This is why I like Retro Games. They may not get it right on release, but they work on it, they listen to the fans, and they fix things as soon as they can. Same goes for Blaze, they are not perfect, but they do try and get things right, and if they don't, they fix it.
I had the Atari VCS and would have dearly loved an Atari 400 or 800 but the cost was simply out of my range at the time. I got my first job in 1985 and could finally afford a 600XL. By then the model was getting rare locally, due to poor sales, but I got one on a clearance sale. Sadly the unit failed within a month and I had to return it. Being a clearance item I couldn't get a replacement so a refund was my only option. Later on I bought an Amstrad CPC6128 and then an Amiga 500 but I will always consider the Atari 400 the one that got away.
I’m glad there’s finally a firmware update for the 400 Mini! And although it’s distributed by a different company hopefully a 2600+ *OFFICIAL* firmware update will finally come soon, too.
That Analogue controller update is fantastic! Atari should release a Trackball controller that's compatible with all their retro remakes. Centipede and Missile Command with a Trackball are so much fun.
My guess is, if they ever do a maxi, the choice of the 400 design will come into play and save them money making a nicer 800 keyboard. Hope I'm wrong !
It's great that they've added Caverns of Mars. This is the game that was released by a high school student a year after he got his Atari 800. It was first published as part of the Atari Program Exchange ("APX") but it sold so well that Atari released it as a regular game and even as a cartridge. I like the keyboard improvements. This almost makes an alternate keyboard useable. I'll do the update, and the ones that follow, but I still think I can do more with my old Atari 400 with its FujiNet peripheral and RF to HDMI adapter.
Great to see this, I feared it was abandoned by the vendor... nice to see the screen toggle thing, my main wish is still ATX file support (this was originally listed in the specs) and true drive emulation. Thanks for the video!
Missile Command 5200 has perfect analog controls using real hardware. You can crawl the cursor or whip it to the edge of the screen instantly. This version's controls look to make the game unplayable. I wonder if some controllers handle better, or if they are all too sensitive.
Glad to see that MULE was fixed. Disappointed that 5200 controls still can’t be fixed, even the digital controls. I would hope a second update could resolve these issues. Strange how those infamous 5200 joysticks are so difficult to emulate.
I hope the Amiga Maxi really hits the shelves by the end of the year, and I hope for the next Maxi console by them to be a The800, The800XL or TheXE with a working keyboard. RetroGames know how to make good quality retro emulation boxes.
Hopefully they will get the 5200 controls more fine tuned next time. There's a lot of hate out there for the 5200 joystick (and yes, the buttons are terrible) but the analog joystick works like a dream. Sure there's no self centering (besides the rubber boot) but it's highly precise. When I finally got a hold of a 5200 this year, I was surprised at how well a game like Pacman controls. Still gotta get my hands on an actual Atari 8-bit computer...
Ahhh...looks like a great update. Haven't been messing with this unit all summer as it is time for outside activities here in the NE US. Looks like I have a lot to catch up with when the leaves are gone (happening soon...too soon).
2:45 You can just hold down the fire button and it will automatically shoot for you. This is especially helpful in the parts where many things are quickly flying past you.
Missile Command, if it is working like a real 5200, is never going to be particularly playable on that gamepad. 5200 Missile Command has an absolute positioning mechanic. Moving the joystick doesn't tell the system what direction to move the cursor, it tells it where the cursor belongs. If your stick is in the top-right, your cursor is in the top-right. If your stick is centered, your cursor is centered. It is a behavior that works very well on the 5200's original controllers, and very poorly on basically anything else. You need a certain length of stick to get a meaningful amount of precision in your movement, and the centering springs will fight any attempt at precision targeting.
Not expecting too much for a x.x.1 update, but sounds like they did deliver some good changes like updated the analog support, plus can't go wrong with bonus free game. I feel one of the main drivers to get it out was the MULE fix (as that was loved by many) since they already provided the patched ROM but wanted to get it officially bundled with the firmware (likely so they can update the next production run with the patched firmware). That seemed like an embarrassing oversight that they hadn't caught that before launch and wanted to get that resolved somewhat quickly.
RGL's done a fantastic job of post release support for their hardware, and it looks like they're continuing that trend here. With Atari distributing the machine here in the US, I'm looking forward to the full sized release w/ a working keyboard (my hope is a 800 for the actual keys and not just a membrane). Maybe we'll see the ST line make an appearance in the not too distant future.
