You may not be an engineer Wes, but your absolutely right. I am just starting my engineering career,but I spent all my time growing up and now working on stuff and try to keep that in the back on my mind when I'm working on a design. New Holland if your watching, pull your head out of your ass and get this man a pickup that works. He can be your greatest advertiser or your greatest enemy. All you have to do is make it right and he'll tells all about it.
I threw the same fit this morning when my neighbors cows got into my grass. I feel better after watching you vent the same way I vented on his cows when I was running them back across the fence. I love it!
I think you're showing considerable restraint, possibly for the TH-cam audience. Having personally had a piece of hay equipment lay down on me in the face of rain, etc. on multiple occasions, I know how you're feeling. I can also tell you that my language was far more colorful than yours. It's therapeutic and it possibly helps in the repair process.
Hope your mother doesn't watch this one, anyway thanks for posting this video. After showing this one to my grandfather you have talked him out of buying a New Holland bailer, and last year's "no rower" too. If only I could get him to use a JD I'd happy. thanks
Hahaha!! I think Wes was trying to explain that the New Holland pickup system is about as substantial as the first imitation of a baler that a 10 year old boy would build with his grandfather's Meccano set.
Wes, I think the trouble that time was that Tim said he slowed the motor down which means he slowed the revs? he should have kept the revs up and slowed the ground speed down by coming back half or one gear I know you where pissed off but the pickup should have been cleaned out before you tried to restart it again. I am an Ex Farmer.
hi Wes. . we run 2 krone forage wagons here in Ireland. they are 2 new 400 wagons... the pick up on the are fantastic with the cam less tine bars. we do be picking up 30 foot of heavy irish grass with them.. the one thing I see wrong with these balers is the space between the header and the under side of the frame of the baler... with the wagons if u come across a big lump of grass u can raise the draw bar on the 2 big rams which opens up all that area allowing the lump to go straight in... but if the krone baler header is half as good as the wagon headers it should be fine... but that new Holland header boy it's crap.... irish Mike
Just wow. That bailer was stalling that engine (admittedly, not running at full power), but you were easily putting 300 ft/lbs into the bailer and stalling it, that's why it breaks!
The clutch is supposed to give and prevent the breakage way before that point though. It doesn't work correctly and even when it is that chain is way too damn long and way too damn small for the job New Holland is asking. There should be a dual side drive or a gear drive.
Hell, it isn't even so much the layout but the laziness of using the backplate of the housing as the support. All that pressure on that corner of the plate going through that much throw of chain of course it is going to warp it all to hell and take everything out of alignment.
+Robert Hardwick What do you suggest would be a successor, JD??? just to have hydraulic problems and burns out like many many others, these green machines tends to blow themselves up!! Nice machines but they have this tendency.
+Robert Hardwick then he would be in a world of hurt with no baler at all tell him to get a international baler I have one for 15 years never had a problem with it
+rob iscrupe (towmater) Thanks, did International still exists in US or did they are Case now, or Mc Cormic, I had an old International 54? years ago and x2 b 250's they were good tractors, I had x2 Ford 5000's as well and the International pulls the same 3 farrow plough in heavy soil
case and international are one company now with all mcormick farmall equipment to . wes needs to look into getting out of new Holland and come back to americian an get ainternational baler never breaks down
Dear New Holland, Screw Your pickup assembly............... Sincerely, onelonelypissedofffarmer Best video ever! I can see where that design wouldnt hold up,a small chain to operate the whole header and then route it all over the dang place. Trouble for sure. Take care.
I believe I would have dug that big wad of hay out before starting that thing up. I know you have to bale in extreme conditions but you are trying to put way to much hay in that thing way to fast.
+rob iscrupe (towmater) maybe in normal hay conditions. But a lot of the stuff he bales is damp and been rained on and tuff and a lot of his ground is super rough.
+rob iscrupe (towmater) If you go to New Holland's website it says In addition to the Standard crop processing system, the BigBaler offers two CropCutter™ systems: the PackerCutter and RotorCutter. The BigBaler 330 with the PackerCutter system cuts silage, hay or straw, with cut lengths as small as 4.5 inches. So silage is wet and green so Wes's BB340 should still bale wet hay full stop! agriculture.newholland.com/us/en/information-center/news-releases/Pages/New-Hollands-Next-Generation-BigBaler-Features-Increased-Capacity-Bale-Density-and-Productivity.aspx
+heyhey1956 yeah I understand that but it wasn't meant to be force fed big ole wads that jam the reel up. That wad in the video was a fine example just because it has a slip clutch doesn't mean you gotta use it. Those big.windrows you have to drop a few gears and give it some time to pull it in. I know he has a lot of ground to cover but maybe he should have to balers running a little slower and still get the job done. That slip clutch puts a lot of strain on that chain and shafts when it finally engages. I do agree it's a poor design but you have to deal with it and go on to get the job done not test it's limits every day.
Well, there is a saying "Engineers and lightnings are related, when there is a flash, there is damage worth of millions" ps. still that usage looks so ugly, it is no wonder everything is broken all the time....
onelonleyfarmer with you having so much trouble with the pick up i think you should slow your speed down some. i know how much stress and headache it is to always be turning a wrench on junk when you need to get the crop in but sometimes iy pays to just slow down. When i ran Massey Ferguson combines there were days i wanted so bad to just burn it to the ground because regardless of preventive maintenance. i spend more time working on it then running. So i purchased a gleaner and never looked back.
Wes, tell us how you really feel, but this time , don't hold back! Sorry for your troubles. I worked as an draftsman/CNC programmer and I completely agree with you that the design is poorly thought out. Too many moving parts and the stresses applied to the upper sprocket are multiplied with this half-assed design. I know nothing about Krone but based upon sheer parts availability, I would go with Deere. Just my two cents. Good luck!
