Hey fellas!! This was in the works for over a year!! Thanks to HTH, Graviteh, Twisted Wrister Hockey, King Angus, & my personal friend Cody Wiggins for helping out with the 1st episode of Ringless! We hope you enjoyed!! EDIT: Since this was made a year ago.. Lots of choppy cuts at times. But still hope yall enjoy!
@@mamaji277 but they wouldn't have had Forsberg or Roy without this trade. The reason I say Roy is because the Nordiques drafted Jocelyn Thibault (who was traded for Roy) with one of the draft picks in the Lindros trade.
@@Dutchovenderlinde Roy wanted the trade and you know why so there would've still been a chance getting him. You act like Thibault and that draft pick were all they got
Exactly,the Philly paper listed that as a top 10 Philly collapse...talking about the 76ers in games 4,& 5. I'm a fan of Denver teams,not Philly. But I told them,that wasn't a collapse. It was a team winning the JV conference...then getting exposed in the Cup Finals by Detroit...just like what wouldve happened had they played Colorado,or anybody else,who wouldve won the West back then.
@@marmalaterjones4526 Those teams were so much deeper also. '02 Red Wings...probably had 10 HOFers. '01 Avs had 5 out of 12 All Star starters...from that season's All Star game...then traded for Rob Blake-#6...few wks later. And that doesn't count Foote,Tanguay,Drury,Reinprecht-those teams would mop the floor with anybody today...as they should have...with no salary cap. Take my Avs today. People think it's so tough to play "heavy Vegas",or Dallas last yr.(granted-no excuses this yr,but insane injuries beat us more than Dallas did,in the bubble) These guys today would shit themselves if they had to play against the grit,& "heaviness" of say 2000 NJ,or '99 Dallas...who also had a lot of skill. Or the unreal skill of Colorado,Detroit...even St Louis,or some of those Pittsburgh teams. Even this Philly team...would likely beat anybody today...& they got friggin swept by Detroit.
@@jasonsmith5226 those avs and wings lineups were ridiculous. On paper they were not as good as the legion of doom lineup of leclair, lindros and recchi, but on ice a good sakic/forsberg/yzerman/fedorov matched them in 2 way play. On top of that flyers were extremely top heavy, as their offensive ouptut falls off after the top line. The avs fielded 2 all star lines and a good checking line, while the wings can field 2 all star lines, an excellent 3rd line and one of the best checking lines of the era. Flyers really never had a chance if lindros never got hurt, he would have been stopped by the elite franchises of avs and red wings in that era.
Lindros' opponents had two choices: 1. Let him become the next Gretzky or Lemieux and get humiliated by him for the next 20 years 2. Break him We know what happened
Detroits D pairing of Lidstrom and Murphy was looked at as soft, and the Legion of Doom was supposed to run all over them. Lidstrom and Murphy embarrassed them. Lol. They were so smart, such great passers, and so smart at moving the puck that they couldn't hit them.
Honestly guys the true Legion Of Doom only played about 80 games. Half way through their 2nd year together Renberg got injured and was never the same again. When they went to the cup in 97 Renberg was being moved around all the lines.
I'm a Flyer fan who followed the team throughout the 90's The Flyers couldn't win a cup of Bob Clarke. He was a neanderthal GM who was terrible with asset management. While Dallas was signing Brett Hull, Belfour, trading for Zubov Colorado trading for Rob Blake, Ray Bourque Detroit getting Chelios, Shannahan Jersey having a steady pipeline of talent coming through the system Clarke was trading 2 first round picks for PAt Falloon; trading PRospal and a first for Alexander Daigle. signing a washed up Beezer over Cujo Clarke is the ultimate reason.... not Lindros' fault at all. And not to mention that five years earlier Clarke had been fired for destryoing the great mid-late 80's Flyers team I could go on and on Another problem is that Clarke holds grudges and lets his personal ego get in the way of good managent. And behind the scenes he's still influencing the management of the team. That's why the Flyers have become a horrible organization
He never won a cup it's a shame that he had a lot of injuries but I don't blame him for not wanting to play for marcel about the nordiques owner at that time marcel was a bad person
Lindros didn't win b/c Bob Clarke never assembled a team good enough. Never had a 2nd line, just Brindamour with nobody on the wings. Poor defensive depth after Desjardins/Therien. They couldn't draft any impact players until Simon Gagne in '98, 6 years after the trade without a single home-grown impact player. Lindros' concussion problems essentially ended his career by 2000.
If they had that spectacular goaltending from the '80s or hell, even Bernie Parent of the '70s. Also Bobby and pretty much the rest of sports didn't take concussions as seriously as they should have
Simple. Gary Bettman. Look up "Clutch and Grab/Neutral zone trap Era". Then look up "Obstruction Interference". Then look up "Neutral zone trap". Then look up "Years inacted" 1993-2005" Then look up "NHL Lockouts". Then armed with this information, look up "Eric Lindros career years played". Then look up the word " IRONY"
During that era Lindros was a dominant physical and scoring force but one reason that slowed him down of course was the concussions. His downfall was skating with his head down as when he was in junior he was possibly used to guys bouncing off of him considering his size as he was basically a giant in comparison to most players. Though he gets a lot of flack, Lindros is still one of my favourites
I seriously believe that Lindros' size is what ended his career. Hear me out. Because he was the biggest growing up he never learned to keep his head up when he was developing, and because he wasn't accustomed to it in the NHL he suffered his most devastating hits.
No thats probably spot on. Was never an issue until he got to the NHL. That's definitely one of the biggest reasons. He did whatever he wanted. No one was close to him..and then the nhl had a lot of guys like him (not necessarily his skill as he was a special player). I was a lindros fan. Even as a sabres fan, I loved playing the bullies. We used to get bullied by the flyers in his era and then out of nowhere we were beating them easily and it was a huge topic. They panicked and were worried about speed. I will go to my grave saying 90s hockey was at it's absolute best. The game itself, you could feel the emotions of the players, it was personal and the legends of that time. Was loaded. Even at the time it was like wow... gretzky, Mario, jagr, selanne and Kariya, hasek,..can keep going for hours.
