How superb was Alan Alda - he is a pure craftsman and the writing was beyond belief. It's hard to imagine another series that will surpass the quality of the actors and the writing. How i miss this show.
@@maxmustermann-zx9yq Posterity has proven they're not above exploring alternatives to voting when democracy fails them, like packing the Supreme Court or storming the Capitol.
Downvote: This cuts the best part of the scene, by leaving out Toby's assessment of the speech "Without one mention, without so much as an allusion to either one, he managed to dismiss Russell and Santos as puny dwarf-like children trying to get a seat at the grown-ups' table". Genius line.
@@garretthildebrandt428wouldnt that be something. A choice between two candidates, both persons of distinction, wit, and intelligence. The mind boggles.
The original plan for the season was that Vinick would win and Santos would go home. However, when John Spencer, who played Leo, died suddenly, the episodes were rewritten as it was deemed to be too much of a downer for the audience.
It should stand as a monument to our collective stupidity that politicians who have tried this level of respect and civility end up getting punished by their voters.
It’s so amazing you can see it in several of the Bartlett staffs eyes- that idea of “now wait just a minute..I might be starting to think I could vote for this guy…”
As a politician it’s easy to win their claps and cheers by hating you opponents. But with a little skill and charisma you can pay tribute to them and instead of mean spirited tribalism you can genuinely win their respect and make them think “this man is better than me, he made a good President” That’s what everybody should think at election time.
@@everardoreyes1411: the standards of human decency? Making it a contest of intellect, vision and ideas, rather than polarizing a nation by hate speech and spewing forth vitriol and bile.
Not many people seem to know this, but this was their way of preparing viewers for Vinnick beating Santos. They changed the script to a Santos victory after the sudden death of Leo/ John Spencer later that year
Actually, I've read that Santos was always intended to be the winner, but the character of Vinick made such a strong impression that there were some real debates in the writer's room. I do think Leo dying AND Santos losing would be too much of a downer. If not for Spencer's death, I would've argued that Vinick should've won. Having the same party control the White House for more than two terms in a row is not likely in modern times (it's only happened once in the last 70 years) and having the show explore a Republican administration after six and a half seasons of a Democratic administration could've been interesting.
@@toddsmitts They were ending the show no matter who they allowed to win the election. I think Vinick should have won but the show wouldn't have gone on anyway.
@@toddsmitts From what I read, there was an idea of Vinick winning, but it was quickly dismissed. Back then hollywood was exactly the same as is now. If it was just up to them, there would never be republican president again. Both in movies or in reality.
Santos was modeled on Barack Obama who was then running for the presidency. So fate having them make Santos win actually helped the show predict Obama's unlikely win.
Aaron Sorkin mentioned in an interview that they were initially planning for a Vinnick presidency in upcoming seasons, but when John died they had to scape it all because it seemed like they were bashing one side a little too much. Hence the meltdown and the unceremonious, yet inevitable end to The West Wing! Edit: It would have been damn cool to see what the writers would have come up with for a Vinnick Presidency!
@@ravivasista2007 Aaron Sorkin was no longer involved at this point, and in fact he's said he hasn't even seen the later seasons, so I kind of doubt that. Someone else might have said it, though.
@@ravivasista2007 I'd kinda like to see that interview, because Sorkin was long gone by then, and their ratings had summarily tanked to subterranean depths. Between no Sorkin and losing the vast majority of the cast to other projects, it would have taken a Lazarus moment to rescue this thing. They lost well over half their viewership from the series high at #10 in season 3. By the time the last season was in play they were at #65 and being handily beaten down by that marvel of epicurean grandeur, Extreme Makeover: Home Edition.
@@ravivasista2007 I think you mean John Wells. He was show runner from season 5-7. I understand the reason but I don’t like it, it to me, cheapens the victory. Santos was great candidate but vinnick was better. Would also be nice for a republican to win in a very pro democratic show, not to subvert expectations or just a cheap gimmick but because Vinnick was a truly great candidate. For him to be Bartlett’s successor would have been a great message about bi-partisanism and the peaceful transfer of power. To have a nuclear meltdown in vinnicks home state where he is a huge advocate of nuclear energy seemed too cheap. Like they were trying to make him lose because up until that point he seemed like the better candidate. If Vinnick won you could have had a similar scene where vinnick invites santos to be the secretary of education just like how santos offered vinnick state. Not out of some misplaced sympathy or a cynical appearance to look magnanimous. He offered it to vinnick because he knew he was the best one for the job. As would vinnick would think about making santos education secretary.
