Unpopular opinion: It's a big deal because toxicity can affect the writers. The fandom harasses the writers so bad that the writer feel obligated to acquiesce to whatever the fandom wants so they don't have to feel the fandom's wrath. Many instances where people have gone so far as to threaten the writer because their ship wasn't canon or the story didn't go a certain way. It's sick honestly.
I've seen some shows give into toxic fandoms and it upsets me. I know they need to make money, and to do that, they need to please the fans, but... I'd rather they just told the story they intended to from the start, even if that means upsetting people. Telling an artist or a writer that they "did something wrong" in their work is really disrespectful to the hard work and thought that went into a creation. Constructive criticism is fine, but harassing creators because something didn't turn out how *you* wanted it to is rude. Isn't this what fan fiction was supposed to be for in the first place? To satisfy people's imagination and fantasies of how *they* wanted the story to go, regardless of the canon events?
"Don't like, don't read." Man do I miss the days of this simple, simple phrase. Edit: I left this comment a year ago and yall have been brawling in the sub comments. What I mean as someone who has been in fandom spaces since the early 2000s, the term "dont like, dont read" in regards to fanfic was another form of reaffirming the tags for a story. I dont like reading stories with gore. Someone labeling their tags or ending their summary with "if you cant handle or dont like gore, dont read" was an early form of a trigger warning online. Sure, people have misused the phrase in recent years to get away with disgusting things. That deserves criticism. It wasnt intended to be "no criticism plz" , it was a checkpoint and warning. Since yall got so argumentative about this- I'd hate to see how yall would have reacted to the citrus scale, another common rating system.
Thing is, as someone who's been involved in various fandoms since the early 2000s - there has always been drama. Does nobody remember Harmonians and Harry/Draco slashers? Cassandra Clare's BNF club? MsScribe? Fans of classic Doctor Who getting confused and upset by post-2006 Doctor Who fans for bringing shipping into fandom? Zutara vs Kataang? The original Twilight backlash? Fandom_Wank and other LJ drama communities existed for a reason. One can argue about just how vitriolic the fandom has gotten, but the drama has always been with us.
But how will I like it if I haven't read it? And what if I'm a critic and was given a job to critique that certain thing? Or what if I'm reading/watching for a reason other than the story/animation/action.. etc.?
Because “the children” are and have always been used as a convenient cop-out trump card people pull to instantly justify whatever their personal opinion is, no matter how flimsy the logic. If their argument doesn’t have much going for it & they don’t want to bruise their fragile ego by being proven wrong, this kind of person will exploit “protecting the kids” as much as possible, because that way they figure they CAN’T be in the wrong. After all, that means that anyone who disagrees hates kids, and only a complete monster hates kids! /s
The funny thing about the Entrapta thing is she's autistic coded meaning any person who says she can't be shipped is literally saying autistic people are too childish/too innocent to be in a relationship which as an actual autistic person actually is funny and hurts all at the same time, which is how Ableism usually goes I guess...
Yeah when I saw the sarcastic “child-coded” pop up in the video I could feel myself getting angry too. Like… I haven’t even seen the show and that’s *still* viscerally upsetting.
Do you remember when John Watson got happily married to a woman and the fandom ridiculed her actress because they wanted him to be gay with Sherlock? Fans are toxic
@@blacktigerpaw1 it doesn't matter if they were baited or not, nobody has the right to harass an actor because something in the show happened they didn't like. Complain to the producers if you want change
@@judeconstantine2767 This is a very bad generalization. Please don't assume that because it's not true. I don't ship Johnlock, I am part of the LGBTQ+ community and I don't do that. And I know lots of people in the community who don't do that either. It's like saying all white people are problematic or or catholics are problematic. Please reconsider this view.
I used to use Amino. I saw two sides of the spectrum. In the Undetale Amino, shippers were running rampant causing ship wars because they thought this character needed to be with that one. On the other hand, I was also there when Godzilla Amino banned all non-canon ships. So yeah, that app is a ride.
I’ve never had a problem with amino besides this one bitch who was toxic AF I blocked her, got everyone who also was being harassed by her, and we all just was like “make sure no one cares about what she post and maybe she’ll leave the community” So yea, there was that
*Breathes deep* Oh yeah. That hits the spot. This is an excellent video! I've seen how these fandom mindsets have made it so people don't want to interact with fandom at all, or killed their passion for the thing itself, and that's so upsetting. The vitriol aimed at content creators in fandoms is especially so insulting and demoralizing.
Thank you Tennelle! TwT AAAA! And YES! I've got a white-knuckled grip on my current fandoms, but there have been times when I've really considered just...dropping everything like a hot potato. It can be so stressful. Hopefully someday we won't have to feel like we're walking on eggshells all the time. Until then, I'm sending good vibes and hot cocoa your way (and to anyone else who reads this comment and could use 'em).
Remember when a crewniverse member was attacked by the Steven universe fandom for how she portrayed Lapis and Peridot's relationship? And how she felt she had to leave the show because of how much harassment she got? Because I do.
Before discovering online fandoms: "I wish there were other people I can talk to about X" After discovering online fandoms: "I TAKE IT BACK I DON'T WANT TO TALK TO THESE CRAZY BASTARDS!! I just wanted to tell people who my favorite character was."
Indeed, relatable. I was in the Undertale fandom and once accidentally said, that a female character who's a gay would (if she wasn't gay)make a cute couple with another guy. Yeah, I was called a homophob for weeks after that.
Sorry. But you can see the similarities, right? I may not watch Voltron, but I have heard all the talk about shipping-related disputes. And what I know is that both fandoms really do have a startling penchant for making up pedophilia problems.
Yes but some are illegal or morally wrong like in fnaf people ship William and glitch trap which is just William’s soul so that’s morally wrong and probably ileagle and micheal x ennard which is micheal dating his murderer that is a animatronic mix of multiple animatronics which includes his sisters soul but the change up the ships as glitch trap being Williams fan made brother which is still illegal or morally wrong and to change it to make the Michael ship correct is by making it not a mix and just having it as a random scraped animatronic and have it were the animatronic doesn’t have his sisters soul and adds a fan made soul most of the time called Noah witch is of correct age and Michael is a walking corpse so this series isn’t made for shipping after all the insanity begins
@@fourrouge3471 If the ship is morally wrong, of course call it out. But don't use that bad ship as a scapegoat to shame others and generalize every ship as bad. Anti-shipping and toxic shipping are in the same boat.
@@fourrouge3471 I don't care what people ship end of day they're are fictional as long they're don't force they ship on people through pressure writers and ship real people.
@@fourrouge3471 Simple. Don't eat the dead dove. Leave it for whatever weirdos like dead doves, and continue about your day. Block it if it bothers you that much. Because believe it or not, you don't have to go on a moral crusade over five nights at freddy's shipping.
Estrella my cookie comment was supposed to be like; “welcome to the club, so have the rest of us” I see how it could be taken the wrong way, but I wasn’t intending to be rude
man, as someone who generally rolls in anime circles the idea of people getting that upset over a character just being child "coded" is fucking wild. I'm not saying that people taking anime's sexualization of kids (or characters who look and act like kids but are *totally* 800 years old) in stride is a good thing, I'm just saying boy does the general fandom not care at all.
I thought there was a post from the creators about her being autistic which would make the assertion of her being 'child-coded' offensive in and of itself.
This year in my country there was a controversy where a girl during the national end of high school exam wrote an interpretation of a poem. Her interpretation was rejected and she failed her exams due to that. BUT it tourned out that her interpretation was correct... according to different examinators. So basically, it was a coin toss between 0 points and max points. I think that indefinetly proves why teaching us that there is one "correct" way to interpret something is bullshit if even people who teach us how to do that can't agree on a proper interpretation.
Things like rape and incest aren't 'factually wrong' though? I think you guys are mixing up factually with morally. The video explains why there's nothing wrong with people exploring those themes, and for many people who've suffered those sorts of traumas (like myself), fanworks like that are helping to deal with our trauma...
The funniest things are the 17 year olds who yell at chill bsfw artists for making them uncomfortable The art was tagged as "nsfw" . U wouldnt find it unless u searched for it.
In their defense a LOT of people don't even bother tagging it as NSFW, or adding the 🔞/18+ emoji. Most of the time it gets shoved in their faces whether they wanna see it or not. Not saying people aren't allowed to make NSFW of course, that's their thing. But most of them can't be bothered to warn people and *that's* what pisses the kiddos off.
@@izzy1356 I can understand being uncomfortable and angry whenever I see something I don't like but demanding creators to off themselves is an overreaction that needs to stop. Harrassment is NOT the answer in that situation. Blocking and walking away is.
Watching you lie in that chair makes me very uncomfortable. As a person who sits in chairs, this is a personal offense to me an I'm questioning your character since you so brazenly attacked my sensibilities.
I disagree completely. As someone who regularly finds myself positioned uncomfortably on chairs, I loved this representation and your discomfort makes me uncomfortable. Thus you’re morally wrong.
You are both wrong and stupid. As a chair stander, I am offended that you would even think of using a chair in such an unholy way. Standing is the only way to go; it's my way or the highway.
I hate when people say “child coded” for characters like Entrapta and Peridot. It clearly comes out of ableism because they are not children, they are neurodivegent. Saying an autistic character is “child coded” is saying that neurodivegent people are children.
The general idea of something be “XYZ coded” makes it to where you are flattening an entire character to one word If that’s not insulting the character itself then what is?
Considering the number of people that tell autistic people that can't actually be autistic because they can do simple things like "doing simple tasks" or "holding a conversation" shows how little people actually know about it. But considering what kind of awareness groups we got, it's amazing it's not worse.
Didnt she talk in the video about different interpretations not being wrong. Unless the character is explicitly stated to be neurodivergent theres really no issue with calling them “child coded”, because that’s just their interpretation of the character.
@@nocturnis1900in case you missed it, its an interpretation that is often only made to construct a battering ram against others. It's posited as a fact that everyone simply knows. and insisted that those that don't agree with the interpretation are potential child predators
I just watched a video about how fandoms become toxic, and am instantly reminded of how people are like when supporting political parties. I guess political parties and fandoms aren’t too far off from one another.
What gets me is all the people talking about the behaviors in "toxic" (terrible overused word for the record) fandoms as if they're something new, and/or unique to fandoms. They're really not, this shitty behavior has existed within every possible grouping of human beings since the dawn of time. One of the most classic examples is religious attitudes towards orthodox versus unorthodox beliefs. "This is the only true interpretation of the Bible and if you disagree, you're not a REAL Christian and you will burn in hell!" is really NOT that far off from "This is the only true interpretation of these fictional characters and if you disagree, you're not a REAL fan and you should kill yourself!", if you really think about it. Humans just fundamentally suck.
@TheThrashyOne Pretty much what I was thinking throughout the whole video. Hell, there've been psychological, neurological, societal, historical, and even archaeological studies out the wazoo that go into bad human behavior, along with other high intelligent species such as dolphins. There's probably buttloads of research that could go into toxic community/fandom actions, but I doubt that people would have the patience to go into a bunch of scientific journals and methods on that...
Honestly shipping is fine But shippers tend to be the most toxic part of their fandoms Shippers need to separate head canon and actual canon Forcing the creator to make your ship canon kinda missed the plot
@Lin Raggar I see. I can see your point, however I do not think Anti-Shipping is good or "Justified" in either scenario. Guilt by association is bad, and using the fact some shippers are Crazy to bash Shipping or Shippers in general only continues toxicity instead of stopping it
i feel like some times the people who harass others are just trying to get internet brownie points or seem like the better person compared to everyone else, like attention seeking like: "i just called out someone who drew a slightly lewd picture and called them a gross ass perv im so good and nice!"
The issue for me isn't wanting attention(I've always been one to say that wanting and doing things to get attention is NOT a bad thing) The issue is that, these people geniunly believe in their simplistic view of things. When it's pointed out their not real and this is fiction they pull the "Fiction impacts reality!" Card.
From what I'm seeing, most of the toxicity in the shipping in particular revolves around people calling out things are not factual with their logic or reason. Specifically like when people called Sheith "abusive" and/or "pedophilia". Not only it doesn't make sense when you think about the definition and the actual thing itself, importantly it show how closed-minded people are when it comes to the internet. Like of course there will be people who think of this way, but they have to deal since that's the cost of freedom on the internet. Edit: like the video said, fandom isn't a safe space especially if they active on the internet people will inevitably find nasty stuff on the internet like porn.
It's SIMPLE, if u see an inappropriate pic, dont scream, "DONT LOOK AT IT!" That just draws more attention to it. JUST.AVOID. IT. There u go, it's simple
I couldn't agree more whenever I see people harassing others online I feel like they're actually just trying to fit into the community themselves by calling out another person they're making themselves look better in the eyes of the community of that they are trying to be accepted in
It's a psychological fact that people who are quick to attack things like that are quite guilty of it themselves. This doesn't just reflect lewd art, but to a plethora of things. They just do it to prove that they are not like that, even when no one suspected a thing in the first place.
Omg you are so right. I've been a shipper since age 11. I never got too into social media though, since I wasn't allowed, but still, I obsess over shows and ignore my surroundings. Around age 16, during the pandemic, I got really into politics. Just like how I got into fandoms
"I think the villain from [media] is actually a genuinely interesting tragic character despite having done [atrocities]" "for one how DARE you like [media], and how DARE you condone [atrocity]??"
@@wizardsandmuggles3569 I know from experience that it works the other way around as well. "I don't like Bakugo because I don't think his development has been adequate enough to make up for the stuff he's done." "BUT YOU _HAVE_ TO LOVE HIM! HE WAS SAD ONCE AND HE ALSO HAD A BAD CHILDHOOD! LOVE HIM! LOVE HIM AND FORGIVE HIM RIGHT NOW OR ELSE! OPINIONS THAT ARE DIFFERENT FROM OURS ARE AUTOMATICALLY BAD!"
When did that happen? For as long as I known different arguments have been categorized to 2 different types, civil and scream matches. In a world without consequences like the internet you see more of the latter than the former.
@@trainerrichard6859 I'm not referring to trolls or jerks on the internet, what I'm referring to is when if you saw something you didnt like, most people wouldnt go out of their way to make a stupid callout post against that someone or thing they didnt like, they would mostly ignore it lmao
I’m pretty sure people who called Entrapta a “child coded” character doesn’t know she’s actually in her early 20s and someone who has symptoms of the Autism Spectrum.
They are either not aware of it, or are aware but are so ableist in their endless journey of being the most woke little fuckstick in the basket that they legitimately believe that autistic people are children and should be treated as such. It's not like as if autistic people have any agency, right gals?
Grandma Tempo that seems to be the case with certain people. Like I'm autistic and when I've heard of the theory, I was like "huh, that's cool" and saw the symptoms that match Entrapta's standard behaviour. It's sad really how fandoms can be so toxic for others.
They don't care...these people think that because a character acts childish or has a mind of a child despite being older and or legally mature in body that that is akin to pedophilia if they have romantic connections...which is not the case.
I said I didnt like She-Ra, but according to some random Twitter user im homophobic. I Just wasn't the biggest fan of the story and artstyle. The characters were pretty decent but I just dont like the story.
And you're not for not liking a show with representation! Like, I really like She-Ra but my mom doesn't, and that doesn't mean one of us has to be wrong
I said I disliked teh chelley ship and bluesy wasn't my thing..... All of a sudden I'm a fuckin fraud and an outcast True story I was on omegle with the tag portal 2 not expecting anyone since portal is practically gone (insert sad recorder) but I found someone, they immediately ask 'whats your view on portals stuff?' Which if ya didn't know.... is pretty bland other than the human wheatley designs even the the older ones are better and everything is chelley and blue sky, so I replied along the lines of 'blue sky's okay not my thing thing since i don't really like the ship chelley but teh games good and i really like Nqn' (a very popular artist in the portal community) and they go off on how im not a true fan im a fraud and a terrible person and I disconnected.... happy times....
The show is pretty good, but just because you don’t like a She-Ra doesn’t mean you’re homophobic. That’s like saying if someone doesn’t like Craig of the Creek that they’re racist.
I’ve never understood people who go after others for just,, shipping things. Like, yeah I have ships I don’t like, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to go after the people that ship it?? I don’t know where all the rage comes from? Even with ships I think are gross, I just,, ignore it. I hyperfixate on characters h a r d, but if someone bashes them I just stay away from it/them
That's not the entire issue. I've seen plenty of pro-shippers who say they are free speech rapidly turn on one another if they suspect someone is 'racist' or 'Nazi'. Not to mention they will *openly defend* CP, lolicon and shotacon and even the worst rape fics without a smidgen of criticism. If I think a ship is gross, I read the fic/view the work and see what's 'gross' about it. If there are grounds for criticism, I go for it.
I had a woman harass me on two different social media platforms (she found me on Twitter after the argument first broke out on Tumblr somehow), for several days. Several days of messages insulting me and calling me a monster. The reason? I made a post saying all ships are valid, that sending harassment/death threats over ships isn't good, and you shouldn't attack creators for not making your ship canon. That canon doesn't mean your alternate fanfic universe can't exist. She insisted that by me accepting that another ship in conflict with her own was valid, I was insulting her, was homophobic, somehow sexist and racist and any other ist she could throw at me. She wanted her ship to be the only valid one and she maintained that she should get to harass and send death threats to others because they don't have the true progressive morally superior ship.
Listening to shippers is like listening to flat earthers, the amount of disprovable logic, and blatant distortions of what most people believe as facts, can make shippers vary aggressive, and the only people willing to interact with them are other shippers and/or people telling them that they are wrong. It's not that everyone is against them, it's that that only alcoholics and anti alcohol activists are willing to sleep in a bar's parking lot. Everyone else just moves on and goes unnoticed by the two.
The moment I heard the word "coded" I internally cringed... it just seems to be a term thrown around by fandoms so they can find more reasons to get offended... Like applying human races to alien space-rocks so that they can pretend that Garnet is a racist stereotype (Yes I saw that argument made once)... Never heard of "child-coded" though...so childish adults aren't allowed to be in relationships anymore? Welp, that's fine. I wasn't interested in dating anyway.
Coding is a real literary term but given the whole "lots of big-name fans don't understand literature" thing it gets misused! Garnet certainly has traits of a black stereotype (which is all coding really means) but that's only one interpretation of her! another fan might say "well, she's a rock from space so she doesn't have a race" or "physically being dark-skinned doesn't mean as much as cultural background".
@@EuphemiaRem That's exactly the problem. In the fandom era "don't like, don't read", dramas were not uncommon but tuned down and between like four people. You could spout all you headcanons into the world because you'd find at least someone that though the same. In the current era of "only this [theory] is the acceptable one", if the dominant theory is that Garnet is coded, you'll be named all kind of names if you say that you interpreted her character diferently. It's sad really.
The "children" thing is a trend in itself. Many corners of the internet are obsessed with telling people which age differences between LEGAL ADULTS are okay and which apparently aren't.
@@Alias_Anybody This! I recently actually left tumblr and my Ask Batgirl blog because A friend and I decided that we would put Killer Moth and Batgirl together. Despite the fact she was an adult, and the age difference was about 11 years at the most, I got harassed and told that it was gross, made them uncomfortable, and that they were going to report me and my friend. We had to end the rp relationship, and I left tumblr. The pedo label was thrown Moth's way, but only in questions to me. My friend received nothing. I was the only one who got harassed. So I left the DC askverse.