I guess people weren't using the Atari 400 Mini to play emulated 5200 games but it's good that they're working on it. That might explain the 4 month delay. Hopefully by the time I buy the Mini it will allow for great experiences in games such as Space Dungeon and Gremlins, the two killer apps the 5200 has in my opinion.
I've been playing both SD & Gremlins beautifuly by running the 800XL disk images. They don't expect or require analog controls and play wonderfully! Like you, though, I'm also holding out hope for usable analog in 5200 games.
I found that the delay from the controller made Miner 2049er impossible to play. Haven't picked it up since I found this massive flaw. Thanks for the video.
Even though I like this company’s products, they have grown very neglectful in maintaining them. We’re still waiting for more features for the C64 Mini and compatibility fixes for the A500 Mini. If this wouldn’t have been a PR disaster because of MULE, they probably wouldn’t had made anything. And it took them forever!!
My emulator, Atari800MacX, doesn't have the function key equivalents you mentioned. Instead this emulator, the best of the bunch IMHO, has a separate window with the function keys and another window with graphic representations of the disk drives and other peripherals along with warm start and cold start keys. With this update will it finally make sense for me to hook up an external keyboard with those stickers. But the Atari computers didn't have the graphic characters on the keycaps, at least through the 400/800/XL years. That's a Commodore thing. It will help me identify the keyboard, though.
It's funny, the ST line didn't have graphic characters on the keyboard either. I always had to look those up. I did appreciate the four-part graphic of Dr. Bob Dobbs included on the ST's character set, as well as the two-part Atari logo.
The struggles you're having with the "analog" joystick reminds me of the trouble I've been having with the Classic Joystick with Missile Command on my new Atari VCS. It's just too "hot" to be useable.
"Hot" is a great way to describe it. I'm not convinced that lightning-fast velocity is the only thing that needs tweaking, but it's the first thing that needs tweaking! 😉
@@georgekelgiorgis5895 Make sure that your USB flash drive is formatted as MS-DOS (not ExFAT) with MBR booting method and have the update in main directory, the "root" directory. It took me three tries to get it right.
@@georgekelgiorgis5895 Βεβαιωθείτε ότι το USB stick σας έχει μορφοποίηση FAT32 με MBR. Υπάρχει ένας σύνδεσμος αντιμετώπισης προβλημάτων ακριβώς στη σελίδα λήψης υλικολογισμικού της RGL.
Just a heads up. I successfully updated firmware from my secondary USB (less Roms than my primary USB). After the update, I later plugged in my primary USB with the full library of roms but each rom file was renamed jargon including question marks and random letters. Games would not open. I opened primary usb stick on my PC to check but the usb root menu opens up empty. Make sure you add the firmware to your primary rom usb stick so that you don’t have to go through the search and download of all the 5200 and 8-Bit roms again.
For some reason after the update i cant access my 5200 folder on the mini.. previously i could.. have even deleted and added the folder back with no luck, just wont open
My problem is that It's not setup to play the new VBXE or 320K games that are out now.... Hoping for a update to address that. I was not really into the 5200 features...
As cool as that would be, that wasn't within the scope of what RGL promised to deliver here. If it could be added, then it would certainly be a nice bonus, but they don't owe it to us. I do understand, though, that this is the thing you'd most like to see.
My Atari 800XL never needed a firmware update. Just saying. ☝ I don't recall the 5200 controllers auto centering at all. They were the weakest point of the 5200. Should have been 100% digital like the computers.
Never needed to updated its firmware, but also cost nearly $500 adjusting for inflation. 😉 I think I can copy over a few files for that kind of savings.
At 9:05 Can you use the atari joystick instead of snes game pad for missile command? The thumb sticks may be why it is too fast still even at slowest setting? Maybe a trackball would be better also?
I played Missile Command using the dpad as part of this test. Maybe you missed that quick bit. I was specifically testing analog control here, though. We already know how it performs with digital from my initial review.
@@GenXGrownUp i meant can you use the atari 2600 joystick which may be not as quick as the snes dpad analog sticks, and more controllable of the crosshairs.