I don't care how you pronounce Krone, we all know what you are talking about. Hope you get a good and satisfying demo with the Krone baler. Can't wait to see it...
The main problem with this pickup Wes has complained about so is, all those idlers and sprockets are attached to something that isn't much thicker than sheet metal.Then when you get a load or slug in it everything torques to one side or the other and blows the chain off. When I watch the Krone video it looks the pickup frame is twice as thick.
Where I work in the UK we run 2 Massey Ferguson 2270 xd's on the 4x3 side of things and they're pretty good, we also have 4 2190 big Heaton balers, all good, relatively problem free and a much better pickup design than the cheap shit new hollands!
+Tyler Lovell Hi, just curiousness, what is so good, all his videos are good, some can take it as is and some can filter out what they don't like and forgive bad language etc. His experiences are a learning one, interesting and give good performance characteristics of equipment, if it is bad or not, look and learn what you want, there is something for everyone
+Jan Kotze Like you say all his videos are good but this one in particular was very funny and entertaining the way he talks to Tim reminds me of the way my dad is with me it's good to see a son follow in his dad's footsteps he makes great videos
I've always thought a totally independent testing company would be a good idea. Something like the Nebraska tractor test but for everything from balers to combines and before they are released. The trouble is the guy buying the machinery doesn't know what there are for weak points when he buys it. He only finds that out after he owns the thing. Yeah, there is usually warranty but that won't look after the downtime. If someone already put a couple thousand acres on a few of these before they were released to the public, and published the results, I think the buyer would have a better chance of making the best choice from the start. Just a thought
That Krone looks bad ass, German engineering buddy! Looks like they put a pickup off a small square baler on the New Holland FIAT, Fix It Again Tony lol
+Thomas Hood I've owned an E36 and E46. The E30 was defiantly a simpler car to work on, but the E36 and E46's aren't bad. The E90 is fine other than for that electric water pump they put on the N52 ,N54 motors. I would much rather work on an inline 6 bmw engine than any V6 FWD car. I went through my E36/E46 and fixed all the weak parts like the cooling system and the CCV valve. I haven't had anything major go bad since after 100k miles and I drive this car nearly everyday. I gave the E36 to my neighbor and it has 250k miles on with with the original engine and transmission. The E46 I have now has 125K and it still feels brand new. I also own a 2012 chevy silverado, but thats a different story. Germans are always pushing the envelope to make things more efficient and powerful.
+Thomas Hood VAG group is complete SHIT BMW are on the highest failure rate on the fucking planet and mercedes is good but so much electronic shit it cant go right. AGCO is however quite good with their Fendt tractors, but they are expensive.
bimmerman3 Fendt are decent but cant beat SOME of the john deeres value/money wise. The JD after 2012 (idk exactly) are complete fucking junk, every 3k hours you have the replace the filter thing for the emissions that costs 3k!!! I am happy we have 7 John deeres from 2010 to 2012. Fendt has the same regenation thing but they dont break somehow. All fun fun the ''no adblue'' tractors.
From the sound file is making, it sounds like the shaft is pretty hard. Maybe something like a Ryobi version of a Dremel grinder would work. Never mind, I spoke too soon... :>))
yea Wes i am in agreement with you ,, this is just a very poor design there are lots of ways this could be remedied I don't understand why it doesn't have a chain on both sides at the very least I'm not much of an engineer but i am a tinkerer that likes to build stuff and I can see a couple of ways it could be improved one way would be having the chain drive sectioned ,,or having part of it driven hydraulically with a hydro motor I do agree with you on the idea of a gearbox ,, that would be a very good idea and i seriously doubt it would be that noisy ,, it would be heavy , and have a bunch of seals in it to replace but i am pretty sure it would be more reliable than this mess which you have been having trouble with from day one
I used to question how much I'd really use a Dremel tooll but they were cool. So finally bought one and turned out to be my go to tool for many thiings...use it all the time. I wonder if the New Holland representatives watch this deformation of their products.
It needs a sealed compartment with an oil bath. Look at a snowmobile chaincase. Everything is sealed up and automatic tensioner. Oil bath so nothing gets hot.
It baffles me why NH doesn't send their R&D to you for your input on redesign for future baler generations. It appears you have one of the more severe applications here in the US. If they can design a baler to hold together on your farm they would be the world's top baler manufacturer.
Wes, have you talked to NH directly about your design concerns and ideas? You certainly know what you're talkin' about and I'm sure they'd appreciate the feedback.