I am not American, so I can't vote in the US elections and if I were one, I would never vote Republican giving the... options. But if Vinick was an option - even I would have difficulty choosing between the two of them.
@@ScorpiusZA. I’m not American so can’t vote but I’d struggle to think of a democrat I would vote for. But in the west wing it’s different lol I’d proudly vote for Bartlett and Santos because of the particular men they were, not the party they represent. I think it’s folly to start your political deliberations based on party loyalty, there should always be exceptions. Since when they’re president sometimes they have to do things that go against the party but they do them because they’re in the greatest interest in the nation. If you went by party loyalty as a deciding factor think of all the great presidents we would have lost because they were from another party. On my side FDR, Truman, Kennedy, Johnson Clinton and Obama. None of these men were perfect, far from it, but they were perfect for the job at the time.
I love that I still see 4 week old videos, and 14 hour old comments for this exceptional show. I agree. I’m a registered Democrat, and Vinnick would have had my vote. At some point in American politics there came a moment where some overpaid pollster realized that it was easier to stop speaking to the well informed electorate, and instead play to the base audience. Recognizing that the uninformed wildly outnumber the informed, and that there was no need for a moral code if you could simply fool the majority into voting for you, was the beginning of the end for our democracy. While Aaron Sorkin may not have been involved in these later seasons, I think he realized this, and that’s why he followed up with The Newsroom.
If I lived in west wing world I’d have a hard time choosing Vinnick or Santos. Both were great men and would be great Presidents. I’d want both of their influences in the cabinet. I may be wrong but in the early days of the republic didn’t the runner up become VP. Washington > Adams then Adams > Jefferson. That would be nice today. Unrealistic since candidates in the same party can’t even refrain from attacking each other. Hillary and Obama, Hillary and bernie, Trump and Jeb. and many more to follow no doubt. Saunders vs Harris or maybe Ron desantis against trump Jr/ivanka or Mike pence. I’d probably end up voting for vinnick for many reasons (experience, integrity, intelligence, honesty. I think vinnick would be a better unifier than Santos since vinnick is more centrists and Santos is more left) But if I knew before the election that santos would put vinnick in one of the most important seats in American government then I probably would have voted thusly. Also when you compare their VPs, santos wins by a mile, and between santos and vinnick, it’s vinnick that would most likely need his VP…….and I didn’t want an evangelical as president because what would happen if god parted the skies and asked the President to launch all nuclear bombs at once? It scares me to have a leader who has a higher authority than the peace and prosperity of the people who elected them.
Yep, that was indeed the case that in the early days of the republic, it was a case of highest vote gets you president, runner up becomes vice president--and if we're being honest, it was hard to keep personalities out of it even then (read Burr and Hamilton among the more acrimonius amongst the runners up). For that matter, when John Adams was elected to follow Washington, he was not altogether certain that Washington would actually retire gracefully--only to find that Washington was indeed about "teach them to say goodbye."
When you feel bad that vinnick didn’t win. Just know that while he’d be a great President, he’d be a better Sec of State. And Sam Seaborn should be administrator of NASA
The writers initially wrote vinick to win. Then Leo died IRL mid season, and they decided to have Santos win because they thought the public couldn’t handle more defeat
@@davidh4653 They were good, decent men, and Republican voters didn't turn out for them. Republican voters did turn out en mass for someone truly indecent, and I don't know how that doesn't mean the GOP is now an indecent party.
@@Relativ9 vinnick would never have picked Sarah palin as his Running mate in a cynical attempt to take the spot light off President Obama. I know Vinnick’s running mate was not very good but he was still not Sarah palin. That choice was just an insult.
@@scbluesman13 I think this is part of the discourse that gets us divided. Saying one side is evil and the other one mostly isn’t. Trump was a disgrace to the office and fair enough, but saying most republicans are evil is not correct.
@@dauferm Speaking strictly from a perspective of what issues/values are supported and which are fought against? I can easily disagree with what you've just said.
@@scbluesman13 this country could use some reason. If republicans believe democrats hated America, were unpatriotic, communist while the democrats believe the republicans are racist, homophobic, Xenophobic, what chance do we have for honest discourse?
