Designed for a lifespan of 90 sols (93 Earth days), Zhurong was active for 347 sols (356.5 days) after its deployment on Mars's surface. The rover became inactive on 20 May 2022 due to approaching sandstorms and Martian winter, pending its self-awakening with appropriate temperature and sunlight conditions. Zhurong never woke up from its hibernation. The rover was expected to wake in December 2022 as winter in the Martian northern hemisphere drew to a close and sunlight increased, but did not. NASA images showed the rover in the same position where it had entered its hibernation period, almost a year earlier.
I will happily be impressed if China or well, anyone makes a probe that lasts even half of that time on Venus. Still, surviving that long, first through space, then landing and operating on Mars is impressive. It's a royal PIA to design things to survive such environments, but actually getting there and even briefly operating is a major accomplishment! I'd suggest collaborating with JPL for the next probe, with no sides hiding any efforts and methods. Likely gaining a probe that lasts far longer than anything humanity has yet launched. And if one selected Venus, one might actually learn a hell of a lot more, given a supercritical near atmosphere, temperature and pressure. We have a preference for STP, that isn't present for either other planet under study. Still, only a suggestion.
Yeah, not the dust storm from the Martian that destroyed the martian base, but certainly a factor in our future colonization missions. I never expected mars to have such a complex atmospheric system of winds, heat and dust, especially with how thin the air is. Thanks for another banger Astrum!
To be fair the lack of gravity might be the bigger issue on colonizing Mars. Living on 1/3 of heart gravity is going to cause some health issues on any long mission (which going to mars already is by definition, with about 7 months of travel just to get there)
Isn't it fascinating that planets (all large space objects really) experience such strange but consistent patterns on these massive scales? Could such a pattern or season like behavior have been a catalyst for life?
people seem to think that earth is the only planet with super complex mechanisms in it. i mean we have people dedicating their entire life to studying weather, geology, volcanology, tectonic plates, and we see other planets as just “The desert one” or “the cold one” or “the hot one”. it’s cool to see that earth isn’t the only one with super complex mechanisms that need to be explored more
The other major hazard with these dust storms is, well as Anakin would put it, "It's coarse, rough and it gets in everywhere." Much like lunar dust, the extremely fine-grain jagged electrostatic nature of the particles means that any materials we bring to and build there, from habitats to electronics to space suits will very quickly become saturated with the stuff, leading to abrasion and possibly short-outs of essential equipment. The fabric of space suits could also over time wear thin enough to rupture, which would not be great for astronauts. To top it all off, it's full of toxic perchlorates, and is EXTREMELY difficult to clean off of any surface. The dust on the moon already poses challenges for future missions. Just imagine that but whipping around the whole planet at storm-force speeds, saturating the entire atmosphere for months.
@@mikestephens5200 And I think it's gonna be a long, long time' Til touchdown brings me 'round again to find I'm not the man they think I am at home Oh, no, no, no!
I appreciate you single handedly battling my bipolar and getting me to sleep every night, I've learned so much and my sleep is finally decently stable. You're pretty cool
If you're a scifi fan you might enjoy Kim Stanley Robinson's trilogy Red Mars, Green Mars, Blue Mars about the terraforming of the red planet. Lots of detail and a good read.
Jupiter is my favorite. It's sheer size and power amazes me. One of my favorite things that happened to Jupiter was when Shoemsker Levvy 9 hit it in '94 and the planet basically said "COME ON MAN!! THAT'S TOO EASY!!!" while that same comet probably would've sent Earth to the backrooms.
Jupiter causes fear in me. The radiation field Jupiter emits around itself would kill us. The moon Callisto is far away enough to be outside of this radiation field I believe so that it is at non-lethal levels, but the moon Io certainly is not.
Should we ever get a decent amount of humans on its surface, I'm curious how simple things like walking and driving around would be a catalyst for (more of) these storms...
I think I remember that the Mars atmosphere appears like it is fast-switching between two atmospheric systems, where the temperatures and pressures are vastly different. The global Mars duststorms are unstable under the current combination of gas pressures and radiation from the Sun, but it might have been a stable state in the past.
It has only been a decade or so since NASA has admitted to re-coloring nearly every single photo from Mars. Only recently have they stopped (for the most part) with the "true" color images from Mars. This began with the very first images from the Viking lander. As the first color image was displayed on the monitors within 10 to 15 minutes the head of NASA instructed a technician to adjust all of the monitors in the room to make the images more red. This practice has gone on ever since.
I guess dust storms would be an issue if we tried terraforming Mars. As the temperature went up, it would probably generate even longer lasting global dust storms.
@@jebes909090 Mars' atmosphere does contain moisture though obviously not much. There are water ice clouds and frost can form on the ground overnight.
In the book of The Martian (which I highly recommend) Watney ran into a dust storm on the way to the escape ship which he only found out since the solar panels he took were very slowly losing efficiency. Kind of scary to see even very fine dust in a storm on Mars can very easily kill us...
Interesting to consider the consequences of the arrival of retro rockets and discarded heat shield on the pattern of dust disturbance. In an atmosphere this rarified pretty explosive. Microscopic silica particles are extremely abrasive and dangerous to electronics, respiratory systems, and everything from solar arrays to camera lenses. Frank Herbert's model of the alien desert world in Dune is made more scary by the native creatures but to my mind, even with a great potential for mining resources, Mars is not worth it.
I wonder if the 2-year gap between storms occurs because storms cover larger sand grains with smaller ones. If larger sand grains are needed to get smaller ones into the air, covering up the larger grains would inhibit dust storm formation.
