Star Wars in 4K HDR Dolby Vision on Disney Plus Analysis: Is It Fake HDR?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ต.ค. 2024
- We used a proprietary luminance heatmap system (developed by our resident HDR game expert Adam Fairclough, a.k.a. @Evilboris online) to analyse the HDR presentation of the Star Wars Original Trilogy (A New Hope; The Empire Strikes Back; and Return of The Jedi) on the newly-launched Disney Plus streaming service, and think that it's not true HDR.
Comparisons include The Force Awakens and also Captain Marvel on Disney+ played on a 2019 LG OLED.
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My man puts a spoiler warning on a 40 year old movie, a true hero
My man, my man.
people are born every day. People see these films for the first time every day. Hope that helps.
Stats say 50-60% of adults haven't seen first 6 episodes of Star Wars ;)
@@Elderhet and yet ignorant people continue to say: if it's an old film, dont bother with a spoiler alert.
people should use their heads.
@@MrAlexM007 Yep it's a special kind of d!ck that will spoil the all-time great movies for new generations who've not yet had the chance..
The only TV/4k/OLED/HDR review that matters. This is the most highly underrated TH-cam review channel.
Since I do live in graphs I am really missing the reviews on hdtvtest.co.uk. Still I wouldn't want to miss the TH-cam entertainment he comes up with every time.
Could you re-do the sound effects for the entire saga and release it, please?
Quote by George Lucas
LMAO =D
2:20 I don't think I'm the only one who needs to see the whole scene done like that.
I was cracking up here, he’s so deadpan. Wyhoom, ptchow, fhum...
This shit cracked me up hahahahahahaha
Theres a cool Tron/Tec-Noir feel to it.
Yes, please attempt to recreate the "fake" HDR. Thank you for your efforts; I hope that the word gets out in order to compel Disney and other companies to not attempt cheap "upgrades" again!
Want to see that 2
Fuck HDR! All I want is HD for Star Wars and not the godawdul old Scan vom 1997.
Linus Tech Tips actually did something similar in thier 4K Blu-ray general analysis
@@turrican4d599 fuck you. Hdr is awesome when they actually implement it instead of faking It so they can add a hdr label on the box.
Disney plus: We have original star wars in 4k HDR Dolby Vision.
Vincent: Hold my pending OLED 4k TV Review.
Hdr: hold my Vincent's analysis
I've made those exact sound effects since I was a child so I'm submitting a TH-cam copyright infringement takedown for this blatant theft.
It would be nice to see this test with The Mandalorian. I felt that the HDR was very flat on that one.
I felt the same from what I saw too. Maybe we can take a look at that too if there is demand
I felt the same way. It got a little better in the latter half of the first episode, but the first half looked dull and washed out. I know it’s a dustbowl setting, but still.
@@EchoDissolve The first half lacked contrast in SDR as well.
Same, felt like the image was also too soft.
Are you saying the HDR version was flat compared to the SDR version? Or is the color grading of the show supposed to be flat?
FORCE AWAKENS is a "native" HDR film that had a Dolby Vision theatrical release. The overall look of the original trilogy films is much darker than their SDR counterparts and I can readily see the HDR in lightsabers and explosions and such - and darker areas like space where the stars shine brightly against their black background - something not captured on previous video transfers very well. It still exceeds the range of SDR (however slight). It's a modest application that respects filmmaker intent.
Do you use HDR10+ or Dolby Vision? Without dynamic metadata it is not very good..
@@lolerie DV on my Sony XBR Z9D
The sound effects, priceless!
** Vooom, pew, phooom! ** Just pure gold!
Your review was very timely. I have been questioning the quality of Disney's HDR offerings on videos not out on 4k disc yet, with Star Wars at the top of that list. I couldn't find any reliable information until your review. Excellent job. I'm assuming then they are also digitally upconverting to 4k instead of scanning film negatives in many cases too. I thought the UHD alliance would have some kind of specification for being able to advertise something in HDR. Sounds like the wild west.
Fantastic overview here Vincent! I was wondering about this, and bam - there’s your video!
That was extremely good.Ive got the 4k skywalker boxset on pre/order for 20/4/20 and I’m praying the HDR content is better than what you have just shown us from the streaming content
Vincent: Love your technical analyses and your sense of humor. Thanks for the sound effects! :)
Yes please, would Like to see what a real HDR will look like in these Original StarWars movies.