Yep spot on, Lindros had no problem giving hits, viciously. But he never learned how to take them, on the ice, or off the ice. Players like Stevens weren't going to take that, & for the first time Lindros was being bullied by smaller but also smarter players. Stevens isn't small, but he's still decently smaller than Lindros.
@@Conflict1922 had he learned, and had he been a smite more humble it would have turned out better, but he had his career and got paid so that's life. As far as playing closer to home..... the school reason was extremely valid. There are things I know about his family from being around them during the early to mid 90s. Extremely personal reasons but extremely valid one's. Nothing against the soo, but looking after Eric & his siblings best interests through private challenges that have never made it to the media.
I wonder what would have happened if the NHL had modern concussion protocols in place in the 90s, and Lindros had been allowed to recover properly from his first one rather than repeatedly being exposed to risk.
Lindros was the one of the most hyped athletes not just in Hockey but out of any sport. He lived up to the hype and beyond being at times the most skilled and toughest player in league and hard carried the Flyers to the top of the league. They rewarded him by blaming him for losing in the finals and running him out of town after concussions and injuries started slowing him down.
Darren McCarty wrote in his book that Lindros had a tendency to look at the puck and not keep his head up even in juniors. That said, I remember hearing about Detroit looking into acquiring Lindros in the summer of 2001 (Stevie Y was said to be putting Lindros over to management). That could have been interesting, at the very least.
Because it takes an entire team to win a stanley cup, not just 1 player. A stanley cup winning team needs good forwards, defense, goaltending, coaching, scouting, management, etc. Lindros alone cannot fill all those roles
Too much was traded away to acquire Lindros from Québec. Flyers made it to the finals on with him and Lindros won a hart in 95 IIRC, but the way his concussions were handled by the Flyers was the “icing on the cake”. Back then, concussions weren’t seen as career threatening and lesser players would just “somehow fall into obscurity”, declining abruptly and be pushed aside or simply retire when they would get hurt too much. Lindros and .. Crosby led the game to be more aware of such injuries and how to treat them. If you guys haven’t seen Lindros in a Quebec jersey, search TLMEP Eric Lindros.
The Flyers gave up the difference of what would have brought them a cup to get him. Lindros dominated juniors so much he never learned "head on a swivel". So much early individual success may have very well have prevented him for the later success.
Ok one thing Lindros couldn’t take over himself meaning it had to be in his end , he wasn’t a jagr or federov who could take blue line to blue line .. he was more of a physical specimen but his skills never quite matched
Great production value as always! If you're unsure as to which player to do next, maybe I can make a suggestion. How about Pavel Bure? He didn't have the longevity and wasn't the same after knee issues got the better of him. But for the short period he was in his prime, he was ELECTRIFYING. He sadly never got a ring.
He was fun to watch. Hated when your team played him but deep down you loved it. He made sabres games legendary. The brawls. Remember him running hasek lol. Was too funny. The way lindros would do it so nonchalantly was hilarious. He was awesome for hockey. I don't care what anyone says. He was damn good offensively too. But he could get dirty ones also. As a kid whenever we played hockey and the goalie was rammed as a goal was scored we would always yell lindros.
Wrong era, big stars were targeted by career-enders like Stevens when player safety played a 5th fiddle and skull-crunching elbows to the head vacated highlight reels.
The problem with the lindros era flyers is that the flyers never really had any depth. Outside the legion of doom bind'amour, desjardins and, later, gagne and recchi, they were really thin. Plus, they had a past-his-prime and old ron hextall in net as well as brian boucher, so goaltending was also another big issue. Trading renberg in his prime to tampa bay in 97, only to bring him back, but with his self-confidence being shot and injuries piling up on both lindros and renberg also didnt help. Yknow what the ironic part of all of this is? If lindros went to the rangers instead of the flyers, suddenly, the flyers will not only have forsberg as its main star, but also have the depth they so desperately needed throughout the decade! Plus, if they kept guys like beranek, carkner and mellanby around, you'd have a team like this in the mid-90s: Leclair-Forsberg-Renberg Brind'amour-Ricci-Mellanby Juhlin/Prospal-Beranek-Podein Simon-Zubrus-Dionne Svoboda-Desjardins Carkner-Duchesne Therien-Yushkevich Hextall Thibault Plus, when they traded for pat falloon, they sent the 1st rounder that eventually turned into Daniel brière. So you'd have the 99-00 team like this: Leclair-Forsberg-Renberg Gagné-Brind'amour-Recchi Zelepukin-Ricci-Mellanby Simon-Prospal-Podein Weinrich-Desjardins Niinima-Yushkevich Therien-dykhuis Thibault Boucher Sure, you could go with a better goalie, but thibault is decent enough. Plus, another unknown fact was when they traded for pat falloon, they also traded the pick that became daniel brière. So if they kept that pick, plus the picks that landed them williams, gagné and don't whiff on the 1999 1st rounder and selected martin havlat, you'd have that prospect pool: Brière Williams Sharp Havlat Which means in 2003-2004, the flyers lineup would look something like this Gagné-Forsberg-Brière Leclair-Brind'amour-Havlat Sharp-Ricci-Williams Simon-Prospal-brashear Niinima-Desjardins Therien-Yushkevich Weinrich-pitkanen Timander Thibault This is just a theory, of course, but the flyers woudl definitely have a lot more depth
Growing up in philly suburbs I was graduating high school in 91 my younger brother and I watched every single game during the lindros era .the leclair lindros connection was just insane to watch.leclair is still my favorite hockey player and deserves to b in the hockey hall of fame..the man helped Montreal win a cup ,dominated the World Cup in 96 to help usa win that cup and was one of the best power forwards in hockey from 94-2000..