I am sure that I am not the only person to think that there could be a blower system aboard a rover to clear dust from the panels. Tanks could hold air to power the operation, and a small compressor could operate when there is extra power to store air at a high pressure. Hoses and nozzles on the arm complete the system, along with some fixed nozzles in strategic locations.
Yep, whole thing is ridiculous scaremongering. You need hugely outsized solar arrays for methalox production, if you get a big dust storm coming through chopping efficiency by 95% then you just turn off the hydrolysis and sabatier reactors. Will still be MORE then enough for human needs.
Seems to me the difference between Mars, Earth, and Venus is life. The co2 and o2 provided by plants and microbes kept us from the extremes of the others. We truly are special and lucky to even exist.
Could the cycle be related to surface temperature? My thought is that the dust storms are being partially caused by the surface temperature increasing but as the storms grows eventually the temperature falls because the dust clouds block sunlight. Just a thought.
If we ever colonies Mars, it would be wise to have a space station (or several) ion orbit. The colonists could plan launches up to the space stations before the superstorms begin and wait out the storms on board the stations. The space stations should grow in size as the population grows so that they are always big enough to fit the entire colony on board during the superstorms.
Wouldn't it be more appropriate to build the infrastructure to handle the storms, since it needs to still be there after you expensively evacuate everyone?
Giant Jupiter and it's moons are my Favorites after Earth of course. They can keep Mars, never knew what the attraction is. Your planetary portraits are beautiful.
This dust storms were common on early earth, too, until plants conquered the non water parts of the planets, and starting to stop the storms in this scale.
They do. Also calculated in is the service life and if its even necessary, and the chance that winds will blow some of the dust off without any intervention
Hey, good question! In essence, several types of equipment were tested in NASA labs from wipers to retractable plastic coverings. In the end, all of them were deemed to be unnecessary weight and also added complexity to Rovers that had no means of repairing mechanical and electronic issues. It was a very conservative trade-off.
@@beckenbaylin3167IIRC, they just ended up hoping that dust devils would wander by and push some of the dust off, which I’m pretty sure worked, but only for some of the dust.
I feel an easy work around for solar panels gathering dust would be a wiper blade type thing. Where it is on a motorized track with a small blade that sits in a recessed area while not being used. Then when needed just activate it and have it scrape the dust off the panels.
This is utterly fascinating. I am a technician who also enjoys solo tramping living on borrowed time. I could quite happily spend the rest of my life being dumped on the Martian surface with a tool kit exploring the planet and fixing the odd broken rover I came across. It would be fascinating to wander and alien world and come across a piece of technology and get it working again. And I would love to climb Olympus Mons. Dreams are free. Favourite planet? Mine would be Mars because it is possible (with life support) to exist there, at least for a while and because there are no wars or politicians.
Once the batteries go and freeze, there is no repair possible. You would have to get there before that happens. Which is why preserverence uses an RTG - it provides heat.
Which is why its already been agreed that any permeant colonisation of mars would involve structures being built in underground caves to protect against this thing.
Could this be related to increased atmosphere density building up over the 5½ years, and shed during the swelling? There's dry ice in the soil and on the poles, could that drive it?
7:10 I believe the author said he wrote that before they had more information on how impactful the wind would actually be on Mars. I could be wrong though.
11:20 - Ive always questioned why something like windsheild wipers on a solar panel are not used, there is probably a solid reason but I would assume with with humans it can just be a person task if its not too dangerious to go and wipe down solar panels.
After the storm humans could do that yea. But they'd still have to find a sustainable way to power the base for multiple weeks without solar panels. Batteries can only take you so far.
"why something like windsheild wipers on a solar panel are not used," Given the extreme temperature changes and zero humidity my bet is that they are struggling to find a wiper that doesn't simply fall apart after a week. :-) But also; wiping sand a and dirt from a planet that has very little erosion across a solarpanel is a good way to make the panel's surface opaque. I'd probably try parking the rover on a slope and add a vibrating motor to the panels to shake the dirt off. But I'm just brainfarting here.
Weight penalties for everything else, and they were never intended to be immortal in the first place. Remember that the first rovers only needed to work for a few months to be continued a success.
There are a number of reasons why insight doesn't have a way to clean it's solar arrays, let me list a handful. wasn't really designed to last this long. Even though Mars surface assets always outlast their design windows, we have to manage scope so we only design for nominal mission. heavier than you think, 1kg on lander = 100s of kg in support hardware = 1000s of kg in rocket fuel. windshield wiper apparatus is difficult to design into an array that must also fold up to, 1/10th it's size, survive launch and entry/landing on mars, then deploy out. more moving parts = more options to break something you didn't expect to. dust on Mars does not behave like a liquid, or like dust on earth. The atmosphere is so thin that electrostatic forces hold the dust down making it sticky. That's why dumping dirt nearby helps, it disrupts the charge. However, those are engineering challenges which are hard but can be overcome. What can't be overcome is the fact that adding functionality doesn't always add capability. Right now, Mars geometry (tau = 2.5-4), means there is very little light available. This happens every year, and regardless of whether we wiped off the arrays or not, we would still be sitting in quiescent survival mode for the season. Engineers knew this was coming and designed the lander to handle it, not to outperform it.
@@SanquinityNeil deGrasse Tyson once equipped that nuclear was the other forbidden n word. But even to settle the moon, with permanent sunlight at the polar regions and 2 weeks continuous sunlight everywhere else, you are going to need a consistent high-level source of energy to keep people alive and machinery running. Yes I understand that nuclear power is expensive, it's complicated, and there are still anti-nuke Kooks that will freak out at the mere mention of launching something with radioisotope thermal generators. But going to and staying on Mars with only solar power? Fughetaboutit!
