Honda Had The Best 1.5-liter F1 Engine
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ย. 2024
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“ＨＯＮＤＡ ＲＡ３０１（１９６８） Honda Music” by M16HT
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“Honda F-1 RA301 (1968) - Final 3.0L V12 NA sound of Honda F-1” by Deckay_F
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“The F1 Prototype, Honda's RA270 | 1964 Footage | Powered By Honda” by Honda Racing F1
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“Honda F1 Race Vintage Mexico GP (1965)” by H-Tune
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“HONDA F-1 RA271 dNaNo” by fullthrotlekinoshita
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“Honda F-1 RA272 (1965) vol.1 - 1.5L V12 NA Sound!!” by Deckay_F
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“Jpanese Grand Prix 2022 HONDA RA272 drived by Takuma Sato” by Ecurie230
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“1967 Honda RA300 F1 Car - 3.0L V12 Engine Sound!” by 19Bozzy92
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“Honda F-1 RA300 (1967) - 3.0L V12 NA sound !!” by Deckay_F
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“McLaren Honda MP4/5 (1989) vol.2 - 3.5L V10 NA Engine” by Deckay_F
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I love Honda for their out-of-the-box thinking that made so many strange and out of this world mechanical designs.
Have seen clips of this parking lot on many of your videos. Honda museum would be my guess. Almost worth the trip to see history carefully, and lovingly displayed. Another masterpiece from Visioracer
You go to the Honda collection in Motegi to see the cars and then there are the bikes!
Those Honda engineers were absolute geniuses. Here they are today still building some of the finest F1 engines.
The 89’ MP4/5 is my all time favorite, what an engine in that McLaren chassis
This video is horrible it is obviously made by a Honda fanboy. They make it seem like that air cooled Honda F1 car was the natural progression of their development when in fact it was a second F1 car Honda developed in secret and showed up as a competitor to the liquid cooled car. No reputable F1 driver would get near it and only a desperate racer eager to make a mark in F1 took a chance and paid the ultimate price for Honda's hubris.
@@EricHorchuckblah blah blah blah...saltiness...blah blah blah...edginess...blah blah blah...you can shut up, pack up your tears now
Once again I’m learning something new today with your videos.
Previously, I am aware that the ridiculous “60’s Honda V12” also had 12 individual Keihin carburetors. What I didn’t know was that on top of that it also had a mechanical fuel injection. While 99% of any fuel delivery application throughout history only asks for either one, it’s rather amazing that Honda chose both.
I haven’t actually read the entirety of the RA series history, but I would love to imagine the engineers stumbled upon the mechanics of fuel mixing and delivery while attempting to perfect the ITB system which would eventually lead to the swirl combustion in their motorcycles and later the CVCC system.
Honda throughout the years has maintained it's place as the king of high power, low displacement reliable engines.
1.5 liter v12. Those cylinders had to have been tiny. The redline on this engine is insane.
You could think of it as 3x 500 cc fours. In that context, it's a relatively large engine (cylinder dimensions) by Honda's standard at the time.
They were famed for their 350 cc six cylinders and even a 50 cc twin, which became the basis for a 125 cc 5 cylinder!
Insane V10s of the 00s revved near enough to 20k. Materials these days are much better.
@@samiraperi467 funnily enough the Honda 125 I mentioned revved well over 20k. They used torsion springs for the valves.
Ordinary axial coil springs topped out at around 13k -14k then, just as they did into the 90s and before F1 switched to pneumatic springs
It was pneumatic valve springs that allowed a greater increase all the way up to and over 20k. It was less materials and more making the air system light and robust enough. That was already nearly 30 years ago.
Interesting history, thank you. The clip of the marshall spraying water on the magnesium chassis fire is chilling.
The golden era of formula 1 rules when engineers had so much freedom and this lead to so many groundbreaking and revolutinary inventions that not only made road cars better and faster but most importantly safer. F1 was and will always be one of the pinacles of engineering. F1 even revolutionised surgery when doctors learned from f1 pitstops to streamline and make complex surgeries more efficient and this in itself saved countless lives
Biggest myth of all-time is that F1 benefitted car design...in fact there are probably more examples of production passenger cars innovating ahead of F1, turbocharging for instance, or rotary engines. Bit different with motorcycle GP design though; most sports bikes today effectively follow the architecture of 1950's ,60s bikes.