As someone who's been in multiple fandoms... I'm desensitized to most of it by now. Just ignore the stuff you don't like, and focus on the stuff you do like, and you'll be pretty much fine
My Tip : just be an antisocial hermit who never answers anything and doesn't even engage with people on the internet. I only watch shipping wars and fandom toxicity from afar as a quiet observer. Nevermind the loneliness. Or depression. Hm..
Ackchually... what you're describing is asocial behaviour, not anti-social. From wikipedia "Asociality refers to the lack of motivation to engage in social interaction, or a preference for solitary activities", and "Anti-social behaviours are actions that harm or lack consideration for the well-being of others".
I don’t do communities though and if people like/dislike agree/disagree with somebody on that media, I look at it and just entertain myself. It’s not worth getting angry about, especially since there is more things to worry about
I've noticed a trend among these "what ifs" that seem to have negated my last point. Ask yourself one question, in these situations; "can I click away without anyone even knowing I was here and/or bothered?" If the answer is yes, do that. Don't start a shitstorm if you can click away and go about your business.
I now look for red flags! lol. sometimes I didn't think something would be as disturbing as what it would be (for me) , I like extreme entertainment .. but some things are a big line of taste for me .. (so yes I can now chose not to click on something) ive learnt that "what if " doesn't matter ! lol. .. but a year ago it felt like someone making an evil fan fic should be in jail!! lol. but I now know its only fantasy . ..(but there have been cases where someone wrote a evil fan fic then actually did crime! ) but that's a 1%... maybe some fantasy's are better left in peoples heads .. or in their room privately .. its way better if there is a "you must be 18" warning just to ive people a fighting chance to be able to click away!!. lol.
We need more of this: If you hate something, just hate that thing. Don't hate the people who make or enjoy it. If you hate something, you should avoid it. Why? People usually don't like things they hate. Why the hell would anyone do anything they don't want to and don't have to do?
big fat agree! and we need more of the reverse as well in my opinion[warning: very long paragraph]: if you like a thing, and the creator/s of that thing did something discriminatory or in bad taste, it doesn't reflect the quality of the thing they created. Boycotting a piece of media just because of something "problematic" the creator did is a mega waste of time and energy. I understand the feeling of betrayal one can get when their perfect view of a creator is tarnished. However, it isn't a cause to shaft them as a creator or say their contributions have lost their meaning. Someone's ability to write, compose, animate, or program is a totally separate can of worms than how good of a person they are morally. this also touches on the "safe space" segment of the video. If you see anything mildly different from your opinion and deem it immoral, all you're doing is upholding an unrealistic standard of a community that is fundamentally flawed. and every fandom, toxic or not, is fundamentally egotistical because it relies on self-indulgence above all else. you can never have a 100% clean and shiny fanbase or creator, much less a 100% kind and clever person behind the veil.
Exactly! I see a lot of people in the comments going "but,, but what if a ship is immoral and evil and bad!!!" like. did you miss the whole video?? please scroll up and hit play. if a ship bothers you, just leave it be. don't use it as an excuse to vilify and attack actual human beings over fictional characters kissing or w/e. I promise it's not as horrible and dangerous as you think it is
I think of it like food, I hate fast food for many reasons, it's bad for you, a lot of fast food companies arnt in my opinion moral (overworking children) ect So I don't eat fast food, and if other people want to eat fast food they are more than welcome to.
@@peeblekitty5780 The only time the ship is ever incorrect is if the creator canonically says the ship is not what it is. But if there’s no canonical proof then ship all you want.
@@doggoadexx2680 I mean, creator's word holds different weight to different people. Folks may interpret the original work differently. Good old death of the author. Not to mention there are cases where the creator claims something about the work that is unsupported or even can be proven false by what's actually in the text, at which point what is canon when employing Word of God is less than clear. Though, all that's besides my initial point: whether or not a ship is accurate to canon or morally pretty has no bearing on whether the person shipping them is a Bad Person Actually, and not something to attack people over.
Honestly after spending so much time in fandom, I realize the key to having a good time is just. Finding a small group of friends you jive with and then ignore pretty much everyone else. I say this as a fan artist who would get so anxious about posting in case I got yelled at, I eventually just found it easier to share within a smaller discord group and worry less about pleasing people because this is MY thing I like and I’ll enjoy it how I want. Once IRL stuff starts piling up you just don’t have the energy or time to argue with strangers online, and I would rather spend it talking about the thing I like rather than defending the “bad parts” of it.
This is very much true with life in general too, as there are plenty of bad parts in the world but it's best to balance that out with good parts (and one of them is definitely finding a good group of friends without needing to please whole crowds of people)! 🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩
This is pretty much exactly the route I ended up going. I stick to small Discord groups with friends who share common interests (and are at least non-judgmental about interests they don't happen to share) rather than going out of my way to interact with large swaths of the fandoms via forums and Twitter and whatnot, since all I ever seem to encounter is the exact type of bullshit described in this video. Small groups of friends may _seem_ more "safe spacey" to some, but in reality, you're simply far less likely to get into really stupid fandom flamewars with smaller groups of friends. Friends with whom you can have civil disagreements because, well...you're _friends._ lol
I'm a writer and I've had a person get upset because one of my adult characters had been nine before he became an adult. What? Are adults supposed to just spring into existence as fully formed adults, never having been children? It was especially weird since the character in question was an asexual adult so somehow creating a character that doesn't have sex as an adult, meant that I was implying that he had sex as a child (which he did not).
That’s a problem with me too. My fans on a story I make on Wattpad called The Star Covers want two of my characters in a lesbian relationship and I said that they were not going to be together and they thought I was homophobic but I’m not. Also I putted my favourite band Kiss in the story and they are like 40 years maybe older than the main characters because they are 10-11 when the series started and they are 14-15 this year but they want me to do some things with them and I can’t believe it!
I miss when the Warriors fandom was nice. It was just a group of animators, artists, songwriters, and fanfic authors sharing their love for books about cats. Nowadays it seems to be swimming in controversy.
I feel like the more child-friendly a show is the more toxic the fandom is. Like Cookie Run, I’ve never seen the other side of the game which is issuing with genders.
Reasons why I don't like to watch a lot of animation shows don't with other people who either already know the show or are on the fandom side of the show.
People take children's shows way too seriously these days. It's either the best thing ever that causes a toxic fandom filled with ships or "the worst" thing that every adult cartoon reviewer rants about for 3+ hours because of nostalgia blindness, like Peppa Pig
wth THERE IS A TOXIC FANDOM OF COOKIE RUN?!(8 good thing i was impatient for the download to complete lmao well... i did try to download it cause of my nice online friends dkjddj
A lot of these fandom toxicity stems from, in an observation, their entitlement and control on something they found something to be passionate about, but must have been shortsighted enough to not realize that they aren't the only ones who deserve both reprieve from 'everyday' reality and enacting on their passions; they aren't special. And that might set them off to defend, rant, harass or just outright apathetically do batshit things without any idea of the consequences of their actions, whether or not it's within and outside the fandom community.
Hi OP here. Just to add, share your passions kindly and if they aren't on board, just let them be. Most of the time, those who won't get on board don't hate it, it's just they're busy, already into something and don't want to fixate (....me), or may not have the means to find out about it. Thank you 💖
"Is an 18 year old an adult?" - "Yes" - "And they're responsible for their own choices?" - "Right" - "And you agree this character is 18?" - "Correct" - "So that means theeyyyyyy" - "Are a baby." Unrelated, but i've never laughed so hard at a cut away than that fucking running segment
@@lionrence not really, he's not wrong... any form of shipping is pretty cringe, because the shippers then tend to focus on that one aspect of hoping those characters get together, that they forget there's an actual story being told outside of that relationship. Let the writers decide the direction of the show, not idiots that think 2 people would be good together.
I wouldn't call that Toxicity. Its just speculating stuff for fun, Wich they have every right to do Its if they force their theory onto others it becomes toxic.
Or Plot: *shows minor inconvenience or a hole* That kind of fan: All of the writers and artists are idiots and should be lambasted on social media until they cry or quit.
I’m an artist, and as weird as it sounds, I don’t think I’d ever want to create a wildly popular thing. Having seen what fans do, I can’t imagine how a creator would feel. I’m sure many have grown accustomed to it but with my own mental illnesses, I likely would get hospitalized at least once out of stress. Small fanbases, or better yet NO fanbases are honestly the best. I’d give up fanfiction for sanity any day.
Maybe not quite the same but as a game developer I kinda feel the same way. Having a small chill community of people who follow my work sounds a million times more appealing than being a massive success and attracting the worst kinds of people. My anxiety over it has gotten so bad that I've been trying to figure out a way to publish something 100% anonymously to avoid getting doxxed, cause if I was ever the target of mass harassment I probably wouldn't live through it.
Shaun Dreclin Same here, I’m legit terrified about what could happen if I ever made something that caught lots of people’s attention and getting doxxed cuz I didn’t make so so’s ship canon. It’s scary world out there on the internet.
@@tamaradelgado8254 Just like in Hermitcraft Minecraft Series... Grian and Mumbo Jumbo's fanbase are so toxic that they literally threathened FalseSymmetry that they will unsubbed to her channel if she run for 'mayor' they are doing this because Mumbo is running for mayor and they just want Mumbo to win by default. Grian and Mumbo seems like they're pretty nice people they actually tried to fix it but their fanbase is just- Sorry for bad english by the way..
Remember when the Steven Universe fandom kept hating on this one girl because she drew Rose Quartz too skinny? She tried to kill herself because of all the hate she got.
Good thing that was like 2 years ago. But now we have Spinel x Steven shippers vs the people who think it’s pedophilia (or people who are aggressively loyal to Connie x Steven)
• Sunshine • some people say that it’s pedophilia bc spinel is literally thousands of years older than Steven, but some people do stuff based on a gem’s mental age since they’re immortal and stuff
I read a post on tumblr saying fatphobia isn't a thing, it's just a made up thing by snowflakes so they can have a "reason" to get triggered over. I WORSHIP THAT POST SO MUCH
"THINK OF THE CHILDREN" Trust me, no one was thinking of the children in the 90s and early 00s internet, and we turned out just fine. At 13 years old, I was very, very familiar with certain pornagraphic tropes, and my parents were pretty strict with my internet access and what I viewed. But I managed to find a way around their rules and supervision because THAT'S WHAT KIDS FREAKING DID. And I turned out normal. Never harassed anyone for shipping something I didn't, never freaked out over seeing something I wasn't keen on, never screeched at people how x character I liked was perfect and pure (they weren't, they were usually unhinged monsters), and just....10-15 years ago, you didn't DO the shit fandom is notorious for now. Like jfc. My ship wasn't canon? Guess I'll write fanfic and scour for obscure doujinshi then! Big freaking whoop!
I’m reminded of the time I asked my coworker what she thought of the oscars the night before and she said “I don’t really care about movies” and I, who gave too much of a shit and was ready to argue, found her answer so refreshing and beautiful that I felt my entire body relax. Taught me to calm the f down. Would recommend.
As a representative of the JJBA Fandom, I apologies to everyone that we have annoyed by our constant "Is that a Jojo Reference?" and "Watch Jojo", also how we dominate the comment section of music videos, I hope you can forgive us
Aw, that's sweet. I don't personally think those kinds of comments are that troubling tho, as long as they don't involve harrasing people for not doing so.
Also as a representative, don't join the fandom, because it's a cesspool. If you like Josuhan or Giomis you will be shot on site even though the former has Josuke in an canon adult appearance in the OVA iirc and the latter is a 3 year age gap between a 15 yr old and an 18 yr old, the equivalent of a sophmore dating a senior. But you know.
nah that's hilarious. I don't do it myself but i love seeing boomers getting mad that people can't appreciate "true culture" and only watch "silly japanese cartoons for losers" It's hilarious.
Just run around chucking phones with this video playing at people the next time you go to Mcdonalds. The cops will love that so much they'll take you into there office and give you cookies. They put you in there cheap hotel while they bake the cookies tho
ButterflyColors Most of these points are biased anyways, there’s arguments for all of these things regardless (especially any form of child porn being bad), don’t let one person on either side dictate what you think, you dictate what you think. Just try to understand too sides instead of what you’re simply informed by others
The YB fandom. When the creator was literally going to court for her and her partner allegedly doing something to someone, people cared more about the art of YB or wtf his name is than an actual victim.
A lot of the discourse around keeping children from nsfw also comes from this perspective of rigidly defining under 18 as child and over 18 as adult and there are always going to be teenagers looking for and watching porn and the harder we make it for them to access just means they'll be forced to find it through sketchier more potentially dangerous ways. Antis absolutely do not make minors safer from online predators imo, even if that's their intention.
The US has very black and white laws about what is and isn't appropriate for people under 18, because the US tends to have very black and white, right and wrong ideas around sexuality as a whole. The person creating the content tends to be held responsible for allowing their content be accessed by people who shouldn't have been looking it up in the first place. (Even if it's educational. Sex education in US schools is also unheard of or of poor quality when it exists.) I'm asexual and sex indifferent and because of this paranoia and black and white, right and wrong thinking found all across the internet, I avoid striking up platonic friendships with anyone younger than 24. Turning 27 made me acutely aware of how people in my age group might perceive me. US culture sexualizes everything while also simultaneously sexually vilifying everything.
THIS. I used to be in a discord group that had this mentality for a couple years in high school, and it was so bad that when my friendship with them ended it was partially because of this. I had turned 18 LITERALLY a month or two before, and I was explaining to what was normally a very LGBT-friendly group that I was bisexual homoromantic and just called myself a lesbian to simplify… I guess they felt threatened and were pressuring me to explain it. I was being vague about it because most of them were 16 or 17 and I was just TERRIFIED to explain how it worked since, y'know, it involves things to do with sex… I was 18, even though they were just my peers, I was terrified because suddenly they weren't my peers anymore. I was suddenly the adult, and I think those friendships at least partially ended because of the rigidness of the 18 line.
@@firefancy9928 and that too, the second part of what you said. My best friend who I've known for years is currently 17 while I'm 19… we met years ago back when we were both literally FNAF kids. I was 14 and she was 12… and it didn't matter back then, because we were both just FNAF kids and I liked her art. But since I turned 18 I've been nervous to be too overly public about how close we are… I can't wait until she turns 18 this fall just so it will be normal again. I've never had a single romantic interest in her… I literally just want her to be an adult too so I don't have to be afraid of people making assumptions anymore. People can be really quick to assume the worst.
@@CorinneStephens if it helps with something, not all places have laws as rigid as the US. For example in my country if you're in a relationship with someone under 18 as long as your age difference is less that 3 years nothing happens legally to you. Think they are called Romeo and Julliet laws .
I wasn't a sheith shipper but the voltron fandom made me so stressed with all the hatred going around I just wanted to enjoy the show and my ship and let everyone just do their own thing and enjoy what they liked as well
@@GabyGeorge1996 You mean it wasn't just me?! Thank heavens! It seemed like virtually everyone else in the VLD fandom who was critical of ships were complete a-holes! I felt very alone, knowing that I couldn't express any opposition to Sheith etc without people judging me.
Neverside Faerie Same here! Although I did and still do like some Shaladin ships like Shance and Shallura aged up, I had this not-good feeling with Sheith that I couldn’t post about since I was constantly hammered to be “positive” but it didn’t feel like it allowed my opinion in since I didn’t know if it was a toxic opinion to not like Sheith, even Plance for my reasons. I now still respect them as another fan, I do poke jokes and things ridiculous (like the socks for Voltron thing-) they do sometimes but not full blown harassment. I want to treat it like a discussion so people can take what I have to say seriously.
Neverside Faerie me too! I actually had so much faith that it would happened that I actually commissioned an artist to draw porn of them. My anger at the news that Shiro has a boyfriend was not directed at the fact that he was gay, but rather the fact that a pairing I’d sunk a 40 dollar commission into now had no chance in hell of happening; especially with fans rejoicing that he was Gay rather than pan or bi, and I couldn’t state my opinion without risking a lynch mob of pitchforks and torches
@ItsRxchel I'd argue that "technology rapidly happened, and people are still trying to process it". It's kinda like how the Industrial Revolution and the Enlightenment Era brought huge worldview changes as technology grew.
In a nutshell: *_"This is why we can't have nice things."_* After my experience on shipping wars and drama, I decided to stay at the surface- searching arts and theories but not reading comments, but only in popular fandom because more fans = higher chance of losing braincells. If people wrote or drew with controversial topic, then please always remember that it does not representing or showing of who the person is. When one finds it uncomfortable, then just leave because it's not worth to cause trouble, no one is forcing you to like it, unless when there's a misunderstanding- like forgot to add appropriate tags and warnings, which is when you should call them out for it. TL;DR: Whenever there's a problem, please just do it in civil way. There’s an example that is not related to fandom, but still related on toxicity: I remember when a person was upset about an artist for not adding gore warning in TH-cam, but then that person said shit like "They wasted talent in this", "This video deserves dislike" and such, and it's all because there isn't any warning. They could've gone with "Excuse me, I'm sorry, but I don't like the video because there's gore, and it would've been nice to add a warning," but hey, why not make things more complicated?! Well, welcome to fandom.
Oh my god I absolutely HATE IT when people say that someone "wasted their talent" on something they didn't like. Cause it's fucking dumb, a person wants to use their talents for gore and enjoys it then I don't see how it's a waste.
@@nepnep8444 I know there was this one animator using a more cartoon-y and tweeny animation style for a series they're working on and this one person was like "yOu'RE waStIng YOuR tALenT" but like, you need easier animation for a long term project like that and their talent isn't wasted just because *you* don't like it. Nobody is entitled to someone's talent. You're getting to basically watch an animated series for free and then complain about the art/animationstyle. Entitled much I'd say.
@@vickypedia1308 yeesh I was referring more to like NSFW artists since I find it common there but jesus it amazes me how entitled some people think they are to someone's talent
The same can be said for Video Game fandoms (although I had to admit, I am a part of some of them) like Rockstar's works and the Super Smash Bros. games. Rockstar when they are fixing everything for their online parts - Fans: How long are we gonna wait to play Grand Theft Auto VI? Rockstar Games: We can't rush art.
Other fandom people: THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE SHIP Me: What if we put Character 1 x Character 2! Oh oh! And what about Character 2 x Character 3!? Or even.... Character 1 x Character 3????
One time there was a Powerpuff Girls fandom on Sony Sketch or something, and some girl shipped herself with Boomer. Lets call her Person A. And then she got PISSED because some other girl (lets call her Person B) was ALSO shipping herself with Boomer. Person A told all her friends to confront Person B because 'Person A had Boomer first and he belongs to her.' OMG HE'S A FICTIONAL CHARACTER AND HE DOESN'T BELONG TO YOU. HE BELONGS TO CRAIG MCCRACKEN.
This reminds of I post I once made about the character All Might from BNHA, it was a poet just talking about how quickly he became one of my favorite characters and someone reblogged it with something like "all might is mine alone no one else's and I love him!"
*checks back in 2021* hehe ahaha uhhhh,,, yeah. (it's still pretty incredible how well this video holds up though, even in an ironic "you've got a big storm comin'" way. it's also interesting looking back on some of the media i was into at the time and how the way i look at art and authorial intent has changed. i may not have been involved in fandom in 2019, or now even, but these fandoms were still incredibly formative for me, if only as an example of what not to do.)