Never mind the emails. What about his failure to disclose to the public that he had MS? Trumps failure to disclose that he had a consensual affair with a woman long before he ran for office made him a convicted felon!
Vinick was going to win the election until Leo's actor died (RIP) and the showrunners wanted a more upbeat conclusion to the series. VINICK FOR PRESIDENT
This is so delirious it's not even funny. No Republican would ever talk like that. And even if they did, no RNC would ever applaud it even begrudgingly.
He's an idealized John McCain, just as Santos was openly stated to have been based on Barack Obama circa 2005-2006 (who was seriously considering his presidential run back then). This is a US that never saw a Bush/Cheney administration, that didn't get sucked into a military quagmire in Iraq and Afghanistan, and so had to appeal to a much more liberal voter base than the US of 2004-2008.
Can you imagine someone standing up there and saying that about trump? No, I can't either. I can about every president before him, but it will never be said about him. It's a damn shame what the republican party has been reduced to.
meh, I couldn't say it about george w Bush. couldn't say it about Nixon. couldn't say it about andrew Jackson. a lot of bums have inhabited that office.
George Bush managed slip by without his knowledge of the Kennedy assassination slipping out. The flak the G.W.Bush took for being G.W.Bush & seeming to hit new lows in U.S. presidencies. President Clinton was tarnished not for being a bad president but for fooling around with Monica- this says more about the Republican Party & the press than about his ability as a president. Although President Obama was, perhaps one of the most appealing & charming of presidents it didn’t alter one iota his foreign policy. Surprise, surprise when President Trump turned out to be the most unpresidential president ever & now incoherent President Biden. What the hell is going on? Who really runs that country?
Sad how even after watching this, after recognizing that there was no way he could win, the White House still tried to push Bob Russell as their nominee and sweep Santos off to the side, only accepting him as the nominee after the delegates basically forced them to. And even after that, no one in the White House still supported him. Toby still hated him cause he went to the center on ONE issue, CJ was too busy messing things up as Chief of Staff, and Bartlett couldn't be bothered to campaign for him. It's one of the things I don't like about the last seasons, they show the White House people as not caring at all about the future of the country and their party, despite their claims to the contrary.
the delegates didn't force them. Santos gave a rousing speech, and Bartlett decided to throw his weight behind him. Meeting with, I want to say the Head of the New York delegation, to get Santos the required delegates for the nomination. As CJ said earlier, Bartlett chose his successor.
The only misstep this amazing writing team made: Vinnick losing. Would have nailed the stark reality of how difficult it is for an incumbent party to win.
Never noticed until now how fake the convention crowd was. There were maybe 10-15 people providing applause with an offset loop to sound like more. Also, Alan Alda used to be a good actor. In his speech, he was only talking to people about 10 feet in front of him. A true convention speech would have him speaking to people more than 100 feet away. BTW: This is the worst critique of the show I could come up with.
I read somewhere that it was Sorkin's original intent to have Vinick win, but that when John Spencer (Leo McGarry) passed away, Sorkin decided it was just too much of a downer to have the Democrats lose McGarry AND an election. I wish our politics was more like this.
Vinick was the best president (or presidential candidate) in the show. Was a thousand times smarter, more interesting and more eloquent than Bartlett and Santos combined. The only admirable character in the entire show.
What a great election it would be if both candidates were honourable and competent. If both parties actually put up their best candidates. And not a crazy geriatric against a crazy geriatric, who happened to be the main candidates last election too.
"He just picked up 5 million Democratic votes." Yep, and he lost 10 million Republican votes at the same time, give or take. At least, that's how it would have played out in reality. I love this show, but it sure had no problem ignoring how things actually work.
What's really scary about these West Wing videos?? Judging by a few comments, certain people's political opinion is being influenced by a TV show!!! All this time I thought "TV programming" meant how the networks decide which shows to air at what time of day...I believe it's the viewer who is being programmed!!
The fictional characters in this 30 year old show have more dignity and poise than some of our real life politicians today. The only brainwashing going on is whatever they're putting in republican people's water to make them believe that Trump shouldn't have been impeached the first time that was going around.
Every time I watch this show I hope that the outcome will change and Vinic wins. Because as much wi like this show the Democrats are destroying my country.
