I do not think the last Tenet is a contradiction of the Tenets with themselves. Rather it is a safeguard meaning that nobody who claims to follow the Tenets can do evil and then claim he is following the Tenets. Also this makes sure they remain guiding principles instead of literal doctrine.
I think it's a solid one to have. You don't want someone too dogmatic that they lose sight of what the Tenets were meant to be a way to guide people to be good.
Satanic beliefs require the capacity for paradoxical thought & the nuance of wisdom. (The more we know about a thing -- the more our knowledge shapes the thing we see.) 🐍 One of the greatest acts of love, is to freely give the gift of knowledge to another.🐍
that is definitely what you are supposed to think, and I am sure many who hold to these tenants believe that. that said, it is still problematic, because it provides an easy out if anyone tries to call them on their hypocrisy.
@@NeonCicada "The more we know about a thing -- the more our knowledge shapes the thing we see." this isn't paradoxical. and freely giving knowledge is easy. if that is the greatest height of love, than love isn't worth very much after all.
Particularly as an ex-Catholic Satanist, I appreciate this video. It is rare for me to see a good faith examination for either the tenets of Satanism OR of Christian doctrine. While I obviously disagree with a number of assumptions and assertions made, the respect and consideration given here is heartening and exactly the kind of discussion I would hope that we could all have with one another. Thank you for doing this video and if nothing else laying a good example for how to approach one another with respect for each other and a heart of love for people as people.
I agree, they did really good with the video although some of the assumptions that they made while discussing the tenets were a really far reach Imo and it kinda made it seem like they were trying to find a reason to disagree. either way, I really appreciate how respectful they were being and how it seems like they are willing to co-exist with satanists.
I'm sorry but someone's going to have to explain to me what a "Catholic Satanist" is. As a Satanist, this is the first time I've ever heard of anything of the sort.
@@sinik07 the issue is a lack of clarity in punctuation or grammar. I wouldn’t know what “Catholic Satanist” either, but when typing this initially “Satanist who formerly identified as a Catholic” seemed rather cumbersome.
@@AJ-wh1tw ah yes, I figured but didn't want to assume (since there are different sects of satanism, I figured this could be one). Yes, lack of grammar/punctuation would indeed be the issue of my misunderstanding, thanks for clearing it up 🙌🏽
Yeah that was my first thought aswell. Also i wouod love to see Christians going equally far into the philosophy of the ten commandments and trying to find some mistakes there because thats overdue a couple of centuries.
If your “Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world” how do determine your morals? Do *you* set the bar for what is good and moral or do you adhere to the public authority’s ideas? Either way it’s hard to scientifically prove morals. I’m truly curious what your answer is.
@@youtubegirl149 human morality is fairly universal on many aspects, I go by this rule of thumb: if it benefits someone or society it is a net positive, if it detracts for someone or society it is a net negative. Alas, I also don’t view things like “homosexuality” or “transgenderism” as inherently bad. They’re just descriptors of an individual based on their life experiences and societal perception. How do you define your morality, by a book that’s nothing more than a compilation of fairy tales? Science has time and again debunked the Bible, if you wish to see more of this I recommend looking up AronRa. He’s an atheist educator who specializes in life sciences, specifically evolution.
@@Skurian_krotesk I grew up in a Baptist church and I’m glad to have gotten out of such a toxic environment. I have a decent understanding of the Ten Commandments and I can say that we’re better off ignoring them.
@@LexieLPoyser I am truly sorry you have been hurt in Any church. I have been hurt by people too. God said to not put your trust in any man. All you can do is your best.
Satanists do not believe in a literal satan. We do not "worship" satan, and or any other being. We believe in ourselves and that we are the masters of our own domain, instead of blindly believing in a fictional character in a book that teaches people to refrain from doing what is in the human nature, thus not allowing a human being to enjoy their lives to the fullest extent (as we should considering our time here is short and NOBODY knows where we go post mortem) And instilling the "fear of god". We refuse to fear any force that has no solid evidence of being real, and we do not waste our time dwelling in that matter. Ave Satanas 🖤
This is a modern view of Satanism. Please understand, some of us do worship. That is our will. I have no problem with your being an atheist. My belief in entities of any kind does not make you unable to be a nonbeliever. All I ask is please don't do what Wiccans do and throw us under the bus. Don't introduce yourself all the time by saying your not us, defining what we do as bad or sinful. It's hypocrisy on your part. Hail Satan! Hail Lilith!
Hi there. Member of The Satanic Temple here and I just wanted to say that I really appreciate this video. Taking a step back and really going over the values of another belief system, especially one that comes across as so strongly opposed to what you believe as TST does with a lot of those of Christian faith, is a difficult, but necessary thing to do. I am of the mindset that I need to always be open to new ideas and arguments, to be willing to challenge my own beliefs. If someone is kind enough to hand me a pamphlet about their church, I'll give it a read. I feel secure enough in my own rational thought processes to not just believe everything someone hands me as the truth. I know folks love to hate on the JW's as well. I spent a year studying at a Kingdom Hall in northern VT to better understand the JW faith and teachings and can honestly say that it's not for me, but understanding their beliefs on that level allows me to have a better and more meaningful conversation in the even that they stop by. If you want to talk to me about Jesus, that's fine, but we both need to enter into this conversation calmly and willing to change our own viewpoints, otherwise it's just an argument with no goal other than to argue and there's no point in wasting our time. I hope all of that makes some sense and thank you again for taking a close, objective look at The Satanic Temple and giving your honest feedback on it.
Yes, I'm looking through the comments and I'm only a third through the video but I came here, thought I was going to be mad, but so far its very respectful and I can respect that.
*Catholic Answers* john 3 16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son Jesus Christ, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
I think the Satanists should perform a post mortum conversion ceremony and make Jesus an honorary Satanist. It's one of the highest honors a human can be bestowed. Hail Satan \m/
I am a member of the satanic temple. I just need to say that you guys did an absolutely spectacular job of explaining our religion. I obviously disagree with some of your point about god, but you did TST justice. Such a refreshing thing to see, as most christians just brush us off once they hear the word Satan. Once again, amazing job.
Hey Sean, thanks for taking the time to listen and for your kind comments. Please do call our live show some time! 888 318 7884. Be careful though, we will try to bring you to Christ! Peace friend.
I just joined the satanic temple and I think you have given a fair assessment by taking the tenets at face value. And yes there is some ambiguity in some places but that is on purpose, because morality and ethics is a back an forth cooperative pursuit. We are to hammer out our morality upon the anvil of reason and temper it with compassion. You have been very charitable and I would be happy to know more Catholics like you. I wish you well.
I'm not going to say that I agree with 100% of what you have to say about my religion, but I want to give you credit for being fairly even handed, well researched, and companionate. I was not expecting a video about Satanism made by Catholics to be as good as it was. Thank you so much, and Hail Satan! :-)
With a truth turned eye, the TST reaffirms my trust in God and the Bible. Their very nature is reflective of Genesis and the idea that Pride is the sin of Satan and that the tst is the rejection of spirituality in order to worship self is ultimately wholly Christian in doctrine.
I think that at some point a nation needs values and truths to agree on. This country will either center on a religion or on the religion of secularism. Truth is exclusive and will not tolerate excluded alternatives. To permit other beliefs among yourselves is fine so long as your beliefs continue to be asserted strongly. This was a Christian country for the first two hundred years, and in becoming more non-Christian it violently seeks to know itself by another means, and secularism offers no means except to persecute things which are not secular.
Secularism is not a religion, it is a political system. This country has never been a "Christian country" it was founded on enlightenment ideas, which includes the separation of church and state. Secularism is the separation of church and state. If you're anti seculariam, you're putting religion before patrotism.
@@captaincookie2785 Keep telling yourself that guy. I've spoken to enough Atheists who spoke just like a cultist to know that being a materialist doesn't make them any more logical or less prone to pontificating on things that they couldn't prove, could model, and called everyone stupid for not believing in it. Religion in my mind is any idea that binds thought without demonstrable proof. By that definition, everyone I've ever met is religious.