From a pure hockey fan point of view it would've been cool to see lindros win a cup. But as a pens fan I have to say I'm so glad he didn't. Lol. But the LOD was so scary to watch if you weren't a flyers fan. I mean 3 power forwards that are good and know how to score. 1 of which is one of the top players in the league. Lindros wasn't as fun to watch on the rangers. And his leafs and stars stints aren't even worth mentioning. But that LOD line was sick to watch. It was just one of those trios that played perfectly together. That was the height of all 3 of their careers. Matter of fact Renberg sucked after that line was broken up. Lol. Great video bro. Really cool concept and well done. Can't wait for the next one. And congrats on 10k.👌
The flyers are still technically benefiting from trading away and again for renberg. He was traded as part of compensation payback for the picks given up for Chris gratton’s offer sheet and then swapped back for renberg & langkow. Langkow was swapped for 1st rounder that became Jeff Carter who was traded for Voracek and pick that became couturier
They never could put together a good second line. It was just Brin'Amour (who was awesome on the role of 2nd line center) with a couple of bums. They could never find a consistent goalie either. That first line, along with Desjardins and Therien, really carried them that far.
@@timyumichuck9262 He did do it to himself but I'm not sure he missed out on two Cups. If he was on that team, there wouldn't have been that huge trade. I don't think Colorado would have been that good with Lindros and without Forsberg and the other assets they got from the Flyers. Who knows, maybe Philadelphia would've actually won something with those guys still in the franchise.
As for the reason Lindros didn't win: 1) Goaltending - the team was never solid in net; 2) Bobby Clarke as GM could never leave well enough alone, with all the constant trades. The Chris Gratton deal in particular was silly.
They couldn't draft a single impact player in any round until Gagne in '98. Pathetic. 2 years old after, Lindros' career was essentially over. Brindamour NEVER had decent wingers. No legit 2nd scoring line his whole time in Philly. Clark's incompetence as a GM.
Jesus, I blocked Chris Gratton out of my head all these years. That was awful. Clark had a huge ego as GM and really made a bunch of stupid decisions that hurt the team.
He was interesting growing up in the 90's. No one liked him for sitting out that year. Then when he did play, people hated him (except Flyers fans) because he basically played like Tom Wilson. I love big hits, but the way he went at smaller guys was not good for his rep either. He became a target by the bigger guys, and really, most hockey fans at the time loved that Stevens took him out because he deserved it. But yeah, those Detroit teams in a league with no salary cap were unbelievable. No one was beating Detroit or the Avs very much those days.
Lindros actually delivered the goods in a lot of ways that people forget. To bad a minor hockey coach never taught him to keep his head up. He was so physically dominating as a kid and even Junior star he didn't need to, he would just run you over. Until he started to play with opponents that made a living of destroying the guys looking in there feet for the puck. I truly hope he stays healthy in retirement as he was a real star for Team Canada any times and his story is one of great caution for others.
I think the team did an earnest job producing this and it's a worthwhile series...AND...my suggestion is to balance out the audio when you edit the next episode. There were times when I had to crank it up to hear the young man in the corner with the orange wall background, and then it would get super loud when it would cut away to someone or something else.
Was edited a year ago and the og file got deleted, so I couldn’t rly fix it even if I wanted to at that point haha. But yes I agree. The sound was all over the place and it lowkey bugs me a bit too. Still hope you enjoyed tho!
I once remember seeing something where Lindros didn't lift weights mainly because he would "get too big" and felt too heavy. The guy was 235 pounds and wasn't lifting like Brindamour. It was just natural size. Let that sink in. Also worth noting, his brother Brett was also skilled, but had his career also cut short because of concussions
With every game I saw him play one word stood out every time. Work. When I saw him on the ice it was work to him. I've watched hockey a long time and seen players like Lafleur, Orr, Sittler, Bossy, Gretzky, Lemieux,... They all looked like they played and loved the game. Not what I saw whenever I saw Lindros jump over the boards. One word always stood out when I saw him. Hockey was work to him and that more than anything is why he never won a cup. He did not love the game like those other players.
Bullshit. He was a teenager in the spotlight dealing with a target on his back is all. The guy had a ton of heart. More myths about Lindros than any other player I can think of.
Two of Lindros' big problems were his father and his injuries. Carl Lindros inserted himself into everything in his son's life and became a thorn in the side of Flyers GM Bobby Clark. Those two big ego guys proceeded to have their own ugly battles, all to the detriment of Lindros' hockey career. And Eric never learned that he had to skate with his head up. He never saw Scott Stevens coming when Stevens knocked him into the next season. That was a dirty hit but Lindros could've avoided the brunt of it had he kept his head up. He did that a lot, looking down at the puck instead of at his surroundings because most guys couldn't really faze him with a check. He thought he was too big. And then came Darius Kasparitus and Scott Stevens. You've got to brace yourself for those kind of shots. All those concussions effectively ended his career. It ultimately just came to wasted years for the Flyers.
Thats a big reason for sure. Just watch Hextall let in those weak goals against the Devils in the 95 Eastern Finals for some good examples of the goalie letting the team down.
Really good video, me and a bud enjoyed it ,avs fan and philly fan Also we're deciding to play some throwback NHL 06 to play some old Lindros, maybe even NHL 2000 xD
What a great video! Love the collaborative aspect, it's nice to get input from different sources and put it all together into a single narrative. Never been a Philly fan, but I always loved and respected Lindros. It truly is a shame that things didn't work out differently, especially as far as injuries go. This format would definitely make for an interesting ongoing series.🏒🥅🚨
Lindros in his prime was a force of nature each shift. He really could dominate the ice. His style of play was so intense before the injuries added up, which made him great but probably is why he got so many injuries.
I remember watching that era (error?) of the Flyers. The team never had the crucially important right mix of depth on offense and defense,. The goaltending was average or slightly above on its best days. Damn near impossible to win under those circumstances.
Lindros had it too easy in ohl when he could just put his head down and run over players like a train. He never learned to keep his head up and never imagined nhl d men like kaspar and stevens could hit like a train and lay him out like a bag of laundry. A lesson learned too late. Plus the bounty flyers gave up to get him hampered them building a team around him and no proper goalie as well. Devils had Brodeur. Sabres had Hasek. Habs/Av's (thanks to lindros) had Roy. And wings were too fast and too skilled for the big bad flyers in '97 finals sweep.
@@QenaitheCustodianGuard Av's getting roy had to do with lindros trade. If lindros doesn't shut nords they probably don't leave qc. And habs never trade roy to nords when roy makes his trade demand to habs. No way
@@QenaitheCustodianGuard Hypothetical of course. I know roy wasn't part of the lindros trade. But think about it. Lindros trade made nords/av's a cup contender. All they needed was a goalie. Roy became available. Habs would have traded him anywhere except to nords if they still remained in qc. Just makes you think about the what ifs of that trade...