Maybe it takes 3 Martian years to sufficiently heat the surface up enough to cause the storms to form. Perhaps we're overthinking this. Is it possible it's that simple? It chokes itself out when the heat from the sun doesn't reach the surface for several weeks. If it reaches -207°F because no light reaches the surface it gets bone-chilling cold, so after the storm dies and the dust finally settles it only warms a little at a time because of day and night. Three years later temps are right for winds to ramp up again. Just a thought.
There are faint clouds in the martian sky, they say sometimes they may sprinkle puny amounts of snow on the surface, sadly the atmosphere is too thin for liquid water rain to be possible. It's also theorized that CO2 gas geysers exist on the planet's poles, spewing the gas for it to freeze up there and it falling again coating the surface.
Great video and explanation. It has always been puzzling to me that NASA leaves all those probes and rovers to rot once their panels are covered on dust. You spent billions, for f* shake, they all have robotic arms or motors, put some wipers on them! or simply a folding mechanism to put panels vertical or upside down when storms are coming!! Even a shaking mechanism....
Electrical activity is the sole reason for the dust storms. The dust devils are also caused by electrical activity. The timing also may implicate the solar maximum and minimum. Every 5 years or so isn't far off of twice every 11 years.
It worked for years after the planned lifespan of 3 months. That is success. They don't go around asking what it would take to make them immortal, especially since there's no way to fix anything that breaks.
As the clouds thicken, temperature cycling forms small amounts of water near the surface. When the surface temp increases enough the Martian life can ascend from the caverns below to drink and mate. Then descend as the temperatures lower allowing the moisture evaporate & dust to hide the holes that were made by any activity. - Having a lander / rover capable of analysing atmos. during a storm will be enlightening.
Isn't there a way to just clean the solar panels? Like a backup battery to power wipers that can clean the solar panels, or a way to retract them when the storm is brewing, using a battery to then reawaken and re-extend them once it fades
Percy and Ginny have been a great team, but i'm afraid that means Percy may soon be without its little scout. that helicopter has to br so light weight to fly in the thin air, I imagine it doesn't take much dust to block its solar panels. on top of which it may be sensitive to mechanical interference from dust screwing up, aerodynamics, electronics, or even just adding too much weight.
It would be interesting to see a plot graph showing the surface & atmospheric temps, the average wind speed & average AOD value over the 5.5 year period leading up to these storms. If the amount of dust in the atmosphere is dependent on wind & heat, than there should be a correlation with all these factors right?
What I miss from discussions about colonising Mars is: due to its thin atmosphere (which we are unlikely to restore for obvious reasons), what about a sudden destruction of structures build for our protection, like a glass dome, by falling debris from the sky? Mars doesn't have an atmosphere that protects us from most of this debris on Earth. A lot of it burns in the atmosphere or is significantly reduced (and perhaps slowed down, I don't know) before it hits Earth.
Could they build an onboard "umbrella" for dust? Basically, a wired balloon, built of a lightweight plastic. that can be opened from the top of the rover. Like an umbrella, it would open on a wired frame, then drop a tube of plastic, with a powered, retracting circular ring, like a ziptie but more flexible. Maybe the weight of plastic edger/trimmer line for lawns? A simple reversible motor could unwind and rewind the cable (monofilament one way, the heavier cable the other way).
These storms are a problem. They reset the gained heat right back down. If we increase the atmospheric heat the storms would be more frequent. One step forward equals 2 step back. Or worst even longer.
Mars has another problem. It is Gravity. For every 100kg you would have only 38kg gravitational pull. You could jump really high. Objects of any weight would be 62% lighter than they are here. This is fact.
It strikes me that a bunch of dust in the air rubbing together could build up an electrical charge, particularly given the metallic content of most of Mars's dust. Is lightning a problem in those storms? Am I missing something?
I would be really interested to know at what depth geothermal energy could be practically accessed. Is there any way to scan the surface to find hot spots where the crust is thinner? Like the "Iceland" of mars?
I believe the author has admitted to it being artistic licence is order for the story to work. Not a lot of things that could come up for only one person to suddenly go MIA yet have everyone else run away.
Andy Weir has always admitted that the storm was unrealistic but he couldn't think of any scenario that would realistically leave a single astronaut stranded like that. As for the Iron Man thing, that was a Hollywood change to make things more exciting and doesn't happen in the book
Llove your videos you are entertaining and you explain things so even this rube can understand you make me feel smarter even if for a little while thanks Alex good day and good luck 😊
Considering small stones rain from the sky periodically at the speed of bullets and repairs have to wait for bi annual rocket shipments cramming relatively tiny amounts of supplies onto the preciously limited cargo and every bit of weight in material comes out of the food supplies, i feel like it would *have* to be underground.
Could a colony dig into the surface to use Geothermal energy to help sustain power, heat, and bio growth? I would think it would be also possible to build a setup that would be able to lower into the surface to prevent much of the dust from damaging equipment and help with keeping most of the weather at bay until the storms ran their course? Once the storms or any weather was over, the colony could be raised to the surface again. While under the surface, however, the idea of Nuclear energy would be a more viable power source than simple Geothermal but it would help. I am not a scientist but I was genuinely curious as to seeing if this was a possibility?
So if we can't use solar power, could we use wind turbines or geothermal energy? Or a combination of the two? And is it feasible to burrow into the ground or natural caves to make shelters and garden areas for habitation? I may read too much sci-fi...