@@GenXGrownUp Or, Atari just needs to come out with a 5200+, which would take physical cartridges, and use the designated controllers like the joystick and trakball.
I suspect I’m the only one with an issue. I have done every step, exactly the same, including leaving only the minimum peripherals plugged in and the update does not show up.
@@kghhgkgk6322 You can do exactly that when configuring the controller for games you add. In my Firmware Wishlist video I mention that it would be nice to be able to do that for pre-installed games, as well.
I believe it’s like 4, not counting those that were simply adapted and/or “hacked” to have updated graphics for the GTIA instead of the CTIA. It’s irrelevant, though, as all the “exclusives” have been converted.
Well @GenXGrownUp , everytime I try to control Pengo, Pengo is stuck in a random block and I can't even control him at all! That's the problem I'm talking about.
Playing Pac-Man on a genuine 5200 with the analog controller actually works quite well. I used it here to illustrate that we're not quite there with accurate analog control on THE400 Mini.
Not terribly surprising in a second-dot update (x.x.1). Seems like this focused on fixing bugs over implementing new features. Here's hoping for the next one.
@@GenXGrownUp Hope so because this is a slick little emulator. I just expect it work at least as good as Alitrra in terms of emulation, since that is a mature emu that has been around for years.
Lol, why would you hate this exactly? You have 7 subscribers, you haven't produced any content yourself in over two years so maybe focus on something you like instead of hating things others do.
This is why I like Retro Games. They may not get it right on release, but they work on it, they listen to the fans, and they fix things as soon as they can. Same goes for Blaze, they are not perfect, but they do try and get things right, and if they don't, they fix it.
Caverns of Mars is an all time great Atari 8 bit game.
I had the Atari VCS and would have dearly loved an Atari 400 or 800 but the cost was simply out of my range at the time. I got my first job in 1985 and could finally afford a 600XL. By then the model was getting rare locally, due to poor sales, but I got one on a clearance sale. Sadly the unit failed within a month and I had to return it. Being a clearance item I couldn't get a replacement so a refund was my only option.
Later on I bought an Amstrad CPC6128 and then an Amiga 500 but I will always consider the Atari 400 the one that got away.
Wow the opening for Mule looks like an an AT-AT from the Parker bros Star Wars game.
I’m glad there’s finally a firmware update for the 400 Mini! And although it’s distributed by a different company hopefully a 2600+ *OFFICIAL* firmware update will finally come soon, too.
That Analogue controller update is fantastic!
Atari should release a Trackball controller that's compatible with all their retro remakes.
Centipede and Missile Command with a Trackball are so much fun.
Yes. 800 XL Maxi please!!
My guess is, if they ever do a maxi, the choice of the 400 design will come into play and save them money making a nicer 800 keyboard. Hope I'm wrong !
It's great that they've added Caverns of Mars.
This is the game that was released by a high school student a year after he got his Atari 800. It was first published as part of the Atari Program Exchange ("APX") but it sold so well that Atari released it as a regular game and even as a cartridge.
I like the keyboard improvements. This almost makes an alternate keyboard useable.
I'll do the update, and the ones that follow, but I still think I can do more with my old Atari 400 with its FujiNet peripheral and RF to HDMI adapter.
I just got an original 400. Had one back in 1982-86 too. Pretty cool retro machine. Works well.
Great to see this, I feared it was abandoned by the vendor... nice to see the screen toggle thing, my main wish is still ATX file support (this was originally listed in the specs) and true drive emulation. Thanks for the video!
Thank you Jon for getting the update out there. Just did it. Keep rockin'!
Missile Command 5200 has perfect analog controls using real hardware. You can crawl the cursor or whip it to the edge of the screen instantly. This version's controls look to make the game unplayable. I wonder if some controllers handle better, or if they are all too sensitive.
I just updated my 400 mini. Thank you, Jon!!!
I never had any interest in the 5200 and 7800 until I saw your original feature on this...
Glad to see that MULE was fixed. Disappointed that 5200 controls still can’t be fixed, even the digital controls. I would hope a second update could resolve these issues. Strange how those infamous 5200 joysticks are so difficult to emulate.
I hope the Amiga Maxi really hits the shelves by the end of the year, and I hope for the next Maxi console by them to be a The800, The800XL or TheXE with a working keyboard.
RetroGames know how to make good quality retro emulation boxes.