Imagine if he had just sucked it up and stayed with the Nordiques. Can you picture that 1990s, 2000s Colorado Avalanche with Lindros instead of Forsberg?
We can sum this up rather easliy 1) He didn't want to go to the Nordiques PERIOD..He was then traded to Philly eventually. 2) The Nordiques moved to Colarado and won 2 Cups the following Years. Too bad for Eric! 3) Enough said!!
One last thing - I don't know what the audio features are of your video editing software, but I advise using some sort of compression or automation to keep the volume of the voices consistent.
Is there any way Lindros and Sundin could have stayed with Nordiques/Avs? That may have gotten them both a cup. I say “maybe” because the Lindros trade gave the Nordiques/Avs several key players.
They wanted to trade Sundin because he “didn’t fit in”. Big mistake, if he went to the avs like Sakic and Forsberg he would be just as good in my opinion. Sundin was amazing in Quebec as a 20 year old, shouldn’t have been traded. Even had a 114 point and 47 goal season with the nordiques in his early 20s.
@@F.C.mobile_edits those leafs teams were good just not great. Loved the playoffs battles between them and the Devils. Those were physical series. I still curse Tie Domi's name to this day for that hit he put on Scott Niedermayer.
Hey fellas!! This was in the works for over a year!! Thanks to HTH, Graviteh, Twisted Wrister Hockey, King Angus, & my personal friend Cody Wiggins for helping out with the 1st episode of Ringless! We hope you enjoyed!! EDIT: Since this was made a year ago.. Lots of choppy cuts at times. But still hope yall enjoy!
As an Eric Lindros fan, I can’t wait to see this 🙂
Jesus, absolutely crazy. Hope this blows up
How was this commented 3 months ago lol
@@mfc8778 was unlisted for 10 months haha
@@idontgivetkachuk ohhhh
They say Eric Lindros trade won the Colorado Avalanche two Stanley Cups
It definitely tipped them over the iceberg. The Roy trade was the icing on the cake.
Honestly if they kept Lindros and still moved to Colorado I still think they’d win the cups
@@mamaji277 but they wouldn't have had Forsberg or Roy without this trade. The reason I say Roy is because the Nordiques drafted Jocelyn Thibault (who was traded for Roy) with one of the draft picks in the Lindros trade.
@@Dutchovenderlinde Roy wanted the trade and you know why so there would've still been a chance getting him. You act like Thibault and that draft pick were all they got
You could argue if lindros for forsberg is a fair trade
but the flyers decided to give quebec like half their roster and a ton of cash too lole
Lindros couldnt skate and stick handle at the same time and keep his head up. Thats why he got hit so much. That 97 series wasn't even close
Plenty of today's star players would get destroyed if they played in the Scott Stevens era.
Exactly,the Philly paper listed that as a top 10 Philly collapse...talking about the 76ers in games 4,& 5. I'm a fan of Denver teams,not Philly. But I told them,that wasn't a collapse. It was a team winning the JV conference...then getting exposed in the Cup Finals by Detroit...just like what wouldve happened had they played Colorado,or anybody else,who wouldve won the West back then.
@@marmalaterjones4526 Those teams were so much deeper also. '02 Red Wings...probably had 10 HOFers. '01 Avs had 5 out of 12 All Star starters...from that season's All Star game...then traded for Rob Blake-#6...few wks later. And that doesn't count Foote,Tanguay,Drury,Reinprecht-those teams would mop the floor with anybody today...as they should have...with no salary cap.
Take my Avs today. People think it's so tough to play "heavy Vegas",or Dallas last yr.(granted-no excuses this yr,but insane injuries beat us more than Dallas did,in the bubble) These guys today would shit themselves if they had to play against the grit,& "heaviness" of say 2000 NJ,or '99 Dallas...who also had a lot of skill. Or the unreal skill of Colorado,Detroit...even St Louis,or some of those Pittsburgh teams. Even this Philly team...would likely beat anybody today...& they got friggin swept by Detroit.
@@jasonsmith5226
Can imagine how many of today's "NHLers" would be in the minors in a 26 team league....
@@jasonsmith5226 those avs and wings lineups were ridiculous. On paper they were not as good as the legion of doom lineup of leclair, lindros and recchi, but on ice a good sakic/forsberg/yzerman/fedorov matched them in 2 way play. On top of that flyers were extremely top heavy, as their offensive ouptut falls off after the top line. The avs fielded 2 all star lines and a good checking line, while the wings can field 2 all star lines, an excellent 3rd line and one of the best checking lines of the era. Flyers really never had a chance if lindros never got hurt, he would have been stopped by the elite franchises of avs and red wings in that era.
Also this shows how far the editing has gone 😂😂.
Lindros' opponents had two choices:
1. Let him become the next Gretzky or Lemieux and get humiliated by him for the next 20 years
2. Break him
We know what happened
The Legion of doom line was so dominant it's hard to believe they never won a cup
Or as Wings fans called them "Legion of Broom"
@@frankpapp1933 hahahaha i forgot about that
One line a stanley cup champion does not make. You need depth up and down the lineup.
Detroits D pairing of Lidstrom and Murphy was looked at as soft, and the Legion of Doom was supposed to run all over them.
Lidstrom and Murphy embarrassed them. Lol.
They were so smart, such great passers, and so smart at moving the puck that they couldn't hit them.
Honestly guys the true Legion Of Doom only played about 80 games. Half way through their 2nd year together Renberg got injured and was never the same again. When they went to the cup in 97 Renberg was being moved around all the lines.
I'm a Flyer fan who followed the team throughout the 90's
The Flyers couldn't win a cup of Bob Clarke.
He was a neanderthal GM who was terrible with asset management.
While Dallas was signing Brett Hull, Belfour, trading for Zubov
Colorado trading for Rob Blake, Ray Bourque
Detroit getting Chelios, Shannahan
Jersey having a steady pipeline of talent coming through the system
Clarke was trading 2 first round picks for PAt Falloon; trading PRospal and a first for Alexander Daigle.
signing a washed up Beezer over Cujo
Clarke is the ultimate reason.... not Lindros' fault at all.