When you threw it in gear to feed the wad in (I would have never done that... grab a hay hook and get under there and pull that shit out before you throw the baler in gear THEN drive into it and gobble it up... starting a machine that busted on a wad with the wad still in it is about the WORST thing you can do... I pop shear bolts on the driveline of my old Gehl baler from time and time, 99% of the time it's a wad in the pickup... grab the hay hook and spend 5-10 minutes digging it out, pop in a new shear bolt and you're golden. Don't dig enough out, pop in a shear bolt and throw it in gear, and you just threw away a new shear bolt because it'll pop instantly... but at least nothing else breaks, so the shear bolt is doing its job! Difference between good engineering and bad engineering). Anyway, when you fed the wad in, you could see the pickup torquing down under the load from the driveshaft-- all that torquing force overcoming the pickup lift cylinder or whatever, was being transmitted through the drive shaft, sprockets, and chain, and acting DIRECTLY on that top sprocket, bearing, etc. That's an ENORMOUS amount of force! If you had double chains and heavier idler sprocket/post up in that corner, it'd probably be twisting off or snapping off shafts instead. When that clutch "hammers" it through, it puts ENORMOUS loads on all those parts, which is part of the problem and why that corner was bending and stuff. SOMETHING's gotta give, and it's always the weakest link. You fixed the corner so now something else is the weakest link that will break. Agree the pickup is the limiting factor and a stupid design. Now that you know what the weakest link on the machine is, you have to run the machine within the tolerance of the weakest link. EVERY machine has a weakest link no matter what it is... it's the part of the machine that dictates what the "top end speed or load" the machine can handle without breaking. You have to operate the machine NO HIGHER than the load the weakest link (the pickup) can sustain without breaking. Meaning ya gotta go slower, period... Unless you just like fixing stuff; I hate fixing stuff so I run stuff a little slower. Enough breaks "on its own" from sheer wear and tear and dust and heat and filth, without breaking stuff from going too fast. ALSO, when you fed the wad in, I could hear the tines scraping the concrete... that SHOULD NOT happen! I just went to a baler clinic the local Deere dealer put on the other night and their baler guru (who worked at the Ottumwa, Iowa baler plant for about 25 years or so) said their recommendation is to operate the pickup NO LOWER than the thickness of a 2X4 ABOVE THE GROUND... he set the tractor and baler up on concrete, shoved a 2x4 under the baler, and lowered the pickup teeth so they JUST touched it, and locked in the setting with the gauge wheels. THE biggest screw-up I COMMONLY see guys make is RUNNING THE RAKE OR PICKUP TEETH IN THE DIRT! It is THE WORST thing you can do to a rake or baler pickup, period. They are NOT designed for "tillage" and running them in the dirt turns them into a power spring-tooth HARROW; guaranteed that parts will break and the machine life will be cut to a fraction of what it was designed to be! Running it 1.5 inches above the ground (thickness of a 2x4 board) will probably leave a LITTLE hay behind, just like running a rake with the teeth just ABOVE the ground will leave a LITTLE hay behind (usually just really short stuff, but if the hay is really thick and heavy enough to bale (not too thin to really bother cutting it) then whatever is left behind should be practically NOTHING in the grand scheme of things. Running the tines in the dirt will get that tiny bit of "nothing" left behind, along with plenty of scratch marks in the dirt, BUT, it will also cause 10X the amount of repairs necessary and cut the machine's life to 1/10 of what it COULD have been... SO, SET YOUR GAUGE WHEELS LOWER TO RAISE THE PICKUP TINES to 1.5 inches off the floor of the shop! This will leave a little bit of hay in low spots, but it will keep the tines from digging in all the time (other than high spots in the field, which intermittent contact IS OKAY, just not CONTINUOUS contact between the tines and dirt!) and raising it up will prevent it from "digging in" on high spots, which slows the pickup down and causes plug-ups that then break parts or cause the clutch to slip.... Is all this hassle REALLY worth an extra half-bale per field that would be left out there by raising the pickup up to the proper height?? Gotta operate to the weakest link... Best of luck! OL J R :)
I would put/make a double-gear at the output(power) (yes it would require somewhat an extension-shaft a bit) and shorten the chain to power the bottom part of the pickup and the second chain would only power the top (tiny idler gear) ............ Better yet, shorten that chain to power the bottom part, and power that idler (top roller) from the other side of the pickup.....(flipping the roller would put its input-gear on the other side of the pickup and then trying to find some way to power it) True, I do not have the machine in front of me to inspect if it is any/even possible.... but you get the idea... in fact, this is your idea. It is based on what you said the other day about powering the thing from both sides.... only in this case, the bottom would be powered by one side and the top-roller(s) would be powered by the other side....
You know, you might think I'm crazy ,but there are many suppliers of cogged belts and pullys out there . I have seen them in use in much more severe industrial enviornments than what you got there....Caterpiller even markets them. Would it get NH's attention if you designed a replacement kit and resold them??? Worked out for Harley's pretty nice too. Something to think about over the winter....or not.
why not just take that one idler out of there?, have that chain wrap over the top of the gear right under that idle that just broke and have it then go back to the sproket that is applying all the pressure. yes i know it will stress that bearing but hell its worth a fucking try, i would just figure out a way to route the chain a different way and see if that will help
+MrDIY72 haha ye was stoned when i watched this didnt think it through. almost makes ya wonder if there is a way to install a large sprocket and chain on everything, and install gussets on the back side
You can't be the only one to have this problem, of planned obsolescence! When it really hurts is when they have something that works and works well they'll change it just for changes sake
Just a suggestion, with the amount you spend, why don/t you get a design fim to design a pick-up driven from both ends (like you suggested) and yes it would be totally expensive but once it was designed you could sell the plans to anyone who needs one or have them manufactured and sell the "One Lonly Farmer" pick-up.
holy shit lmfao I haven't heard a man cuss like that, since my Gramps was fighting with the pickup on his 851 new Holland. they still haven't learned how to make a baler pickup. time for a krone
Well good luck with whatever you choose to buy for a baler in the future i do think Krone will do well for you and just because its Deere Green does not always mean it is the best lol
Will the New Holland BB340 crop cutter finish the season? Stay Tuned to Find Out!!! I don't know Wes, you might want to send Krone back without a baler.... (as in you buy it in your field.....) (I hope they bring you a Big M to try as well....) Of course, you could try to get a different pickup, and try to mount it to your baler.... Make your own Monster Baler....
Used to own a Case IH BB (Hesston) and the pickup was the weak link....all the internal parts on the pickup reel are about as heavy as you'd need on a small square baler. Now have a NH 330 Standard. So different drive setup to your rotor machine, but I don't have the problems you have. I am also not in conditions your in. The point of my story is I think the pickup on most all balers is generally the weak point. It takes all the abuse i.e. slugs, uneven terrain, and there are allot of small parts that are moving at a very high rate of speed. I would certainly think these companies could make something really good if they wanted it isn't that complicated. I think they don't understand that most farmers would pay the extra $ to have something build HD than to pay current price and it be gone at the cheapest way to save some money and weight.
every pickup/heaader should be designed with a reverser so you don't have to cross your fingers that it doesn't break something else and / or you don't have to dig it out by hand.