@@robertsimon2885 By referring someone as a "dumbass who gets mad over the littlest things." You're becoming what you dislike. In doing so, it becomes ironic.
Tbh, the worst way this entitlement manifests is in people who claim Ao3 is a terrible website for allowing things they're uncomfortable with. Ao3 is the thing we used to dream about back in the day. And you think it should start moderating what content can be there? You think Ao3 shouldn't allow x and y thing, but you know what would happen if they tried to get rid of it (which they never will because the website was literally built to hold even the grossest stuff)? People would fucking abandon ship, or at least anyone with any sense would. Learn your fandom history! This kind of thing never stops with what you personally think is morally objectionable and will always disproportionately affect marginalized creators. Your porn isn't safe just because _you_ think it's okay. Ao3 exists entirely because fandom learned the hard way, repeatedly, that all of it's okay or none of it is. You can either let the gross stuff exist in it's own little space, or you can try to get rid of it and end up with another purge and another mass migration to a different website that won't try to regulate people.
Lucas T, Ao3 is the best website (as long as there is proper tagging which you can call out people for not doing), if it ever gets destroyed there will be consequences, the same way Tumblr got destroyed and real MAPs fled to Twitter.
this! Now, sometimes I'll stumble into quite an... Interesting untagged fic, but at that point I just back out and keep searching. It's not hard to pick out what you want and ignore the other stuff.
Truth!! If you don’t like something, they have a thing called an exclude filter for that and AO3 is awesome for it! It lets anything and everything on it, if someone doesn’t like it, they ignore it
The voltron fandom was just mad, i mean when the creators even themselves said '' Klance wont happen, its not going to be canon'' and ''dont harras people over ships'' it didn't prevent from half of the fandom thinking Klance was going to be endgame or telling people to kill themselves over shipping sheith, shance or shidge
What angered me most was how many of them claimed to be standing up for LGBTQ representation; while simultaneously attacking LGBTQ people who didn't agree with them. Those people didn't give a crap about representation unless they got what they wanted out of it.
Klance was the most popular ship, I was okay with it at first but ever since i saw the toxic fans complaining about Klance not being in a Sheith, Allurance and Plance video/fanart they just made despise the pairing and since season 8 was receiving a lot of negative backlash for 'Klance not becoming canon' and 'Allurance being too forced', I have seen a Klance shipper complaining to Lance VA about Klance deserves better and i replied to them by saying that Klance isn't canon and that not everything is about them in Voltron ( Keep in mind, I wasn't being rude to this person at all ) till a lot of Klance shippers started attacking me, accusing me of being a toxic Sheith and Plance shipper which made me delete my comment and i blocked them because it was so hard to deal with toxic Klance shippers. I left the fandom for good because of them, I will always love Sheith till this day and i feel truly sorry for the creators of Voltron, they don't deserve this.
@@imgone1360 and the thing is voltron wasn't about romance, while I do agree allura and Lance's relationship came out of no where, we all knew klance wasn't going to be canon then the fandom had the nerve to say the creators queer baited when, when we had shiro who was gay or bi and married a man in the end. I also hated the fact people attack the creators for killing Adam because he was gay UwU, l I'm like hello he was in a war, it was always a possibility that he could die, and honestly the fandom hated him because of what he did to shiro, but when they found out he died, he was a pewious gay baby UwU, who didn't deserve to die and the creators were homophobic for killing him.
Damn, you totally nailed why people get so upset at anything in fandom that goes against what they believe. It IS because fandom is an escape, and we get protective of our “safe spaces.” What I think is especially interesting (and this is all from my POV) but I’ve been genuinely terrified to share my ideas online simply because I’ve seen OTHERS get smeared and doxxed over their [similar] takes. It’s a terrifying landscape because you’re far more likely to have someone disagree with you, and then come AFTER YOU FOR IT, than you are to find like-minded or even open-minded folks. :(
The history and psychology/neurology nerd in me speculates that fandoms are toxic since it's about a group of people with similar interests, but disagree with how similar interests are to be consumed or expressed, and all the psychological fallacies/biases that form as soon as groupthink and/or tribalism happens (it's in our genes to try to establish how a certain group or tribe is supposed to act, and I theorize that fandoms seem to be something like that to a larger scale, combined with all the positives and negatives of internet culture too). 🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓 I should also mention that I'm not going off of a study on this, but just off of thinking of what little I know of human history and psychology/neurology studies, and seeing how it'd be applicable to fandoms. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I agree, as a psych nerd, too. ;) I see many different facets of the behavioral spectrum when it comes to fandoms. The majority of the time, I sense a herd mentality, where people will wanna follow the popular opinion on something in order to fit in. Another huge factor is how the person was raised. What sorts of morals/ethics did the parents/guardians instill on their offspring and how much of that, if any, did said child take with them into adulthood? Since a TON of what makes us who we are was melded into us at a young age, it's easy to see where certain behaviors come from when expressed by an adult. It's only when we become aware of these traits that we're able to modify and/or change them to fit who we actually are. It's fascinating how much of our behavior was learned in childhood and became our "norm" in adulthood. I love the complexities of the human brain! :D
When I was 13, I made an original character that I shipped with canon character Levi Ackerman from Attack on Titan. I had multiple people on amino and TH-cam who would bash me for even mentioning my oc or sharing a drawing I did of them hugging. I remember one commenter on my channel (when all I really did was mention her name) said something along the lines of “This is TH-cam, not a fanfic site, if you want to share your opinion, go write a fanfic” As a 13 year old, I was hurt and discouraged from showing my character to anyone else online (unless they asked to see my art through private message on amino).
Everyone goes through that phase where they create an OC and ship them with their favorite canonical character. I did it, and I'm willing to bet the person who made the snotty comment on your channel did it, too. It's a little cringey, sure (kidding! XD), but it's also just harmless fun. There's no need for that kind of rudeness towards someone who is hurting no one and is just doing something that makes them happy. People need to chill and realize, too, that probably 99.9% of people who ship their OCs with canon characters are just kids. People should have been encouraging you and giving you *constructive* criticism instead of just crapping all over you like that. I know how much reading comments like that can sting; over the years I've gotten overwhelmingly positive feedback on all my drawings/fanfics, and yet I can *still* recall every word of the very tiny handful of negative comments I've gotten. It sucks, ngl, but I promise you that if you keep at it you'll eventually attract a community of people that will appreciate what you do. Please don't let the jerks of the world discourage you from doing what you enjoy :)
@@Spectra651 That was really sweet! Thank you so much It’s very encouraging to find someone who has had similar experiences and can now help others along their way. I hope to be like that too when I’m older. I think I was an especially sensitive and insecure kid when I got the negative comments (still am now but not nearly as bad), and it probably didn’t help that I was a bit anti-social. I think at the time I just wanted everyone to like me and saw rejection or negative comments that didn’t hold much weight as the worst thing in the world. Your comment made me smile so thank you, seriously.
The thing about humans is they are a strange group who fight each other a lot mostly because they don’t have anything else to fight cuz if they did they would fight them
Imma be honest: OCs aren't my cup of tea, but that doesn't mean I'll go around bashing people's ocs or people who ship their ocs with other characters, and other people shouldn't either. You do you fam, as long as you aren't hurting anyone. We all have our own way of enjoying our favorite series/games/etc and everyone should be allowed to do so.
FyrFlyr The whole Vic debacle is so ridiculous. These people are basically cultists, worshipping this man just because he voiced the main character of the greatest anime of all time (which FMAB is IMO), and completely ignoring the fact that the vast majority of his acts HAVE BEEN PHOTOGRAPHED. I actually met Monica Rial at a Comic Con about a week ago, and she told me the majority of bad press is basically Twitter (because of course it is), whereas she’s received no ill will at cons or even other social media platforms. So it could mainly be certain subsets of fandoms.
@@raycom201 Quite the opposite. All of the charges were just recently dismissed, and for some legal shenanigans he's unable to appeal; the judge even labeled him a public nuisance. So the only thing that has to be shown is Vic's thousands of dollars in legal fees.
@@Gemnist98 You sounds like you’re pretty bias and don’t know much about what’s happened. I’m neutral on it, but evidence points to Monica Rial and other involved are vindictive toward Vic and lies about what went down have come out into the open.
The most vocal part of the SU fandom calling pink diamond (a character that has been written to have been abused and have had actual abuse victims compare their similar stories) a literal monster because she had to learn to be a better person, and then decided she wanted a kid out of pure personal desire with no other motives, and then have Spinel be redeemed despite the fact she very much try to kill the entire earth (along with all three other diamonds) are a textbook example of people being toxic and refusing to think critically beyond what people tell them. You have a right to not like a character, I've come to near hate spinel because of the fandom, but dear god dont call them the literal devil and scream at anyone who doesn't agree with you.
Exactly. That first one you said happened with Catra in the she-ra fandom too. Sometimes antis take it so personally they make whole blogs dedicated to hating a character or a ship, it's insane.
I am one of those people - at least, up until “A Single Pale Rose” at which point I just rolled my eyes because the way they shoved the plot twist felt more like a last minute retcon… But it’s still valid for people to see her character a different way.
It’s because “social justice” became ingrained into fandoms especially shows like Steven Universe. Everything is black and white. People seem to think calling shippers Nazis is an acceptable form of activism
Tbh Social Justice is already written into the show itself because the showrunners are part of this movement. Same with 2018 SheRa. Of course it's those kind of people who'll be the loudest in the fandoms then.
@@Nutmeg- I think the issue isn't Social Justice. Condemning racism, Sexism ECT? All that is bad and should be condemned. The issue is when people, as the video says go after things that make them uncomfortable and such. And they make issues way more simplistic and black and white to demonize Rule 34 or Porn fics. With stuff like "This shouldn't be debatable, Rape and pedophilia is bad" to make anyone who writes those or defends their existence using the stuff in the video as secretly pedophiles or Rape Apologists.
I actually think it’s engrained in the Internet and how you can be anonymous on there and harass people, it’s a completely different thing to tell someone their bad in front of their face then on the Internet...
Exactly. I know that whatever I see, it's my fault for not being responsible. The person who posted the thing definitely didn't intend kids to see it. And most of the time, it's not even that bad, but that may just be me.
Children is a vague term relating to intelligence If you are a child You can be innocent and stupid Or you can be the direct opposite Either way. It’s a broad term
While we do need some "protect the children" culture, most of it isn't what we need. Making sure you guys don't see the naked figure from figure drawing studies done by artists like Rembrandt is not a problem. Making sure you guys don't see nitty gritty politics or moral outlooks is not a problem. You guys need to experience things to formulate your hobbies and opinions. The things that "protect the children" should be about is making sure you know the red flags of a child predator, and how to keep yourself out of compromising positions. A kid taking a naked picture of themselves for some online partner is not ok, regardless of what massive parts of the furry community would have you believe, because it still counts as child pornography and not only is the person receiving capable of getting in legal trouble, but so are you. Even if they're another kid, it's still consumption and production of child porn. But some communities don't treat it as a bad thing, and it absolutely should be. It puts you at risk of having your pictures leaked, of getting legal trouble, of getting your friend/partner in trouble, and so on. And it's not just about saying "this is bad, don't do it" but giving you the tools to know it for yourself. When I was young spending my time on the internet, I ran across Onisions channel, and because I didn't have any idea what gaslighting and inappropriate behavior in general was, I actually kept watching him. The whole scandal with him rating underage girls bodies on his forum? I watched those videos as a kid- maybe 11-12 years old, and an impressionable girl. It scares the shit out of me because I recall being sad that I couldn't put my pictures up there because I didn't own a phone. Kids aren't dumb, but they are a bit naive. I shouldn't have been told, "don't do this because it's bad" (and I clearly wasn't because I got into Onisions shit), but instead "here are some red flags and what these actions/conversations generally mean. Here's how to look out for a bad person by keeping an eye out for gaslighting, etc." I could've recognized that was a creator I wanted nothing to do with if O'd had those skills already developed or at least encouraged. I didn't until I started to get into more political circles, because I needed to know the terminology to explain political behavior and action that I didn't like. I would never have known better were it not for those circles, because my parents and my school never went over anything like that. I was a smart kid, in honors classes and so on. But kids need to learn critical thinking skills on the plane of social interaction more than anything, and not every child does until it's too late. That's why it is important that your social circles are polices a little bit by people who are older. I wish my parents had kept an eye on me, because I could've destroyed my life over a couple pictures sent to a deranged child predators forum before I ever knew he was a bad person. The things people police you over are useless- nude figure art, hobbies others find strange. None of that is what's important, and you're right that it is stupid. You can navigate what you do and don't like based on your own personality and ideas just fine. But there is cause to watch what you're doing in terms of other people, and that's not completely idiotic, because older people can manipulate you. Will they always? Of course not. The same time I was watching Onisions, I was also watching genuinely kind creators like Markiplier. But I couldn't differentiate for myself and it's almost a certainty that most kids, just like myself, have some blind spots too. Not every precaution is to ruin your life- some are legitimately necessary. Make sure you're talking to people you trust about the circles you are in- it'll save you grief later.
For the third time in this reply section so far, exactly. I'm out here writing small essays and shit in the comments section of videos like this, and I go around on the internet looking for weird fucked up shit as a hobby, yet no matter what there never ceases to be somebody advocating for internet censorship, as if you could even do that in the first place. To be fair, I'm 16 at the time of writing, but according to them it's 18+ or GTFO anyway.
Omg thank you, it's like people want everyone to be *child friendly* "Wow your 18 and have everyright to look at porn, well too bad my child is more important and you should be treated like a child too -_-"
A few years ago i was underage too but i wasnt fragile enough to get uncomfortable at a ship between a 16 year old and an 18 yearold because i had enough brain cells to know its not real. I saw some one screaming about ships between an adult character and a minor character because she role played as the minor one ,once, with an adult and got uncomfortable bc the person got sexual, nothing even happened. Maybe u shouldnt role play as a character shipped with an adult , with an ctual adult. Maybe u should be smart enough to know that as a kid u should perhaps not trust all adults to be cool and role play with them when u know u will be role playing as a ship??? I swear, these people dont think for themselves.
Im a minor and I honestly don't care anymore. Like if people want to draw sexual drawings or read fanfictions that are sexual, go ahead. Like fandoms needs to calm down, if a child uncovers something they don't want, oh well. And dont get me started on minor and adult ships, ive gotten in way too many fights over this topic
It's like taking an amusement park and getting rid of all attractions except the baby train and carousel. Adult people aren't allowed to have fun I guess.
I had a horrible experience with a toxic fandom, and to this day, I'm still shaken up. I don't know if I should share it here, but if someone wants to hear it, I'll tell. I was into the ninja turtle fandom, and I really liked this person's art. I remember commenting "I love your art, even if it is for a ship I'm not fond of". The fandom blew up at me and told me I was "a selfish idiot" and that I should kill myself. I told them that I understood why the comment could be perceived negatively, but they took it way too far. I was banned the next day. Btw: I was like 14 years old when this happened. Edit: Thank you for all the supportive comments, you guys really made my day 🥺♥️♥️♥️
Yoo wtf... that's so messed up. All you did was compliment that person's work. If anything, that should be a MAJOR compliment, the fact that you enjoyed the art piece despite it not being your favorite ship. Hell, I know I would be honored to recieve a comment like that on ANYTHING I made. That's a top-tier compliment imho. Now that you mention it though, I remember seeing artists on Tumblr ranting about "I don't ship it but I like it" comments. They were whinging over how "its offensive cause you're like,, invalidating my ship" which is obviously not true. It was one of the stupidest things Tumblr has ever complained about, a freaking COMPLIMENT. One of the many reasons I've left that godforesaken site. Anyways I'm so sorry that happened to you, people can be such assholes and don't think about what they say before saying it. I hope you're doing better now, or at least better compared to then.
Bruh I was accused of being a racist homophobic pedophile for shipping these two ADULT MEN and making a fanart of them. Like bruh wtf. They kept tagging one of them as transgender (even though canonically he isn't but I don't really care if they make him trans) but damn they were mad I drew him in a gay ship with a dude. Like fuck calm down.
That's horrible! They're the worst. You are precious and beautiful, not everyone is able to cheer on an artist that focuses on a ship they don't like. Also, from an artist's heart, please keep leaving nice comments on people's art. It really makes our day and of this one can't appreciate it, too bad for him 💙💙💙
I think a Huge thing is control. People think (even just subconsciously) of fandom as their safe space, their escape, their “let’s forget about real life and chill” - and they want to *control* that safe space, not just because it’s Theirs, but bc there is so much, online and offline, that is simply not controllable. People *want* to have control over their fandom, they want it to be cozy and happy and everything that is good for them - but so many people go about trying to achieve that control by attacking and harassing others. “That hurts me” or “I think that could hurt me!” leads to essentially a territory war, like cats hissing and marking. “You did this, in my space, so you are awful and need to leave forever!” There’s no way to directly physically attack someone online (thank fuck!) so turf wars are fought through reputation, harassment, bullying, essentially posturing - anything one can do to make “the threat” go away The trouble is even if some harassment campaigns “work”, there will always be other “threats”, because of the nature of the internet. It is completely natural to want an escape, and to want to control your safe space, but this is an inherently flawed method of doing it! Instead of achieving any quiet or away time, it creates a cycle of the opposite. Again going back to the cat defending territory metaphor (now that I’ve thought of it I think it’s spot on and brilliant), this is a cat who spends all their time driving away threats, from all sides, and never having any time to enjoy what their territory can give them - food, shelter, rest, fun, etc I don’t know how to like convince all of the internet “hey what your doing is harmful to you and everyone else” Cause like coming at someone and saying “you’re wrong” causes instant defense and “I’m not listening bc I can’t be wrong” even offline - the convo can’t start that way! Even if it’s accidentally implied it could set someone off into defense. There surely a way but at the moment by brain is too tired You did good video
I am a multishipper but I don’t ship Shiro and Keith because I just can’t help see it as brotherly but I wouldn’t harasses someone for shipping something a lot my ships are hated because people see them as bad
I've always felt that it's because most of these people had life too easy, and never had the kind of struggles that other people had. This caused them to mature at a **much** slower rate, and can't really differentiate reality and fiction. Just look at the recent thing with the Velma show: I've watched people get into these 400 reply arguments over the sexuality of a fictional character. She's NOT EVEN REAL, and in some shows she's straight, while others she's gay or bi. But then you got people on both ends accusing each other of being terrible people, and throwing insults. I don't care who thinks they're morally superior because they got I to a fight over the sexuality of a fictional character, but it's REALLY WEIRD to get into an argument over something so dumb. This kind of behavior is why fandoms like the star wars community is still perceived as adult children throwing tantrums.
No those are people who somehow couldn't adapt to a maybe worse situation than before and decided to be a psychopath from that day on because "I didn't know my life would get worse"
It's the issue of people wanting a win. Because you're right, it doesn't matter. At all. That's why it's fought over because people want something they feel they control or can win at. It's why people get really pissed over small things and ignore the big ones. They want a battle they feel is winnable because the big ones don't feel that way. This is the crux of cancel culture. Attack something small you think you can control and influence, because giant corporations sure don't care. Political groups don't care. But that one person who drew some fetish porn over something ? Tear them a new one, especially if they are a small creator. Either because it's redirection or people get a bee in their bonnet over because it is fictional and not hurting anyone (beyond maybe wanting eye-bleach) it's attackable. No consequences, no real stakes. Except to make someone feel terrible which is the entire goal. Not for actual change or helping anyone. Just gratification over making someone feel shitty because the real people doing truly shitty harmful things, they're generally untouchable.