Shows like West Wing are awesome for giving us aspirational hopes for how not only our leaders but we as a society can collectively hope to be better and achieve great things. Then you go back to reality and all those hopes and dreams are instantly squashed when you have an 80 year old presidential candidate ranting and raving over fake news about immigrants eating pets, and remind yourself that in reality we are collectively stupid AF.
![The West Wing: Chaos at the Convention [CLIP] | TNT](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/iz88gB1JOFU/mqdefault.jpg)
![The West Wing: Two Words the President Doesn’t Want to Hear [CLIP] | TNT](/img/n.gif)
How superb was Alan Alda - he is a pure craftsman and the writing was beyond belief. It's hard to imagine another series that will surpass the quality of the actors and the writing. How i miss this show.
“That bastard......he just picked up 5 million Democrat votes.”
😆😆😆
...and would've lost 10 million Republican votes in the process.
Lol yeah but would've picked up 6 million independents
@@jsemail1852 get moderate democrats and independents to overcome low turnout base but gains for The GOP broader base
@@fede2 who are they gonna vote for? the democratic nominee?
@@maxmustermann-zx9yq Posterity has proven they're not above exploring alternatives to voting when democracy fails them, like packing the Supreme Court or storming the Capitol.
Downvote: This cuts the best part of the scene, by leaving out Toby's assessment of the speech "Without one mention, without so much as an allusion to either one, he managed to dismiss Russell and Santos as puny dwarf-like children trying to get a seat at the grown-ups' table".
Genius line.
The scene isn't called "What Toby said when Vinick Accepts the Republican Nomination".
Was so pissed the line wasn't there
Thank You for sharing that line.
You know, if it was choice between Vinnick or Bartlet, I’d feel pretty good as an American.
@@garretthildebrandt428wouldnt that be something. A choice between two candidates, both persons of distinction, wit, and intelligence. The mind boggles.
I like how they fleshed out Vinick. Made him not a bad guy and some people probably wanted him to win. Alan Alda did an amazing job portraying him.
The original plan for the season was that Vinick would win and Santos would go home. However, when John Spencer, who played Leo, died suddenly, the episodes were rewritten as it was deemed to be too much of a downer for the audience.
Un presidente come vinick non ci sarà mai purtroppo. In questi tempi difficili servirebbe uno come lui
@@BaileysMariner Vinick had some integrity. It's been awhile since I watched the show, but I think I would've been fine with a Vinick presidency.
The loss of John Spencer and the loss of a Vinick presidency were two tragedies in one year.
@@antoniomaietta1116 We HAD a president like Vinick. Better in fact. His name was Reagan.
It should stand as a monument to our collective stupidity that politicians who have tried this level of respect and civility end up getting punished by their voters.
Absolutely.
It’s so amazing you can see it in several of the Bartlett staffs eyes- that idea of “now wait just a minute..I might be starting to think I could vote for this guy…”
no , no , i dont think they are thinking that, they are thinking how the hell are we gonna beat that guy so damn good
@@anishgb that’s fine. I posted my opinion.
“You have one year to talk me out of voting for him.” -Donna Moss
Wait, he didn't call for Santos and Bartlett to be jailed? I'm so confused...
What about Hillary’s e-mails?
@@NChant101 Hillary would have been the First F presidet.....id say female....but someone deleted the emale
Hard to believe that the differences between D's & R's was just ideological.
Well Santos and Bartlett didn't commit any crimes..
Because unlike Hillary or the Kenyan, Bartlett and Santos don’t belong in jail
"Damn. Ok, maybe 7 million."
Hawkeye Pierce for prez!!! Trapper for V.P.
Maxwell Klinger for SecState
Radar as sec of agriculture, Houlihan gets health or general surgeon (or what it is called).
Alan Alda is a great actor, but would you imagine Hawkeye as a Republican?
Colonel Potter would be good as Speaker of the House.
Nah, BJ for VP all the way. Gotta get California's vote. XD
If only the modern Reps have men like Arnold Vinnick on top.
If only the modern Dems had a man like Bartlett or Santos on top.
@@Elthenar false equivalency.
@@JoefromNJ1 explain how.
@@Elthenar is your implication the distance between bartlett and biden is the same between vinick and trump?
@@JoefromNJ1 Is your implication that Trump is the only conservative in the world?
As a politician it’s easy to win their claps and cheers by hating you opponents.
But with a little skill and charisma you can pay tribute to them and instead of mean spirited tribalism you can genuinely win their respect and make them think “this man is better than me, he made a good President”
That’s what everybody should think at election time.