And not to mention that five years earlier Clarke had been fired for destryoing the great mid-late 80's Flyers team
I could go on and on
Another problem is that Clarke holds grudges and lets his personal ego get in the way of good managent.
And behind the scenes he's still influencing the management of the team. That's why the Flyers have become a horrible organization
He never won a cup it's a shame that he had a lot of injuries but I don't blame him for not wanting to play for marcel about the nordiques owner at that time marcel was a bad person
He learned at an early age that it's all about him.
Yup. I blame Carl Lindros for that.
Not such a bad thing.
Lindros didn't win b/c Bob Clarke never assembled a team good enough. Never had a 2nd line, just Brindamour with nobody on the wings. Poor defensive depth after Desjardins/Therien. They couldn't draft any impact players until Simon Gagne in '98, 6 years after the trade without a single home-grown impact player. Lindros' concussion problems essentially ended his career by 2000.
If they had that spectacular goaltending from the '80s or hell, even Bernie Parent of the '70s. Also Bobby and pretty much the rest of sports didn't take concussions as seriously as they should have
They were never going to win anything with Hextall and Snow between the pipes.
Simple. Gary Bettman.
Look up "Clutch and Grab/Neutral zone trap Era".
Then look up "Obstruction Interference".
Then look up "Neutral zone trap".
Then look up "Years inacted" 1993-2005"
Then look up "NHL Lockouts".
Then armed with this information, look up "Eric Lindros career years played".
Then look up the word " IRONY"
God, I hated “Trap Defense” the Devils played Trap D and destroyed Detroit in 1995.
During that era Lindros was a dominant physical and scoring force but one reason that slowed him down of course was the concussions. His downfall was skating with his head down as when he was in junior he was possibly used to guys bouncing off of him considering his size as he was basically a giant in comparison to most players. Though he gets a lot of flack, Lindros is still one of my favourites
It’s like asking why Crosby never got 200 points, why mcdavid never scored 50
Why Mcdavid,Mcinnon,& Matheuws cant make a conference final...let alone win a Cup.
Wow this looks interesting. Is this going to be a series?
Yes :)
@@idontgivetkachuk awesome 👍
@@idontgivetkachuk what will you do next?
Ringless lundquist
@@RomanoRailfanning Lundqvist just had a terrible team around him
I'm sad I wasn't invited to speak. Lindros got me into hockey living near Philly. He was the complete package. Thank you Eric for everything.
Lindros had a cup run in 1997 just ran into a superb Detroit
Lindros was my favorite player growing up. I hate to here ppl talk trash on this guy. He was by far one of the most exciting athletes to ever play.
Know four die hard Flyers fans who said exactly the same...until they met him.
Bob Clarke was a horrible GM, as Dave Babych could attest to.
He was a dick after all. That stated, I loved watching him play. Before I became a full time defenseman I wore 88 as kid because of him.
Bought a ‘97 playoff Lindros jersey this year hoping the flyers would make a run...
HAHHAHA
I was at Game 2 of the finals. After that pathetic loss, I got the feeling that it was already over.
I seriously believe that Lindros' size is what ended his career. Hear me out. Because he was the biggest growing up he never learned to keep his head up when he was developing, and because he wasn't accustomed to it in the NHL he suffered his most devastating hits.
No thats probably spot on. Was never an issue until he got to the NHL. That's definitely one of the biggest reasons. He did whatever he wanted. No one was close to him..and then the nhl had a lot of guys like him (not necessarily his skill as he was a special player). I was a lindros fan. Even as a sabres fan, I loved playing the bullies. We used to get bullied by the flyers in his era and then out of nowhere we were beating them easily and it was a huge topic. They panicked and were worried about speed. I will go to my grave saying 90s hockey was at it's absolute best. The game itself, you could feel the emotions of the players, it was personal and the legends of that time. Was loaded. Even at the time it was like wow... gretzky, Mario, jagr, selanne and Kariya, hasek,..can keep going for hours.
@@andyc9979 Totally agree. And hockey these days were more physical, more fun to watch, as tough guys were allowed in teams, unlike these days.
Probably yes, but most people adjust their playing style when going into pro's. He never did that.
Yep spot on, Lindros had no problem giving hits, viciously. But he never learned how to take them, on the ice, or off the ice. Players like Stevens weren't going to take that, & for the first time Lindros was being bullied by smaller but also smarter players. Stevens isn't small, but he's still decently smaller than Lindros.
@@Conflict1922 had he learned, and had he been a smite more humble it would have turned out better, but he had his career and got paid so that's life.
As far as playing closer to home..... the school reason was extremely valid. There are things I know about his family from being around them during the early to mid 90s.
Extremely personal reasons but extremely valid one's. Nothing against the soo, but looking after Eric & his siblings best interests through private challenges that have never made it to the media.
I wonder what would have happened if the NHL had modern concussion protocols in place in the 90s, and Lindros had been allowed to recover properly from his first one rather than repeatedly being exposed to risk.
Why didn’t Lindros win a cup?
Easy: he played for the Flyers
😂😂😂
@@idontgivetkachuk *sad South Jersey resident noises*
His head did not fit into his helmet.
@@mckessa17 true
@@payrysdoscs4903 same here. Burlington county
Lindros was the one of the most hyped athletes not just in Hockey but out of any sport. He lived up to the hype and beyond being at times the most skilled and toughest player in league and hard carried the Flyers to the top of the league. They rewarded him by blaming him for losing in the finals and running him out of town after concussions and injuries started slowing him down.
Lindros' Flyers may not have won, but 2 conference finals and a finals appearance is still good.
By far the coolest thing I've ever been apart of, congrats on 10k, Paul! Thanks for having me on!
Anytime Angus!! Thanks for being apart of Ringless!!
Darren McCarty wrote in his book that Lindros had a tendency to look at the puck and not keep his head up even in juniors. That said, I remember hearing about Detroit looking into acquiring Lindros in the summer of 2001 (Stevie Y was said to be putting Lindros over to management). That could have been interesting, at the very least.