I think of all the rovers on Mars that have sadly died or never got a chance to work and I immediately cheer myself up with the thought that one day we will collect them all up fix them and put them in museums where they belong!...cheers.
4:00 that is probably the most insane thing i have ever heard! 8500 meter tall dustnados! That is over 10 burj khalifas tall. 5:52 I wonder how warm the temperature gets on the inside of these dust storms. Would it be a little over 27, or more like a Jacuzzis temprtature.
Would it be possible to equip rovers with a marquee like cover to protect them from the dust storms? Probably it could sense the wind picking up before there’s a full blown dust storm, right?
I don't think the video mentioned rovers being mechanically damaged by impact with dust. It said the problem is how the dust blocks sunlight (=power) and communications.
Designed for a lifespan of 90 sols (93 Earth days), Zhurong was active for 347 sols (356.5 days) after its deployment on Mars's surface. The rover became inactive on 20 May 2022 due to approaching sandstorms and Martian winter, pending its self-awakening with appropriate temperature and sunlight conditions.
Zhurong never woke up from its hibernation. The rover was expected to wake in December 2022 as winter in the Martian northern hemisphere drew to a close and sunlight increased, but did not. NASA images showed the rover in the same position where it had entered its hibernation period, almost a year earlier.
Zhurong died? Good, we don’t need bugs on other planets
@@WimsicleStrangerScience is science. Don’t denounce Zhurong just because it’s Chinese.
Oppy lasted 15 years, over 5000 sols.
I will happily be impressed if China or well, anyone makes a probe that lasts even half of that time on Venus.
Still, surviving that long, first through space, then landing and operating on Mars is impressive.
It's a royal PIA to design things to survive such environments, but actually getting there and even briefly operating is a major accomplishment!
I'd suggest collaborating with JPL for the next probe, with no sides hiding any efforts and methods.
Likely gaining a probe that lasts far longer than anything humanity has yet launched.
And if one selected Venus, one might actually learn a hell of a lot more, given a supercritical near atmosphere, temperature and pressure. We have a preference for STP, that isn't present for either other planet under study.
Still, only a suggestion.
They don’t share their science with the broader community.
Truly fascinating! If you live on Mars, this brings a whole new meaning to "overcast weather."
And one other thing, the concept of sandblasting.
Sandstorms? Brand new- wait no the meaning stays the same no matter what planet your on…
Ah yes, (if you live on mars)
@@SealWithoutHat which would leave me breathless- literally. ;)
I have to go under ground when this happens.
Thank you for the considerate sponsor message placement. I'm happy to watch all the way to the end in gratitude for the uninterrupted content.
Yeah, not the dust storm from the Martian that destroyed the martian base, but certainly a factor in our future colonization missions. I never expected mars to have such a complex atmospheric system of winds, heat and dust, especially with how thin the air is. Thanks for another banger Astrum!
Further proof of electricity driven weather.
Axion might not be as theoretical as we thought in that case
Colonisation will never happen. Space is a killer and our biology is so tied to this poor planet to make colonisation absolutely impossible. End of.
@@efdangotulol "electricity driven weather"? Is that some reference to electric universe pseudoscience?
To be fair the lack of gravity might be the bigger issue on colonizing Mars. Living on 1/3 of heart gravity is going to cause some health issues on any long mission (which going to mars already is by definition, with about 7 months of travel just to get there)
Isn't it fascinating that planets (all large space objects really) experience such strange but consistent patterns on these massive scales? Could such a pattern or season like behavior have been a catalyst for life?
Everything that naturally happens has a purpose. We just haven't discovered the purpose of these dust storms
in a way yes ... for example rain and wind drags water onto land on earth which caused plant life to start spreading inland
@@onenation8707 - *Nothing* that naturally happens has a purpose. Purpose requires consciousness. Life just evolves to fit into these natural rhythms.
No
Well, humanity thrives on finding patterns, probably in our DNA.
people seem to think that earth is the only planet with super complex mechanisms in it. i mean we have people dedicating their entire life to studying weather, geology, volcanology, tectonic plates, and we see other planets as just “The desert one” or “the cold one” or “the hot one”. it’s cool to see that earth isn’t the only one with super complex mechanisms that need to be explored more
“People seem to think….” Means “I used to think….”
@@Mike_Dubayou 100% i just recently started to think differently
What do you think Jupiter's big red spot it? Its a giant storm.
You mean that television represents
i guess its a little hard to get people to study these mechanisms when they don't have any immediate affect on society
The other major hazard with these dust storms is, well as Anakin would put it, "It's coarse, rough and it gets in everywhere." Much like lunar dust, the extremely fine-grain jagged electrostatic nature of the particles means that any materials we bring to and build there, from habitats to electronics to space suits will very quickly become saturated with the stuff, leading to abrasion and possibly short-outs of essential equipment. The fabric of space suits could also over time wear thin enough to rupture, which would not be great for astronauts. To top it all off, it's full of toxic perchlorates, and is EXTREMELY difficult to clean off of any surface. The dust on the moon already poses challenges for future missions. Just imagine that but whipping around the whole planet at storm-force speeds, saturating the entire atmosphere for months.
BRAVO LUCAS
@@chrispekel5709 "Sandstorms are very, very dangerous."
~Anakin Skywalker, age 9.
but very very light. The winds can't carry anything heavy.
Lunar regolith is not in any way comparable to Martian fines.
@@Shrouded_reaper Aside from the fact that they're both coarse, rough and irritating and get in everywhere? :P
Mars is not a bad kid he is just lonely
She?