*listening to audio* wait... is that Hawkeye?
Alan Alda is one of my favorites ^^
This video is ever so more poignant now. This video shows how a presidential candidate of the opposie party SHOULD act. Not like a spoiled child.
Or a senile old fool.
Lol. According to who?!?
@@johnsimpson8043 Like this one? th-cam.com/video/6iImmd4zn40/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=CBSEveningNews
@@everardoreyes1411: the standards of human decency?
Making it a contest of intellect, vision and ideas, rather than polarizing a nation by hate speech and spewing forth vitriol and bile.
Cmon I supported trump and defended his great accomplishments as president but enough is enough. The circus has to end.
Not many people seem to know this, but this was their way of preparing viewers for Vinnick beating Santos. They changed the script to a Santos victory after the sudden death of Leo/ John Spencer later that year
Actually, I've read that Santos was always intended to be the winner, but the character of Vinick made such a strong impression that there were some real debates in the writer's room.
I do think Leo dying AND Santos losing would be too much of a downer. If not for Spencer's death, I would've argued that Vinick should've won. Having the same party control the White House for more than two terms in a row is not likely in modern times (it's only happened once in the last 70 years) and having the show explore a Republican administration after six and a half seasons of a Democratic administration could've been interesting.
@@toddsmitts They were ending the show no matter who they allowed to win the election. I think Vinick should have won but the show wouldn't have gone on anyway.
I'd heard the same thing
@@toddsmitts From what I read, there was an idea of Vinick winning, but it was quickly dismissed. Back then hollywood was exactly the same as is now. If it was just up to them, there would never be republican president again. Both in movies or in reality.
Santos was modeled on Barack Obama who was then running for the presidency. So fate having them make Santos win actually helped the show predict Obama's unlikely win.
This is the type of politics I REALLY wish we could have in the United States instead of what we have now.
1:42 amen!!!
2022 Republicans would have booed him off the stage.
Why would one ever cut Toby's part of that out (only reason why I clicked on it).
me too
man, if only that nuclear reactor hadn't of melted down....
Ikr
Aaron Sorkin mentioned in an interview that they were initially planning for a Vinnick presidency in upcoming seasons, but when John died they had to scape it all because it seemed like they were bashing one side a little too much. Hence the meltdown and the unceremonious, yet inevitable end to The West Wing!
Edit: It would have been damn cool to see what the writers would have come up with for a Vinnick Presidency!
@@ravivasista2007 Aaron Sorkin was no longer involved at this point, and in fact he's said he hasn't even seen the later seasons, so I kind of doubt that. Someone else might have said it, though.
@@ravivasista2007 I'd kinda like to see that interview, because Sorkin was long gone by then, and their ratings had summarily tanked to subterranean depths. Between no Sorkin and losing the vast majority of the cast to other projects, it would have taken a Lazarus moment to rescue this thing. They lost well over half their viewership from the series high at #10 in season 3. By the time the last season was in play they were at #65 and being handily beaten down by that marvel of epicurean grandeur, Extreme Makeover: Home Edition.
@@ravivasista2007 I think you mean John Wells. He was show runner from season 5-7.
I understand the reason but I don’t like it, it to me, cheapens the victory.
Santos was great candidate but vinnick was better. Would also be nice for a republican to win in a very pro democratic show, not to subvert expectations or just a cheap gimmick but because Vinnick was a truly great candidate. For him to be Bartlett’s successor would have been a great message about bi-partisanism and the peaceful transfer of power.
To have a nuclear meltdown in vinnicks home state where he is a huge advocate of nuclear energy seemed too cheap. Like they were trying to make him lose because up until that point he seemed like the better candidate.
If Vinnick won you could have had a similar scene where vinnick invites santos to be the secretary of education just like how santos offered vinnick state. Not out of some misplaced sympathy or a cynical appearance to look magnanimous. He offered it to vinnick because he knew he was the best one for the job.
As would vinnick would think about making santos education secretary.
Tragic that this level of respect & intelligence has become science fiction.
Clinton and Bush became great friends. Clinton brought Nixon into the White House to talk and solicit advice.
VOTE VINICK!!!
I am not American, so I can't vote in the US elections and if I were one, I would never vote Republican giving the... options. But if Vinick was an option - even I would have difficulty choosing between the two of them.