@@captaincookie2785 Let me sing you a bit of the fourth stanza from Star Spangled Banner. "Oh! Thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand, Between their loved homes and the war’s desolation, Blest with vict’ry and peace, may the Heav’n-rescued land, Praise the Pow’r that hath made and preserved us a nation. Then conquer we must, for our cause is just, And this be our motto - “In God is our trust.”
@@captaincookie2785 I don't think the founder's foresaw Satanists giving "blessings" in court houses. I think the separation of church and state was to cut down on sectarianism within Christianity rather than giving entirely different faiths equal status.
Hey, I really liked how neutral you went into the whole topic and being open minded about our religion. We can really just have a conversation about the issues that we adress if everyone goes in to the topic like you guys did, even if we don't have the same view on things. So thanks for that. I just wanted to add that we don't just 'use Satan to trigger'. It just feels a lot more than that and because I have grown up knowing the biblical stories it also means a lot to me that it is part of the religion.
@@curator6971 Satan is a symbol for freedom from opression. In the biblical story but especially in later works (like the revolt of angels by anatole france) satan is the highest of angels who revolts against an allpowerfull god because he understands his wrongdoings. Satan by the biblical story is the first entity to go by secular rule instead of the rule of god, and with that he saw that god is evil. The god of the bible (if he existed which I dont believe) is evil. He gave us sickness and death, he tests us eventhough he created us himself and since he is all knowing he shouldnt need the test. Satan is the first one who saw that. So the idea is that Satan started to make people think for themselves and only because of that he is outcast by god. (And I dont believe in god nor satan, but its a very important story and my takeaway from it)
@myotiswii Briefly consider that, should Satan actually exist, with grace and wisdom would be the way he should seek to be depicted. Artwork before the 1600s depicts the Prince of Darkness as a cunning and vile thing, which is certainly more apt. Should this being exist, his sole motivation is to draw us to him so that we may spend eternity under his heel after death. I would encourage further research before writing off God and accepting who has been known for centuries as the enemy of mankind. Read Paradise Lost, but pay attention not just to Satan's words, but how he acts (or watch Wendigoon's summary).
@@curator6971 Ok but consider if god would exist and the bible is his true word. Out of his actions in the bible I draw the conclusion that god is evil. And although the bible portrays satan as evil I dont believe It because god clearly is in the wrong here. The problem in christianity is that they say that the standart of moral is god, but thats a messed up standart. God is depicted as good in the bible yet his actions show that he is not. Even in the bible, which is seen as gods words, satan is the good one, judging by a standart of secular morality. And I just say that that image is further used in later works but it is the bible which christianity upholds that validates this stance the most
Literally all of their criticisms of the temple posit catholicism as the center of the universe, as if catholicism is objectively true, which is BIG big assumption that I take issue with. It's an assumption that completely ignores every system of belief that doesn't stem from an abrahamic religion (of which there are many). not to mention that they absolutely missed the point of every single tenet. Otherwise, regardless of the bad faith arguments put forth, I appreciate the willingness to engage.
the big, main question is, why call themselves the "satanic" temple? their tenets are simply humanist tenets. so why not Humanist Temple? "satanic" simply means "anti-Christian."
From the TST FAQ page Q “How do you differ from humanist?” A “A unifying attribute of all Satanists is our embrace of our outsider status. In addition, Satanists adhere to the principles of individual sovereignty and the rejection of tyrannical authority. These concerns are of paramount importance to us, but are not fundamental components of Humanism”
Satan is a potent symbol of rebellion and as a sort of dialectical advocate. It's a core part of our beliefs because left unchecked organized religion can be oppressive and coercive. Our role, in my mind, is to make sure that engage our society as to what it values. In short, Satanism exists to highlight and fight hippocracy.
An easy philosophical argument would be to challenge the ST is with their belief in relativism and atheism. They have no justification to force their beliefs on anyone by their very own paradigm.
What part of 'we'd like to be included to, please' is 'forcing our beliefs on anyone'? When the 10 commandment statue was declined, we retracted our bid for the Baphomet statue (just to cite an example that comes to mind), because we believe in pluralism. It wouldn't be right to only put Baphomet there if the Christians weren't being represented. That's the entire point - if one religion is going to get represented by the state, so should the other however many be.
@@DutchHeathen well your argument is based upon presuppositions I don’t agree with. Our worldview doesn’t believe in pluralism. We believe in the One True Faith. Also, if I were to agree to your presuppositions, you’re making an ethical claim. Why should I accept your ethical standards? What justification do you have for forcing pluralism?
@@livingstranger In other words, you're saying 'me me me', and we're saying 'yeah, but what about everyone else though?'? Which seems more 'evil'? My justification? Reality. The facts are that there are 1001 different faiths out there (not the actual number, it's a figure of speech), and if you believe in freedom of religion, they all should be allowed to exist. I don't have to believe in your 'One True Faith', to let you have your space on the lawn.
God created our bodies with the potential to produce another human being. everyone of us have that potential in our bodies, and i think that's the topmost reason why we must respect our bodies and others' as well, as God commands us to.
"Topmost" is 1 Cor. 6:15-20. Next-most is the fact that the human person is a spiritual thing united to a material thing (hence the necessity of burying the dead and otherwise treating even the corpse of a human being with reverence). Third in importance is where I would personally place this fact of the generative faculty being substantial to our nature.
@@john-paulgies4313 for us Christians, that is definitely it. totally agree with you. but for non-believers, I think if they were to debate the body rights issues, i would say to them what i wrote above.
If you're against showing compassion and empathy towards non-rational animals does that mean that you're okay with torturing lions and bears... are you advocating for people murdering animals for fun like on some horror movie killer origin story type stuff.. are you really saying that it's too much to ask for to treat animals with compassion right up until the point that your life is in danger or until you need to eat
Just wanted to say thanks for not being total jerks about the temple and our tenants. You were a little condescending and snarky, but as far as most Christians I've encountered with an audience, not jerks. I would love it if you guys would get someone from TST to have a lively discussion with. Thanks again. ⛧❤️
@@in_defense_of_the_church Of course, and he also followed Old Covenant Judaism, which Christianity, specifically Catholicism, is a continuation of. That Old Testament form of Judaism died when the temple was destroyed in 70 AD. We have the true faith. Christianity. Rabbinical Judaism, what we know as Judaism today, came about between the destruction of the temple and 90 AD. Christianity predates it. It is a false pagan religion that at it's core is anti Christian. It was formed by the Pharisees. When we put "Judeo" in front of "Christian", it is an insult to our church fathers who suffered terribly at the hands of the Jewish leaders.
@@sataniclivesmatter it doesn't cast them in a positive light in my book. It just explains their tenants which are still ambiguous. There are many non Christian religions with equal freedoms of Christians, which is why I am still puzzled. The Satanic Temple felt it was necessary to choose a label that directly conflicts with Christianity, even if the Satanic temple's name is just that, and they don't worship Satan, it seems as if the purpose of choosing such a symbol is to point out that religions can't co-exist, because Satan is evil and ultimately wants the demise of Christianity. Therefore it seems that the reason for the name is to promote pure secularism or removal of all religions from the public which is truly an infringement on human rights and is a contradiction Satanic temple tenants discussed in the video.
@@sataniclivesmatter Very well said! I'm so happy that our religion has wonderful people like you who can so clearly communicate our belief system! Hail Satan!
That's half of the equation. We do use it fort he shock factor, but we do genuinely believe in something: the 7 tenants. These are: I One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason. II The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions. III One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone. IV The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own. V Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs. VI People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused. VII Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.