@stephenscholes4758 you forgot about aerodynamics, active suspension, regenerative braking, carbon fiber, hybrid powertrains, padel shifters no scratch that the wheel design itself, and many safety improvements that came after the death of many f1 drivers, there is many more, if it didn't benefit car manufacturers beyond marketing you would've seen much less interest from manufacturers
I'm not saying anything stupid like all innovations came from f1, but you have to give credit where credit is due
Great video! Thanks!
The supreme engineering of Honda's made my father change from Citroën roadcars to Honda roadcars in the 1980's! The Honda roadcars were and are indeed advanced, excellent and reliable! And they were and are nicely styled too! 👀👽
Cheers, Rolf/*\✓
I have owned 8 Honda cars and 2 Honda motorcycles
Honda has always made great engines. Best engine builder....
By a massive margin.
@@stavroshadjiyiannis6283 strongly disagree....... Paul Rosche, Hanz Metzger, Cosworth,80s Abarth, Gioachinno Colombo are better engine builders.... Honda couldn't do the personal favor for Gordons F1 engine requirement..........
I saw the 1.5 litre V12 car race at Silverstone and up close in the paddock there. I even have a photo of it. The fascination for me being that it was mounted transversely.
like the Maserati Tipo 8 (1962/63) made by Alfieri....strange, isn't ?
3:07 The Cams are powered by a jack shaft that sits half way across the cylinder banks, rather than being driven by a chain at the end of the bank.
This is the same set up as the CBX1000.
Yeah, my thoughts exactly, very similar designs to the CBX, no wonder the CBX sounds so F-1 like. Lots of other engines used the center to drive cams and many had the power take off on the middle as well, the only bike I know with gear-driven cams is the Honda 4 cylinder 250cc that revs to 20k.
@@_..-.._..-.._
The Honda VFR and RVF series are gear driven V4s. From 400 to 800cc. From 2001 onwards they are chain driven. The early gear driven models make a particular whine.
The only Honda (that I know of) 250cc 4 cylinder that would rev to 20k is the CBR250, which I thought was chain driven cams. I had the Yamaha counterpart, the FZR250 3ln3 model. Also revved to 20k. To this day I cannot imagine the valves actually closing at that speed.
Isn’t it the same on a Porsche 917 ? Porsche even had a shaft from the middle of the engine to the clutch/ gearbox removes the trouble with such a long 12 cylinder crankshaft
Most successful name in the history of motorsport
125cc per cylinder and 58mm bore how they got that much airflow & power out of a 58mm bore is wizardry.
Those rising sun paint jobs where spectacular.
Appreciate all the work youve put into all of your videos! Theyre always great, you never fail these days!!
I was in hi school in 1965 ,and I was following F1 at the time. I was always disappointed by Honda’s lack of wins in 1965, but lo and behold, the team went to Mexico City two weeks in advance, and got their cars tuned for the high altitude. By golly, they won.
This was the first and last win for this car as it was the last race of the season, and the formula changed to 3 liters in 66.
What an era of racing. Regulations, by today’s standards were nonexistent.
man that thing sounds so raw and beautiful
What made Honda road cars so great was the stubborn insistence of their engineering department to adhere to a path they believed in and developed to perfection. It might be apocryphal, but I love the story that incessant demand from American dealers for a V8 was met with the shipment of a case of V8 juice.
This was highly effective engineering practice. Trends be damned, they knew what was best. That is so difficult to accomplish in reality, with a wealthy but fickle US market baying for the same excesses of other manufacturers. I’m not sure if they’ve remained on that path today.
There is a great doco about Honda and what they had to overcome after WW2 to get anything built. I think it’s called Giants of Engineering.
Thank you. Excellent video. Great engine notes.
Wish they still made some RWD sport cars...
Maybe you could do a review of the mid 60's Honda F2 1 litre engine. Jack Brabham and Denny Hulme were unbeatable in them.
I.6 VTEC engine in 1995 with 185 bhp, nobody else does that type of stuff.
This is amazing, as someone that has owned a 4 carb R1 is must of a been a nightmare trying to sync all these carbs together
2:30 shows the first one was already fuel injected, so I think they all were
Thanks for your continuously excellent videos!
Honda did more for four stroke engine improvement than any other company on earth. I love that they disliked 2 strokes, but had to make them for racing and still dominated. I’m okay with 2 strokes, but 4 strokes are just better overall. I love pushing the limits of airflow and power.