Vincent, the original Star Wars was filmed on Kodak 5247. A film stock that is now 60 years old (it was originally introduced in the 1950's). How much dynamic range do you really believe could be squeezed out of that source, regardless of the process used for HDR remastering? It's a bit silly to put it up against movies shot in the last decade and act shocked that it does not show as much dynamic range.
According to Walter Volpatto who did the color grading for EP VII and up, the original master was done with a Rec709 conversion (ARRI-X-2) at the end.
So with the newer films they had a way better source (ARRI Log C and grading and VFX done in Log C as well) and a proper pipeline to make it real HDR with a new output conversion Lut by ARRI while the older movies are just conversions...
Thanks , that’s really interesting and sits in line with what we were seeing. Is this new information?
@@EvilBoris he posted about it on Facebook like 1-2 years ago. And it explains your observations.
Changing from a Log-C->Rec709Gamma 2.4 conversion to a Log-C->Rec2020 PQ conversion and changing some stuff before should result in pretty convincing HDR grades, while stretching some finished master probably not so much ;)
Even though the Master source is limited, would the released BR4k that you can buy now have a better quality of grading or should we expect about the same with what disney+ is showing us currently?
Walter did not grade 7
@@GeekaddNet So, that's a no?
The sound effects are hilarious! You are truly awesome!
I am interested in seeing if the prequels have the same treatment, my initial guess would be yes
same here!
The prequels look half assed as well. I would bet the house they were upgraded with using the same tools as the original trilogy were.
I've got all 6 4k UHD HDR10 Dts.master audio 6.1 converted to 4k disk
@@chadbrick67 how do you get them?
@@somespoiledfanboy got them from my Russian friend
So Disney is using Red Dead HDR for the original trilogy. Lame.
These movies are the special editions so no one should really care anyway.
@@gjk2012 Yeah, I was going to watch them until I skimmed forward and found Vader screaming "Nooooo!" before saving Luke.
@@TheGreatMunky I recently download the Harmy's Despecialized Editions. Its worth the download. Disney can go to hell.
@@gjk2012 I have the despecialized versions. I was hoping to get a 4K release and good HDR. There is a 4K fan release floating around online, but I haven't had a chance to grab it. Each movie is like 46GB.
@@TheGreatMunky Harmy might make 4K updates for the movies. If they release 4K blu-ray copies I might get them but because of Disney Plus they might change their minds to release them and wait a few years.
Hello everyone ... my name is Vincent Teoh. I am a television reviewer and professional calibrater ... foley artist ... and genuine comedic giant. 👊😎👍
The 20th Century-Fox logo and fanfare was restored in Disney+ print of Star Wars: Episode V - The Empire Strikes Back (1980) in 4K with Dolby Vision HDR.
Thanks! As a fan of THE (original) Star Wars movies, you have spared me of investing in these HDR fakes.
Thanks for that Vincent I will hang onto my DVD's IV / V / VI with the original theatrical release on and wait for a propper blu ray 4k version on disc if ever! Keep the vid's coming
Tanky Man just download the 4K scans of the original film that are available. Looks great.
What about the hdr for prequel trilogy? And how is the actual 4K for all films, it’s still compressed compared to blu ray or does it look sharper?
To the first question, Evil Boris replied to someone here saying it is the same with the prequels. To the second question: thedigitalbits.com/columns/my-two-cents/111519-1700
Vinny, I don't say this lightly. I watch ads for you.
PS: do the Pixel 4 display/camera and I'll watch even more ads.
PPS: maybe have Boris do Stadia?🤔
Great review, no way anybody can dispute the Heat Maps. Vincent already stated at the beginning of the review that he could not find out whether the original Star Wars are streaming in true HDR or not. No malicious intent from him, just the truth.
Well, at least it is in true 10 bit and DCI-P3 color gamut.
Are the 4k blurays for the original trilogy any better?
Hello Vincent in the video you state that Star Wars is not in real hdr since the nits never really get above 500. Does this mean that the A9G does not do real hdr since it’s max nits are around 600 and the C9 tops out at 700 nits.
2:04 Maglunky, I see what you did there Vincent - you must be a big SW fan :O)
@Mark Bennett Yes I'm pretty sure it is. Another George tweak that I believe only Disney has at the moment.
