn't been loved enough. My love will heal them" only to find out later "this person does not value my love at all. They value me as a tool and a resource"
@@kevinbissingerdamn this was hard to hear. Revealed the lie of ‚my love will heal him‘ some time ago..but haven’t made it out yet. I know i have to..
Same.
This is amazing content 🎉😍💘 Jo and Jacob , these hunks must do MOREEE ❤ 🔥🔥 Jo how is your relationships , do you need a partner to feel stable and secure ? Since you mentioned you have an identity is your relationships for any resource your lacking or is it for your own kind of “love” and what is love defined as to you?
HAHAHA I'll ask him!
Thanks for spreading awareness! It was very interesting to listen!
I like this a lot it makes me feel less alone ❤ sometimes i wonder if i have anything. I have bipolar but i seem to feel like i am lacking in empathy lately
That is normal with BPD.
Did you see his eyes when the music went off on your computer?!? That right there is the perfect definition of a sociopath- they're always waiting for a threat. It's like their brains are always in defensive mode.
That could also be from trauma though...
no
Thank you both. Great interview and questions.
I've always wondered how comorbidity of BPD & ASPD would present itself. Combined with your perspective is very interesting! 🎯
As an aspd/bpd/adhd this is spot on. You'll find me deep in the woods FAR away from people than ever 'socializing'.
This is good for other people with these disconnections to see, specifically within this format, just two seemingly-normal guys chatting with no stigma attatched; neither of them feeling interrogated by the other, so that maybe at least one person can see themselves in this and can potentially encourage them to consider whether they should seek help for similar issues, and ultimately become more transparent about who they are, in order to reduce harm for others they interact with. A disorder like this is only as bad as one lets it get (and its easier to let it get worse), as they can either deny or take ownership their true natural impulses. If they begin to own the the reality of their conscience, then they can potentially start to navigate it better.
I can relate to a few things Jo has described. Wondering if thats the adhd, either that or clusterbmilkshake was right on her past comment regarding us adhd’ers are for the watching 🙈😂
This was a great interview Jacob & Jo & a topic I’ve been wanting to learn a lot more of. I agree Jacob, learning more of what’s going on internally & the thought processes would be very helpful in understanding aspd.
I realise every person with a condition is different. Can you ask Jo next time if he sees people as objects?
How does Jo view/treat friends & has this changed over time being self aware & doing the work?
What age did Jo become fully self aware?
Does Jo take medication for adhd & if so how does it change his aspd & adhd symptoms internally & externally.
Would love to know this
I'll relay these to him! I also think me and him should do a live per another commenters request!
@@Thenamelessnarcissist and then with a psychopath
@@Thenamelessnarcissist yes please do this! 🔥🔥🔥
I really hope you do a second interview- this was amazing!
The most interesting part about this interview was when they touched on splitting! He said I won’t split on my clinician/therapist! Which would imply a choice when it comes to splitting. Now I was under the impression that splitting which is a form of black and white thinking (All good or all bad) was purely a subconscious thing, it would seem not if we are to take what they say literally.
When someone is already entering therapy, that means they know they are sick and submitting themselves to recovery; by that time, they know they have to put everything on the table to get better. So why would you see this as some big AHA relevation when it's moreso they splitted on you when they didn't realise they were wrong back then? You also fail to realise a therapist is strictly a professional and not someone personal relations with the ill person, so they wouldn't likely be as emotionally charged or triggered in any way to "split" on the therapist either. But at the end of the day you can only perceive it the way you want, so do you.
@@joeykoo3779 on point