@@bountyhuntermk2520 Mars is definitely a "he", Venus definitely a "she" as well as Earth. Don't misgender the planets. :D
@@bountyhuntermk2520 The red planet would be a "she" if it was named Athena or Minerva.
So, quiet kid?
@@bountyhuntermk2520He?
Mars ain't the kind of place to raise your kids, In fact it's cold as hell.
And there's no one there to raise them, if you did.
@@mikestephens5200and all this science, I don’t understand. It’s just my job, five days a week…
There's no stores for Dad's to go get the milk
@@mikestephens5200 And I think it's gonna be a long, long time' Til touchdown brings me 'round again to find
I'm not the man they think I am at home Oh, no, no, no!
Im a rocket man.... rocket man...
I appreciate you single handedly battling my bipolar and getting me to sleep every night, I've learned so much and my sleep is finally decently stable. You're pretty cool
I have been falling asleep to Alex's enlightenment for years, it's become a requirement haha
If you're a scifi fan you might enjoy Kim Stanley Robinson's trilogy Red Mars, Green Mars, Blue Mars about the terraforming of the red planet. Lots of detail and a good read.
Jupiter is my favorite. It's sheer size and power amazes me. One of my favorite things that happened to Jupiter was when Shoemsker Levvy 9 hit it in '94 and the planet basically said "COME ON MAN!! THAT'S TOO EASY!!!" while that same comet probably would've sent Earth to the backrooms.
Actually the force of that hit was still mind boggling even to our systems giant.
@@Thulgore If I recall correctly I read somewhere that it was equivalent to 5 BILLION atomic bombs. Insane to even imagine such a scenario on Earth.
Jupiter is eerily beautiful ❤
Jupiter causes fear in me. The radiation field Jupiter emits around itself would kill us. The moon Callisto is far away enough to be outside of this radiation field I believe so that it is at non-lethal levels, but the moon Io certainly is not.
Each collision blast was the size of Earth. They were planet killin rocks
Should we ever get a decent amount of humans on its surface, I'm curious how simple things like walking and driving around would be a catalyst for (more of) these storms...
I think I remember that the Mars atmosphere appears like it is fast-switching between two atmospheric systems, where the temperatures and pressures are vastly different. The global Mars duststorms are unstable under the current combination of gas pressures and radiation from the Sun, but it might have been a stable state in the past.
Thanks for the video brother Alex
Man, I have habe not been suggested one of your videos in months. They are the best!!!!
It has only been a decade or so since NASA has admitted to re-coloring nearly every single photo from Mars. Only recently have they stopped (for the most part) with the "true" color images from Mars. This began with the very first images from the Viking lander. As the first color image was displayed on the monitors within 10 to 15 minutes the head of NASA instructed a technician to adjust all of the monitors in the room to make the images more red. This practice has gone on ever since.
So much for the red planet 😔
Sunsets on mars are actually blue instead of red, and even the sky is blue in color apart from when dust storms are blowing.
Love your narration and love of knowledge Alex.
I guess dust storms would be an issue if we tried terraforming Mars. As the temperature went up, it would probably generate even longer lasting global dust storms.
We'd need to increase the humidity as well, which may introduce tornadoes or hurricanes.
@@celticlass8573you literally cant increase the humidity as its atmosphere is nearly a vacuum
@@jebes909090
I assume terraforming would include doing something to create or simulate a magnetic field.
@@jebes909090 Mars' atmosphere does contain moisture though obviously not much. There are water ice clouds and frost can form on the ground overnight.
@@jebes909090 Which is why you increase the atmosphere through terraforming.
Your videos are so captivating. Jupiter Eye Storm.
So magical
In the book of The Martian (which I highly recommend) Watney ran into a dust storm on the way to the escape ship which he only found out since the solar panels he took were very slowly losing efficiency. Kind of scary to see even very fine dust in a storm on Mars can very easily kill us...
There was the Matt damon movie that was based on the book.
@@4skin595 The movie was great, don't get me wrong. But the book was far better
So could a snowstorm on earth.
Fascinating and so well presented. The graphics as well as the in situ are demonstrative. But who on earth would really want to live on Mars!!
Interesting to consider the consequences of the arrival of retro rockets and discarded heat shield on the pattern of dust disturbance. In an atmosphere this rarified pretty explosive. Microscopic silica particles are extremely abrasive and dangerous to electronics, respiratory systems, and everything from solar arrays to camera lenses.
Frank Herbert's model of the alien desert world in Dune is made more scary by the native creatures but to my mind, even with a great potential for mining resources, Mars is not worth it.
Yeah like I said in another comment Mars behaves more like a death trap.
Maybe Europa is better?
Production quality of this video was breathtaking.
Great work as always. Mine is Jupiter. When looking thru my telescope it just amazing.
Thank you for displaying what footage we are seeing.
I wonder if the 2-year gap between storms occurs because storms cover larger sand grains with smaller ones. If larger sand grains are needed to get smaller ones into the air, covering up the larger grains would inhibit dust storm formation.
That actually makes sense, and explains why it isn't a yearly thing.
more likely due to needed time to accumulate CO2 ices that then thaw - and loft the particles of dust.
@@jessepollard7132 I can see that too.
Martian cow farts and SUV’s
I am sure that I am not the only person to think that there could be a blower system aboard a rover to clear dust from the panels. Tanks could hold air to power the operation, and a small compressor could operate when there is extra power to store air at a high pressure. Hoses and nozzles on the arm complete the system, along with some fixed nozzles in strategic locations.