Yes. I believe the word "Maclunky" is Rodian for "watch the Despecialized versions of this film"
He’s definitely a big Star Wars fan as he never mentioned The Last Jedi in any of the comparisons 😆👍
@@PaulScullion55 A man of taste if I ever saw one!
Nice one Vincent. Very jealous that you’ve got access to Disney plus (in the uk ) share the secret. But feel comforted that I’m not really missing out on much. Helps a lot as I was very annoyed that Apple TV wasn’t carrying 4K versions of the Star Wars movies.
Vincent your humor is the best don't stop
Love your work, and loved your sound effects even more. I want to see the whole Star wars original trilogy with your sound effects in them.
Would have loved to see this HDR comparison side by side with the 4K UDH Blu-ray discs as well.
Please check out the 4k77 project and 4k83 project. Those were 4k scanned original theatrical films. They aren’t hdr, but perhaps you can contact the creators and you can work with the high quality original files to make an hdr version. Thank you.
Are you going to do the same with the prequels?
Best tech channel on TH-cam! :D
Sort of disappointed that he didn’t do Vaders breathing effects lol
Please do the same analysis on The Mandalorian.
As I've seen commented elsewhere, it's possible that Disney+ purposefully using Dolby Vision in order to take advantage of the wider color gamut of Rec2020 without any HDR.
Bryan Hulke isn’t it BT2020?
How dows this heatmap work? Is this a software filter or a hardware device?
It's the heatmap camera that stares into the TV capturing the bright spots and then converting that to luminance levels. :D
sermerlin1 in 4K?? :-0
@@Keneo1 Yes they announced all 1-6 parts to be released on UHD blu ray but still not confirmed date but early "next year". Maybe we will get this version or maybe we will get to see the real 4k UHD version how it's properly done.
@@Keneo1 well, i suppose in full hd. 4k heatmap will coast crazy amount of money🤔🤔
@@lolerie there are no 4k Thermal cameras. Not even 1080p
this was something I talked about with a friend of mine about and the problems with internet connection speeds bandwidth and colour correction or softening in the prequel trilogy movies and waxing images and filtering of grain levels in older films not shot on digital that’s why I prefer discs
Wouldn’t the dynamic range be limited to whatever the original film stock was?
Jimo368
Yes, which is more than 8-bit SDR.
You should compare quality of streaming compression used by services like netflix, amazon and disney.
Thank you for this video. Subscribed.
Its a good jump from the blu ray on my Lg C9 oled /apple Tv which plays it in dolby vison n more importantly in Dolby Atmos.
Nothing beats physical media and eventually ,hopefully all of the Star Wars will be released in a true remaster 4k hdr/dv format until now this is good hold me over more or less.
Thank Vincent/hdtvtest for being on top ,(bing) ? Of things.
there is a fan restoration of the theatrical cuts called "4K77/4K80/4K83" and the 4K83 version of Return Of The Jedi does have a rather nice HDR version done by tekno3d
Please compare different TV models to eachother.
You could put 2 models of most popular brands.
For example:
SONY OLED vs Philips OLED vs LG OLED vs Samsung OLED
And SONY LCD vs Philips LCD vs LG LCD vs Samsung LCD
And you can also compare picture quality with the factory settings, and which gives the best picture with tweaked settings.
I would love to see which brand gives the best picture on OLED TV, and which brand gives the best picture on LCD.
Exceptional video as per usual - this was an excellent way to present HDR.
Would you be able to address the issue you alluded to regarding gray/washed out looking streaming HDR content? I'm almost always disappointed with the visual quality of streaming HDR (Dolby Vision or otherwise) on my OLED, while physical quality media always looks exceptional. I understand the bitrates are vastly different, but I'd like to know more about what the technical differences are that lead to the effect. The Mandalorian is a good recent example.
im watching this on a C9 OLED its crazy how modern it looks in dolby vision
Exactly you need a good tv. Most of these crack heads on here have low end tvs
Could you make a whole track where you will do all the soundeffects please
I need you to start reading me bedtime stories when I'm high ....
so every night?
@@daveninjaneuro7089 no 2-3 times a day.
Since more and more Dolby Vision content is coming out, will Samsung ever decide to support it? Is it possible for then to add this support via a firmware update and allow current and previous models or is the lack of support due to hardware that would have to be replaced in a new model.