@@Ropetrick6 I thank you for your response. While I support some of your tenets I don't see any indication that you believe in satan. ( you didn't say you did). It also seems that some of your tenents are in conflict with claiming to belong to an organization associating itself with satan, a concept you do not believe in. I don't see anything "noble" in calling yourselves Satanic Temple when you don't believe in satan. I believe this is the opposite of 'noble'. Tenet one seems to be violated simply by claiming to be a temple of satan when you are actually Atheists. If you did practice compassion and empathy then you wouldn't be using satan as a guide-on when you know how others who do believe in God feel about that. While I respect your right to offend, it doesn't seem as though tenet four allows YOU to offend , only that you respect a persons right to do so. Tenet one seems to prevent you from offending? Yet you have gone out of your way to choose an offensive title. Surely you know that to claim satan for anything is offensive to most people who believe in God? Shock value? Offensive? Five doesn't make much sense to me, this would have to be explained in some detail as I don't understand why my beliefs should be guided by my knowledge of the physical world. IE. You bring up freedoms and justice, neither is a scientific function of the world. In fact every tenet except the fifth one has nothing to do with science....do they? They are beliefs not based in science but morality. I don't mean my criticisms to be mean spirited, as they may come across in the printed format but I don't understand why a group of Athiests ( who don't wish to offend no less) couldn't have come up with a better name?
@@dave_ecclectic "While I support some of your tenets I don't see any indication that you believe in satan. ( you didn't say you did)." TST does not believe in a literal satan, but rather a metaphorical satan. If you take an objective look at the Bible, you see that Yahweh is a petty tyrant and pretty objectively evil, whilst satan is a rebel against said authority and encourages humanitarianism (feeding a starving man in the desert, encourages education and rationalism, and finally rebels against a being that has committed multiple genocides). As such, we embrace satan in the sense of his values and of his fight against unjust authority, but not in the sense of believing he actually exists. "It also seems that some of your tenents are in conflict with claiming to belong to an organization associating itself with satan, a concept you do not believe in." like I said, we associate with the metaphorical satan, not a literal satan. " I don't see anything "noble" in calling yourselves Satanic Temple when you don't believe in satan. I believe this is the opposite of 'noble'." as I just explained, we use satan as a metaphorical figure to guide us, but the secondary reason we use the name is to get a reaction out of people. There's a notable difference between hearing "humanitarians are more moral than christians" and "satanists are more moral than christians", and one of them tends to attract more attention. We want attention, because any attention at all helps to serve our message. Another benefit of this name is that it tends to outrage the zealots, and that means instead of hiding their hypocrisy from the world, allowing for people to remain unaware of it, we can instead bring attention to their hypocrisy, and show it to the world. To sum it up nicely: It's a marketing ploy, working in favor of us and in opposition of the zealots. "Tenet one seems to be violated simply by claiming to be a temple of satan when you are actually Atheists." we embrace the morals of our metaphorical satan, therefore making us an atheistic religion and still allowing us to legitimately take the name of satanists. Tenet one remains unbroken. "If you did practice compassion and empathy then you wouldn't be using satan as a guide-on when you know how others who do believe in God feel about that." Their outrage, like I said before, allows us to expose their hypocrisy. Exposing hypocrisy is always a good thing, especially when doing so has actually won us some court cases in favor of secularism and humanitarianism. "While I respect your right to offend, it doesn't seem as though tenet four allows YOU to offend , only that you respect a persons right to do so." It allows for all people to offend, and all people to be offended. If we were to be refused our right to offend others, that itself would be an attempt against our tenets, especially since we should still use this method of offending under our single most important tenet: 7 " Tenet one seems to prevent you from offending?" It does not do so. Our offending of zealots serves in our fight for secularism and humanitarianism, meaning to change our name would actually be going against the first tenet. "Yet you have gone out of your way to choose an offensive title. Surely you know that to claim satan for anything is offensive to most people who believe in God?" That's the point, it makes the zealots furious, and when they're furious they don't bother to hide their hypocrisy. Those who are reasonable will see past the name and look at the validity of our belief, whilst those whop aren't will blatantly expose themselves. "Five doesn't make much sense to me, this would have to be explained in some detail as I don't understand why my beliefs should be guided by my knowledge of the physical world." Because to do otherwise is to shape your perception of the world not on the world itself, but based off of your own potential delusions. And when people do see the world through their delusions, they will do what they can to defend the delusion, even distorting the truth to themselves and to others. A quote I've heard before is "Theists go with an answer already determined, and look for evidence that supports them. Atheists go with all of the evidence available, and draw a conclusion from it, that they're willing to change should new evidence or information come along.", and it summarizes the point of this tenet perfectly. "You bring up freedoms and justice, neither is a scientific function of the world. In fact every tenet except the fifth one has nothing to do with science....do they? They are beliefs not based in science but morality. " While the two might not be inherently related, that does not mean they should not go together. Philosophy and science may be entirely separate from each other, much like how cheese and sauce are, but a human relies on the former two things much like how a pizza relies on the latter two. This comment is getting long, so I'll finish off in a second one.
@@dave_ecclectic one of my favourite songs is the teufslied "when ever we are let go forwards the devil laughs like this hahahahahaha! We fight for Germany and for freedom and honor The enemy will never get to rest"
Probably partly true but I also think they chose the name Satanism because Satan means "Adversary" in Hebrew and they see themselves as adversaries to Christian dogma. Also, if you believe the serpent in Eden was Satan, than technically Satan was the one who convinced Eve to seek knowledge about good and evil so it's also symbolic in that way.
I think that part of the danger is the explicit use of the name and the likelihood that the average person will not deliberate the truth-worthy qualities of their tenets thoroughly. These may mislead those who encounter this group to believe that the one named embodies those qualities which they regard as good and virtuous. In effect, it opens doors that May give entrance to more problematic situations.
Satan a son of God until his rebel. At the beginning of the world all the sons jumped for joy. Satan created being. Jesus Christ only beloved begotten son of God!
I was actually surprised by the very measured way to engage with the ideas proclaimed by ST. If nothing else, they've adopted the name, among other things, to get a rise of more easily offended Christians, and calmly discussing what ST believe and teach is a good way to outplay them at least in that aspect. It's interesting that their tenets not just superficially mimic a lot of common Judeo-Christian moral teachings, they are most likely directly inspired by them, and belong to the same tradition, even if some people who join ST probably want to escape it.
But... the 10 commandments are just a superficial mimicry of the code of Hammurabi... all marketed under the moral superiority of being more avant garde than the old "eye for an eye"
I am happy to see christians actually talking about satanism in a seamingly very open and actually in an honest way. As an every day satanist myself I think there would be a very interesting discussion if you'd talk to someone like me who is a satanist. I follow the tenets of The Satanic Temple but I'm not part of the organization. There would possibly be an interesting conversation. Feel free to hook up with me at any time. I am in Finland though... so just keep that in mind. :D Have a great end of the year and stay safe.
This video really should be called "Catholic Strawman Focus: The Satanic Temple." It's as if these hosts did no research on the topic other than asking other Catholics how they feel about Satanists. Oh well. I guess if you live in an echo chamber long enough, you end up sniffing your own farts.
They are not equal. God alone is to be worshipped. Satan is not God. He shouldn't get equal time. True religion is how we worship God. We may have different ways to worship God but religion is the worship of God. Since Satan is not God then it isn't true religion to worship a creature like him anyway. Oh and they lie. Satan is the father of lies so you can't trust what is on the website. Satan's motto IS do what you want.
Pray that they go to our Father! Let's ask the Virgin Mary for help. May they follow God so that they can know His Love for God IS love and teaches us to be loving
1 Corinthians 15:1-4 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
Hey hey! Would love to meet the guy, He seemed cool. I think it's more likely that a group of old men came upon the idea and decided that it'd be a way to guilt trip people into subservience. But that's just me.
No matter who you are or what sins you committed, even if you sold your soul to the evil one; turn to God now. He’s waiting for you with open arms and Unfathomable Mercy. Nobody gets into Heaven without Jesus. He is the only way, truth and life. Jn 14:6 The evil one (satan) is the father of lies and evil. Bless yourselves, loved ones, car, home, work space, etc with Holy Water to drive satan and evil spirits away. Holy Water is a powerful sacramental used in exorcisms. It acknowledges you belong to God, cleanses, heals, remits venial sin, grants graces and drives away demons. Everyone should keep a bottle and use it daily.