Yep, whole thing is ridiculous scaremongering. You need hugely outsized solar arrays for methalox production, if you get a big dust storm coming through chopping efficiency by 95% then you just turn off the hydrolysis and sabatier reactors. Will still be MORE then enough for human needs.
I read in another comment that the dust could scratch up the surface and damage electronics over time
I think the dust particles being so fine makes it extremely hard to clean the surfaces, since they stick to them electrostatically.
7:19 mars rover designers could put a broom in a robotic arm to sweep the dust from solar panels
NASA should hire this guy!
too heavy and likely to damage the solar panels.
Jupiter as a child, Earth now Mars bars sounds like the coolest way to find a finishline🏁🏁🍻😎
Seems to me the difference between Mars, Earth, and Venus is life. The co2 and o2 provided by plants and microbes kept us from the extremes of the others. We truly are special and lucky to even exist.
No offense but, I feel like this was the dumbest comment I've read yet.
learned something new! favorite video in a while!!!
Nice. I’m old enough to have watched humans first walk on the moon and I would love to still be alive to see humans walk on Mars (and get home safely)
You're around 70?!?!? I do hope you get to see that day too..
The idea is that Mars in fact will be their home, I thought...
Humans will never get to Mars. Maybe not even the moon again.
But you as an AI, you can just teleport yourself there, or not?!
@@ia8018 I remember when bait used to be good
Could the cycle be related to surface temperature? My thought is that the dust storms are being partially caused by the surface temperature increasing but as the storms grows eventually the temperature falls because the dust clouds block sunlight. Just a thought.
If we ever colonies Mars, it would be wise to have a space station (or several) ion orbit. The colonists could plan launches up to the space stations before the superstorms begin and wait out the storms on board the stations. The space stations should grow in size as the population grows so that they are always big enough to fit the entire colony on board during the superstorms.
would surface weather affect underground bases using nucular reactors
Two foundations for space stations are already in orbit. Phobos and Deimos
Wouldn't it be more appropriate to build the infrastructure to handle the storms, since it needs to still be there after you expensively evacuate everyone?
transport would cost too much weight in fuel.
Giant Jupiter and it's moons are my Favorites after Earth of course. They can keep Mars, never knew what the attraction is. Your planetary portraits are beautiful.
My name is on board both Curiosity and Perseverance. ❤🙂
This dust storms were common on early earth, too, until plants conquered the non water parts of the planets, and starting to stop the storms in this scale.
With the known dust storms on Mars... Why doesn't NASA use some sort of means to dust off the dust drom their solar panels?
Ask NASA... this is youtube
They do. Also calculated in is the service life and if its even necessary, and the chance that winds will blow some of the dust off without any intervention
Hey, good question! In essence, several types of equipment were tested in NASA labs from wipers to retractable plastic coverings. In the end, all of them were deemed to be unnecessary weight and also added complexity to Rovers that had no means of repairing mechanical and electronic issues. It was a very conservative trade-off.
I asked myself the same question. Maybe implement some type up air blower to remove the dust.
@@beckenbaylin3167IIRC, they just ended up hoping that dust devils would wander by and push some of the dust off, which I’m pretty sure worked, but only for some of the dust.
I feel an easy work around for solar panels gathering dust would be a wiper blade type thing. Where it is on a motorized track with a small blade that sits in a recessed area while not being used. Then when needed just activate it and have it scrape the dust off the panels.
I feel like that runs the risk of slowly damaging the panels because of how fine and rough the dust is.
This is utterly fascinating. I am a technician who also enjoys solo tramping living on borrowed time. I could quite happily spend the rest of my life being dumped on the Martian surface with a tool kit exploring the planet and fixing the odd broken rover I came across. It would be fascinating to wander and alien world and come across a piece of technology and get it working again. And I would love to climb Olympus Mons. Dreams are free.
Favourite planet? Mine would be Mars because it is possible (with life support) to exist there, at least for a while and because there are no wars or politicians.
Once the batteries go and freeze, there is no repair possible. You would have to get there before that happens. Which is why preserverence uses an RTG - it provides heat.
@@jessepollard7132 I don't think I'll be going to Mars any time soon ;-) As I said, dreams are free.
Which is why its already been agreed that any permeant colonisation of mars would involve structures being built in underground caves to protect against this thing.
Could this be related to increased atmosphere density building up over the 5½ years, and shed during the swelling? There's dry ice in the soil and on the poles, could that drive it?
7:10 I believe the author said he wrote that before they had more information on how impactful the wind would actually be on Mars. I could be wrong though.
11:20 - Ive always questioned why something like windsheild wipers on a solar panel are not used, there is probably a solid reason but I would assume with with humans it can just be a person task if its not too dangerious to go and wipe down solar panels.
After the storm humans could do that yea. But they'd still have to find a sustainable way to power the base for multiple weeks without solar panels. Batteries can only take you so far.
"why something like windsheild wipers on a solar panel are not used,"
Given the extreme temperature changes and zero humidity my bet is that they are struggling to find a wiper that doesn't simply fall apart after a week. :-)
But also; wiping sand a and dirt from a planet that has very little erosion across a solarpanel is a good way to make the panel's surface opaque.
I'd probably try parking the rover on a slope and add a vibrating motor to the panels to shake the dirt off. But I'm just brainfarting here.
Weight penalties for everything else, and they were never intended to be immortal in the first place. Remember that the first rovers only needed to work for a few months to be continued a success.