You have more time invested in that New Holland baler fixing it, then you do baling hours. But what do you do as a farmer? You gotta keep fixing it and running to get your hay off.
You are right about how to pronounce Krone. In Germany ( at least in my area and where the Krone is ) an e is an e and not at all pronunced a ;) In my opinion you will love the HDP II and don't think I am a Krone fanboy, most of the hay stuff I use is from Poettinger ( Austrian company)
was just wondering if you could explain a little more about why you think deere teaming up with kuhn was a bad idea? lots of kuhn gear around here and it seems to be some of the best especially there disc mowers.... just curious?
do agree that chain layout is beyond stupid. that said that was a big lump of hay. don't you think it would have bin kinder to pull some out instead of trying to ram it in. that just looked brutal
I dont understand why New Holland has no reverseger or a hydraulically lowerd bottom plate. Slippingclutches like the ones build in to this baler are usefull to prevent major damage but they certainly are not reliable beacause friction i a very complex phenomenon. There is never the exact same releaseforce on the clutch. It depends on the surface condition of the friction surfaces, moisture, debris and it even changes with every "clonk" you hear. The Baler my family uses is equiped with a lowerable bottomplate and a friction clutch. Which definetly makes more sense beacuase wehn you lower the plate you give the grass more room infront of the rotor an lower the requiered force on the pickupshaft. It is stoneage material to let the friction clutch hammer till the blockage is gone. Thats like hitting a nut with a brick 1000 times instea of using another way.
i have a question would it be hard to fabricate your own bailer or would it be to costly you sound very aggravated and taking it out on tim wont help but hes got brood shoulders and can take it but id hate to piss him off
+william burgin It is cheaper to buy a new holland baler and use it for 1 to 2 thousand bales and sell it again than making your own one. He needs to try if the krone works and if it works that would be perfect.
TheZwerfer14 I just thought with his mechanical know how he might be able to construct one of his own design I guess you can tell iam not a farmer but just a fan of the show and a city boy lol
I agree with you I don't give a flying fuck how great it looks how quiet it is how wind resistant it is. Can it make a through a fucking day without falling apart all I hear now is it runs so quiet oh it's so smooth. It's s godam piece of heavy equipment should it be comfy yes should it be like a rolls Royce no just get me through the day with no break downs and high productivity and I'm pumped I've been having issues to pain in the ass. And yes the people who think they know the names and blah blah they usually don't and it doesn't matter what the name is as long as u can afford one then you can call it whatever you damn well please
Now that's the day in the life of a farmer. I seen this many times when my husband doing the same thing working on his combine in the field. What dumb engineer though of this. LMAO.
Don't it make ya wonder out of the dozens of BB340 balers NH have sold, how many operator s have pick-up trouble.Not that many I imagine. Suppose they should build Wes a one off baler.
Wes you need to stop holding back and let us know how you feel! It’s a good thing you don’t have another channel where you talk about agriculture and other things on your mind. Maybe you can get something on your twins(triplets) Les’ & More’s channel⁉️
when u got a load on the baler u need 2 start the pto at max rpm's it wont hurt it. & if something does fail, its time 4 a new baler. & i think this time it should be a krone. u would think that john deere big balers would be good becuz there round balers r good..
![[DRIP] ‘Really Like You’ PREVIEW](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/6KYxQ-Udrj0/mqdefault.jpg)
a father and son moment lol sounds just like me and my dad "slow the fuck down" lmao
I was thinking the exact same thing lol.
Same here haha.
You may not be an engineer Wes, but your absolutely right. I am just starting my engineering career,but I spent all my time growing up and now working on stuff and try to keep that in the back on my mind when I'm working on a design. New Holland if your watching, pull your head out of your ass and get this man a pickup that works. He can be your greatest advertiser or your greatest enemy. All you have to do is make it right and he'll tells all about it.
I threw the same fit this morning when my neighbors cows got into my grass. I feel better after watching you vent the same way I vented on his cows when I was running them back across the fence. I love it!
I think you're showing considerable restraint, possibly for the TH-cam audience. Having personally had a piece of hay equipment lay down on me in the face of rain, etc. on multiple occasions, I know how you're feeling. I can also tell you that my language was far more colorful than yours. It's therapeutic and it possibly helps in the repair process.
I wish Wes would be more honest about how he really feels about things! I'm pretty sure he holding back, can't be good for his health.
Hey New Holland, fix your shit! LoL
Hope your mother doesn't watch this one, anyway thanks for posting this video. After showing this one to my grandfather you have talked him out of buying a New Holland bailer, and last year's "no rower" too. If only I could get him to use a JD I'd happy. thanks
Don't hold back tell us how you really feel Wes. Great video
Hahaha!! I think Wes was trying to explain that the New Holland pickup system is about as substantial as the first imitation of a baler that a 10 year old boy would build with his grandfather's Meccano set.
Wes, I think the trouble that time was that Tim said he slowed the motor down which means he slowed the revs? he should have kept the revs up and slowed the ground speed down by coming back half or one gear I know you where pissed off but the pickup should have been cleaned out before you tried to restart it again. I am an Ex Farmer.
hi Wes. .
we run 2 krone forage wagons here in Ireland.
they are 2 new 400 wagons... the pick up on the are fantastic with the cam less tine bars. we do be picking up 30 foot of heavy irish grass with them.. the one thing I see wrong with these balers is the space between the header and the under side of the frame of the baler... with the wagons if u come across a big lump of grass u can raise the draw bar on the 2 big rams which opens up all that area allowing the lump to go straight in... but if the krone baler header is half as good as the wagon headers it should be fine... but that new Holland header boy it's crap.... irish Mike
As soon as you see the title you know there's going to be some cursing, I think you held it together pretty good:-)
ahahahah.. I'm dieing over here from laughing so hard.. " SLOW THE FUCK DOWN " lmfao
Just wow. That bailer was stalling that engine (admittedly, not running at full power), but you were easily putting 300 ft/lbs into the bailer and stalling it, that's why it breaks!