Honestly, I think we shouldn’t forbid Baphomet statues, but rather rise to the challenge and put up all kinds of Bible verses and Christian statues right next to it. Then it would be consistent.
Are you joking? You have it backwards. The Baphomet statue was made in response to you Christians insisting on pushing your religious monuments into the public square.
I mean, being against a genocidal dictator that demands absolute obedience or else he'll throw you into eternal torment? I think you mean just being a good person.
And this is what I tell people when they ask, 'Why call yourselves Satanists?' Doesn't matter what we call ourselves, according to people like you if we are not Christian we are Anti-Christian. You'll call us Satanists no matter what we call ourselves, so we may as well embrace the label and maybe we can get back to talking about things that actually matter.
@Allah hates the age of consent Pretty sure he must have been talking about the people against TST, as opposing TST is opposing personal freedom and simple morality.
@@aliciapadget3706 Yah, me too, it was genuine empathy. Some of the things they said pulled my heart down because I know the weight of the world can be lifted from their shoulders.
Here's my issues- if you dont belive in Satan why is your temple that of the most unholy deity in Christianity? The idea that you are the center of the universe means you are only subject to what you deem as reasonable or justified. What do you call evil? There are demons and they so exist. Exorcism is a real thing. Throughout history, mankind will self destruct if left to his own will. Your do what thou wilt theory will destroy you. You dont believe in forgiveness or modesty.
hi, member of the tst here. we use satan as a symbol of liberty and independent thinking. we see what he does in the Bible and just think he represents us well (although he opposes your god so you see him as evil, from and outsiders point of view, we often don't). seeing ourselves as the center of the universe is slightly wrong. we want to care of ourself and "worship" ourselves because we believe that we die and nothing happens, this means that we live for ourselves. this doesn't mean that we don't have to follow the tenets and that we can harm others. so we have to follow the compassion and kindness rules. plus we still have negative and positive consequences for everything we do, just like anyone else. for us, evil is just when people harm others or "tread" on them. Like you can't infringe on others rights and stuff and negatively harm them (unless they are harming others). historically, mankind has destroyed themselves wether they are religious or not, no matter the religion. in fact, many would argue that christians or other religious people have been the worst. although you could argue that last point for the church of satan, its not correct at all. I agree the church of satan may be a bit more extreme but even then, a lot of them are the most forgiving people I've talked to. the temple of satan (the one they talked about most in this video) does not believe that at all and I'm pretty confident that if you went on their website or talked to any member, you will not find anything that will allow you to argue that point. I hope this helps!
Catholicism means universal. Rome will accept even satanism into their cult. Nothing Christian in Catholicism or satanism! They both serve the same god when the truth is revealed.
@@captaincookie2785 Satan is the god of this world! You worship him! Puny god! You should check out his downfall as written in the book of the revelation of Jesus Christ. He loses BADLY!!! 🤣😇🙌 Maranatha!
We are humanists. Just Google humanist and Google the temple itself. All the information is there. If you really need this talking head to tell you about people he knows nothing about, you are pitiful.
After about 5 minutes into it it seems like these guys are really trying to make it sound like the Satanists aren't all that bad and maybe we can all get along. Moving on from Catholic Answers.
I think they are being charitable toward them. They are critical throughout the whole thing, acknowledging the possibility of the worst but also willing to give the benefit of the doubt.
They're trying to be loving & see their mistakes in the most charitable way. You know trying to behave in a way that shows the love of Jesus. Yes, we need some people to be blunt & serious & maybe even confrontational with those fighting against the will of God, but it's best & more effective for us to be lovingly charitable. If we look at the Bible, we can see God uses both types. Even small kids understand that "you catch more flies with honey than vinegar."
I would argue that they are behaving in a way that Christ would approve of. Jesus met people where they were and loved them, right? They seem to be great Christians who are confident in their faith and comfortable questioning their thoughts, feelings, and intuitions. If you're not able to do that, then maybe you're couching your faith in a insincere place.
Then all you know about them is what you've heard from others. Do your own research and you'll understand better. Or, you know, keep going off of your limited outside misinformed perspective.
There are theistic Satanists, and there are non-theistic Satanists who nonetheless invoke supernatural elements (LaVeyan Satanism in particular is noteworthy for espousing a belief in magic), but The Satanic Temple in particular strictly and solely uses Satan as a symbol. Satanism isn’t a single, coherent movement. It’s just an umbrella term for anything that identifies with Satan, symbolically or otherwise. Imagine I lumped together Catholics, Mormons, and some aging old hippie who just thinks Jesus was a cool dude maaaaan, and then called you a liar for describing what Baptists believe. That wouldn’t be fair, would it?
They don’t worship satan, they worship what satan worshipped which is the self.
Precisely! 💖
Wouldn't that attract or turn people into narcissists
If by worshipping self do you mean standing up for religious freedom and being compassionate.
Worshipping yourself is what Satan teaches.
That's true if you're referring to the church of satan (Anton LaVey) and within the ballpark for the satanic temple
I do not think the last Tenet is a contradiction of the Tenets with themselves. Rather it is a safeguard meaning that nobody who claims to follow the Tenets can do evil and then claim he is following the Tenets. Also this makes sure they remain guiding principles instead of literal doctrine.
I think it's a solid one to have. You don't want someone too dogmatic that they lose sight of what the Tenets were meant to be a way to guide people to be good.
Satanic beliefs require the capacity for paradoxical thought & the nuance of wisdom.
(The more we know about a thing -- the more our knowledge shapes the thing we see.)
🐍 One of the greatest acts of love, is to freely give the gift of knowledge to another.🐍
that is definitely what you are supposed to think, and I am sure many who hold to these tenants believe that. that said, it is still problematic, because it provides an easy out if anyone tries to call them on their hypocrisy.
@@NeonCicada "The more we know about a thing -- the more our knowledge shapes the thing we see."
this isn't paradoxical. and freely giving knowledge is easy. if that is the greatest height of love, than love isn't worth very much after all.
@@marvalice3455 why is a safeguard against dogmatism, in a creed designed to not be dogmatic, bad?
Particularly as an ex-Catholic Satanist, I appreciate this video. It is rare for me to see a good faith examination for either the tenets of Satanism OR of Christian doctrine. While I obviously disagree with a number of assumptions and assertions made, the respect and consideration given here is heartening and exactly the kind of discussion I would hope that we could all have with one another. Thank you for doing this video and if nothing else laying a good example for how to approach one another with respect for each other and a heart of love for people as people.
I agree, they did really good with the video although some of the assumptions that they made while discussing the tenets were a really far reach Imo and it kinda made it seem like they were trying to find a reason to disagree. either way, I really appreciate how respectful they were being and how it seems like they are willing to co-exist with satanists.
I'm sorry but someone's going to have to explain to me what a "Catholic Satanist" is. As a Satanist, this is the first time I've ever heard of anything of the sort.
@@sinik07 the issue is a lack of clarity in punctuation or grammar. I wouldn’t know what “Catholic Satanist” either, but when typing this initially “Satanist who formerly identified as a Catholic” seemed rather cumbersome.
@@AJ-wh1tw ah yes, I figured but didn't want to assume (since there are different sects of satanism, I figured this could be one). Yes, lack of grammar/punctuation would indeed be the issue of my misunderstanding, thanks for clearing it up 🙌🏽
Would gladly discuss TST with you folks rather than you two folks contemplating what you think we mean.
Yeah that was my first thought aswell.
Also i wouod love to see Christians going equally far into the philosophy of the ten commandments and trying to find some mistakes there because thats overdue a couple of centuries.
If your “Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world” how do determine your morals? Do *you* set the bar for what is good and moral or do you adhere to the public authority’s ideas? Either way it’s hard to scientifically prove morals. I’m truly curious what your answer is.
@@youtubegirl149 human morality is fairly universal on many aspects, I go by this rule of thumb: if it benefits someone or society it is a net positive, if it detracts for someone or society it is a net negative. Alas, I also don’t view things like “homosexuality” or “transgenderism” as inherently bad. They’re just descriptors of an individual based on their life experiences and societal perception. How do you define your morality, by a book that’s nothing more than a compilation of fairy tales? Science has time and again debunked the Bible, if you wish to see more of this I recommend looking up AronRa. He’s an atheist educator who specializes in life sciences, specifically evolution.