4 stroke is not better overall. 2 stroke 50cc scooters are times better than 4 strokers. For reason.
They produce more power but they are so bad for the air. Literally exhausts oil
Thankyou VR for another fascinating video. The 1.5 litre has a beautiful sound.
My pleasure!
When I drive my little Accord, I appreciate its heredity
Superb video, thanks!
this powerplant has a quite motorcycle design , it could be "funny " in a 60's RC race motorcycle ... 😋
Japanese engineering just blows me away.
Still wondering how they (and competitors) managed to get some torque out of these super small engines, even more later on in the 80s turbo era.
Gearing, and they still have a rough time from a dead-stop.
Always a great video. Many thanks.
Until now with the F1 hybrid era, they are still winning.
This was my favorite recent video of yours. Honda in F1 in the 60s prompted rule changes...no more than 12 cylinders, and rpm caps. Imagine what they could have done by 1970 without restrictive rules! Need to go somewhere now, do I take the Civic, CRV, Ridgeline, or the hotrod 1971 CB350 twin?
I'd take the bus
@@nwga.5327
Sure. You do that. I am a rider/driver/ pilot. Go take the bus.
Take the civic and crv to someone that can fit the k24 awd system into the civic and bolt a big turbo on it.
I was impressed with a hotrod cb350 running in the high 11's without a wheelie bar and mainly only stiffer valve springs for higher RPMs.
Built without computers…
Backed by passion
Worked wonders
So was the Saturn 5.
Without computers, but with a lot of heart.
And with white gloves! 💗
Just the sound of that engine is worth all the money they spent on it.
Awesome! Thanks!
4:05 What a glorious sound
Thanks for another interesting video Visio.
4:25 what an amazing cross section wow
If you think this is amazing check out their RC66 race bike. It had a 250cc 6 cylinder engine with pistons that would fit in the palm of your hand with the connecting rod. It valves barely larger than a pencil eraser. It revved to 20k rpm and made 60 horsepower. 60 Horsepower from a 250cc engine in the 1960's is just wild.
I wish Honda still showcased this innovation today. They still make great products, love their motorcycles and K series. But arguably they haven't done much innovating in a while.
Amazing video and car!
HOLY CRAP, I HAD ONE OF THOSE LIL HONDA PICK UPS IN '68 JAPAN ... HAD TO SELL IT, KNEES HIT LIGHT BUTTON & I KEEP KILLING THE BATTERY ... AT 6'6" I FIT IN ... BARELY! FUN ... ALL WERE 360CC(ROAD TAX!)
You should do a video of the Cosworth DFV....most successful racing engine of all time.
"Veni, vidi, vici." is not in German but in Latin!
Gear driven cams are only found in heavy duty diesels and high-revving race engines 😂
Yet, how easier the life would be if car manufacturers put them into road legal cars as well.
Had substitles
At 7:35, when the RA 273 leave the peat, substitles say [Music] :D
Before watching. The 1.5litre class in grand Prix racing was before my time, a think the first races I watched at all were from the era of the lotus 72, and the first season i remember paying any attention to was the 'Rush' season but I have heard that the Honda engine was a miracle while the chassis actively tried to kill you
I am not surprised. Honda had motorcycle experience. What about Suzuki that had in 1967 a 50cc engine with more than 390hp/litre. Atmospheric! And 20000 rpm! In 1967
I don't care about the NA fizz-boxes of the '90s and '00s - they were such a backward step from the '80s turbo engines, but the F1 regulators had a terrible reputation for trampling upon innovation and performance (how many developments were banned, such as ground-effect aerodynamics? ). I'd never say that modern F1 drivers have it easy - if only because of the cornering forces and the drivers limited vision - but the truly great drivers were those piloting the 1.5-litre turbo cars of the '80s, men such as Prost, Berger and Senna.
The V6 Honda engines of that period were the most amazing of a great breed, although I understand that a (Brabham?) 4-cylinder Ford engine was reputedly the most-powerful in qualification trim (at 1400-1600bhp).
You mean the BMW 4-cylinder (the one that used the road block)? There is a doco on Cosworth trying to similarly adapt the Ford Pinto Cosworth engine for use in the 1.5L turbo class and they gave up as it could not hold the stress without the engine failing (due to the block warping), so Duckworth decided to design a "conventional" 1.5 V6 twin-turbo for the Lola Beatrice Ford project. The return to the NA rules in 1989 was welcome for Ford-Cosworth as their 1.5L turbo F1 engine was never competitive (despite their turbocharged Indycar USAC success).