There are a number of reasons why insight doesn't have a way to clean it's solar arrays, let me list a handful.
wasn't really designed to last this long. Even though Mars surface assets always outlast their design windows, we have to manage scope so we only design for nominal mission.
heavier than you think, 1kg on lander = 100s of kg in support hardware = 1000s of kg in rocket fuel.
windshield wiper apparatus is difficult to design into an array that must also fold up to, 1/10th it's size, survive launch and entry/landing on mars, then deploy out.
more moving parts = more options to break something you didn't expect to.
dust on Mars does not behave like a liquid, or like dust on earth. The atmosphere is so thin that electrostatic forces hold the dust down making it sticky. That's why dumping dirt nearby helps, it disrupts the charge.
However, those are engineering challenges which are hard but can be overcome. What can't be overcome is the fact that adding functionality doesn't always add capability. Right now, Mars geometry (tau = 2.5-4), means there is very little light available. This happens every year, and regardless of whether we wiped off the arrays or not, we would still be sitting in quiescent survival mode for the season. Engineers knew this was coming and designed the lander to handle it, not to outperform it.
@@SanquinityNeil deGrasse Tyson once equipped that nuclear was the other forbidden n word. But even to settle the moon, with permanent sunlight at the polar regions and 2 weeks continuous sunlight everywhere else, you are going to need a consistent high-level source of energy to keep people alive and machinery running. Yes I understand that nuclear power is expensive, it's complicated, and there are still anti-nuke Kooks that will freak out at the mere mention of launching something with radioisotope thermal generators. But going to and staying on Mars with only solar power? Fughetaboutit!
Thinking of Martian settlers facing this reminds me of a favorite short story, "A Wind Is Rising", by Robert Sheckley.
Those storms must be from the Martian's use of fossil fuels.
You're deluded
@@Kuhanapomaranca😂
Alex, your narration is God-tier 😊
Alex, where is your accent from?
So basically Arrakhis
too cold. Arrakhis had water. even though most of it was supposed to be locked up in the sandworms.
Maybe it takes 3 Martian years to sufficiently heat the surface up enough to cause the storms to form. Perhaps we're overthinking this. Is it possible it's that simple? It chokes itself out when the heat from the sun doesn't reach the surface for several weeks. If it reaches -207°F because no light reaches the surface it gets bone-chilling cold, so after the storm dies and the dust finally settles it only warms a little at a time because of day and night. Three years later temps are right for winds to ramp up again. Just a thought.
So, basically the dust in Mars plays the role of both air and water cycle on earth. It is basically the only large scale weather event on Mars.
There are faint clouds in the martian sky, they say sometimes they may sprinkle puny amounts of snow on the surface, sadly the atmosphere is too thin for liquid water rain to be possible. It's also theorized that CO2 gas geysers exist on the planet's poles, spewing the gas for it to freeze up there and it falling again coating the surface.
I read that mars experiences Dry ice snow fall at its poles, but that has yet to be recorded.
sounds like a normal November in scotland
Great video and explanation. It has always been puzzling to me that NASA leaves all those probes and rovers to rot once their panels are covered on dust. You spent billions, for f* shake, they all have robotic arms or motors, put some wipers on them! or simply a folding mechanism to put panels vertical or upside down when storms are coming!! Even a shaking mechanism....
Thanks for the vids
Electrical activity is the sole reason for the dust storms.
The dust devils are also caused by electrical activity.
The timing also may implicate the solar maximum and minimum. Every 5 years or so isn't far off of twice every 11 years.
Bro I know a lot about weather and dust devils are caused by whirlwinds
Absolutely correct.
@barry | Exactly my thoughts
nope - simple thermal differences.
global storm season on mars seems to line up solar min/max so I wonder if there isn't some net charge effect working on it
I still can't believe that NASA has the smartest engineers on Earth and they couldn't install a simple brush to clean the solar panels on their rover.
The wind storms clean off the solar panels, buddy 😂 they know what they are doing lol
@@K0wface apparently they don’t, since their rover stopped working.
It worked for years after the planned lifespan of 3 months. That is success. They don't go around asking what it would take to make them immortal, especially since there's no way to fix anything that breaks.
What makes you think they have the smartest engineers on earth?
Bro, they have the best technology and best engineers, they know their job very well.
All the martians underneath the surface laughing at humans trying to farm in the surface 😂
It’s hard to believe such a thin atmosphere could have such huge dust storms. This is important to understand why we don’t have them on Earth.
I think it's because 70% of the Earth is covered with water.
As the clouds thicken, temperature cycling forms small amounts of water near the surface. When the surface temp increases enough the Martian life can ascend from the caverns below to drink and mate. Then descend as the temperatures lower allowing the moisture evaporate & dust to hide the holes that were made by any activity. - Having a lander / rover capable of analysing atmos. during a storm will be enlightening.
any water vapor there freezes out of the atmosphere.
Really wish the clickbait titles and/or thumbnails would stop. Makes me not want to watch the videos anyone despite the content being fine
oh its a clickbait?
Who knew Texas and mars had the same weather pattern with the temperature swings
Isn't there a way to just clean the solar panels? Like a backup battery to power wipers that can clean the solar panels, or a way to retract them when the storm is brewing, using a battery to then reawaken and re-extend them once it fades
Its not the dust on the panels thats a problem its the fact the sun is blocked.
Percy and Ginny have been a great team, but i'm afraid that means Percy may soon be without its little scout. that helicopter has to br so light weight to fly in the thin air, I imagine it doesn't take much dust to block its solar panels. on top of which it may be sensitive to mechanical interference from dust screwing up, aerodynamics, electronics, or even just adding too much weight.
You called it!