Ruby Y. i was in hetalia before becoming a shipper and i didnt interact with any fans so that show is still mediocre to me, whereas voltron is not that because i interacted with the fans and had a ship. it sucks that they ruined it for me. i liked that show till the last season.
The thing people need to learn, is self-awareness and empathy. Because the moment they realize that other people have other opinions and feelings on something and understand WHY, then they'll be able to avoid that kind of toxic behavior. The coping mechanism of fandom stops being a coping mechanism if it's bringing personal stress.
"Just because a person consumes problematic, fictional porn does not mean that they want to go outside and commit atrocities." If more people understood this and spoke about this (and more young people had access to proper and safe sex education) then younger people like my past teenage self wouldn't have to suffer for years in silence, thinking that they are absolutely horrible people and hating themselves for not understanding their own sexual thoughts.
That's the thing about porn, really: there are plenty of people who don't like it, and it's not exactly hard to understand why that is. But just because they dislike it doesn't mean it's bad; it's very similar to swearing, actually: a friend of mine doesn't like when people swear, and because he doesn't understand, he thinks that swearing is inherently "bad". He even complained once about someone swearing in a text that clearly was NOT meant to be sent to him, so there was really no reason for him to get upset about it, but that's besides the point. Both porn and swearing are things that make certain people uncomfortable, but some people are too stupid to realize that this doesn't automatically make these things bad.
I had arguments about that topic with others. I asked them "do you believe videogames cause violence?" then they answered "no, that is different". Bunch of idiots.
People ship Toadette and Peach because of Super Mario bros U since Peach gives Toadette a slight kiss on the head. People were like "Omg Peach is bi" and I got called a homophobe
Thank 👏 you 👏 I was trapped in an abusive relationship and sexually assaulted as a teenager; as a coping mechanism, I read problematic ships, abusive stories, or even rape fanfics. I still do. It has helped me work through my trauma. Edit: thank you for your support :) it’s nice to admit that and not be shamed for one
I am one of those people who doesn't understand "how?" Not to demean someone's experiences, I've honestly been just curious, how did it help when some fan works or other entertainment can seem so scarring sometimes. Because I thank god haven't experienced that in my life as of now. I don't fully understand how it could work as a positive coping mechanism. It's horrible what you and so many other had & have to go through..... If soneone were comfortable enough to at least partially explain their point of view, that would be helpful..
THE Berrby tbh I’m not entirely sure myself. I think it’s the relatability of the characters, the comfort of feeling like I’m not alone, but the safety of knowing that it’s fiction. For me, if there was a disclaimer that the fanfiction was based off of someone’s personal experience, then it immediately went from something therapeutic to something distressing.
@@theberrby6836 Fanfics were mostly written for kink purposes with little to no realistic backgrounds whatsoever. Also as someone who's nearly sexually abused, I don't necessarily mind them since 80% of the fanfics makes no sense and some are admittedly amusing due to the way they are badly written. Of course when some gets very realistically graphic, that's where I have to put my phone down and process (but again, that's not necessarily bad as it's not something to be shield away from any victims just cuz truama imo).
THE Berrby it’s kinda like how abuse survivors are extremely more likely to find themselves in abusive relationships compared to the rest of the population. It helps the brain recontextualize, reliving it in a safe and non threatening way for the body and mind to move past said experiences
@@lurji I'm very similar. My absolutely favorite things to read are Yandere Guy stories. The more aggressive, dominating, innocent "rival" killing and Stockholm Syndrome-y the better. Sadly hardly anything I find under that subject fits my standards for writing so I've thought about just writing my own for my fix. Lol And I only enjoy it with characters from anime. Even my original stories I see my characters like an anime. I don't really like stories like this from real life movies. Once it involves real people i get uninterested unless it's a high fantasy story like pirates, elves or something not real life and mundane. Lmao
Remember when SU fans kept hating on the girl who drew Rose Quartz too skinny? She ended up attempting suicide because of all the hate she got. When those people found out, they leaked the hospital she was staying at and called in the further berate her.
And it was Tumblr that did it. Tumblr culture is out of fucking control. They're 4Chan for white 20-something Liberal college women who want to feel spesho and appropriate social justice to be about them.
The world is on fire. Fandom is the last place some people feel they can control. It has gotten so bad I don't even make fanfiction anymore out of fear of harassment.
This might be my cranky bias, but half of these people come across as just being on a pure, unfiltered power trip, and the other half come across as younger people who've been over-indulged, such that they believe that their tastes, morals, and preferences are the *only* tastes, morals, and preferences.
I've noticed among pro-shippers is that they say they are pro discourse but support the most ghastly things and are actually for deplatforming of 'bigots'. Shippers tend to be crazy, but the fact so much cannibalism occurs among these two is entertaining. However, it doesn't bode well for casual observers and critics of content like myself. I'm an adult, I can deal with 'problematic' things. The minute these idiots think they can pitch a clearly dark theme or action as flowery, they deserve criticism.
@@blacktigerpaw1 Stop spreading misinformation about proshippers who literally just don't want people to be harassed over fiction. You're trying rationalize harassing people over things you find "icky" and think thats ok? You wanna talk about how proshippers "cannibalize" each other, how about anti's that send death threats to CHILDREN because they liked "problematic" fiction? Sending gore pics, ACTUAL CSEM, not to mention the blatant harassment and disregard of trauma and CSA victims that make up the majority of the proshipping community. The majority of us have no association in "normalizing" pedophilea, incest or abuse and actively shoo out any pedophiles that try to associate with us. You antis deliberately frame it that way to get supporters to harass us. We can't tag our content anymore because antis will deliberately lurk in tags to make "call out" posts and harass us. Kids, parents and artists have been doxxed by your community, antis have literally ignored and DEFENDED predators and rapists that have been outed in the anti community, your puritanical ways has caused suicides and multiple suicide attempts. The sooner people realise your community is the true cancer of fandom and can see through your puritanical propaganda, the better everyone will be.
This is why I’m just a lurker in fandoms. Aside from posting OC fanfiction, I hardly ever interact with fellow fans unless I think I can say something that there’s a 95% chance no one will be mad.
Obviously, in fandom, the characters aren't "just" characters- they mean a lot to people despite their fictional nature- but the most toxic parts of fandom seem to forget that they still are characters. They attack and defend characters as if they're real people. Like, in the latest season of Sex Education there's this character who interferes with one of the main ships ever so slightly, and now you can't go to a Sex Ed related video without someone in the comments saying "I hate him. I'm going to push him down a flight of stairs. " And there's clearly a line between those who are saying it jokingly because he's dragging out the obviously intended narrative and those who are saying it seriously because they feel personally offended that this fictional human is standing between two other fictional humans they care about. It's fine to care about stories, its great even. But when your care for a story starts to morph into real world hostility (like sending death threats to actors who in no way are the same as their characters **coughcough*STARWARS*coughcough**), then thats a problem. You can't take fandom too personally. It basically comes down to the same thing she said in the video: Fandom doesn't belong to you personally, and when you start acting like it does, thats when things get toxic.
I choose to believe that the simple answer is this: society is filled to the brim with overgrown children who have no respect for others and firmly believe that it's acceptable to act in a disrespectful manner without any fear of possible consequences.
So one thing I've personally noticed I' 27, I've had access to the internet from around the age of... 9? When I was younger my perception of the internet was well it was mostly for adults, but there were some spaces that were for me (We're talking like... Neopets and like the 'Kids account approved' sections of AOL) but yeah through my early-mid teens on the internet I was basically under the assumption most people were older than me and that well the internet was more for them than me.And that well if a sign said DO NOT CLICK I probably shouldn't. I wasn't that involved in fandom during this time, but also the internet was less open. For example this was when Livejournal and Forums were like how you connected to fandom, a livejournal or a forum is like pretty easy to lock down and you can keep your distance and probably like reduce the risk of someone stumbling into your content who disapproves. Or to keep minors away from 18+ content (I mean I know people ignored those signs anyway but you know). But then social media really kicks off, the internet is then hyper connected The switch to Tumblr. Well in short TUMBLR IS SHIT FOR KEEPING CONTENT CONTAINED. Reblogging is a great feature, however tumblr doesn't really have that many controls for you to keep your work contained, tag blocking only works if people remember to do that and for ages on tumblr you needed a third party app to do it. So I can see where some frustration comes from because yeah it can be kind of hard to keep unwanted content off your dash or out of a tag. Tumblr hasn't got much of an age lock either so you know it's a pain in the ass to keep younger users away from adult content and for adult tumblr users to have their own space where they can engage in fandom without being yelled at by teenagers or being told to 'go do ur taxes' Fandom also just seems to skew 'younger' to me these days, like a lot of accounts from teenagers when on tumblr especially, which I think has def increased over time. I also notice this in some 'discourse' spaces. And like at the risk of sounding old, a lot of teenagers basically well haven't learned good reasoning/debate skills or seem to be into stuff for the sake of 1.trolling 2.some sort of attempts at moral superiority (see for example what happens with a lot of 'transmed' discourse or 'ace discourse, I've seen a lot of shit in there that's basically obviously people thinking these topics are a fun game and them wanting to 'own'people and not it actually being born out of any sense of actual care about the issue,) Basically people want to be edgy and need an outlet so I guess why not use the internet? There's def a 'culture' I've noticed of basically being an 'edgy asshole' for fun. Also yeah I see a lot of stuff where you have people in my 'generation' as it were and 'fandom olds' who are like well just existing online and doing like what you've always done in fandom like you know the whole DON'T LIKE DON'T LOOK rule and what not. And then it's usually people say up to around age 21 who seem to be on the EXCUSE ME YOU BETTER MEET MY STANDARDS, ALSO US YOUNGER TUMBLR USERS OWN THE INTERNET NOW AND FANDOM AND YOU MUST DO IT THIS WAY OR ELSE YOU ARE BASICALLY SATAN
I 100% agree on these discourse people. Kids who cannot decide on their genders or identities will call women who don't think transwomen are women 'bigots', and are in favour of deplatforming. They usually are in favour of really, really nasty content 'because it's just fiction', but are against guys like Shadman. So you can draw child porn, write rape or whatever as normal, but don't be Shadman. *Then* you're problematic. I don't care if characters are aged up and getting gangbanged. It'd be weird, but they're depicted as adults. The minute I ask these people why they are thinking of fictional kids getting rammed up the butt, I'm an anti, or something.
Unpopular opinion: It's a big deal because toxicity can affect the writers. The fandom harasses the writers so bad that the writer feel obligated to acquiesce to whatever the fandom wants so they don't have to feel the fandom's wrath. Many instances where people have gone so far as to threaten the writer because their ship wasn't canon or the story didn't go a certain way. It's sick honestly.
I've seen some shows give into toxic fandoms and it upsets me. I know they need to make money, and to do that, they need to please the fans, but... I'd rather they just told the story they intended to from the start, even if that means upsetting people. Telling an artist or a writer that they "did something wrong" in their work is really disrespectful to the hard work and thought that went into a creation.
Constructive criticism is fine, but harassing creators because something didn't turn out how *you* wanted it to is rude. Isn't this what fan fiction was supposed to be for in the first place? To satisfy people's imagination and fantasies of how *they* wanted the story to go, regardless of the canon events?
The best fandoms are the older ones that have had time to settle, long after the initial show ended
The best fandoms are the older ones that have had time to settle, long after the initial show ended.
Trust me I know from experience
Eddsworld vibes tho
I heard that happened to a show called rwby, i heard the fandom pressured the writer into making two characters a lesbian couple
"Don't like, don't read." Man do I miss the days of this simple, simple phrase.
Edit: I left this comment a year ago and yall have been brawling in the sub comments.
What I mean as someone who has been in fandom spaces since the early 2000s, the term "dont like, dont read" in regards to fanfic was another form of reaffirming the tags for a story.
I dont like reading stories with gore.
Someone labeling their tags or ending their summary with "if you cant handle or dont like gore, dont read" was an early form of a trigger warning online.
Sure, people have misused the phrase in recent years to get away with disgusting things. That deserves criticism.
It wasnt intended to be "no criticism plz" , it was a checkpoint and warning.
Since yall got so argumentative about this- I'd hate to see how yall would have reacted to the citrus scale, another common rating system.
Bees bees
I still do that. If I see a fanfic that has something that I won’t like, then I skip it
@@geomeopeoleo1740 I wish more people did that, especially nowadays.
Midnight Sonnet Does it count if I’m reading it to make fun of it personally and laugh at how bad it is, without saying anything to the creator?
Thing is, as someone who's been involved in various fandoms since the early 2000s - there has always been drama. Does nobody remember Harmonians and Harry/Draco slashers? Cassandra Clare's BNF club? MsScribe? Fans of classic Doctor Who getting confused and upset by post-2006 Doctor Who fans for bringing shipping into fandom? Zutara vs Kataang? The original Twilight backlash? Fandom_Wank and other LJ drama communities existed for a reason.
One can argue about just how vitriolic the fandom has gotten, but the drama has always been with us.
But how will I like it if I haven't read it? And what if I'm a critic and was given a job to critique that certain thing? Or what if I'm reading/watching for a reason other than the story/animation/action.. etc.?
Its so ironic that the very people who try to protect the "children" are the ones making fandoms toxic.
Because “the children” are and have always been used as a convenient cop-out trump card people pull to instantly justify whatever their personal opinion is, no matter how flimsy the logic. If their argument doesn’t have much going for it & they don’t want to bruise their fragile ego by being proven wrong, this kind of person will exploit “protecting the kids” as much as possible, because that way they figure they CAN’T be in the wrong. After all, that means that anyone who disagrees hates kids, and only a complete monster hates kids! /s
Yup.... i guess
Notice how most of the people who make that argument either don't have children or have little to no experience with them
@@ggudjsgaming5650 your friend is probably (not sure, maybe) a bully
@aquamarine ancient soul
Not exactly. Yes they're PART of the problem, but they're not the sole problem.
The funny thing about the Entrapta thing is she's autistic coded meaning any person who says she can't be shipped is literally saying autistic people are too childish/too innocent to be in a relationship which as an actual autistic person actually is funny and hurts all at the same time, which is how Ableism usually goes I guess...
god yep
Yeah when I saw the sarcastic “child-coded” pop up in the video I could feel myself getting angry too. Like… I haven’t even seen the show and that’s *still* viscerally upsetting.
Plus she’s like 30 she can kiss whoever she wants
Never watched the she-ra reboot but aiblest people are loosers (this is from someone whit autism)
I feel like the real problem is that they're all teens/young adults and ENTRAPTA'S 30!
Do you remember when John Watson got happily married to a woman and the fandom ridiculed her actress because they wanted him to be gay with Sherlock? Fans are toxic
@@blacktigerpaw1 it doesn't matter if they were baited or not, nobody has the right to harass an actor because something in the show happened they didn't like. Complain to the producers if you want change
@@HestyThrones I agree. But shippers *did* go after the showrunners for it. Even when the showrunner was *gay*.
@@judeconstantine2767 not all of them
@@drisspinker ALOT of them...oh boy, ALOTTA LOT of them. RWBY, anyone? :D
@@judeconstantine2767 This is a very bad generalization. Please don't assume that because it's not true. I don't ship Johnlock, I am part of the LGBTQ+ community and I don't do that. And I know lots of people in the community who don't do that either. It's like saying all white people are problematic or or catholics are problematic.
Please reconsider this view.
This is why I deleted Amino 2 hours after getting it.
I just don't join fandom communties. That's what usually makes me leave. I'm on food ones and writing ones
I used to use Amino. I saw two sides of the spectrum. In the Undetale Amino, shippers were running rampant causing ship wars because they thought this character needed to be with that one. On the other hand, I was also there when Godzilla Amino banned all non-canon ships. So yeah, that app is a ride.
Same with Persona 5 Amino
I’ve never had a problem with amino besides this one bitch who was toxic AF
I blocked her, got everyone who also was being harassed by her, and we all just was like “make sure no one cares about what she post and maybe she’ll leave the community”
So yea, there was that
DUDE SAME. LIKE LEGIT.
*Breathes deep*
Oh yeah. That hits the spot.
This is an excellent video! I've seen how these fandom mindsets have made it so people don't want to interact with fandom at all, or killed their passion for the thing itself, and that's so upsetting. The vitriol aimed at content creators in fandoms is especially so insulting and demoralizing.
Thank you Tennelle! TwT AAAA!
And YES! I've got a white-knuckled grip on my current fandoms, but there have been times when I've really considered just...dropping everything like a hot potato. It can be so stressful. Hopefully someday we won't have to feel like we're walking on eggshells all the time. Until then, I'm sending good vibes and hot cocoa your way (and to anyone else who reads this comment and could use 'em).
TennelleFlowers like how most of Voltron fans make me weary
i vibe with your comment so much
I'd probably be interested in Avatar if the fanbase just wasn't so toxic it killed any interest I may of had in the series.
@@bretginn1419 no
NO
The avatar fanbase was toxic too? NOOO SAY IT AINT SO THIS HAS SPOILED MY EVENING
Fandoms become toxic when people become so obsessed with a show that they take any criticism of it as an attack on them
True that.
attack on fandoms
how to sum up toxicity in just a few words.
True. Whenever someone types something wrong about a game/show respectfully, those toxic fans just create a big argument.
Thats why I love PvZ and Polytopia fandom
Remember when a crewniverse member was attacked by the Steven universe fandom for how she portrayed Lapis and Peridot's relationship? And how she felt she had to leave the show because of how much harassment she got? Because I do.
Oh, I remember. What was her name? I can’t find it.
@@nkbujvytcygvujno6006 Their name was Lauren Zuke (their current name is Jesse Zuke).
my god, really?
Oh... yeah, thank you.
Dont let that distract you from how a woman portrayed Rose Quartz skinny instead of fat and Tumblr drove her to borderline suicide.
Before discovering online fandoms: "I wish there were other people I can talk to about X"
After discovering online fandoms: "I TAKE IT BACK I DON'T WANT TO TALK TO THESE CRAZY BASTARDS!! I just wanted to tell people who my favorite character was."
Sadly this is relatable haha
Indeed, relatable.
I was in the Undertale fandom and once accidentally said, that a female character who's a gay would (if she wasn't gay)make a cute couple with another guy.
Yeah, I was called a homophob for weeks after that.
Yeah that’s why I don’t share any of my presences. Mostly since it’s not the main in most fandoms
The reason I almost never watch any show in the universe ever.
@@milkbeforecereal7064 You can watch a show without being involved in the fandom
*Voltron ship wars PTSD intensifies*
Have you ever heard of the SMG4 fandom?
@@empoleon7750 Oh God no don't remind me of thst
Sorry.