@@Skurian_krotesk I grew up in a Baptist church and I’m glad to have gotten out of such a toxic environment. I have a decent understanding of the Ten Commandments and I can say that we’re better off ignoring them.
@@LexieLPoyser I am truly sorry you have been hurt in Any church. I have been hurt by people too. God said to not put your trust in any man. All you can do is your best.
God bless everyone here.
Ah yes, the redditor religion.
Indeed reddit bans many other religious communities but they do advertise this one
@@turinturambar6234
It really makes you think doesn't it?
@@turinturambar6234 Which religious communities were banned on Reddit? I was not aware of that.
isn't that atheism?
Does anyone know where I can find a Spanish version of this info?
One thing I've learned is 'God' is not in philosophy
Satanists do not believe in a literal satan. We do not "worship" satan, and or any other being. We believe in ourselves and that we are the masters of our own domain, instead of blindly believing in a fictional character in a book that teaches people to refrain from doing what is in the human nature, thus not allowing a human being to enjoy their lives to the fullest extent (as we should considering our time here is short and NOBODY knows where we go post mortem)
And instilling the "fear of god". We refuse to fear any force that has no solid evidence of being real, and we do not waste our time dwelling in that matter.
Ave Satanas 🖤
Ave Satanas!
Hail Satan!
This is a modern view of Satanism. Please understand, some of us do worship. That is our will. I have no problem with your being an atheist. My belief in entities of any kind does not make you unable to be a nonbeliever.
All I ask is please don't do what Wiccans do and throw us under the bus. Don't introduce yourself all the time by saying your not us, defining what we do as bad or sinful. It's hypocrisy on your part.
Hail Satan! Hail Lilith!
"The death of RGB made me become a satanist" just about sums up what we're working with lol
My thoughts exactly, although I can well understand why a person might associate Ruthless Ruth with the demon.
RBG was a hero and an icon
@@seagreenm LOL yeah advocating for abortion is really commendable. I feel bad for you honestly
@@sagabeard it's okay to have an abortion, I never had one and never will but I don't want to take that away from someone else
@@sagabeard Advocating for deaths due to miscarriage and other childbirth accidents is really commendable. I feel bad for you honestly.
Hi there. Member of The Satanic Temple here and I just wanted to say that I really appreciate this video. Taking a step back and really going over the values of another belief system, especially one that comes across as so strongly opposed to what you believe as TST does with a lot of those of Christian faith, is a difficult, but necessary thing to do. I am of the mindset that I need to always be open to new ideas and arguments, to be willing to challenge my own beliefs. If someone is kind enough to hand me a pamphlet about their church, I'll give it a read. I feel secure enough in my own rational thought processes to not just believe everything someone hands me as the truth.
I know folks love to hate on the JW's as well. I spent a year studying at a Kingdom Hall in northern VT to better understand the JW faith and teachings and can honestly say that it's not for me, but understanding their beliefs on that level allows me to have a better and more meaningful conversation in the even that they stop by. If you want to talk to me about Jesus, that's fine, but we both need to enter into this conversation calmly and willing to change our own viewpoints, otherwise it's just an argument with no goal other than to argue and there's no point in wasting our time.
I hope all of that makes some sense and thank you again for taking a close, objective look at The Satanic Temple and giving your honest feedback on it.
Also a member of TST. I also respect the discussion covered in this video.
Yes, I'm looking through the comments and I'm only a third through the video but I came here, thought I was going to be mad, but so far its very respectful and I can respect that.
*Catholic Answers* john 3 16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son Jesus Christ, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Sounds more like a boy whistling in the dark trying to keep his wits.
I think the Satanists should perform a post mortum conversion ceremony and make Jesus an honorary Satanist.
It's one of the highest honors a human can be bestowed.
Hail Satan \m/
I am a member of the satanic temple. I just need to say that you guys did an absolutely spectacular job of explaining our religion. I obviously disagree with some of your point about god, but you did TST justice. Such a refreshing thing to see, as most christians just brush us off once they hear the word Satan. Once again, amazing job.
Y''all should come on into Catholic Answers for a philosophical debate!
@@carlitosefalcon I've definitely been thinking about calling in if that's what you mean
Hey Sean, thanks for taking the time to listen and for your kind comments. Please do call our live show some time! 888 318 7884. Be careful though, we will try to bring you to Christ! Peace friend.
I hope you become part of Jesus Christ church
hail satan 🤘🏽
I just joined the satanic temple and I think you have given a fair assessment by taking the tenets at face value. And yes there is some ambiguity in some places but that is on purpose, because morality and ethics is a back an forth cooperative pursuit. We are to hammer out our morality upon the anvil of reason and temper it with compassion. You have been very charitable and I would be happy to know more Catholics like you. I wish you well.
I'm not going to say that I agree with 100% of what you have to say about my religion, but I want to give you credit for being fairly even handed, well researched, and companionate. I was not expecting a video about Satanism made by Catholics to be as good as it was. Thank you so much, and Hail Satan! :-)
With a truth turned eye, the TST reaffirms my trust in God and the Bible. Their very nature is reflective of Genesis and the idea that Pride is the sin of Satan and that the tst is the rejection of spirituality in order to worship self is ultimately wholly Christian in doctrine.
The first "T" in TST is "The." You're not supposed to write "the TST," it's redundant.
I think that at some point a nation needs values and truths to agree on. This country will either center on a religion or on the religion of secularism. Truth is exclusive and will not tolerate excluded alternatives.
To permit other beliefs among yourselves is fine so long as your beliefs continue to be asserted strongly. This was a Christian country for the first two hundred years, and in becoming more non-Christian it violently seeks to know itself by another means, and secularism offers no means except to persecute things which are not secular.
Secularism is not a religion, it is a political system. This country has never been a "Christian country" it was founded on enlightenment ideas, which includes the separation of church and state. Secularism is the separation of church and state. If you're anti seculariam, you're putting religion before patrotism.
@@captaincookie2785 Keep telling yourself that guy. I've spoken to enough Atheists who spoke just like a cultist to know that being a materialist doesn't make them any more logical or less prone to pontificating on things that they couldn't prove, could model, and called everyone stupid for not believing in it. Religion in my mind is any idea that binds thought without demonstrable proof. By that definition, everyone I've ever met is religious.
@@captaincookie2785 Let me sing you a bit of the fourth stanza from Star Spangled Banner.
"Oh! Thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand,
Between their loved homes and the war’s desolation,
Blest with vict’ry and peace, may the Heav’n-rescued land,
Praise the Pow’r that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, for our cause is just,
And this be our motto - “In God is our trust.”
@@captaincookie2785 I don't think the founder's foresaw Satanists giving "blessings" in court houses. I think the separation of church and state was to cut down on sectarianism within Christianity rather than giving entirely different faiths equal status.
@@captaincookie2785 A lack of belief is still a belief.
Hey, I really liked how neutral you went into the whole topic and being open minded about our religion.
We can really just have a conversation about the issues that we adress if everyone goes in to the topic like you guys did, even if we don't have the same view on things.
So thanks for that.
I just wanted to add that we don't just 'use Satan to trigger'. It just feels a lot more than that and because I have grown up knowing the biblical stories it also means a lot to me that it is part of the religion.
If I may, what does the use of Satan's name imply, if not what was proposed?
@@curator6971 Satan is a symbol for freedom from opression. In the biblical story but especially in later works (like the revolt of angels by anatole france) satan is the highest of angels who revolts against an allpowerfull god because he understands his wrongdoings. Satan by the biblical story is the first entity to go by secular rule instead of the rule of god, and with that he saw that god is evil.
The god of the bible (if he existed which I dont believe) is evil. He gave us sickness and death, he tests us eventhough he created us himself and since he is all knowing he shouldnt need the test. Satan is the first one who saw that.