I still need to pick one of these up.
They've gotten a bit cheaper. Shopping link in the video description if you're interested.
@GenXGrownUp Oh I am interested. It is the wife's level of (dis)interest that is the main reason I have not grabbed one yet.
Hopefully they will get the 5200 controls more fine tuned next time. There's a lot of hate out there for the 5200 joystick (and yes, the buttons are terrible) but the analog joystick works like a dream. Sure there's no self centering (besides the rubber boot) but it's highly precise. When I finally got a hold of a 5200 this year, I was surprised at how well a game like Pacman controls. Still gotta get my hands on an actual Atari 8-bit computer...
Ahhh...looks like a great update. Haven't been messing with this unit all summer as it is time for outside activities here in the NE US. Looks like I have a lot to catch up with when the leaves are gone (happening soon...too soon).
Nice quality of life improvements. Extra games are always a plus
2:45 You can just hold down the fire button and it will automatically shoot for you. This is especially helpful in the parts where many things are quickly flying past you.
🫡
Thanks for the video Jon! I updated mine with no problems! It is actually the first time i did it for this system.
Missile Command, if it is working like a real 5200, is never going to be particularly playable on that gamepad.
5200 Missile Command has an absolute positioning mechanic. Moving the joystick doesn't tell the system what direction to move the cursor, it tells it where the cursor belongs. If your stick is in the top-right, your cursor is in the top-right. If your stick is centered, your cursor is centered.
It is a behavior that works very well on the 5200's original controllers, and very poorly on basically anything else. You need a certain length of stick to get a meaningful amount of precision in your movement, and the centering springs will fight any attempt at precision targeting.
Great video, thankyou for doing this.
My pleasure!
Not expecting too much for a x.x.1 update, but sounds like they did deliver some good changes like updated the analog support, plus can't go wrong with bonus free game. I feel one of the main drivers to get it out was the MULE fix (as that was loved by many) since they already provided the patched ROM but wanted to get it officially bundled with the firmware (likely so they can update the next production run with the patched firmware). That seemed like an embarrassing oversight that they hadn't caught that before launch and wanted to get that resolved somewhat quickly.
Great review and info on this update - thank you!
My pleasure!
Thanks for the info update and showing us how to do this and the improvements and changes!
👊🏻😎🕹️
Great firmware update for the bug fixes. Thanks for the review Jon! 😊
RGL's done a fantastic job of post release support for their hardware, and it looks like they're continuing that trend here. With Atari distributing the machine here in the US, I'm looking forward to the full sized release w/ a working keyboard (my hope is a 800 for the actual keys and not just a membrane). Maybe we'll see the ST line make an appearance in the not too distant future.
This firmware update was so simple to do compared to the GSP update. Glad they supported the mini 400.
Seems like a worthy update.
thanks Jon. Been waiting all day for this video. Glad you got it done.
Hope you enjoyed it!
Thanks John! Hope you are feeling better!
I guess people weren't using the Atari 400 Mini to play emulated 5200 games but it's good that they're working on it. That might explain the 4 month delay.
Hopefully by the time I buy the Mini it will allow for great experiences in games such as Space Dungeon and Gremlins, the two killer apps the 5200 has in my opinion.
I've been playing both SD & Gremlins beautifuly by running the 800XL disk images. They don't expect or require analog controls and play wonderfully! Like you, though, I'm also holding out hope for usable analog in 5200 games.
@@GenXGrownUp I have Gremlins on 800XL but haven't found Space Dungeon yet.
@@GenXGrownUpcan you use both sticks for SD on your 8bitdo?
Excising the opening animation for 7 Cities - that's bizarre. The original game fit on a single floppy!
It's strange, I know. AFAIK, the game is there, just missing that opening that helps to set the mood.
Thanks for the video John
Surely. Thanks for watching.
I found that the delay from the controller made Miner 2049er impossible to play. Haven't picked it up since I found this massive flaw. Thanks for the video.
So much easier then the GSP process, I'll give Retro Games props for streamlining it - just as easy to do this with the A500 and C64 ^_^
Great update Jon! Thanks for sharing :-)
Thanks for the update Jon. As I havent really explored my 400 mini as of yet, can you recomend a good USB stick to download games on? Thanks
Even though I like this company’s products, they have grown very neglectful in maintaining them. We’re still waiting for more features for the C64 Mini and compatibility fixes for the A500 Mini.