But you can see the similarities, right? I may not watch Voltron, but I have heard all the talk about shipping-related disputes. And what I know is that both fandoms really do have a startling penchant for making up pedophilia problems.
my first thought
200th like
If you ship, you ship. But if you shove shipping in someones face, or shoving anti-shipping in people's face, then something is wrong with you
Yes but some are illegal or morally wrong like in fnaf people ship William and glitch trap which is just William’s soul so that’s morally wrong and probably ileagle and micheal x ennard which is micheal dating his murderer that is a animatronic mix of multiple animatronics which includes his sisters soul but the change up the ships as glitch trap being Williams fan made brother which is still illegal or morally wrong and to change it to make the Michael ship correct is by making it not a mix and just having it as a random scraped animatronic and have it were the animatronic doesn’t have his sisters soul and adds a fan made soul most of the time called Noah witch is of correct age and Michael is a walking corpse so this series isn’t made for shipping after all the insanity begins
@@fourrouge3471 If the ship is morally wrong, of course call it out. But don't use that bad ship as a scapegoat to shame others and generalize every ship as bad. Anti-shipping and toxic shipping are in the same boat.
@@fourrouge3471 I don't care what people ship end of day they're are fictional as long they're don't force they ship on people through pressure writers and ship real people.
@@fourrouge3471 Simple. Don't eat the dead dove. Leave it for whatever weirdos like dead doves, and continue about your day. Block it if it bothers you that much. Because believe it or not, you don't have to go on a moral crusade over five nights at freddy's shipping.
I just re found this comment and apparently I wasn’t thinking correctly because this is just shoving anti shipping in someone’s face
Video on toxic fandoms: *steven universe*
Me, an SU fan: Yea that's pretty accurate
Estrella congrats, want a cookie or something?
Estrella cool
Kale 23 I’m not annoyed or pissed or anything XD I’m just being snarky
Estrella my cookie comment was supposed to be like; “welcome to the club, so have the rest of us” I see how it could be taken the wrong way, but I wasn’t intending to be rude
Yeah honestly its pretty intense
"child-coded" my brain cells have just committed scooter ankle
poodle on my noodle I love this
Scooter ankle is horrible. I’m so sorry
man, as someone who generally rolls in anime circles the idea of people getting that upset over a character just being child "coded" is fucking wild. I'm not saying that people taking anime's sexualization of kids (or characters who look and act like kids but are *totally* 800 years old) in stride is a good thing, I'm just saying boy does the general fandom not care at all.
I thought there was a post from the creators about her being autistic which would make the assertion of her being 'child-coded' offensive in and of itself.
For me it's toe chair leg.
This year in my country there was a controversy where a girl during the national end of high school exam wrote an interpretation of a poem. Her interpretation was rejected and she failed her exams due to that. BUT it tourned out that her interpretation was correct... according to different examinators. So basically, it was a coin toss between 0 points and max points. I think that indefinetly proves why teaching us that there is one "correct" way to interpret something is bullshit if even people who teach us how to do that can't agree on a proper interpretation.
,,, Toin coss?
@@ladylaurel5941 50/50 wheter you get the guy that will accept your interpretation or one that will not
Eezel Draco *Coin Toss
@@theghostinthemirror8158 ... I think I should see an eye doctor since I thought that was "coin toss"... twice
@@d-chan4357 Same, I was like "why are you correcting him?", And then I looked at it again and felt stupid.
Good thing I'm apart of the Garfield fandom, where the only discourse is nermal's existence
so fucking based
Lucky.
this made me smile we love to see that
I love this
@@herobrine3245 Fr tho
It's not: "you're wrong" it's: "i disagree" that's how you do it
Sometimes things are factually incorrect though
ghostchilie like incest
Ice Heart and rape
Things like rape and incest aren't 'factually wrong' though? I think you guys are mixing up factually with morally.
The video explains why there's nothing wrong with people exploring those themes, and for many people who've suffered those sorts of traumas (like myself), fanworks like that are helping to deal with our trauma...
@@MK-ophelia i am sorry for you i hope your life is now better😢🤧😞🤲🥺❤
The funniest things are the 17 year olds who yell at chill bsfw artists for making them uncomfortable
The art was tagged as "nsfw" . U wouldnt find it unless u searched for it.
In their defense a LOT of people don't even bother tagging it as NSFW, or adding the 🔞/18+ emoji. Most of the time it gets shoved in their faces whether they wanna see it or not.
Not saying people aren't allowed to make NSFW of course, that's their thing. But most of them can't be bothered to warn people and *that's* what pisses the kiddos off.
@@izzy1356 I can understand being uncomfortable and angry whenever I see something I don't like but demanding creators to off themselves is an overreaction that needs to stop. Harrassment is NOT the answer in that situation. Blocking and walking away is.
Watching you lie in that chair makes me very uncomfortable. As a person who sits in chairs, this is a personal offense to me an I'm questioning your character since you so brazenly attacked my sensibilities.
i enjoyed the sloth look, fits well with the overall theme of the video
"There's a common thread here and it's comfort"
*sits very uncomfortably*
I disagree completely. As someone who regularly finds myself positioned uncomfortably on chairs, I loved this representation and your discomfort makes me uncomfortable. Thus you’re morally wrong.
You are both wrong and stupid. As a chair stander, I am offended that you would even think of using a chair in such an unholy way. Standing is the only way to go; it's my way or the highway.
All of you are wrong... CHAIRS.ARE.BEDS.
I hate when people say “child coded” for characters like Entrapta and Peridot. It clearly comes out of ableism because they are not children, they are neurodivegent. Saying an autistic character is “child coded” is saying that neurodivegent people are children.
The general idea of something be “XYZ coded” makes it to where you are flattening an entire character to one word
If that’s not insulting the character itself then what is?
Considering the number of people that tell autistic people that can't actually be autistic because they can do simple things like "doing simple tasks" or "holding a conversation" shows how little people actually know about it. But considering what kind of awareness groups we got, it's amazing it's not worse.
Didnt she talk in the video about different interpretations not being wrong. Unless the character is explicitly stated to be neurodivergent theres really no issue with calling them “child coded”, because that’s just their interpretation of the character.
@@nocturnis1900in case you missed it, its an interpretation that is often only made to construct a battering ram against others. It's posited as a fact that everyone simply knows. and insisted that those that don't agree with the interpretation are potential child predators
@@pandoratheclay that's not only insulting the character but the very writer of said character as well
I just watched a video about how fandoms become toxic, and am instantly reminded of how people are like when supporting political parties. I guess political parties and fandoms aren’t too far off from one another.
What gets me is all the people talking about the behaviors in "toxic" (terrible overused word for the record) fandoms as if they're something new, and/or unique to fandoms. They're really not, this shitty behavior has existed within every possible grouping of human beings since the dawn of time. One of the most classic examples is religious attitudes towards orthodox versus unorthodox beliefs. "This is the only true interpretation of the Bible and if you disagree, you're not a REAL Christian and you will burn in hell!" is really NOT that far off from "This is the only true interpretation of these fictional characters and if you disagree, you're not a REAL fan and you should kill yourself!", if you really think about it. Humans just fundamentally suck.
@TheThrashyOne
Pretty much what I was thinking throughout the whole video. Hell, there've been psychological, neurological, societal, historical, and even archaeological studies out the wazoo that go into bad human behavior, along with other high intelligent species such as dolphins.
There's probably buttloads of research that could go into toxic community/fandom actions, but I doubt that people would have the patience to go into a bunch of scientific journals and methods on that...
I think back to when fandoms themselves are political and depending on which side you’re on they won’t be very willing to take you in.
Honestly shipping is fine
But shippers tend to be the most toxic part of their fandoms
Shippers need to separate head canon and actual canon
Forcing the creator to make your ship canon kinda missed the plot
Anti shippers are just as bad.
@Lin Raggar I'm not sure I get what your trying to say?
If you don't want to explain you don't have too just wanted to say that
@Lin Raggar I see.
I can see your point, however I do not think Anti-Shipping is good or "Justified" in either scenario. Guilt by association is bad, and using the fact some shippers are Crazy to bash Shipping or Shippers in general only continues toxicity instead of stopping it
@@brianbrush5107
Tell that to the RWBY fandom, the bleach fandom, The Naruto fandom and the fire emblem fandom when they don't get their ships canon
@@ImmaLittlePip The issue is individuals. Not shippers in general
i feel like some times the people who harass others are just trying to get internet brownie points or seem like the better person compared to everyone else, like attention seeking like: "i just called out someone who drew a slightly lewd picture and called them a gross ass perv im so good and nice!"
The issue for me isn't wanting attention(I've always been one to say that wanting and doing things to get attention is NOT a bad thing)
The issue is that, these people geniunly believe in their simplistic view of things.
When it's pointed out their not real and this is fiction they pull the "Fiction impacts reality!" Card.
From what I'm seeing, most of the toxicity in the shipping in particular revolves around people calling out things are not factual with their logic or reason. Specifically like when people called Sheith "abusive" and/or "pedophilia". Not only it doesn't make sense when you think about the definition and the actual thing itself, importantly it show how closed-minded people are when it comes to the internet. Like of course there will be people who think of this way, but they have to deal since that's the cost of freedom on the internet.
Edit: like the video said, fandom isn't a safe space especially if they active on the internet people will inevitably find nasty stuff on the internet like porn.
It's SIMPLE, if u see an inappropriate pic, dont scream, "DONT LOOK AT IT!" That just draws more attention to it. JUST.AVOID. IT. There u go, it's simple
I couldn't agree more whenever I see people harassing others online I feel like they're actually just trying to fit into the community themselves by calling out another person they're making themselves look better in the eyes of the community of that they are trying to be accepted in
It's a psychological fact that people who are quick to attack things like that are quite guilty of it themselves. This doesn't just reflect lewd art, but to a plethora of things. They just do it to prove that they are not like that, even when no one suspected a thing in the first place.
fandoms sound a lot like political parties for people that think politics is too overrated
it was'nt always like that but damn they make it that way
no, no, you got a point
Omg you are so right. I've been a shipper since age 11. I never got too into social media though, since I wasn't allowed, but still, I obsess over shows and ignore my surroundings. Around age 16, during the pandemic, I got really into politics. Just like how I got into fandoms
Fr
Well damn, I don’t like politics and a lot of fandoms require a hazmat suit
"I think the villain from [media] is actually a genuinely interesting tragic character despite having done [atrocities]"
"for one how DARE you like [media], and how DARE you condone [atrocity]??"
Prime example: Lily Orchard's Steven Universe video.
@@rozzbourn Indeed.
An example: Loki from marvel
Bakugou fans vs Bakugou haters in a nutshell (my hero acadmeia for the people who don't know)
@@wizardsandmuggles3569 I know from experience that it works the other way around as well.
"I don't like Bakugo because I don't think his development has been adequate enough to make up for the stuff he's done."
"BUT YOU _HAVE_ TO LOVE HIM! HE WAS SAD ONCE AND HE ALSO HAD A BAD CHILDHOOD! LOVE HIM! LOVE HIM AND FORGIVE HIM RIGHT NOW OR ELSE! OPINIONS THAT ARE DIFFERENT FROM OURS ARE AUTOMATICALLY BAD!"
I miss the days of fandom where if you didnt like something you would just ignore it
The good old days
When did that happen? For as long as I known different arguments have been categorized to 2 different types, civil and scream matches. In a world without consequences like the internet you see more of the latter than the former.
@@trainerrichard6859 This was back in the glory days of the internet known as 10+ years ago
@@sunnydeechi I would've been 8 and I still remember the internet being a wasteland of trolls and jerks.
@@trainerrichard6859 I'm not referring to trolls or jerks on the internet, what I'm referring to is when if you saw something you didnt like, most people wouldnt go out of their way to make a stupid callout post against that someone or thing they didnt like, they would mostly ignore it lmao
@@sunnydeechi Ten Years Ago Is 2009
I’m pretty sure people who called Entrapta a “child coded” character doesn’t know she’s actually in her early 20s and someone who has symptoms of the Autism Spectrum.
They are either not aware of it, or are aware but are so ableist in their endless journey of being the most woke little fuckstick in the basket that they legitimately believe that autistic people are children and should be treated as such.
It's not like as if autistic people have any agency, right gals?
Grandma Tempo that seems to be the case with certain people. Like I'm autistic and when I've heard of the theory, I was like "huh, that's cool" and saw the symptoms that match Entrapta's standard behaviour.
It's sad really how fandoms can be so toxic for others.
Stop calling people autistic just because they're cringy it's lewd towards the ASD community
They don't care...these people think that because a character acts childish or has a mind of a child despite being older and or legally mature in body that that is akin to pedophilia if they have romantic connections...which is not the case.
Excuse me, English is my second language, so what means ,,child coded'' Please tell me . I love She ra and Entrapta is my favorite character.
I said I didnt like She-Ra, but according to some random Twitter user im homophobic. I Just wasn't the biggest fan of the story and artstyle. The characters were pretty decent but I just dont like the story.
And you're not for not liking a show with representation! Like, I really like She-Ra but my mom doesn't, and that doesn't mean one of us has to be wrong
I said I disliked teh chelley ship and bluesy wasn't my thing.....
All of a sudden I'm a fuckin fraud and an outcast
True story
I was on omegle with the tag portal 2 not expecting anyone since portal is practically gone (insert sad recorder) but I found someone, they immediately ask 'whats your view on portals stuff?' Which if ya didn't know.... is pretty bland other than the human wheatley designs even the the older ones are better and everything is chelley and blue sky, so I replied along the lines of 'blue sky's okay not my thing thing since i don't really like the ship chelley but teh games good and i really like Nqn' (a very popular artist in the portal community) and they go off on how im not a true fan im a fraud and a terrible person and I disconnected.... happy times....
Your not. You just dont like the show. I ADORE the show but even I know that's ridiculous
The show is pretty good, but just because you don’t like a She-Ra doesn’t mean you’re homophobic. That’s like saying if someone doesn’t like Craig of the Creek that they’re racist.
@@autumnnal or it's like saying if you don't like Black Panther, you're a racist.... oh wait that actually happened anyway.
I’ve never understood people who go after others for just,, shipping things. Like, yeah I have ships I don’t like, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to go after the people that ship it?? I don’t know where all the rage comes from? Even with ships I think are gross, I just,, ignore it. I hyperfixate on characters h a r d, but if someone bashes them I just stay away from it/them
That's not the entire issue. I've seen plenty of pro-shippers who say they are free speech rapidly turn on one another if they suspect someone is 'racist' or 'Nazi'. Not to mention they will *openly defend* CP, lolicon and shotacon and even the worst rape fics without a smidgen of criticism.
If I think a ship is gross, I read the fic/view the work and see what's 'gross' about it. If there are grounds for criticism, I go for it.
I had a woman harass me on two different social media platforms (she found me on Twitter after the argument first broke out on Tumblr somehow), for several days. Several days of messages insulting me and calling me a monster. The reason? I made a post saying all ships are valid, that sending harassment/death threats over ships isn't good, and you shouldn't attack creators for not making your ship canon. That canon doesn't mean your alternate fanfic universe can't exist. She insisted that by me accepting that another ship in conflict with her own was valid, I was insulting her, was homophobic, somehow sexist and racist and any other ist she could throw at me. She wanted her ship to be the only valid one and she maintained that she should get to harass and send death threats to others because they don't have the true progressive morally superior ship.
@@IceFireofVoid Sounds like true fandom discourse. They don't want people to be threatened, yet I've seen them advocate violence towards TERFs.
Listening to shippers is like listening to flat earthers, the amount of disprovable logic, and blatant distortions of what most people believe as facts, can make shippers vary aggressive, and the only people willing to interact with them are other shippers and/or people telling them that they are wrong. It's not that everyone is against them, it's that that only alcoholics and anti alcohol activists are willing to sleep in a bar's parking lot. Everyone else just moves on and goes unnoticed by the two.
@hey beans *COUGH* Jelsa *COUGH*
The moment I heard the word "coded" I internally cringed... it just seems to be a term thrown around by fandoms so they can find more reasons to get offended... Like applying human races to alien space-rocks so that they can pretend that Garnet is a racist stereotype (Yes I saw that argument made once)... Never heard of "child-coded" though...so childish adults aren't allowed to be in relationships anymore? Welp, that's fine. I wasn't interested in dating anyway.
Coding is a real literary term but given the whole "lots of big-name fans don't understand literature" thing it gets misused! Garnet certainly has traits of a black stereotype (which is all coding really means) but that's only one interpretation of her! another fan might say "well, she's a rock from space so she doesn't have a race" or "physically being dark-skinned doesn't mean as much as cultural background".
@@EuphemiaRem That's exactly the problem. In the fandom era "don't like, don't read", dramas were not uncommon but tuned down and between like four people. You could spout all you headcanons into the world because you'd find at least someone that though the same. In the current era of "only this [theory] is the acceptable one", if the dominant theory is that Garnet is coded, you'll be named all kind of names if you say that you interpreted her character diferently. It's sad really.
The "children" thing is a trend in itself. Many corners of the internet are obsessed with telling people which age differences between LEGAL ADULTS are okay and which apparently aren't.
@@Alias_Anybody This! I recently actually left tumblr and my Ask Batgirl blog because A friend and I decided that we would put Killer Moth and Batgirl together. Despite the fact she was an adult, and the age difference was about 11 years at the most, I got harassed and told that it was gross, made them uncomfortable, and that they were going to report me and my friend. We had to end the rp relationship, and I left tumblr. The pedo label was thrown Moth's way, but only in questions to me. My friend received nothing. I was the only one who got harassed. So I left the DC askverse.
@@Denabella
It's even worse when it involves real people.
Just because a fandom is bad, does not automatically mean the media is bad.
As someone who's been in multiple fandoms... I'm desensitized to most of it by now. Just ignore the stuff you don't like, and focus on the stuff you do like, and you'll be pretty much fine
Thats called being mature!😆 its just sets better, I do it too!!
@@forzenfukuroanimations you’re going to be surprised by how few people know how to be like that
You see the reason fandoms suck is because they're filled with people. People from the internet. You see the problem
Aidan Penn sketches yes
My Tip : just be an antisocial hermit who never answers anything and doesn't even engage with people on the internet. I only watch shipping wars and fandom toxicity from afar as a quiet observer. Nevermind the loneliness. Or depression. Hm..
Dammm
Why you out here saying my life secrets?
Ackchually... what you're describing is asocial behaviour, not anti-social.
From wikipedia "Asociality refers to the lack of motivation to engage in social interaction, or a preference for solitary activities", and "Anti-social behaviours are actions that harm or lack consideration for the well-being of others".
But this is how I live.
I don’t do communities though and if people like/dislike agree/disagree with somebody on that media, I look at it and just entertain myself. It’s not worth getting angry about, especially since there is more things to worry about
So your basically Sweden in any war
My motto is, and continues to be, “do what you want if you are not hurting anybody. If I do not like it, I will move along.”
What if it's bdsm?
@@dianak8656 as long that it dosent hurt annyone
but it still hurts that others are hurting and should know better ...(yeah if its not physical/mental/intended .. then ok.)
I've noticed a trend among these "what ifs" that seem to have negated my last point. Ask yourself one question, in these situations; "can I click away without anyone even knowing I was here and/or bothered?" If the answer is yes, do that. Don't start a shitstorm if you can click away and go about your business.
I now look for red flags! lol. sometimes I didn't think something would be as disturbing as what it would be (for me) , I like extreme entertainment .. but some things are a big line of taste for me .. (so yes I can now chose not to click on something) ive learnt that "what if " doesn't matter ! lol. .. but a year ago it felt like someone making an evil fan fic should be in jail!! lol. but I now know its only fantasy . ..(but there have been cases where someone wrote a evil fan fic then actually did crime! ) but that's a 1%... maybe some fantasy's are better left in peoples heads .. or in their room privately .. its way better if there is a "you must be 18" warning just to ive people a fighting chance to be able to click away!!. lol.