That woulda def been fun
Because it takes an entire team to win a stanley cup, not just 1 player. A stanley cup winning team needs good forwards, defense, goaltending, coaching, scouting, management, etc. Lindros alone cannot fill all those roles
Too much was traded away to acquire Lindros from Québec. Flyers made it to the finals on with him and Lindros won a hart in 95 IIRC, but the way his concussions were handled by the Flyers was the “icing on the cake”. Back then, concussions weren’t seen as career threatening and lesser players would just “somehow fall into obscurity”, declining abruptly and be pushed aside or simply retire when they would get hurt too much. Lindros and .. Crosby led the game to be more aware of such injuries and how to treat them. If you guys haven’t seen Lindros in a Quebec jersey, search TLMEP Eric
Lindros.
Because sadly,Detroit was too good man.
(Cough) 1995 (cough, cough)
@@Jason-bo-Bason that year the devils were too good for philly
I’m surprised Lindros can still remember his name from all the head hits he took.
The Flyers gave up the difference of what would have brought them a cup to get him.
Lindros dominated juniors so much he never learned "head on a swivel".
So much early individual success may have very well have prevented him for the later success.
Ok one thing Lindros couldn’t take over himself meaning it had to be in his end , he wasn’t a jagr or federov who could take blue line to blue line .. he was more of a physical specimen but his skills never quite matched
Never had 50 , topped out at 47 , but also not once did he play a full season
Special thanks TO YOU IDGT, THIS THING TOOK A YEAR TO DO AND ITS SICK
Great production value as always! If you're unsure as to which player to do next, maybe I can make a suggestion. How about Pavel Bure? He didn't have the longevity and wasn't the same after knee issues got the better of him. But for the short period he was in his prime, he was ELECTRIFYING. He sadly never got a ring.
my favorite player of all time to watch... I'm a blues fan, but man, no one was more exciting to watch than bure
He was fun to watch. Hated when your team played him but deep down you loved it. He made sabres games legendary. The brawls. Remember him running hasek lol. Was too funny. The way lindros would do it so nonchalantly was hilarious. He was awesome for hockey. I don't care what anyone says. He was damn good offensively too. But he could get dirty ones also. As a kid whenever we played hockey and the goalie was rammed as a goal was scored we would always yell lindros.
Wrong era, big stars were targeted by career-enders like Stevens when player safety played a 5th fiddle and skull-crunching elbows to the head vacated highlight reels.
Not to mention, Donzi equipment. Their elbow pads alone could put someone in the hospital!
Sleeping with teamate's wife certainly hurts the lockeroom
And it got him one of those concussions
Wow I didn't even know that.......
He's straight?!?!?!
That's false
The problem with the lindros era flyers is that the flyers never really had any depth. Outside the legion of doom bind'amour, desjardins and, later, gagne and recchi, they were really thin. Plus, they had a past-his-prime and old ron hextall in net as well as brian boucher, so goaltending was also another big issue. Trading renberg in his prime to tampa bay in 97, only to bring him back, but with his self-confidence being shot and injuries piling up on both lindros and renberg also didnt help.
Yknow what the ironic part of all of this is? If lindros went to the rangers instead of the flyers, suddenly, the flyers will not only have forsberg as its main star, but also have the depth they so desperately needed throughout the decade! Plus, if they kept guys like beranek, carkner and mellanby around, you'd have a team like this in the mid-90s:
Leclair-Forsberg-Renberg
Brind'amour-Ricci-Mellanby
Juhlin/Prospal-Beranek-Podein
Simon-Zubrus-Dionne
Svoboda-Desjardins
Carkner-Duchesne
Therien-Yushkevich
Hextall
Thibault
Plus, when they traded for pat falloon, they sent the 1st rounder that eventually turned into
Daniel brière. So you'd have the 99-00 team like this:
Leclair-Forsberg-Renberg
Gagné-Brind'amour-Recchi
Zelepukin-Ricci-Mellanby
Simon-Prospal-Podein
Weinrich-Desjardins
Niinima-Yushkevich
Therien-dykhuis
Thibault
Boucher
Sure, you could go with a better goalie, but thibault is decent enough.
Plus, another unknown fact was when they traded for pat falloon, they also traded the pick that became daniel brière. So if they kept that pick, plus the picks that landed them williams, gagné and don't whiff on the 1999 1st rounder and selected martin havlat, you'd have that prospect pool:
Brière
Williams
Sharp
Havlat
Which means in 2003-2004, the flyers lineup would look something like this
Gagné-Forsberg-Brière
Leclair-Brind'amour-Havlat
Sharp-Ricci-Williams
Simon-Prospal-brashear
Niinima-Desjardins
Therien-Yushkevich
Weinrich-pitkanen
Timander
Thibault
This is just a theory, of course, but the flyers woudl definitely have a lot more depth
It's so crazy that the Bertuzzi family still managed to be involved in all this.
Yeah, i had no idea the whole Bertuzzi family was involved in the NHL. Tyler Bertuzzi is has played great with the Red Wings.
Growing up in philly suburbs I was graduating high school in 91 my younger brother and I watched every single game during the lindros era .the leclair lindros connection was just insane to watch.leclair is still my favorite hockey player and deserves to b in the hockey hall of fame..the man helped Montreal win a cup ,dominated the World Cup in 96 to help usa win that cup and was one of the best power forwards in hockey from 94-2000..
Leclair's not in the HHOF? What a crime!!!
Cool idea for a series. Lots to work with - Mike Gartner, Marcel Dionne, Adam Oates, Dale Hawerchuk (rip)...
What happened to Hawerchuk?
@@RIUUI007 he died
Cujo (Curtis Joseph) needs to be here too. Pretty soon you can add Joe Thornton and Patrick Marleau
Lindros in NHL 95-96 was a beast :)
My dude's making full on documentary's now !
And it was awesome, great job guys
Thanks Nada!! Appreciate everyone who was involved in makin this happen! Hope u enjoyed!