If this wouldn’t have been a PR disaster because of MULE, they probably wouldn’t had made anything. And it took them forever!!
Ahh the 400 where it all started
Awesome video, thanks for the update info
Any time!
I have one of these 😂👍
I had a 1200XL when I was a kid, wish someone made a mini 1200XL Shell I could pot that board in
💜
My emulator, Atari800MacX, doesn't have the function key equivalents you mentioned. Instead this emulator, the best of the bunch IMHO, has a separate window with the function keys and another window with graphic representations of the disk drives and other peripherals along with warm start and cold start keys.
With this update will it finally make sense for me to hook up an external keyboard with those stickers. But the Atari computers didn't have the graphic characters on the keycaps, at least through the 400/800/XL years. That's a Commodore thing. It will help me identify the keyboard, though.
I loved the keyboard design of my 130XE. It had the ATASCII characters printed on the front face of the keycaps.
@@GenXGrownUp I blame "Mad" Jack Tramiel.
It's funny, the ST line didn't have graphic characters on the keyboard either. I always had to look those up.
I did appreciate the four-part graphic of Dr. Bob Dobbs included on the ST's character set, as well as the two-part Atari logo.
i feel the maxi for this year is probably the amiga given they had taken about this long for the C64 maxi and how popular the amiga was
Full-size Amiga is ALSO on the roadmap, which suggests the "new full-size console" for Q4 is not the Amiga.
Awesome!
Love the music
Where did you get the keys stickers for your keyboard that list the atari commands for F5- to F12? How can I get them?
Check this video and it's description. th-cam.com/users/liveilT4F6VOECY
The struggles you're having with the "analog" joystick reminds me of the trouble I've been having with the Classic Joystick with Missile Command on my new Atari VCS. It's just too "hot" to be useable.
"Hot" is a great way to describe it. I'm not convinced that lightning-fast velocity is the only thing that needs tweaking, but it's the first thing that needs tweaking! 😉
Έχω πρόβλημα δεν βλέπει το update μου δείχνει 1 0 0
@@georgekelgiorgis5895 Make sure that your USB flash drive is formatted as MS-DOS (not ExFAT) with MBR booting method and have the update in main directory, the "root" directory. It took me three tries to get it right.
@lorensims4846 too late my friend atari 400 is to recycling bin destroyed
@@georgekelgiorgis5895 Βεβαιωθείτε ότι το USB stick σας έχει μορφοποίηση FAT32 με MBR. Υπάρχει ένας σύνδεσμος αντιμετώπισης προβλημάτων ακριβώς στη σελίδα λήψης υλικολογισμικού της RGL.
They should sell an atari keyboard with the symbols already on it.
Just a heads up. I successfully updated firmware from my secondary USB (less Roms than my primary USB). After the update, I later plugged in my primary USB with the full library of roms but each rom file was renamed jargon including question marks and random letters. Games would not open. I opened primary usb stick on my PC to check but the usb root menu opens up empty. Make sure you add the firmware to your primary rom usb stick so that you don’t have to go through the search and download of all the 5200 and 8-Bit roms again.
How odd!
Hell yeah
For some reason after the update i cant access my 5200 folder on the mini.. previously i could.. have even deleted and added the folder back with no luck, just wont open
Mine went weird. :( I lost sound after the update. I haven't figured out why yet. :-/
I know it's silly, but I'd like it if they'd release this console with a mini 5200 case.
Not silly. Neat! 😁
My problem is that It's not setup to play the new VBXE or 320K games that are out now.... Hoping for a update to address that. I was not really into the 5200 features...
As cool as that would be, that wasn't within the scope of what RGL promised to deliver here. If it could be added, then it would certainly be a nice bonus, but they don't owe it to us. I do understand, though, that this is the thing you'd most like to see.
Coolness
My Atari 800XL never needed a firmware update. Just saying. ☝
I don't recall the 5200 controllers auto centering at all. They were the weakest point of the 5200. Should have been 100% digital like the computers.
Never needed to updated its firmware, but also cost nearly $500 adjusting for inflation. 😉 I think I can copy over a few files for that kind of savings.
I want to get one of these
The price has dropped. Link in the video description.