We need more of this:
If you hate something, just hate that thing. Don't hate the people who make or enjoy it. If you hate something, you should avoid it. Why? People usually don't like things they hate. Why the hell would anyone do anything they don't want to and don't have to do?
big fat agree! and we need more of the reverse as well in my opinion[warning: very long paragraph]:
if you like a thing, and the creator/s of that thing did something discriminatory or in bad taste, it doesn't reflect the quality of the thing they created. Boycotting a piece of media just because of something "problematic" the creator did is a mega waste of time and energy. I understand the feeling of betrayal one can get when their perfect view of a creator is tarnished. However, it isn't a cause to shaft them as a creator or say their contributions have lost their meaning. Someone's ability to write, compose, animate, or program is a totally separate can of worms than how good of a person they are morally. this also touches on the "safe space" segment of the video. If you see anything mildly different from your opinion and deem it immoral, all you're doing is upholding an unrealistic standard of a community that is fundamentally flawed. and every fandom, toxic or not, is fundamentally egotistical because it relies on self-indulgence above all else. you can never have a 100% clean and shiny fanbase or creator, much less a 100% kind and clever person behind the veil.
Exactly! I see a lot of people in the comments going "but,, but what if a ship is immoral and evil and bad!!!" like. did you miss the whole video?? please scroll up and hit play. if a ship bothers you, just leave it be. don't use it as an excuse to vilify and attack actual human beings over fictional characters kissing or w/e. I promise it's not as horrible and dangerous as you think it is
I think of it like food, I hate fast food for many reasons, it's bad for you, a lot of fast food companies arnt in my opinion moral (overworking children) ect
So I don't eat fast food, and if other people want to eat fast food they are more than welcome to.
@@peeblekitty5780 The only time the ship is ever incorrect is if the creator canonically says the ship is not what it is. But if there’s no canonical proof then ship all you want.
@@doggoadexx2680 I mean, creator's word holds different weight to different people. Folks may interpret the original work differently. Good old death of the author. Not to mention there are cases where the creator claims something about the work that is unsupported or even can be proven false by what's actually in the text, at which point what is canon when employing Word of God is less than clear.
Though, all that's besides my initial point: whether or not a ship is accurate to canon or morally pretty has no bearing on whether the person shipping them is a Bad Person Actually, and not something to attack people over.
Honestly after spending so much time in fandom, I realize the key to having a good time is just. Finding a small group of friends you jive with and then ignore pretty much everyone else. I say this as a fan artist who would get so anxious about posting in case I got yelled at, I eventually just found it easier to share within a smaller discord group and worry less about pleasing people because this is MY thing I like and I’ll enjoy it how I want. Once IRL stuff starts piling up you just don’t have the energy or time to argue with strangers online, and I would rather spend it talking about the thing I like rather than defending the “bad parts” of it.
That is very true. I have become friends with people on google+ in the dragon ball communities and we made a discord together.
This is very much true with life in general too, as there are plenty of bad parts in the world but it's best to balance that out with good parts (and one of them is definitely finding a good group of friends without needing to please whole crowds of people)! 🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩
yea i have some pretty close friends and i just talk with them and post my stuff sometimes
Undertale_artist girl just idk do stuff it’s like how I got into the hetalia fandom. I was just there.
This is pretty much exactly the route I ended up going. I stick to small Discord groups with friends who share common interests (and are at least non-judgmental about interests they don't happen to share) rather than going out of my way to interact with large swaths of the fandoms via forums and Twitter and whatnot, since all I ever seem to encounter is the exact type of bullshit described in this video. Small groups of friends may _seem_ more "safe spacey" to some, but in reality, you're simply far less likely to get into really stupid fandom flamewars with smaller groups of friends. Friends with whom you can have civil disagreements because, well...you're _friends._ lol
I'm a writer and I've had a person get upset because one of my adult characters had been nine before he became an adult. What? Are adults supposed to just spring into existence as fully formed adults, never having been children?
It was especially weird since the character in question was an asexual adult so somehow creating a character that doesn't have sex as an adult, meant that I was implying that he had sex as a child (which he did not).
I'm here wondering how in the hell this person jumped to this many stupid conclusions with I suppose little to no context.
That’s a problem with me too. My fans on a story I make on Wattpad called The Star Covers want two of my characters in a lesbian relationship and I said that they were not going to be together and they thought I was homophobic but I’m not. Also I putted my favourite band Kiss in the story and they are like 40 years maybe older than the main characters because they are 10-11 when the series started and they are 14-15 this year but they want me to do some things with them and I can’t believe it!
bejjinks wow. Um I’m shocked
Rae Droid you’ll have to ban them or s
Wow I guess I should just delete every single exposition scene where my adult characters are children.
I miss when the Warriors fandom was nice. It was just a group of animators, artists, songwriters, and fanfic authors sharing their love for books about cats. Nowadays it seems to be swimming in controversy.
@Sorendoodle oh a few months ago it was full of drama regarding cat's appearance, and a few youtubers who got chased off the internet
@@EarlyOwOwl yeah, because those youtubers did some pretty bad things to people, im glad we (sorta) got them out of the fandom
One thing I have ask though...
Wasn't the fact that the Warriors weren't spayed or Neutered a fairly major plot point in the first book?
@@firekram main character didn't want to have his balls removed so he went to join a religious cult in the forest
The Warriors fandom is still alive? I remember reading those in fucking middle school, holy shit.
As long as you dont ship real people idc
I know right. Shipping actual people is creepy.
Look no further than Septiplier, not only are they shipping two real people but these two people already have partners.
Mcyt ships.... Unless it's a joke ship I'm ok
Watch out for the Dan and Phil fandom lol
A big problem in the SPN fandom unfortunately :/ its pretty gross that they'd disrespect misha and jensen like that.
I feel like the more child-friendly a show is the more toxic the fandom is. Like Cookie Run, I’ve never seen the other side of the game which is issuing with genders.
_Laughs in bnha_
Reasons why I don't like to watch a lot of animation shows don't with other people who either already know the show or are on the fandom side of the show.
People take children's shows way too seriously these days. It's either the best thing ever that causes a toxic fandom filled with ships or "the worst" thing that every adult cartoon reviewer rants about for 3+ hours because of nostalgia blindness, like Peppa Pig
My sister loves Cookie Run
wth THERE IS A TOXIC FANDOM OF COOKIE RUN?!(8 good thing i was impatient for the download to complete lmao well... i did try to download it cause of my nice online friends dkjddj
A lot of these fandom toxicity stems from, in an observation, their entitlement and control on something they found something to be passionate about, but must have been shortsighted enough to not realize that they aren't the only ones who deserve both reprieve from 'everyday' reality and enacting on their passions; they aren't special. And that might set them off to defend, rant, harass or just outright apathetically do batshit things without any idea of the consequences of their actions, whether or not it's within and outside the fandom community.
an i n t e l l i g e n t resonse
Underrated
Hi OP here. Just to add, share your passions kindly and if they aren't on board, just let them be. Most of the time, those who won't get on board don't hate it, it's just they're busy, already into something and don't want to fixate (....me), or may not have the means to find out about it. Thank you 💖
"Is an 18 year old an adult?" - "Yes" - "And they're responsible for their own choices?" - "Right" - "And you agree this character is 18?" - "Correct" - "So that means theeyyyyyy" - "Are a baby."
Unrelated, but i've never laughed so hard at a cut away than that fucking running segment
I misread the first question as "Is an 18 year old an aunt?" and I was really curious where you were going to go with it.
18 or not,shipping cartoons characters is cringe
@@giorgio_8013 see, this is the kind of behaviour that's part of the problem
@@lionrence not really, he's not wrong... any form of shipping is pretty cringe, because the shippers then tend to focus on that one aspect of hoping those characters get together, that they forget there's an actual story being told outside of that relationship. Let the writers decide the direction of the show, not idiots that think 2 people would be good together.
i think the issue is that shiro adopted keith with his fiancé when keith was a child. that's the problem
I don't care what ship makes to canon. There's plenty of fanmade content to keep me content. Why can't people just be chill like that?
My life motto.
Plot: *shows minor inconvenience or a hole*
That type of fan: there must be SECRETS right there
I wouldn't call that Toxicity. Its just speculating stuff for fun, Wich they have every right to do
Its if they force their theory onto others it becomes toxic.
@@brianbrush5107 i remember when i used the game theorist's fnaf theories as canon stuff
*The Roundtable intensifies*
69th like😎😎😎😎
Or
Plot: *shows minor inconvenience or a hole*
That kind of fan: All of the writers and artists are idiots and should be lambasted on social media until they cry or quit.
"I'm gonna lose so many followers aren't I?"
Only the people who can't handle the truth and cause all the problems you listed.
SoulHero7 69th like .😎😎😎😎😎
@Bion Yeah 90% sounds about right.
SoulHero7 yep
gained one right here :)
better surround yourself wih sane good people instead of whiny brats.
Bathe me in the tea and bury me in salt
Gotta love all the comments in this video that are 100% proving your point, lol.
This tea is indeed exceptionally good 🍵
change the salt to dirt
K
Mood
"Think of the children!"
Say that to she-ra fandom who chased a minor off twitter
What? What happened?
@ANGELMANCY :(
If the artist was re drawing 80s Mermista then wasn't she white correct me if wrong.
@ANGELMANCY excuse me *what*
Twitter is fucked. This is why I stay on my Scratch and Sketchers United. Their small and targeted toward my age.
I’m an artist, and as weird as it sounds, I don’t think I’d ever want to create a wildly popular thing. Having seen what fans do, I can’t imagine how a creator would feel. I’m sure many have grown accustomed to it but with my own mental illnesses, I likely would get hospitalized at least once out of stress. Small fanbases, or better yet NO fanbases are honestly the best. I’d give up fanfiction for sanity any day.
Maybe not quite the same but as a game developer I kinda feel the same way. Having a small chill community of people who follow my work sounds a million times more appealing than being a massive success and attracting the worst kinds of people.
My anxiety over it has gotten so bad that I've been trying to figure out a way to publish something 100% anonymously to avoid getting doxxed, cause if I was ever the target of mass harassment I probably wouldn't live through it.
Shaun Dreclin Same here, I’m legit terrified about what could happen if I ever made something that caught lots of people’s attention and getting doxxed cuz I didn’t make so so’s ship canon. It’s scary world out there on the internet.
As a writer, I'm right there with you. The idea of fame and success these days scares the ever loving hell out of me.
Agree, i can't imagine the level of stress when you find out your project/show/book have a terrible fandom, it must be like "i've create a monster"
@@tamaradelgado8254 Just like in Hermitcraft Minecraft Series... Grian and Mumbo Jumbo's fanbase are so toxic that they literally threathened FalseSymmetry that they will unsubbed to her channel if she run for 'mayor' they are doing this because Mumbo is running for mayor and they just want Mumbo to win by default. Grian and Mumbo seems like they're pretty nice people they actually tried to fix it but their fanbase is just-
Sorry for bad english by the way..
Remember when the Steven Universe fandom kept hating on this one girl because she drew Rose Quartz too skinny? She tried to kill herself because of all the hate she got.
Good thing that was like 2 years ago. But now we have Spinel x Steven shippers vs the people who think it’s pedophilia (or people who are aggressively loyal to Connie x Steven)
Elokin
I dunno why you can’t just ship what you want, just so you don’t hurt anybody
WTF IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE?
• Sunshine • some people say that it’s pedophilia bc spinel is literally thousands of years older than Steven, but some people do stuff based on a gem’s mental age since they’re immortal and stuff
I read a post on tumblr saying fatphobia isn't a thing, it's just a made up thing by snowflakes so they can have a "reason" to get triggered over. I WORSHIP THAT POST SO MUCH
"THINK OF THE CHILDREN"
Trust me, no one was thinking of the children in the 90s and early 00s internet, and we turned out just fine. At 13 years old, I was very, very familiar with certain pornagraphic tropes, and my parents were pretty strict with my internet access and what I viewed. But I managed to find a way around their rules and supervision because THAT'S WHAT KIDS FREAKING DID. And I turned out normal. Never harassed anyone for shipping something I didn't, never freaked out over seeing something I wasn't keen on, never screeched at people how x character I liked was perfect and pure (they weren't, they were usually unhinged monsters), and just....10-15 years ago, you didn't DO the shit fandom is notorious for now. Like jfc. My ship wasn't canon? Guess I'll write fanfic and scour for obscure doujinshi then! Big freaking whoop!
p r e a c h
Yeah, currently a child, and that’s pretty much my experience now, I think I’ll be okay eventually
I think that being exposed to mature topics as a teenager made you more mature because it prepared you for real life
I knew what sex was when I was like 9 or 10
I knew what sex was when I was 7 or 8 because of the kids in my school and I didn’t care
I’m reminded of the time I asked my coworker what she thought of the oscars the night before and she said “I don’t really care about movies” and I, who gave too much of a shit and was ready to argue, found her answer so refreshing and beautiful that I felt my entire body relax. Taught me to calm the f down. Would recommend.
As a representative of the JJBA Fandom, I apologies to everyone that we have annoyed by our constant "Is that a Jojo Reference?" and "Watch Jojo", also how we dominate the comment section of music videos, I hope you can forgive us
Aw, that's sweet. I don't personally think those kinds of comments are that troubling tho, as long as they don't involve harrasing people for not doing so.
@@pearlyp9898 oh ok
Also as a representative, don't join the fandom, because it's a cesspool. If you like Josuhan or Giomis you will be shot on site even though the former has Josuke in an canon adult appearance in the OVA iirc and the latter is a 3 year age gap between a 15 yr old and an 18 yr old, the equivalent of a sophmore dating a senior.
But you know.
@@slightlyuncomfortable why ship in jojo...
nah that's hilarious. I don't do it myself but i love seeing boomers getting mad that people can't appreciate "true culture" and only watch "silly japanese cartoons for losers" It's hilarious.
Google how do I send a video to every single person on the internet?
TH-cam recommendations
I mean you can try to send it to people by hand
Just run around chucking phones with this video playing at people the next time you go to Mcdonalds. The cops will love that so much they'll take you into there office and give you cookies. They put you in there cheap hotel while they bake the cookies tho
*you dont*
ButterflyColors Most of these points are biased anyways, there’s arguments for all of these things regardless (especially any form of child porn being bad), don’t let one person on either side dictate what you think, you dictate what you think. Just try to understand too sides instead of what you’re simply informed by others
That bruh moment when literal lines on paper are more important than real, living, breathing people
The YB fandom. When the creator was literally going to court for her and her partner allegedly doing something to someone, people cared more about the art of YB or wtf his name is than an actual victim.
A lot of the discourse around keeping children from nsfw also comes from this perspective of rigidly defining under 18 as child and over 18 as adult and there are always going to be teenagers looking for and watching porn and the harder we make it for them to access just means they'll be forced to find it through sketchier more potentially dangerous ways. Antis absolutely do not make minors safer from online predators imo, even if that's their intention.
The US has very black and white laws about what is and isn't appropriate for people under 18, because the US tends to have very black and white, right and wrong ideas around sexuality as a whole. The person creating the content tends to be held responsible for allowing their content be accessed by people who shouldn't have been looking it up in the first place. (Even if it's educational. Sex education in US schools is also unheard of or of poor quality when it exists.)
I'm asexual and sex indifferent and because of this paranoia and black and white, right and wrong thinking found all across the internet, I avoid striking up platonic friendships with anyone younger than 24. Turning 27 made me acutely aware of how people in my age group might perceive me. US culture sexualizes everything while also simultaneously sexually vilifying everything.
Those kind of people probably ship leo x karai (who are related)
THIS. I used to be in a discord group that had this mentality for a couple years in high school, and it was so bad that when my friendship with them ended it was partially because of this. I had turned 18 LITERALLY a month or two before, and I was explaining to what was normally a very LGBT-friendly group that I was bisexual homoromantic and just called myself a lesbian to simplify… I guess they felt threatened and were pressuring me to explain it. I was being vague about it because most of them were 16 or 17 and I was just TERRIFIED to explain how it worked since, y'know, it involves things to do with sex… I was 18, even though they were just my peers, I was terrified because suddenly they weren't my peers anymore. I was suddenly the adult, and I think those friendships at least partially ended because of the rigidness of the 18 line.
@@firefancy9928 and that too, the second part of what you said. My best friend who I've known for years is currently 17 while I'm 19… we met years ago back when we were both literally FNAF kids. I was 14 and she was 12… and it didn't matter back then, because we were both just FNAF kids and I liked her art. But since I turned 18 I've been nervous to be too overly public about how close we are… I can't wait until she turns 18 this fall just so it will be normal again. I've never had a single romantic interest in her… I literally just want her to be an adult too so I don't have to be afraid of people making assumptions anymore. People can be really quick to assume the worst.
@@CorinneStephens if it helps with something, not all places have laws as rigid as the US. For example in my country if you're in a relationship with someone under 18 as long as your age difference is less that 3 years nothing happens legally to you. Think they are called Romeo and Julliet laws .
I wasn't a sheith shipper but the voltron fandom made me so stressed with all the hatred going around
I just wanted to enjoy the show and my ship and let everyone just do their own thing and enjoy what they liked as well
Deku baby I myself was Anti-Shaladin but I never personally went out of my way to harass people over it
@@GabyGeorge1996 You mean it wasn't just me?! Thank heavens! It seemed like virtually everyone else in the VLD fandom who was critical of ships were complete a-holes! I felt very alone, knowing that I couldn't express any opposition to Sheith etc without people judging me.
Neverside Faerie Same here! Although I did and still do like some Shaladin ships like Shance and Shallura aged up, I had this not-good feeling with Sheith that I couldn’t post about since I was constantly hammered to be “positive” but it didn’t feel like it allowed my opinion in since I didn’t know if it was a toxic opinion to not like Sheith, even Plance for my reasons. I now still respect them as another fan, I do poke jokes and things ridiculous (like the socks for Voltron thing-) they do sometimes but not full blown harassment. I want to treat it like a discussion so people can take what I have to say seriously.
@@surraciddac170 I actually thought that Shiro and Allura were actually going to become a couple at one point! 😅
Neverside Faerie me too! I actually had so much faith that it would happened that I actually commissioned an artist to draw porn of them. My anger at the news that Shiro has a boyfriend was not directed at the fact that he was gay, but rather the fact that a pairing I’d sunk a 40 dollar commission into now had no chance in hell of happening; especially with fans rejoicing that he was Gay rather than pan or bi, and I couldn’t state my opinion without risking a lynch mob of pitchforks and torches
I can answer this in one sentence
“Because people gave idiots access to the internet.”
@Woodrow Pride you know America isn't the only state out there
Also who is stupid shouldn't have access to media like you for example
@Woodrow Pride i meant to say the only state srry
@Woodrow Pride i don't think grammatic is an important subject here i'm just saying you're wrong stupid people should NOT use internet
100th like
@ItsRxchel
I'd argue that "technology rapidly happened, and people are still trying to process it". It's kinda like how the Industrial Revolution and the Enlightenment Era brought huge worldview changes as technology grew.
The first religions were fandoms if you think about it. That’s why the crusades happened.