Honda used a cast-iron (or compacted graphite) block for their 1.5L V6 as being so small in capacity it didn't have much of a weight penalty, while providing ample strength.
@4:35 ... its a big motorcycle engine. even the type of multi disc clutch is of a motorcycle type.
Honda built an engine that was amazing in every way possible, who would have thought that. . .
Good stuff. Dear VisioRacer, would you be so kind to mention the maximum torque@rpm, if that info is available ofcourse. Simply because the torque metric is more important than HP, plus if you know the max torque RPM and max RPM, it's easier to find HP than vice versa. Ideally the torque curve says the most about an ICE.
"Simply because the torque metric is more important than HP" It's not. Power is the fundamental rate that the engine can convert chemical energy in fuel to useful work. Torque is just a function of the geometry of the engine and can be easily multiplied using gearing, where power cannot.
@@TassieLorenzo So you also admit that the torque curve indicates better what kind of an engine geometry you have. Maximum power without mentioning RPM indicates very little.
@@phillgizmo8934 Gears exist, so that a 2.4L F1 V8 makes 750hp @ 18,000rpm (with 280 Nm @ 16,000rpm) instead of it being a 4.8L making 750hp @ 9,000rpm (with 560Nm @ 8,000rpm) is quite frankly irrelevant. With double the gearing: the torque *at the wheels* for the same road speed is exactly the same, you change gear at the same road speeds, you have the same wheel power -- that you are revving twice as high and have half the torque at double the pm is of no consequence.
You could put a 200hp Yamaha R1 engine in place of the 200hp 3.2L turbo diesel inline-five in a Ford Ranger and it would be functionally equivalent at peak power as long as you tripled the gear ratio to compensate for the Yamaha engine producing peak power at three times the revs (obviously you'd burn the clutch up trying to get the Ranger moving from stationary, but you get the point!). :)
@@TassieLorenzo I agree with you about gears, but then we are talking about a vehicle as a whole. I thought the topic was the engine only. I love the Automation game btw.
Sounds like a Motorbike!
i miss the 3 litre v10s f1 engines🤩
The 3.5 and 3 litre V12s were awesome, too. The manufacturers eventually decided that the V10 configuration was the best compromise, and yes, they had a unique and totally bitchin sound!
@@monsieurcommissaire1628 oh yes, the v12s are good sounding machines🤩❤
How could you miss a 3 liter engine there huge 😂
@@tonywright8294 😂🤦♂️
Just Honda, no Red bull or McLaren to talk of!
São os melhores motores de todos os tempos tanto moto como carro não há igual
You should make a video on the Bill Thomas Cheetah
Yes there was a time where man really used his own brain
I'm thinking of the 1.6L I had in my EF hatchback.
this is so confusing, I wish she put the no of cylinder in the Title, eg V2, V4, V5, V6, V7, V8, V9, V10, V15, V20 etc
That is what a racing car should sound like. Powerful. Not a bumble bee trapped in a jam jar....
I verify, I'm sure it's a mistake. F1 Minimum Weight was 453 kgs. How engine could be louder than a whole car.
it's written car's weight .
I wonder if it's possible to build something like this out of C50 components.. 🧐🤔😅
I'm sure Mr. Millyard has considered it!
Ce n'est pas les allemands qui ont «Veni, vidi, vici», mais Jules César.
et d'ailleurs Jules (Julius) n'était pas son prénom mais son nom de famille
Love Honda
Thanks! Very interesting! Levi in Sweden (though a Finn ;D)
Just like today as yesterday. No torque and a peaky above 10k powerband.
Obrigado.
Thanks again :-)
now put it in a race bike plz
And still they have it 😢😢😢😢
Now they ship a 1.5 turbo that obliterantes oil delusion records.
those pistons were TINY. 58mm is 2.2 inches.
Good video.
Honda the best always.
Japanese precision.
will it fit in a miata?
Had? I'd say they still do.
Rouen les Essarts
Ra272 is pretty op in Gran Turismo 7. Although the sound is completely wrong. It’s nowhere near as epic as it is in real life.
REally lol the best.. how many races did honda win in F1 back in the 60's 70's
Hosing burning magnesium is ridiculous.
Sometimes people are so stupid it is difficult to understand and I'm not talking about the track marshal here.