So the idea is that Satan started to make people think for themselves and only because of that he is outcast by god.
(And I dont believe in god nor satan, but its a very important story and my takeaway from it)
That is also why in a lot of satanistic artwork satan isnt portrayed as like a demon that eats kids, but as beautiful and wise.
@myotiswii Briefly consider that, should Satan actually exist, with grace and wisdom would be the way he should seek to be depicted. Artwork before the 1600s depicts the Prince of Darkness as a cunning and vile thing, which is certainly more apt. Should this being exist, his sole motivation is to draw us to him so that we may spend eternity under his heel after death. I would encourage further research before writing off God and accepting who has been known for centuries as the enemy of mankind. Read Paradise Lost, but pay attention not just to Satan's words, but how he acts (or watch Wendigoon's summary).
@@curator6971 Ok but consider if god would exist and the bible is his true word. Out of his actions in the bible I draw the conclusion that god is evil. And although the bible portrays satan as evil I dont believe It because god clearly is in the wrong here.
The problem in christianity is that they say that the standart of moral is god, but thats a messed up standart.
God is depicted as good in the bible yet his actions show that he is not. Even in the bible, which is seen as gods words, satan is the good one, judging by a standart of secular morality.
And I just say that that image is further used in later works but it is the bible which christianity upholds that validates this stance the most
Literally all of their criticisms of the temple posit catholicism as the center of the universe, as if catholicism is objectively true, which is BIG big assumption that I take issue with. It's an assumption that completely ignores every system of belief that doesn't stem from an abrahamic religion (of which there are many). not to mention that they absolutely missed the point of every single tenet. Otherwise, regardless of the bad faith arguments put forth, I appreciate the willingness to engage.
the big, main question is, why call themselves the "satanic" temple? their tenets are simply humanist tenets. so why not Humanist Temple? "satanic" simply means "anti-Christian."
They are satanists not humanists its all a deception
@@colonelautism9957
Liberal humanism isnt luciferianism thats just liberalism
From the TST FAQ page Q “How do you differ from humanist?” A “A unifying attribute of all Satanists is our embrace of our outsider status. In addition, Satanists adhere to the principles of individual sovereignty and the rejection of tyrannical authority. These concerns are of paramount importance to us, but are not fundamental components of Humanism”
@@pocket1578 Pocket, I just want to say this: I highly appreciate your efforts, and best of luck to you!
Satan is a potent symbol of rebellion and as a sort of dialectical advocate.
It's a core part of our beliefs because left unchecked organized religion can be oppressive and coercive. Our role, in my mind, is to make sure that engage our society as to what it values.
In short, Satanism exists to highlight and fight hippocracy.
An easy philosophical argument would be to challenge the ST is with their belief in relativism and atheism. They have no justification to force their beliefs on anyone by their very own paradigm.
Neither do Christians and yet you do it all the time. You're all hypocrites.
He really said "they have no justification to force their beliefs on anyone" 🤣🤣
What part of 'we'd like to be included to, please' is 'forcing our beliefs on anyone'? When the 10 commandment statue was declined, we retracted our bid for the Baphomet statue (just to cite an example that comes to mind), because we believe in pluralism. It wouldn't be right to only put Baphomet there if the Christians weren't being represented. That's the entire point - if one religion is going to get represented by the state, so should the other however many be.
@@DutchHeathen well your argument is based upon presuppositions I don’t agree with. Our worldview doesn’t believe in pluralism. We believe in the One True Faith. Also, if I were to agree to your presuppositions, you’re making an ethical claim. Why should I accept your ethical standards? What justification do you have for forcing pluralism?
@@livingstranger In other words, you're saying 'me me me', and we're saying 'yeah, but what about everyone else though?'? Which seems more 'evil'?
My justification? Reality. The facts are that there are 1001 different faiths out there (not the actual number, it's a figure of speech), and if you believe in freedom of religion, they all should be allowed to exist. I don't have to believe in your 'One True Faith', to let you have your space on the lawn.
please turn closed captioning on. thanks,
God created our bodies with the potential to produce another human being. everyone of us have that potential in our bodies, and i think that's the topmost reason why we must respect our bodies and others' as well, as God commands us to.
"Topmost" is 1 Cor. 6:15-20.
Next-most is the fact that the human person is a spiritual thing united to a material thing (hence the necessity of burying the dead and otherwise treating even the corpse of a human being with reverence).
Third in importance is where I would personally place this fact of the generative faculty being substantial to our nature.
@@john-paulgies4313 for us Christians, that is definitely it. totally agree with you.
but for non-believers, I think if they were to debate the body rights issues, i would say to them what i wrote above.
If you're against showing compassion and empathy towards non-rational animals does that mean that you're okay with torturing lions and bears... are you advocating for people murdering animals for fun like on some horror movie killer origin story type stuff.. are you really saying that it's too much to ask for to treat animals with compassion right up until the point that your life is in danger or until you need to eat
John Adams Treaty of Tripoli article 11 disagrees with your notion of the US being founded of christianity.
Well...this episode was pretty surreal ay?
Satanists dont worship satan
A very clickbait title, but an excellent way of engaging with the ideas!
Just wanted to say thanks for not being total jerks about the temple and our tenants. You were a little condescending and snarky, but as far as most Christians I've encountered with an audience, not jerks. I would love it if you guys would get someone from TST to have a lively discussion with.
Thanks again. ⛧❤️
I cringe every time I hear someone use the term "Judeo-Christian".
Judeo-Christian
@@in_defense_of_the_church The term is an oxymoron. Jewish values have been at odds with Christian values for almost 2000 years.
@@TD-bq5bo so Jesus didn’t start Christianity?
@@in_defense_of_the_church Of course, and he also followed Old Covenant Judaism, which Christianity, specifically Catholicism, is a continuation of. That Old Testament form of Judaism died when the temple was destroyed in 70 AD. We have the true faith. Christianity. Rabbinical Judaism, what we know as Judaism today, came about between the destruction of the temple and 90 AD. Christianity predates it. It is a false pagan religion that at it's core is anti Christian. It was formed by the Pharisees. When we put "Judeo" in front of "Christian", it is an insult to our church fathers who suffered terribly at the hands of the Jewish leaders.
Why is that?
these are dark times. Praise God Praise God
Praise Satan! Hail Satan!
Ave Satanas! Ave Satanas!
Ave Satanas!
Thank you so much for publishing this video.
@@sataniclivesmatter it doesn't cast them in a positive light in my book. It just explains their tenants which are still ambiguous. There are many non Christian religions with equal freedoms of Christians, which is why I am still puzzled. The Satanic Temple felt it was necessary to choose a label that directly conflicts with Christianity, even if the Satanic temple's name is just that, and they don't worship Satan, it seems as if the purpose of choosing such a symbol is to point out that religions can't co-exist, because Satan is evil and ultimately wants the demise of Christianity. Therefore it seems that the reason for the name is to promote pure secularism or removal of all religions from the public which is truly an infringement on human rights and is a contradiction Satanic temple tenants discussed in the video.
@@sataniclivesmatter Very well said! I'm so happy that our religion has wonderful people like you who can so clearly communicate our belief system! Hail Satan!
@@jacquelineknox1853 A secular state doesn't infringe on human rights. It ensures their protection.
Tenets, not tenants.
im a newer member of the tst (only a few months) and I keep making this mistake lol
They will also eventually become Satan's tenants soon enough.
From reading some of the comments it seems that these people are atheists who have chosen to use this as some kind of shock value thing.
That's half of the equation. We do use it fort he shock factor, but we do genuinely believe in something: the 7 tenants. These are:
I
One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason.
II
The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.
III
One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.
IV
The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own.
V
Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs.
VI
People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused.
VII
Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.
@@Ropetrick6 I thank you for your response.
While I support some of your tenets I don't see any indication that you believe in satan. ( you didn't say you did).
It also seems that some of your tenents are in conflict with claiming to belong to an organization associating itself with satan, a concept you do not believe in. I don't see anything "noble" in calling yourselves Satanic Temple when you don't believe in satan. I believe this is the opposite of 'noble'.