SUPER helpful, thank you! And yes, give it a shot w/the brightness on SDR please
The originals with Vinces effects are still better than the new ones. Og theatrical cut on 4k ray, NOW!!!!
Google 4K77
@@MrChomiq harmy will be doing 4k version soon
@@johnnytopgun6414 and 4K80 is currently being scanned, they just need the funds to finance it
Thanks for the laughs am I glad I watched this video haha! On another note I seen the video you made on the ubp x700 I agreed that it looks cheap n nasty.. (although I did buy one) . I am wondering if I need to turn off the dolby vision on that for hdr or does it matter?
Wow, these releases are surprising news on Disney's behalf. The fact that they're not true HDR is not surprising, however. I also don't believe for a second that Disney did some frame by frame color and noise restoration and UHD scanning of original film negatives. No way in hell. So these are most likey not the original theatrical releases which projects like Harmy's Despecialized Editions have painstakingly recreated. I'd like to get more info on these regardless. A 10Mbit video stream is what you would expect from a 1080p Blu-ray, definitely not 4K.
Is this the same thing with the new 2020 blue ray 4K Edition?
Thank you for testing this EvilBoris and Vincent
A nice upgrade for sure but it appears they're being too generous applying the HDR label.
Very interesting! Your videos are next level information. Kudos to the quality of content!
I have a Sony a8g and have noticed that 4k hdr and Dolby vision looks better on Netflix’s compared to Disney+ that’s why when I saw the title of this video I was intrigued find out what this guy would say
Is this also the case with the 4K discs of these movies?
I didn‘t know the Prequles even had any range to extend.
Is the new 4K blu ray version any better?
Does the HDR and Dolby Atmos features work on mobile??? It doesn't seem to in my case.
Bravo once again. It was very informative. I love your sense of humor!
I would've watched this for a third time if the sound effects kept going. Just sayin'.
And thank you for making this. This was what I expected to have happen, something in a 4K HDR wrapper - but it's empty sweet, or tart, nothing nourishing. Just fluff. 400 nits at the highest end. Oof. Well done.
One of the problems is probably the scanning of the original 35mm film stock. If this HDR release is a reworking of the original digital scan which was done back in the late 90's then it will be lacking in dynamic range. To do this properly they'll need to rescan the original stock with more modern scanning equipment at maximum resolution, which would then mean they'd have to redo and re-render all the additional animations which were added at the time of the digital reworking by Lucas.
Would be a great idea to simply remove the awful animations and give us the original movies as were released.
@@Lg_tuber 3 years later lol. I had a DVD box set my wife bought me of all the original 6 movies including the first three in both versions. Of course not in HD though.
@@Cell1969 yep, hope not too late 😆 of course I mean in 4k hdr
@@Lg_tuber It appears there is a 4K HDR bleu ray disc set released already. Do a google and you'll find it, dependant of what you country I guess.
Amazing work. I knew disney was cutting corners.
Great job Adam Fairclough/+Evilboris. Well done!
those sound effects made laugh the whole night. do you have patreon? or any other method of contributing to this channel?
Your channel would develop a HUGE following if you made a series analyzing popular streaming movies and services according to quality of HDR. Similar to your series with HDR analysis for video games but for streaming shows and movies. I know you have a playlist for HDR streaming services and movies but it only has 4 videos in it.
Also, if you compile a video of best streaming shows/movies with HDR, that would get a ton of views.
All with luminance heat maps of course. That's what makes your videos stand out.
Great sound effects!!! It really made my morning
How about the colors? Its 10-bit colors though right? So it should still look a lot better.
Well.. it was graded in 400 nits, but I don't see any evidence that the dynamic range is not HDR 10bit. Usually those uprenderings are done in a 12 or 16bit environment in machines that will render new colours in between and therefore add additional contrast and dynamic range (just like Sony TVs do with the video setting in the menu that is always set to low to add additional dynamic range where dithering or colour banding occurs in 8bit, although banding shouldn't even happen in 8bit if rendered correctly). Even if converted back to 10bit HDR, there's definitely more colours used than in the original 8bit colour range after upscaling the colours.
I wonder if this will be the same results when the 4k discs become available at the end of March
Thumbs up for sound effects
Vincent, do you have a link on calibrating a 2019 Vizio M-Series 4K HDR 55" Quantum TV? Thanks!