Wow i never thought it like that it all makes sense now damn i kinda scared now but am also amsued.
"Fan" came from "fanatic".
This even applies to Hatedoms. Who use guilt by association to shame those in the Fandom/are part of a religon
Toxic Fandoms are just a microcosm of religious disparity
🤣🤣🤣
This is why I don't become a part of fandoms, I just take in the media and ship on my own.
exactly
we should all do the same
Same
In a nutshell: *_"This is why we can't have nice things."_*
After my experience on shipping wars and drama, I decided to stay at the surface- searching arts and theories but not reading comments, but only in popular fandom because more fans = higher chance of losing braincells.
If people wrote or drew with controversial topic, then please always remember that it does not representing or showing of who the person is. When one finds it uncomfortable, then just leave because it's not worth to cause trouble, no one is forcing you to like it, unless when there's a misunderstanding- like forgot to add appropriate tags and warnings, which is when you should call them out for it.
TL;DR: Whenever there's a problem, please just do it in civil way.
There’s an example that is not related to fandom, but still related on toxicity: I remember when a person was upset about an artist for not adding gore warning in TH-cam, but then that person said shit like "They wasted talent in this", "This video deserves dislike" and such, and it's all because there isn't any warning. They could've gone with "Excuse me, I'm sorry, but I don't like the video because there's gore, and it would've been nice to add a warning," but hey, why not make things more complicated?!
Well, welcome to fandom.
Oh my god I absolutely HATE IT when people say that someone "wasted their talent" on something they didn't like. Cause it's fucking dumb, a person wants to use their talents for gore and enjoys it then I don't see how it's a waste.
@@nepnep8444 I know there was this one animator using a more cartoon-y and tweeny animation style for a series they're working on and this one person was like "yOu'RE waStIng YOuR tALenT" but like, you need easier animation for a long term project like that and their talent isn't wasted just because *you* don't like it. Nobody is entitled to someone's talent. You're getting to basically watch an animated series for free and then complain about the art/animationstyle. Entitled much I'd say.
@@vickypedia1308 yeesh I was referring more to like NSFW artists since I find it common there but jesus it amazes me how entitled some people think they are to someone's talent
The same can be said for Video Game fandoms (although I had to admit, I am a part of some of them) like Rockstar's works and the Super Smash Bros. games.
Rockstar when they are fixing everything for their online parts -
Fans: How long are we gonna wait to play Grand Theft Auto VI?
Rockstar Games: We can't rush art.
Other fandom people: THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE SHIP
Me: What if we put Character 1 x Character 2! Oh oh! And what about Character 2 x Character 3!? Or even....
Character 1 x Character 3????
Character 1 x character 1 and there's nothing you can stop me
Timothy the oncler fandom
character 1 x 2 x 3!👀
They all have 2 hands :/
I do this
One time there was a Powerpuff Girls fandom on Sony Sketch or something, and some girl shipped herself with Boomer. Lets call her Person A. And then she got PISSED because some other girl (lets call her Person B) was ALSO shipping herself with Boomer. Person A told all her friends to confront Person B because 'Person A had Boomer first and he belongs to her.' OMG HE'S A FICTIONAL CHARACTER AND HE DOESN'T BELONG TO YOU. HE BELONGS TO CRAIG MCCRACKEN.
This reminds of I post I once made about the character All Might from BNHA, it was a poet just talking about how quickly he became one of my favorite characters and someone reblogged it with something like "all might is mine alone no one else's and I love him!"
Sans fangirl? Is that you?!
"The world's always been shit... but it's especially shit right now"
Looks at the upload date
Sep 25, 2019
Me: Haaaaaa... you have no IDEA DO YOU...
my exact thoughts when they said that
@@hh-uk8hd same
This has something to do with Trump, isn't it?
@@anneoneal3865 no it has to with covid.
I thought the anti-Trump crowd considered themselves to be smart?
*checks back in 2021* hehe ahaha uhhhh,,,
yeah.
(it's still pretty incredible how well this video holds up though, even in an ironic "you've got a big storm comin'" way. it's also interesting looking back on some of the media i was into at the time and how the way i look at art and authorial intent has changed. i may not have been involved in fandom in 2019, or now even, but these fandoms were still incredibly formative for me, if only as an example of what not to do.)
Because the toxic "fans" are overgrown toddlers who should've stayed in preschool.
Robert Simon but why are they toxic?
Sonic Xtreme99 Because they have no brains whatsoever. They're nothing but immature dumbasses who get mad over the littlest things.
@@robertsimon2885 that statement was ironic.
Chicken Stripz How?
@@robertsimon2885 By referring someone as a "dumbass who gets mad over the littlest things." You're becoming what you dislike.
In doing so, it becomes ironic.
Tbh, the worst way this entitlement manifests is in people who claim Ao3 is a terrible website for allowing things they're uncomfortable with. Ao3 is the thing we used to dream about back in the day. And you think it should start moderating what content can be there? You think Ao3 shouldn't allow x and y thing, but you know what would happen if they tried to get rid of it (which they never will because the website was literally built to hold even the grossest stuff)? People would fucking abandon ship, or at least anyone with any sense would. Learn your fandom history! This kind of thing never stops with what you personally think is morally objectionable and will always disproportionately affect marginalized creators. Your porn isn't safe just because _you_ think it's okay.
Ao3 exists entirely because fandom learned the hard way, repeatedly, that all of it's okay or none of it is. You can either let the gross stuff exist in it's own little space, or you can try to get rid of it and end up with another purge and another mass migration to a different website that won't try to regulate people.
Lucas T, Ao3 is the best website (as long as there is proper tagging which you can call out people for not doing), if it ever gets destroyed there will be consequences, the same way Tumblr got destroyed and real MAPs fled to Twitter.
this!
Now, sometimes I'll stumble into quite an... Interesting untagged fic, but at that point I just back out and keep searching. It's not hard to pick out what you want and ignore the other stuff.
Truth!! If you don’t like something, they have a thing called an exclude filter for that and AO3 is awesome for it! It lets anything and everything on it, if someone doesn’t like it, they ignore it
Tumblr got ruined. This stupid nsfw cleanse didn't attract new people, it just lost their old ones. Good job. Ao3 is a heaven place.
The voltron fandom was just mad, i mean when the creators even themselves said '' Klance wont happen, its not going to be canon'' and ''dont harras people over ships'' it didn't prevent from half of the fandom thinking Klance was going to be endgame or telling people to kill themselves over shipping sheith, shance or shidge
Or call the creators homophobic/ say they queerbaited them. Cause how dare two male characters be close with each other and not be gay.
What angered me most was how many of them claimed to be standing up for LGBTQ representation; while simultaneously attacking LGBTQ people who didn't agree with them. Those people didn't give a crap about representation unless they got what they wanted out of it.
@@siobhannoble8545 yep
Klance was the most popular ship, I was okay with it at first but ever since i saw the toxic fans complaining about Klance not being in a Sheith, Allurance and Plance video/fanart they just made despise the pairing and since season 8 was receiving a lot of negative backlash for 'Klance not becoming canon' and 'Allurance being too forced', I have seen a Klance shipper complaining to Lance VA about Klance deserves better and i replied to them by saying that Klance isn't canon and that not everything is about them in Voltron ( Keep in mind, I wasn't being rude to this person at all ) till a lot of Klance shippers started attacking me, accusing me of being a toxic Sheith and Plance shipper which made me delete my comment and i blocked them because it was so hard to deal with toxic Klance shippers. I left the fandom for good because of them, I will always love Sheith till this day and i feel truly sorry for the creators of Voltron, they don't deserve this.
@@imgone1360 and the thing is voltron wasn't about romance, while I do agree allura and Lance's relationship came out of no where, we all knew klance wasn't going to be canon then the fandom had the nerve to say the creators queer baited when, when we had shiro who was gay or bi and married a man in the end. I also hated the fact people attack the creators for killing Adam because he was gay UwU, l I'm like hello he was in a war, it was always a possibility that he could die, and honestly the fandom hated him because of what he did to shiro, but when they found out he died, he was a pewious gay baby UwU, who didn't deserve to die and the creators were homophobic for killing him.
Damn, you totally nailed why people get so upset at anything in fandom that goes against what they believe. It IS because fandom is an escape, and we get protective of our “safe spaces.” What I think is especially interesting (and this is all from my POV) but I’ve been genuinely terrified to share my ideas online simply because I’ve seen OTHERS get smeared and doxxed over their [similar] takes. It’s a terrifying landscape because you’re far more likely to have someone disagree with you, and then come AFTER YOU FOR IT, than you are to find like-minded or even open-minded folks. :(
The history and psychology/neurology nerd in me speculates that fandoms are toxic since it's about a group of people with similar interests, but disagree with how similar interests are to be consumed or expressed, and all the psychological fallacies/biases that form as soon as groupthink and/or tribalism happens (it's in our genes to try to establish how a certain group or tribe is supposed to act, and I theorize that fandoms seem to be something like that to a larger scale, combined with all the positives and negatives of internet culture too). 🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓
I should also mention that I'm not going off of a study on this, but just off of thinking of what little I know of human history and psychology/neurology studies, and seeing how it'd be applicable to fandoms. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I agree, as a psych nerd, too. ;) I see many different facets of the behavioral spectrum when it comes to fandoms. The majority of the time, I sense a herd mentality, where people will wanna follow the popular opinion on something in order to fit in. Another huge factor is how the person was raised. What sorts of morals/ethics did the parents/guardians instill on their offspring and how much of that, if any, did said child take with them into adulthood? Since a TON of what makes us who we are was melded into us at a young age, it's easy to see where certain behaviors come from when expressed by an adult. It's only when we become aware of these traits that we're able to modify and/or change them to fit who we actually are. It's fascinating how much of our behavior was learned in childhood and became our "norm" in adulthood.
I love the complexities of the human brain! :D
When I was 13, I made an original character that I shipped with canon character Levi Ackerman from Attack on Titan. I had multiple people on amino and TH-cam who would bash me for even mentioning my oc or sharing a drawing I did of them hugging. I remember one commenter on my channel (when all I really did was mention her name) said something along the lines of “This is TH-cam, not a fanfic site, if you want to share your opinion, go write a fanfic”
As a 13 year old, I was hurt and discouraged from showing my character to anyone else online (unless they asked to see my art through private message on amino).
That's some nasty stuff tbh, also I think that you shipping your oc with Levi was cute, don't know why.
Everyone goes through that phase where they create an OC and ship them with their favorite canonical character. I did it, and I'm willing to bet the person who made the snotty comment on your channel did it, too. It's a little cringey, sure (kidding! XD), but it's also just harmless fun. There's no need for that kind of rudeness towards someone who is hurting no one and is just doing something that makes them happy. People need to chill and realize, too, that probably 99.9% of people who ship their OCs with canon characters are just kids. People should have been encouraging you and giving you *constructive* criticism instead of just crapping all over you like that. I know how much reading comments like that can sting; over the years I've gotten overwhelmingly positive feedback on all my drawings/fanfics, and yet I can *still* recall every word of the very tiny handful of negative comments I've gotten. It sucks, ngl, but I promise you that if you keep at it you'll eventually attract a community of people that will appreciate what you do. Please don't let the jerks of the world discourage you from doing what you enjoy :)
@@Spectra651
That was really sweet! Thank you so much
It’s very encouraging to find someone who has had similar experiences and can now help others along their way. I hope to be like that too when I’m older.
I think I was an especially sensitive and insecure kid when I got the negative comments (still am now but not nearly as bad), and it probably didn’t help that I was a bit anti-social. I think at the time I just wanted everyone to like me and saw rejection or negative comments that didn’t hold much weight as the worst thing in the world.
Your comment made me smile so thank you, seriously.
The thing about humans is they are a strange group who fight each other a lot mostly because they don’t have anything else to fight cuz if they did they would fight them
Imma be honest: OCs aren't my cup of tea, but that doesn't mean I'll go around bashing people's ocs or people who ship their ocs with other characters, and other people shouldn't either. You do you fam, as long as you aren't hurting anyone. We all have our own way of enjoying our favorite series/games/etc and everyone should be allowed to do so.
Because social media exists and people only want to focus on the negatives.
That's really sad.
Have you seen Yellow Flash's channel?
Ever since Vic Mignona was fired he's been in full rage mode ever since.
FyrFlyr The whole Vic debacle is so ridiculous. These people are basically cultists, worshipping this man just because he voiced the main character of the greatest anime of all time (which FMAB is IMO), and completely ignoring the fact that the vast majority of his acts HAVE BEEN PHOTOGRAPHED.
I actually met Monica Rial at a Comic Con about a week ago, and she told me the majority of bad press is basically Twitter (because of course it is), whereas she’s received no ill will at cons or even other social media platforms. So it could mainly be certain subsets of fandoms.
Luke Dias hasn’t it been shown that they lied to vic
@@raycom201 Quite the opposite. All of the charges were just recently dismissed, and for some legal shenanigans he's unable to appeal; the judge even labeled him a public nuisance. So the only thing that has to be shown is Vic's thousands of dollars in legal fees.
@@Gemnist98 You sounds like you’re pretty bias and don’t know much about what’s happened. I’m neutral on it, but evidence points to Monica Rial and other involved are vindictive toward Vic and lies about what went down have come out into the open.
The most vocal part of the SU fandom calling pink diamond (a character that has been written to have been abused and have had actual abuse victims compare their similar stories) a literal monster because she had to learn to be a better person, and then decided she wanted a kid out of pure personal desire with no other motives, and then have Spinel be redeemed despite the fact she very much try to kill the entire earth (along with all three other diamonds) are a textbook example of people being toxic and refusing to think critically beyond what people tell them.
You have a right to not like a character, I've come to near hate spinel because of the fandom, but dear god dont call them the literal devil and scream at anyone who doesn't agree with you.
Exactly. That first one you said happened with Catra in the she-ra fandom too. Sometimes antis take it so personally they make whole blogs dedicated to hating a character or a ship, it's insane.
I am one of those people - at least, up until “A Single Pale Rose” at which point I just rolled my eyes because the way they shoved the plot twist felt more like a last minute retcon…
But it’s still valid for people to see her character a different way.
I made a joke saying "Thank God Steven Universe is finally gone." And now I'm suddenly Hitler
People really cant respect opinions
Tbh that was a little rude
not rude enough to compare them to hitler though lmao???
Wth?
as a steven universe fan i agree with your sentiment so much
It’s because “social justice” became ingrained into fandoms especially shows like Steven Universe. Everything is black and white. People seem to think calling shippers Nazis is an acceptable form of activism
Tbh Social Justice is already written into the show itself because the showrunners are part of this movement. Same with 2018 SheRa. Of course it's those kind of people who'll be the loudest in the fandoms then.
@@Nutmeg- I think the issue isn't Social Justice. Condemning racism, Sexism ECT? All that is bad and should be condemned.
The issue is when people, as the video says go after things that make them uncomfortable and such.
And they make issues way more simplistic and black and white to demonize Rule 34 or Porn fics. With stuff like "This shouldn't be debatable, Rape and pedophilia is bad" to make anyone who writes those or defends their existence using the stuff in the video as secretly pedophiles or Rape Apologists.
I actually think it’s engrained in the Internet and how you can be anonymous on there and harass people, it’s a completely different thing to tell someone their bad in front of their face then on the Internet...
@@Nutmeg- no its just crazy people no matter spectrum there on
@@Nutmeg- so it was basically doomed to happen
"Pshh, fandoms aren't THAT bad!"
*Star Wars kazoo intensifies.*
*My Hero Academia kazoo intensifies*
*Steven Universe kazoo roars over the world*
Each time a new movie comes out fans say it ruined Star Wars. Each. Time. Since 1980.
@@smoky7451 kind of a Point, i think that TFA was mildly good? But then TLJ and TROS became Rubbish
Ps: my mom is a Reylo shipper, no joke
@@mateorios1636 Oof that's rough, buddy XD
The "ThInK Of THe CHilDrEN!" people makes me, a child sad. We're not just some innocent creatures that don't know what we're doing on the internet.
Exactly. I know that whatever I see, it's my fault for not being responsible. The person who posted the thing definitely didn't intend kids to see it. And most of the time, it's not even that bad, but that may just be me.
Children is a vague term relating to intelligence
If you are a child
You can be innocent and stupid
Or you can be the direct opposite
Either way. It’s a broad term
While we do need some "protect the children" culture, most of it isn't what we need. Making sure you guys don't see the naked figure from figure drawing studies done by artists like Rembrandt is not a problem. Making sure you guys don't see nitty gritty politics or moral outlooks is not a problem. You guys need to experience things to formulate your hobbies and opinions.
The things that "protect the children" should be about is making sure you know the red flags of a child predator, and how to keep yourself out of compromising positions. A kid taking a naked picture of themselves for some online partner is not ok, regardless of what massive parts of the furry community would have you believe, because it still counts as child pornography and not only is the person receiving capable of getting in legal trouble, but so are you. Even if they're another kid, it's still consumption and production of child porn. But some communities don't treat it as a bad thing, and it absolutely should be. It puts you at risk of having your pictures leaked, of getting legal trouble, of getting your friend/partner in trouble, and so on. And it's not just about saying "this is bad, don't do it" but giving you the tools to know it for yourself.
When I was young spending my time on the internet, I ran across Onisions channel, and because I didn't have any idea what gaslighting and inappropriate behavior in general was, I actually kept watching him. The whole scandal with him rating underage girls bodies on his forum? I watched those videos as a kid- maybe 11-12 years old, and an impressionable girl. It scares the shit out of me because I recall being sad that I couldn't put my pictures up there because I didn't own a phone.
Kids aren't dumb, but they are a bit naive. I shouldn't have been told, "don't do this because it's bad" (and I clearly wasn't because I got into Onisions shit), but instead "here are some red flags and what these actions/conversations generally mean. Here's how to look out for a bad person by keeping an eye out for gaslighting, etc." I could've recognized that was a creator I wanted nothing to do with if O'd had those skills already developed or at least encouraged. I didn't until I started to get into more political circles, because I needed to know the terminology to explain political behavior and action that I didn't like. I would never have known better were it not for those circles, because my parents and my school never went over anything like that.
I was a smart kid, in honors classes and so on. But kids need to learn critical thinking skills on the plane of social interaction more than anything, and not every child does until it's too late. That's why it is important that your social circles are polices a little bit by people who are older. I wish my parents had kept an eye on me, because I could've destroyed my life over a couple pictures sent to a deranged child predators forum before I ever knew he was a bad person.
The things people police you over are useless- nude figure art, hobbies others find strange. None of that is what's important, and you're right that it is stupid. You can navigate what you do and don't like based on your own personality and ideas just fine. But there is cause to watch what you're doing in terms of other people, and that's not completely idiotic, because older people can manipulate you. Will they always? Of course not. The same time I was watching Onisions, I was also watching genuinely kind creators like Markiplier. But I couldn't differentiate for myself and it's almost a certainty that most kids, just like myself, have some blind spots too. Not every precaution is to ruin your life- some are legitimately necessary. Make sure you're talking to people you trust about the circles you are in- it'll save you grief later.
For the third time in this reply section so far, exactly. I'm out here writing small essays and shit in the comments section of videos like this, and I go around on the internet looking for weird fucked up shit as a hobby, yet no matter what there never ceases to be somebody advocating for internet censorship, as if you could even do that in the first place. To be fair, I'm 16 at the time of writing, but according to them it's 18+ or GTFO anyway.
depends how old you are tbh.