Tenet one seems to be violated simply by claiming to be a temple of satan when you are actually Atheists. If you did practice compassion and empathy then you wouldn't be using satan as a guide-on when you know how others who do believe in God feel about that. While I respect your right to offend, it doesn't seem as though tenet four allows YOU to offend , only that you respect a persons right to do so. Tenet one seems to prevent you from offending? Yet you have gone out of your way to choose an offensive title. Surely you know that to claim satan for anything is offensive to most people who believe in God? Shock value? Offensive?
Five doesn't make much sense to me, this would have to be explained in some detail as I don't understand why my beliefs should be guided by my knowledge of the physical world. IE. You bring up freedoms and justice, neither is a scientific function of the world. In fact every tenet except the fifth one has nothing to do with science....do they? They are beliefs not based in science but morality.
I don't mean my criticisms to be mean spirited, as they may come across in the printed format but I don't understand why a group of Athiests ( who don't wish to offend no less) couldn't have come up with a better name?
@@dave_ecclectic "While I support some of your tenets I don't see any indication that you believe in satan. ( you didn't say you did)." TST does not believe in a literal satan, but rather a metaphorical satan. If you take an objective look at the Bible, you see that Yahweh is a petty tyrant and pretty objectively evil, whilst satan is a rebel against said authority and encourages humanitarianism (feeding a starving man in the desert, encourages education and rationalism, and finally rebels against a being that has committed multiple genocides). As such, we embrace satan in the sense of his values and of his fight against unjust authority, but not in the sense of believing he actually exists.
"It also seems that some of your tenents are in conflict with claiming to belong to an organization associating itself with satan, a concept you do not believe in." like I said, we associate with the metaphorical satan, not a literal satan.
" I don't see anything "noble" in calling yourselves Satanic Temple when you don't believe in satan. I believe this is the opposite of 'noble'." as I just explained, we use satan as a metaphorical figure to guide us, but the secondary reason we use the name is to get a reaction out of people. There's a notable difference between hearing "humanitarians are more moral than christians" and "satanists are more moral than christians", and one of them tends to attract more attention. We want attention, because any attention at all helps to serve our message. Another benefit of this name is that it tends to outrage the zealots, and that means instead of hiding their hypocrisy from the world, allowing for people to remain unaware of it, we can instead bring attention to their hypocrisy, and show it to the world. To sum it up nicely: It's a marketing ploy, working in favor of us and in opposition of the zealots.
"Tenet one seems to be violated simply by claiming to be a temple of satan when you are actually Atheists." we embrace the morals of our metaphorical satan, therefore making us an atheistic religion and still allowing us to legitimately take the name of satanists. Tenet one remains unbroken.
"If you did practice compassion and empathy then you wouldn't be using satan as a guide-on when you know how others who do believe in God feel about that." Their outrage, like I said before, allows us to expose their hypocrisy. Exposing hypocrisy is always a good thing, especially when doing so has actually won us some court cases in favor of secularism and humanitarianism.
"While I respect your right to offend, it doesn't seem as though tenet four allows YOU to offend , only that you respect a persons right to do so." It allows for all people to offend, and all people to be offended. If we were to be refused our right to offend others, that itself would be an attempt against our tenets, especially since we should still use this method of offending under our single most important tenet: 7
" Tenet one seems to prevent you from offending?" It does not do so. Our offending of zealots serves in our fight for secularism and humanitarianism, meaning to change our name would actually be going against the first tenet.
"Yet you have gone out of your way to choose an offensive title. Surely you know that to claim satan for anything is offensive to most people who believe in God?" That's the point, it makes the zealots furious, and when they're furious they don't bother to hide their hypocrisy. Those who are reasonable will see past the name and look at the validity of our belief, whilst those whop aren't will blatantly expose themselves.
"Five doesn't make much sense to me, this would have to be explained in some detail as I don't understand why my beliefs should be guided by my knowledge of the physical world." Because to do otherwise is to shape your perception of the world not on the world itself, but based off of your own potential delusions. And when people do see the world through their delusions, they will do what they can to defend the delusion, even distorting the truth to themselves and to others. A quote I've heard before is "Theists go with an answer already determined, and look for evidence that supports them. Atheists go with all of the evidence available, and draw a conclusion from it, that they're willing to change should new evidence or information come along.", and it summarizes the point of this tenet perfectly.
"You bring up freedoms and justice, neither is a scientific function of the world. In fact every tenet except the fifth one has nothing to do with science....do they? They are beliefs not based in science but morality.
" While the two might not be inherently related, that does not mean they should not go together. Philosophy and science may be entirely separate from each other, much like how cheese and sauce are, but a human relies on the former two things much like how a pizza relies on the latter two.
This comment is getting long, so I'll finish off in a second one.
@@dave_ecclectic one of my favourite songs is the teufslied "when ever we are let go forwards the devil laughs like this hahahahahaha! We fight for Germany and for freedom and honor
The enemy will never get to rest"
Probably partly true but I also think they chose the name Satanism because Satan means "Adversary" in Hebrew and they see themselves as adversaries to Christian dogma. Also, if you believe the serpent in Eden was Satan, than technically Satan was the one who convinced Eve to seek knowledge about good and evil so it's also symbolic in that way.
Your logo has a suspiciously close resemblance to Creative Assembly.
I think that part of the danger is the explicit use of the name and the likelihood that the average person will not deliberate the truth-worthy qualities of their tenets thoroughly. These may mislead those who encounter this group to believe that the one named embodies those qualities which they regard as good and virtuous. In effect, it opens doors that May give entrance to more problematic situations.
Satan a son of God until his rebel.
At the beginning of the world all the sons jumped for joy.
Satan created being.
Jesus Christ only beloved begotten son of God!
They need God so may we pray to God that they will go to the truth.
Satan did not create being. Read Genesis ♥️
@@marvelator8303 a created being a son of God!
@@marvelator8303 " a created being,"
A son of God^^^^^^
Hail Satan!
Nothing like the taste of freedom from superstition in the morning -- have a bowl of tasty Satan-O's 😋🥣
Satanist and Satan worshipper are not interchangeable
No gods, no masters... Hail thyself! Ave Satanas! 🖤🤘🏽
Hail Satan! 💖
hail satan
Hail!
Pipi
Thyself is Thy Master!😀
I was actually surprised by the very measured way to engage with the ideas proclaimed by ST. If nothing else, they've adopted the name, among other things, to get a rise of more easily offended Christians, and calmly discussing what ST believe and teach is a good way to outplay them at least in that aspect.
It's interesting that their tenets not just superficially mimic a lot of common Judeo-Christian moral teachings, they are most likely directly inspired by them, and belong to the same tradition, even if some people who join ST probably want to escape it.
But... the 10 commandments are just a superficial mimicry of the code of Hammurabi... all marketed under the moral superiority of being more avant garde than the old "eye for an eye"
I believe they’re more playing “devil’s advocate” literally and pushing debate
I am happy to see christians actually talking about satanism in a seamingly very open and actually in an honest way. As an every day satanist myself I think there would be a very interesting discussion if you'd talk to someone like me who is a satanist. I follow the tenets of The Satanic Temple but I'm not part of the organization. There would possibly be an interesting conversation. Feel free to hook up with me at any time. I am in Finland though... so just keep that in mind. :D Have a great end of the year and stay safe.
hail satan 🤘🏽
This video really should be called "Catholic Strawman Focus: The Satanic Temple."
It's as if these hosts did no research on the topic other than asking other Catholics how they feel about Satanists.
Oh well. I guess if you live in an echo chamber long enough, you end up sniffing your own farts.
Do you believe you yourself don't live in an echo chamber of your own as well?
They are not equal. God alone is to be worshipped. Satan is not God. He shouldn't get equal time. True religion is how we worship God. We may have different ways to worship God but religion is the worship of God. Since Satan is not God then it isn't true religion to worship a creature like him anyway. Oh and they lie. Satan is the father of lies so you can't trust what is on the website. Satan's motto IS do what you want.
gop..