The clutch is supposed to give and prevent the breakage way before that point though. It doesn't work correctly and even when it is that chain is way too damn long and way too damn small for the job New Holland is asking. There should be a dual side drive or a gear drive.
Hell, it isn't even so much the layout but the laziness of using the backplate of the housing as the support. All that pressure on that corner of the plate going through that much throw of chain of course it is going to warp it all to hell and take everything out of alignment.
Take it out in the field and blow it up with DYNAMITE...you will feel better and get lots of views!!!
HA! Very Funny you Idot HA!
+Robert Hardwick What do you suggest would be a successor, JD??? just to have hydraulic problems and burns out like many many others, these green machines tends to blow themselves up!! Nice machines but they have this tendency.
+Robert Hardwick then he would be in a world of hurt with no baler at all tell him to get a international baler I have one for 15 years never had a problem with it
+rob iscrupe (towmater) Thanks, did International still exists in US or did they are Case now, or Mc Cormic, I had an old International 54? years ago and x2 b 250's they were good tractors, I had x2 Ford 5000's as well and the International pulls the same 3 farrow plough in heavy soil
case and international are one company now with all mcormick farmall equipment to . wes needs to look into getting out of new Holland and come back to americian an get ainternational baler never breaks down
Dear New Holland,
Screw Your pickup assembly...............
Sincerely,
onelonelypissedofffarmer
Best video ever!
I can see where that design wouldnt hold up,a small chain to operate the whole header and then route it all over the dang place. Trouble for sure.
Take care.
I was wondering when Wes was going to give up on the file and get the dremel.
I believe I would have dug that big wad of hay out before starting that thing up. I know you have to bale in extreme conditions but you are trying to put way to much hay in that thing way to fast.
+John Wallace hes only going 5 mph. its not going to hurt
+rob iscrupe (towmater) maybe in normal hay conditions. But a lot of the stuff he bales is damp and been rained on and tuff and a lot of his ground is super rough.
question is why is he baling wet hayfor that's why baler breaks let it dry more
+rob iscrupe (towmater) If you go to New Holland's website it says In addition to the Standard crop processing system, the BigBaler offers two CropCutter™ systems: the PackerCutter and RotorCutter. The BigBaler 330 with the PackerCutter system cuts silage, hay or straw, with cut lengths as small as 4.5 inches. So silage is wet and green so Wes's BB340 should still bale wet hay full stop! agriculture.newholland.com/us/en/information-center/news-releases/Pages/New-Hollands-Next-Generation-BigBaler-Features-Increased-Capacity-Bale-Density-and-Productivity.aspx
+heyhey1956 yeah I understand that but it wasn't meant to be force fed big ole wads that jam the reel up. That wad in the video was a fine example just because it has a slip clutch doesn't mean you gotta use it. Those big.windrows you have to drop a few gears and give it some time to pull it in. I know he has a lot of ground to cover but maybe he should have to balers running a little slower and still get the job done. That slip clutch puts a lot of strain on that chain and shafts when it finally engages. I do agree it's a poor design but you have to deal with it and go on to get the job done not test it's limits every day.
Well, there is a saying "Engineers and lightnings are related, when there is a flash, there is damage worth of millions"
ps. still that usage looks so ugly, it is no wonder everything is broken all the time....
Hate seeing you have a hard time with your equipment. But, it makes for an entertaining video.
+Jeff James yea buddy
Hi Wes, You put a spin on that Grandma thing that a lawyer would be proud of. Tim didn't even catch it, either. Good luck on that pickup head. 57
onelonleyfarmer with you having so much trouble with the pick up i think you should slow your speed down some. i know how much stress and headache it is to always be turning a wrench on junk when you need to get the crop in but sometimes iy pays to just slow down. When i ran Massey Ferguson combines there were days i wanted so bad to just burn it to the ground because regardless of preventive maintenance. i spend more time working on it then running. So i purchased a gleaner and never looked back.
man that header was stuffed with hay..
Wes, tell us how you really feel, but this time , don't hold back! Sorry for your troubles. I worked as an draftsman/CNC programmer and I completely agree with you that the design is poorly thought out. Too many moving parts and the stresses applied to the upper sprocket are multiplied with this half-assed design. I know nothing about Krone but based upon sheer parts availability, I would go with Deere. Just my two cents. Good luck!
Yes you are right all the pressure is on the one bearing like you said they should have use to motors
I don't care how you pronounce Krone, we all know what you are talking about. Hope you get a good and satisfying demo with the Krone baler. Can't wait to see it...
found it so funny when he was talking about how to pronounce Krone.
The main problem with this pickup Wes has complained about so is, all those idlers and sprockets are attached to something that isn't much thicker than sheet metal.Then when you get a load or slug in it everything torques to one side or the other and blows the chain off. When I watch the Krone video it looks the pickup frame is twice as thick.
Where I work in the UK we run 2 Massey Ferguson 2270 xd's on the 4x3 side of things and they're pretty good, we also have 4 2190 big Heaton balers, all good, relatively problem free and a much better pickup design than the cheap shit new hollands!
Best video ever
+Tyler Lovell i agree
I also agree. I approve of the language he used. Makes for a funnier video.
Ditto!!!