*And this is why I just don’t get involved.*
*exactly*
*bold letters*
Literall...💀
Omg thank you, it's like people want everyone to be *child friendly*
"Wow your 18 and have everyright to look at porn, well too bad my child is more important and you should be treated like a child too -_-"
A few years ago i was underage too but i wasnt fragile enough to get uncomfortable at a ship between a 16 year old and an 18 yearold because i had enough brain cells to know its not real. I saw some one screaming about ships between an adult character and a minor character because she role played as the minor one ,once, with an adult and got uncomfortable bc the person got sexual, nothing even happened. Maybe u shouldnt role play as a character shipped with an adult , with an ctual adult. Maybe u should be smart enough to know that as a kid u should perhaps not trust all adults to be cool and role play with them when u know u will be role playing as a ship??? I swear, these people dont think for themselves.
Pirate .A Kirkland It's never gonna get better
Im a minor and I honestly don't care anymore. Like if people want to draw sexual drawings or read fanfictions that are sexual, go ahead. Like fandoms needs to calm down, if a child uncovers something they don't want, oh well.
And dont get me started on minor and adult ships, ive gotten in way too many fights over this topic
@@wizardsandmuggles3569 Same I agree some people just need to grow up and move on and be mature about it.
It's like taking an amusement park and getting rid of all attractions except the baby train and carousel. Adult people aren't allowed to have fun I guess.
Me, a multishipper, watching ship wars: lol
Mind if I join?
*Grabs out Popcorn* Guys want any?
Yeeeeeaaaaaahhh maybe I’ll just stick to barley talking in the fandoms
@@blazingtimeblazer9004 oh thanks
Sup Grimmi
I had a horrible experience with a toxic fandom, and to this day, I'm still shaken up. I don't know if I should share it here, but if someone wants to hear it, I'll tell.
I was into the ninja turtle fandom, and I really liked this person's art. I remember commenting "I love your art, even if it is for a ship I'm not fond of". The fandom blew up at me and told me I was "a selfish idiot" and that I should kill myself. I told them that I understood why the comment could be perceived negatively, but they took it way too far. I was banned the next day.
Btw: I was like 14 years old when this happened.
Edit: Thank you for all the supportive comments, you guys really made my day 🥺♥️♥️♥️
wow...omg i am so sorry that happened to you! they overreacted. it's completely ok if you don't ship something, that's your opinion.
Yoo wtf... that's so messed up. All you did was compliment that person's work. If anything, that should be a MAJOR compliment, the fact that you enjoyed the art piece despite it not being your favorite ship. Hell, I know I would be honored to recieve a comment like that on ANYTHING I made. That's a top-tier compliment imho.
Now that you mention it though, I remember seeing artists on Tumblr ranting about "I don't ship it but I like it" comments. They were whinging over how "its offensive cause you're like,, invalidating my ship" which is obviously not true. It was one of the stupidest things Tumblr has ever complained about, a freaking COMPLIMENT. One of the many reasons I've left that godforesaken site.
Anyways I'm so sorry that happened to you, people can be such assholes and don't think about what they say before saying it. I hope you're doing better now, or at least better compared to then.
@@mcflurryfrostie You just made my day, thank you so much!
Bruh I was accused of being a racist homophobic pedophile for shipping these two ADULT MEN and making a fanart of them. Like bruh wtf. They kept tagging one of them as transgender (even though canonically he isn't but I don't really care if they make him trans) but damn they were mad I drew him in a gay ship with a dude. Like fuck calm down.
That's horrible! They're the worst. You are precious and beautiful, not everyone is able to cheer on an artist that focuses on a ship they don't like.
Also, from an artist's heart, please keep leaving nice comments on people's art. It really makes our day and of this one can't appreciate it, too bad for him 💙💙💙
Just wanna say, thank you for being one of the few people that talk about this and don’t basically say that porn= toxic part of fandoms
I think a Huge thing is control. People think (even just subconsciously) of fandom as their safe space, their escape, their “let’s forget about real life and chill” - and they want to *control* that safe space, not just because it’s Theirs, but bc there is so much, online and offline, that is simply not controllable. People *want* to have control over their fandom, they want it to be cozy and happy and everything that is good for them - but so many people go about trying to achieve that control by attacking and harassing others.
“That hurts me” or “I think that could hurt me!” leads to essentially a territory war, like cats hissing and marking. “You did this, in my space, so you are awful and need to leave forever!” There’s no way to directly physically attack someone online (thank fuck!) so turf wars are fought through reputation, harassment, bullying, essentially posturing - anything one can do to make “the threat” go away
The trouble is even if some harassment campaigns “work”, there will always be other “threats”, because of the nature of the internet. It is completely natural to want an escape, and to want to control your safe space, but this is an inherently flawed method of doing it! Instead of achieving any quiet or away time, it creates a cycle of the opposite. Again going back to the cat defending territory metaphor (now that I’ve thought of it I think it’s spot on and brilliant), this is a cat who spends all their time driving away threats, from all sides, and never having any time to enjoy what their territory can give them - food, shelter, rest, fun, etc
I don’t know how to like convince all of the internet “hey what your doing is harmful to you and everyone else”
Cause like coming at someone and saying “you’re wrong” causes instant defense and “I’m not listening bc I can’t be wrong” even offline - the convo can’t start that way!
Even if it’s accidentally implied it could set someone off into defense.
There surely a way but at the moment by brain is too tired
You did good video
I am a multishipper but I don’t ship Shiro and Keith because I just can’t help see it as brotherly but I wouldn’t harasses someone for shipping something a lot my ships are hated because people see them as bad
I ship tokofuka and people harass me for it, like my god it’s just too fictional characters 🤦♀️
I've always felt that it's because most of these people had life too easy, and never had the kind of struggles that other people had. This caused them to mature at a **much** slower rate, and can't really differentiate reality and fiction. Just look at the recent thing with the Velma show:
I've watched people get into these 400 reply arguments over the sexuality of a fictional character. She's NOT EVEN REAL, and in some shows she's straight, while others she's gay or bi. But then you got people on both ends accusing each other of being terrible people, and throwing insults.
I don't care who thinks they're morally superior because they got I to a fight over the sexuality of a fictional character, but it's REALLY WEIRD to get into an argument over something so dumb. This kind of behavior is why fandoms like the star wars community is still perceived as adult children throwing tantrums.
No those are people who somehow couldn't adapt to a maybe worse situation than before and decided to be a psychopath from that day on because "I didn't know my life would get worse"
It's the issue of people wanting a win. Because you're right, it doesn't matter. At all. That's why it's fought over because people want something they feel they control or can win at. It's why people get really pissed over small things and ignore the big ones. They want a battle they feel is winnable because the big ones don't feel that way. This is the crux of cancel culture. Attack something small you think you can control and influence, because giant corporations sure don't care. Political groups don't care. But that one person who drew some fetish porn over something ? Tear them a new one, especially if they are a small creator. Either because it's redirection or people get a bee in their bonnet over because it is fictional and not hurting anyone (beyond maybe wanting eye-bleach) it's attackable. No consequences, no real stakes. Except to make someone feel terrible which is the entire goal. Not for actual change or helping anyone. Just gratification over making someone feel shitty because the real people doing truly shitty harmful things, they're generally untouchable.
Having grown up with the Hetalia fandom, it’s sad that this kind of garbage has become the norm. Heck, I’d dare say it’s child’s play compared to now.
Ugh I remember The FRUK vs. USUK.....I was over here Ameripanning in the closet lol
Noire Dove
god i was in the same boat, dude. Like, yALL, let me ship what i want without telling me to kms huh
Ruby Y. i was in hetalia before becoming a shipper and i didnt interact with any fans so that show is still mediocre to me, whereas voltron is not that because i interacted with the fans and had a ship. it sucks that they ruined it for me. i liked that show till the last season.
hetalia
The thing people need to learn, is self-awareness and empathy.
Because the moment they realize that other people have other opinions and feelings on something and understand WHY, then they'll be able to avoid that kind of toxic behavior.
The coping mechanism of fandom stops being a coping mechanism if it's bringing personal stress.
Whenever I see the word fandom I remember michael saying:
*T E E N A G E R S*
"They said : all teenagers scare the living shit out of me"
"Just because a person consumes problematic, fictional porn does not mean that they want to go outside and commit atrocities."
If more people understood this and spoke about this (and more young people had access to proper and safe sex education) then younger people like my past teenage self wouldn't have to suffer for years in silence, thinking that they are absolutely horrible people and hating themselves for not understanding their own sexual thoughts.
period! i agree so hard.
And not feel bad about having these entertaining fantasies.
That's the thing about porn, really: there are plenty of people who don't like it, and it's not exactly hard to understand why that is. But just because they dislike it doesn't mean it's bad; it's very similar to swearing, actually: a friend of mine doesn't like when people swear, and because he doesn't understand, he thinks that swearing is inherently "bad". He even complained once about someone swearing in a text that clearly was NOT meant to be sent to him, so there was really no reason for him to get upset about it, but that's besides the point. Both porn and swearing are things that make certain people uncomfortable, but some people are too stupid to realize that this doesn't automatically make these things bad.
I agree
I had arguments about that topic with others. I asked them "do you believe videogames cause violence?" then they answered "no, that is different".
Bunch of idiots.
Remember those moments where fans would harass creators just because they didn't make a character gay/make their ship canon?
Pro gamer moment.
Lol
People ship Toadette and Peach because of Super Mario bros U since Peach gives Toadette a slight kiss on the head. People were like "Omg Peach is bi" and I got called a homophobe
You mean Voltron?
Thank 👏 you 👏 I was trapped in an abusive relationship and sexually assaulted as a teenager; as a coping mechanism, I read problematic ships, abusive stories, or even rape fanfics. I still do. It has helped me work through my trauma.
Edit: thank you for your support :) it’s nice to admit that and not be shamed for one
I am one of those people who doesn't understand "how?" Not to demean someone's experiences, I've honestly been just curious, how did it help when some fan works or other entertainment can seem so scarring sometimes. Because I thank god haven't experienced that in my life as of now. I don't fully understand how it could work as a positive coping mechanism.
It's horrible what you and so many other had & have to go through..... If soneone were comfortable enough to at least partially explain their point of view, that would be helpful..
THE Berrby tbh I’m not entirely sure myself. I think it’s the relatability of the characters, the comfort of feeling like I’m not alone, but the safety of knowing that it’s fiction.
For me, if there was a disclaimer that the fanfiction was based off of someone’s personal experience, then it immediately went from something therapeutic to something distressing.
@@theberrby6836 Fanfics were mostly written for kink purposes with little to no realistic backgrounds whatsoever. Also as someone who's nearly sexually abused, I don't necessarily mind them since 80% of the fanfics makes no sense and some are admittedly amusing due to the way they are badly written. Of course when some gets very realistically graphic, that's where I have to put my phone down and process (but again, that's not necessarily bad as it's not something to be shield away from any victims just cuz truama imo).
THE Berrby it’s kinda like how abuse survivors are extremely more likely to find themselves in abusive relationships compared to the rest of the population. It helps the brain recontextualize, reliving it in a safe and non threatening way for the body and mind to move past said experiences
@@lurji I'm very similar. My absolutely favorite things to read are Yandere Guy stories. The more aggressive, dominating, innocent "rival" killing and Stockholm Syndrome-y the better. Sadly hardly anything I find under that subject fits my standards for writing so I've thought about just writing my own for my fix. Lol
And I only enjoy it with characters from anime. Even my original stories I see my characters like an anime. I don't really like stories like this from real life movies. Once it involves real people i get uninterested unless it's a high fantasy story like pirates, elves or something not real life and mundane. Lmao
Why fandoms are so toxic
Me, a person from what’s pretty much a dead fandom: *Never heard of it.*
Lol
I’m in a fandom from a musical that came out over 60 years ago. So I’m just vibing.
The fandom im in is dead af lmao
Sometimes small and dead fandoms are blessings in disguise
Animeteor I’m in the Ed, Edd, n Eddy fandom. Tbf, you don’t see anyone these days even TALKING about it. It’s pretty much dead.
Remember when SU fans kept hating on the girl who drew Rose Quartz too skinny? She ended up attempting suicide because of all the hate she got. When those people found out, they leaked the hospital she was staying at and called in the further berate her.
Ironic considering what happened later in the series...
Does anyone know if she's okay now? I feel really bad for her...
Is she okay? Plz I hope she's okay
And it was Tumblr that did it. Tumblr culture is out of fucking control. They're 4Chan for white 20-something Liberal college women who want to feel spesho and appropriate social justice to be about them.
i'm glad i felt bad about watching su as a kid.....
The world is on fire. Fandom is the last place some people feel they can control. It has gotten so bad I don't even make fanfiction anymore out of fear of harassment.
I forgot that some parents use the internet as a babysitter, and thinking back on it COD turned into "get off my lawn (server)" almost overnight.
This might be my cranky bias, but half of these people come across as just being on a pure, unfiltered power trip, and the other half come across as younger people who've been over-indulged, such that they believe that their tastes, morals, and preferences are the *only* tastes, morals, and preferences.
I've noticed among pro-shippers is that they say they are pro discourse but support the most ghastly things and are actually for deplatforming of 'bigots'. Shippers tend to be crazy, but the fact so much cannibalism occurs among these two is entertaining. However, it doesn't bode well for casual observers and critics of content like myself. I'm an adult, I can deal with 'problematic' things. The minute these idiots think they can pitch a clearly dark theme or action as flowery, they deserve criticism.
@@blacktigerpaw1 Stop spreading misinformation about proshippers who literally just don't want people to be harassed over fiction. You're trying rationalize harassing people over things you find "icky" and think thats ok? You wanna talk about how proshippers "cannibalize" each other, how about anti's that send death threats to CHILDREN because they liked "problematic" fiction? Sending gore pics, ACTUAL CSEM, not to mention the blatant harassment and disregard of trauma and CSA victims that make up the majority of the proshipping community. The majority of us have no association in "normalizing" pedophilea, incest or abuse and actively shoo out any pedophiles that try to associate with us. You antis deliberately frame it that way to get supporters to harass us. We can't tag our content anymore because antis will deliberately lurk in tags to make "call out" posts and harass us. Kids, parents and artists have been doxxed by your community, antis have literally ignored and DEFENDED predators and rapists that have been outed in the anti community, your puritanical ways has caused suicides and multiple suicide attempts. The sooner people realise your community is the true cancer of fandom and can see through your puritanical propaganda, the better everyone will be.
This is why I’m just a lurker in fandoms. Aside from posting OC fanfiction, I hardly ever interact with fellow fans unless I think I can say something that there’s a 95% chance no one will be mad.
Obviously, in fandom, the characters aren't "just" characters- they mean a lot to people despite their fictional nature- but the most toxic parts of fandom seem to forget that they still are characters. They attack and defend characters as if they're real people. Like, in the latest season of Sex Education there's this character who interferes with one of the main ships ever so slightly, and now you can't go to a Sex Ed related video without someone in the comments saying "I hate him. I'm going to push him down a flight of stairs. " And there's clearly a line between those who are saying it jokingly because he's dragging out the obviously intended narrative and those who are saying it seriously because they feel personally offended that this fictional human is standing between two other fictional humans they care about. It's fine to care about stories, its great even. But when your care for a story starts to morph into real world hostility (like sending death threats to actors who in no way are the same as their characters **coughcough*STARWARS*coughcough**), then thats a problem. You can't take fandom too personally. It basically comes down to the same thing she said in the video: Fandom doesn't belong to you personally, and when you start acting like it does, thats when things get toxic.
MJ Wise thank you I agree!!!
I will never forget how people send death threats to a 13 reasons why actor because they simply didn't like her characters.
I choose to believe that the simple answer is this: society is filled to the brim with overgrown children who have no respect for others and firmly believe that it's acceptable to act in a disrespectful manner without any fear of possible consequences.
I think people have a hard time believing that people on the internet are people
So one thing I've personally noticed
I' 27, I've had access to the internet from around the age of... 9?
When I was younger my perception of the internet was well it was mostly for adults, but there were some spaces that were for me (We're talking like... Neopets and like the 'Kids account approved' sections of AOL) but yeah through my early-mid teens on the internet I was basically under the assumption most people were older than me and that well the internet was more for them than me.And that well if a sign said DO NOT CLICK I probably shouldn't.
I wasn't that involved in fandom during this time, but also the internet was less open. For example this was when Livejournal and Forums were like how you connected to fandom, a livejournal or a forum is like pretty easy to lock down and you can keep your distance and probably like reduce the risk of someone stumbling into your content who disapproves. Or to keep minors away from 18+ content (I mean I know people ignored those signs anyway but you know). But then social media really kicks off, the internet is then hyper connected
The switch to Tumblr. Well in short TUMBLR IS SHIT FOR KEEPING CONTENT CONTAINED. Reblogging is a great feature, however tumblr doesn't really have that many controls for you to keep your work contained, tag blocking only works if people remember to do that and for ages on tumblr you needed a third party app to do it.
So I can see where some frustration comes from because yeah it can be kind of hard to keep unwanted content off your dash or out of a tag. Tumblr hasn't got much of an age lock either so you know it's a pain in the ass to keep younger users away from adult content and for adult tumblr users to have their own space where they can engage in fandom without being yelled at by teenagers or being told to 'go do ur taxes'
Fandom also just seems to skew 'younger' to me these days, like a lot of accounts from teenagers when on tumblr especially, which I think has def increased over time. I also notice this in some 'discourse' spaces. And like at the risk of sounding old, a lot of teenagers basically well haven't learned good reasoning/debate skills or seem to be into stuff for the sake of 1.trolling 2.some sort of attempts at moral superiority (see for example what happens with a lot of 'transmed' discourse or 'ace discourse, I've seen a lot of shit in there that's basically obviously people thinking these topics are a fun game and them wanting to 'own'people and not it actually being born out of any sense of actual care about the issue,)
Basically people want to be edgy and need an outlet so I guess why not use the internet? There's def a 'culture' I've noticed of basically being an 'edgy asshole' for fun.
Also yeah I see a lot of stuff where you have people in my 'generation' as it were and 'fandom olds' who are like well just existing online and doing like what you've always done in fandom like you know the whole DON'T LIKE DON'T LOOK rule and what not. And then it's usually people say up to around age 21 who seem to be on the EXCUSE ME YOU BETTER MEET MY STANDARDS, ALSO US YOUNGER TUMBLR USERS OWN THE INTERNET NOW AND FANDOM AND YOU MUST DO IT THIS WAY OR ELSE YOU ARE BASICALLY SATAN
I 100% agree on these discourse people. Kids who cannot decide on their genders or identities will call women who don't think transwomen are women 'bigots', and are in favour of deplatforming. They usually are in favour of really, really nasty content 'because it's just fiction', but are against guys like Shadman. So you can draw child porn, write rape or whatever as normal, but don't be Shadman. *Then* you're problematic.
I don't care if characters are aged up and getting gangbanged. It'd be weird, but they're depicted as adults. The minute I ask these people why they are thinking of fictional kids getting rammed up the butt, I'm an anti, or something.
this is the best analysis of fandoms without demonizing everyone but also critizing how awful we all can be. you just won a subscriber for life