@@ScorpiusZA. I’m not American so can’t vote but I’d struggle to think of a democrat I would vote for.
But in the west wing it’s different lol
I’d proudly vote for Bartlett and Santos because of the particular men they were, not the party they represent.
I think it’s folly to start your political deliberations based on party loyalty, there should always be exceptions.
Since when they’re president sometimes they have to do things that go against the party but they do them because they’re in the greatest interest in the nation.
If you went by party loyalty as a deciding factor think of all the great presidents we would have lost because they were from another party.
On my side FDR, Truman, Kennedy, Johnson Clinton and Obama.
None of these men were perfect, far from it, but they were perfect for the job at the time.
I would have Voted for Arnie Vinick in a Heartbeat
Vinnick should have won. No disrespect to the decision to change to Santos, but Vinnick was clearly the better candidate.
Factual I loved vinick
I love that I still see 4 week old videos, and 14 hour old comments for this exceptional show. I agree. I’m a registered Democrat, and Vinnick would have had my vote. At some point in American politics there came a moment where some overpaid pollster realized that it was easier to stop speaking to the well informed electorate, and instead play to the base audience. Recognizing that the uninformed wildly outnumber the informed, and that there was no need for a moral code if you could simply fool the majority into voting for you, was the beginning of the end for our democracy. While Aaron Sorkin may not have been involved in these later seasons, I think he realized this, and that’s why he followed up with The Newsroom.
I think that was the original plan, until John Spencer died. Then they rewrote the ending of the season.
Even if it’s fictional, Hollywood can never elect a republican
@@staleydu1 They’d have to admit that the sky wouldn’t fall out of the sky.
Wish today's Gop was like vinick
Winick per sempre , il migliore di tutti
It's interesting that the writers were indeed originally intending hto win in the end. Only the death of John Spencer changed all that.
The eyes have it.
A great actor.
What’s funny about this, is that Vinick/Sullivan is 1000000% a foreshadowing of McCain/Palin.
Sullivan could form a sentence. Palin could not.
@@monizdm yeah but she could see Russia from Alaska-that has to count for solid foreign policy experience
@monizdm Palin COULD form a sentence, just not one that made any sense to anybody.
If I lived in west wing world I’d have a hard time choosing Vinnick or Santos.
Both were great men and would be great Presidents.
I’d want both of their influences in the cabinet.
I may be wrong but in the early days of the republic didn’t the runner up become VP.
Washington > Adams then
Adams > Jefferson.
That would be nice today. Unrealistic since candidates in the same party can’t even refrain from attacking each other. Hillary and Obama,
Hillary and bernie,
Trump and Jeb.
and many more to follow no doubt. Saunders vs Harris or maybe Ron desantis against trump Jr/ivanka or Mike pence.
I’d probably end up voting for vinnick for many reasons (experience, integrity, intelligence, honesty.
I think vinnick would be a better unifier than Santos since vinnick is more centrists and Santos is more left)
But if I knew before the election that santos would put vinnick in one of the most important seats in American government then I probably would have voted thusly.
Also when you compare their VPs, santos wins by a mile, and between santos and vinnick, it’s vinnick that would most likely need his VP…….and I didn’t want an evangelical as president because what would happen if god parted the skies and asked the President to launch all nuclear bombs at once?
It scares me to have a leader who has a higher authority than the peace and prosperity of the people who elected them.
Yep, that was indeed the case that in the early days of the republic, it was a case of highest vote gets you president, runner up becomes vice president--and if we're being honest, it was hard to keep personalities out of it even then (read Burr and Hamilton among the more acrimonius amongst the runners up). For that matter, when John Adams was elected to follow Washington, he was not altogether certain that Washington would actually retire gracefully--only to find that Washington was indeed about "teach them to say goodbye."
A great choice for Alan Alda to be Vinnick.
When you feel bad that vinnick didn’t win. Just know that while he’d be a great President, he’d be a better Sec of State.
And Sam Seaborn should be administrator of NASA
The writers initially wrote vinick to win. Then Leo died IRL mid season, and they decided to have Santos win because they thought the public couldn’t handle more defeat
So nice..
At least he is worth looking at!
The last intelligent and respectable Republican in recent memory is a work of fiction. Ladies and gentlemen... Arnold Vinnick.
unfortunately this was filmed before John McCain... he was a decent GOP
Far better than Ritchie, that’s for sure.