From a pure hockey fan point of view it would've been cool to see lindros win a cup. But as a pens fan I have to say I'm so glad he didn't. Lol. But the LOD was so scary to watch if you weren't a flyers fan. I mean 3 power forwards that are good and know how to score. 1 of which is one of the top players in the league. Lindros wasn't as fun to watch on the rangers. And his leafs and stars stints aren't even worth mentioning. But that LOD line was sick to watch. It was just one of those trios that played perfectly together. That was the height of all 3 of their careers. Matter of fact Renberg sucked after that line was broken up. Lol. Great video bro. Really cool concept and well done. Can't wait for the next one. And congrats on 10k.👌
The flyers are still technically benefiting from trading away and again for renberg. He was traded as part of compensation payback for the picks given up for Chris gratton’s offer sheet and then swapped back for renberg & langkow. Langkow was swapped for 1st rounder that became Jeff Carter who was traded for Voracek and pick that became couturier
Renberg was a fantastic player. He was hurt in 1996 and was never the same. Go watch Renberg play in his first two years in the league
The answer is he played for a team that wasn’t good enough at the time
they were good just not good enough...
They never could put together a good second line. It was just Brin'Amour (who was awesome on the role of 2nd line center) with a couple of bums. They could never find a consistent goalie either. That first line, along with Desjardins and Therien, really carried them that far.
The answer is he did it to himself. He wanted out of Quebec and he got his wish. 2 cups he missed out on
You are just forgetting that good player make their team win. Lindros was a rotten apple , nobody rallies with a bad apple.
@@timyumichuck9262 He did do it to himself but I'm not sure he missed out on two Cups. If he was on that team, there wouldn't have been that huge trade. I don't think Colorado would have been that good with Lindros and without Forsberg and the other assets they got from the Flyers. Who knows, maybe Philadelphia would've actually won something with those guys still in the franchise.
As for the reason Lindros didn't win: 1) Goaltending - the team was never solid in net; 2) Bobby Clarke as GM could never leave well enough alone, with all the constant trades. The Chris Gratton deal in particular was silly.
They couldn't draft a single impact player in any round until Gagne in '98. Pathetic. 2 years old after, Lindros' career was essentially over. Brindamour NEVER had decent wingers. No legit 2nd scoring line his whole time in Philly. Clark's incompetence as a GM.
Jesus, I blocked Chris Gratton out of my head all these years. That was awful. Clark had a huge ego as GM and really made a bunch of stupid decisions that hurt the team.
Just finished watching, Great video idea! Keep it up!
Thanks sm Manuel!
Great video man!! Cody Wiggins is my best friend, you picked a good guy to help. Everyone did amazing, keep up the great work!!
Thanks man! He did great!! He's a buddy of mine too :D
He was interesting growing up in the 90's. No one liked him for sitting out that year. Then when he did play, people hated him (except Flyers fans) because he basically played like Tom Wilson. I love big hits, but the way he went at smaller guys was not good for his rep either. He became a target by the bigger guys, and really, most hockey fans at the time loved that Stevens took him out because he deserved it. But yeah, those Detroit teams in a league with no salary cap were unbelievable. No one was beating Detroit or the Avs very much those days.
Lindros actually delivered the goods in a lot of ways that people forget. To bad a minor hockey coach never taught him to keep his head up. He was so physically dominating as a kid and even Junior star he didn't need to, he would just run you over. Until he started to play with opponents that made a living of destroying the guys looking in there feet for the puck. I truly hope he stays healthy in retirement as he was a real star for Team Canada any times and his story is one of great caution for others.
Another awesome video!!!! Keep em coming
Oh, and Brian Propp! 5 trips to the finals, no rings.
Can do this about bondra as well
I can't believe he got in to the HHOF
It's a joke he wasn't a first ballot HOFer. Goes to show how dumb people are.
Thanks for having me included! Congrats on 10K!
Thanks John!! Thanks for helping me out with this project!!
One player doesn't win a cup, the whole team does, including the coach.
I think the team did an earnest job producing this and it's a worthwhile series...AND...my suggestion is to balance out the audio when you edit the next episode. There were times when I had to crank it up to hear the young man in the corner with the orange wall background, and then it would get super loud when it would cut away to someone or something else.
Was edited a year ago and the og file got deleted, so I couldn’t rly fix it even if I wanted to at that point haha. But yes I agree. The sound was all over the place and it lowkey bugs me a bit too. Still hope you enjoyed tho!
@@idontgivetkachuk I did enjoy it and look forward to seeing the next episodes.
I once remember seeing something where Lindros didn't lift weights mainly because he would "get too big" and felt too heavy. The guy was 235 pounds and wasn't lifting like Brindamour. It was just natural size. Let that sink in.
Also worth noting, his brother Brett was also skilled, but had his career also cut short because of concussions
With every game I saw him play one word stood out every time.
Work.
When I saw him on the ice it was work to him.
I've watched hockey a long time and seen players like Lafleur, Orr, Sittler, Bossy, Gretzky, Lemieux,...
They all looked like they played and loved the game.
Not what I saw whenever I saw Lindros jump over the boards.
One word always stood out when I saw him.
Hockey was work to him and that more than anything is why he never won a cup.
He did not love the game like those other players.
Bullshit. He was a teenager in the spotlight dealing with a target on his back is all. The guy had a ton of heart.
More myths about Lindros than any other player I can think of.
Two of Lindros' big problems were his father and his injuries. Carl Lindros inserted himself into everything in his son's life and became a thorn in the side of Flyers GM Bobby Clark. Those two big ego guys proceeded to have their own ugly battles, all to the detriment of Lindros' hockey career. And Eric never learned that he had to skate with his head up. He never saw Scott Stevens coming when Stevens knocked him into the next season. That was a dirty hit but Lindros could've avoided the brunt of it had he kept his head up. He did that a lot, looking down at the puck instead of at his surroundings because most guys couldn't really faze him with a check. He thought he was too big. And then came Darius Kasparitus and Scott Stevens. You've got to brace yourself for those kind of shots. All those concussions effectively ended his career. It ultimately just came to wasted years for the Flyers.
Great stuff idgt, nice to see Grav in here too
Wow, now this is a great video
My new favorite idgt vid cant wait for more to take that spot
If Philly got Roy instead of Colorado he would have several cups. Instead just a STACK of mediocre goalies. That’s why!