What about colors? Is there WCG in place or is it also a 8 Bit upscale?
Great Video Mate!!
Do you guys have TV HDR settings per tv models somewhere, thanks.
That was very informative!! pure gold!! Ty
I like the idea about a follow-up video where you will try to recreate this fake HDR using only TV settings on the 1080p-SDR-Blu-rays. Please do so!
Sound effects killed me lol thanks
Thanks for this. I thought I was losing my mind. It does look better overall, but you're spot on in this analysis.
The snow scenes in ESB might be the most interesting case, curious how the new "tweak" compares to similar scenes shot with hdr highlight detail in mind. (You don't want snow scenes to blind people, so you need to be very careful about adding highlights in key parts of the frame to make the effect work.)
I haven't seen the new movies in HDR so not sure how the effect works, but frankly I'm not interested in seeing solar-bright hotspots injected into the lightsabers/background lights of dark scenes in old movies, IMO it'd ruin the original lighting/look.
ESB is the only one of the original trilogy which was heavily cropped and Noise filtered - everything looks flat and like wax 😞
What's the data rate for these movies from Disney+? Supposedly it's 4K resolution but I can't image the data rate is even half of that from a Blu-Ray, especially the peak rate from action scenes. I assume Disney+ is using H.265 which is better than H.264 but going from 8-bit to 10-bit makes it harder to compress (because there's a heap of noise in those extra two bits).
Disney's 4K streaming bitrate is around 15 megabits/second. Pretty much the same as what Netflix offers. Both are substantially below 4K Blu-ray which can be up to 100 megabits/second.
I look forward to a comparison between Disney+ 4K Dolby Vision and the physical 4K Blu Ray release when that comes out!
One can "only hope" when the whole Box Set of the Star Wars Trilogy comes out in 2020 it will have THE TRANSFER IT DESERVES and not some lame (that will do) picture!
We DEMAND from Disney you put "time into the transfer" with REAL HDR and Dolby Vision too!
I like many others thought it was a BIG mistake to let Disney buy the Rights to this precious franchise!
My God, as Vincent here just proved for ALL to see Disney+ can't even get REAL HDR right!
This Box Set MUST be...,
A damn good transfer!
Damn good HDR!
Oh and not asking for too much..., A DAMN GOOD DOLBY VISION PICTURE QUALITY!
I think that is not true HDR for the first 6 episodes... I think they will show up when they get released on UHD blu ray early next year.
Revenge of the Sith seems to have a great HDR implementation. I don't have any professional tools of course but it blew me away.
the UHD Blurays are exactly the same as the Disney+ versions.
@@evooff yeah i saw it. Damn. I was disappointed. But at least it has 3 times or more bit rate so action scenes look much cleaner.
If my TV only supports HDR10+ do I get any HDR benefits from Disney+?
What about Episodes 1-3? I assume it’s the same for those too?
Thank you for the video, would you be willing to re-do the sound effects of all the movies ? Cheers !
Thanks for breakdown. Downloaded 4K 77 of original Star Wars & it looks great with JVC 2000 with Frame Adapt firmware. Disappointed in 4K disc
2:21 hahaha that made me laugh so much, legend
HDR is much more then peak brightness.. The biggest noticeable thing in HDR is wide colour gamut and better contrast. People usually say things like "woah that colour pops" Not "woah that light saber makes me squint"
What about analysis of the wide color gamut?
Vinnie, are defective pixels common on OLEDs? I ask because of 6 OLEDs I’ve tested NONE was pixel perfect. Every unit had at least 1 defective pixel (black or just stuck) , and I’ve also seen dead pixels on units in stores. Of course they are not visible at a normal viewing distance. I was just wondering what you think about this. Is this very common?
Interesting. Though i heard that it is not very common, because OLED is printed...
Валерий Заподовников I’ve seen with my eyes almost 15 panels with that specific defect, either in my house or in stores around the world, fortunately they are not visible in actual content, but still it’s extremely annoying to have what is basically a defect on a TV that costs that much money. I’d like to have a flawless display.
@@francescofoti236 alas. I'd like that as well.))
Best reviews on You Tube, thanks for the facts
Very interesting - You're very clever & thorough - Respect to you !
Nice video once again. Thanks
Thank you vincent! I was expecting exactly this