McCain, and even Romney in recent years, has been OK.
@@davidh4653 They were good, decent men, and Republican voters didn't turn out for them. Republican voters did turn out en mass for someone truly indecent, and I don't know how that doesn't mean the GOP is now an indecent party.
McCain & Romney were intelligent & respectful as well.
I preferred Vinick to Santos but in the end they would make a great partnership. So well written.
If only ALL occupants of the WH felt this way.
Alan Alda's greatest acting job. He was a lifetime Democrat.
He played a similar role in The Aviator.
He's still alive.
There used to be a Republican like Vinnick. His name was Richard Lugar.
His name was also John McCain.
U mean Richard Nixon
Wasn't he from Pennsylvania?
@@bucklaw Indiana.
@@Relativ9 vinnick would never have picked Sarah palin as his Running mate in a cynical attempt to take the spot light off President Obama.
I know Vinnick’s running mate was not very good but he was still not Sarah palin.
That choice was just an insult.
If only republicans in today's party acted with even a fraction of that much integrity.
Or the dems. They’re all horrible.
@@dauferm Most are. Not all, though.
@@scbluesman13 I think this is part of the discourse that gets us divided. Saying one side is evil and the other one mostly isn’t. Trump was a disgrace to the office and fair enough, but saying most republicans are evil is not correct.
@@dauferm Speaking strictly from a perspective of what issues/values are supported and which are fought against? I can easily disagree with what you've just said.
@@scbluesman13 this country could use some reason. If republicans believe democrats hated America, were unpatriotic, communist while the democrats believe the republicans are racist, homophobic, Xenophobic, what chance do we have for honest discourse?
But...Bartlett's emails...
Never mind the emails. What about his failure to disclose to the public that he had MS? Trumps failure to disclose that he had a consensual affair with a woman long before he ran for office made him a convicted felon!
Why would the Vice-Presidential nominee introduce the Presidential nominee?
Loves vai amém bom
How un-Trump like was this performance.
Vinick was going to win the election until Leo's actor died (RIP) and the showrunners wanted a more upbeat conclusion to the series.
VINICK FOR PRESIDENT
un presidente come il senatore Vinicio lo vorrei per 10 mandati
President Hawkeye would have been a decent one.
He should have won. In real life, he would've definitely won.
This is so delirious it's not even funny. No Republican would ever talk like that. And even if they did, no RNC would ever applaud it even begrudgingly.
Actually, a Republican did do that and didn't get much applause: th-cam.com/video/JIjenjANqAk/w-d-xo.html
It wasn’t unthinkable in 2008. GOP’s gone straight downhill since.
He's an idealized John McCain, just as Santos was openly stated to have been based on Barack Obama circa 2005-2006 (who was seriously considering his presidential run back then). This is a US that never saw a Bush/Cheney administration, that didn't get sucked into a military quagmire in Iraq and Afghanistan, and so had to appeal to a much more liberal voter base than the US of 2004-2008.
Vinnick would have been a great Prez.
Can you imagine someone standing up there and saying that about trump? No, I can't either. I can about every president before him, but it will never be said about him. It's a damn shame what the republican party has been reduced to.
meh, I couldn't say it about george w Bush. couldn't say it about Nixon. couldn't say it about andrew Jackson. a lot of bums have inhabited that office.
George Bush managed slip by without his knowledge of the Kennedy assassination slipping out. The flak the G.W.Bush took for being G.W.Bush & seeming to hit new lows in U.S. presidencies. President Clinton was tarnished not for being a bad president but for fooling around with Monica- this says more about the Republican Party & the press than about his ability as a president. Although President Obama was, perhaps one of the most appealing & charming of presidents it didn’t alter one iota his foreign policy. Surprise, surprise when President Trump turned out to be the most unpresidential president ever & now incoherent President Biden. What the hell is going on? Who really runs that country?
Not true of W either, as far as recent presidents go
Trump was a great president, how's Biden doing?
Who would be in Republican Party a guy like Vinick? I don't see one.
Closest thing to a Vinick right now is probably Mitt Romney?
@@helios24601 Not a Californian guy. ;more Schwarzenegger.
Who loves tnt?