+Tyler Lovell Hi, just curiousness, what is so good, all his videos are good, some can take it as is and some can filter out what they don't like and forgive bad language etc. His experiences are a learning one, interesting and give good performance characteristics of equipment, if it is bad or not, look and learn what you want, there is something for everyone
+Jan Kotze Like you say all his videos are good but this one in particular was very funny and entertaining the way he talks to Tim reminds me of the way my dad is with me it's good to see a son follow in his dad's footsteps he makes great videos
You talk to Tim just like my dad talks to me. Hahahaha
I've always thought a totally independent testing company would be a good idea. Something like the Nebraska tractor test but for everything from balers to combines and before they are released. The trouble is the guy buying the machinery doesn't know what there are for weak points when he buys it. He only finds that out after he owns the thing. Yeah, there is usually warranty but that won't look after the downtime. If someone already put a couple thousand acres on a few of these before they were released to the public, and published the results, I think the buyer would have a better chance of making the best choice from the start. Just a thought
this one had me laughing
That Krone looks bad ass, German engineering buddy! Looks like they put a pickup off a small square baler on the New Holland FIAT, Fix It Again Tony lol
+Thomas Hood I've owned an E36 and E46. The E30 was defiantly a simpler car to work on, but the E36 and E46's aren't bad. The E90 is fine other than for that electric water pump they put on the N52 ,N54 motors. I would much rather work on an inline 6 bmw engine than any V6 FWD car. I went through my E36/E46 and fixed all the weak parts like the cooling system and the CCV valve. I haven't had anything major go bad since after 100k miles and I drive this car nearly everyday. I gave the E36 to my neighbor and it has 250k miles on with with the original engine and transmission. The E46 I have now has 125K and it still feels brand new. I also own a 2012 chevy silverado, but thats a different story. Germans are always pushing the envelope to make things more efficient and powerful.
+Thomas Hood VAG group is complete SHIT BMW are on the highest failure rate on the fucking planet and mercedes is good but so much electronic shit it cant go right.
AGCO is however quite good with their Fendt tractors, but they are expensive.
+TheZwerfer14 Fendt's are awesome, ask the UK farmers.
+Thomas Hood I go on Pelican parts, Bavauto, oembimmerparts etc to find what I need and they always have it.
bimmerman3 Fendt are decent but cant beat SOME of the john deeres value/money wise. The JD after 2012 (idk exactly) are complete fucking junk, every 3k hours you have the replace the filter thing for the emissions that costs 3k!!! I am happy we have 7 John deeres from 2010 to 2012.
Fendt has the same regenation thing but they dont break somehow.
All fun fun the ''no adblue'' tractors.
From the sound file is making, it sounds like the shaft is pretty hard. Maybe something like a Ryobi version of a Dremel grinder would work.
Never mind, I spoke too soon... :>))
seems like there still is enough room in there to make the thing double chained , might need to adapt some stuff but from the look of it can be done
It looked good on the CAD drawing I bet. Making it work in the real world is another story. Seems they have forgotten how to do that.
yea Wes i am in agreement with you ,, this is just a very poor design
there are lots of ways this could be remedied
I don't understand why it doesn't have a chain on both sides at the very least
I'm not much of an engineer but i am a tinkerer that likes to build stuff and I can see a couple of ways it could be improved
one way would be having the chain drive sectioned ,,or having part of it driven hydraulically with a hydro motor
I do agree with you on the idea of a gearbox ,, that would be a very good idea and i seriously doubt it would be that noisy ,, it would be heavy , and have a bunch of seals in it
to replace but i am pretty sure it would be more reliable than this mess which you have been having trouble with from day one
I used to question how much I'd really use a Dremel tooll but they were cool. So finally bought one and turned out to be my go to tool for many thiings...use it all the time.
I wonder if the New Holland representatives watch this deformation of their products.
It needs a sealed compartment with an oil bath. Look at a snowmobile chaincase. Everything is sealed up and automatic tensioner. Oil bath so nothing gets hot.
Poor Grandma Pandy! It must be hard keeping you two in line. haha. Frustrating work though indeed. Been there done that believe me.
Wes needs a second NH baler. That way he can have one in the field and one in shop.
It baffles me why NH doesn't send their R&D to you for your input on redesign for future baler generations. It appears you have one of the more severe applications here in the US. If they can design a baler to hold together on your farm they would be the world's top baler manufacturer.
Wes, have you talked to NH directly about your design concerns and ideas? You certainly know what you're talkin' about and I'm sure they'd appreciate the feedback.
video has made my day, thanks for the great uploads OLF.
Dig the damn header out
When you threw it in gear to feed the wad in (I would have never done that... grab a hay hook and get under there and pull that shit out before you throw the baler in gear THEN drive into it and gobble it up... starting a machine that busted on a wad with the wad still in it is about the WORST thing you can do... I pop shear bolts on the driveline of my old Gehl baler from time and time, 99% of the time it's a wad in the pickup... grab the hay hook and spend 5-10 minutes digging it out, pop in a new shear bolt and you're golden. Don't dig enough out, pop in a shear bolt and throw it in gear, and you just threw away a new shear bolt because it'll pop instantly... but at least nothing else breaks, so the shear bolt is doing its job! Difference between good engineering and bad engineering).
Anyway, when you fed the wad in, you could see the pickup torquing down under the load from the driveshaft-- all that torquing force overcoming the pickup lift cylinder or whatever, was being transmitted through the drive shaft, sprockets, and chain, and acting DIRECTLY on that top sprocket, bearing, etc. That's an ENORMOUS amount of force! If you had double chains and heavier idler sprocket/post up in that corner, it'd probably be twisting off or snapping off shafts instead. When that clutch "hammers" it through, it puts ENORMOUS loads on all those parts, which is part of the problem and why that corner was bending and stuff. SOMETHING's gotta give, and it's always the weakest link. You fixed the corner so now something else is the weakest link that will break.