Really? They were named after Harry Potter characters? I never knew that
Hi Alex. I thought you stopped making videos. I am glad you are back.
It would be interesting to see a plot graph showing the surface & atmospheric temps, the average wind speed & average AOD value over the 5.5 year period leading up to these storms. If the amount of dust in the atmosphere is dependent on wind & heat, than there should be a correlation with all these factors right?
The dust storms would make such a good backstory for tons of stories
Venus and Earth are my favorite planets
Remind me again, what is the ways of stickyness? Adhesion, Cohesion and the 3rd?
What I miss from discussions about colonising Mars is: due to its thin atmosphere (which we are unlikely to restore for obvious reasons), what about a sudden destruction of structures build for our protection, like a glass dome, by falling debris from the sky? Mars doesn't have an atmosphere that protects us from most of this debris on Earth. A lot of it burns in the atmosphere or is significantly reduced (and perhaps slowed down, I don't know) before it hits Earth.
Pluto is my favourite - New Horizons has totally sold me on it & it would be great to have a Pluto globe
Could they build an onboard "umbrella" for dust? Basically, a wired balloon, built of a lightweight plastic. that can be opened from the top of the rover. Like an umbrella, it would open on a wired frame, then drop a tube of plastic, with a powered, retracting circular ring, like a ziptie but more flexible. Maybe the weight of plastic edger/trimmer line for lawns? A simple reversible motor could unwind and rewind the cable (monofilament one way, the heavier cable the other way).
@12:09. Curiosity and Perserverance are the only two rovers still operating on Mars.
Zhurong went into hibernation in May of 2022.
These storms are a problem. They reset the gained heat right back down. If we increase the atmospheric heat the storms would be more frequent. One step forward equals 2 step back. Or worst even longer.
Mars has another problem. It is Gravity. For every 100kg you would have only 38kg gravitational pull. You could jump really high. Objects of any weight would be 62% lighter than they are here. This is fact.
Nice illustration of a tipping point.
Fascinating, thank you!
It strikes me that a bunch of dust in the air rubbing together could build up an electrical charge, particularly given the metallic content of most of Mars's dust. Is lightning a problem in those storms? Am I missing something?
I would be really interested to know at what depth geothermal energy could be practically accessed. Is there any way to scan the surface to find hot spots where the crust is thinner? Like the "Iceland" of mars?
I love this channel.
Thank you for calling out the movie "The Martian". That was ridiculous. Also the end when he flew "like Ironman" with a simple hole in his suit.
I believe the author has admitted to it being artistic licence is order for the story to work. Not a lot of things that could come up for only one person to suddenly go MIA yet have everyone else run away.
Andy Weir has always admitted that the storm was unrealistic but he couldn't think of any scenario that would realistically leave a single astronaut stranded like that. As for the Iron Man thing, that was a Hollywood change to make things more exciting and doesn't happen in the book
Llove your videos you are entertaining and you explain things so even this rube can understand you make me feel smarter even if for a little while thanks Alex good day and good luck 😊
I always figured the first step in colonising Mars would be robots digging a tunnel network that would protect most of the stuff.
Considering small stones rain from the sky periodically at the speed of bullets and repairs have to wait for bi annual rocket shipments cramming relatively tiny amounts of supplies onto the preciously limited cargo and every bit of weight in material comes out of the food supplies, i feel like it would *have* to be underground.
"unable to call for help" - Well, calling for help wouldn't make much sense anyway, if it takes 7 months to get there.
Thanks, Alex! 🌪
Could a colony dig into the surface to use Geothermal energy to help sustain power, heat, and bio growth? I would think it would be also possible to build a setup that would be able to lower into the surface to prevent much of the dust from damaging equipment and help with keeping most of the weather at bay until the storms ran their course? Once the storms or any weather was over, the colony could be raised to the surface again. While under the surface, however, the idea of Nuclear energy would be a more viable power source than simple Geothermal but it would help. I am not a scientist but I was genuinely curious as to seeing if this was a possibility?
Great video. Also loving the piano version of Despacito. :p
It will be more than one or two centuries before anyone will inhabit Mars. Visiting? That's obviously different.
So if we can't use solar power, could we use wind turbines or geothermal energy? Or a combination of the two? And is it feasible to burrow into the ground or natural caves to make shelters and garden areas for habitation? I may read too much sci-fi...
I think of all the rovers on Mars that have sadly died or never got a chance to work and I immediately cheer myself up with the thought that one day we will collect them all up fix them and put them in museums where they belong!...cheers.
From the model we see white patches, is that ice? Can you dig there to build underground bases?
Mars is a good example of where earth is headed
4:00 that is probably the most insane thing i have ever heard! 8500 meter tall dustnados!
That is over 10 burj khalifas tall.
5:52 I wonder how warm the temperature gets on the inside of these dust storms. Would it be a little over 27, or more like a Jacuzzis temprtature.
Hate the name but Uranus has always been my favorite. It’s my favorite color, spins sideways and rains diamonds.
There was once a king named Bob who did food reviews on Mars.
Did Sanderson get the idea for his storms in the storm light archive from this I wonder?
Kudos for debunking the dust storm in "The Martian."
In Australia we call Dust Devil's 'Willy Willy's'
Very interesting, had no clue about the storm cycle of Mars. Peace!
Would it be possible to equip rovers with a marquee like cover to protect them from the dust storms? Probably it could sense the wind picking up before there’s a full blown dust storm, right?
I don't think the video mentioned rovers being mechanically damaged by impact with dust. It said the problem is how the dust blocks sunlight (=power) and communications.