Not me since they air aew
GWB was a lot like this prior to 9/11
Winnick numero 1
Sad how even after watching this, after recognizing that there was no way he could win, the White House still tried to push Bob Russell as their nominee and sweep Santos off to the side, only accepting him as the nominee after the delegates basically forced them to. And even after that, no one in the White House still supported him. Toby still hated him cause he went to the center on ONE issue, CJ was too busy messing things up as Chief of Staff, and Bartlett couldn't be bothered to campaign for him. It's one of the things I don't like about the last seasons, they show the White House people as not caring at all about the future of the country and their party, despite their claims to the contrary.
the delegates didn't force them. Santos gave a rousing speech, and Bartlett decided to throw his weight behind him. Meeting with, I want to say the Head of the New York delegation, to get Santos the required delegates for the nomination. As CJ said earlier, Bartlett chose his successor.
The only misstep this amazing writing team made: Vinnick losing. Would have nailed the stark reality of how difficult it is for an incumbent party to win.
He would get laughed out of the RNC today
😎
Never noticed until now how fake the convention crowd was. There were maybe 10-15 people providing applause with an offset loop to sound like more. Also, Alan Alda used to be a good actor. In his speech, he was only talking to people about 10 feet in front of him. A true convention speech would have him speaking to people more than 100 feet away. BTW: This is the worst critique of the show I could come up with.
I read somewhere that it was Sorkin's original intent to have Vinick win, but that when John Spencer (Leo McGarry) passed away, Sorkin decided it was just too much of a downer to have the Democrats lose McGarry AND an election. I wish our politics was more like this.
Sorkin had left the show by then-but yes I think that was the original plan.
Too bad this TNT excerpt in 2020 didn’t change a damn thing.
And then you get Trump!
Vinick was the best president (or presidential candidate) in the show. Was a thousand times smarter, more interesting and more eloquent than Bartlett and Santos combined. The only admirable character in the entire show.
Those United States of that part of these Americas.
They should've stuck to the original plan of having Vinick win...
i enjoy this show, but i think of it more as an fantasy like lord of the rings as reality lol
Should be how kamala speaks about biden in the convention speech
I have trouble visualizinga republican behaving that way nowadays. Oh the good old days - of fiction.
What a great election it would be if both candidates were honourable and competent.
If both parties actually put up their best candidates. And not a crazy geriatric against a crazy geriatric, who happened to be the main candidates last election too.
"He just picked up 5 million Democratic votes." Yep, and he lost 10 million Republican votes at the same time, give or take. At least, that's how it would have played out in reality. I love this show, but it sure had no problem ignoring how things actually work.
I think in the early 2000s, he could have gotten away with such rhetoric now, obviously, he would get canned immediately
Show this to Trump
What's really scary about these West Wing videos?? Judging by a few comments, certain people's political opinion is being influenced by a TV show!!! All this time I thought "TV programming" meant how the networks decide which shows to air at what time of day...I believe it's the viewer who is being programmed!!
The fictional characters in this 30 year old show have more dignity and poise than some of our real life politicians today. The only brainwashing going on is whatever they're putting in republican people's water to make them believe that Trump shouldn't have been impeached the first time that was going around.
And at the moment you’ve got President Biden and Trump, come on America, you can do better.
And now our politics is a fucking circus, and the biggest clown wins.
Vinick should have won.
Then why didn't you cast your ballot for him?
That only works if the outgoing president is popular. Note, Biden is not
...and just list 6 million republicans votes!
this is all warm and fuzzy and whatever, but Bartlett didnt actually accomplish anything
His “accomplishments” were mainly symbolic, and only appealed to one side.
@@Egilhelmson there were a couple of things, but fuck all for eight years.
Just like in real life, I think the power of the presidency is over rated
And we have trump....wtf
even worse.......Biden
Classy - as far removed from the current republicans as can be. Unrecognizable.
Republican>Democrat
I still think he should have won. Words cannot describe how upset I was at the result of this fictitious election at the time lol.
Democrats on this show, would be considered republican now....
Every time I watch this show I hope that the outcome will change and Vinic wins. Because as much wi like this show the Democrats are destroying my country.
They should have continued the show through Santo's presidency than then to a Vinick presidency.
Shows like West Wing are awesome for giving us aspirational hopes for how not only our leaders but we as a society can collectively hope to be better and achieve great things.
Then you go back to reality and all those hopes and dreams are instantly squashed when you have an 80 year old presidential candidate ranting and raving over fake news about immigrants eating pets, and remind yourself that in reality we are collectively stupid AF.