At 9:05 Can you use the atari joystick instead of snes game pad for missile command? The thumb sticks may be why it is too fast still even at slowest setting? Maybe a trackball would be better also?
Is millipede same as missile command with the analog stick game pad?
I played Missile Command using the dpad as part of this test. Maybe you missed that quick bit. I was specifically testing analog control here, though. We already know how it performs with digital from my initial review.
@@GenXGrownUp i meant can you use the atari 2600 joystick which may be not as quick as the snes dpad analog sticks, and more controllable of the crosshairs.
I don’t know the recommended control settings when playing 5200 ROMs using the CX stick. I still can’t play Pac-Man properly.
Same here, as illustrated in this video. It's not the settings - it's the software's behavior.
@@GenXGrownUp What I need is a modern-style controller. That might be the solution.
@@GenXGrownUp Or, Atari just needs to come out with a 5200+, which would take physical cartridges, and use the designated controllers like the joystick and trakball.
Do actual paddle controllers work?
I want to know too 😊
Yes, on the bonus games, but not on anythis else at this time as far as I know.
th-cam.com/video/w_YIevAubno/w-d-xo.html
I suspect I’m the only one with an issue. I have done every step, exactly the same, including leaving only the minimum peripherals plugged in and the update does not show up.
Have you verified FAT32 with MBR for your USB stick?
@@GenXGrownUp it is FAT32 but I am not sure what MBR is
There's a USB stick troubleshooting page linked from the RGL firmware download page.
@@GenXGrownUp thank you!
Did they fix the issue where the buttons on the stick would reset the games while you're playing if you accidentally pressed them?
Software on the console isn't going to be able to address the physical design of the controller.
@@GenXGrownUp was hoping they'd just make the emulator ignore those buttons. Doesn't seem hard
@@kghhgkgk6322 You can do exactly that when configuring the controller for games you add. In my Firmware Wishlist video I mention that it would be nice to be able to do that for pre-installed games, as well.
I can`t play Spelunker on the 400 mini. When Basic is on , an error message says that it needs 48K memory.
Hmmm. I'll have to give that a try. No sure I've given Spelunker a spin on this unit.
cool❤
Are there any 5200 games that are not on the 8 bit Computers? I would just stick with the A8 roms.
I haven't run a comparison, but I expect there are a few.
I believe it’s like 4, not counting those that were simply adapted and/or “hacked” to have updated graphics for the GTIA instead of the CTIA.
It’s irrelevant, though, as all the “exclusives” have been converted.
I hope the firmware update fixed the Pengo 5200 port as well.
(Well, at least the analogue is fixed, but it didn't fix Pengo 5200 Port...)
Not sure the firmware can fix a port. What trouble were you experiencing?
Well @GenXGrownUp , everytime I try to control Pengo, Pengo is stuck in a random block and I can't even control him at all! That's the problem I'm talking about.
Did they address how to run XEGS games?
No mention in the release notes. Are you unable to play XEGS?
They all run fine as is?
They need to address extended memory 256k - 320k - 576k and 1088k this is holding me back from purchasing the 400 mini
Am I missing something? I don't understand why you'd want to play Pac-Man with an analog input.
Playing Pac-Man on a genuine 5200 with the analog controller actually works quite well. I used it here to illustrate that we're not quite there with accurate analog control on THE400 Mini.
R I P Atari A400
❓
Still no fix for artifacting colors? Disappointing. Renders many disk and RPG games in B&W only
Not terribly surprising in a second-dot update (x.x.1). Seems like this focused on fixing bugs over implementing new features. Here's hoping for the next one.
@@GenXGrownUp Hope so because this is a slick little emulator. I just expect it work at least as good as Alitrra in terms of emulation, since that is a mature emu that has been around for years.
The fact that a USB stick has to be involved is incredibly lame 😂
👌
What a piece of garbage. Why would anyone buy this thing?
th-cam.com/video/eQHeYK7gPcU/w-d-xo.html
Let me guess... "Just get a RPi"
There are billions of products being sold in the world. Go find something you like.
Lol, why would you hate this exactly? You have 7 subscribers, you haven't produced any content yourself in over two years so maybe focus on something you like instead of hating things others do.
Indeed it is a garbage that's why I got rid of it
Hola! Se ve bueno este juego.