Agree the pickup is the limiting factor and a stupid design. Now that you know what the weakest link on the machine is, you have to run the machine within the tolerance of the weakest link. EVERY machine has a weakest link no matter what it is... it's the part of the machine that dictates what the "top end speed or load" the machine can handle without breaking. You have to operate the machine NO HIGHER than the load the weakest link (the pickup) can sustain without breaking. Meaning ya gotta go slower, period... Unless you just like fixing stuff; I hate fixing stuff so I run stuff a little slower. Enough breaks "on its own" from sheer wear and tear and dust and heat and filth, without breaking stuff from going too fast.
ALSO, when you fed the wad in, I could hear the tines scraping the concrete... that SHOULD NOT happen! I just went to a baler clinic the local Deere dealer put on the other night and their baler guru (who worked at the Ottumwa, Iowa baler plant for about 25 years or so) said their recommendation is to operate the pickup NO LOWER than the thickness of a 2X4 ABOVE THE GROUND... he set the tractor and baler up on concrete, shoved a 2x4 under the baler, and lowered the pickup teeth so they JUST touched it, and locked in the setting with the gauge wheels. THE biggest screw-up I COMMONLY see guys make is RUNNING THE RAKE OR PICKUP TEETH IN THE DIRT! It is THE WORST thing you can do to a rake or baler pickup, period. They are NOT designed for "tillage" and running them in the dirt turns them into a power spring-tooth HARROW; guaranteed that parts will break and the machine life will be cut to a fraction of what it was designed to be! Running it 1.5 inches above the ground (thickness of a 2x4 board) will probably leave a LITTLE hay behind, just like running a rake with the teeth just ABOVE the ground will leave a LITTLE hay behind (usually just really short stuff, but if the hay is really thick and heavy enough to bale (not too thin to really bother cutting it) then whatever is left behind should be practically NOTHING in the grand scheme of things. Running the tines in the dirt will get that tiny bit of "nothing" left behind, along with plenty of scratch marks in the dirt, BUT, it will also cause 10X the amount of repairs necessary and cut the machine's life to 1/10 of what it COULD have been... SO, SET YOUR GAUGE WHEELS LOWER TO RAISE THE PICKUP TINES to 1.5 inches off the floor of the shop! This will leave a little bit of hay in low spots, but it will keep the tines from digging in all the time (other than high spots in the field, which intermittent contact IS OKAY, just not CONTINUOUS contact between the tines and dirt!) and raising it up will prevent it from "digging in" on high spots, which slows the pickup down and causes plug-ups that then break parts or cause the clutch to slip....
Is all this hassle REALLY worth an extra half-bale per field that would be left out there by raising the pickup up to the proper height??
Gotta operate to the weakest link...
Best of luck! OL J R :)
I would put/make a double-gear at the output(power) (yes it would require somewhat an extension-shaft a bit) and shorten the chain to power the bottom part of the pickup and the second chain would only power the top (tiny idler gear) ............ Better yet, shorten that chain to power the bottom part, and power that idler (top roller) from the other side of the pickup.....(flipping the roller would put its input-gear on the other side of the pickup and then trying to find some way to power it) True, I do not have the machine in front of me to inspect if it is any/even possible.... but you get the idea... in fact, this is your idea. It is based on what you said the other day about powering the thing from both sides.... only in this case, the bottom would be powered by one side and the top-roller(s) would be powered by the other side....
Your cussing cracks me up.
I enjoy watching the videos
You know, you might think I'm crazy ,but there are many suppliers of cogged belts and pullys out there . I have seen them in use in much more severe industrial enviornments than what you got there....Caterpiller even markets them. Would it get NH's attention if you designed a replacement kit and resold them??? Worked out for Harley's pretty nice too. Something to think about over the winter....or not.
hey Wes been watching your vids for awhile now i respect all that you and all farmers do was just wondering where u got those dewalt safty glasses at
Glad to see you wearing eye protection while grinding!
and if you have 540 pto speed, you can get there with boot and then switch the tractor pto at 1000 rpm, then you have no hydro start up required
How about going to a 80# chain and sprockets.
why not just take that one idler out of there?, have that chain wrap over the top of the gear right under that idle that just broke and have it then go back to the sproket that is applying all the pressure. yes i know it will stress that bearing but hell its worth a fucking try, i would just figure out a way to route the chain a different way and see if that will help
+MrDIY72 haha ye was stoned when i watched this didnt think it through. almost makes ya wonder if there is a way to install a large sprocket and chain on everything, and install gussets on the back side
the round balers are designed to not get out of the tractor if theres a blockage, maybe they should do the same for squares.
You can't be the only one to have this problem, of planned obsolescence! When it really hurts is when they have something that works and works well they'll change it just for changes sake
Love the video I love your "verb" intensifiers lol
This video is a perfect example of why I subscribed to OLF :) Love you guys keep up the good vijya's!!!! Two thumbs up!!
Slowing down with a baler means a gear change lower on the tractor. That will bring less hay and leave the baler at the same speed.
Can't believe you are still using that baler I would have thought it would be on the road by now and an a new baler in its place.
Just a suggestion, with the amount you spend, why don/t you get a design fim to design a pick-up driven from both ends (like you suggested) and yes it would be totally expensive but once it was designed you could sell the plans to anyone who needs one or have them manufactured and sell the "One Lonly Farmer" pick-up.
holy shit lmfao I haven't heard a man cuss like that, since my Gramps was fighting with the pickup on his 851 new Holland. they still haven't learned how to make a baler pickup. time for a krone
Watching since this thing came to the farm. I was surprised when you were welding on it when it was new. Hope the Krone is better.
+Jonathan Holler The Krone 1290 HDPII will kill the New Holland in all aspects!
Nothing makes me any madder than "crap" that doesn't work right.
Well good luck with whatever you choose to buy for a baler in the future i do think Krone will do well for you and just because its Deere Green does not always mean it is the best lol
So WHEN is the Krone baler coming?!
Do you like that pick-up Wes? hahahahahahaha! Krone Exactly!! thanks for the English lesson
Will the New Holland BB340 crop cutter finish the season?