Thats a big reason for sure. Just watch Hextall let in those weak goals against the Devils in the 95 Eastern Finals for some good examples of the goalie letting the team down.
Do Kariya next please!
Awesome series idea! But someone please tell Graveith to sit down during his parts please
The Flyers lost Forsberg who was a much better player.
Getting Forsberg for Lindros was a robbery all by itself, forget the additional two lines that came along with him.
@@Hisdudeness9500 The Flyers would have been Stanley Cup bound with Peter Forsberg's career in Colorado.
Peter was a still an unknown professional commodity.
@@Pfsif Ah, but what a commodity!
Really good video, me and a bud enjoyed it ,avs fan and philly fan
Also we're deciding to play some throwback NHL 06 to play some old Lindros, maybe even NHL 2000 xD
😂😂 word! Thanks sm for watching!!
Great video. Keep it up. I've been a sub for a while, hope to see your channel rise.
Thanks man!!
most underrated channel on youtube
Thanks man!
I remember my dad and I going to see him play against the Windsor spitfires at Windsor arena, the building was jammed packed
What a great video! Love the collaborative aspect, it's nice to get input from different sources and put it all together into a single narrative. Never been a Philly fan, but I always loved and respected Lindros. It truly is a shame that things didn't work out differently, especially as far as injuries go. This format would definitely make for an interesting ongoing series.🏒🥅🚨
3 more episodes in production as we speak 👀
Lindros in his prime was a force of nature each shift. He really could dominate the ice. His style of play was so intense before the injuries added up, which made him great but probably is why he got so many injuries.
His ego was his undoing.
If Eric just stayed with Quebec he would have had 2 Stanley Cups
How many episodes will we see? I really enjoyed this.
4!
Can you make a video on players who battle concussions throughout their careers like, Crosby, Marc Savard, Nathan Horton, etc
I remember watching that era (error?) of the Flyers. The team never had the crucially important right mix of depth on offense and defense,. The goaltending was average or slightly above on its best days. Damn near impossible to win under those circumstances.
With what the Flyers traded for Lindros, that gave Colorado the Stanley Cup wins they had (after moving from Quebec).
Really good work. I enjoyed seeing the other TH-camrs. Some I follow. Missed out on having ohnyquist. Really great channel
Hit him up for it cause hes my buddy. Was in the og lineup but things popped up. But thanks haha!
He is ringless because he had his ass handed to him by the red wings
Love the video! I can tell you put a ton of effort into it!
Thanks sm BP!
Such an Awesome Video!
"You can't build a team around one player"
The Pens the last 35 years "Hold my beer"
It's like poor Sittler with the Leafs, he was a great player but the teams weren't good enough to all the way, that's life!
This is amazing. I think the next one has to be Jerome Iginla. Great vid bud
Secret base did a youtube video about how Jarome Iginla never won a stanley cup
@@flavoredliquid3380 touché so how about marcel dionne
Well done!!! Super informative and professionally put together!
Thanks!!
His parents and his ego together made him a difficult player to deal with. He was a great player in the juniors and even then he was a douchbag.
Lindros had it too easy in ohl when he could just put his head down and run over players like a train. He never learned to keep his head up and never imagined nhl d men like kaspar and stevens could hit like a train and lay him out like a bag of laundry. A lesson learned too late. Plus the bounty flyers gave up to get him hampered them building a team around him and no proper goalie as well. Devils had Brodeur. Sabres had Hasek. Habs/Av's (thanks to lindros) had Roy. And wings were too fast and too skilled for the big bad flyers in '97 finals sweep.
Avs did not have Roy thanks to lindros he left for other reasons.
@@QenaitheCustodianGuard Av's getting roy had to do with lindros trade. If lindros doesn't shut nords they probably don't leave qc. And habs never trade roy to nords when roy makes his trade demand to habs. No way
@@stevenbauer4799 oh you mean it like that, well I would say that is a stretch but I see your point.
@@QenaitheCustodianGuard Hypothetical of course. I know roy wasn't part of the lindros trade. But think about it. Lindros trade made nords/av's a cup contender. All they needed was a goalie. Roy became available. Habs would have traded him anywhere except to nords if they still remained in qc. Just makes you think about the what ifs of that trade...
Congrats on 10k!!!!
Thanks AeO!
Imagine if he had just sucked it up and stayed with the Nordiques. Can you picture that 1990s, 2000s Colorado Avalanche with Lindros instead of Forsberg?
😳😳😳
Amazing video bro
We can sum this up rather easliy
1) He didn't want to go to the Nordiques PERIOD..He was then traded to Philly eventually.
2) The Nordiques moved to Colarado and won 2 Cups the following Years. Too bad for Eric!
3) Enough said!!
One last thing - I don't know what the audio features are of your video editing software, but I advise using some sort of compression or automation to keep the volume of the voices consistent.
"Normalize audio"
@@iix23 So, basically, compression, then. ;-)
Is there any way Lindros and Sundin could have stayed with Nordiques/Avs? That may have gotten them both a cup. I say “maybe” because the Lindros trade gave the Nordiques/Avs several key players.
They wanted to trade Sundin because he “didn’t fit in”. Big mistake, if he went to the avs like Sakic and Forsberg he would be just as good in my opinion. Sundin was amazing in Quebec as a 20 year old, shouldn’t have been traded. Even had a 114 point and 47 goal season with the nordiques in his early 20s.
@@F.C.mobile_edits As a diehard Leafs fan, it pained me that he never got a cup.
@@busupshot83 same, but the reason he never won a cup is the reason mcdavid and drai have no playoff success, you need a real team to back you up.
@@F.C.mobile_edits those leafs teams were good just not great. Loved the playoffs battles between them and the Devils. Those were physical series. I still curse Tie Domi's name to this day for that hit he put on Scott Niedermayer.
@@Sweeptheleg83 lol
Awesome video, great music choices! kinda feel bad my red wings rekt em so bad tho haha
Nothing like a hockey TH-camr crossover episode lol, nice job
A good TH-cam video to me is like art. This was art, Thankyou.
Thanks sm man!
8 flyers fans are mad Detroit is built different
Great job guys