The V12 and RA302 were unique, innovative and powerful, but they were also overweight, oversized and thirsty. Their virtues couldn't overcome their detractions. Honda was as forward thinking and talented as e was stubborn and prideful, many believe he would have had more success bringing his expertise in motorcycles concepts to a more conventional GP engine archearchitecture than trying to reinvent the wheel. It may not have been as inspired, but I truly believe he would have been the dominant force in the 60's with more conventional designs.
Would it not be better to show pictures of the car you are talking about at any one moment, rather than a car totally unrelated to the narration?
DFV is king
as they do in the present with their 1.6 liter engine nothing new...
Oh I verify. It's car Weight. It's still heavy Both. I remember they made it in magnesium. How Can they nearly 100 kg heavier than Ferrari or Lotus ? And 3 liter is worse.
Lourd isn’t a word
@@joao_oliveira5282did you come here to just hammer on people for some obviously translation-related wording errors?
Use Google translate please
Speak in French please.
@@davidaugustofc2574 I modify. Is it better for your Majesty?
nice!
today its electric engines
Sorry, there is no such thing. It's called an electric motor. An engine converts heat into motion.
@@robertrobinson3861 engines must must go to museums
Yh he
So the "best" 1.5 litre engine in F1 achieved a magnificent , single victory?
Incidentally, Veni, Vidi, Vici is not German; it is Latin and translates as "I came, I saw, I conquered" - supposedly said by Julius Caeser.
Where did I say it is German? I said triumphant message
3:55: "A declaration of the triumph in German".
Incidentally, Peugeot used four-valve per cylinder grand prix engines more than a hundred years ago.@@VisioRacer
@@gnosticbrian3980 “A declaration of a triumhant journey”
Doesn't sound like that to me.@@VisioRacer
@@gnosticbrian3980 This is the original script. Not sure why you assumed that I said that considering it is not correct
Hi. Bravo for your achievements, but what a shame for you to have so skillfully mastered written English, researched your subjects and crafted commentaries, only to deliver them with what sounds like guesswork pronunciation. I would recommend immersing yourself in the speech patterns of native-speakers to better familiarize yourself with where the emphasis should go in certain words...podcasts or audio books, maybe?
Maserati Tipo 8, 1500 cc, V 12 transverse, 1962/1963.....
No, they did not have "the best" 1.5 liter F1 engine. They had the one YOU like. Another engine won the World Championship. Please define your concept of "best" for the rest of us.
"Honda Had The Best 1.5-liter F1 Engine"
Probably not.
The Coventry Climax V-8 just got the job done.
1962/63 : Maserati Tipo 8, V12 transverse, 1,500 cc
523 kg? Are you sure ? It's very loud
Wdym is very loud ??? Loud is for sound kg is for weight
@@joao_oliveira5282 it's a measure? How many loud? Ok it's very kg. Lol🤣🤣🤣🤣. Sorry it's very heavy. Do you prefer?
@@joao_oliveira5282decibels refers to sound
It's a such heartbreaking shame that Honda has never made and V8 for the mass market and got stuck with econo shitboxes
Can you imagine a k40 or k48 in something like the nsx or s2000 I would have made nice cars legendary from their engineering prowess alone and potentially it would have destroyed everyone else
Already legendary cars with 4 and 6 cyls. Toyota is a close second in engineering and they have plenty of V8’s. I do agree that Honda should’ve made at least one RWD/AWD V8 car. As for the v8, some people have made K24 V8’s. A company out there makes 2.6L Suzuki Hayabusa V8’s with 360+ hp N/A.
I wouldn’t call their cars what you called them, personal taste be damned, they are great cars. And Honda was right, V8’s are going away, they knew all along. Honda doesn’t even boost anything at least until maybe recently, not sure if they do now. Seems everyone makes - 1300-1600cc turbo 4 now.
@@_..-.._..-.._ "Already legendary cars with 4 and 6 cyls." Absolutely it is a different perspective than US automakers (with their 7L, 8L engines and "compact" cars with 4L engines!). Honda started making cars with just 360cc and the 3700cc J series is the biggest engine they ever put in a car. Of course the 5.5L V10 from the planned second generation NSX was cancelled before it went into production. I do think it is a shame the first generation NSX wasn't updated with a 4.0L V8 based on two K20 engines though, to make for a direct rival to the Ferrari 360 and F430.