Stay Tuned to Find Out!!!
I don't know Wes, you might want to send Krone back without a baler.... (as in you buy it in your field.....) (I hope they bring you a Big M to try as well....)
Of course, you could try to get a different pickup, and try to mount it to your baler.... Make your own Monster Baler....
took a look at Krones baler on their website. looks complex but extremely heavy duty. From what I read It has NO CHAINS
I'f said in a previous video, that Chinese chain will break and NH will get the blame, stuff the other crap and just use good replacement parts
When it comes down to filing on multi tens of thousands of pounds machinery, you know you're in trouble.
Used to own a Case IH BB (Hesston) and the pickup was the weak link....all the internal parts on the pickup reel are about as heavy as you'd need on a small square baler. Now have a NH 330 Standard. So different drive setup to your rotor machine, but I don't have the problems you have. I am also not in conditions your in. The point of my story is I think the pickup on most all balers is generally the weak point. It takes all the abuse i.e. slugs, uneven terrain, and there are allot of small parts that are moving at a very high rate of speed. I would certainly think these companies could make something really good if they wanted it isn't that complicated. I think they don't understand that most farmers would pay the extra $ to have something build HD than to pay current price and it be gone at the cheapest way to save some money and weight.
every pickup/heaader should be designed with a reverser so you don't have to cross your fingers that it doesn't break something else and / or you don't have to dig it out by hand.
You have more time invested in that New Holland baler fixing it, then you do baling hours. But what do you do as a farmer? You gotta keep fixing it and running to get your hay off.
It was so good I had to post twice. sorry you had to deal with that situation
here in the uk i call it krone, the way its ment to be said........
You are right about how to pronounce Krone. In Germany ( at least in my area and where the Krone is ) an e is an e and not at all pronunced a ;)
In my opinion you will love the HDP II and don't think I am a Krone fanboy, most of the hay stuff I use is from Poettinger ( Austrian company)
Amen on the limp wrist,.they must build them in a bicycle factory hence all the chain.
It is from Holland. they must be smokin' when they made that! You'll need to run it like your high, 2 miles an hour!
was just wondering if you could explain a little more about why you think deere teaming up with kuhn was a bad idea? lots of kuhn gear around here and it seems to be some of the best especially there disc mowers.... just curious?
In German you say the 'e' on the end like an 'a'. I wonder if those little FIAT cars are as well engineered as this pickup.
do agree that chain layout is beyond stupid. that said that was a big lump of hay. don't you think it would have bin kinder to pull some out instead of trying to ram it in. that just looked brutal
Hopefully NewHolland is listening & designs a proper gear box for that P/U & gets rid of that damned chain.
Ford Newholland, Sperry Newholland and now just Newholland. ....... Great Britain?
I dont understand why New Holland has no reverseger or a hydraulically lowerd bottom plate. Slippingclutches like the ones build in to this baler are usefull to prevent major damage but they certainly are not reliable beacause friction i a very complex phenomenon. There is never the exact same releaseforce on the clutch. It depends on the surface condition of the friction surfaces, moisture, debris and it even changes with every "clonk" you hear. The Baler my family uses is equiped with a lowerable bottomplate and a friction clutch. Which definetly makes more sense beacuase wehn you lower the plate you give the grass more room infront of the rotor an lower the requiered force on the pickupshaft. It is stoneage material to let the friction clutch hammer till the blockage is gone. Thats like hitting a nut with a brick 1000 times instea of using another way.
that machine is going to make your mind up for you very soon
i have a question would it be hard to fabricate your own bailer or would it be to costly you sound very aggravated and taking it out on tim wont help but hes got brood shoulders and can take it but id hate to piss him off
+william burgin It is cheaper to buy a new holland baler and use it for 1 to 2 thousand bales and sell it again than making your own one.
He needs to try if the krone works and if it works that would be perfect.
TheZwerfer14 I just thought with his mechanical know how he might be able to construct one of his own design I guess you can tell iam not a farmer but just a fan of the show and a city boy lol
I agree with you I don't give a flying fuck how great it looks how quiet it is how wind resistant it is. Can it make a through a fucking day without falling apart all I hear now is it runs so quiet oh it's so smooth. It's s godam piece of heavy equipment should it be comfy yes should it be like a rolls Royce no just get me through the day with no break downs and high productivity and I'm pumped I've been having issues to pain in the ass. And yes the people who think they know the names and blah blah they usually don't and it doesn't matter what the name is as long as u can afford one then you can call it whatever you damn well please
Tell us how you really feel............I love the video........... the swearing is perfectly appropriate for the BS you are dealing with.
Check the Massey 2270 XD high density baler with crop cutter. At least the pickup drive is better and the name is easier to pronounce than Krone :)
I like his attitude in this video thumbs up see more
Now that's the day in the life of a farmer. I seen this many times when my husband doing the same thing working on his combine in the field. What dumb engineer though of this. LMAO.
HA HA HA I love it when you get mad and tell it like a Real man :) Thanks I needed a laugh
Don't it make ya wonder out of the dozens of BB340 balers NH have sold, how many operator s have pick-up trouble.Not that many I imagine. Suppose they should build Wes a one off baler.
Wes you need to stop holding back and let us know how you feel! It’s a good thing you don’t have another channel where you talk about agriculture and other things on your mind. Maybe you can get something on your twins(triplets) Les’ & More’s channel⁉️
Yep, Hesston has been around for a while, and you need to find a dealer and some operators. Stop fixing that POS and set on it on fire!
So much for trading in that baler. LOL. Great Rant!
when u got a load on the baler u need 2 start the pto at max rpm's it wont hurt it. & if something does fail, its time 4 a new baler. & i think this time it should be a krone. u would think that john deere big balers would be good becuz there round balers r good..