Pray that they go to our Father! Let's ask the Virgin Mary for help. May they follow God so that they can know His Love for God IS love and teaches us to be loving
1 Corinthians 15:1-4
Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
Hail Satan!
Just all part of the falling away which comes before Jesus returns.
So... you got an ETA on that? Cuz it's been a few thousand years already... how much longer?
Hey hey! Would love to meet the guy, He seemed cool.
I think it's more likely that a group of old men came upon the idea and decided that it'd be a way to guilt trip people into subservience. But that's just me.
I find it sad that we have to create a religion to keep religious people from opressing us with Chrisianity.
Instead of asking a member of the TST on to discuss they just make assumptions. Also why are there never woman on these programs?
No matter who you are or what sins you committed, even if you sold your soul to the evil one; turn to God now. He’s waiting for you with open arms and Unfathomable Mercy. Nobody gets into Heaven without Jesus. He is the only way, truth and life. Jn 14:6 The evil one (satan) is the father of lies and evil. Bless yourselves, loved ones, car, home, work space, etc with Holy Water to drive satan and evil spirits away. Holy Water is a powerful sacramental used in exorcisms. It acknowledges you belong to God, cleanses, heals, remits venial sin, grants graces and drives away demons. Everyone should keep a bottle and use it daily.
Hail Satan
Honestly, I think we shouldn’t forbid Baphomet statues, but rather rise to the challenge and put up all kinds of Bible verses and Christian statues right next to it. Then it would be consistent.
Are you joking? You have it backwards. The Baphomet statue was made in response to you Christians insisting on pushing your religious monuments into the public square.
...it doesnt matter if you believe in satan or not, satan believes in you anyways... if you are not for God then you are against God...
I mean, being against a genocidal dictator that demands absolute obedience or else he'll throw you into eternal torment? I think you mean just being a good person.
And this is what I tell people when they ask, 'Why call yourselves Satanists?' Doesn't matter what we call ourselves, according to people like you if we are not Christian we are Anti-Christian. You'll call us Satanists no matter what we call ourselves, so we may as well embrace the label and maybe we can get back to talking about things that actually matter.
Being someone who is choosing to turn to Satanism very recently I like seeing this perspective first.
Hail Satan, friend.
The world has gone mad . Theres nothing to accept with evil being popularized. evil is evil.
May I ask what exactly it is about The Satanic Temple that you think is evil?
@@slimfrinky Hahaha wot u wrote is hilarious
@@immortalwarrior4722 Yeah, truly hilarious, mostly because of your mindless response.
Only 66 more likes needed. 😉
just the name of satan is offensive so.....i think thats theyre whole thing to offend.
I'm a member of tst and no it's not. For example we do fundraiser and charity drives. Socks for satan was definitely my favorite
If loving people and teaching them things is a sin... I am a SINNER 4 LIFE!
We are not a cristian society - our country was not founded on judeo chtistian principles
They're all as crazy as each other.
Same could be said for anyone.
@@Lucifer. . . . er, that's what I said!
💓💓💓💓
8:41 and what principles are they? slavery perhaps?
Catholic perception. Fair consideration......Roflmao
You should not test the lord with this and it should not even be spoken about
It’s sad to see how confused and brainwashed they are.
@Allah hates the age of consent Pretty sure he must have been talking about the people against TST, as opposing TST is opposing personal freedom and simple morality.
I agree, are used to be one of them.
@@aliciapadget3706 Yah, me too, it was genuine empathy. Some of the things they said pulled my heart down because I know the weight of the world can be lifted from their shoulders.
these tenets are just like the temptations that the devil presented. All parables from with the bibles but without the full context
This is not a Christian nation. We were founded on FREEDOM OF RELIGION. Your base arguement was flawed even if you're attempting to sound fair
This is the worst philosophical pondering I have seen in quite some time, very dim.
Hail Jesus Christ!
No thanks
Here's my issues- if you dont belive in Satan why is your temple that of the most unholy deity in Christianity?
The idea that you are the center of the universe means you are only subject to what you deem as reasonable or justified.
What do you call evil? There are demons and they so exist. Exorcism is a real thing.
Throughout history, mankind will self destruct if left to his own will. Your do what thou wilt theory will destroy you.
You dont believe in forgiveness or modesty.
hi, member of the tst here. we use satan as a symbol of liberty and independent thinking. we see what he does in the Bible and just think he represents us well (although he opposes your god so you see him as evil, from and outsiders point of view, we often don't).
seeing ourselves as the center of the universe is slightly wrong. we want to care of ourself and "worship" ourselves because we believe that we die and nothing happens, this means that we live for ourselves. this doesn't mean that we don't have to follow the tenets and that we can harm others. so we have to follow the compassion and kindness rules. plus we still have negative and positive consequences for everything we do, just like anyone else.
for us, evil is just when people harm others or "tread" on them. Like you can't infringe on others rights and stuff and negatively harm them (unless they are harming others).
historically, mankind has destroyed themselves wether they are religious or not, no matter the religion. in fact, many would argue that christians or other religious people have been the worst.
although you could argue that last point for the church of satan, its not correct at all. I agree the church of satan may be a bit more extreme but even then, a lot of them are the most forgiving people I've talked to. the temple of satan (the one they talked about most in this video) does not believe that at all and I'm pretty confident that if you went on their website or talked to any member, you will not find anything that will allow you to argue that point. I hope this helps!
Well done gentlemen.
Idk why this trash was recommended to me.
Catholicism means universal.
Rome will accept even satanism into their cult.
Nothing Christian in Catholicism or satanism!
They both serve the same god when the truth is revealed.
Satanism is *Non*-theistic
@@captaincookie2785
Satan is the god of this world!
You worship him!
Puny god!
You should check out his downfall as written in the book of the revelation of Jesus Christ.
He loses BADLY!!! 🤣😇🙌
Maranatha!
We are humanists. Just Google humanist and Google the temple itself. All the information is there. If you really need this talking head to tell you about people he knows nothing about, you are pitiful.
After about 5 minutes into it it seems like these guys are really trying to make it sound like the Satanists aren't all that bad and maybe we can all get along. Moving on from Catholic Answers.
I think they are being charitable toward them. They are critical throughout the whole thing, acknowledging the possibility of the worst but also willing to give the benefit of the doubt.
They're trying to be loving & see their mistakes in the most charitable way. You know trying to behave in a way that shows the love of Jesus. Yes, we need some people to be blunt & serious & maybe even confrontational with those fighting against the will of God, but it's best & more effective for us to be lovingly charitable. If we look at the Bible, we can see God uses both types. Even small kids understand that "you catch more flies with honey than vinegar."
I would argue that they are behaving in a way that Christ would approve of. Jesus met people where they were and loved them, right?
They seem to be great Christians who are confident in their faith and comfortable questioning their thoughts, feelings, and intuitions.
If you're not able to do that, then maybe you're couching your faith in a insincere place.
Groups like that remind me of mocking ‘know betters’ full of contempt and self pride 🤮
Then all you know about them is what you've heard from others. Do your own research and you'll understand better. Or, you know, keep going off of your limited outside misinformed perspective.
Catholic Answers ............Sounds like Catholic psychobable . Must be why I attend Latin Mass .
You all are liars. I know people who were inclined in this deception. You do believe in deities and spirits and use them during rituals.
There are theistic Satanists, and there are non-theistic Satanists who nonetheless invoke supernatural elements (LaVeyan Satanism in particular is noteworthy for espousing a belief in magic), but The Satanic Temple in particular strictly and solely uses Satan as a symbol.
Satanism isn’t a single, coherent movement. It’s just an umbrella term for anything that identifies with Satan, symbolically or otherwise.
Imagine I lumped together Catholics, Mormons, and some aging old hippie who just thinks Jesus was a cool dude maaaaan, and then called you a liar for describing what Baptists believe. That wouldn’t be fair, would it?
People be crazy
Magic is cool!
Oh this is going to be fun, a pair of god believers talking about .T.S.T.
:23 and that's what you want to do to satanism